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I'm looking for an all around list, something that I can paint up, throw in my gaming case and know that I always have a solid army ready on hand. My problem is that I have been playing since 2nd edition and I own more models and units than I know what to do with. In addition some of the old units have changed in their implementation and I am inexperienced with some of the new units I own. I own approximately 6000 points of BA, so really I just need help building a synergistic army list that is fun to play and able to hold its own.

What I own:


My List at 1850:


Comments criticism, my list total suck? please let me know and help me to build one that is fun to play and able to be fairly competitive.

Thanks in advance!

I feel like the kid picked last for dodgeball.. lol

Anyone got any advice ?

Looks pretty solid for the most part. A few things that if I were in your shoes I might consider rethinking or at least considering.

HQ- Pretty good lots of things he can do and pretty hard to kill.
Troops - possible 5 scoring groups nice, with some extra denial in the form of the DC.
Tac- always a bit controversial with blood angles but i can somewhat see where you are going with the ADL and such.
Assault - good , sarge is a bit points heavy but could be useful in a challenge so not too worried
Scouts- interesting, here I would be tempted to use a missile launcher rather than the heavy bolter, same cost if i am not mistaken and could (though not super likely to) give you a little more long rang AT if they are going behind the ADL.
DC- I have never used these personally but they seem solid enough- drop pod is an interesting choice though i might consider an alternate plan of moving them but it does give you some disruption- on the other hand the deathwind upgrade. I really wanted to like it and this is one of the few places where I can see it being useful but I am still undecided. Possibly something to drop for points.

As to the DC equipment I would consider giving them some form of power weapons a fist perhaps. I generally like the DC with bolters as the extra shooting that you can use with relentless is a benefit that is not often realized, on the other hand most of the cost of the company comes from the assault power they bring so i would suggest attempting to utilize that power more.


Elite -
Terminators - hard to kill that is always a plus. some good missile launcher fun as well. Like the backup chainfists . It really depends how you intend to use them in the list. If you want something as a counter punch you could do worse then these guys but they need to use their shooting to make up for not having storm shields. I would also like to see these with feel no pain.

Chaplain - I assume he tags along with the death company, if so not bad. I would consider finding the points to take a reclusiarch instead or just shell out for Lemartes as spending the elite slot is not the best way to use your points. overall Death company can mostly handle themselves so this could be changed over to a different choice.

I would also generally suggest the inclusion of some form of sang priests either by way of honor guard or through the elite priests these are what make blood angles so much more survivable than a basic marine and allows assault units to hit harder than their codex counterpart.

Heavy-
Devs- No real complaints they get extra staying power behind the ADL but They really need a priest babysitting them since they will still take alot of heat and this is where a decent chunk of your long range AT is coming from.

Overall.

I think you could use some more mobility- getting to far away objectives is going to be challenging with the current list as the units you have are going to have a hard time moving enough bodies to an objective sitting anywhere past midfield. the DC cannot claim though they may cause backfield havoc they will probably bite it eventually,, that leaves only your assault marines and terminators moving across the field possibly your tac as well depending on the circumstances. If you want to use your force in a defensive manner (a good enough strategy) you need some more forward elements in order to claim objectives at the halfway mark. I also think you could use some priests to buff your forces. other than those considerations i think this is still a pretty solid list.

Unless this app on my phone is wrong, your current set up is 1732 points, not 1850.

Are you putting the scouts behind the ADL? Are you giving them snipers? If not, I'd drop the ADL and extra Devastator from each squad, which should give you enough points to take two Stormravens without sponsons (I've yet to do much with the sponsons when I used them during my BA days).

If you are keeping the scouts behind the ADL, I'd still drop the extra Devastator from each group to give you enough points to take a stock Stormraven and second Assault Squad.

For your Librarian, I suggest keeping the Blood Angels powers, as Shield of Sanguinous is the only Space Marine psyker ability that works on your opponents turn, leaving the Librarian's warp charge available for Blood Lance on your turn. If you're footslogging your tac squad, put the Libarian with them to give them some kind of extra protection.

Of course, if my app is off, then I apologize.

personally? I'm not a fan of the tactical squad in BA nor am I a fan of their devastators. I'd always go with more assault troops instead of a tac squad. The extra mobility, on top of DoA, is huge. I had both armies so I ran an allied detachment of Space Wolves, took grey hunters, a rune priest, and long fangs. A little cheesy, but no one in my playing group ever had issue with it.

