Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I think there are still a lot of good ideas and creativity left within the GW design team. The problem, however, lies with the person in charge of which ideas will get produced. God himself could be on the design team, but it wouldn't matter as long as the likes of Alan Merrett are in charge.

Makumba wrote:
If a model isn't used in games, then it is useless. that is like getting an additional box.

Well good for you. In Poland FLGS can't sell for less then GW calls for the same models, and they are limited to 1 per shop box. If they want to order a second one, they have to order 1 box for every army. Which is a huge problem for new players. For example the IG army is ok, if the lemman russes get converted.But you need 2 to start an army. Which more or less means you have to find 2 stores that have 1 box each. Or order online, which not everyone can do.

And ordering from outside of Poland brings the risk of customs checking the order, and they normaly do as 2 boxs cost a lot. If that happens you get 23% vat for modeling articles add, unless of course your ordering from outside of EU then it could be 23% vat and important tax. Making the box cost more, then if you bought a train ticket to Warsaw and bought them at the GW store there.

1. If you order from within the EU you don't pay any additional VAT.
2. Who doesn't have access to a paypal account I wonder.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Yeah, it really feels like right about the time 5E started, their fluff has really just gone consistently downhill. The writing has read more and more like juvenile fanfiction, and the way GW laid out their books and the pictures they took of models increasingly looked like catalog displays more than gameboards.

Just picking up and reading some of the older 2E/3E/4E books you get a totally different feel and level of enthusiasm for the game and its background than you do from the newer books.

Quoted for truth, specially the bold part.

Whenever I read something written by Ward, my mind inmediately says "this looks like amateurish fanfiction written by a 14-yeared old". It's the same silly style with "cool" characters who "kick ass" everywhere. In example, a few weeks ago I was reading an article in the spanish fantasy wiki that compiles a lot of Wood Elf fluff following chronologic order. Everything was mostly ok until I reached the part with the involvement of Malekith's wife. That part was incredibly silly. It screamed "amateur fanfiction" from a mile away. The contrast with the rest of the fluff was so blatant I asked around about it and I was told that part was from the latest WE armybook. Then I checked who may have written it and, while I didn't find any direct confirmation, it seems Ward was the lead writer behind the latest armybooks for all three fantasy elven factions.

And that still falls flat against Draigo, the bloodied bloody Blood Bloongels or the Wardcrons. I agree the old "killer robots from outer space" from 3rd edition may have needed a bit of fleshing out, but to turn them into space tomb kings lead by moustache twirling villains... seriously Ward? I won't even comment on Draigo, pure juvenile fanfiction down to the last word. But it wasn't enought for Ward, he had to bring him to Fantasy too

the bloodied bloody Blood Bloongels

I hate it but I also remember back in the distant past when I was child and wanted to "draw robots with guns shooting guns that fired guns" ( to also paraphrase the Simpsons) and wondered if this had been a conscious decision to appeal to younger boys (in particular) who could convince their parents to buy more stuff.

I really don't know about 40k at the moment - loved Shield of Baal - good story, lovely artwork - enjoyed reading it but the Codex's just seem bland nowadays, spilt up into shadows of themselves and supplements /DLC......

They are not interested in balance, FAQs and the like............which has put me right off......added a magic phase to 40k which I hate............

morgoth wrote:


1. If you order from within the EU you don't pay any additional VAT.
2. Who doesn't have access to a paypal account I wonder.

1. yes you do if vat is different in country of orgin and Poland
2. me for example.[and here I go again] to get you need a credit card and to get that you need a bank account[technicly possible to get] and at least 400$ added to your account monthly.Ah and it can't be your parents, even if they have an account in the same bank, because besides the 400$ each month you have to bring a document from where you get the money. The other option is to open different type of account, with at least 5k$ on it for half a year or longer, and then they give you an option to open an additional account where you can get card no questions asked, other then the 400$ each month too. Ah and when you make the 5k$ account for the first time you have to show from what source you got the money, and if you don't get a higher tax or goverment can freez the account till you do. And if you tell it is from your parants you have to pay a tax, as all type of gifts over 400$ fall under income tax, if your 16 or older.

Makumba wrote:

morgoth wrote:


1. If you order from within the EU you don't pay any additional VAT.
2. Who doesn't have access to a paypal account I wonder.

1. yes you do if vat is different in country of orgin and Poland
2. me for example.[and here I go again] to get you need a credit card and to get that you need a bank account[technicly possible to get] and at least 400$ added to your account monthly.Ah and it can't be your parents, even if they have an account in the same bank, because besides the 400$ each month you have to bring a document from where you get the money. The other option is to open different type of account, with at least 5k$ on it for half a year or longer, and then they give you an option to open an additional account where you can get card no questions asked, other then the 400$ each month too. Ah and when you make the 5k$ account for the first time you have to show from what source you got the money, and if you don't get a higher tax or goverment can freez the account till you do. And if you tell it is from your parants you have to pay a tax, as all type of gifts over 400$ fall under income tax, if your 16 or older.

