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Today i was thinking GW is huge it has a store in pretty much every city in the UK. Then wht is it stigmatized as nerdy you would think that would put people off?

In corporate terms, GW is tiny. They are just the biggest fish in a very very small pond with wargaming.

What MGS said plus playing with toys is looked down on as common thought is that adults should have something better/serious to spend their time on. Not sure what though?

I spend more time at the rugby club than gaming each week and can assure you that it's far more childish than any wargames event I've been to. Not sure what that says about me.

There are a few other reasons but the biggest is that we all ultimately think what we like is better than what everyone else likes and treats it accordingly. Just look at musical tastes and how people split down those lines particularly for young'uns. I can remember at college/uni there practically being fights over who's genre was better, belittling what others like despite knowing the square root of feth all about it.

Look at some of the comments on that BBC article today that add up to Football is better than 40k for example.

Dabansheedude wrote:Today i was thinking GW is huge it has a store in pretty much every city in the UK. Then wht is it stigmatized as nerdy you would think that would put people off?

Who said so? Stigmatized by who?

Can't be too nerdy if we're using it to plan real world .... work with. GW is a tiny tiny portion of what miniature wargaming is about. I've used it extensivly to plan operations, work though history lessons, teach with, Explain complex issues and graphicly show examples as to what will and won't work.

Wargaming is a staple of what I do, more accurate you are with the information, the more $$$ you earn the boss, so in effect- Play on, player!!!


Don't put too much stock in other peoples "Opinions."

Yeah... my coworkers think it's cool and are impressed that I have the attention span to sit there and paint up entire armies for hours at a time, and my girlfriend thinks that it's endearing. Frankly, if this is what stigmatised feels like, then frankly I could get used to it.

Maybe your presentation is off, otherwise, maybe you just associate with the wrong people.

We live in a world of geek chic. What are you worried about?

Now, being 16 and playing warhammer in 1987 when no one had heard of it, and there was nothing chic about geek... THAT is when there was a stigma.

... and I didn't care what anybody thought then, why would I care now?

Regardless of how popular GW or table top gaming becomes you will never get rid of the GEEK stigma because GEEKS play tabletop gaming...........


Walk into your local gamesnight and look around at the long greasy haired guy with black T-shirts that look like social degenerates, most dont have a GF or ever had one etc........

That is a GEEK and that is who plays this game.

Christ just watch a few video battle reports lol.... All Geeks!

The same phenomena applies to WoW and other similar MMOGs. Absolutely huge, people from every side of life are playing them and yet they still have major geek associations.

Which I agree with...

You have to look at what people outside of the hobby think as the stereotype of people who play table top board games. Goto a shop and look from the outside, or take a friend who know's nothing about the game. They will likely pinpoint on some of the gamers who are folks who have bad hygiene, bad social ettiquitte, are loud, and generaly obnoxious.

This stereotype is applied to card players, table top gamers, and anything fantasy related. Irony is, take that same friend to a Grand tournment. I'd say 75% of those players, have decent social ettiquette, better hygiene... pending the adult beveraging that day / nite before, and are your normal every day person with a hobby.

The stigmatizism is stuck on table top gamers, because of what non-table top gamers hone in on. They will ignore the 12 normal looking folks, and look at the few who annoy them. They won't look past the outside and see what a lot of gamer see, people with similar interests who are just different. I look like any average guy. But I know countless gamers who fit the "stereotype" and I think they are wondeful and awesome people. I hang out and go drinking with them. I love sitting around the table arguing about the Emperor, Horus, and why Thrakka is the best. Going drinking with my other group of friends, sometimes I miss being able to talk about painting, modeling, and tournments. My non gaming friends think my painted models are cool. But they will never get it.

Sorry to soap box, but more people SHOULD give things like warhammer a go. What's better for a teenager: being in a GW shop, interacting with adults / teenagers, and having to practice things like grammers, math, and social skills OR sitting being a computer or TV screen pushing numbers on a control pad or key board.

More people should tabletop game, its actually good for children in my opinion AND good for adults to remember how to interact with people younger then them especially when that takes place in person. I have no issues with WoW, I play, i love it. but i'd rather be out in public rolling dice, then on my couch in sweat pants.

notprop wrote:.

Look at some of the comments on that BBC article today that add up to Football is better than 40k for example.

Football (soccer for our colonial chums) is a game for pussies with pretty hair and earrings who are too scrawny to play rugby.

Yeah i agree, rugby made me the man I am today - that is to say slightly overweight, fond of a drink, a bit senseless and covered in innumerable cuts and scars.

I do know some cracking rude songs though!

GW is nerdier than historical wargames because it covers Dwarfs and Space Elfs rather than real history.

Grot 6 wrote:

Can't be too nerdy if we're using it to plan real world .... work with. GW is a tiny tiny portion of what miniature wargaming is about. I've used it extensivly to plan operations, work though history lessons, teach with, Explain complex issues and graphicly show examples as to what will and won't work.

Wargaming is a staple of what I do, more accurate you are with the information, the more $$$ you earn the boss, so in effect- Play on, player!!!


Don't put too much stock in other peoples "Opinions."

I'm sorry, but really??!?!? You use Warhammer 40K to "Teach"? Who, and what are you teaching? Can't be real world combat tactics? or even strategy? No, this needs further explanation or investigation.

