Switch Theme:

Do you think all these multiple wound weapons are going to slow down the game?  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in lu
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought






We're seeing quite a few weapons, both melee and ranged d3/d6 damage or multiple hits, both at the same time seems to be reserved to really big guns.
Fnp type rolls are still a thing it appears and rolled per damage.

Four meltas in 7th were 4 to hit/wound/save/fnp rolls. Now its 4 to hit/wound/save rolls but d6 per wound taken in fnp rolls. And there will be more multi wound units around.
Multiple hitting weapons work the same as before although there seem to be more shots overall with the changes to twinlinked.
And the changes to AP mean there will be more save rolls in general.

Personally I expect that less units will have fnp mechanics and there won't be a ton of multiwound units besides vehicles and MC around.
At least not enough to really have any noticeable impact on time spent rolling dice. Vehicles will resolve faster than before despite the extra wounds imho.
No need to look up any tables to cause damage and roll for broken weapons and you're still likely shooting weapons that don't give them a save. Plus they'll likely to be the only model in the unit, so no need to allocate wounds.

There will be times when the rolling for extra wounds will be a bit finnicky but I feel like that'll be the exception rather than the rule.
Overall I don't expect the changes to shooting/melee to take up any more time than it takes now. Perhaps faster even as some USRs will be rolled into the damage like force and presumably no more instant death to account for either.
Also, many of the extra shots will not wound where they did before due to the new to wound values.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/19 18:37:51


 
   
Made in us
Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter







Not really. A lot of things slow AoS down but rolling damage isn't one of them.

(And if save-stacking goes away and we get 4e-style wound allocation back the game will speed up a lot more than the extra roll in the damage resolution process slows it down.)

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using.
Homebrew oldhammer project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/790996.page#10896267
Meridian: Necromunda-based 40k skirmish: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/795374.page 
   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord





Dallas area, TX

No more than rolling on a vehicle damage chart or on the D-table. The big difference is that it seems most armies will have multi-wound damage weapons (unlike having vehicles and D weapons in 7E) so EVERYONE should be readily familiar with the process, which will keep the game moving.

My favorite example right now is Force weapons. Though they do D3 wounds instead of Instant Death, there is no more psychic test required. I'll take a simple D3 over the resource management nightmare of Warp Charge that involves 2 rolls (yours and the opponents deny).

-

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Not only is the damage stay relatively meaningless in terms of rolling against what half of the units in the game, but I'm also not confident fnp is coming back. I wouldn't be surprised to see fnp be replaced with something like an ablative wound a turn, which if memory serves was the 2nd ed medkit.
   
Made in lu
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought






Yea force is lot better in this form. No setting aside dice, no testing, no being denied and then later no interaction between rules. It simply does it's damage and your done. And you don't have to remember who managed to get force manifested successfully without being denied. And there is no longer any discussion whether or not it buffs Thousand Sons XD.
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





I don't think it'll be a big deal; those weapons will only really "work" that way against multi-wound models. Against single-wound models you won't roll for the damage. At the end of the day, at most it'll be the same amount of rolling as with armor penetration.

 Galef wrote:
If you refuse to use rock, you will never beat scissors.
 
   
Made in lu
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought






Darkagl1 wrote:
Not only is the damage stay relatively meaningless in terms of rolling against what half of the units in the game, but I'm also not confident fnp is coming back. I wouldn't be surprised to see fnp be replaced with something like an ablative wound a turn, which if memory serves was the 2nd ed medkit.


From the live QnA thread here in general discussion:
Many armies have abilities that allows them to save wounds after Armour or Invulnerable saves (Dark Eldar get Power From Pain, Disgustingly Resilient for Nurgle Daemons). These saves occur after damage, so if an attack causes 5 damage you need to make 5 seperate secondary saves.

I didn't actually watch the video though.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 Roknar wrote:
Darkagl1 wrote:
Not only is the damage stay relatively meaningless in terms of rolling against what half of the units in the game, but I'm also not confident fnp is coming back. I wouldn't be surprised to see fnp be replaced with something like an ablative wound a turn, which if memory serves was the 2nd ed medkit.


From the live QnA thread here in general discussion:
Many armies have abilities that allows them to save wounds after Armour or Invulnerable saves (Dark Eldar get Power From Pain, Disgustingly Resilient for Nurgle Daemons). These saves occur after damage, so if an attack causes 5 damage you need to make 5 seperate secondary saves.

I didn't actually watch the video though.


IIRC they made power from pain sound more like reanimation protocols. Where every casualty had a chance to come back on a 6.
   
Made in lu
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought






Hmm, guess we'll have to wait a while to find out then.
   
Made in au
Ancient Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnought






I think the extra armour saves will be levelled out by the mortal wounds that ignore both armour and invulnerable saves.
Most of the multiple wound weapons are high AP or done after saves anyway.
Remembering the order is going to be a pain for the first few games but when people are used to it things might get faster.

I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go. 
   
Made in us
Calculating Commissar




pontiac, michigan; usa

Honestly whether people know it or not this game is featuring quite a lot of stuff from old Warhammer Fantasy. 7th edition WHFB had chargers go first, fantasy had strength giving negative modifiers to armor saves rather than canceling out, multi wounds are WHFB including d3 and d6 and there's a couple more. If anything 8th seems like a combo between 40k, WHFB and AoS.

I'm a bit uncomfortable about some of the AoS aspects however. I can't tell you how much i hate AoS but luckily the no points costs thing is not in this.

For me slowing down the game wasn't a huge issue though big games of AoS look slow far as i can see. I don't like the morale system, don't know that i like wounds on vehicles and i don't know that i like primaris marines. On the upside primaris marines are similar to the thunder warriors being transitioned to space marines but they just made it sound a bit dumb. Also it doesn't sound like the baddies are too big a deal. Grim dark is turning into noble bright and though i don't like grim dark the enemies have to feel like a threat for the setting to matter.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/05/20 23:22:26


Join skavenblight today!

http://the-under-empire.proboards.com/ (my skaven forum) 
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran




I'll bet In about 6 months time we'll have a "universal house rule" in place like in WMH where you roll for the column along with the damage dice (on the off chance you break their armour), even though officially speaking you're not supposed to do this in the rules, but everyone does it to speed up the game.

I see a similar thing being done amongst the 40k player base if it's not in the base rules.
   
Made in nl
Bounding Assault Marine






Of course, in some cases you can just ignore a damage roll.

If you use a D3/D6 damage weapon to hit a single target that has only 1 Wound, and no way (such as an invulnerable save) to mitigate this damage, why roll at all? That roll would just be for the thrill of seeing 'how dead the target is'.

   
Made in nl
Longtime Dakkanaut






Multi wound models slow down the game. -> Models stay on the field longer and thus demand more time.

Multi wound weapons hasten it.
No time is wasted against 1 wound models since you do not need to roll for additional wounds.
The additional wounds rolled against multi wound models cost time but also kill those "monsters" faster. The extra dmg rolls are more than compensated by the time that is saved by removing the time consuming multi wound model.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/21 11:19:52


Inactive, user. New profile might pop up in a while 
   
Made in au
Hissing Hybrid Metamorph





'Straya... Mate.

I think once everyone has sorted a good way of wound counting it will be fine.

 
   
 
Forum Index » 40K General Discussion
Go to: