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I always seem to go just over the points limit whilst list building, sometimes by as little as 5 points, sometimes by as much as 30. I always try to bring it down as much as possible ofcourse, I don't want to be seen as a cheat, though I couldn't help but wonder how much my fellow dakkanauts consider is too much? Has your opponent ever said "I've gone xx points over" and how have you reacted?

Well, if it's something that you've agreed upon, and you've exceeded it, even just, then doesn't that mean that you have too much?

I'm generally ok with a little over (1-2pts) in casual games but I do consider it cheating, just as I would consider a 6.5" move cheating (instead of a 6" move.)

At a tournament, obviously, I would not expect my opponent to be a single point over and would expect them to be suitably disciplined should they be found out.

10 pts over in 40k is my limit. 10 points can buy a single gun that can make a big difference.

Fantasy? Eh, more or less then same, but only because over 10pts you start getting into magical items.

I've only gone over the points limit once and that was by 2pts, but up to about 10 is ok id say but if your opponent is fine with it then its ok

Here's the thing. Say you have 165 points left to spend, and you want another Tac Squad. A 10 man tac squad costs 170 points. It also gets you a free flamer and a free missile launcher.

Suddenly, you're not just getting 'one extra marine', you're getting an extra marine and a bunch of weapons for those extra 5 points.

Alternatively, consider this: If going over by 5-10 points shouldn't be any big deal by your opponent, and shouldn't give you an unfair advantage, why do you want to do it so much?

0: A limit is a limit.

Of course, there's room to be flexible. For example, if a new player only has a couple squads of troops painted, or you want to try something weird.

Balance wrote:0: A limit is a limit.

Of course, there's room to be flexible. For example, if a new player only has a couple squads of troops painted, or you want to try something weird.

Ya, new players or people with far fewer models than yourself.

When I'm talking 10 points wiggle room I mean super friendly games. If I show up for a pick up game in the store I would prefer you were spot on.

Generally, in pickups against unfamiliar opponents and tournaments, the limit is the limit and that's that.

In games against friends, we'd quite commonly go up to thirty or so points over, and just let the other player know so they can match it.

0 points. Under is always better than over.

My friends and I have a 2-pt bend. There are plenty of wargear choices that can leave you a point or so high.

Anything above that can buy you another peice of wargear that you could have left home to fit the points cap.


Tournaments, even friendlyish ones? Points as listed.

I am going to copy-paste the same answer I always post when this question comes up.

Please note that this isn't directed at anybody in particular and all use of "you" is as a generic "you".


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I'll allow a zero point breach of the maximum allowed.

5 points is the difference between a Mortar and an Autocannon. It makes a hell of a lot of difference to the Rhino heading towards you.

3 points allows for a Singing Spear upgrade. Make a lot of difference to the Land Raider nearby. Plus I get to hear about how his Warlock killed my Land Raider forever.

1 point is a Searchlight. The Searchlight that just lit up my Stormraven, allowing the rest of his army to shoot at it.

Saying; "It's just 1 point. It doesn't make a lot of difference" is a huge fallacy. That 1 point might also be part of a larger chunk of points that makes it possible to field that extra Hive Guard, Terminator, Meltagun or whatever.

Saying; "Just add a Melta Bomb to one of our Sergeants and we are even" is a fallacy. Said squad might not have been taken to move aggresively forwards....making the upgrade utterly pointless. Hell, it might even induce me to stray from the basic tenents of my battleplan, which I had in mind when I made the armylist. Maybe I even considered giving him a Melta Bomb but discarded the idea because it was a useless waste of points.....and now I add it again to compensate for your unwillingness to follow the rules?

If 5 points is no big deal, then remove them. They are "no big deal", remember?

Thank you for putting me in a situation where I, by saying "no", is denying you your "right to have fun". I am not really given a choice. You broke the rules/agreement and suddenly I'M the TFG?!?

We have to set the limit somewhere....and that might as well be at the limit agreed upon beforehand.

Asking "how many points can I be over my list" is a litlte bit like asking "how much intimate contact counts as infidelity?"

The answer is always "zero, unless you're explicitly allowed more by an individual."

