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Made in us
Long-Range Ultramarine Land Speeder Pilot




Dallas, TX

A Treatise on Space Marine Infantry Portable Ranged Weaponry and Deployment
A tactical article for the Space Marine Army by GeneralRetreat (Matt Varnado)

Most often, I hear new players asking about armament for Tactical Squads, Devastator Squads, and the like, asking for the “magic combination” that rises above the rest. I have always contended that there is no magic combination – there are only the needs of the rest of your army to consider. I believe what these players need is a real understanding of the different types of weapons available to the Space Marines, what they are made to do, and how best to deploy them to minimize weakness and maximize effect. I believe that the best tactical doctrine is one of combined arms. Using too much of any one type of weapon leads to waste, inevitably, or even complete lack of use in the wrong circumstances. What I humbly attempt to do here is classify the arsenal we know and love into broad “Tiers” of weapons, with notes on each to give the reader some ideas to form or supplement their own tactical preferences. These Tiers are a rough attempt to classify these weapons from heaviest ordnance to lightest. I only seek to cover the infantry-portable weapons here - vehicle weapons, due to so many factors, deserve space all their own. I’m sure I’ve missed a few and probably made a few typographical or memory errors here and there. Your comments, criticisms, corrections, additions, and doctrinal differences of opinion are welcome as always.


Tier 1

The Lascannon Str 9 AP 2 48” Heavy 1

Primarily an anti-light armor weapon, and usually found on vehicles, a Marine can carry it only thanks to his power armor. It begs to be used against skimmers, transports, and maybe even a main battle tank. Its 48” range allows you to deploy this on your back edge, or in a corner, and still command most of the board. Taken in Devastator squads, it’s very expensive, while in a Tactical Squad, you can only get one. This only exacerbates the main weakness of the weapon, low Rate of Fire. One shot means one bad roll can ruin your day. However, taking it as a single weapon in a Devastator squad allows you to use the Signum for BS 5 to hit on 2+. In a Sicarious based force, a Tactical Squad with a Lascannon can be granted Tank Hunters, giving it (effectively) Strength 10 against AVs. Too bad you can’t combine the two. Non AV targets should include enemy commanders of T4 or less, Multi-Wound models of T4 or less such as Nobs and Tau Crisis Suits, Monstrous Creatures, and TEQs when bypassing a 2+ save is advantageous.

The Plasma Cannon Str 7 AP2 36” Heavy 1, Blast, Gets Hot!

Though the Plasma Cannon is the premier anti-heavy infantry weapon of the Imperium, great power does come with risk. In this case, that risk is much less than the potential killing power of an AP2 Blast. It can fail you at a bad time (1/6th if you’re lucky), and the blast can even scatter back on you if you aren’t careful, but the ability to wipe out a clump of TEQs in one shot is amazing. Even used against lesser troops, wounding on a 2 virtually everything and bypassing all armor saves can make any unit evaporate very quickly. Used on Aspect Warriors or Firewarriors, or Marines or Chaos Marines, this weapon will make its points up very quickly if deployed well. With a 36” range, you will need to find a spot about 12” from the edge to get real coverage, and the higher the better. Cover is far too easy to get, so if you can find a building sitting on a plain with lots of open space around it, a Plasma Cannon can command the 36” bubble around it like no other infantry killing weapon can. In a pinch, it can be used to fire at vehicles AV11 or less. If fired at a squadron, you might even get multiple hits.

The Assault Cannon Str 6 AP 4 24” Heavy 4, Rending

The Assault Cannon is the balancer of the Lascannon. Whereas the Lascannon has great range and one shot, the Assault Cannon has half the range, and four shots. Strength 6 will wound any MEQ on a 2+, and bypass Carapace or Aspect Warrior armor with ease. Rending allows it to get in the odd AP2 shot, or, once in range, actually have a better chance at penetrating AV14 than the Lascannon. These are only man-portable in Terminator Squads, and now only one per five models. However, for doing things like shooting down high toughness models from mid range, there is no finer weapon. Four shots also allows this weapon to be reasonably good at crowd control, especially from the 12-24” range.