My idea was to form a defensive fire base with the AGL, devastators and either the Tac squad or the scouts (sniper equipped). Or I can infiltrate the scouts to another point. I could add another assault squad, but I was worried about the lack of long range firepower against meq or teq. The Plas Tac squad packs lots of plasma.
The chappy would ride with the DC in the drop pod and are basically an annoyance unit that the opponent MUST deal with or pay the consequences.

I could pack in transports, but I was trying to mitigate the need by having a bunch of jump pack scoring units. I could take out the scouts, Tac squad and both debs and add IG allies.

As for bringing 2 storm ravens, I only own one (also own a vendetta) and I am dubious of buying more as I feel the moment GW mass releases skyfire missiles we are going to see a lot of downed flyers during games.

I see the defensive army thing and I think it can work. However, I think some changes and additions (moving up to higher points) would improve the list.

Tac squads are fine for what they do. Plasma is also fine for this list with the large number of ML you have.I like the devastators as far as providing more firepower. I think relying on infantry firepower in such small squads means that you really need priests to provide feel no pain.

Death company may not need the chappy to be effective could save points.

I still think that you need a little more of a forward scoring element in order to take objectives.

so to sum up.
I think adding some priests would increase the staying power.
maybe adjusting the death company for more hitting power.
If you want a storm raven I would add a death company dread or some other dread to carry in.
another solid option would be to add another scoring assault marine squad.
hope that helps

Ok I am gonna remove the chaplain. Add a second assault squad (flamers). And do some reworking to add some priests in. I will post the list in he morning as it will be the list I am playing with later in the afternoon. As far as adding something mobile to capture objectives, how about two 5 man assault squads in razorbacks? The only problem I can see is that they might be picked off. I will have to think it all over a bit.


Kcwm did you add the defense line to the points cost? That's 100 right there with the wall and quad gun.

 TheLionOfTheForest wrote:
Ok I am gonna remove the chaplain. Add a second assault squad (flamers). And do some reworking to add some priests in. I will post the list in he morning as it will be the list I am playing with later in the afternoon. As far as adding something mobile to capture objectives, how about two 5 man assault squads in razorbacks? The only problem I can see is that they might be picked off. I will have to think it all over a bit.


Kcwm did you add the defense line to the points cost? That's 100 right there with the wall and quad gun.

Yeah, that app was way off. I need to look into a different app or source file. Bah. I'm really sorry. I currently have it loaded in Army Builder and I'm reevaluating based on your removal of the Chaplain.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok, so dropping the Chaplain, here are my suggestions:

If you weren't going to, separate your terminator squad of 10 guys into two groups of 5. You can still take the two CML and chain fists, but you can split up their attacks between two different targets. You have the elite slots to spare, especially with dropping the Chaplain (I'm not a big fan of them outside of Lemartes).

I still suggest taking a Stormraven. Right now, there's no indication that GW is going to FAQ other armies to have Flakk missiles once the C:CSM is released tomorrow. I assume they will, but there's no guarantee. The SR gives you a great gunboat that's ideal for taking out other flyers, can't be melta'd, and can transport troops if you need it to. PotMS has been a boon to me when it comes to facing opponents with multiple flyers.

If you do this and drop those two extra Devastators in each squad, you have 90 points to play with. I love Sanguinary Priests. Buy one and stick him with your Devastators so that they get FNP. If I remember right, it's within 6" of him, so put him in between both units. In the event that your devastators end up with Flakk missiles soon, FNP offers them an extra layer of protection for them.

WIth the extra, take two more bodies in your Death Company squad or one and give one of them a power weapon and one of your terminator squads an extra Chain Fist.

Again, sorry about the gaffe with the app I was using. Lesson learned there.

Ok, well here is the list I think I am going to run today at 1850 points.



I do not have the Stormraven built yet, but as soon as I do and figure out how I want to fit it that will be included.

Here is a picture because sometimes I find a visualization brings to light something that is missing

let us know how you do. I like most of the changes to your list.

Well the first battle was a resounding success. I noticed as I was deploying at 2k points that my maths powers had failed me. 1850 + 250 Sanguinary guard =2100 lol. The good part is, he only thing that squad did was get heir hands on the relic. Which means I can use a 5 man assault squad.

So I as up against dark eldar with eldar allies. Thankfully no eldrad. We had the relic mission and we deplyed at the far edges of the board with 6ft of table between us. My first advantage. I also go to go first and the other player failed to seize initiative Ina 4+.

