| Author |
Message |
 |
|
|
 |
|
Advert
|
Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
- No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
- Times and dates in your local timezone.
- Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
- Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
- Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now. |
|
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/27 18:33:27
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
Defending Guardian Defender
|
Hello all,
Background:
This list was born from extensive playtesting against Salamanders Space Marines, so if I'm a bit biased it's against marine bodies and meltaguns.
Previously I ran 2-3 Wave Serpents to shuttle around the dire avengers and protect the reapers turn 1. The wave serpents have proved to be a liability not only because of the prevalence of high AP weaponry, but also because they took my opponent's Bring It Down potential through the roof. Additionally I could never find a Secondary Objective that really worked for me to finish off my usual Engage On All Fronts and Deploy Scramblers.
Overview:
The new version of this list seeks to run Engage On All Fronts, Deploy Scramblers, and While We Stand, We Fight as secondaries. These picks allow me to focus on position over killing power and gives me a lot of play regardless of my opponents army. This is a Custom Craftworld with the Expert Crafters and Superior Shuriken traits, thus you will see a lot of MSU unit choices to try to maximize the efficiency of the EC ability. I am limited in my choices of high point single models, because my WWSWF targets are currently 2 farseer skyrunners and a wraithlord that will be put in strategic reserve until the endgame, and I would like to keep those my choices. Most of my powers tend to buff a single shining spears squad at a time, which will be shunted into the enemy 1 at a time, unless there's some great opportunity I can't pass up; However the guardian blob in the webway is available as a defensive move to allow my characters to hide, lock down a position, get that 3++, and fire at a problem unit while remaining out of the charge range of typical units, thanks to the SS trait. The SS trait also allows for shining spears to fire and fade closer to enemies who are even farther away than usual. All of the seers will be operating as an untargetable, unbuffed seer council, harassing the edges of enemy positions and staying alive at all costs.
All of that being said, here's the list:
List:
Battalion:
HQ: Farseer Skyrunner - Fortune - Executioner - Smite
HQ: Farseer Skyrunner - Doom - Mind War - Smite
HQ: Warlock Skyrunner - Protect - Fateful Divergence
Elite: 5x Striking Scorpions - Stalker
Troop: 5x Dire Avengers - Battle Fortune
Troop: 5x Dire Avengers - Battle Fortune
Troop: 20x Guardians - 2x Starcannons
Fast: 3x Shining Spears - Starlance - Skilled Rider
Fast: 3x Shining Spears - Starlance - Skilled Rider
Fast: 3x Shining Spears - Starlance - Skilled Rider
Heavy: 3x Dark Reapers - Fast Shot
Heavy: 3x Dark Reapers - Fast Shot
Heavy: 3x Dark Reapers - Fast Shot
Spearhead:
HQ: Warlock Skyrunner - Jinx - Fateful Divergence
HQ: Warlock Skyrunner - Quicken - Fateful Divergence
Heavy: Wraithlord - 2x Starcannons
Heavy: War Walker - 2x Starcannons
Heavy: War Walker - 2x Starcannons
Heavy: War Walker - 2x Starcannons
Summary:
This list is currently 105 pts under 2000. I'm struggling to decide what else to take. I am open to general comments/suggestions as well as, what the heck do I do with the remaining points??? I'm willing to drop a starcannon or two off of the wraithlord if that gets me something noticeably better. This list should be take all comers, but should be marine focused and oriented towards tournament play and the standard missions. I considered two Vypers, but they give up BID points. I considered +1 shining spears to each squad. I considered Fire Dragons, but I worry they may be too CP heavy. I considered 2 squads of Windriders, but I'd have to buy the models.
Let me know, and thanks for reading
|
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/28 01:16:27
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/28 23:04:08
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
Agile Revenant Titan
|
For Deploy Scramblers, a squad of Warp Spiders are very useful and start at 90 or so points.
|
No earth shattering, thought provoking quote. I'm just someone who was introduced to 40K in the late 80's and it's become a lifelong hobby. |
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/29 18:17:53
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
Defending Guardian Defender
|
That's not a bad suggestion, strangely enough I tend to struggle most with the mid-board scrambler deploy, which warp spiders would do well.
Is there an inherent advantage to Warp Spiders over another fast infantry unit like Howling Banshees who just got their strength buff?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/29 18:47:14
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
[DCM]
Procrastinator extraordinaire
|
While your list is a unique take on Craftworlds in the current meta, you just have to accept that bring it down is something that you have to sacrifice in order to protect your squishy infantry and give your opponent something to shoot at that aren't your highly mobile shining spears that will be doing the leg work with superior shuriken and expert crafters. I understand you're in a melta heavy meta, but the list will struggle against other match-ups without a couple of grav tanks around.
Regarding the shining spears, they are already so mobile in the first place, I am not sure fire and fade is the best stratagem for them due to the fact they can't make a charge move after they use it and it could leave them stranded from your buffing units.