The Heavy Flamer Str 5 AP 4 Template Assault 1

Portable only by Terminators, Sternguard, and Legion of the Damned, this is the ultimate answer to your crowd control needs. With the same Strength and AP as a Heavy Bolter, it is elevated to Tier 1 status by the virtue of two things; being able to potentially hit more than 3 models, and ignoring cover. The fact that all hits are automatic also adds to the value of this weapon. Where a regular flamer may not toast Genestealers with Extended Carapace, the Heavy Flamer will, and reliably so, since it bypasses cover. The 8” template is the main weakness, of course, but once again, the greater strength and AP over a regular flamer will guarantee many more kills before the counter-charge. Assuming you plan to charge, using this weapon is a horrible mistake for exactly the same reason. It will help you remove so many casualties you may put yourself out of charge range. Used wisely, this weapon can destroy whole Scout squads, Pathfinder Squads, and Aspect Warrior squads at a time. In a Terminator squad, the combined weight of four Storm Bolters and a Heavy Flamer will put a dent in even MEQ squads. In a Legion of the Damned squad the best application may be the ability to fire it after deep-strike. LotD having a re-roll to scatter allows you to place it aggressively with confidence. Sternguard can take two in a 5 man squad, and can fire the Assault weapon on the move, or even from the firing points of a Rhino that moves 6".

The Cyclone Missle Launcher Str4 AP 5 Blast / Str8 AP3 48” Heavy 2

This weapon makes it to the bottom of Tier One because it finally got a second shot in this edition. See the section in Tier 2 on the standard Missile Launcher, and then double the effect, with the ability to move and fire from the back of a Terminator. Also, in a stroke of luck, the CML does not replace the Storm Bolter of the unit, allowing a 5 man squad to crank out 10 Bolt shots and 2 Missiles a turn while moving. The potential for this weapon is the best overall of the three Terminator Heavy choices. Combining range, strength, multi-hit possibility, and Rate of Fire while not sacrificing a Storm Bolter is what makes the CML one of the truly golden combinations of the new codex. Ten Terminators with two Cyclone Missile Launchers puts out the same amount of Missile Fire as a Devastator squad with 4 Missile Launchers, but can move and fire ten Storm Bolters out to 24” as well. Combined with a Librarian with Gate of Infinity and some Locator Beacons, you could warp this squad around as a hyper-mobile firebase, able to fire after the teleport, thanks to Relentless, and simply lay waste to any backfield armor your enemy likes to hide during deployment.

The Autocannon Str 7 AP 4 48” Heavy 2

I know I said I wouldn’t include vehicle weapons, but the Dreadnought operates similarly to infantry so I think it bears inclusion. The Autocannon is a good all-around weapon, with a decent Rate of Fire and good strength. Its main drawback is that the strength isn’t quite high enough to threaten armor above AV12, and AP 4 falls short of making it a good MEQ killer. Against 4+ save infantry, it can shine, but with only two shots, it can rarely kill enough to dent. Taken as a twin-linked weapon on a Dreadnought, I would classify it as a Tier 1 weapon, but just barely. What it does do is punish light armor squadrons. The “Rifleman” pattern Dreadnought (Mortis DA?) with two twin-linked Autocannons can put out a respectable 4 Strength 7 shots at 48”, all twin-linked. This is the perfect tool for counter-shooting a squadron of Land Speeder Typhoons, Sentinels, War Walkers, or Tau Piranha who hang back to shoot.


Tier 2

The Missile Launcher Str 4 AP 5 Blast / Str 8 AP 3 48” Heavy 1

The Missile Launcher is the Swiss Army Knife of Space Marine weaponry. Combined with a commanding range, the utility of both the Frag and Krak firing modes are hard to deny. Fired with Frag munitions, there is no need to roll to hit, but you must contend with the vagaries of scatter dice. Fired with Krak rounds, you can threaten light to medium armor, or bypass MEQ 3+ armor. The main weaknesses of this weapon are low Rate of Fire and inability to move and shoot. A single missile launcher can be very unreliable, such as in a Tactical squad, but it is something your enemy must worry about. It represents a very real threat to hordes and light armor, but in practice, one missile usually isn’t enough to do the job. Taken in a group of three or four launchers in a Devastator squad, you can achieve the kind of volume of fire that can remove an entire gaunt brood or IG platoon in a single shooting round with good scatter results, or drop an entire squadron of Land Speeders. The Strength 8 Krak missile can also be used to get Instant Kill wounds on models like enemy commanders, Nob Bikers, and Tyranid Warriors, while the AP3 can be useful to knock wounds off of a Carnifex or an Avatar of Khaine. The only place this really fails is against TEQs. Single wound models with a 2+ armor save are better dealt with by Plasma. Taking a Devastator squad of 10 with one Lascannon and three Missile Launchers is a great unit for the ability to split into two combat squads, one of which is a three Missile Launcher squad with two ablative wounds, and one a Lascannon with Signum (for BS5) and three ablative wounds.

