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 koooaei wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:


Elysian list with no fliers that needs to get into assault to do any real damage that's not BS2 auto-targetting, and can't Deep Strike its platoon because of the 50% rule.

This has a chance to be worse than mellee batlesuits

The only thing against it is that sixty lasguns might kill something squishy.

My attempt at a Space Marines list:

HQ

Master of the Forge
Auspex, Meltabombs, Power Axe, Teleport Homer, Thunder Hammer

Elites

Vanguard Vets
10x with 2x Thunder Hammers, storm shields and meltabombs
No jump packs or transports, so they're just huffing around on foot

Troops

Scouts
5x with Sniper Rifles. Sgt has 2x Thunder Hammers, melta bombs and Telport Homer

Tac Squad
5x with bolters. Sgt has melta bombs and teleport homer

Heavy Support

Hunter
Dozer blades, extra armor

Stalker
Dozer Blades, extra armor


Chapter tactics IF (there are only 4 bolters in this list, so there's basically no benefit from the CT). The idea here is that I've dumped about 1000 points into the way over-equipped vanguard vet squad. Storm shields are non-factor if you're fighting against other "terrible" lists with no AP3. Blood Angels can do this better with Death Company, who are also non-scoring.

tgjensen wrote:
It's kind of hard to come up with a properly useless Ork list because you inevitably have to take something that could be a threat, but here's a suggestion:

Zagstruk - 65
Mek – Killsaw, Grot Oiler, Kustom Mega-Slugga - 60
30 Grots + 3 Runtherds w/ 3x Grot Prod, 3x Squighounds – 145
30 Boyz – 180
10 Meganobz w/ 10x Killsaws, 10x Bosspole – 550
Trukk w/ Boarding Plank, Extra Armour, Stikkbomb Chukka, Red Paint Job – 65
Warbuggy w/ Red Paint Job, Extra Armour, Grot Riggers, Wartrakk - 55
6 Killa Kans w/ Big Shoota, Rokkit, Grotzooka, Kustom Mega-Blasta, 2x Skorcha, 6x Extra Armour – 380

Fairly useless characters, a transport that none of the mobs can fit into, excessive and expensive wargear, no worthwhile shooting or weapons loadouts with minimal synergy and three big mobs of grots, boyz and meganobz that have to slog it across the table to get into close combat to be useful.

Meganobz, Kanz and 30 boyz. That's gona krump the other worst lists like no big deal...Maybe max on warbugies instead of kanz and burna boyz instead of meanobz. Also, Zaggy ain't that bad. I'd take a big mek without anything useful instead. With fixxer upperz and a bunch of ammo runts + the ones to reroll fixes.

Also, i'd drop squighounds cause they'd be able to pass some ld otherwise!

Another thing i'd take would be Zzap gunz without ammo runts. Whenever you shoot a battery, it's gona be very likely that 1-2 grots will die to overheats and they'd have to pass ld5 not to run away.

At 23 points a piece, I'd rate the Zzap guns as very good for a T7 2W Sv3+ piece artillery with 36" range, AP2 and an average of S7. The risk of causing a wound on the crew due to Gets Hot! is only 1/24, so almost insignificant for such a cheap unit.

I agree the meganobz are probably quite good, relative to what we are trying to accomplish. With the Orks you can't really avoid taking something that's going to be at least halfway decent, so I tried to get as little bang for my points, and at 550 points for a slow unit with only close combat weapons they don't provide much bang. That said it is possible that footslugging burnas, combined with a smaller unit of meganobz and/or possibly regular nobz might be better if you also got rid of the Trukk.

I think Killa Kans are better than a unit of warbuggies though. Buggies are cheaper and have outflank plus greater speed, whereas Kans are slower, more expensive and at risk of running away when they suffer casualties.

tgjensen wrote:
At 23 points a piece, I'd rate the Zzap guns as very good for a T7 2W Sv3+ piece artillery with 36" range, AP2 and an average of S7. The risk of causing a wound on the crew due to Gets Hot! is only 1/24, so almost insignificant for such a cheap unit.