My devastators were awesome popping light open tipped skimmers left and right. I think more dark eldar died to exploding vehicals than to actual BA fire.
My assault Srg wih SS and LC went toe to toe with and eldar farseer, tying him up for 2 turns before dying on the 3rd combat phase, one assault marine lasted an entire additional turn.
My fire base (2 x 5 man devs, plasma Tac squad) killed the enemy DE HQ and second HQ unit after they assaulted through my aegis. Took 3 full player turns to kill them. Challenges cut both ways if you know how to utilize the game mechanic to your advantage. He entire time I will had the 2nd dev squad (manning the quad gun) free to keep shooting.

My termie librarian rolled decent powers but I never used them. He was attached to the termie squad. He rolled FNP for him and his squad on the warlord trait list and it saved me 2 terminators.
My DC and pod (240 points) killed almost 500 poin of DE and their 2 skimmers. I did t even use the powerfist. I might changeout to a power maul.

All in all his didn't seem a fair fight. Most rolls went my way. My devastators and cyclone missile launchers were over kill.

I think just a few small tweaks and this army will be solid.

My opponent noted right after he deployed that he wished he knew I wasn't bring any vehicals as his dark lances were now a suboptimal choice. Termies shrugged off 2 dark lance hits on heir invulnerable save!

Great to hear that it went well.

With the change to power swords and maces, Sanguinary Guard are now excellent choices with their 2+ save, even if they are 200 points...very survivable.

I played a game over the weekend against a dual Devastator squad. Without the mobility to move up and engage them, they sat back and picked me off with Krak missiles and bombed my Zombie horde with Frag missiles. Devs, or their equivalents, in cover, especially with FNP, are pretty tough.

In our newest podcast episode, we discussed the fact that our group doesn't use Fortifications. Between posting in this thread and talking about it on there, I'm sold on using an ADL in some of our higher point games. I guess it's time to unbox that Imperial Strongpoint sitting in my closet.

What's your podcast? I listen to quite a few. I think Sanguinary guard are awesome but probably not needed in my list since I have the deep striking terminators. To bring my list up to 2k I will just round the 5 man flamer assault squad up to 10 man. But I need to write up an alternate list that includes them, maybe with Dante.

A couple other players commented as they were watching that my army was very old school second edition. I thanked them for the complement.

I'm a co-host of the Hitting On 3s podcast. We can be a bit offensive and we're not very PC. It's a very casual podcast, but that's the kind of thing that I enjoy, so it works for me.

Deep Striking Terminators are definitely nice and reduce the need for Sang Guard, but SG get DoA, so they only scatter D6 instead of 2D6. Sticking them Dante to precision strike can be really nasty. Hell, sticking anything with Dante to precision strike can be nasty.

I'll have to subscribe to your podcast. I'll just make sure not to play it around the kid.

I think when I build a list with SG in it I will probably throw some vehicals in with them. Maybe 2 predators and a stormraven and a deep striking furioso with a frag cannon and heavy flamer.

I never like flamers in 5th or previously at all really. Lovin them in 6 so far though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Found your site. You guys arent on Itunes I take it. Is there a way I can download it so I can throw it in my MP3 player ?

I just had my second game with this list agains a necron opponent that won our last local tournament in 5th and only lost twice in 5th with necrons. This was my second game in 6th and his first. I was expecting to get blown off the board but I actually did really well. My Aegis defense line with quad gun, both devastator squads and Plasma tac w/ attached Sanguinary priest did awesome, again! Things were going very well for me until my 470 pt terminator squad and 130 terminator librarian scattered on their deep strike (rolled double 6's) and just nicked the edge of terrain, of course I roll a 1 on the deep strike mishap table, so 600 points of my 1850 point list GONE! To make matters worse this gave my opponnent, First blood, Slay the warlord and since it was purge the alien (deployment was hammer and anvil) an additional point for each. By turn 4 the score was 8-4, with my defensive block still strong. He then moved all his units into cover out of line of sight. I would have had to trek across the board to fight him and that wouldn't have worked out for me, so I had to concede defeat.

All in all I can claim a personal and moral victory. He admitted that if my terminators and attached HQ hadn't misshaped I would have won. Just the fact that I did as well as I did with only 1250 points vs his 1850 feels good. I am really liking this list. I cant wait to get some more games in with it.

I have added a second flamer assault squad to my list to bring it up to 2k.

I will keep you all posted on how this list continues to fair.

