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So I saw Terminator:Salvation the other day, which by the way rocked. But I couldn't get out of my mind Necrons. Yes, Necrons are copies of Terminators. But I mean, if Necrons were more like Terminators, they'd be more, well, interesting. You know that a codex is bad when people remark about how the people who have to write the Necron codex die of boredom. So I was thinking.

Why not have Necrons be:

WS:3 BS:4 S:4 T:5 W:1 I:3 A:1 LD: 10 SV: 3+

Their weapon is a Gauss Rifle (Flayer?). I don't know. I don't play Necrons.

It is R:30" Str:5 Ap: 6, Heavy 1, Gauss

Gauss is defined as: Rending, Glances on a 6 unless it can penetrate instead. Counts vehicles as being open-topped.

Necrons are all Relentless. They may choose whether to pass or fail morale tests (ala Marneus Calgar), and they may fire into combat at a -1 BS and with their normal initiative. So if you charge them with Orks or whatever, they will be shooting you at BS3. I think that this is pretty good, but of course they're still going to get the living, well, you know, beaten out of them.

We'll Be Back...I'm still working on this. But it will have some huge changes. Absolutely no FNP in my opinion. Why make the most boring codex even more boring?

Necrons are all Relentless. They may choose whether to pass or fail morale tests (ala Marneus Calgar)

This one really speaks to me, the reason they're broken in my opinion is due to the fact they'll almost always lose their assaults and be sweeping advanced on int 2. I never thought necrons should have to take morale tests, it doesn't sound right fluffwise, what do necrons have to be scared of? The ctan already ripped their souls out of their bodies and placed them in living machines, I doubt that anything can do much worse than that.

I don't really think stats line for the necrons (and their guns) are that bad. Its how they deal with other things and their special rules.
Heres my list of what problems the necrons have...

1> Sweeping Advance insurance
Losing an entire unit of necrons to a sweeping advance is just devastating. While giving them something like ATSKNF is a bit much (and reserved for marines), Necrons need some way to prevent a complete squad wipe due to one bad roll (Stubborn only helps as much as your dice). One idea I had is that if Necrons get caught up in a sweeping advance, the necrons still get away but those lost in the assault do not get their We'll be back roll due to the enemy destroying their bodies. Maybe even giving every Necron the Stubborn special rule might help too.

2> Gauss weapon special rules
While the ability to glance any vehicle with about any gun is nice, its no decent way to actually deal with tanks and with the super rise in tank loving, it is something necrons are needing. I do like the idea of the guns getting a glancing hit and with +1 on the damage result table (So a total of -1).

3> We'll be back
While I agree that making this into FnP isn't a great idea, it does have the same purpose. We'll be back as it stands now is a bit complex and I usually need up explaining it as FnP any how, just with more "except when...." lines. We'll be back is what really defines the Necrons through and FnP is no longer something really that super special any more with each new codex it seems.

4> Flayed Ones and Pariahs
The flayed ones do need a little boost in my opinion. While some people do like them, to a lot they just don't make their worth especially with fearless being given left and right to everyone. The Pariahs are in a much worse case through, they really need a over hull to get on the right page.

5> Ability to play smaller games
This is more of something due to either personal preference, having an opponent with a small army, or for whatever reason. But with 460 points of the army being decided for you by just the FoC is a pain in smaller games. Not sure of a fix myself through : /

I also agree with SirRouga in that stat changes aren't necessary. I think points cost should be reduced.

Ok, yes, we have WBB and a 3+ save. But, in essence, we lose out in CC thanks to I2 and the chance of having an entire squad of precious Warriors lost to a sweeping advance. 16 points per Necron would be nice, though I may be insane.

Would it be possible to get different new troops? Most armies have a troop choice that costs under 100, at least before upgrades and everything. Maybe something lightly armored?

Plus, the necrons need some weapon choices. It does not need to be the full compliment that can be had for the SM or 'nids, but some sort of missle launcher so in a 500-pt battle the lord is not your only anti-tank? Maybe a template weapon to deal with hoards?

rashad wrote:Would it be possible to get different new troops? Most armies have a troop choice that costs under 100, at least before upgrades and everything. Maybe something lightly armored?

Plus, the necrons need some weapon choices. It does not need to be the full compliment that can be had for the SM or 'nids, but some sort of missle launcher so in a 500-pt battle the lord is not your only anti-tank? Maybe a template weapon to deal with hoards?

