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Because this is the art that introduced him to a lot of us:

http://whfb.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/thumb/c/c6/Nagash.jpg/300px-Nagash.jpg

And the model we got was not even close.

Nyeh, He-Man, Nyeh!

I don't think it's the model as such, so much as the fact you're paying £13.50 for him.

I found this conversion on first page of google images.

Much better IMHO.
At least it isn't going to make you opponent laugh.

That's quite nicely done. And a vast improvement on the actual model.

Huh, that's a clever use of the nightbringer body.

Personally, I think it is the paint job that makes it look crap. I always quite liked it at the time it was made - it doesn't stand up to the test of time however.

He reminds me of the "LOL WUT" Pear...except hes a skeleton


the LOLWUTskeleton

Maybe because he's a pimpin liche?

I swear he has fething parachute pants under that robe, along with a flava flave clock around his neck.

I understand Mr Morley has done some sculpting for Mantic (IIRC he did the metal Elven cavalry). Maybe we'll see his revised version of "Nagash" as part of the Undead range for Mantic? Here's hoping!

I personally think Nagash should look more like this:

I think Nagash should look more like this:

insaniak wrote:
The problem with Nagash is largely down to his head... The rest of the model is pretty much in keeping with the range at the time of it's release. The head is just awful, and looks like it was taken from a cheap novelty statue.

According to Morley in an interview years ago, the head it was supposed to have was better, but whoever was approving the sculpts at the time didn't like it (to scary or somesuch thing) and asked for something different for comparison. Morley says he sculpted the skull head badly deliberately, thinking that they would see how silly it was and opt for the original head... but the plan backfired, and the mini was accepted with the wooden voodoo head that we've all come to deride so much.

Here's a pic of the alleged alternative head. Much better IMO
http://www.collecting-citadel-miniatures.com/wiki/index.php/Image:Unreleased_-_Undead_Nagash.jpg

It is a dated sculpt when you compare it to recent minis put out by GW and most other miniature companies.

It doesn't suck, but I have no use for it.

reds8n wrote:It is a true story

and, for the record, some of his sculpts were indeed gorgeous.

IIRC, he also said he was a beginning designer at the time and probably followed the brief and artwork too closely. Not that the end result is a carbon copy of the artwork, mind you. Just that he probably tried to duplicate details more than adapt them. *shrug*

He was inconsistent. I really liked his Waywatchers. Then in the same line you had his top-heavy bodybuilder Orion. The secret to the mystery of Morley was to figure out which days of the week he tended to produce the good stuff, then only employ him on those days.

I think that Nagash is big because this is his second incarnation, after his body was remade by magic as an undead construct. Previously he was struck down by Sigmar.

LunaHound wrote:
I recently was curious and looked up Nagash , the supposedly dreaded GW model that even makes GW fans cry about.

But i dont understand , what exactly about it makes people hate it? It looks just the same as other GW sculpt?

If you ever get a chance to get one of these models, I can assure you that you will never ask that question again.

The commentary here is all in all, correct.

This guy was from when Undead were a serious army choice, and we wern't trapped to Vampires only.

When I played, I had another alternative that was 110% better, and had more character then Nagash.

Most players at the time didn't even really give the Nagash sculpt a serious look. I've seen maybe one or two players that ever had the guts to put that on a table in the whole two years or so between 94-96.

I used the Lichmaster, Hendrich Kimmler and his sidekick Krell who first made an impression on me after playing the Hogshead Warhammer RPG in the modual "Death on the Reik."

Nothing says hard core fantasy like fighting off a zombie horde in a small warhammer fantasy town with nothing but your Brains, a good crew, and a sword.

Games Workshop has a LARGE history of funny looking models. Just look at some of the older Chaos and Tyranids. Sloooowly, very sloooowly they are replacing these funny mini's or 'out of date' minis. One reason I never picked up Chaos is because they dont look evil\mean etc. And although armies like Chaos are getting better models they still look a little silly to me.

The Tyranids are a great example of how things have improved with GW. The whole look has been redone which for once is nice to see. Hopefully Nagash and his armies will also get redone from scratch.

I remember seeing a Nagash model that was converted into a different pose, more in keeping with his artwork, on the back cover of an old Citadel Journal. That conversion, that also had a more dark and menacing color scheme is the Nagash I wish people could see.

I know, pics or didn't happen, but my citadel journal collection was pitched in a move. That conversion(along with Nagash's rules from what I remember) was what made me buy the model and try a similiar conversion, which was subsequently stolen, believe it or not.

