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In the new daemon codex one of the options for lesser and greater demonic gifts is a weapon, say an etherblade which gives AP2. Heralds (and others) may already have a close combat weapon as standard (e.g. plaguesword, poison 4+).

So, does taking the weapon choice for a demonic gift mean that the herald now has two close combat weapons (and therefore an extra attack) and can take advantage of both the AP2 and poison rules?

All the Melee Weapons on p62-63 are Specialist, with the exception of Hellblade and Plaguesword. Read the USR Specialist Weapon to see what that means for your question.

Just an FYI
They are not "Daemonic Gifts" they are "Rewards" if they were "gifts" then that GK power could make them useless for the turn.

They are all Daemonic Gifts, as Melee Weapons is a subhead of that section (see p. 61 and note the front size).

The answer to the OP is that they get an additional Attack (see Specialist Weapons, p. 42) but do not necessarily get the abilities of both at the same time (see More Than one Weapon, p. 51).

TzeentchNet wrote:
They are all Daemonic Gifts, as Melee Weapons is a subhead of that section (see p. 61 and note the front size).

If that were true, then according to my digital codex, GK can nullify the following with just one simple psychic power:

All Daemon of "insert God"
All Daemonic Steeds
All Icon and Instruments
All Daemonic Rewards
All Daemonic Psychic Powers
All Melee Weapons
All Hellforged Artefacts

And their associated Special Rules.

Some how I do not think that is the case.

They are Gifts, they get effected while the unit is in BtB with a guy with that power.

Don't assault a guy with Dark Excommunication

40k-noob wrote:

TzeentchNet wrote:
They are all Daemonic Gifts, as Melee Weapons is a subhead of that section (see p. 61 and note the front size).

If that were true, then according to my digital codex, GK can nullify the following with just one simple psychic power:

All Daemon of "insert God"
All Daemonic Steeds
All Icon and Instruments
All Daemonic Rewards
All Daemonic Psychic Powers
All Melee Weapons
All Hellforged Artefacts

And their associated Special Rules.

Some how I do not think that is the case.

I'm assuming you are talking about Dark Excommunication? If so it only works during the assault phase which means Damon of X (which is a special rule) would not be affected. They would lose any melee weapons, attributes, steeds, icons/instruments, artifacts, rewards, loci, and psychic powers.

This will (hopefully) be in the yet to be released FAQ to clarify what exactly constitutes as Daemonic Gifts.

 Happyjew wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

TzeentchNet wrote:
They are all Daemonic Gifts, as Melee Weapons is a subhead of that section (see p. 61 and note the front size).

If that were true, then according to my digital codex, GK can nullify the following with just one simple psychic power:

All Daemon of "insert God"
All Daemonic Steeds
All Icon and Instruments
All Daemonic Rewards
All Daemonic Psychic Powers
All Melee Weapons
All Hellforged Artefacts

And their associated Special Rules.

Some how I do not think that is the case.

I'm assuming you are talking about Dark Excommunication? If so it only works during the assault phase which means Damon of X (which is a special rule) would not be affected. They would lose any melee weapons, attributes, steeds, icons/instruments, artifacts, rewards, loci, and psychic powers.

This will (hopefully) be in the yet to be released FAQ to clarify what exactly constitutes as Daemonic Gifts.

yeah, that is the power.

However in my iDex. It lists Daemon of (insert God) under the Daemonic Attributes which are under the Gifts section so, yes, that power nullifies that special rule as well, right?

If it is actually listed under the Gifts section, yes it would take it away.


Don't worry about it. It can only effect 1 unit in BtB with the caster of the power and people usually run Divination on their Librarians. So really you will only see this power on Dreadknights and Coteaz.

Possibly. My codex lists Daemon of X as a special rule - both on page 26 and in the actual army list.

Furthermore, per the FAQ it has no effect on Daemonic Steeds.

Nothing prevents a thing from being both a Daemonic Gift and a special rule. And you can come with a Daemonic Gift standard as well.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Nothing prevents a thing from being both a Daemonic Gift and a special rule. And you can come with a Daemonic Gift standard as well.

I realize that, however, the only things listed under Daemonic Attributes (pg 63) is the Collar of Khorne, Rot Proboscis, Venom Sting, and Warp-forged Armour.

Er, why is that important

LOL that is just plain crazy.

That would insta-kill any daemon in that combat. Except those with an actual Save value in their profile because the Invul comes from the Daemon rule which is part of the Daemon of etc attribute.