The risk is 1/6 per shot. And if you roll s10+ than it's 1/2 per shot. Grots don't have armor so if the gun gets hot, one guaranteerly dies. So, you can have a squad of 2 gunz with a crew of 4 grots. If at least one gun gets hot, one grot dies and they have to pass ld5 not to flee.

They're not bad with ammo runts or ability to reroll ones at least. But quite selfdistructive.

Ah okay, I see what you mean. I never really read the rule properly since the last codex.

OK I think I got this.

HQ:
Illic Nightspear
Prince Yriel

Troops
10x Alaitoc Pathfinders
20x Storm Guardians

Elites
10x Harlequins (8x Harlequin Kisses, 1x Shadowseer, 1x Death Jester, 1x Troupe Master)
10x Howling Banshees (1x Exarch, Executioner, Disarming Strike, Shield of Grace)

Heavy Support
3x War Walkers (6x EML, 6x Flakk Missiles)

Of course this army will actually wreck in assault, but...

Pretty strong worst list you got there. Think they'd crush dual thunder hammer deathcompany like no big deal. And they can rush the walkers at the IG wall of s3. Easy with all that battlefocus run + shoot stuff. While the mellee guyz will come in a bit after the walkers and chop up the remains.

tgjensen wrote:
It's kind of hard to come up with a properly useless Ork list because you inevitably have to take something that could be a threat, but here's a suggestion:

Zagstruk - 65
Mek – Killsaw, Grot Oiler, Kustom Mega-Slugga - 60
30 Grots + 3 Runtherds w/ 3x Grot Prod, 3x Squighounds – 145
30 Boyz – 180
10 Meganobz w/ 10x Killsaws, 10x Bosspole – 550
Trukk w/ Boarding Plank, Extra Armour, Stikkbomb Chukka, Red Paint Job – 65
Warbuggy w/ Red Paint Job, Extra Armour, Grot Riggers, Wartrakk - 55
6 Killa Kans w/ Big Shoota, Rokkit, Grotzooka, Kustom Mega-Blasta, 2x Skorcha, 6x Extra Armour – 380

Fairly useless characters, a transport that none of the mobs can fit into, excessive and expensive wargear, no worthwhile shooting or weapons loadouts with minimal synergy and three big mobs of grots, boyz and meganobz that have to slog it across the table to get into close combat to be useful.

That will still butcher that no-weapons tau list in CC.

Orks face a similar problem to space marines here. Even the meh-stuff is kind-of decent and will slaughter the really bad units of the other codices. That Meganobz mob will put up a lot of hurt once they come close and with 2+ save you'd have to gear up on something usefull to decimate the squad in time.

I've got one



Necrons

Illuminator Szeras

3 x 20 flayed ones

2 x 7 warriors

1 x 1 tomb blade, shields, scope, vane. With particle beamers
1 x 2 tomb blade, scope, vane. with particle beamers.

3 x 3 spyders. No upgrades.

Sure, in cc it's okay. But no dakka and no way to get to cc...

Too many duplicate units in that list, Ffyll., and besides, Flayed Ones infiltrate.

A truly bad Necron list would use the Maynarkh rules from forge world to put Flayed Ones in as one Troops choice, something like;

+++ New Roster (1500pts) +++

++ Necrons: FW IA12 - Dark Harvest (2014) (Combined Arms Detachment) ++

+ HQ +

Maynarkh Overlord [Flensing Scarabs, Hyperphase Sword, Phase Shifter, Phylactery, Upgrade to Phaeron]

+ Elites +

Charnel Lychguards [Flensing Scarabs]
····10x Charnel Lychguards [10x Warscythe]

+ Troops +

Maynarkh Flayed One Pack [20x Flayed One, Flensing Scarabs]

Maynarkh Immortals [Flensing Scarabs]
····5x Maynarkh Immortals [5x Tesla Carbine]

+ Fortification +

Necron Tomb Fortress

Created with BattleScribe

Ffyllotek, check the OP - no duplicates.

Has anyone considered including fortifications (EDIT: Other than Miko)? A fortification network takes up a single Fortification choice, and CADs get 1 fortification slot.