Well when you bring up 40k in a soccer crowd, you're more than likely gonna be the only one who knows what your talking about. Same thing if a soccer fan brings up a soccer match in the middle of a GW store and no one cares about the match.

It took 50 years for sports as they are to become what they are and create the fans that exist right now. It will take another 20-40 years for gaming in all it's forms to be much more mainstream. Look at what poker has become if you need proof.

Though there will always be things too far off the beaten path to draw lots of people. Stuff like LARPing is in the boonies in that regard, and will probably stay there.

I find it funny that some gamers will defend being 'nerdy' yet look down upon LARPers. It's not even like Warhammer is that niche an interest, I find that a large number of people are acquainted with it in the UK even if they have never been in a shop and don't really know much about it. Try explaining something really peculiar like my interest in disused railway stations.

But generally, who cares what other people think? There seems a constant stream of threads about being nerdy, the stigma of gaming and whether people should be open about it or hide it away in shame.

Maybe it's a kids thing, but I stopped giving a feth about what others thought of my private life/hobbies years ago.

It's the same way that historical wargamers look down on people who play GW games, PP, or any other fictional TT game. Because pushing models around a table and rolling dice while reanacting historical fights is "serius bizness," while what we do is not.

Delephont wrote:

Grot 6 wrote:

Can't be too nerdy if we're using it to plan real world .... work with. GW is a tiny tiny portion of what miniature wargaming is about. I've used it extensivly to plan operations, work though history lessons, teach with, Explain complex issues and graphicly show examples as to what will and won't work.

Wargaming is a staple of what I do, more accurate you are with the information, the more $$$ you earn the boss, so in effect- Play on, player!!!


Don't put too much stock in other peoples "Opinions."

I'm sorry, but really??!?!? You use Warhammer 40K to "Teach"? Who, and what are you teaching? Can't be real world combat tactics? or even strategy? No, this needs further explanation or investigation.

I think he meant 'wargaming' in general.

I can think of quite a few wargamers who are stigmatized as nerdy, yet are also huge.

Brother SRM wrote:I can think of quite a few wargamers who are stigmatized as nerdy, yet are also huge.

I thought that this was what the thread would be about. I was
getting ready to lock it.

It's a niche market of a niche market. Gaming is nerdy, miniaturized
fantasy obsessions are nerdy, roleplay is nerdy. Why wouldn't
we be exponentially nerdier than the next person?

Delephont wrote:

Grot 6 wrote:

Can't be too nerdy if we're using it to plan real world .... work with. GW is a tiny tiny portion of what miniature wargaming is about. I've used it extensivly to plan operations, work though history lessons, teach with, Explain complex issues and graphicly show examples as to what will and won't work.

Wargaming is a staple of what I do, more accurate you are with the information, the more $$$ you earn the boss, so in effect- Play on, player!!!


Don't put too much stock in other peoples "Opinions."

I'm sorry, but really??!?!? You use Warhammer 40K to "Teach"? Who, and what are you teaching? Can't be real world combat tactics? or even strategy? No, this needs further explanation or investigation.

Whats to explain?

We use wargaming all the time. Its a staple of following through with planning. Just because I used to slip a rogue Space Marine mini in there once in awhile, or an Ork doesn't make it any less relevent. They got a comment once from the boss who wanted to know who had that equipment, and what unit that was, but when they came back with the feedback later- the boss thought it was none too funny.

Wonders never ceased when I found the IG book sitting around the ...office, though. (It was his)


Not the 40K per say, WARGAMING. BUT- the planning and training tools that I have would put some of the figures here to shame. I use some on scale with FOW, and other ones at much smaller scale. Map based AAR's. sandbox tables, digital and computer based sims, and even a few COD type shoot houses with a large screen and a weapons system set up with attachments beat Pew Pew noises any day of the week.

Kilkrazy wrote:GW is nerdier than historical wargames because it covers Dwarfs and Space Elfs rather than real history.

I think you will find the exact opposite is true.

Grot 6 wrote:
Whats to explain?

We use wargaming all the time. Its a staple of following through with planning. Just because I used to slip a rogue Space Marine mini in there once in awhile, or an Ork doesn't make it any less relevent. They got a comment once from the boss who wanted to know who had that equipment, and what unit that was, but when they came back with the feedback later- the boss thought it was none too funny.

Wonders never ceased when I found the IG book sitting around the ...office, though. (It was his)


Not the 40K per say, WARGAMING. BUT- the planning and training tools that I have would put some of the figures here to shame. I use some on scale with FOW, and other ones at much smaller scale. Map based AAR's. sandbox tables, digital and computer based sims, and even a few COD type shoot houses with a large screen and a weapons system set up with attachments beat Pew Pew noises any day of the week.

Ok, well I guess what you're saying would make more sense if "we" had a context to your "teaching" and "training". I appreciate that it may not be desired to tell everyone what you do for a living, but from your statements, I assume you have some involvement with Military or Law Enforcement. If that's true, then yeah, I can see how you might use miniatures to show tactics, and that makes perfect sense. My understanding of the thread however, was directly about using GW games and why they are seen as "nerdy". based on that, I thought you were suggesting you used WH40K (straight out of the box) as a teaching aid....which I think we’d all agree, would pretty much get your “students” dead, real quick!

I can see it now, “Right guys, when you see them insurgents, shoulder your rifle (cause you’ve only got a 24ft range anyway!) pull out your combat knife and charge them suckers”