The Heavy Bolter Str 5 AP 4 36” Heavy 3

The Heavy Bolter is best used as a long-range infantry killer. The inability to move and shoot means that you will need to set these teams up about 12” inside your board edge to get maximum fire coverage. While it tends to fall short of killing Marine and Terminator Equivalents, this weapon excels at light infantry control. With three direct shots, no scatter dice can ruin your day; you can bet on two hits per turn at a good enough strength to wound almost all infantry on 2+ or 3+, the AP 4 will punch right through Firewarriors, Aspect Warriors, Genestealers, and Stormtroopers. Deployment is almost identical to the Plasma Cannon, somewhere high up in a building surrounded by open field is ideal. The Heavy Bolter is, overall, your most consistent and reliable medium-to-long range infantry killer. Flamers have to be too close, and blasts can scatter off into nothingness, and Plasma Cannons can overheat, but a few Heavy bolters in strategic spots create a wall of fire consistently, and at a rate that can even defeat units in cover. The direct-fire is even better when used against an opponent who always spreads his units to maximum coherency to minimize blast weapons. Spread correctly, you should never get more than two hits on a unit with a small blast template, while the Heavy Bolter will always have the potential for three hits. In a pinch, Heavy Bolters can be used against AV10 or 11, hoping that the rate of fire will produce at least one damage result.

The Multi-Melta Str 8 AP 1 24” Heavy 1, Melta

Given the new rules for Vulkan He’Stan, and the sudden reduction of the Multi-Melta cost to a free selection in a ten man Tactical Squad, it comes as no surprise that the previously neglected Multi-Melta is finding its way into lists again. This is one of the hardest weapons to deploy and use to maximum effect because of its maddening combination of requirements. High strength, low rate of fire, and AP 1 makes this an obvious vehicle killer. Lack of move and fire ability combined with a 12” prime firing range makes this almost impossible to deploy against any armor piece that moves. However, if you sneak one close enough in a Rhino, drop one in a Drop Pod, or have it sitting in a commanding central spot, it can be the deadliest anti-armor weapon in the arsenal. For the first two options, lack of move and shoot capability really cripples the gun, allowing your opponent a whole turn to get outside of 12”. On the flip side, you just managed to force him to scramble his Basilisks out of the way instead of firing. The threat of force can be just as useful as force itself in a circumstance like this. If you do get a shot, you’ve got a great chance of destroying anything, and everyone knows it. Play it like a knight on a chessboard. Drop in the middle and in range of multiple targets, and force your opponent to choose what to loose. Alternatively, deploying a squad of 2-4 Multi-Meltas in a Devastator squad is a great way to make a No Vehicles zone somewhere on the board. Drop them right in the middle, or in a good position overlooking a main avenue and you can really shut down your opponent’s mobility options. Even at 24”, AP1 will drive home any damage you do, but Strength 8 falls short of being a serious threat to AV13 and 14 without the 2D6 penetration when in melta range. If all the enemy armor flees like ants before your mighty Multi-Melta, this can also be used for 24” Instant Kill sniping on high-value enemy infantry. This weapon is far better deployed on an Attack Bike, Land Speeder, or Land Raider, who can all add 12” to the weapon range with movement before firing.

