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So, there is an AvP Kickstarter going on. Take a gander, but that's not what this thread is about.

It turned out, in the course of that thread, at least one member of our esteemed number had yet to view any of the films that provided the source material. I have decided not to say who because I don't want to embarass RiTides; this thread is educational.

Please discuss the minutiae of the Aliens, Predator, and AvP films here. Recommended viewing order, etc. Although these are very old films please add spoiler tags to any major plot points because, again, at least one anonymous person has not seen these films.

Some stuff from the previous thread:

 Imposter101 wrote:
Alien, Aliens, Predator, Predator 2, and Predators.

You can skip AVP, AVP Requiem, Alien3 and Alien 4.

Also, I suggest you find the AVP comic omnibus somewhere.

I agree wholly with the above post, but also rather liked AVP:R while simultaneously seeing why everyone hated it.

 Alfndrate wrote:
RiTides, watch them all in our chronology and suffer through them like the rest of us

Another fair viewpoint.

 Bull0 wrote:
You can comfortably skip Alien Resurrection, and the AvP movies, but I wouldn't want to miss any of the others. Alien 3 gets unfair gak because of the plot, but it's a good film in its' own right - can't say the same for Resurrection which is just two hours of Joss Whedon comic book crap

Alien 3 is much maligned, but it has some good points as well. I especially liked Charles S. Dutton's role.



Ok, so have at it.

 Ouze wrote:
Please discuss the minutiae of the Aliens, Predator, and AvP films here. Recommended viewing order, etc. Although these are very old films please add spoiler tags to any major plot points because, again, at least one anonymous person has not seen these films.

Lol and much appreciated! The advice has been very helpful and I'm hoping to get initiated to the old movies this weekend!

And hey, I Have seen Prometheus! Which sort of counts... although I didn't really know there was an Aliens connection going in.

Prometheus definitely counts!

What was so bad about Aliens 3? I mean, I get the criticism, but it just seems that folks were pining for a movie to top Aliens 2.

I thought it was well done in the same sort of vein as the first one.

Here's a good discussion:

Aliens 3 as in the cut released on blu ray is a pretty cool movie, IMO.

 RiTides wrote:

 Ouze wrote:
Please discuss the minutiae of the Aliens, Predator, and AvP films here. Recommended viewing order, etc. Although these are very old films please add spoiler tags to any major plot points because, again, at least one anonymous person has not seen these films.

Lol and much appreciated! The advice has been very helpful and I'm hoping to get initiated to the old movies this weekend!

And hey, I Have seen Prometheus! Which sort of counts... although I didn't really know there was an Aliens connection going in.

It's in the last scene... similar to this:



Well, there's many more, but it'd be very spoilerish to spill it now for you.

I have never seen Alien 3, probably due to my progenitors feeling that it was a gak movie and saved me the trouble (wtf were they thinking with Alien: Resurrection? ) and I've never seen Predators (though that Berserker Predator looks fething awesome!), and I haven't watched Prometheus because I don't feel like sitting there watching Michael Fassbender slowly turn me gay for him (and Guy Pierce is in that film, my sexuality it's doomed!), also didn't have the cash to see it.

With that being said, I have been pouring over the various Alien, Predator, and AvP wikis today reading everything I can. Which might be a better way to ingest these films instead of seeing them. But seriously, go watch Alien and Aliens, and anything with Predator in it (especially the Predator vs Batman fan made film)

The Aliens graphic novels are top notch as well...

I have decided not to say who because I don't want to embarass RiTide

Hahahahaha

But no I kid. Aliens was a great action adventure film with a splash of horror and Alien is also a good film... The rest of the Alien franchise not so much. Predator and Predator 2 were okay movies but I love the character. Predators was an enjoyable enough return to the them.

AvP is an idea I love. They are cool characters too pair off against one another. I liked the first film but it was far from spectacular. To me the greatest failure of AvP though was to set it in our day and age. A remake of Aliens with Predator thrown in as an additional antagonist would be a cool movie if done right. I liked the shooter that was released a couple years back, as wonky as its controls were.

If you can get the quadrilogy or special edition version from somewhere, after you see Aliens check out how they did the animations for the queen.

Also here is another video showing how an effect was done which you may want to safe for after as well.



Also, make sure for Aliens, you catch the Special Edition. There were some scenes cut from older versions that I think are totally essential to the story (though I guess Mr. Cameron disagreed), and some that are less essential but still enormously influential, such as the Sentry Gun scene.

True Cool Story Bro: The first time I saw Aliens, it was a WPIX movie of the week. They cut some of it for violence so to pad it out they added in some other scenes that were dropped theatrically: the Sentry Guns, Burke briefing Ripley... what she missed, and the order that was relayed to some settlers. Anyway, it came out on VHS after that and those scenes were again gone. I would talk to people about it, and they had no idea wtf I was talking about. They existed on laserdisc, but who the hell owned a laserdisc player? No one I knew, the discs were $90.