The monolith is pretty good at being a template weapon.

I think by template weapon he was referring to flame throwers and the such for smaller point games where a monolith is not really in the budget.

I don't think Necrons should have flame throwers through. Maybe some with a small blast would work through.

SirRouga wrote:I think by template weapon he was referring to flame throwers and the such for smaller point games where a monolith is not really in the budget.

I don't think Necrons should have flame throwers through. Maybe some with a small blast would work through.

Personally, I think for anti-horde, the necron need something with a high rate of fire. Though, with how the weapons of the necrons are described, a gauss template weapon wouldn't be inconceivable.

Here are two suggestions for Necron Weapons that could help against horde armies:

The little-seen weapon known as the Gauss Ravager is, in many ways reminiscent of an ancient Terran Gatling Gun. The abnormally large power cylinder is surrounded by barrels, which fire rapidly at targeted enemies.
Gauss Ravager: 24" Str:6 AP:4 Heavy 5, Gauss. (Gets Hot?)

The dreaded Gauss Devourer is an hereunto unseen weapon of the Necron forces. The device seems to utilize the Necron Gauss technology to power a "wave" effect, with everything in the weapon's path being shredded to component atoms.

Devourer: Template Str:4 AP:5 Assault 1, Gauss.

The Ravager, I would suspect, would be found only on Immortals, or destroyers. The Devourer could be used by lords, Warriors, practically any necron unit.

As to an anti-tank weapon...

Necron "Hornet": Dubbed by the buzzing noise it makes when preparing to fire, this weapon is respected by any force that has fought against it. Using strange Gauss energies, the Hornet fires a single, highly energized sliver at insane velocities. Anything hit by the shot faces extreme destruction.

Hornet: Range:36" Str:8 AP:1 Heavy 1, Gets Hot!,
The Hornet adds an additional d6 to armor penetration if the target is within 12", as the shot still burns with strange gauss energies.

This, I'm thinking, heavy destroyer only.

ack! through=/=though
But back to the topic.
I think that stubborn would be enough of a fix for the sweeping advance thing. It would make it so they only have a 1/12 chance of trying to run when they lose combat, and make sense, seeing as they're machines of death. They shouldn't be failing leadership left and right. (fearless would make more sense, but now fearless is just another way to lose in CC)
Another problem with necrons, though, is the phase out nonsense. One player-made codex I saw had all necrons as stubborn and had phase out "Whenever a unit fails a moral test, they are removed from the board." This may seem a bit harsh, but it actually plays pretty well from what I've seen. However, if phase out is changed, something would have to be done about the monolith. Phase out is currently just about the only reliable way to take that sucker off the field.
I actually like WBB as it stands (even with all its hideous problems) It sets necrons apart, where otherwise they'd just be SMs with scary masks and no heavy weapons.

Keep the points the same; give them FNP and WBB; give back mixed Destroyers option (instead of dedicated ability only), AND FOR GODS SAKE FIND A FREAKING POWER WEAPON ON A WARRIOR SQUAD!

Giving the extra d6 to the current Heavy Gauss Cannon would be nice.

Make scarabs troops choices (since they come on the fething sprue).

Personally, I think for anti-horde, the necron need something with a high rate of fire. Though, with how the weapons of the necrons are described, a gauss template weapon wouldn't be inconceivable.

Here are two suggestions for Necron Weapons that could help against horde armies:

The little-seen weapon known as the Gauss Ravager is, in many ways reminiscent of an ancient Terran Gatling Gun. The abnormally large power cylinder is surrounded by barrels, which fire rapidly at targeted enemies.
Gauss Ravager: 24" Str:6 AP:4 Heavy 5, Gauss. (Gets Hot?)

The dreaded Gauss Devourer is an hereunto unseen weapon of the Necron forces. The device seems to utilize the Necron Gauss technology to power a "wave" effect, with everything in the weapon's path being shredded to component atoms.

Devourer: Template Str:4 AP:5 Assault 1, Gauss.

The Ravager, I would suspect, would be found only on Immortals, or destroyers. The Devourer could be used by lords, Warriors, practically any necron unit.

As to an anti-tank weapon...