The Wall Of Martyrs Defense Network would be a load of rubbish for non-shooting armies.
Wall of Martyrs Defense Line with 6 sets of tank traps: 170 points
Wall of Martyrs Defense Emplacement with 6 sets of tank traps: 130 points
Wall of Martyrs Imperial Bunker with 6 sets of tank traps, Magos Machine Spirit (BS 3 for the non-existent emplaced weapons!), Void Shields, and either comms relay or an ammunition dump 220
That's 520 points and doesn't include a single gun. And that's before we consider the Firestorm Redoubt and the weapon batteries*.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Spinner wrote:
How does this challenge's Highlander rule work with Guardsman infantry platoons?

The unit is the platoon, not the various sub-units. So you could take a platoon with lots of squads, but you probably don't want to.

The same logic would apply to the fortification network, so that means we can add even more useless defense lines / emplacements / bunkers /etc.

Then use the rest of the points to guy some units that don't have ranged weapons

*Yay, immobile guns with either 24'' range (punisher gatling cannon) or BS2 that will fire harmlessly at enemy tanks, or giant lascannon arrays that keep snapfiring. Oh, and have a bad habit of firing at the gretchen in the ruins (giant lascannon) or front armour of a main battle tank (gatling cannon).

lol, Mallich, we cross-posted. Check my list above yours.

Forgive me. Generally with Necrons i assume duuplication because that's what we are. Next time I'll read more carefully.

HQ:
Company Command Squad: 323 pts
+Vox Caster
+Veterans have pistol+CCW
+Krak Grenades
+Camo Gear
+Creed
+Astropath
+Master of Ordnance
+Officer of the fleet
+Kell
+Nork Deddog

Tank Commander: 636 pts
+Pask
+Leman Russ Demolisher
+Hull Mounted Lascannon
+Sponson mounted Plasma Cannons
+Camo netting
+Relic Plating
+Augur array
+Hunter killer missile
+Heavy stubber
+Extra armor
+Fire barrels
+Recovery gear

Leman Russ Demolisher
+Hull Mounted Lascannon
+Sponson mounted Plasma Cannon
+Camo netting
+Relic Plating
+Augur array
+Hunter Killer Missile
+Dozer blade
+Heavy Stubber
+Extra armor
+Fire barrels
+Recovery gear

Commissar Yarrick: 145 pts

Troops:
Veterans: 140 pts
+Forward Sentries
+Krak Grenades
+Power Fist
+Heavy Flamer
+Vox Caster
+2x Grenade Launchers
+Lascannon
+All remaining veterans have shotguns


Infantry Platoon:
PCS: 143 pts
+4x Sniper Rifles
+Vox Caster
+Power Fist
+Krak Grenades
+Plasma Pistol
+Melta Bombs
+Taurox


Infantry Squad: 55 pts
+Grenade Launcher

Infantry Squad: 50 pts

Ffyllotek wrote:
Forgive me. Generally with Necrons i assume duuplication because that's what we are. Next time I'll read more carefully.

So not true.

I don't think fortifications are appropriate here =) They're somewhat identical to everyone iirc.

Here's my Awful Eldar list:

Illic Nightspear
Jain Zar

Harlequin x8
- Death Jester
- Troupe Master

Howling Banshees x 5
- + Exarch

Alaitoc Pathfinders x 5
Storm Guardians x 10

Hemlock Wraithfighter

Vyper w/Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Catapult
- Crystal Targeting Matrix
- Ghostwalk Matrix
- Holo-Fields
- Star Engines
- Spirit Stones
- Vectored Engines

War Walker w/2x Eldar Missile Launcher
- Crystal Targeting Matrix
- Ghostwalk Matrix
- Holo-Fields
- Star Engines
- Spirit Stones
- Vectored Engines

Wraithlord
- Shuriken Catapult and Flamer

Sadly, this list might not actually be all that bad against some of the other lists on here. I do kind of like the Wraithlord with no heavy weapons, though. That's kind of funny. The fully-kitted out Vyper is kind of hilarious too (140 points!). The War Walker also has tons of equipment that it can't use.

