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Are Kommandos worth taking without Boss Snikrot? They seem a little underwhelming to me...they're cheap, yes, but they don't seem very strong. Now with Snikrot it's a completely different story thanks to Ambush, but he does cost a fair chunk of points.

I've seen a few games with people using Kommandos and I don't think I've ever seen them without Snikrot or some mega conversion job that counts as him.
I don't have much experience with the Orks yet but I'm just speaking from what I've seen and what I've read.

I personally think that Ambush is far too useful to go without anyway if your using Kommandos.

You really, really have to use him well with the right enemy. Yes, it's a neat unit to have, but lacking a PK to go with him kinda neuters his effect. Pack flamers with him and you should be good to go. Make sure to run with a full squad of Kommandos, as well. I never got the Snikrot model--just kitbashed one together. Best picture I have of him is here.

Infiltrating komandos is a pretty bad idea imo, they are just going to get picked off first turn and likely wont even make it to combat, easy points for your opponent.

@yournamehere--not true. More often than not there's always a vehicle of some sort sitting in the back, or a unit of long range blasters out there. You just have to use them correctly.

i run a 10 man group of kommandos with a nob and a PK and a burna. i out-flank with them and they pretty much always end up destroying a tank or 2 along with a squad. the burnas nice because you either get a flamer or 3 S4 power weapon attacks. now like any out-flankers they do end up on the wrong side sometimes, but thats to be expected. the main thing is go through terrain, thats why we get 3D6 to move through them.

no one expects sneaky orks!!

In my opinion, the best way to run Kommandos is by using Snikrot, and abusing his Ambush special rule.

Attach a Warboss with a Power Klaw to the unit, or even Ghazkghull himself. You'll wreck anything within 13-18" of any board edge, even with a small squad.

I usually run 2-3 units of kommandos 12 boys in each, led by uge choppa nobs, and armed with bigshootas.

it's usually enugh to bring down a vehicle, and the bigshootas enable you to take potshots at side/rear AV on transports if you outflank. they're relatively cheap, and annoying if you outflank with 'em.

36+ orks with move through cover tends to be a pretty good distraction aswell.

//Calle

@Minmax--pretty sure once you attach an IC without his rule, or the ability to outflank means he loses the ability to Ambush. Check the codex, however--I'm working on a 12 hour shift right now, and am slightly delirious.

It's one of those really poorly written out rules that can go both ways. I know that my gaming group doesn't allow it, and for good reason.

MasticatorDeelux wrote:@Minmax--pretty sure once you attach an IC without his rule, or the ability to outflank means he loses the ability to Ambush. Check the codex, however--I'm working on a 12 hour shift right now, and am slightly delirious.

Not in the least! Ambush is completely separate from outflank, and requires neither infiltrate nor scouts.

MasticatorDeelux wrote:@yournamehere--not true. More often than not there's always a vehicle of some sort sitting in the back, or a unit of long range blasters out there. You just have to use them correctly.

My only question is who are you playing that is letting you get your komandos that close to anything? I mean I'm not trying to put down your idea it works on paper but with the people I play against, they understand how to deploy an army. And when they deploy correctly then I am not able to get my komandos anywere near anything worth sending them at, remember that if they can see my komandos at all then they have to be 18" back right? So then they just stick the targets that would be great to send komandos at (devs, lootas ect.) inside a ring of stuff that is not so great to send my komandos at.

So what are you going to do? Either you get first turn, move up, cant whaag and cant cover the 18 inches leaving you to what? shoot with sluggas? pff, then they are taken out next turn, or your opponent gets first turn, sees a group of boyz separate from the rest of your army and easily picks them off. I just don't think its that good, or good at all really. You could rely on putting them in reserve but then they are comming on from a short table end, and a random one at that, and with only a 12-18" assault reach with a whaag from a short table edge it really is not that great to hope you come on the right side with a good whaag roll if you havnt used it already.

I just don't see them working, and I have tried. After enough failed attempts at trying to make them work in some fashion I ended up getting Snikrot (which is an awesome model btw) and have not looked back, your experience may tell you differently but if you play with people that know how to deploy and army, they can make your infiltrating komandos useless.

And to the op, yes Snikrot looks like a points sink at first, that why I didn't use him, but after having used him I must say he is worth it, he and his unit become like a swiss army knife, useful in a large variety of conditions.

I agree with yournamehere. Infiltrating them is usually a waste. in cover they will be slightly difficult to kill, but its still going to die, and most likely not kill anything. and taking snikrot still does give decent AT power. x6 str6 re-rolling is fully capable of Pening the avg AV of a tank. and if that doesnt do it (which it hasnt in the past) the 52-54 Str 4 attacks will most likely glance the **** out of it. and that has happened in a recent game to me

Kommandos definitely have their uses in certain lists, even without Snikrot.

Snikrot's ability is good, but you pay out the nose for it. You're mostly paying for what is essentially a Nob without a PowerKlaw who is really good in CC. The benefit is that you don't have to rely on a die-roll to determine where your Kommandos end up, and potentially have them be tactically ineffective.

It's thus tempting to say Kommandos are useless WITHOUT this ability, but any outflanking unit suffers from this potential fate of ending up where they're not needed. Not really true.

Kommandos are relatively cheap for what they do. They also are the only infantry unit besides Burnas that can get flame templates, which is great. Even a small unit of 10-12 Kommandos with 2 flamers and a PK nob is not going to be ignored.

They don't fit perfectly in all lists, but they're good units. Snikrot isn't mandatory for them to be good either.