Necron "Hornet": Dubbed by the buzzing noise it makes when preparing to fire, this weapon is respected by any force that has fought against it. Using strange Gauss energies, the Hornet fires a single, highly energized sliver at insane velocities. Anything hit by the shot faces extreme destruction.

Hornet: Range:36" Str:8 AP:1 Heavy 1, Gets Hot!,
The Hornet adds an additional d6 to armor penetration if the target is within 12", as the shot still burns with strange gauss energies.

This, I'm thinking, heavy destroyer only.

I really like the idea of the devourer and giving heavy destroyers 2d6 armor pen. I don't like the idea of things getting hot though.

Think of it this way, necrons are made out of living metal that convers a +3 save like marine power armor, this covers their whole body including their hands. If something got hot, I doubt a necron would care. Not only this, but the way gauss works, it's more like a microwave, by transmitting and rearranging atoms to break down the structure of an object, thus "Flaying it".

See, why not rename the Gauss Flayer the Gauss Cannon Rifle, and then the Gauss Flayer can be R:13" Str 4 Ap 6 Heavy 4, Gauss, Pinning

Stay JUST out of assault range.

I'm also happy to see that most of you are fine with the suggestions so far.

What I'm NOT big fan of is the boring MEQ statline. These are freaking undead robots coming for your soul, not humans in powered armor.

I like Sir Rouga's 1st point a lot, I must say.

I think the statline for the warriors are fine, actually most of the necron stat lines are fine imo. I would agree the CC units need some work.

I also think most necron gauss wep are ok as well, in both range and effectivness, but more variety couldn't hurt.

Here is what I think needs to be done.

A generic points decution in warriors (should be about the same as the basic SM).
Stubborn to the entire army (not relentless).
WBB/FNP or something is iconic of the necrons but perhaps on a 5+ if you make them stubborn. Have to work on that one still.

C'tan - they disapear. Lets face it they are rather broken and well, they eat up far to many points the crons need in troops and other areas like tank busting. Either simplify the gack out of them or remove them.

Monoliths - in their current state they are better than the landraider. I would hope living metal turns into a 4+ obscurity from any shooting attack. Now they are killable in melee and from melta (which keeps their points down)

Phase Out - if C'tan go and Monoliths become killable then I would hope that this would go away. They are the only army who can just disapear if you kill off enough of their troops.

I'll probably have more ideas later, need more time to think.

C'Tan are not "broken", they're just expensive.

They're making them Apoc-only anyway, so quit yer whinin.

Phase out is good, considering how surviveable the entire Necron Army is.

Monoliths just need to be more expensive.

As a Necron-only player, I think that most of what they have is pretty decent, but here is a rundown (some of it is incoherent):



Lord: Pretty much fine. Starts with a power weapon, S5 T5 (can be upped to T6), and decent I and A. Doesn't really need any changes.

Warriors: Just about perfect, ALTHOUGH one option to separate them from MEQs could be to make them worse at CC (lower WS), and make them T5, to make them the tough warriors they are supposed to be. Also MAYBE give them some wargear (not sure what though).

Immortals: Just about perfect. If warriors get WS3 and T5, immortals could either be the same, or get T6 (but that seems a bit much for immortals). But yeah, pretty good as is.

Flayed Ones: Oh god. These need changes. They need either a Higher T or WS, or more A, or some ability to make them more useful.

Pariahs: Probably the MOST needed changes. If Necrons keep WBB (which I will talk about below), then, INSTEAD of just giving them WBB, give Pariahs FNP (fluff wise, the mechanical parts keeping the living parts alive) Just about everything else is decent, but they need a price drop

Wraiths: Pretty good, but they NEED their claws to be power weapons. POSSIBLY a cheaper price, but I think that's good.

Scarabs: Pretty much fine...not sure about these guys...

Destroyers: Also pretty good, but could use a price drop, and MAYBE some different weapon options (to sorta customize the squad at least a bit)

Heavy Destroyers: Also COULD use a slight price drop. Also needs something to make Heavy Gauss Cannons not just lascannons (something like 2D6 penetration always, or a plus on the damage table, or a some other special abilty for the cannon)

Tomb Spiders: Again, MAYBE price drop, other than that they are decent, maybe some weapon options, but they seem to fit their role. Something to make more than one scarab would be cool, but probably OP.