Didn't think about Fortifications.

OK, updated list.

Ilic Nightspear (140 points)
5x Alaitoc Pathfinders (125 points)
16x Storm Guardians (144 points)
Void Relay Network (1090 points)
- Honoured Imerium (6x Tank Traps)
- 3x Promethium Relay Pipes (6x Tank Traps each)
- 3x Void Shield Generators (3x Void Shields each, 6x Tank Traps each)

They'll survive. But they won't' kill much.

How about this for Eldar?

New Roster (1500pts)

Eldar: Codex (2013) (Combined Arms Detachment)

HQ

Illic Nightspear Voidbringer

Jain Zar, The Storm of Silence Blade of Destruction, The Silent Death

Troops

10x Pathfinder

Storm Guardians 18x Guardian with Chainsword and Shuriken pistol, 2x Guardian with Power sword and Shuriken pistol, Plasma grenades

Wave Serpent Crystal Targetting Matrix, Ghostwalk Matrix, Holo-fields, Serpent Field, Spirit stones, Star engines, Twin-linked shuriken cannons, Twin-linked shuriken catapults, Vectored engines

Fast Attack

3x vypers
Vyper Squadron Vyper Crystal Targetting Matrix, Ghostwalk Matrix, Holo-fields, Shuriken cannon, Spirit stones, Star engines, Twin-linked shuriken catapults, Vectored engines Vyper Crystal Targetting Matrix, Ghostwalk Matrix, Holo-fields, Shuriken cannon, Spirit stones, Star engines, Twin-linked shuriken catapults, Vectored engines Vyper Crystal Targetting Matrix, Ghostwalk Matrix, Shuriken cannon, Spirit stones, Twin-linked shuriken catapults

Heavy Support

Wraithlord Shuriken catapult and flamer

After some more thought I have come up with a revised AM list. I read over some of the 'rules' and applied them as follows.

Only one selection from each FOC, except troops. However each troop choice must be different if possible.

No Wargear that you can't make some use of. For example in the AM list I have, I put Auger Arrays on every vehicle, so I was obligated to put at least one Deep Strike unit in the army.

Regarding the type of wargear, I specifically tried to outfit my units with the worst possible choices, always trying to play against their strengths. A few examples being; grenade launchers on Scions, Shotguns on Vets, Power Fists and Power Axes for characters (they suck in CC and will probably be guaranteed to die before striking), Melta Bombs on Powerfist characters.

Overloaded Characters. Am much junk on them as possible, without making them more combat effective. (Really only the Company Commander in this list)

As you look over the list you will see that it is really weak against any armour. The Officers are on foot and the squads are mounted. Crumby weapon selections.

I don't think there is any real synergy in this army. Comments welcome.

HQ

Company Command Squad: 4LasP+CCW, Medi-pack; Commander: Power Fist, Krak Grenades, Laurels of Command, The Tactical Auto Rel, Deathmask, Kurov's Aquila

Enginseer: Melta Bombs

Troops

Vet Squad: 9 Shotguns, vox caster; Sgt: Power Fist

Infanty Platoon

Platoon Cmd: Medi-Pak, vox caster; Cmdr: Power Fist, Melta Bombs

Inf Squad: Sgt: Power Axe, Melta Bombs
Chimera : Hull and Turret Hvy Flamers, Hunter Seeker Missile, Relic Plating, Dozer, Recovery Gear, Extra Arm, Fire Barrels, Camo, Auger Array.

Inf Squad: Sgt: Power Axe, Melta Bombs
Chimera : Hull and Turret Hvy Flamers, Hunter Seeker Missile, Relic Plating, Dozer, Recovery Gear, Extra Arm, Fire Barrels, Camo, Auger Array

Elite

Scion Squad (5 man): 2 Grenade Launchers; Sgt: Power Fist

Fast

Armoured Sentinel Squad (3 models, all outfitted the same): MultiLaser, Hunter Killer Missile, Search Light, Relic Plating, Recovery Gear, Smoke Launchers, Extra Arm, Camo, Auger Array

Heavy

Hydra Battery (1 model): Hull mounted Hvy Flamer, Relic Plating, Dozer, Recovery Gear, Extra Arm, Fire Barrels, Camo, Auger Array

The whole list is just shy of 1500 pts. Any thoughts on how you would try to play this list? Any ways to make it even worse?

