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The idea its pretty simple. If a close combat army like blood angels can put a librarian inside a dreadnought and make it work, why the hell the mighty thousand sons, the psychic astartes chapter (no one say grey knights) cant? this would be exclusive to thousand sons and successor chapters in a maybe tzeentch demon kin codex, like khorne and probably nurgle have. Here are my ideas for a stat chart. (Disclaimer: English inst my mother tongue, expect some grammatical errors)

Battle role: HQ 11PL/160P

M8 / WS3 / BS3 / S6 / T7 / W8 / A3 / LD8 / SV3+

A Mirage helbrute is a single model equipped with a soulreaper cannon and a ritual force axe



(idea for the axe instead of an arm)

Ritual force Axe: Melee / Melee / S+4 / AP-4 / D3

this model may replace his soulreaper cannon with a heavy warp flamer

this model may replace his soulreaper cannon with a heavy warp flamer

(I will use similar rules to that of the chaos index, so i wont put the description for Copyright themes)

Crazed: The same of the helbrute, but you have to cast smite instead of shoot or figth.

Favoured of tzeentch T

Explodes

Psyker: Can cast 2 powers, deny 1 and knows smite and 2 of heretic discipline

Faction keywords: Chaos, Tzeentch, Heretic Astartes, Thousand Sons.

Keywords: Character, Vehicle, Helbrute, Psyker, Sorcerer, Mirage Helbrute

And some fluff: Since the times when the emperor walked among his sons across the galaxy, the crippled heroes of the adeptus astartes has been preserved for the eternity inside the sarcophagus of the mighty dreadnoughts, ready to fight for the imperium for all eternity. In the case of the thousand sons legion, such honor was granted to the wiser and most powerful of their librarians. In his natal world, Prospero, the Adeptus Mechanicus gave the legion a new model of dreadnoughts, capable of contain and preserve the knowledge and intellect of so reverenced psykers, the mirage pattern. Without the limitations of a mortal body, and instant access to the vast libraries of arcane knowledge of the imperium, this inmortal soldiers became the guardians of the most sacred piramids and places of the planet or counselors of their beloved primarch, Magnus. With the attack of the space wolves to prospero during the Horus Heresy, many of these ancient machines were destroyed defending his home or were lost forever during the long exile of the legion inside the warp. Like the entire legion, the changing forces of the empyrean also affected the remaining Dreadnoughts of the Thousand Sons, twisting this once reverenced war sarcophagus, into horrible tombs of nightmare , his once wise librarian pilots into crazed heretic sorcerers. What was an honor in past and glorious days is now a cruel punishment to any aspiring sorcerer who dares to challenge the control of his master over the cabal. The simple execution of such a valuable arcane "resource" isnt enough for an exalted sorcerer of tzeentch, who will enslave the psychic power of such a naive fool until his objectives are achieved.

So what do you think?

I like the idea, but fluff-wise, A Helbrute is so broken in mind that they are little more than a force of pure hatred that seeks to crush and destroy than one that uses Psychic might, not to mention that this madness would leave them terribly open to daemons of the warp if they could channel their power. If they were more like a standard dreadnought, then yes, I would agree wholeheartedly. but as a Helbrute, no.

Tristanleo wrote:
I like the idea, but fluff-wise, A Helbrute is so broken in mind that they are little more than a force of pure hatred that seeks to crush and destroy than one that uses Psychic might, not to mention that this madness would leave them terribly open to daemons of the warp if they could channel their power. If they were more like a standard dreadnought, then yes, I would agree wholeheartedly. but as a Helbrute, no.

Maybe, since it is a new unique pattern, that allows a little bit of control (or enslave, which is a regular theme with the rubrics souls, now also extending to disobedient aspiring sorcerers. Maybe ahriman find another spell to preserve the mind and enslave his fallen entourage for eternity) and his pilot isnt a regular marine, but a wise librarian/now chaos sorcerer, who has spent his entire life bending the warp to his will, it can withstand the voices in his head a little bit better to channel. And honestly we are chaos, we are all crazy to some degree. although i cover that with the crazed rule just for smite(not all the heretic discipline, in my mind it represents the helbrute, feeling the wound, enrage and channel a burst of psychic RAPE, like some force nova or empyrean lightnings out of nowhere, he cant control his mind for the other-better focusing powers), instead than also shoot the soulreaper cannon or warp flamer, or striking with the force axe. If that isnt enough, well, just make that any perils do 1d6 mortal wounds (but update his wounds to 9 to compensate), so that will be fluffy, meaning his lack of control carrying more risks. Besides its a character with the resistance of a dreadnought and tzeentch blessings, it shouldnt fall to a lass cannon easily.

The other option will be to use a contemptor chaos dreadnought pattern, since a)they are reserved for chaos lords (a sorcerer in a thousand sons equivalent), b) they are reverenced and still want demon ascension, so no risk of madness c) its a lost pre-heresy tech, so it will explain why this sorcerers are a rare view this days.

Is there no psychic dread for chaos in FW?

im surprised.

I like the idea, but I think I agree Tristaneio, that a Helbrute may be the wrong fit.

There are two obvious options though. First is to simply not call it a Helbrute; I think a psychically powerful daemon shackled to (or mutated from) something that used to be a Dreadnought is perfectly fine, it just feels like it should be called something else, as Helbrute very much feels like a hulk-smash unit thematically

The alternative is to make it more like a regular Dreadnought, e.g- a Rubric Contemptor or something along those lines.


Anyway, that's just the theme; rules-wise this looks pretty reasonable to me!

 Desubot wrote:
Is there no psychic dread for chaos in FW?

im surprised.

Thousand Sons in 30k can upgrade a Contemptor to an Orison pattern.

 MagicJuggler wrote:

 Desubot wrote:
Is there no psychic dread for chaos in FW?

im surprised.

Thousand Sons in 30k can upgrade a Contemptor to an Orison pattern.

Damn, never read about it... thanks for the info