The Meltagun Str 8 AP 1 12” Assault 1

The assault version of the Multi-Melta, the Meltagun shares a lot of the same strengths and weaknesses as its larger cousin, with one notable exception, the ability to move and shoot. With only half the range, the Meltagun is best delivered point-blank, within 6” of enemy armor. However, being an Assault weapon, it’s actually much easier to accomplish than getting within 12” with a Multi-Melta. A Meltagun in a Tactical Squad mounted in a Rhino can drive forward 12”, and deploy within 2” of the door, giving you about 14” to add to the 6” melta range when figuring out delivery methods. You can also move 6” in the Rhino, and fire it from the top hatch for some drive-by armor killing. The Melta and Multi-Melta are best used against AV13 or 14, since other weapons with higher rates of fire can handle AV12 and down. One shot comes down to one dice, as always, so always plan for the worst and try to deploy so that your squad can survive even if it fails to make the kill. Also, arming your Seargent with a Combi-Melta can help you insure that your first target goes down quickly. When not used against vehicles, the Meltagun can provide Str8 Instant Kills while still allowing a charge. Unfortunately, most of the infantry targets you want to use the Meltagun on aren’t the same ones you’ll want to charge with a Tactical squad, for the most part, but the option is there.

The Plasmagun Str 7 AP 2 24” Rapid Fire, Gets Hot!

This is the weapon of choice for facing down Marine and Terminator Equivalents or any heavy infantry from close range. AP2 will bypass Feel No Pain from pesky Death Companies and Plague Marines, and will put Necrons down for the count. Strength 7 will wound even a Carnifex most of the time, and can be used against light armor if needed. Gets Hot is an issue at times, but at least it’s not as bad as in the 4th Edition, where a 1 or a 2 got Hot. Now, you have a flat 1/6th chance per shot of taking a wound, and a 1/3 chance of failing the save as a Marine. Given the potential damage output of the weapon over the game, this risk is most often worth a 1/18 chance per shot of loosing the model. This can be used in conjunction with a Lascannon in a Tactical squad to give them another AP2 shot at mid-range, or with a Seargent with Combi-Plasma or Plasma Pistol to maximize drive-by and disembarking shots from a Rhino. Another good combination is a Command Squad with 2-4 Plasmaguns. A model with Feel No Pain (from the Apothecary) reduces the risk of shooter death to 1/36. A quad-Plasmagun Command Squad can absolutely murder a unit of Terminators in a single round of shooting in rapid-fire range. Add a Captain with Plasma Pistol (like Sicarious) and a Razorback with Lascannon/Twin-linked Plasmagun to really maximize the Plasma Shock effect.

The Flamer Str 4 AP 5 Template Assault 1

This weapon is a classic standby of the Tactical Squad, used for thinning hordes, especially the ones that like to lurk in cover. With Template coverage, catching your opponent clumped up in the bushes waiting to assault is what you want to do. The main drawback of the weapon is that it often leaves you stranded, having killed enough models to put you out of range of the assault. These are good to have in Tactical Squads if you know you are facing a horde, or if you have no desire to assault. They do pick up a bit of usefulness in an Assault Squad, which can take two Flamers. Used against Kroot or Eldar Guardians in cover, you can often do more damage with piles of auto-hits at Strength 4 than getting into assault with a full-strength unit. However, with the Strength and AP of a Boltgun, this weapon can be easily outclassed by MEQ opponents or high toughness. It remains in Tier Two because of the ability to auto-hit while ignoring cover, and potentially gets more than two hits on a unit.

The Storm Bolter Str 4 AP 5 24” Assault 2

This is the big brother of the Boltgun; essentially two of them strapped together on a shotgun trigger. It has a better rate of fire and a better range than the standard Bolter, and if this weren’t advantage enough, it allows for assault afterwards. The only drawback of this pattern is that it does not count as a pistol weapon for the +1 attack in close combat. Most people are familiar with Storm Bolters as the standard armament of the Terminators, but it can also be taken on a Tactical Seargent for a cheap way to add fire, or to a Captain or Commander for small points games. If you plan on using a Powerfist or Thunderhammer anyway, the Storm Bolter is an excellent pairing since a pistol weapon won’t grant you +1 A anyway.

