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http://www.tvsquad.com/2011/02/15/lara-logan/?icid=main%7Chp-laptop%7Cdl1%7Csec1_lnk3%7C201574

I don't know what to say about this. Should anyone be surprised a white woman was assaulted in Egypt during a time of turmoil? Why wasn't there better security? Why were they there in the first place?

So much suffering and for what?

What does her being white have to do with it?

Do you ask because you don't have answer to that question or because you want to know my answer?

Well if you let me guess why you choose white as opposed to American, or not choosing any descriptor beyond woman, you probably won't like it.

Amaya wrote:
I don't know what to say about this. Should anyone be surprised a white woman was assaulted in Egypt during a time of turmoil? Why wasn't there better security? Why were they there in the first place?

So much suffering and for what?

Well, I'm certainly curious to know your answer Amaya, as to what her being white has to do with it.

Also, don't you think it seems a bit ridiculous to ask "why were they there in the first place?" They're part of the news media, they were there to gather news.

Im pretty sure he meant white as in "foreigner"

Being white in certain parts of the world, especially those in turmoil, isn't safe. Even more so when there is a history of whites interfering significantly in those lands.

I blame the Egyptians. Although, apparently 20+ soldiers ran in to save her...

LunaHound wrote:Im pretty sure he meant white as in "foreigner"

Those two things aren't synonyms so that doesn't make sense.

Amaya wrote:Being white in certain parts of the world, especially those in turmoil, isn't safe. Even more so when there is a history of whites interfering significantly in those lands.

Strangely enough there isn't a whole lot of racial tension between Arabs and Whites, at least not in the sense that there exists tension between Whites and Blacks in the US.

For Arabs is cultural, national, and religious; while for Europeans it tends to be religious and national. Americans are a bit strange in that they often find racial issues where none necessarily exist. I mean, the only issues that Egypt really has in terms of race regard Black Africans. I guess you could also include antisemitism, but that's way more complicated than just race.

I'm just going to go ahead and say that it was a terrible thing that happened and not try to make too much of a racial issue out of it.

I'm sure there are plenty of women being sexually assaulted (see below) that no one cares about because they aren't American news correspondents.

She was sexually assaulted, not raped.

Ahtman wrote:She was sexually assaulted, not raped.

OP Article wrote:"She was surrounded and suffered a brutal and sustained sexual assault and beating before being saved by a group of women and an estimated 20 Egyptian soldiers," the statement continued.

Brutal and sustained sexual assault? I don't think I'm making too much of a leap here, dude.

But, I suppose you're right. Pedantry for the win.

Would you rather be assaulted or murdered? Or is that just pedantry? I never said it wasn't horrible or a traumatic, just that it wasn't rape becuase, dur, it wasn't.

Ahtman wrote:Would you rather be assaulted or murdered? Or is that just pedantry?

It's more of a non-sequitur, isn't it?

"Would you rather be raped or endure a 'sustained and brutal sexual assault'" would probably be more accurate.

Ahtman wrote:...just that it wasn't rape becuase, dur, it wasn't.

You know that how?

"Sustained and brutal sexual assault" could reasonably be interpreted to at least include the r-word. But whatever, I changed it and said I misspoke. Does this need to continue?

except if she had been raped they would have said she was raped. Sexual assault and rape are two different things, much as burglary and manslaughter are two different things. She wasn't much of a position to be raped, but was in a position to be forcefully groped, molested, and pushed.

Ahtman wrote:except if she had been raped they would have said she was raped. Sexual assault and rape are two different things,...

It most certainly can be the same thing.

http://www.womenshealth.gov/faq/sexual-assault.cfm wrote:What is sexual assault?

Sexual assault and abuse is any type of sexual activity that you do not agree to, including:

* Inappropriate touching
* Vaginal, anal, or oral penetration
* Sexual intercourse that you say no to
* Rape
* Attempted rape
* Child molestation

It's entirely possible that they're being vague with the details to protect her privacy.

