Grey Knights Black Box in stores March 12th/ pics on page 12 onwards.

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**BrassScorpion**

What a few people here seem to recognize, but many people here appear to have forgotten or simply don't realize due to later entry dates to Warhammer 40,000 is that the original 1987 version of the game was a very tongue-in cheek RPG/skirmish game that was a conglomeration of ideas from myriad science fiction and fantasy sources. There are still elements today that reflect that sensibility and during the past couple years GW has gone out of its way to bring back, albeit in altered forms, some of those early Rogue Trader elements. The Jokaero is just another example of that kind of "call-back" to the early days. If people wish to take 40K super-seriously they can do that, it's their right, but the elements of overt silliness and humor will always be there, so venting hatred toward them time after time with each release accomplishes nothing and will surely not alter what GW is doing. There, I said it and I'd say it again.

If you're bitter about that reality, check out the quote from The Mighty Boosh in my signature below and repeat it to yourself like a litany.

**Breotan**

physcosamatic wrote:Dreadknight. Its like, a Greyknight made sweet love to a Wraithlord and a Tau battle suit then the children of those 2 had a baby together then that baby got made sweet love to by a greyknight then this would be the creation. After a long time of cleansing and purifying.

What are you talking about? Everyone knows the Space Marines desperately needed a War Walker of their very own.

**Flashman**

JGrand wrote:In all seriousness, I found this linked image. Can anyone confirm if this is the Jokearo?

Finally, anyone who has seen the codex care to share some wargear or differences from the pdf? I don't mean to be a jerk and divert the conversation from bashing the Dread Knight with the same four jokes over and over again...

Hmm... small pic, but definitely an orange monkey. Yes, this is what was missing from 40K

**puma713**

Flashman wrote:
JGrand wrote:In all seriousness, I found this linked image. Can anyone confirm if this is the Jokearo?

Finally, anyone who has seen the codex care to share some wargear or differences from the pdf? I don't mean to be a jerk and divert the conversation from bashing the Dread Knight with the same four jokes over and over again...

Hmm... small pic, but definitely an orange monkey. Yes, this is what was missing from 40K

I'm not sure I am going to be able to shoot and kill these things. Aren't they endangered? The Dreadknight, however. . . I'm as anxious to kill one as GK players to field one.

**BrassScorpion**

I'm not sure I am going to be able to shoot and kill these things. Aren't they endangered?

You definitely don't want to find out what this new Imperial simian ally's close range weapon is, not at all.

**Neffertech**

Flashman wrote:
JGrand wrote:In all seriousness, I found this linked image. Can anyone confirm if this is the Jokearo?

Finally, anyone who has seen the codex care to share some wargear or differences from the pdf? I don't mean to be a jerk and divert the conversation from bashing the Dread Knight with the same four jokes over and over again...

Hmm... small pic, but definitely an orange monkey. Yes, this is what was missing from 40K

I wonder if he still have the Clyde Rolex watch. "Scrap the Rhino Clyde"

**tech66**

**BrassScorpion**

That's not the weapon I was talking about, I was referring to the common close range throwing weapon commonly used by most higher primates.

**Breotan**

puma713 wrote:I'm not sure I am going to be able to shoot and kill these things. Aren't they endangered?

I wouldn't worry too much. Given the likely price of $15.00 each, I don't think you'll see to many of them on the table.

**Lord Scythican**

You know I find myself defending the Dread Knight sometimes, but that Jokaero (Joke) is pushing it. Seriously that thing is in the same army as Grey Knights? I might be able to believe it being in a Tau army, but Grey Knights?

**sourclams**

Breotan wrote:
puma713 wrote:I'm not sure I am going to be able to shoot and kill these things. Aren't they endangered?
I wouldn't worry too much. Given the likely price of $15.00 each, I don't think you'll see to many of them on the table.

With Counts-As alive and well I could fill my Chimeras with Lizardmen Skinks for a pittance and watch my Skinkaero lascannon it up.