1. No, that's not how it works. You only pay origin country VAT, for you that would be Germany in most cases, at 19%
2. No you don't need a credit card. You can have a Paypal account with just a junior bank account.

narrative_forger wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
GW is basically in "nobody new is starting these games, so we need to suck the veterans dry" mode. Hence the doubling or tripling the price of the rules you need to play your old army, updates to 80s concepts that only grognards care about, etc.

I'm not so sure i can agree with this. Their new boxsets for armies seems to encourage new players and also entices vets to start a new army or expand their current range for what i reckon. The Adeptus Astartes Strikeforce for instance.... or the Tyranid Swarm... or The Grey Knight Nemesis Vanguard or maybe Cadian/Catachan Defence Force. All those boxsets gave a unit for free usually so it is not bad either. On a discount store those prices are slashed 20% off too most likely.

Just because the box sets seem targeted as such, it doesn't necessarily mean they're being bought as such (or bought at all..)




Automatically Appended Next Post:

morgoth wrote:

Makumba wrote:

morgoth wrote:


1. If you order from within the EU you don't pay any additional VAT.
2. Who doesn't have access to a paypal account I wonder.

1. yes you do if vat is different in country of orgin and Poland
2. me for example.[and here I go again] to get you need a credit card and to get that you need a bank account[technicly possible to get] and at least 400$ added to your account monthly.Ah and it can't be your parents, even if they have an account in the same bank, because besides the 400$ each month you have to bring a document from where you get the money. The other option is to open different type of account, with at least 5k$ on it for half a year or longer, and then they give you an option to open an additional account where you can get card no questions asked, other then the 400$ each month too. Ah and when you make the 5k$ account for the first time you have to show from what source you got the money, and if you don't get a higher tax or goverment can freez the account till you do. And if you tell it is from your parants you have to pay a tax, as all type of gifts over 400$ fall under income tax, if your 16 or older.

1. No, that's not how it works. You only pay origin country VAT, for you that would be Germany in most cases, at 19%
2. No you don't need a credit card. You can have a Paypal account with just a junior bank account.

Forget it dude, she's been told repeatedly and at length, but chooses to be relentlessly negative and defeatist - at this point it's probably better to let her believe what she likes and wallow.

 Azreal13 wrote:

narrative_forger wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
GW is basically in "nobody new is starting these games, so we need to suck the veterans dry" mode. Hence the doubling or tripling the price of the rules you need to play your old army, updates to 80s concepts that only grognards care about, etc.

I'm not so sure i can agree with this. Their new boxsets for armies seems to encourage new players and also entices vets to start a new army or expand their current range for what i reckon. The Adeptus Astartes Strikeforce for instance.... or the Tyranid Swarm... or The Grey Knight Nemesis Vanguard or maybe Cadian/Catachan Defence Force. All those boxsets gave a unit for free usually so it is not bad either. On a discount store those prices are slashed 20% off too most likely.

Just because the box sets seem targeted as such, it doesn't necessarily mean they're being bought as such (or bought at all..)

hmm.. interesting. No offense, but it is sold out where i am at. The GK boxset too is only avalaible atm i believe in US? i know UK is sold out on the website. To be honest, i don't buy them either besides Tyranids Swarm. I have enough marines already, and for tyranids, well you can never have enough ga(u)nts. Not to be obtuse though, what makes you think that the box is not selling? What is the target audience for the box then, in your opinion, if they are not for all target range? The boxset seems to make it easy for vets to make an allied detachment, and also the boxset can be used to make small armies for beginners... even the Tyranid Swarm.... will be really really hard to win with them though, with the lack of synapse and all. That is how every starting army starts... doesn't change when i started over a decade ago. The only target that i can think of that the boxset are not marketed for are.... Tournament players. I very much appreciate of course, if you can enlighten me in what the target range is.

But i digress, i think this discussion is not really answering the question that is being asked on the topic. And to answer the question, i think if GW actually follows through with Ad Mech after Harlequins, their creativity juice is still going, imo. Now whether the creativity for fluff is still gonna be juvenile or not following 5th ed type of fluff.... well.... only time can tell. At the very least, they dialed down some stuffs.

Makumba wrote:
And ordering from outside of Poland brings the risk of customs checking the order, and they normaly do as 2 boxs cost a lot. If that happens you get 23% vat for modeling articles add, unless of course your ordering from outside of EU then it could be 23% vat and important tax. Making the box cost more, then if you bought a train ticket to Warsaw and bought them at the GW store there.

