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Way to go GW.
Due to flat out moves being made in shooting, does this mean that grav-chute insertion is now functionally useless?
You are only allowed to disembark in the movement phase, right?

Also, the Guardsmen would have to weather a turn of enemy shooting.

As a caveat, I don't actually have the new rule book and am only going by what I have seen leaked on the internet.

As a note, the Storm Raven rules explicitly say that the embarked unit can disembark even if the transport has moved more than 6."

Why would it be useless? Nothing in the rules say you cannot use it while zooming.

It's best not to get mad about rules that you're incapable of referencing.

I've gotten my hands on a digital copy, an excerpt actually, of the rules and I still stand by my claim.

Grav-Chute Insertion allows one to disembark after a flat-out move. However, flat-out moves are made in the shooting phase. Units are not allowed to disembark in the shooting phase. Thus the rule is now useless.

I'd like to note again, that the rules for the Storm Raven explicitly say that Skies of Blood allows units to disembark after the transport has moves over 6" while Grav-Chute Insertion does not.

This is just another examples of shoddy work on the part of GW.
Not that that's going to stop me from buying from them yet.

acekevin8412 wrote:I've gotten my hands on a digital copy, an excerpt actually, of the rules and I still stand by my claim.

Grav-Chute Insertion allows one to disembark after a flat-out move. However, flat-out moves are made in the shooting phase. Units are not allowed to disembark in the shooting phase. Thus the rule is now useless.

I'd like to note again, that the rules for the Storm Raven explicitly say that Skies of Blood allows units to disembark after the transport has moves over 6" while Grav-Chute Insertion does not.

This is just another examples of shoddy work on the part of GW.
Not that that's going to stop me from buying from them yet.

No need to get hasty, Vendettas and Valkyries can both Hover, which allows them to act like normal and revert back to being skimmers. Grav-chute will work the same exact way.

Not to be rude, but has anyone read my post?

GRAV-CHUTE INSERTION IS ONLY ALLOWED WHEN GOING FLAT-OUT.

FLAT-OUT MOVES ARE MADE IN THE SHOOTING PHASE NOW.

UNITS CANNOT DISEMBARK IN THE SHOOTING PHASE.

The Stormraven amendment however changed its rule to, "allowing a unit to disembark even if the transport moved more than 6."

You do realize that prefacing with 'not to be rude' does not mean you can then say whatever you want - to do that you need to say 'with all due respect'

That said, this would not be the first rule obsoleted by GW, I suggest you wait until you have an actual copy of the text. Further, units disembark from transports all the time outside of the movement phase.

Thank you for your response. I feel that I have not been rude with my previous statement, I used all caps to high light the information that I felt people were missing. I'll keep in mind the use of "with all due respect," instead of "not to be rude"

Anyway, I have a (digital) copy of the text, and the pertinent rules are quite legible.

I also play Tau and was going to start a WWP DE Wych list, so I well aware that GW has no qualms with invalidating rules.

Could you elaborate on when units can disembark outside the movement phase? I can only think of the case when their transport is destroyed by shooting or assault.

Reread the FAQ and I have thought about the rules again.

I noticed toward the beginning of the FAQ, in black instead of pink it says, "If a Valkyrie or Vendetta moved flat out passengers may still disembark, they they do so as follows."

Does this mean that Grav-Chute Insertion lets the embarked unit perform an out-of-sequence disembark? is the unit allowed to shoot in the shooting phase afterward?

I don't see anything that stops it. What are the restrictions for shooting after disembarking that might apply?

This is a very good example of the whole general is over ruled by specific: the general rule is that you cannot assault after disembarking, but anyone who points at that rule and argues that you can't assault after getting out of an open topped vehicle is going to get laughed at.

In this case, the grav-chute insertion rules specifically allow you to disembark after moving flat out, which would over-ride any general rules about timing of disembarkation.

Bookwrack wrote:I don't see anything that stops it. What are the restrictions for shooting after disembarking that might apply?

This is a very good example of the whole general is over ruled by specific: the general rule is that you cannot assault after disembarking, but anyone who points at that rule and argues that you can't assault after getting out of an open topped vehicle is going to get laughed at.

In this case, the grav-chute insertion rules specifically allow you to disembark after moving flat out, which would over-ride any general rules about timing of disembarkation.

Yeah, sorry about some of my previous posts. Didn't notice, or think about until now, the wording since it wasn't in pink. That and that out of sequence actions are kinda weird.

It's still not as good as Blood Skies though, since you have to give up shooting to disembark squishy troops that'll probably die after a turn.

acekevin8412 wrote:Thank you for your response. I feel that I have not been rude with my previous statement, I used all caps to high light the information that I felt people were missing. I'll keep in mind the use of "with all due respect," instead of "not to be rude"

Anyway, I have a (digital) copy of the text, and the pertinent rules are quite legible.

I also play Tau and was going to start a WWP DE Wych list, so I well aware that GW has no qualms with invalidating rules.

Could you elaborate on when units can disembark outside the movement phase? I can only think of the case when their transport is destroyed by shooting or assault.

So are you saying or implying embarked units now can't get out of a wrecked or destroyed transport?

Dozer Blades wrote:

acekevin8412 wrote:Thank you for your response. I feel that I have not been rude with my previous statement, I used all caps to high light the information that I felt people were missing. I'll keep in mind the use of "with all due respect," instead of "not to be rude"

Anyway, I have a (digital) copy of the text, and the pertinent rules are quite legible.

I also play Tau and was going to start a WWP DE Wych list, so I well aware that GW has no qualms with invalidating rules.

Could you elaborate on when units can disembark outside the movement phase? I can only think of the case when their transport is destroyed by shooting or assault.

So are you saying or implying embarked units now can't get out of a wrecked or destroyed transport?

Those two situations are explicitly covered on page 426. Grav-Chute Insertion is a special case with the rules worded the way they are now.
I also made another after that when I remembered about out of sequence actions.

Well, I'm probably gonna end up using the Skies of Blood rules variation that allows disembark after moving more than 6". Yes, it's not RAW, but these FAQs are all full of holes anyway, and its fits with my own RAI ruling, like Storm Troopers using Aerial Assault with Grav-Chute Insertion. Unless overruled by a TO, I'm gonna settle on playing it like this.