For its age, its not really that bad. Mostly everything from that time frame sucked, compared to whats out now. The only thing from that era that is universally(in my experience) seen to have aged almost perfectly are the stone trolls. Everyone has different tastes, but the nagash bashing just seems to be a niche nerd meme that people latch onto for humor and an easy dig at GW sculptors.

And I agree with reds8n, some of Gary's later sculpts were pretty awesome. I also agree with OoieGoie, if they revisited him he'd be pretty cool with today's sculpting techiques. Lemartes is proof that they can remake a crap model into a work of art. Also, see Azhag.

When people ask "Why the Nagash model hate?" it makes me ask, "Why ask why the Nagash model hate?".

Seriously, it is one screwed up model, in every way possible.

Of course opinions vary.

But not this time.

Seriously.

Hmmm, Time of Legends series seem to have left that 14 foot tall thing out. He goes through plenty of changes, but doesnt grow to that extent.
On topic: If they could make the model look like the cover art of the 3rd book in the Time of Legends Sigmar series, It would be utterly awsome!


Edit: Pic is small, check it out on Black Library sight it you want though!

Post 2010/06/29 02:28:21 Subject: Re:Why the Nagash model hate?
I remember seeing a Nagash model that was converted into a different pose, more in keeping with his artwork, on the back cover of an old Citadel Journal. That conversion, that also had a more dark and menacing color scheme is the Nagash I wish people could see.

I know, pics or didn't happen

I remember this as well. Some chap polished that turd quite well. I just wish I could remember which journal or WD it was in.

Alpharius wrote:When people ask "Why the Nagash model hate?" it makes me ask, "Why ask why the Nagash model hate?".

Seriously, it is one screwed up model, in every way possible.

Of course opinions vary.

But not this time.

Seriously.

Becauuuuse.... GW always have wacky poses
still have wacky body proportions.

They are improving now days , but alot of models in stock dont differ much from Nagash.
So i just want to see why Nagash itself gets singled out so much.

The Nagash model is glaringly ridiculously bad. Wacky proprotions and detailing aside, it's just goofy, not scary. A hack job by a hack sculptor.

As for Morley saying it was a joke, that's a crock. If he really can do a better head, how come he can't re-sculpt the "correct" head? Put up or shut up, Gary.

JohnHwangDD wrote:The Nagash model is glaringly ridiculously bad. Wacky proprotions and detailing aside, it's just goofy, not scary. A hack job by a hack sculptor.

As for Morley saying it was a joke, that's a crock. If he really can do a better head, how come he can't re-sculpt the "correct" head? Put up or shut up, Gary.

Erm, if you're not going to bother looking at the link i've already put in this thread, then i'll just post it again...
http://www.collecting-citadel-miniatures.com/wiki/index.php/Image:Unreleased_-_Undead_Nagash.jpg

He DID resculpt the head. This one is the supposed original.

Grot 6 wrote:I used the Lichmaster, Hendrich Kimmler and his sidekick Krell who first made an impression on me after playing the Hogshead Warhammer RPG in the modual "Death on the Reik."

I still love the Kemmler model. That's one I'll never part with.

Buttlerthepug wrote:Hmmm, Time of Legends series seem to have left that 14 foot tall thing out. He goes through plenty of changes, but doesnt grow to that extent.

He doesn't grow to the 14' ht until he rebuilds himself when Sigmar pastes him. The books are portrying the lead up to that fight.

I assume the 3rd Nagash novel will cover his slow rebuild, ala Sauron.

Grimtuff wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:The Nagash model is glaringly ridiculously bad. Wacky proprotions and detailing aside, it's just goofy, not scary. A hack job by a hack sculptor.

As for Morley saying it was a joke, that's a crock. If he really can do a better head, how come he can't re-sculpt the "correct" head? Put up or shut up, Gary.

Erm, if you're not going to bother looking at the link i've already put in this thread, then i'll just post it again...
http://www.collecting-citadel-miniatures.com/wiki/index.php/Image:Unreleased_-_Undead_Nagash.jpg

He DID resculpt the head. This one is the supposed original.

Thank you. I don't know how I missed it first go around.

Still not great, but not as bad as what ended on the shelves.

JohnHwangDD wrote:As for Morley saying it was a joke, that's a crock. If he really can do a better head, how come he can't re-sculpt the "correct" head?

Because the sculptors aren't in charge of what gets released, and because he no longer works for GW?

Lets be honest this all comes down to GW's marketing department say "MOR' SKULLZ!!!" Is that the GW we all know? So no surprise.

unaHound wrote:They are improving now days , but alot of models in stock dont differ much from Nagash.

You're going to have to back this statement up with actual proof.