Had my 3rd game. Won against a 2000 point Deathwing army. My opponent had no landraiders and my lack of ap2/1 was an issue, luckily he fed me two five man terminator units a turn (we had relic mission), which I just whittled down with weight of fire. My Librarian has been kind of meh, I am never really impressed with his power usage and I would probably get more use out of the ap2 on smite (primaris power). So I have been thinking about either a Termie reclusiarch or dare I say it a space marine captain in terminator armor. My issue with the chaplain is even though I like power mauls the one place I do not want one is on my HQ. I found the Librarians 2 base attacks and force axe just to be underwhelming, so I am sure I will not be impressed with the chaplains maul when I want to go toe to toe with an enemy HQ. So then my only real choice is a Terminator Captain. I assume he keeps his Iron Halo since it does not say that it is replaced when he chooses his terminator armor. So if that is in fact the case is it worth the 15pts to make the upgrade to a storm shield for a 3++? The way I see it I could either go with a THT/SS or a Combiweapon / TH.

Typically I was putting my Terminator Librarian with the 10 man terminator squad. I have also been thinking of switching between a 5 man shootie terminator squad and a 5 man assault termie squad. Then I could pick and choose which group the HQ joins based on the mission and the enemy units I am up against.

I dont want to switch my list up too much atm as it has been working rather well for me, I just want to fine tune the few things I have not been so satisfied with.

I wish I could take a second DP death co squad as they are gold. I just do NOT want Astorath as my HQ in this list.

Term Lib; I love the model, I love the idea, but not the reality in game.

I tend to think a lot of problem come back to drop pod capacity. if it where 12 you could give put tyco, the lamenators grand master, brother corbulo with 5 terms

Also our special charactors are super expensive (don't worry I dante I still love you even though you strike at In1 with a In6)

I know you are not changing the list much but maybe one day consider dante, guard or two (depending on point adjustments)

I have some assault terminators on my shelf, but they just scream give me a land raider, which would not fit

other option is to focus more on shooty/defensive

anyway just my drunken ramblings

Yeah Dante, just doesn't work for me unless he's with a SG squad. And I agree with you assault termies need a Landraider, a huge points sink. Jury's still ou on the fate of the termie librarian, although I am customizing a termie captain in the meantime.

You know Ad_Allstar, I think I might give Tycho a try in the DC drop pod. instead of the termie librarian. Hes almost as tough 2+4++ instead of 2+3++, but he has combimelta with special ammo, his attacks ignore armor... gonna have to mull it over.

You play very alike to me, I run BA's with a fire base and assault elements. My usual list consists of standard libby using divination powers (will add some more info further down) Sang Priest (only way to get a save against perils) devastator squad with 4 ML's behind a Aegis defence line. Some times I add a tac squad in there for more bodies and deployment based objective scoring

I have run two 10 man assault squads in there as well deepstriking or combat squading as needed.

The divination powers work very well IME with a libby attached to a devastator squad with ML's, you have prescience which re rolls misses, you have spent enough on the squad not to have them miss any shots. Misfourtune to make one squad re roll ALL passed saves, Perfect timing is the best imo though, ignores cover with a AP3 rocket?, takes out quad guns thunderfires enemy marines like no bodies business, if you are against guard or orks behind a aegis use frags to force loads of wounds. A lot of people dont bother taking armour upgrades on the guard if they are using aegis as they just think the 4+ plus loads of bodies will be enough.


To flesh the rest out I usually use a couple of SR's and or attack bikes for tank popping but last night run a 2k point list

libby
sang priest
4x 5 non JP ASM in razorbacks (two TL HB, one TL LC, one LC TL PG)
10 DC in LR redeemer (first time I have used the LR as a transport, toasted 9 marines in first time after they drop podded down and missed with the melta!)

5 attack bikes with MM (facing a SR, all 3 within 12inch, rolled two 6's to hit!, I could not believe it!)

Devi squad with 4 ML's two extra bodies

Aegis Defence line with quad gun

OH and 5 Vanguard vets, 4 with dual LC's all with JP's

Beat my opponent 9-1 on VP's, popped every tank he had (two razorbacks and two preds) by turn 2 all ASM's jumped out of Rbacks by turn 5 on objectives DC where dying off after tie ing up his captain with sternguard unit for a few turns. Never used the MSU before but the rest of the army worked wonders last night

How are you liking armor? I have been too afraid to field my razors or Landraider. I am totally digging the all infantry list. I think I might break down my ten man Tac term squad into one 5 man and use the points on a 3rd ML dev squad. That would give me 12 ML shots coming from behind m aegis.