**ductvader**

bhsman wrote:
ph34r wrote:The only Daemonhunters players that should be mad are daemonhunters players that used only inducted guard.

The good news is, they made a codex for inducted guard. It's called Codex: Imperial Guard.

Oh right, there's no way a Grey Knights player would be upset at:

-Losing WS5, True Grit or an equivalent, and being made Ld8 and losing Fearless for ATSKNF - all the while being told that Grey Knights are as above normal Astartes as an Astartes is to a man

-Being composed entirely of Mary Sues like Thawn and the Chapter Master who's never there but doubled as a Warp Entity (for no reason other than Ward's own whimsy, looking at his model), Draigo, who makes the Emperor weep with inadequacy

-Warrior Acoyltes being BS3 to represent the elite Inquisitorial Stormtroopers

-A Grey Knight character being allowed to join a unit of Daemonhosts (who are essentially toothless)

-Eversors losing Bio-Meltdown and Infiltrate

-Culuxes losing the Pariah aura and the ability to single out Psykers in CC

-Assassins only being given a 6+ FNP aside from their unchanged 4+ Dodge save

-Crowe, who unlocks Purifers - the most faithful representation of the old PAGK - as troops, is not an Independent Character for whatever reason

-Being reduced to only 1,000 Grey Knights and essentially being made Silver Ultramarines in terms of organization

-Any other dumb retcons Ward will arbitrarily make in the process of rewriting the fluff of the first army I ever played

-All of this happening exactly one year after he ruined Blood Angels for me

...but no, you're right, I haven't got a reason to be upset.

Well said...the codex did take a beating I will admit...but the more I look at it...the more I am laughing at the bandwagon. They have no idea what it's like to play GKs...and not much has changed in terms of play style. You have to be flawless...and in a month there are going to be some very frustrated people selling their expensive army.

And by the way...so glad I have my metal models...they're so much more gorgeous...TGK aside. Glad to have plastic of course for the few necessary conversions...

**Flashman**

So what does the monkey do anyway?

**ductvader**

Obliterater that gives bonuses to the unit as well

**ph34r**

So is anyone else pissed at the fact that Psycannons, GK's primary anti tank, are 24" for both heavy and assault?

**Ian Sturrock**

I like the goofiness of the Joker-Os, and will probably be fielding several of them, most likely in some kind of counts-as form. I like that it looks like this codex will be usable for all kinds of crazy circus armies. I might even mash up my old metal GKs with some CSM bits, add in some traitor guard, and use this codex for a Lost and the Damned army... looks spot on for that, given that we can have henchmen, MEQs, and weird oddball stuff.

**deleted20250424**

BrassScorpion wrote:That's not the weapon I was talking about, I was referring to the common close range throwing weapon commonly used by most higher primates.

Can't stop laughing.

Good times.

**reds8n**

doing the rounds as well...

**Kirasu**

Well said...the codex did take a beating I will admit...but the more I look at it...the more I am laughing at the bandwagon. They have no idea what it's like to play GKs...and not much has changed in terms of play style. You have to be flawless...and in a month there are going to be some very frustrated people selling their expensive army.

What? Demon hunters has been the absolute worst codex since it came out more or less.. Even 3rd ed orks could beat it

I cant fathom how it has taken a beating.. Yeah you lose WS5 for power weapons and a 5 pt reduction in cost. Oh, also you gain mobility and options!

Thats a pretty elitist attitude to take that only people can win by being flawless. You've gained rhinos, a crazy MC and things that can actually kill units. This codex will destroy almost all nid armies and is like the space marine codex except everything is better

This is not your 3rd ed book, lets realize it's powerful book and not assume only a few people will play it well.

**puma713**

reds8n wrote:*snip*

Is it me, or are the characters underwhelming? I mean, how are you supposed to stand out when every marine in the army is as ornate as the SC's?

Save for Draigo's shield, which is pretty amazing, they all look like just another Grey Knight to me.

