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Hey guys,

I need quite a bit of help deciding what I should do with my IG army. At the moment its been performing relatively well, but I've been making a few changes here and there to try and squeeze a little bit more out of my points allowance. It also involves using some tactics that I have heard are effective online, but never tried them out on the table before. Anyway, enough of my chat, here's the list as it stands:

HQ

CCS
- 4 x plasma guns
- Chimera
- multi-laser, heavy flamer
165

TROOPS

Platoon
PCS
- 4 x GLs/flamers
- Chimera
- multi-laser, heavy flamer
105

PIS x 3
- GL, AC
- Chimera
- multi-laser, heavy bolter
120 (360)

Veterans x 2
- 3 x meltaguns
100 (200)

FAST ATTACK

Vendetta
130

Vendetta
130

Vendetta
130

HEAVY SUPPORT

Demolisher
165

Demolisher
165

Manticore
160

Total = 1710

I'm considering using the remainder of the points to add either and Astropath or OoTF to the CCS. I think the OoTF might be more useful to usurp enemy outflankers, as its only very, very rarely that I'll be outflanking the Vendettas.

The two Veteran squads go inside the Vendettas for a first-turn alpha strike, the third Vendetta acts as a gunship to support. The PIS inside the Chimeras hold the home objective with the Manticore whilst the PCS, CCS and Demolishers advance onto the enemy and put pressure on his lines.

I don't think there's many bases I haven't covered, possible mass infantry could present a problem, but I do have 3-5 large S10 blasts to deal with them along with a ton of multi-laser shooting which should be able to sufficiently deal with horde armies. Nidzilla and mechanised armies shouldn't pose too much of a problem due to the sheer volume of S7-10 firepower I can throw at them.

Thoughts? Opinions?

Regards,

L. Wrex

Only thing I would change is make the PCS Launchers into flamers. I prefer to make them and the chimera a mobile burnination bunker before unloading on an objective. looks pretty good otherwise

I like it. The only things I see being a major issue are outflanking/deepstrike armies and maybe hordes (excluding 'nids). Single biggest weakness I see is a small amount of stuff that can ignore cover saves.

daedalus wrote:I like it. The only things I see being a major issue are outflanking/deepstrike armies.

This.

i would use your 40 points to grab an officer of the fleet to somewhat counteract this problem, or you can downgrade your CCS weapons to meltaguns, pick up an elite inquisitor, (maybe with auspex to deal with infiltration as well,) w/ 2 mystics, run it barebones with like, a bolter and possibly a hood if you can squeeze it in.

I don't do the Inquisitor/Mystic trick. Will probably opt for an OoTF to ward off potential deep strikers.

Thanks guys!

L. Wrex

actually, I'd go for the astropath in this case. Those flyers being able to outflank is a powerful asset, and even though their speed makes it less necessary that they come off the proper board edge, it's still a nice thing to have. This is doubly true as it helps your tanks and skimmers hit their stuff at exactly the same time.

Otherwise, this list looks just fine. The only thing I don't like is the 5 flamer of doom tank. The PCS really ought to have plasma or something that the heavy flamer can't liquefy horribly.

Just played a test game with this list (with an OoTF) against a Tau army. He conceded after Turn 2. The damage potential is truly absurd if I'm honest, and the combined elements really come together nicely.

The only reason I don't particularly want to plump for the Astropath is that the Vendettas will likely never, ever be outflanking, except when facing a drop-pod list for example. The advantage of melta-ing something Turn 1 is just too big a boon to resign to reserves. If anything was to go into reserve it'd be the single Vendetta, and I want that to arrive quite late on for late-game contesting more than anything.

L. Wrex

I would remove the plasma guns in you CCS. In my experience, that doesn't always turn out well. your CCS will likely blow itself to molten blobs on the ground, if you know what I mean.

I would arm them with meltas. thats also vheaper, but I is better in a mach list then plasmas IMHO.

Ailaros wrote:actually, I'd go for the astropath in this case. Those flyers being able to outflank is a powerful asset, and even though their speed makes it less necessary that they come off the proper board edge, it's still a nice thing to have. This is doubly true as it helps your tanks and skimmers hit their stuff at exactly the same time.

Otherwise, this list looks just fine. The only thing I don't like is the 5 flamer of doom tank. The PCS really ought to have plasma or something that the heavy flamer can't liquefy horribly.

Really, you'd go with plasma on a PCS? It just feels like diminishing returns to me. I could see an argument for some meltas though.

^
haha, someone actually quoted a post of mine. that made my day.

Why not trad the Demolishers for regular lrbts might give you some wiggle room points wise, and range wise (sure its not a demolisher cannon, but it still hurts people right?)

daedalus wrote:Really, you'd go with plasma on a PCS? It just feels like diminishing returns to me.

If you want to talk about diminishing returns, adding a FIFTH flamer to a unit pretty much sounds like the definition to me.

Lucid wrote:Why not trad the Demolishers for regular lrbts might give you some wiggle room points wise, and range wise

I'd be concerned about this as the only way to cover for the rather lackluster troops is by being extremely aggressive with all of the rest of the list. Bottom-heavy lists have to be careful about preserving the top, and if you're taking vendettas and tanks and are playing aggressively with them, range shouldn't be an issue.