Anyway, I never felt such vindication as I did when Aliens SE was finally released on DVD, and no, I was not crazy

 Ouze wrote:
They existed on laserdisc, but who the hell owned a laserdisc player? No one I knew, the discs were $90.

The feth is a laserdisc? Something from the stone age?

Edit: Jesus this thing is huge!


Seriously you could use that to cut someone in half.

Second Special Edition of Aliens. The extra scenes are fun. I understand why Cameron cut them (3 hours was long for the LotR films) but seeing them when you can relax in your own home is great.

Aliens was the first R rated film I ever saw and one of the earliest films I remember seeing (apparently I loved Bambi but I don't remember it XD). It and Starship Troopers inspired my love of Scifi.

 whembly wrote:
http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3142698/alien-3-revisited-why-its-not-so-bad-and-why-killing-newt-and-hicks-is-a-good-thing/

The blog doesn't do a good job of arguing for killing Hicks and Newt; it just says that assuming everything else about Alien 3, having Hicks and Newt around wouldn't work. But the usual argument is that Alien 3 should have been a completely different film -- i.e., one that involved Hicks and Newt.

 whembly wrote:
The Aliens graphic novels are top notch as well...

Yes, there are worse ways to spend $18.

The 4 shot + 0 book collection is amazing, and far better than any of the AVP movies they wound up making.

Also, surprisingly excellent: the Predator vs Batman comic. It was super dark, and the mood was amazing. Unfortunately after that they kind of whored the franchise out, and not a single subsequent crossover comic I read was any good, this includes Predator vs Batman 2 and 3 (the last was truly odious).




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Alfndrate wrote:

 Ouze wrote:
They existed on laserdisc, but who the hell owned a laserdisc player? No one I knew, the discs were $90.

The feth is a laserdisc? Something from the stone age?

Edit: Jesus this thing is huge!


Seriously you could use that to cut someone in half.

The best part of this thread so far was someone not knowing was a laserdisc was.

Man I feel kinda old now

Watch them all.

IMO the Alien 4 is the "worst" but it still has some great scenes and there aren't any film franchises that are producing "great" films by their 4th incarnation.

Predator 2 is the weaker link out of the 3 films but it did a lot to expand the predator culture and most importantly it tied the two settings together. While it was kinda meh it added some cool stuff.

The AVP stuff I loved, I know a lot of people find issues with the films but I really liked the concepts they explored with the first AVP and the second was like a godzilla fight complete with an exploding power plant. They dialed down some of the graphic elements but I think that the pg-13 rating is more of a result of film standards getting more lax over time as opposed to having less violence. Had the films been out 5-10 years earlier it would have been a solid R rating.

Honestly I love them all and I think every flm has something worth watching for, don't let the die hard fans dissaude you from checking out a particular film.

 Ouze wrote:
The best part of this thread so far was someone not knowing was a laserdisc was.

Man I feel kinda old now

Shall we continue to make you feel old? Wrath of Khan and all of the Star Wars films are all older than me, and Fraggle Rock started and ended before I was born.

I still contend Minnie the Moocher was the height of songwriting ever.

Prometheus, Alien, Aliens, Predator, Predator 2, and Predators.

I LOVE the Alien series, and Predator being another favorite. I remember watching Alien and Aliens on a Halloween night when I was younger, and it's stuck with me ever since. As for their respective EU, I've read AvP: Prey, and it was really cool. The other one...I can't recall the name of, but it was very similar to Predators - humans were captured and taken to a "hunting world." It was...alright. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone, though . I also had a Batman vs. Predator graphic novel, but that went missing a loooong time ago

Edit - Predators, not AVP:R. Whoops!

Alien 3 is a good film with a phenomenal cast, the unreleased cut (ox not dog) is even better as it takes time to explore the religion aspects.

It falls foul of not being what the 3rd movie in the series should have been, the Earth War, the fall of our home and civilization to the xenomorphs. It's a great shame they didn't go with it.

But for all of that, it's still pretty good.

4 was a very mixed bag for me, I loved Ripley as a new neutral evil hybrid, she really enjoyed acting it as well, the movements and such. But the weird organic (very little biomechanic) feel of the xenomorphs, coupled with the simply ridiculous hybrid baby monster and some really gakky acting from others makes it a cumbersome filler movie, very very low on horror, which was what I always wanted from these movies.

I may well like Predator 2 more than Predator, especially the robocop-esque biting satire on the decaying city and Busey at his best... They are both truly great movies though.