Tier 3

The Boltgun (Bolter) Str 4 AP5 24” Rapid Fire

The mighty standby of the Space Marines, the Boltgun is the most widely recognized weapon, and perhaps symbol, of the Space Marine army. Billed as a .75 caliber SMG firing rocket-propelled explosive miniature warheads, a lot of people are very underwhelmed by this weapon’s very average stat-line after just a few games’ use. Strength 4 means you only wound enemy Marines on a 4+, while AP 5 can’t even pierce Carapace Armor. The short 12” range of rapid-fire exposes you to the enemy, while the 24” range mode halves your rate of fire to a single shot per marine and forces the squad to stay stationary. What the Boltgun does do, however, is come by the Rhino-load. Volume of fire is actually the most reliable way to accomplish anything in the cover-rich environment of 5th Edition Warhammer 40K, and every Space Marine can hit on a 3+. To perform the classic Bolter Shock maneuver, simply mount a squad of ten Marines in a Rhino, drive up and disembark within 12” of your target, and unload with everything. As long as your target is T4 or less, you have a decent chance to pile on the wounds. The idea is that any armor, even 2+ Terminator armor, will fail those saves if you make them roll enough. Boltguns may not be amazing by themselves, but a squad volley of Strength 4 fire is actually one of the greatest things the Space Marines can do. Although you don’t find the lighter units much in the current game these days, the Boltgun is an optimal armament for light infantry killing. Eldar Guardians, Gaunts, Flak Vest wearing IG platoons, and Orks with 5+ or lower armor saves have a right to be afraid. If a squad of Boltguns can deployed quickly within 12”, they can cause enough wounds to cripple or destroy the unit outright. All it takes is 25% casualties to force a leadership check, and some armies don’t have anything to save them from falling back off of the board. Boltguns also come twin-linked on bikes as standard, with the primary application difference being the Relentless nature of bikes, which allows them to use the 24” single shot mode even after a full 12” move. Strength 4 can also glance AV10 if there’s nothing else to do, and if you grant Tank Hunters to a Tactical Squad with Sicarious, those Bolters can suddenly penetrate AV10 and glance AV11.

The Plasma Pistol Str 7 AP 2 12” Pistol, Gets Hot!

As the smallest package plasma comes in, the Plasma Pistol can add a significant shooting punch to any unit in the army. A Tactical Seargent can take one in place of his Bolt Pistol, which is especially effective in squads armed with a Plasmagun special weapon. Since you will already be seeking the 12” Rapid Fire range most of the time, having a third Str 7 AP2 shot can give a little extra insurance to eliminating the target. When shooting at squads like Terminators and FNP Plague Marines it especially shines, increasing the potential damage of the unit by almost 50%. With the Plasmagun/Plasma Pistol combination in a Rhino, the Rhino can drive 6” and both weapons can be fired from the top hatches, allowing for a three-shot mobile plasma pillbox. Add a Plasma Cannon to the unit, and now you have the option to sit still for a Cannon shot and 1 single-shot at 24”. Plasma Pistols can be taken by Assault Marines for a maximum of three in a unit. This can really surprise an opponent who has never seen this deployment, as they suddenly have a jump packing unit putting out three Str 7 AP2 shots a turn. Vanguard Vets and Command Squads can take a Plasma Pistol for each model, with the Command Squad benefiting from Feel No Pain. Aside from the points costs, this can lead to some very scary squads. A Command Squad with Plasma Pistol x4 and Powersword x4 might just be the best of both worlds, but once again, tactical casualty removal seriously hampers any unit that attempts to shoot before charging.

The Bolt Pistol Str4 AP5 12” Pistol

The best thing you can say about a Bolt Pistol is – at least it’s not a Laspistol. Just as a Boltgun, a Strength 4 AP5 single shot at 12” isn’t going to win anyone a marksman award. The only reason this stays in Tier 3, and the reason every Seargent has one, is because as a pistol, it grants +1 Attack in Assault. If you are performing a Bolter Shock maneuver, this is one more shot to pile on, since you’ll be within 12” anyway, and if the squad is about to charge, everyone can now shoot once, thanks to the fact that every Tactical Marine comes with a Bolt Pistol now. Why they gave everyone a Bolt Pistol, Frag Grenades and Krak Grenades, but left out the Combat Blade is beyond this author’s ability to understand. So, every Marine gets a Bolt Pistol, so a charging Tactical squad can crank out 10 St 4 shots before a charge. Don’t forget that your Heavy Weapon carrier isn’t useless on the charging shots; he’s just reduced to firing his sidearm. This leads back to the same problem as the Flamer, and all Assault weapons, really. Shooting before charging is a perfectly logical thing to do, but in game terms, it can defeat the charge by a smart enemy player’s tactical model removal. If your charge is on the edge of the distance, or only to one or two models, you want to forgo shooting to make sure you catch them. You can choose to not shoot with a unit, but if you fire, you have to fire all weapons. If you fire 10 Bolt Pistols, or 9 and a Flamer at a unit that is 4” away, you very well might remove just enough models to put you out of charge range. The general recommendation is to only shoot if you can charge the rear-most enemy model in the unit.