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:Just played a test game with this list (with an OoTF) against a Tau army. He conceded after Turn 2. The damage potential is truly absurd if I'm honest, and the combined elements really come together nicely.

Nice job.

Ailaros wrote:

daedalus wrote:Really, you'd go with plasma on a PCS? It just feels like diminishing returns to me.

If you want to talk about diminishing returns, adding a FIFTH flamer to a unit pretty much sounds like the definition to me.

That's fair. I'll give you that. I still feel plasma is too expensive to trust on a BS 3 model though.

Lucid wrote:Why not trad the Demolishers for regular lrbts might give you some wiggle room points wise, and range wise

I'd be concerned about this as the only way to cover for the rather lackluster troops is by being extremely aggressive with all of the rest of the list. Bottom-heavy lists have to be careful about preserving the top, and if you're taking vendettas and tanks and are playing aggressively with them, range shouldn't be an issue.

Now this I can wholeheartedly agree with.

daedalus wrote:I'll give you that. I still feel plasma is too expensive to trust on a BS 3 model though.

Sure.

I don't take plasma in my PCSs either for this reason, but that you can take 4 at least mitigates the effectiveness (though not the cost, of course). Melta would also be fine - I was only thinking plasma because it isn't elsewhere in the list.

The CCS has plasma. I kept the PCS with GLs because they are both cheap and surprisingly potent; able to throw out 4 S3 blasts or 4 S6 shots is pretty cool, and at 1/3 the price of a plasma gun as well its really the weapon of choice for BS3 PCS squads.

I'm also very aggressive with pretty much all my armour so the Demolisher is the ideal variant for me.

L. Wrex

Fair enough, I'm particular to the Demolisher myself. But in favor of spending points elsewhere this might be an option. It doesn't have to effect your playstlye except for in a couple of very specific scenarios

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:The CCS has plasma. I kept the PCS with GLs because they are both cheap and surprisingly potent; able to throw out 4 S3 blasts or 4 S6 shots is pretty cool, and at 1/3 the price of a plasma gun as well its really the weapon of choice for BS3 PCS squads.
L. Wrex

I still say drop the plasmas on the CCS. You can kill yourself with it quit easily. rapid fire: 8 shots. lets say 2 of them overheat and 2 of your squad die by it. next turn the same. you fail leadership test, they run, and you lose 2 orders a turn. That's Bad.

yes, but the amount of carnage you put down with a single volley of BiD BS4 plasma well-justifies the cost, even without things like medpacks and carapace.

That and you don't take morale tests when you lose dudes to burns. You only take morale tests due to enemy action.

Ailaros wrote:yes, but the amount of carnage you put down with a single volley of BiD BS4 plasma well-justifies the cost, even without things like medpacks and carapace.

That and you don't take morale tests when you lose dudes to burns. You only take morale tests due to enemy action.

well yes it kinda justifies it, as I didn't know you needn't take a LD test bacause of Gets hot. Sorry for that. I might just try that out one time than.

well, plasma isn't good all the time. It has a niche purpose. That said, if you have a problem that you really need plasma for, there really isn't a better way about it. +1 plasma gun and always being within range of BiD is sassy.

Scrazza wrote:I still say drop the plasmas on the CCS. You can kill yourself with it quit easily. rapid fire: 8 shots. lets say 2 of them overheat and 2 of your squad die by it. next turn the same. you fail leadership test, they run, and you lose 2 orders a turn. That's Bad.

2 may overheat, but if 6 hit thats a Swarmlord or a Trygon that has just been melted. BiD also reduces the liklihood of an overheat occuring to an almost negligible amount. A CCS is probably the best place to put plasma in an IG army as you can take four of them, twin-link them, AND have BS4 to make the most of the expensive weaponry.

It's a niche unit, but its one that doesn't really have an adequate replacement anywhere else in the codex short of taking an Executioner. Plasma is great against a huge, huge variety of targets, and losing 2 plasma vets is an excellent return for killing 200 points of Assault Terminators.

L. Wrex

The other important thing to do is differentiate your plasma rolls. Both of those Gets Hot! could be on the same dude, and since there is no wound allocation, in this case you'd only lose one.

Ailaros wrote:yes, but the amount of carnage you put down with a single volley of BiD BS4 plasma well-justifies the cost, even without things like medpacks and carapace.

That and you don't take morale tests when you lose dudes to burns. You only take morale tests due to enemy action.

Not so.

Page 44, 2nd paragraph wrote:A unit losing 25% or more of its models during a single phase must pass a Morale check at the end of that phase...

The only stated exception is CC.

That being said, I still use plasma on those guys. You have to have something to kill off DSing terminators, sterngard, etc.

Also, people afraid of losing guard models to gets hot have the option of purchasing a medic; but in the end, really shouldn't be playing guard. Guard are meant to die.

well the list looks solid to me, you have decent firepower and much material that is, erm "physically present" (which is a loss of firepower, but for an undisciplined enemy it may be hard to distinguish between dangerous and scoring...)

actually I dont like the platoon too much (I dont like platoons anyways, I always prefer penal legions, but thats a different story ), but you could add more flexibility if you screw the chimeras and blob the infantry together extracting the ACs to HWSs. So you could keep moving with lasgunmen while still firing ACs with orders and so on.

but still, solid list.