Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So as the title says really. Are the cult marines only really found with in there associated legions?

Nope. They can be found within warbands with other chaos forces.

Cult marines can also emerge from newly turned loyalist marines, assuming they are drawn strongly enough to a specific power.

That is the cool thing about chaos... it is chaotic, and you can run pretty much whatever fluff you want for your army choices, from a full blown PM deathguard army, to a shakey alliance of cult and vanilla troops blasting their way through the Imperium.

CULT marines are a weird one. Plague Marines and Berzerkers are the only two who can be from anyone, truly. Noise Marines are fluff-wise the only ones who use sonic weaponry, them being the Emperor's Children. Thousand Sons are obviously from the Thousand Sons chapter, no way around that. Plagues and Berzerkers are just god-blessed marines of either sort, so yeah.

However, Black Legion is the excuse to this as they can incorporate ANY cult marine.

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:CULT marines are a weird one. Plague Marines and Berzerkers are the only two who can be from anyone, truly. Noise Marines are fluff-wise the only ones who use sonic weaponry, them being the Emperor's Children. Thousand Sons are obviously from the Thousand Sons chapter, no way around that. Plagues and Berzerkers are just god-blessed marines of either sort, so yeah.

However, Black Legion is the excuse to this as they can incorporate ANY cult marine.

Well, not exactly.

Abbadon controls a corps of Berzerker-Surgeons, who are capable of performing the necessary alterations to turn a "normal" CSM into a Berzerker. That's why the Black Legion has its own Berzerkers. Other than that, non-World Eaters Berzerkers are rare, because in order to be a "Berzerker", per se, you have to be lobotomized in a very specific way, and doing that right takes very specific training.

Powerful Nurglite sorcerors in the pay of the Black Legion can confer Plague Marine-hood upon worthy worshipers of Nurgle. Alternatively, you can join the Death Guard. Those are the only two ways to become a Plague Marine.

To become a Noise Marine, you have to visit Fabius Bile and have him tweak your brain to be super-sensitive to aural stimulus. Then you get yourself a Sonic Blaster (tricky, since those are pretty much the sole demesne of the Emperor's Children) and you're set.

Rubric Marines come from the Thousand Sons, period. There is no other source, no-one can join their ranks, at least not unless someone somehow recreates the Rubric of Ahriman.

BeRzErKeR wrote:

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:CULT marines are a weird one. Plague Marines and Berzerkers are the only two who can be from anyone, truly. Noise Marines are fluff-wise the only ones who use sonic weaponry, them being the Emperor's Children. Thousand Sons are obviously from the Thousand Sons chapter, no way around that. Plagues and Berzerkers are just god-blessed marines of either sort, so yeah.

However, Black Legion is the excuse to this as they can incorporate ANY cult marine.

Well, not exactly.

Abbadon controls a corps of Berzerker-Surgeons, who are capable of performing the necessary alterations to turn a "normal" CSM into a Berzerker. That's why the Black Legion has its own Berzerkers. Other than that, non-World Eaters Berzerkers are rare, because in order to be a "Berzerker", per se, you have to be lobotomized in a very specific way, and doing that right takes very specific training.

To become a Noise Marine, you have to visit Fabius Bile and have him tweak your brain to be super-sensitive to aural stimulus. Then you get yourself a Sonic Blaster (tricky, since those are pretty much the sole demesne of the Emperor's Children) and you're set.

I have never heard of either of those, both seem outright ridiculous to me. Where did you find this bit of fluff? And Fabius didn't awaken the Noise Marines' visual extremes. Well, not directly. That happened via stimms he created to really heighten their senses for battle.

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:
I have never heard of either of those, both seem outright ridiculous to me. Where did you find this bit of fluff? And Fabius didn't awaken the Noise Marines' visual extremes. Well, not directly. That happened via stimms he created to really heighten their senses for battle.

The Berzerker thing comes from the Berzerker unit description in Codex; CSM. Specific mention is made of the Black Legion's cadre of Berzerker-Surgeons and the lobotomization Berzerkers undergo. While it's possible to be a Berzerker without being affiliated with either the Black Legion or the World Eaters, it's rare.

As for the Noise Marines, Bile did not "create stimms" so much as actually rewire the brains of the Emperor's Children. Specifically, he connected the pleasure centers of their brains directly to their nervous system. It's this neural modification that makes a Noise Marine; While there are probably others who can do it (or for that matter Slaanesh might intervene directly for a particularly favored warrior), Bile would be the best man for the job.

BeRzErKeR wrote:

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:
I have never heard of either of those, both seem outright ridiculous to me. Where did you find this bit of fluff? And Fabius didn't awaken the Noise Marines' visual extremes. Well, not directly. That happened via stimms he created to really heighten their senses for battle.

The Berzerker thing comes from the Berzerker unit description in Codex; CSM. Specific mention is made of the Black Legion's cadre of Berzerker-Surgeons and the lobotomization Berzerkers undergo. While it's possible to be a Berzerker without being affiliated with either the Black Legion or the World Eaters, it's rare.

As for the Noise Marines, Bile did not "create stimms" so much as actually rewire the brains of the Emperor's Children. Specifically, he connected the pleasure centers of their brains directly to their nervous system. It's this neural modification that makes a Noise Marine; While there are probably others who can do it (or for that matter Slaanesh might intervene directly for a particularly favored warrior), Bile would be the best man for the job.

Read Fulgrim. The thing that made their brains into ecstasy mush was his combat stimms designed from an alien he experimented on.

And those Berserker surgeons DO NOT take regular CSM and turn them into Berzerkers. They add interfaces to inject them with stimms and give them the same craze as the World Eaters and their enhancements have. But the recruits taken are not average CSM. They're Khorne-Worshippers.

As for berzerkers I remember reading in Storm of Iron that some of the chaos undivided soldiers of the Iron warriors were borderline berzerkers.

Same with the Word Bearers in the Dark series.

For plauge marines there is a fallen chapter that are servants of Nurgle (they're in the mini gallery section) Basically it says the plauge terminators of X chapter.

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:

Read Fulgrim. The thing that made their brains into ecstasy mush was his combat stimms designed from an alien he experimented on.

Fair enough. Is this contradictory with or supplementary to the mention (once again, in the Codex) that he also re-wired the brains of the Emperor's Children? If contradictory, which has more weight?

And those Berserker surgeons DO NOT take regular CSM and turn them into Berzerkers. They add interfaces to inject them with stimms and give them the same craze as the World Eaters and their enhancements have. But the recruits taken are not average CSM. They're Khorne-Worshippers.

So. . . Khorne worshippers who aren't Berzerkers aren't regular CSM? Since "average" is meaningless in this context. But yes, naturally it's only Khorne worshippers who would WANT to be Berzerkers.

It isn't contradictory exactly. It does say he augmented the captains and Lord Commanders who came to him to do so, but to the masses of troops he simply injected stimms. It's impossible for him to have augmented EVERY SINGLE MARINE of the EC by himself.

And yes, I'd agree with the Khorne Worshippers only wanting to get the treatment, but it sounded like you were saying otherwise before... >_>

When I said "normal", I basically meant "not already a Berzerker, Plague Marine, Noise Marine, Rubric Marine". I mean, what would "normal" mean for CSM, really?

As for Bile, in order delve into 40k fluff you've gotta be like Alice, and believe six impossible things before breakfast. I've pretty much turned off my realism-detector when it comes to Space Marines.