I'll keep posting here how m list does and how it evolves or doesn't over time.

Thanks for your input.

 TheLionOfTheForest wrote:
I just had my second game with this list agains a necron opponent that won our last local tournament in 5th and only lost twice in 5th with necrons. This was my second game in 6th and his first. I was expecting to get blown off the board but I actually did really well. My Aegis defense line with quad gun, both devastator squads and Plasma tac w/ attached Sanguinary priest did awesome, again! Things were going very well for me until my 470 pt terminator squad and 130 terminator librarian scattered on their deep strike (rolled double 6's) and just nicked the edge of terrain, of course I roll a 1 on the deep strike mishap table, so 600 points of my 1850 point list GONE! To make matters worse this gave my opponnent, First blood, Slay the warlord and since it was purge the alien (deployment was hammer and anvil) an additional point for each. By turn 4 the score was 8-4, with my defensive block still strong. He then moved all his units into cover out of line of sight. I would have had to trek across the board to fight him and that wouldn't have worked out for me, so I had to concede defeat.

All in all I can claim a personal and moral victory. He admitted that if my terminators and attached HQ hadn't misshaped I would have won. Just the fact that I did as well as I did with only 1250 points vs his 1850 feels good. I am really liking this list. I cant wait to get some more games in with it.

I have added a second flamer assault squad to my list to bring it up to 2k.

I will keep you all posted on how this list continues to fair.

Dont you only roll on the mishap table if you DS onto an enemy unit or off the table edge? I thought if you hit terrain you just did the dangerous terrain test for all models within.

I think I may have just misremembered at the time when I wrote the write up. I think I clipped the hill with he center guy but also clipped an enemy model on the first concentric ring. 11 terminator bases leave a large footprint when deep striking.

 OutlawBandit wrote:

 TheLionOfTheForest wrote:
I just had my second game with this list agains a necron opponent that won our last local tournament in 5th and only lost twice in 5th with necrons. This was my second game in 6th and his first. I was expecting to get blown off the board but I actually did really well. My Aegis defense line with quad gun, both devastator squads and Plasma tac w/ attached Sanguinary priest did awesome, again! Things were going very well for me until my 470 pt terminator squad and 130 terminator librarian scattered on their deep strike (rolled double 6's) and just nicked the edge of terrain, of course I roll a 1 on the deep strike mishap table, so 600 points of my 1850 point list GONE! To make matters worse this gave my opponnent, First blood, Slay the warlord and since it was purge the alien (deployment was hammer and anvil) an additional point for each. By turn 4 the score was 8-4, with my defensive block still strong. He then moved all his units into cover out of line of sight. I would have had to trek across the board to fight him and that wouldn't have worked out for me, so I had to concede defeat.

All in all I can claim a personal and moral victory. He admitted that if my terminators and attached HQ hadn't misshaped I would have won. Just the fact that I did as well as I did with only 1250 points vs his 1850 feels good. I am really liking this list. I cant wait to get some more games in with it.

I have added a second flamer assault squad to my list to bring it up to 2k.

I will keep you all posted on how this list continues to fair.

Dont you only roll on the mishap table if you DS onto an enemy unit or off the table edge? I thought if you hit terrain you just did the dangerous terrain test for all models within.

if you look on page 32 of the BA codex seeing the drop pod entry for inertial guidance system you wont mishap ever unless its off the board. if you scatter onto a unit you scatter next to it inorder to not get a mishap. =]

Got a 1750 tourny today. Using basically the same list except the terminator librarian has her replaced by a JP one and the terminators have been cut and replaced by a Sanguinary guard squad along with an added JP Sanguinary priest. I will post a follow up and the complete list when I return later today.

I totally forgot to post a write up with the holidays and all.

Anyway I lost my first game to a mech Sisters player by one VP. Last turn I went to kill Celestine and jacobus. Killed Celestine and only put one wound in jacobus that would have ID'd him but he made his 4++.

Second game was against an IG player with meh vets 2 medusa and a LRBT. I know IG I play IG, I wasn't worried. The dice conspired against me all game but I still managed to eek out a win by 1 VP.

My third game was against an eldar player. The game started out very poorly. With a couple deep strikes scattering out of optimal ranges and such. The avatar of Kaine and he eldar dread died to krak missile volleys. Rangers died to flamers and assault marines. Death co. We're awesome distracting multiple eldar units for multiple turns. The wraith robot things also died to krak. Sanguinary guard destroyed everything else. I ended up tabling him on turn 5.