Predators... meh, filler again, the new predators were daft, uncool things that were purposely overpowered and didn't stick to the predator's rules, the thing that made the predator cool. You have no idea how much I was willing the 'original' predator in the movie climatic fight to win and knew that because we were introducing new monsters, that wasn't going to happen.

AVP...

They should have gone with the graphic novels with Machiko.

Also, did anyone else notice the second film was so damned dark you couldn't see what was happening half the time. Still, it had some allusions to what an earth war might have been like, so there's that. Again the 'new monster' was stupid, the predalien was a daft gimmick monster that broke the reproductive 'rules' for the aliens (also, dreadlocks, wtf?!?) and so annoyed me.

Alien and Aliens are among if not my actual favorite movies ever. Both amazing and both so different.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 whembly wrote:
The Aliens graphic novels are top notch as well...

Some, not others.

Deadliest of the Species had phenomenal cover art, but the story it's self was utterly bonkers.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:


Also, did anyone else notice the second film was so damned dark you couldn't see what was happening half the time. Still, it had some allusions to what an earth war might have been like, so there's that. Again the 'new monster' was stupid, the predalien was a daft gimmick monster that broke the reproductive 'rules' for the aliens (also, dreadlocks, wtf?!?) and so annoyed me.

I was so pumped for that movie...and then my heart was broken because you could never tell what the frak was ACTUALLY going on in the fight scenes. So bummed.

I liked avp reqium,

dopping off a bunch of people in the forest to hunt them?

awesome!

could have been done a bit better at parts, but meh, was better then the earlier ones in a lot of ways I feel.

or am i thinking of predators...

Alien, Aliens and Aliens 3 were all great, though I can see why people didn't like the ending of Aliens 3.

Alien Resurrection was unfortunately played too camp.

Predator was great. Predator 2 was pretty good.

Aliens versus Predators, the one in the Antarctic, I liked a lot more than most people seemed to. I think there are two more AVP films after that, which are rather shonky and forgettable.

Haven't seen Prometheus.

There are only two AvP films overall.

Not so much a fan of the Predator series, but Alien and the sequels I loved.

I'd also recommend reading the screenplay for Alien 3, which centers around Hicks - I think I had a link somewhere...

Ah, here we go:

http://www.awesomefilm.com/script/Alien3.txt

Of all the films, Aliens was my favourite - Shame the colonial marines game sucked!

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Alien 3 is a good film with a phenomenal cast, the unreleased cut (ox not dog) is even better as it takes time to explore the religion aspects.

It falls foul of not being what the 3rd movie in the series should have been, the Earth War, the fall of our home and civilization to the xenomorphs. It's a great shame they didn't go with it.

Wait, what? The scenario for the third movie I've seen floating around webspace was nothing like what you've just described...?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kilkrazy wrote:
Alien, Aliens and Aliens 3 were all great, though I can see why people didn't like the ending of Aliens 3.

Alien Resurrection was unfortunately played too camp.

Predator was great. Predator 2 was pretty good.

Aliens versus Predators, the one in the Antarctic, I liked a lot more than most people seemed to. I think there are two more AVP films after that, which are rather shonky and forgettable.

Haven't seen Prometheus.

The one in the Antartic had too many obvious flaws and holes in it for me to enjoy. I suggest doing a lot of drugs before watching it.

The one in that rural AMURICAH stereotypical town was fun in a campy way, but it reminded me way too much of an X-files episode. Like, a good 20% of the movie was absolutely identical.

The one about the people being abducted on another planet was just terrible. In quality, I'd compare it to the G.I. Joe movies, if I wasn't too ashamed to admit I've seen the G.I. Joe movies.

Prometheus, I didn't like much, but despite all its flaws, it was still a much better movie than all three AvPs.

 Dark Apostle 666 wrote:
Not so much a fan of the Predator series, but Alien and the sequels I loved.

I'd also recommend reading the screenplay for Alien 3, which centers around Hicks - I think I had a link somewhere...

Ah, here we go:

http://www.awesomefilm.com/script/Alien3.txt

Uh, I've only read the opening scene, and it seems to be pretty cool! Curious to read the rest!

Regarding Alien 3 and Resurrection, Jim Sterling has a few interesting things to say for both movies, well worth the watch:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/movie-defense-force/6678-Alien-3

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/movie-defense-force/7568-Alien-Resurrection

I believe there was plans for 3 AVP movies the last of which was going to be set around the time of the first Alien film and involve: Aliens, Predators and Colonial Marines, which was meant to be the climatic part of the franchise, but ironically in their attempts to build up to it they made poor movies and thus didn't end up being able to make the final one with the actually good idea.

The first AVP has a certain charm about it and I would toats recomend seeing it.

AVP 2 is gak imo.

All the aliens movies are worth watching, they fall off a bit after the first one but remain entertaining in a way that defies more logic than the characters they are stocked with.