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How are you supposed to measure charges now? Do you measure the base-to-base diagonal (C), or the horizontal and vertical combined (A+B)? And whether the model has Fly no longer makes any difference at all, right? I made a gakky drawing to show what I mean.



Signed, a Tau player who doesn't understand charging things.

For most models it is the exact distance from one base to the other base, as it has always been* (With specific previous exceptions of course)

So usually the answer is C.

C.

Measure the shortest distance between the bases of the two units.

A charge is subject to the normal rules for movement, so surely it's A+B right?

You can’t hover through the air.

C can be used to determine Charge eligibility.
A+B must be used to measure the actual movement. You measure up, across and down obstacles, not just diagonal lines through the air. (Citation: the core Movement rules)

 JohnnyHell wrote:
You can’t hover through the air.

C can be used to determine Charge eligibility.
A+B must be used to measure the actual movement. You measure up, across and down obstacles, not just diagonal lines through the air. (Citation: the core Movement rules)

Agreed.

To confirm what others have said, you measure ranges with C and movement with A+B

So I know they altered Fly, but from what I can tell Infantry can still do some wonky movement through Ruins. Would Infantry on the ground floor of a Ruin be able to diagonally charge Infantry on the second floor of a Ruin since they can "move through the floor and walls...without impediment"?

Audustum wrote:
So I know they altered Fly, but from what I can tell Infantry can still do some wonky movement through Ruins. Would Infantry on the ground floor of a Ruin be able to diagonally charge Infantry on the second floor of a Ruin since they can "move through the floor and walls...without impediment"?

Depends on the shape of the ruin. If it's a solid block then yes. If not, then I don't think so. They can move vertically up a wall and stuff, but could only move diagonally through a block of ruin.

Honestly though the terrain rules are somewhat lacking in specifics here so it's definitely something you want to discuss before a game!

So for Charging a roll of C is enough?

When A =4, B = 4 and C = 6 then you can take with a fly unit the Charge with a roll of 6/5?
And none fly units need the 8/7?

Skullphoquer wrote:
So for Charging a roll of C is enough?

When A =4, B = 4 and C = 6 then you can take with a fly unit the Charge with a roll of 6/5?
And none fly units need the 8/7?

No. To initially see if you're eligible to charge it's C. For the actual charge, however, you're still bound by the movment rules and you still have to measure horizontally and vertically for the actual charge itself, so with your example you would need to roll at least a 7 to get within 1" and have a successful charge.

Given the rules, it's possible to declare a charge against an enemy that you can't actually reach.

Let's say you're 6 inches away from a 6.5" inch tall building. An enemy is on top of the building, 2.1" inches from the edge facing you. Measuring diagonally, you're 10.4", base to base. You are allowed to declare a charge. You'll need ~13.7" of movement to get within 1" of the enemy. 6" to the building, 6.5" up and 1.2" to get within 1" of the enemy. I'm rounding a bit here and there, but I wanted to illustrate that it's very possible to be able to declare a charge and then be unable to make the charge if you don't have some sort of bonus to your charge range.

 doctortom wrote:

No. To initially see if you're eligible to charge it's C. For the actual charge, however, you're still bound by the movment rules and you still have to measure horizontally and vertically for the actual charge itself, so with your example you would need to roll at least a 7 to get within 1" and have a successful charge.

Is this because of this clarification from the "Stepping into a new edition" PDF?

Q: How do vertical distances work for movement and measurements?
A: All distances are measured in three dimensions, so if a unit moves over a hill or scales a wall, the horizontal distance and vertical distance combined cannot exceed its Movement characteristic. This means that in order to traverse across an obstacle, you must move up to the top of that obstacle, move across the top of it, then move down it.

So when there is scenery that you either cannot ignore (because it's the charge phase) or don't want to ignore (because you want to land on top of it). You must move up to up it, move up to the top and then move across.

So this is the thing that stops just measuring diagonally for flyers?

 Uther wrote:

So when there is scenery that you either cannot ignore (because it's the charge phase) or don't want to ignore (because you want to land on top of it). You must move up to up it, move up to the top and then move across.

Yes. But, if you have the FLY keyword, and its the movement phase, you can ignore that scenery and move across it. But if you want to land on top of it you would have to add horizontal and vertical distance.

 Uther wrote:

So this is the thing that stops just measuring diagonally for flyers?

You always measure directly base to base (if the unit has a base, otherwise its the hull) for charging and weapons range (which can be diagonally). No matter what unit. But moving is always horizontal and vertical distance added together.

Skullphoquer wrote:
So for Charging a roll of C is enough?

When A =4, B = 4 and C = 6 then you can take with a fly unit the Charge with a roll of 6/5?
And none fly units need the 8/7?

Technically, a right triangle can never have dimensions of 4, 4 & 6. You'd have a 4, 4 & 5.66 or 4.24, 4.24 & 6 triangles.