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So I had a nice 2k list but my friend changed the point limits so I hope it scales well.

Sammy
5 rw command squad with BoF, GL
Libby on bike, lvl 2, PFG
5 RW command squad with apothecarry, RW banner Gl
3X6 rw bikes with 2 meltas
MM attack bike
MM attack bike
2 vindicators
Whirlwind

Im not going to say what Im specifically taking on because although Im taking on one guy, I don't tailor. All you need to know is its cheese so I want to and am willingly to play the most competetive list available for rw

I could be wrong, and this is nothing negative on your play style, but dropping vindi scatter plates amongst all those large footprint bike squads could get messy. Especially as they've got melta which means they'll need to be close to where your vindis will be aiming. Just a thought, I think defensively tho, so having two aggressive units side by side is something I don't usually plan for.

well two things on that, against lists with tanks its probable that I'll combat squad the meltas and have a few units to throw at the opponents tanks. secondly the main reason I want vindies is actually anti infantry/MC because in combo with the GL's on the command squads, I can ID anything up to T6 which is nice to say the least. so hopefully the vindies will be targeting different things to them and will be in different enough areas to negate that. although there is the posibility that it could be near my BK squads because of the 12' rad range but hopefully it doesn't scatter back 12' which would suck a tonne.

thanks for that, personally I dont see it as being a major and frequent problem but it is important to consider when playing.

Do you have a few RW games under your belt?

Libby=Good choice "staple" in any DA list

RWCS= Always a good choice, the libbys PFG will help a little. do not expect them to last long. Id throw a dark shourd in. For its points its a steal, Stealth an Shroud=2+ cover save. Did you add a gernade launcher into this unit? -1 toughness to what ever they hit.

Biker= Must have, Meltas not to sure about i mean what its 20 points to equip two guys with one. They never seem to get in range and live to use it for me.

Attack Bikes= If one goes down they count as a unti and give up a kill point alone. Id play around with land speeder typhoons. They can stay back and give some nice fire support. Im looking into using them more.

The tanks= Like stated your going to be pretty much in the thick of it turn 2. Which is going to leave the tanks looking for targets and not protected. All it takes is one bad scatter and you just smoked some much needed bikers. If i was you i would scratch the tanks an add another unit of bikers.

Sammy=nothing great about him but his sword and cannon. Other wise 3 wounds with a 3 up save. He is ez to kill and really doesnt add much to the overall army. Keep him back he isnt a beast. His sword is nice swings and his I and is ap2.

I'd be inclined to run with Whirlwinds rather than Vindi's if you want some support in the form of tanks, they aren't hugely effedctive against your bikers if you do decide to go danger close and they're effective against a range of threats that you tend to see with Tau, Dark Eldar and Eldar!

 SheSpits wrote:
Do you have a few RW games under your belt?

Libby=Good choice "staple" in any DA list

RWCS= Always a good choice, the libbys PFG will help a little. do not expect them to last long. Id throw a dark shourd in. For its points its a steal, Stealth an Shroud=2+ cover save. Did you add a gernade launcher into this unit? -1 toughness to what ever they hit.

Biker= Must have, Meltas not to sure about i mean what its 20 points to equip two guys with one. They never seem to get in range and live to use it for me.

Attack Bikes= If one goes down they count as a unti and give up a kill point alone. Id play around with land speeder typhoons. They can stay back and give some nice fire support. Im looking into using them more.

The tanks= Like stated your going to be pretty much in the thick of it turn 2. Which is going to leave the tanks looking for targets and not protected. All it takes is one bad scatter and you just smoked some much needed bikers. If i was you i would scratch the tanks an add another unit of bikers.

Sammy=nothing great about him but his sword and cannon. Other wise 3 wounds with a 3 up save. He is ez to kill and really doesnt add much to the overall army. Keep him back he isnt a beast. His sword is nice swings and his I and is ap2.

I just have a few questions, 1st do you play a lot of tau or eldar? because where I play DS are absolutely useless, it takes almost no fire power for some armies to kill because of ignores cover being so prominent, I play a lot of eldar and tau and I can't expect to win tournaments with a DS purely because cover is not so useful. if you dont verse those armies a lot then they would be great but not for me. I'd be better spending those points towards a LS vengeance (yes I know they are terrible, thats my point), where I play they are no longer effective sorry.
2nd as for the meltas, I know they are close distance and stuff and I know about the attack bikes but how do yo otherwise plan or advise I take out AV13 or 14 with any marine armies or IG? I dont see any other option and unfortunatley while kiting is fun, LS don't do that job effectively because they would also suffer from range if they took MM especially since they are AV10.

Im still to try out and see if this large blast conundrum is a real problem or just a possible thing that may happen but will likely not.

here's proof, here's the probability's at various distances of a large blast from a vindicator coming back and hitting 1 squad of bikes with three man in the front (which is a generous assumption because the first three guys would usually be in a V formation. Now I measured these values out myself to make sure that the calculations were correct and I was bias against my self (said it did hit) on the "did it really hit" because you always come up against that guy. I also put the charge chances showing that really if you are 6" away you have about a 5% of scatter back and a 72% of charging. I'd take that risk.

Really this is a slight approximation but I'd id say its a pretty likely chance that the difference between my values and the actual values is negligible. Also yes I have two which means if I fire both every turn for 6 turns than I will get a 2 out of every 3 games a hit on my own guys, but for 6 turns of functionality of 2 vindies is well worth a little sacrifice. and If I decided 7" is the optimal well than realistically that's a 1 in every 4 games it will happen and well that's no problem. the point is that even at 6" on average I will only hit myself once every 19 shots (its actually higher but im rounding down to give myself the most pessimistic outlook)