Monolith: I don't really think it needs Changes. Price: The only vehicle Necrons have, so it should be "cheap" Killability: It should keep "living metal" just to make it the strongest vehicle that either takes dedicated anti tank, or just avoidance altogether.

C'tan: Could use maybe a price drop, or something to help against phase out (count as like 10 Necrons or, while alive, disable phase out due to their being a living god in the battle), and/or some slight stat mods.


WBB: Some people think this should be changed to FNP. I think it should stay the same, to make Necrons unique, and to give them the cool "get back up after they're dead" thing.

Phase Out: Not TOO bad as is (especially if WBB stays), but I think that phase out should be reduced to like 20 or 15%.

Necrons: They could use something to survive better, Stubborn is a pretty good idea, however costs might have to change (because Stubborn is pretty good), but so Necrons can still get killed in CC.


I am not too sure about any of these things, and obviously I wouldn't want ALL of these, but rather some from the list. I think that increasing stats AND reducing price is OP of course, so some of these would have to be OR situations for most of it.

The reason WBB should be changed to FNP is for ease of rules. WBB is functionally the same but needs a lot of additional text to describe when it does and doesnt work. This can cause lots of confusion in games, even among necron players. Instead in the army special rules should be something like:

We'll Be Back: [fluff]. All necrons have Feel No Pain as described in the 40k rule book

Everyone that has the rules knows what FNP is and how it works, so there isnt any confusion. The flavour still remains intact but the rules change to make the game play much more smoothly.

Now on to everything else:

Lord: There should be levels of lords with access to differnt equippment or abilities, maybe allowing slightly changed force org charts. Need a power weapon as standard in anycase.

Pariahs: Need to become necrons (and thus have access to FNP) and gain an extra attack but cost more points (30-45, with 2 attacks and FNP they become slightly more powerful than terminators)

Immortals: Need to be stubbon and relentless for the same cost

Flayed ones: These need to become troops choices and get rending and stubbon for a slight increase in cost (20-24pts each). Maybe fleet. Maybe a slight increase in WS.

Warriors: Need to gain stubbon and relentless for slightly more (20pts with changes to gauss, see below) Maybe gain the ability to be led by an immortal (although I personally cant really see any justification for this, some people like unit champions too much)

Wraiths need to gain one extra wound and have a very slight increase in cost (42-45pts)

Destroyers: Need to gain stubbon. The have relentless due to being jetbikes anyway. (Small increase in points due to changes in gauss)

Scarabs: Need to become troops, but lose the ability to score. Points stay the same.

Tomb spider: Need an extra wound and an increase to WS but a points increase to 55pts

Heavy Destroyer: Heavy Gauss Cannon needs to be heavy 2 but they should cos the same.

Monolith: Power matrix needs to be changed in wording to cover FNP and should cost the same as a landraider.

Special rules: Lose phase out, it never really made much sense anyway. Gauss should be changed to rending.

Comments: Although many of the choices available have gone up in points, they have also ganed special rules that cover their major weakneses. Rending guns make their shooting very powerful, capable to threatening most vehicles, even with simple gauss blasters. These changes make them very good against mech and MEQ armies, but mean they will have some difficulty gainst horde armies. Every army needs a weakness and this should be the necrons. They gain reasonable counter charge in pariahs and flayed ones, but are still generally not good in combat. These rules make necrons much more blanced than they are currently.

Regwon wrote:The reason WBB should be changed to FNP is for ease of rules. WBB is functionally the same but needs a lot of additional text to describe when it does and doesnt work. This can cause lots of confusion in games, even among necron players. Instead in the army special rules should be something like:

We'll Be Back: [fluff]. All necrons have Feel No Pain as described in the 40k rule book

Everyone that has the rules knows what FNP is and how it works, so there isnt any confusion. The flavour still remains intact but the rules change to make the game play much more smoothly.

Yes, but it's boring. There's nothing that can't be fixed with good wording. If someone would kindly post the full wording for WBB, I'd like to mess around with it.

@Eight Ball- Check out my first post, it entails exactly wat you describe. : )

Necrons should be getting a lot of 'robotic' wargear, like scanners and refractors and whatnot. Scanners give -1 to saves, refractors subtract Str from incoming weapons.

Actually. Actually. This is genius, I am so stupidly awesome it's not even funny. Why not give all of them FNP and Bionics? Or something like Commissar Yarrick's ability?