The Sniper Rifle Str X AP 5 36” Heavy 1, Sniper (Rending, Pinning)

The original Hellfire Rounds, the Sniper Rifle is the only weapon to innately wound on a 4+ regardless of Toughness. Scouts came down to BS 3 in this Codex, which reduces the potential output of a sniper unit, but as before, the utility of a long range Pinning weapon is hard to deny. Rending also can add bite to the unit, and hopefully ensure at least one casualty to force the Pinning check. Taken in small numbers, these tend to be so capricious as to be a waste, but taken for a large unit, they can do a great job on infantry and Monstrous Creatures. A Sniper weapon is really wasted against Toughness 4 or less, but quickly picks up efficiency over a standard Boltgun on Toughness 5 or higher models. Against The Avatar, a C’Tan, a Warboss, or a Carnifex, Sniper Rifles start to really shine, as they can start to stack wounds on these big guys in high enough volume to threaten them. When deployed against a horde, attempt to pin a unit that will hamper units behind, or at least stagger the waves back in one spot or another. Delaying just one unit of Orks may buy you all the time you need to turn back the assault. Once you get that Pin, though, move on to other units. Just like with Shaking/Stunning vehicles, once you’ve got them shut down for the next turn, they become a non-immediate threat, and the rest of your firepower should redirect to something more pressing. The 36” range meshes well with Telion’s Stalker Pattern Boltgun, making this the optimal loadout for a Scout squad with Telion for the Seargent.

The Shotgun Str 4 AP - 12” Assault 2

Also for the Scouts in this Codex, the Shotgun is an interesting alternative to the Boltgun for the squad. As an Assault 2 weapon, it can be fired freely before the charge, on the move, or from the back of the open-topped Land Speeder Storm if it slows down long enough. The short range and moderate rate of fire make it difficult to use in the BS 3 Scout squads, and AP – makes it suitable for only the lightest infantry, or shooting at targets in cover or who would take an armor save anyway. It is at least Strength 4 (now) to have a decent chance to wound. Perhaps the best use of them is in a squad that hopes to assault units in cover, but would rather do casualties with shooting so as to have fewer models to fight against in Assault.

Thanks for reading, I hope you found something worth the time it took to wade through that wall of text!
-GR

Edit: Thanks Wehrkind. Heavy Flamer section updated. I'll look up the Sniper Rifles again tonight but I have made the change because you're probably right.

Edit: Thank you Fetterkey. Removed the mistake about Hellfire rounds working with Storm Bolters. My bad. I'll concede the point about ACs and Carnifexes, too. Can you think of a better example target for the AC? Autocannon also moved to Tier 1. Heavy Flamer correction made for Wehrkind. Excellent point about the shotgun on a Scout Sergeant.

Edit: Thank you Regwon. Sentence added to introduction to explain the Tier system. Arbitrary as it is.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2009/12/17 06:53:34




Ultramarines Second Company - ~4000 points

Dark Eldar WIP - ~800 points

 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






Lancaster PA

Nicely written. Some points:

1: Heavy flamers are Assault 1, so everyone can fire them on the move, even girly little SoBs
2: Sniper Rifles: Wounds on 4+ now I think, not 2+. Also, you might want to mention that the SGT is BS 4 and can take a sniper rifle, which I always forget.

Good summary though; I wish I had this back when I wanted to play marines


Woad to WAR... on Celts blog, which is mostly Circle Orboros
"I'm sick of auto-penetrating attacks against my behind!" - Kungfuhustler 
   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon





This seems like an informative but flawed article for new Marine players. A few criticisms:

-Hellfire bolts don't work with a storm bolter.

