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Hey guys

So im asking this on behalf of a friend who plays salamanders, and we figured a cool tactic would be to run a 5 man devastator squad with 4 MM and a combi melta in a pod, he runs vulkan so they would all be TL, and just drop then in for a heavy tank kill like a raider.

Is this viable ?

thanks in advance for the feedback.

It can work, but your still counting that elusive snapshot with all those multimeltas. Even if they are TL. Thats a lot of points to throw into a 1 hit wonder because i doubt they are going to survive much longer than that, up front and in the open.

While I have seen something similar done there are better options in the SM codex for this.

In a droppod
Dread- MM-CCW-Melta
Sternguard with combie melta

or attack bikes with MM

Devastators are not really cheap for what they do, the Dreads or Stern should perform better and provide a wider range of potential threat.

Sure.

But you could do a 5man Sternguard with 5 Combi Meltas for pretty much the same points when you add up the MMs.

Since those Multi Meltas will be snap firing...

sternguards can take up to two heavy or special weapons wich could be mm.
But you would loose special ammo and all that.
I play salamanders and when i take sterngard i usually take a heavy flamer or meltaguns, i never regret those special ammo shots.
It help AT squad or combat squad keep the same role after combis are expended.
For flamers squads, special ammo does the trick for infantry.
It is rarely worth it to keep those combi shots as they are high priority target.

As for devastators i figure it could work but that would be less efficient.
Try 5 sterns with two mm and 3 combimelta or more for a full squad...it will be better.
Would work for an all pod army though, if for somme reason all your elite slots are taken but a a MOFT would allow you to take ironclads in heavy wich would be more efficient for the points.
Taking a pod for devs might be worth it to give flexibility to your drop pod assault either dropping it empty first turn to restrict movement LOS or keeping in reserve some heavy hitters while the opponent reserve is off-table.

I'd do it. As a second wave thing, of course.

4 TLMMs are likely to score a hit in melta range, which is probably going to be good enough. Plus, it sets up a difficult situation for your opponents on turn 2 or 3. Either they shoot at the devs, or they shoot at the guys with krak grenades who may well be scoring.

It's not a good idea. Even TL, 4 MM's will score 1-2 hits. It's just kind of a waste. As already mentioned, Sternguard simply do it better.

Look at it this way. 5 Devastators with 4 multimeltas is 150pts. 5 Sternguard with 5 combi-meltas is... also 150pts! Drop pod costs the same for both so is irrelevant. You can swap 2 of the combi-meltas for regular meltas if you want, its the same points. You just lose the option of their special ammo in exchange for being an ongoing melta threat.

Devastators
When dropping in, all the multmeltas are snap-firing. Someone please check my math, but I believe 4 multimeltas snapfiring and including the effect of twinlinking will give 1.2 hits. That's pretty poor. Yeah, there's a good chance you'll pen, but you're banking a lot on that one shot. And if its a skimmer that moved, or has any kind of cover/invuln, there's another chance to do nothing. And if you're up against anyone without vehicles the unit is frankly quite poor, though I guess you could then just deploy them normally on your side of the board. Which obviously isn't a great outcome.

Sternguard
You can drop very aggressively with drop pods due to inertial guidance, so you're still very likely to get yourself within melta range with combi-meltas on the drop. You aren't snap-firing, so you are averaging 4.4 hits with your 5 combi-meltas, giving a much better chance to destroy what you are shooting. And if there aren't any vehicles, or there's an even tastier target, they still all have their special ammo, so they will be more useful more often. Also with the added bonus of being slightly less sucky if they get assaulted or have the opportunity to assault something, since they all have an extra base attack.

The main reason you'd even consider devastators is if you'd already filled all your elite slots. Sternguard in general are simply better. I even occasionally run 5 man sterns with 2 lascannons as a backfield firing unit instead of devastators, as 5 devs with 2 lascannons is actually 5 points more expensive! The only thing the devs have going for them is being able to take 4 heavy weapons (which is a lot more points obviously), but even then I find it's so soon that you are removing weapons as casualties it just isn't worth it. Unless you add more bodies to the unit... which makes them even more expensive.