The reason WBB should be changed to FNP is for ease of rules. WBB is functionally the same but needs a lot of additional text to describe when it does and doesnt work. This can cause lots of confusion in games, even among necron players. Instead in the army special rules should be something like:

We'll Be Back: [fluff]. All necrons have Feel No Pain as described in the 40k rule book

Everyone that has the rules knows what FNP is and how it works, so there isnt any confusion. The flavour still remains intact but the rules change to make the game play much more smoothly.

Okay, WBB is not confusing. I don't know where people are getting this from. Also, if they get FNP, then you need some use for the Res Orb, Tomb Spider, Monolith...

Lord: There should be levels of lords with access to differnt equippment or abilities, maybe allowing slightly changed force org charts. Need a power weapon as standard in anycase.

Okay, the only thing there should be are different lords to let different things become troops. Like one CC-Lord that allows Flayed Ones to become troops, or destroyer lord making destroyers troops, ect.

Pariahs: Need to become necrons (and thus have access to FNP) and gain an extra attack but cost more points (30-45, with 2 attacks and FNP they become slightly more powerful than terminators)

I don't think they should be Necrons (if WBB stays) due to the fluff, but they SHOULD get FNP, maybe an extra attack, but they already cost 36 points....

Immortals: Need to be stubbon and relentless for the same cost

Stubborn, sure. Why do they need relentless? They have an ASSAULT 2 weapon.

Flayed ones: These need to become troops choices and get rending and stubbon for a slight increase in cost (20-24pts each). Maybe fleet. Maybe a slight increase in WS.

I think they need changes, but they should not get a price increase, they're already 18 points, much higher and you might as well get wraiths.

Warriors: Need to gain stubbon and relentless for slightly more (20pts with changes to gauss, see below) Maybe gain the ability to be led by an immortal (although I personally cant really see any justification for this, some people like unit champions too much)

Yeah, don't know why you would want an Immortal leader though...MAYBE something like a wraith, then a special rule to use his Initiative in sweeping advance.

Wraiths need to gain one extra wound and have a very slight increase in cost (42-45pts)

Yes

Destroyers: Need to gain stubbon. The have relentless due to being jetbikes anyway. (Small increase in points due to changes in gauss)

If anything they need to be LESS points, 50 pts each is a bit steep considering how easily killable they are.

Scarabs: Need to become troops, but lose the ability to score. Points stay the same.

Yeah whatever, as long as they can't score

Tomb spider: Need an extra wound and an increase to WS but a points increase to 55pts

Sure, but they already ARE 55pts, which I think they can stay at with these changes.

Heavy Destroyer: Heavy Gauss Cannon needs to be heavy 2 but they should cos the same.

YES

Monolith: Power matrix needs to be changed in wording to cover FNP and should cost the same as a landraider.

Again, I think WBB should stay, and Also that it should keep the same cost, because it's the ONLY vehicle Necrons have.

Special rules: Lose phase out, it never really made much sense anyway.

This COULD be taken out, however, if you have WBB OR FNP on an entire army, there should be some way to kill the army.

Gauss should be changed to rending.

NO. Firstly, the ability of Necrons to glance any vehicle to death is something totally unique they should keep. ALSO, basic necron warriors should not be able to get past armor saves of terminators, that would get WAY too OP, even with a price increase (which I don't think we need EVEN HIGHER prices)

they will have some difficulty gainst horde armies. Every army needs a weakness and this should be the necrons.

So the ONLY weakness should be against specific armies....wow...

These rules make necrons much more blanced than they are currently.

Not really. These rules you imply make the Necrons way stronger (particularly FNP with no Phase Out) and will mean that Necrons are pretty much Stubborn, Relentless, FNP, RENDING marines for TWO POINTS more than before.

AllWillFall2Me wrote:

SirRouga wrote:
The dreaded Gauss Devourer is an hereunto unseen weapon of the Necron forces. The device seems to utilize the Necron Gauss technology to power a "wave" effect, with everything in the weapon's path being shredded to component atoms.

Devourer: Template Str:4 AP:5 Assault 1, Gauss.

If everything is shredded to component atoms, do you think AP 4 might be a bit better?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Uriels_Flame wrote:AND FOR GODS SAKE FIND A FREAKING POWER WEAPON ON A WARRIOR SQUAD!