-I'm not sure what makes assault cannons that good against Carnifexes, since Carnifexes have 3+ saves. A cyclone launcher seems much better and more versatile to boot.

-As Wehrkind mentioned, heavy flamers can be fired on the move by Sternguard.

-Autocannons definitely seem "tier 1." They are better than lascannons against AV 10-11 vehicles, which are rather common, and are almost as good against AV 12 targets.

-The best use of the shotgun is on a Scout Sergeant without any special close combat weapon, as his BS 4 makes ranged attacks better than melee ones against WS 4 targets, which are quite common. Also, the shotgun is obviously better than the bolt pistol on a Scout Sergeant with power fist.
   
Made in gb
Morphing Obliterator





You havent said what you're basing your tier system on. I assume its how effective the weapons are in the current meta, because they will vary from game to game (plasma guns much better than melta guns vs Nids, but not as good vs mech) and so that cant really provide an objective viewpoint. With that assumption I have to disagree with some of your markings.

I dont think lascannon deserve to qualify as T1. Although it has range it is still only a single S9 shot. At BS 4 this will miss 1/3 of the time and you cant gaurentee that it will destroy a vehicle. Anti-tank is its main role because there are better weapons for killing infantry and MCs, and in 5th i dont think it is as reliable as say, a multimelta. You have to remember that in the current mech environment range means less than it used to. Either you have your guys driving forward in vehicles and/or you opponents comming towards you. As a result the 48" range of a lascannon means less.

Plasma cannon also should lose their T1 status. A S7 AP2 blast is fantastic on paper, but in reality most of your shooting targets will get some sort of cover save. In this case target saturation becomes a key point. Its much better to hit your opponent with lots of high AP shots than a few low AP ones, given the amount of cover saves. For the points, i think heavy bolters are better (although I dont think they should be T1)

Assault cannon, CMLs and heavy flamers, although very very good, should not be T1, purely because of their lack of availability. There is only a single, very expensive unit that can take all three and only two other additional units that can take a heavy flamers (and I dont think you should take heavy flamers on sternguard). It takes a very heavy investment in points to aquire these guns and I think that there is more to be considered when getting them (you dont take a terminator squad simple so you can have an assault cannon for example).

In their place i think you should elevate melta guns, multimeltas and flamers.

Melta guns are the best close range anti-vehicle weapon in the game at the moment. If you can get within 6" of a vehicle (easy if you play mech) then there isnt any other weapon that gives you that good a chance to kill a vehicle. It definately has the most aggressive anti-vehicle utility. Also within 6" a melta guns ahs a much higher chance to destroy an AV12 vehicle (24% vs 7%)

Multimeltas are sometimes overlooked as tactical squad weapons. In actual fact the give you a 24" threat range with a good chance of dealing with vehicles and an excellent chance of dealing with them at 12". Again because of the mech environment range matters less, you can be confident that your multimeltas will do something. But the best thing about them is that they're free! You pay no extra points to At the very least they will stop vehicles comming near your tacticals.

Flamers are the choice for close range anti-infantry. Large numbers of possible hits, a reasonable strength and ignoring cover saves make them very effective against most infantry (even MEQs). Again the fact that they are free make them very attractive to tactical squads. Combined with vulkan to make them TL there arent any infantry portable weapons that compare to them at close range.

taking up the mission
Polonius wrote:Well, seeing as I literally will die if I ever lose a game of 40k, I find your approach almost heretical. If we were to play each other in a tournament, not only would I table you, I would murder you, your family, every woman you ever loved and burn down your house. I mean, what's the point in winning if you allow people that don't take the game seriously to live?
 
   
Made in us
Grim Rune Priest in the Eye of the Storm





Riverside CA

I am so happy to see an objective reveiw of Plasma Weapons. I hope that this will end the WTF responses to my Plasma SPAM Company [probaly not].
I hope you don't mind me pluging this on mt Space Wolf Tread
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/266924.page


Space Wolf Player Since 1989
My First Impression Threads:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727226.page;jsessionid=3BCA26863DCC17CF82F647B2839DA6E5

I am a Furry that plays with little Toy Soldiers; if you are taking me too seriously I am not the only one with Issues.