Likewise, saying, "well, you can add a few extra points to your list now" is kind of like telling your girlfriend "well, you can make out with one of my siblings."

1 point over is too much

Polonius wrote:Asking "how many points can I be over my list" is a litlte bit like asking "how much intimate contact counts as infidelity?"

The answer is always "zero, unless you're explicitly allowed more by an individual."

Likewise, saying, "well, you can add a few extra points to your list now" is kind of like telling your girlfriend "well, you can make out with one of my siblings."

Polonius, you always have the best way of putting things into words.

Polonius wrote:Asking "how many points can I be over my list" is a litlte bit like asking "how much intimate contact counts as infidelity?"

The answer is always "zero, unless you're explicitly allowed more by an individual."

I agree with Polo.

pretre wrote:0 points. Under is always better than over.

Thats how I do it for myself, Im not desperate in a game to must go over something when I can just take something off.

Though I do tolerate others up to 100pts

It's not cheating if you declare the overspend and the other guy allows it. You can think of it as a handicap.

Of course if he says you've got to drop something then you should drop something.

If you knowingly conceal the overspend then it is cheating.

I'd really have to do it on a case by case basis. In friendly games I can usually get passed it. Tournaments are a no go though. Anything competitive and you gotta stay under that limit.

i had a game vs a imp guard krieg player, my list was 1750, i read through his and was ok with it, i noticed he had 120 guardsman and 7 medusa, looked at his points and not knowing the krieg list, just got on with it, when i got home and checked the list, he was rocking 2200 pts, a few points i can accept, but well... you get the idea

Five points over is the max for me, anything more than that means you need to trim that list.

Anything over is unacceptable IMO. There's a point limit for a reason- you have to design your list within those restrictions. A lot of times lists don't work out perfectly, so you have to accept that and adjust.

If you're playing against friends who are in the same boat as you- and everyone's OK with it then of course it's acceptable... 40k is just a game and people can do whatever house rules they want.

If I'm over or an apponent is over, we just add x amount onto our own list.

Usually evens everything out.

well for me,

tournaments: 0pts over

friendly: up to 4-5pts

Zero points. If you want a 5 point buffer, just admit up front that you're playing a 1,705 point game.

0 points for me. In WHFB those VP's matter

0 points. It's a called a limit for a reason.

If you've both agreed something, why would you then try and change that agreement?

Kilkrazy wrote:It's not cheating if you declare the overspend and the other guy allows it. You can think of it as a handicap.

Of course if he says you've got to drop something then you should drop something.

If you knowingly conceal the overspend then it is cheating.

It's breaking the rules, whether the other guy allows it or not. Realistically, if your opponent has taken the time to collect and paint an army, and meet you somewhere for a game, he's probably not going to refuse to play because you're only a few points over the agreed limit. I know I wouldn't make a big deal of it, even though I wouldn't really be happy about it. But next time, I'd probably be looking for a different opponent. I would also be watching this guy really closely to see if he has a magical stretchy measuring tape, magical transmogrifying wargear ("no, really, I paid for this flamer as a meltagun!"), or any of the numerous other things that apparently "aren't really cheating" but totally are.

Or, to put it another way, if you're 5 points over in our 2000 point game, why didn't you simply challenge me to a 2005 point game?

I'm generally ok with my opponents being a couple of points over in friendly games. At 5 points, there's pretty much ALWAYS something to drop to get it down. It's entirely possible that there's nothing you can drop without putting you down 7-9 points, with no upgrades to take to make up for it. Not every codex has a 1, 2, or 3 point option that you can just drop.

If I'm playing DE and am 2 points over, I can't just drop ONE haywire grenade from my wyches...the entire squad has to drop it, causing a lot of rearranging to make it work.

With that said, I refuse to play over myself (My 2K DE list tends to sit at 1995 because I have nothing else to take without putting me over). I also would not tolerate it at a tournament.


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Jangustus wrote:0 points. It's a called a limit for a reason.

If you've both agreed something, why would you then try and change that agreement?

This is way too rigid. If he then plays 5 points down, you're now changing your agreement in YOUR favor.

No you are not. The agreement was 2k and he brought 1995? That is his fault not yours.