Are you running a second jinx/protect jetlock for redundancy's sake? They're the same power in the runes of battle so you wouldn't be able to cast both as far as I am aware, and you have a high redundancy in fateful divergence too, which I am sure you have a plan for. Focus will would be an excellent addition to make your denies and casting easier also.
I have tried warp spiders recently and for 90 points they're excellent in securing deploy scramblers. Their inherent deepstrike saves you CP, they are -1 to hit when shot at and have incredible movement that banshees cannot beat. Plus, if you want a large move across the board, they have a redeploy exarch trait which is very handy, albeit once per game.
I am curious as to how your Dark Reapers are performing, they're very expensive for T3, 1W infantry that don't lend themselves to fire and fade and the lower AP of their weapons would need the remove cover trait to aid them there.
Finally, I wouldn't discount the new banshees though, they may work in a different list with grav tanks.
|
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/29 22:44:05
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
Agile Revenant Titan
|
Warp Spider Exarch ability Web of Deceit and inherent ability to enter from reserve would be the built in advantages. For example, turn 1, a squad of DA completes an action for Deploy Scramblers. Turn 2, the Warp Spiders enter from reserve and completes the second Deploy Scramblers. The objective is to keep them away from enemy shooting and assault as much as possible. Turn 3, use Web of Deceit to move them in the final area to complete the action for Deploy Scramblers.
Until a new codex is released, I've relegated to building mechanized Craftworld armies and accept giving up Bring It Down.
|
No earth shattering, thought provoking quote. I'm just someone who was introduced to 40K in the late 80's and it's become a lifelong hobby. |
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/10/31 17:17:49
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
Adolescent Youth with Potential
Jackson-MS
|
Is there a way to make Bring it Down as painful as possible for the other army ?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/11/03 18:39:49
Subject: [2000] - Craftworld Eldar - Keep Away
|
 |
Defending Guardian Defender
|
Ok, after all of this evidence and some consideration, I agree that warp spiders are definitely the missing sauce from the list. Their shooting feels like icing on the cake if they're not doing actions long enough to get off a shot or two off. Thank you so much for the insight.
My first iterations leaned really heavily into bring it down, but the main issue that I have is that not only am I giving my opponents an easy secondary, but I couldn't figure out what to do with my third secondary after engage on all fronts and deploy scramblers.. So I felt like including wave serpents watered down my list and led to a huge swing in secondary points..
I'm curious what the grav tanks actually protect, I play pretty weirdly so maybe that's the confusion.
So this list's game plan is to generally hide behind cover or at long range. Then put a bunch of random units popping out of nooks and crannies, hiding, lining up single LOS vectors for efficient shooting. So, be everywhere, be annoying, but don't directly engage most of the time. If you hang back, then I can hold the mid-field and shunt buffed spears at you every turn. If you rush me, I pop in behind you while focusing down key units with spears and reapers. Currently, when I play well, there's not really anything except an awful shining spears squad to shoot T1, and I throw out a few shots with reapers and hopefully engage on at least 3 fronts. T2 I've got walkers and jetbikes running all over, and my infantry is still pretty hidden. The longer the game goes, the more I trickle in troops behind terrain, and hit you with a witchfire or two, and shoot you with reapers. T4 guardian blob and wraithlord come in at the most awkward locations, because both of them are tough to kill without the right guns.
The dark reapers are incredible, typically MVP status, I would take more if it weren't for the rule of 3. 4 heavy shots with a to hit re-roll at 48" is incredible. They are all the way back in my deployment zone, and they tend to drift back and forth on different sides of LOS blocking terrain. The trick is to only open up LOS on a single target, or more as long as your opponent doesn't have significant long range fire. They are usually priority #1 for LOS blocking terrain, which makes them very survivable.
The dire avengers easily hide behind cover, try to deploy scramblers and potentially hide my HQs at a mid-field-ish objective. They haven't really needed a transport.
So the shining spears and psychic powers are interesting, I typically only send out 1 at a time. 2 if there's some kind of opportunity I just can't ignore. The one that gets sent out gets Fortune and Protect, as well as probably Quicken and maybe Fateful Divergence for the re-rollable 2++ from shooting on the Exarch.
The trick with the psychic powers is yes, protect has redundancy, but also jinx is incredible, especially jinx and doom against the Guardian Blob's target is juicy. Sometimes I don't need jinx, sometimes I don't need quicken, and I never want to smite with a warlock, so by having fateful divergence across all 3 warlocks I'm able to optimize my flexibility depending on my buff/debuff needs for that round. And because they have different names when cast, you can cast both halves of a runes of battle power. I don't know how I would make focus will work, since I would probably want to cast in on a warlock, with a warlock.... I find that the seer council stratagem fills a similar niche.
|
|
|
 |
 |
|
|
|