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A few years ago, GW had some programs that were army builders, the impression given was that they were going to be updated as to the rules.

Is there an update, or is this just another of GW's epic fails?

If it is updated, could someone point me in the right direction?

I have both of these CD's and found that they haven't been updated since the Eldar codex.

Grot 6 wrote:Is there an update, or is this just another of GW's epic fails?

Hit it on the head there.

Wolf Lair did it better and cheaper, so GW quietly abandoned the project with nary an apology to the poor schmucks who forked out for the rapidly-outdated CDs.

Just one of the many reasons GW are lambasted for not respecting their customers.

Osbad, GW didn't abandon it quietly, but rather the one guy who was supporting it, just left them hanging.

it's true, GW didn't really apologize or give much of a reason.

the simple fact of the matter is GW could actually revive it and give it a good reason to be out there.. (1 cd with all armies on it, updated to their standards and sell it for 20 or 25 dollars.. that would put it below the army builder program ..

if the 40k one were to take off, they could do another 20 dollar cd for fantasy (or if they really felt helpful, they could release a patch including fantasy as well.. )..

At 20 dollars, I think they'd sell a ton of them.. of course, they'd have to really do a good job on it this time.

I wish they'd done that in the 1st place. Instead we got an inferior product x2. There was no good reason for 2 separate disks for 1 game system. The fact that the updates were far and few is another sore spot.

I understand GW is a business. As a business, they have a responsibility to back their product up. It doesn't matter what happened to the programmer. It was GW's responsibility to get the issue rectified.

Grot 6 wrote:A few years ago, GW had some programs that were army builders, the impression given was that they were going to be updated as to the rules.

Anyone who actually believed that should be sterilized.

Flagg07 wrote:There was no good reason for 2 separate disks for 1 game system.

To squeeze more money out of their customers?

Hmm. Looks like somebody still has a grudge with GW....

But I agree that a 20 dollar program as mentioned before would make a killing. If it used a similarly-easy method of putting lists together, it would probably far outsell AB3

No grudge, it's just something that most of us picked when it was first released - this program was split in two to squeeze more money out of people and within 2 years there will be no support. We made fun of the people who bought it, and now those people have two fancy coasters.

It was actually their second attempt at such a thing. The first version died a death due to lack of support from GW too.

Are we talking Army Builder 3 v3.0? It isn't updated?

No, this.

All the latest updates for 2006!

I did titter when I discovered a section entitled 'support'. What a joke!

George Spiggott wrote:It was actually their second attempt at such a thing. The first version died a death due to lack of support from GW too.

Making the people who defended it (and bought it) the second time around all the more tragic (and hilarious).

At least the Dark Eldar section is perfectly serviceable.

The sad thing is that good army builder app from GW would probably put a squeeze on Army BUilder and (mor importantly) allow them to control what is on army lists a bit better.

For example, if GW did IAL 3.0: "We really mean it this time!" and it was better* and cheaper than AB, it'd probably sell as long as they were willing to support it for enough updates to be useful.

If it's their product, they control the layout much better and make sure it gives enough info to be useful, but not enough to make owning Codices unnecessary.

However, I get the idea GW management is a bit behind the times with internet tech, as I don't think you can legally download Codices anywhere (besides the ones they didn't feel like printing).

You'd have to be a fool to trust GW a third time on this.

Armybuilder isn't my bag but it's been solidly supported since 2001 by my count and probably longer.

George Spiggott wrote:You'd have to be a fool to trust GW a third time on this.

Apparently WotC got the 'online component' of D&D 4th edition up and it's actually pretty good, albeit with a number of caveats. (It's, er, not actually 'online' for many tools, it's Windows only, many parts are 'coming soon', etc.)

However, the comments I've seen have been surprisingly positive for the 'Character Builder'... It does a lot of stuff an Army Builder does, and prints botht he expeted RPG character sheet and cards with custom formulas pre-calculated. I've even heard it does a good job of handling 'house rules' (allowing custom stuff to be added and marking them as such). The 3.0 eTools stuff was a complete fiasco.

My army builder.



Really though, I use that to build my armies (obviously my Codex as well) and if I intend on printing out the army sheet I usually go into Word and make it look pretty with lots of images and such.

I found that the rules they had were never close to the rules they were supposed to be anyway.....Microsoft excel is the best army list creator.

Would you guys buy an army list creator - that would be cheaper than army builder?

I think I can get some CS people together and create program, if there is enough interest.

J

If cheap meant free, yeah. Otherwise, as said above, excel is the best.

RogueMarket wrote:Would you guys buy an army list creator - that would be cheaper than army builder?

I think I can get some CS people together and create program, if there is enough interest.

J

You'd have to be careful. Remember they shut down Army Roster .com, among other things.

RogueMarket wrote:I think I can get some CS people together and create program, if there is enough interest.

I got one of those already from a tiny little software company called uhh... what was it again... Smallsoft... no... Microware... no, Microsoft! That's it. Microsoft. They called it "Excel" or something. Really powerful program actually, if a little bland to look at. Works with most game system as far as I can tell.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

RogueMarket wrote:I think I can get some CS people together and create program, if there is enough interest.

I got one of those already from a tiny little software company called uhh... what was it again... Smallsoft... no... Microware... no, Microsoft! That's it. Microsoft. They called it "Excel" or something. Really powerful program actually, if a little bland to look at. Works with most game system as far as I can tell.

Lol. smarta**

lol. HBMC you are a funny mate, haha.

Well I just wanted be a smarta$$ myself, Just wanted to put my 2 cents out.
would get people to do it, if people would buy haha.

(I know theres a lot of lazies out there who wouldn't even want to do excel or note pad)

In reality - its not that hard to put together.

I'm just not majoring in CS.

I mean, make something like army roster - however wont make the same mistake they did.

Can be possible. I'll look into it.

It could be cheap, if not free.



I'd say MEH to all.


Pen and paper foo!

Actually, speaking of Army Roster or whatever it was called, I don't really know what happened there other than GW shut them down.

Why?

And couldn't they just replicate what they did, except not use GW trademarks ie. make a framework ala Army Builder and then just load it with a file for a particular game? What was so different about Army Roster?

They tried to make everything available online (points, options, etc.)

Well that's just silly.

I'm sure that, Dakka being Dakka, we told them that this would happen, right?

Probably somewhere in this thread:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/221124.page

Very first response, lol.

I hope you don't get sued : )

H.B.M.C. wrote:Well that's just silly.

I'm sure that, Dakka being Dakka, we told them that this would happen, right?

Yes, people expressed their concern.

However, I do believe that they decided to make the changes necessary to continue with their work. Their site lists updates as of a few days ago (although only the sites main page is open, as far as I can tell):

http://www.armyroster.com/home.php

Last I heard they had decided to remove all the army files from their site and instead allow them to be independently created and hosted, very similar to army builder, with the big difference, of course, being that this is going to be an online version rather than AB's software.

If they can make it work, I'll be pleased. Even if they charge for it, having an online service where I can make army lists from anywhere and access them from anywhere has more value than AB.

I loved being able to make army lists on my coffee breaks.