Gauss whip, perhaps? And a champion t hold it. Catacombed ....

I used to play Necrons and after reading some of your posts, my suggestions would be to:

1) Make the gauss gun assault, army wide (if an immortal can do it, then a warrior should to - warriors aren't going to assault so the rapid fire is moot).
2) Increase the range for warriors to 30".
3) Give Flayed ones either +6 Str on the charge, or Str 4 power weapon for claws and make them troops.
4) Give Wraiths power weapon attacks.
5) The concept of the Pariah is awesome, the work in progress sucks. Keep the Pariah the way it is (even points), but make it a necron. Can you imagine the Veil of Darkness with a unit of Pariah? And give this unit FNP as well as WBB.
6) Keep WBB the same.
7) Make scarabs troops.
8) Make Tomb Spyders burrowing - similar to Khemri Scorpion (wishing here)

Now Leadership and robots running away I've never understood. What does a robot have to fear that is any greater than the C'tan ripping it's soul out?

I'd say when C'tan are on the table, the army is fearless. Or rework the "gaze of flame" to also include "gaze of the C'tan" and allow units within 12" to be fearless as well.

You can make all Necrons WS2 for all I care, with the exception of Pariah, Wraith, and Flayed Ones.

Would it be a stretch to think if a warrior/flayed one is S 4 T4, then an immortal should be S5 T5?

I think the statline for the warriors are fine, actually most of the necron stat lines are fine imo. I would agree the CC units need some work.

I also think most necron gauss wep are ok as well, in both range and effectivness, but more variety couldn't hurt.

Here is what I think needs to be done.

A generic points decution in warriors (should be about the same as the basic SM).
Stubborn to the entire army (not relentless).
WBB/FNP or something is iconic of the necrons but perhaps on a 5+ if you make them stubborn. Have to work on that one still.

C'tan - they disapear. Lets face it they are rather broken and well, they eat up far to many points the crons need in troops and other areas like tank busting. Either simplify the gack out of them or remove them.

Monoliths - in their current state they are better than the landraider. I would hope living metal turns into a 4+ obscurity from any shooting attack. Now they are killable in melee and from melta (which keeps their points down)

Phase Out - if C'tan go and Monoliths become killable then I would hope that this would go away. They are the only army who can just disapear if you kill off enough of their troops.

I'll probably have more ideas later, need more time to think.


Completely agree with that. I really like the thought of using the C'tan to be stop phase out so long as their alive. By the way Scarabs are awsome but they need to be made as necrons and as a troop choice.

I'd suggest the following:

- Phase Out only comes into effect if the army falls below 20% points cost of Necron units, not models.

- Pulled straight from my WIP Necron fandex: "Every Necron unit is linked by a Collective Node to form a gestalt consciousness, acting in unison upon the relayed instructions of the Necron Lord; they gain the Stubborn USR as long as the Collective Node is intact. Should the number of Necrons forming a Node fall too low, it will become harder for them to retain coherence too far away from the Lord. In practise, if the number of Necrons in a squad falls below the minimum squad size as detailed in the unit profile, then the collective Node is counted as being ‘reduced’. A ‘reduced’ squad loses the Stubborn USR and their leadership value is reduced to 8, subject to modifiers and special abilities as per usual. "

Edit: For those who don't have the Necron Codex, minimum squad sizes equate to roughly half strength. Also, the Lord would be able to temporarily restore the Nodes of any squads within 6", similar to Rez. Orb.

- Gauss stays the same, possibly negative modifier against AV 13/14

- WBB has the same base, modified by the following: "Aside from all other considerations, to qualify for a WBB roll a Necron model must be within 6” of a non-damaged model of the same type (not necessarily of the same unit), or within 12” of a Tomb Spyder; in both cases, the Necron’s unit must still be in play. If it has been destroyed, then the model may not take a WBB roll.

If a Necron passes its WBB roll, place it in coherency with its original unit. If the unit is in close combat, then the repaired Necron may be placed in contact with the enemy its unit is in combat with; note that the repaired Necron does not gain additional attacks for charging, and may not be placed into combat with a new enemy unit.

If a model is removed and replaced with another model (the unit is ‘transformed’), such as with the Gift of Chaos power, then it may not make a WBB roll as the model has been replaced, not just removed as a casualty."