I guess, the devastator w/4 MM's would be pretty rad in the turn AFTER they drop in, if they are still alive. Once they are no longer snapfiring they'd be pretty cool and have a decent threat range (even outside 12", MM's are still great at killing vehicles due to the AP1). But anyone who lets them live through a turn deserves what they get

To be fair, dropping 4 multimeltas would certainly LOOK pretty cool. And it isn't useless, just not 'optimal'. In a casual game, by all means go for it

Backlash wrote:
It can work, but your still counting that elusive snapshot with all those multimeltas. Even if they are TL. Thats a lot of points to throw into a 1 hit wonder because i doubt they are going to survive much longer than that, up front and in the open.

100% this. Devs aren't really meant for upclose and personal kicking of ass, so they're sort of limited by a drop pod. I'd pile a bunch of sternguard with combi meltas in the pod if you're looking for a shock + awe approach. IIRC you can combat squad 10 of them to divide fire.

I have a friend who does this with his SW. I think he has 4 MM, 1 combi-melta with an HQ. He loves this combo and runs 2 pods of this.

I faced him once, we both used our warhound titan. He dropped both pods next to mine, 10 melta shots... all missed. He has had it work in the past. Needless to say... my preadator took down both his void shields, and my warhound let go with a full barrage against his armor. My turbo laser scored dual 6's, and I re-rolled on the damage chat and took him down in 1 turn of shooting.

Its worth experiment around with, exspecially with vulkan, and TL'ing. Might be a better turn out!

J99Pwrangler wrote:
I have a friend who does this with his SW. I think he has 4 MM, 1 combi-melta with an HQ. He loves this combo and runs 2 pods of this.

Except SW do it far better because LF can splitfire but more importantly: Logan gives them relentless, no snap firing.

Sternguard just do it better than devs, sorry.

In similar lines, I've been considering a tactical squad with 10 men, multi melta, sarge with combi melta and melta gun as a 'poor mans sternguard squad.'

Theoretically scoring, can combat squad, put the multi melta into the second squad, have them go out the back of the pod. The sarge and the melta gun go in the front of the squad.

They fire at up to 2 tanks, or a tank and a squad. More guys to kill than a sternguard squad and it's 2 units your opponent needs to divert from the front lines to pull it off.

Edit: Oh, and I can't forget to throw a krak grenade from each squad, since I'm probably hitting rear armour too!

 Compel wrote:
In similar lines, I've been considering a tactical squad with 10 men, multi melta, sarge with combi melta and melta gun as a 'poor mans sternguard squad.'

Theoretically scoring, can combat squad, put the multi melta into the second squad, have them go out the back of the pod. The sarge and the melta gun go in the front of the squad.

They fire at up to 2 tanks, or a tank and a squad. More guys to kill than a sternguard squad and it's 2 units your opponent needs to divert from the front lines to pull it off.

Sternguard can do this too. I regularly come across an opponent with a 10man sternguard squad who once dropped, splits into 2 squads and ploughs my 2 Russes with 5 melta shots each, or if he's out of range of one will throw the melta combat squads into a chimera.
They're not scoring, but it's just really hard to beat this squad at what it does!

If you include the drop pod, they're still barely barely bringing their points back for taking out 2 somewhat-upgraded russes.

People have really started to get into using the sternguard podders at my club in the hopes of first blood. Half the time they end up going second, so lose out. When they do land, they quite often just don't end up killing their 'worth.' Either in points, or just general battlefield ability.

I've not considered their points cost. I'm not a marines player, but you can't simply analyse them by not taking out their points on the turn they arrive.

Even if they don't take out their target I spend a turn lighting them up. I just can't let them sit there in rapid fire range. That one squad, split into two has not only the potential to destroy 2 tanks on turn one, but also requires attention.

Although I see where you're coming from. Everyone wants a points sink to make it back, if they land and fluff they're gone, from the very same battle cannon they tried to remove.

It woould be good with Long Fangs. 5 MM and Logan for Relentless? And Split fire.