This is news to me. I have been ordering from independent retailers from the UK since god knows when and never has a single parcel been taxed additionally.

narrative_forger wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:

narrative_forger wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
GW is basically in "nobody new is starting these games, so we need to suck the veterans dry" mode. Hence the doubling or tripling the price of the rules you need to play your old army, updates to 80s concepts that only grognards care about, etc.

I'm not so sure i can agree with this. Their new boxsets for armies seems to encourage new players and also entices vets to start a new army or expand their current range for what i reckon. The Adeptus Astartes Strikeforce for instance.... or the Tyranid Swarm... or The Grey Knight Nemesis Vanguard or maybe Cadian/Catachan Defence Force. All those boxsets gave a unit for free usually so it is not bad either. On a discount store those prices are slashed 20% off too most likely.

Just because the box sets seem targeted as such, it doesn't necessarily mean they're being bought as such (or bought at all..)

hmm.. interesting. No offense, but it is sold out where i am at. The GK boxset too is only avalaible atm i believe in US? i know UK is sold out on the website. To be honest, i don't buy them either besides Tyranids Swarm. I have enough marines already, and for tyranids, well you can never have enough ga(u)nts. Not to be obtuse though, what makes you think that the box is not selling? What is the target audience for the box then, in your opinion, if they are not for all target range? The boxset seems to make it easy for vets to make an allied detachment, and also the boxset can be used to make small armies for beginners... even the Tyranid Swarm.... will be really really hard to win with them though, with the lack of synapse and all. That is how every starting army starts... doesn't change when i started over a decade ago. The only target that i can think of that the boxset are not marketed for are.... Tournament players. I very much appreciate of course, if you can enlighten me in what the target range is.

But i digress, i think this discussion is not really answering the question that is being asked on the topic. And to answer the question, i think if GW actually follows through with Ad Mech after Harlequins, their creativity juice is still going, imo. Now whether the creativity for fluff is still gonna be juvenile or not following 5th ed type of fluff.... well.... only time can tell. At the very least, they dialed down some stuffs.

I, of course, didn't mean to imply that nobody had bought any at all.

But a dearth of product means nothing without the context of how many were out there in the first place. This is what makes the LE Codexes a somewhat useful gauge, because they do announce the numbers available, and when they take weeks to sell (as some have) it gives a good indicator of army popularity and overall sales strength.

I, among many others, have long since advocated a better approach to beginners than the fixed starters (codex, rulebook, HQ, 2x Troops plus one other box for a fixed price, at a discount, but the buyer chooses what they like from a range for each army - has been my idea) but GW seem to lack business acumen rather than creativity. Hence the reason for this thread and my original response, I don't believe it is a lack of creativity at GW, it's a lack of common sense to appreciate that by pressurising creative people to do things to a deadline you inevitably undermine the quality of the finished product.

I don't think they are running out of creativity. New Dwarf has the design studio fooling around with an Inquisition unit. As those guys are usually associated with the Sisters, maybe
that dream is going to come true in a manner similar to the DE refurb from a couple of years ago. Somebody is tidying up the game by getting all the codex in line with the new rule book
more or less within a year, setting things up for new things for the game - a Sisters/Inquisition codex and models, maybe more scenery kits. They have pretty much stuffed each faction
with more than enough choices, and the Knights appeared out of nowhere, so maybe new directions coming like Ad Mech, Sisters/Inquisition etc. They don't seem to have a problem publishing
faction off-shoot special codex, so, to me, it looks like this tree will be growing more branches.
I stay tuned because I love the models and each faction has a generally unique nature. It's their game, and so far (12 years), I'm enjoying it - maybe more complicated now, but maturing in a generally
positive direction.

 Sir Arun wrote:

Makumba wrote:
And ordering from outside of Poland brings the risk of customs checking the order, and they normaly do as 2 boxs cost a lot. If that happens you get 23% vat for modeling articles add, unless of course your ordering from outside of EU then it could be 23% vat and important tax. Making the box cost more, then if you bought a train ticket to Warsaw and bought them at the GW store there.

This is news to me. I have been ordering from independent retailers from the UK since god knows when and never has a single parcel been taxed additionally.

Many things get through customs, but normally you should be paying import taxes when buying from the UK and anywhere outside the EU.

That's the law, not what happens in practice though.

There is so much lore and background in 40k they don't even need to reinvent new armies just come out with campaigns and supplements galore. Speed freak Orks, catachan jungle fighters, csm, steel legion, and don't forgot gw creates new space marines all the time. Eldar craft worlds, necron dynasties, tyranid hive fleets, sisters, etc.
Personally however I think gw is going to start redoing army Codexs soon like CSM. I also don't think this will invalidate supplements such as black legion since it's simply a relic list, warlord traits, and formation of units from the codex. However at some point In the far future I can see a legal supplement list come out.