**ph34r**

puma713 wrote:
reds8n wrote:*snip*

Is it me, or are the characters underwhelming? I mean, how are you supposed to stand out when every marine in the army is as ornate as the SC's?

Save for Draigo's shield, which is pretty amazing, they all look like just another Grey Knight to me.

If the characters were any more ornate, people would be bitching about how over the top flashy they are. I think they strike a good balance as is.

**Magister187**

Kirasu wrote: Oh, also you gain mobility and options!

Most important change imo. Old Codex, while it had some great things about, was horribly limited in certain ways. Why the update drastically changed the concept of what a Grey Knight army is supposed to look like, it HAD to be done for it to be competitive. I think its a really awesome update, something I have been waiting for, and I am excited to begin collecting a GK army.

Btw, Dreadknight isn't great, but is far from the worst model GW has made. It's more Accord Crosstour then Nissan Cube. The rest of the range looks pretty good for plastic interpretations of amazing metals.

**synack**

ph34r wrote:So is anyone else pissed at the fact that Psycannons, GK's primary anti tank, are 24" for both heavy and assault?

I'm actually starting to think that you're trolling now.

Bramgaunt said on warseer after you posted, that it's the Psybolter that is 24" in assault/heavy NOT the psycannon

**Earthbeard**

JGrand wrote:In all seriousness, I found this linked image. Can anyone confirm if this is the Jokearo?

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/200685_191901017516144_153487338024179_477507_7933324_n.jpg

Finally, anyone who has seen the codex care to share some wargear or differences from the pdf? I don't mean to be a jerk and divert the conversation from bashing the Dread Knight with the same four jokes over and over again...

I can confirm 1000% that is the new Jokaero yes.

edit - too late to the party tonight

**bhsman**

synack wrote:I'm actually starting to think that you're trolling now.

Bramgaunt said on warseer after you posted, that it's the Psybolter that is 24" in assault/heavy NOT the psycannon

Well considering there's a ton of people who have apparently seen the codex but won't post rules from it, don't blame us for not being sure what specific profiles are and being up-to-date on what a random poster on Warseer is saying. No offense to Bram, but seriously, I had heard something similar just now myself.

**Kirasu**

I seriously hope there is an apoc formation that requires 5 dreadknights and allows you to form a Dread Knight Titan

**Kanluwen**

reds8n wrote:doing the rounds as well...

I can dig it.

Here's hoping that Dark Angels get even a quarter of the model love the GKs got.

**puma713**

Kirasu wrote:I seriously hope there is an apoc formation that requires 5 dreadknights and allows you to form a Dread Knight Titan

Nemesis Doomtron!

**MadCowCrazy**

BrassScorpion wrote:
I'm not sure I am going to be able to shoot and kill these things. Aren't they endangered?
You definitely don't want to find out what this new Imperial simian ally's close range weapon is, not at all.

**bhsman**

Kirasu wrote:What? Demon hunters has been the absolute worst codex since it came out more or less.. Even 3rd ed orks could beat it

I cant fathom how it has taken a beating.. Yeah you lose WS5 for power weapons and a 5 pt reduction in cost. Oh, also you gain mobility and options!

Thats a pretty elitist attitude to take that only people can win by being flawless. You've gained rhinos, a crazy MC and things that can actually kill units. This codex will destroy almost all nid armies and is like the space marine codex except everything is better

This is not your 3rd ed book, lets realize it's powerful book and not assume only a few people will play it well.

Most of those complaints of mine weren't about rules specifically, it was about the spirit of the codex, which Ward failed to transition even decently. I could honestly care less about how powerful the dex is, the question is whether or not it actually feels like the same one I played in 3rd. Is it an army I would pick up today for the same reasons if I had never used the old codex? The Dreadnought, stat reductions, and Mary Sue fluff takes away from the heroic desperation that characterized the book before.

Mobility and options are nice, but I want some heart, too, y'know?