Wow, you guys are champions.

Anyways, it is awful that it happened to her, no matter what occurred exactly.

I think you're operating under a false assumption. From Princeton:

Sexual Assault: a statutory offense that provides that it is a crime to knowingly cause another person to engage in an unwanted sexual act by force or threat; "most states have replaced the common law definition of rape with statutes defining sexual assault"

Legally speaking, rape and sexual assault are one in the same in many places. Rape is sexual assault and vice versa.

Morally speaking too as far as I'm concerned.

Dreadwinter wrote:Anyways, it is awful that it happened to her, no matter what occurred exactly.

That's what I was originally trying to say.

http://www.tvsquad.com/2011/02/15/lara-logan/?icid=main%7Chp-laptop%7Cdl1%7Csec1_lnk3%7C201574

I don't know what to say about this. Should anyone be surprised a white woman was assaulted in Egypt during a time of turmoil?

This question sounds racist.

Let's try it again, a different way.

.

I don't know what to say about this. Should anyone be surprised a woman was assaulted in Egypt during a time of turmoil?

Lets just make it simple, the articles (all I have read and the one here) just say sexual assault, and since that it all we know, let's just call it that instead of speculation on the type of sexual assault.

Rape is sexual assault and sexual assault is rape. I don't consider rape a kind of sexual assault, so much as I would say all sexual assault is rape to me.

You're entitled to hold that opinion, however in law they are different things.

By your theory, "copping a feel" is the same as forced sexual intercourse.

Kilkrazy wrote:You're entitled to hold that opinion, however in law they are different things.

By your theory, "copping a feel" is the same as forced sexual intercourse.

Not all intercourse requires penetration... or orgasm for that matter. Sex is weird like that.

Melissia wrote:]Not all intercourse requires penetration... or orgasm for that matter. Sex is weird like that.

That depends on who you talk to, but from the strictest interpretation "sexual intercourse" refers only to copulation. What I imagine that you're talking about (oral sex, manual stimulation, etc.) are often referred to as outercourse.

That being said, rape almost always denotes only unwanted penetration, which is why its a necessarily violent act.

I very much doubt anyone would consider groping to be equivalent to sexual intercourse, and by exstension rape, on either a moral or technical level. If for no other reason than we're also therefore supposing that the vast majority of people everywhere have been and will be raped. After all, if I don't want you to touch me on the should, and I perceive that you've done so sexually, regardless of whether or not you actually have, I could then justifiably claim that you raped me if your theory of equivalence holds true.

Ahtman wrote:Well if you let me guess why you choose white as opposed to American, or not choosing any descriptor beyond woman, you probably won't like it.

Because they were going for the white girl. BBC media members have been treated similarly. They don't like foreigners (at the moment), they don't want press (half the time), and lets not be coy here; they don't much like Americans or Europeans at the moment (not all the anger is justifiable, some is). This is a pretty terrible event and perfectly in keeping with mob mentality and xenophobic revolutionary behavior.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Melissia wrote:Rape is sexual assault and sexual assault is rape. I don't consider rape a kind of sexual assault, so much as I would say all sexual assault is rape to me.

You're neither a lawyer nor journalist. You're more free to use terms how you see fit then those who will be handling this situation.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Ahtman wrote:Well if you let me guess why you choose white as opposed to American, or not choosing any descriptor beyond woman, you probably won't like it.

Because they were going for the white girl. BBC media members have been treated similarly. They don't like foreigners, they don't want press, and lets not be coy here. They don't much like Americans or Europeans at the moment.

Not all Americans or Europeans are white. Would she have been left alone if she had been and African-American? Probably not, and as Dogma pointed out the racial dynamic in the Egypt is not the same as the US. Looking at it all around 'woman' would have been enough, or "American woman" at best.

This thread is closed. Lets have at least an ounce of decency here people.