- Warriors become:
16pts
WS: 3
BS: 4
S: 4
T: 4
W: 1
I: 3
A: 1
Ld: 10
Sv: 3+

- Gauss Flayers become Assault 1


That's just ideas for the core of the army. Feel free to nerf/tear into.

Verkehr wrote:I'd suggest the following:

- Phase Out only comes into effect if the army falls below 20% points cost of Necron units, not models.

- Pulled straight from my WIP Necron fandex: "Every Necron unit is linked by a Collective Node to form a gestalt consciousness, acting in unison upon the relayed instructions of the Necron Lord; they gain the Stubborn USR as long as the Collective Node is intact. Should the number of Necrons forming a Node fall too low, it will become harder for them to retain coherence too far away from the Lord. In practise, if the number of Necrons in a squad falls below the minimum squad size as detailed in the unit profile, then the collective Node is counted as being ‘reduced’. A ‘reduced’ squad loses the Stubborn USR and their leadership value is reduced to 8, subject to modifiers and special abilities as per usual. "

Edit: For those who don't have the Necron Codex, minimum squad sizes equate to roughly half strength. Also, the Lord would be able to temporarily restore the Nodes of any squads within 6", similar to Rez. Orb.

- Gauss stays the same, possibly negative modifier against AV 13/14

- WBB has the same base, modified by the following: "Aside from all other considerations, to qualify for a WBB roll a Necron model must be within 6” of a non-damaged model of the same type (not necessarily of the same unit), or within 12” of a Tomb Spyder; in both cases, the Necron’s unit must still be in play. If it has been destroyed, then the model may not take a WBB roll.

If a Necron passes its WBB roll, place it in coherency with its original unit. If the unit is in close combat, then the repaired Necron may be placed in contact with the enemy its unit is in combat with; note that the repaired Necron does not gain additional attacks for charging, and may not be placed into combat with a new enemy unit.

If a model is removed and replaced with another model (the unit is ‘transformed’), such as with the Gift of Chaos power, then it may not make a WBB roll as the model has been replaced, not just removed as a casualty."

- Warriors become:
16pts
WS: 3
BS: 4
S: 4
T: 4
W: 1
I: 3
A: 1
Ld: 10
Sv: 3+

- Gauss Flayers become Assault 1


That's just ideas for the core of the army. Feel free to nerf/tear into.

Okay, a couple things about this:

-Nodes: Cool idea, however, it should be a lower number before reducing LD values....why do Necrons really NEED LD values, not to mention getting worse off
Also, going by the minimum squad size thing, then if I took a unit of 10 warriors, and lost ONE GUY, I would be down to LD8 and no stubborn....not really useful

-Warriors: Yeah, I guess, but their really fine as-is...dropping that TWO points for a couple changes isnt't worth it, and I3 isn't that useful

-Gauss Flayers: Assault 1?? No way, Necron Warriors rapid firing is a really good troop-based weapon, and that "Assault" characteristic won't be helpful with only WS3

Eight Ball wrote:-Nodes: Cool idea, however, it should be a lower number before reducing LD values....why do Necrons really NEED LD values, not to mention getting worse off

You're right. I was originally going to change the minimum squad sizes, but that's senselessly tricky; what might be better would be using 50% of the original squad size as a marker.

Eight Ball wrote:-Warriors: Yeah, I guess, but their really fine as-is...dropping that TWO points for a couple changes isnt't worth it, and I3 isn't that useful

I'm not just dropping points for the changes; I feel Necron Warriors are overcosted. If you give them WBB, then counteract that with Phase Out, then counteract that again by making Warriors low initiative CC whipping boys, what you have is a unit that costs more than a marine, is less tactically flexible and has to run for the hills when anything comes within 12". By giving them Stubborn, they aren't quite as godawful in combat, but they still have no special/heavy weapons and with the new Glancing Hit table, Gauss just don't cover it.

I feel that WS3 encourages the player to stay out of combat, and whilst I3 isn't going to make much of a different most of the time, the additional point makes them just a little bit better as sentries, when rolling for sweeping advance/fall back etc.