Dark Excommunitcation removes the benefits of any Daemonic Gifts (except Steeds) for the duration of the Assault phase. According the iDex (apparently, don't have it so I don't know) the army special rules "Daemon of X" is listed under Daemonic Atributes (which is itself a Daemonic Gift). According the hardback codex, Daemon of X is a special rule only and is not a Daemonic attribute.

@40knoob

Being a Daemon isn't a Daemonic Gift. Its an intrinsic special rule they have. Unless GW was dumb and only has the Daemon special rule given by being a Daemon of X.

They should all retain the 5+ ward save.


And meh, even if it does do that at least it makes Dark Excommunication useful. I have never used it once since the GK codex came out.

 Grey Templar wrote:
@40knoob

Being a Daemon isn't a Daemonic Gift. Its an intrinsic special rule they have. Unless GW was dumb and only has the Daemon special rule given by being a Daemon of X.

They should all retain the 5+ ward save.


And meh, even if it does do that at least it makes Dark Excommunication useful. I have never used it once since the GK codex came out.

your right, i scrolled too far in my iDex. My bad.

 Happyjew wrote:
Dark Excommunitcation removes the benefits of any Daemonic Gifts (except Steeds) for the duration of the Assault phase. According the iDex (apparently, don't have it so I don't know) the army special rules "Daemon of X" is listed under Daemonic Atributes (which is itself a Daemonic Gift). According the hardback codex, Daemon of X is a special rule only and is not a Daemonic attribute.

Yeah, this is incorrectly stated.

In the ipad codex the following headings are all that are listed as being 'Daemonic Gifts':

Ranged Weapons
Melee Weapons
Daemonic Attributes
Icons and Instruments
Hellforged Artifacts
Daemonic Rewards
Daemon Psychic Powers


---


The 'Daemon of X' rules are Daemon Special Rules, which are located in the 'Infernal Legions' section of the book.

yak, as I stated, I do not own the iDex. The statement you quoted regarding the iDex was based off of this:

40k-noob wrote:
However in my iDex. It lists Daemon of (insert God) under the Daemonic Attributes which are under the Gifts section so, yes, that power nullifies that special rule as well, right?

yakface wrote:
Ranged Weapons
Melee Weapons
Daemonic Attributes
Icons and Instruments
Hellforged Artifacts
Daemonic Rewards
Daemon Psychic Powers
The 'Daemon of X' rules are Daemon Special Rules, which are located in the 'Infernal Legions' section of the book.

Based on the above what (if anything) would a daemon prince of Nurgle for example, still benefit from if it charged a dreadknight or what have you with this power active?
Seems like it pretty much takes away everything...

Dark Excommunication is cast before any blows are struck. So if a gift comes into effect before that time you will benifit, but anything after that gets lost.

It would get whatever bonus being a Monstrous creature and a Daemon of Nurgle gives you..so Fear, 5++, Hammer of Wrath, Smash, and AP2. If you paid the points to be a psyker, you also have a better chance to deny dark excommunication.

I don't think so actually. Dark Excommunication doesn't target anyone. It just says "If the test is passed, pick a unit in BtB with the caster, that unit's models lose all their daemonic gifts till the end of the round"

So no Deny the Witch.

Does it? Nevermind then can't deny.

Gifts, Rewards, Artefacts and Psychic Powers are all different sections in the book codex. Each of these titles is the same size/font, and each has an identical section line to separate it. (Steeds are exempted from their place in "Gifts" via the GK FAQ).


So it would lose neither Psychic abilities, nor any of the rolled rewards. It would lose a 0 result on any of the rewards, since the profiles for those weapons are listed under "Gifts."

it actually says ceases to work, not loses.

So if they cease to work, wouldn't you lose any benefits you gained prior to the Assault phase by having them in the first place?

Elric, the very first line under DAEMONIC GIFTS (on page 61) says it is a list of powers, weapons and equipment. Due to what is listed over the next few pages context is that powers must refer to psychic powers (which is last overall).

Furthermore (and this is not really important but needs to be mentioned) Per the Table of Contents, everything from Ranged Weapons through Psychic Powers fall under the broad category of Daemonic Gifts.

Yeah, here's how it looks in the digital codex...its crystal clear:

I think a lesson here is never get into close combat with a a greyknight dreadknight for any reason as a daemon player. That is ok by me, their psychic abilities are otherwise pretty useless.

That is clear, then. It's just formatted in a misleading manner in the hardback.

So here's a question:
If psychic powers are Gifts, and my DP has Iron Arm cast on himself, does Dark Excom remove the already cast +D3 bonus, or just the ability to cast Iron Arm?