Guyz, pls, no fortifications, if you don't mind

 koooaei wrote:
Guyz, pls, no fortifications, if you don't mind

But, dot dot dot, how will Eldar make the worst possible list?

How's this for Worst Eldar at least:

Illic Night spear
Wraithseer

Harlies
-Troop Master
-Death Jester
-2x Fusion Pistol, Kiss
-6x Kiss

Banshees
-Exarch, mirrorswords, stalker, disarm
-9x warriors

Pathfinders x10

Storm Guardians x18

Hemlock

Vyper
-Stock weapons
-Every upgrade

Can't shoot anything but 12" pistols and battlefocus.

Everything has GEQ survivability, but everything but Storm Guardians pay MEQ prices.

Other factions, I'm sure, can do worse. But this would be very freaking bad.

Bharring wrote:
How's this for Worst Eldar at least:

Illic Night spear

Harlies
-Troop Master
-Death Jester
-2x Fusion Pistol, Kiss
-6x Kiss

Banshees
-Exarch, mirrorswords, stalker, disarm
-9x warriors

Pathfinders x10

Storm Guardians x19

Can't shoot anything but 12" pistols and battlefocus.

Everything has GEQ survivability, but everything but Storm Guardians pay MEQ prices.

Other factions, I'm sure, can do worse. But this would be very freaking bad.

Death Jesters have a 24" range weapon.
Howling Banshees cannot take Stalker.
List is almost 500 points short.

Oops.
-Thought it was 1000.
-Jester does have 24", but in an expensive melee unit, so will usually run at that range (no battle focus)
-My battle scribe sucks? Yeah, Sheild of Grace instead.

What do you guys think?

Ilic Nightspear (140 points)

Guardian Defenders (171 points)
- 19x Guardians
Rangers (250 points)
- 10x Rangers
- - 10x Upgrade to Pathfinders
Storm Guardians (220 pointa)
- 20x Guardians
- - 2x Flamers
- - 2x Power Swords

Harelquins (288 points)
- Shadowseer
- Troupe Master (Harlequin's Kiss)
- Death Jester
- 7x Harlequins
- - 7x Harlequin's Kiss
- - 2x Fusion Pistol
Howling Banshees (190 points)
- 9x Banshees
- Exarch
- - Mirrorswords
- - Disarming Strike
- - Shield of Grace
Striking Scorpions (235 points)
- 9x Scorpions
- Exarch
- - Biting Blade
- - Scorpion's Claw
- - Crushing Blow
- - Stalker

Fixed mine. Happyjew's might be worse.

Mine has a little bit more ranged, his is pretty solidly melee. Would be awesome to face them off sometime, butni have only half the models.

(Although I'd drop the Shadowseer, as it gives the unit assault grenades, and can make the unit hard to shoot at)

Standard Chaos codex:

Warpsmith
Mark of Slaanesh
Combi-bolter
VotLW
Ichor Blood
Power Axe
Gift

10x Termies
10x powerfists
Mark of Slaanesh
Gift

5 Chosen
Chainaxe on Champ
5x Power Fists
Mark of Slaanesh
Gift

20x khorne berzerkers
20x Chainaxe
Power Fist on Champ
Gift

10x Cultists

5x Chaos Marines
Powerfist and Chainaxe on Champ
Gift

comes out to be 1494.

Everyone that has an Unwieldy Weapon and +1 Initiative, everyone else has Chain Axes.

All champs that normally get a pistol and CCW got a Chainaxe and a Powerfist to lose one attack.

See Bharring that is the problem, Eldar are so solid even the worst list will dominate in a game of bad lists.

That said, I think the Tau list might have a chance by focussing everything on one unit at a time.