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Long-Range Ultramarine Land Speeder Pilot




Dallas, TX

Regwon - I'm actually basing my Tier system on what I think is heaviest ordnance down to lightest, or class of weapon, to my way of thinking. Sorry you don't agree, I'm actually trying as much as I can to stay objective to the meta game.

Flamers, Meltaguns, and Multi-Meltas all Teir 1, and everything else bumped down? Can I ask you a question? Did you have a Vulkan model made before it was released?

Seriously, I understand your point, and agree completely with many of the points in your tactical doctrine, but disagree with others. I think that the days of Vulkan spam will pass, and the rise of the Bugs will see a whole new take on army composition. Or maybe not. Who knows?

Anpu42 - No problem at all, thanks for the plug!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/12/17 06:46:32




Ultramarines Second Company - ~4000 points

Dark Eldar WIP - ~800 points

 
   
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Terminator with Assault Cannon





Flamers are very powerful weapons, and I'm not sure that the release of Codex: Tyranids will make them worse. Similarly, melta weapons aren't exactly going to perform poorly against Tyranids, especially against those creatures that can suffer Instant Death. Of course, all of this depends on what sorts of armies the new Codex supports. The one thing that I'm confident in is that the Missile Launcher will be a truly good weapon against Tyranids, with both a high strength attack to target monsters and a blast attack to take out hordes of Gaunts.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/12/18 00:59:32


 
   
Made in us
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Dallas, TX

All good points, Fetterkey. A Meltagun would be even more useful if you could Instakill some of the bigger bugs, like 'thropes and Warriors with multiple wounds. If they remain immune to ID, Plasma will be better for big bugs with the chance to deal two wounds per gun.



Ultramarines Second Company - ~4000 points

Dark Eldar WIP - ~800 points

 
   
Made in us
Grim Rune Priest in the Eye of the Storm





Riverside CA

I starting to like Plasma Guns for my Space Wolves, I can stick 2 out the top of a Rhino.
Not that I dislike the Plasma Weapons, I have a Marine Company with 21 and soon to be 24.

Space Wolf Player Since 1989
My First Impression Threads:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727226.page;jsessionid=3BCA26863DCC17CF82F647B2839DA6E5

I am a Furry that plays with little Toy Soldiers; if you are taking me too seriously I am not the only one with Issues.

IEGA Web Site”: http://www.meetup.com/IEGA-InlandEmpireGamersAssociation/ 
   
Made in nl
Boosting Space Marine Biker



Netherlands

Very nice article, GeneralRetreat. It's always good to see different views on load-outs and tactics and your views are definitely refreshing. I'd already suspected that Plasma was more usable than most people made it appear and your article has prompted me to actually start using them

One question/remark: how can a Terminator fire both the CML and a Storm Bolter? It's still only an infantry model, which can only fire one weapon per turn. I read the same thing on http://40kwaystodie.blogspot.com/ (excellent blog btw, for a beginner like me) but I still can't figure out how a Terminator could fire two weapons.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/12/18 11:02:14


 
   
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant





Teesside

The text for the CML says it has special targeting gubbins that lets you fire both it and the Storm Bolter. That's a specific rule that overrides the general rule that an infantry model can only fire 1 weapon per turn.

I like plasma guns quite a lot. They enhance a tac squad's already excellent ability to be a good general-purpose unit, in that they make infantry-killing a lot more effective as well as giving it a reasonable chance to hurt MCs and light transports.

My painting & modelling blog: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/699224.page

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Made in nl
Boosting Space Marine Biker



Netherlands

Ah, thanks
   
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Long-Range Ultramarine Land Speeder Pilot




Dallas, TX

Yeah, assuming you use rapid-fire volleys, the Plasmagun is the best choice when facing MEQs. I've got my Tactical squad loadouts down to about three overall sets, and the one I simply can't do without in any type of game is what I call the Plasma Wagon:

Tactical x 10 Plasma Cannon, Plasmagun, Plasma Pistol, Rhino w/ EA

The number of ways I've found to use this squad is just never-ending, and I've always got a use for AP2 shooting somewhere in a game.



Ultramarines Second Company - ~4000 points

Dark Eldar WIP - ~800 points

 
   
 
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