Eight Ball wrote:-Gauss Flayers: Assault 1?? No way, Necron Warriors rapid firing is a really good troop-based weapon, and that "Assault" characteristic won't be helpful with only WS3

If you have a Rapid Fire weapon and move, you gotta be within 12" of the enemy to shoot them - charge range. That's where you really, really don't want your warriors to be. With Assault 1, you can move back every turn and still shoot at the enemy at 24". I think it works better for Necron Warriors than giving them a weapon that encourages the player to close in on the enemy.

they need to make necrons troops that are mainly cc

Okay, a couple things about this:

-Nodes: Cool idea, however, it should be a lower number before reducing LD values....why do Necrons really NEED LD values, not to mention getting worse off
Also, going by the minimum squad size thing, then if I took a unit of 10 warriors, and lost ONE GUY, I would be down to LD8 and no stubborn....not really useful

-Warriors: Yeah, I guess, but their really fine as-is...dropping that TWO points for a couple changes isnt't worth it, and I3 isn't that useful

-Gauss Flayers: Assault 1?? No way, Necron Warriors rapid firing is a really good troop-based weapon, and that "Assault" characteristic won't be helpful with only WS3

Warriors with Assault weapons - Thumbs Up : rapid fire sucks and says "Well I'm going to get wiped anyway, so I'll just stand here and take it."

Nodes: Cool idea, but what if you don't take a Lord model? And if the WHOLE army is going to phase out, why am I subject to running in the first place?

WS and I is irrelavant as a Necron warrior, if you're in CC - you're going to be screwed anyway. The only reason to leave them is for a tarpit and hope you get wiped on your opponents turn so you can shoot the hell out of whatever was attacking.

Also - Make the Pariah a unit upgrade (Cpt, Sgt, whatever) so for units of warriors, flayed ones, Immortals you could at least get a pw upgrade into the unit.

Uriels_Flame wrote:

Okay, a couple things about this:

-Nodes: Cool idea, however, it should be a lower number before reducing LD values....why do Necrons really NEED LD values, not to mention getting worse off
Also, going by the minimum squad size thing, then if I took a unit of 10 warriors, and lost ONE GUY, I would be down to LD8 and no stubborn....not really useful

-Warriors: Yeah, I guess, but their really fine as-is...dropping that TWO points for a couple changes isnt't worth it, and I3 isn't that useful

-Gauss Flayers: Assault 1?? No way, Necron Warriors rapid firing is a really good troop-based weapon, and that "Assault" characteristic won't be helpful with only WS3

Warriors with Assault weapons - Thumbs Up : rapid fire sucks and says "Well I'm going to get wiped anyway, so I'll just stand here and take it."

Nodes: Cool idea, but what if you don't take a Lord model? And if the WHOLE army is going to phase out, why am I subject to running in the first place?

WS and I is irrelavant as a Necron warrior, if you're in CC - you're going to be screwed anyway. The only reason to leave them is for a tarpit and hope you get wiped on your opponents turn so you can shoot the hell out of whatever was attacking.

Also - Make the Pariah a unit upgrade (Cpt, Sgt, whatever) so for units of warriors, flayed ones, Immortals you could at least get a pw upgrade into the unit.

Okay:

Necron Weapons: Okay, I admit that rapid fire isn't always nice (Although it always works perfectly for me, but that's just me), but having one shot per warrior is just crap, even if you can fire at while moving. I don't really think Necrons should be a "Can snipe you to death" race....something with 2 shots would be a lot better...

Pariah Upgrades: Why? Firstly, it wouldn't really be that useful (as Necrons like Warriors or Immortals shouldn't be in CC in the first place), makes the Pariahs current abilities sorta OP (like all warrior squads projecting LD7), AND it doesn't fit the fluff at all...

Because it's the only way GW is going to sell the Pariah models

Make it an upgrade for Flayed Ones then. Something, anything to get a power weapon into a CC unit.

Warriors that can move and shoot at max range and glance any vehicle = win to me. At least they would have the ability to run away from a CC unit and deal damage.

Actually, about their weapons, I just thought: Why not keep Gauss Flayers as they are (Rapid Fire) but make them Relentless? That way, they can move and shoot from range, AND deliver a lot of shots if necessary to drive off those CC's and close tanks.

Do you think giving warriors and Immortals Slow and purposeful would be more fitting to there background? Or is it just overkill?

Also, what about putting Wraiths in scarab swarms like they do with Kroxigor and skinks in Fantasy? That would be pretty cool..