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That was a major sticking point with me. While differing armies may pay more or less for a given peice of equipment not errataing the points costs of other chapters transports and the chimera's and rhinos in DH and WH really stank. Obviously the argument "but then the book needs stuff downloaded to even be viable" argument comes into it which is a whole new headache!

What this rumour suggests to me - whether it's true or not - is that armies updated within the next few months - eg. Necrons, Tau & Sisters - could be rendered 'weak' by the introduction of a new edition after their release, which was one of KK's constant 'fears' for the idea of Tau being updated. Obviously however this depends on how big a change 6th edition is, and I don't think a large change is needed or going to happen as I believe 5th is possibly the best so far.

Nonetheless, I think a Black Templar/Chaos Daemons box set (AOBR style), is a bit weird. I think they're both a bit... 'fluid' and movement orientated and non-uniform armies to work with such a sprue design, unlike Ultramarines IMHO. But it worked in a way for the Orks, so you never know.
However, surely if the Chaos Daemons are in the boxed set, this could mean PLASTIC PLAGUEBEARERS?

Plastic bearers would definately be a nice addition! (assuming the price isnt made silly)

Urg...BT in the starter set. I love my templars, but I don't want to see them in the starter set, they had the spot light in 3rd edition. (When I started them) I don't see them as a starter army, and if they get new plastics, I don't want them to be snap togeather like in the starter set, unless they pump out some other plastic kits like BA and SW.

All in all, I do want my BT to get a new codex, but not at the point of seeing my templars become the new ultramarines, showing up with every new player... =\ (no hate with new players!)

OK, how did this "BT in the starter" nonsense get started? I really doubt GW is going to intentionally cut 95% of its starter sales to existing and aspiring Marine players by molding chapter-specific icons on starter box Marines.

lord_blackfang wrote:OK, how did this "BT in the starter" nonsense get started? I really doubt GW is going to intentionally cut 95% of its starter sales to existing and aspiring Marine players by molding chapter-specific icons on starter box Marines.

Probably the same way "BT and Sisters in the same dex!" nonsense gets started. Some poster who's full of bad ideas has one, and somebody else spreads it as rumor.

Honestly i think sisters will be first, over on Astronomican, they had pictures of Codex pages up, even showing an entry for Arbites.

Commisar Von Humps wrote:Honestly i think sisters will be first, over on Astronomican, they had pictures of Codex pages up, even showing an entry for Arbites.

To be fair though, we've seen them too and they were pretty much identified as fakes,

lord_blackfang wrote:OK, how did this "BT in the starter" nonsense get started? I really doubt GW is going to intentionally cut 95% of its starter sales to existing and aspiring Marine players by molding chapter-specific icons on starter box Marines.

like they did with the black reach box by putting smurf symbols on all the marines?

Just Dave wrote:

Commisar Von Humps wrote:Honestly i think sisters will be first, over on Astronomican, they had pictures of Codex pages up, even showing an entry for Arbites.

To be fair though, we've seen them too and they were pretty much identified as fakes,

Oh, my bad , didn't know.

But what about Tau? I heard they were coming almost right after necrons.

It's all right, can't know everything.

AFAIK, it's Necrons then touch and go between Sisters or Tau after them, but Kroothawk's the man to go to on such a matter...

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:

lord_blackfang wrote:OK, how did this "BT in the starter" nonsense get started? I really doubt GW is going to intentionally cut 95% of its starter sales to existing and aspiring Marine players by molding chapter-specific icons on starter box Marines.

like they did with the black reach box by putting smurf symbols on all the marines?

Wow, GW must have made a totally different starter just for you! Lucky!

Does this mean that sisters, tau, and necrons will be updated for at most one year before they become out of date again?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Just Dave wrote:
However, surely if the Chaos Daemons are in the boxed set, this could mean PLASTIC PLAGUEBEARERS?

Yes, but you'd only be able to get them in the starter kit. You know, so that the GW execs would have a good reason to stand on the balcony and cackle.

I actually hope the rumor on here about a Black Templar/Daemon starter kit is true. I'm sure it'll mean plastic plague bearers, probably plastic fiends, a plastic herald of sorts plus the new BT love (even though I really enjoy BT now with the FAQ and agree they don't need to be changed).

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:
like they did with the black reach box by putting smurf symbols on all the marines?

If by "putting smurf symbols on all the marines" you mean "put a decal sheet with Ultramarine iconography in addition to other Marines" then yes, they did!

You guys know that if BT are in the starter, they will:

A. Not have an chapter specific icons on them.

B. Be compatible models with all the other marine codexs.

But hey, the pretty picture on the front will be marines in black and white!

Brother SRM wrote:

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:
like they did with the black reach box by putting smurf symbols on all the marines?

If by "putting smurf symbols on all the marines" you mean "put a decal sheet with Ultramarine iconography in addition to other Marines" then yes, they did!

not on my set, my set had them sculpted on which made them hard to convert to other legions of mine

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:
not on my set, my set had them sculpted on which made them hard to convert to other legions of mine

The only Marines with sculpted on Ultramarines insignia are the ones in the painting kit - the little set of 5 Marines that came with a bunch of paint. The Marines in Black Reach have some sculpted on skulls and the like, but nothing resembling Ultramarines badges.

Ah yes, the AoBR painting set, where you got the 5 space marines. I never bought that kit and I myself have gone through 3 AoBR boxes.

I honestly can't see BTs in the new starter kit, I mean all you do is undercoat the miniature black and throw some deneb stone on the tabards and that's it for a basic colour scheme. Painting the black decently with highlights is more tedious than throwing blue and gold around to paint your first marine. They're really trying to cut down on the time spent on intro lessons so they can sell more boxes if this rumour has any truth behind it

However I am very interested to see what GW has produced for BTs, lots of tabards and crosses to go around!

Ehsteve wrote:I honestly can't see BTs in the new starter kit, I mean all you do is undercoat the miniature black and throw some deneb stone on the tabards and that's it for a basic colour scheme. Painting the black decently with highlights is more tedious than throwing blue and gold around to paint your first marine. They're really trying to cut down on the time spent on intro lessons so they can sell more boxes if this rumour has any truth behind it

However I am very interested to see what GW has produced for BTs, lots of tabards and crosses to go around!

GW will continue to push the Ultramarines at new players regardless of whether or not BTs are on the box for a new starter set, and since the starter boxes will not have any pre-molded icons on them the transfer sheet will continue to contain a good variety of other chapters to use.

As for Daemons, I would love to see them in a starter kit. The fact that I cannot get any sort of boxed deal on daemons is what keeps me from playing them, not counting websites where I can get a bulk deal for a decent rate.

btemple0 wrote:As for Daemons, I would love to see them in a starter kit. The fact that I cannot get any sort of boxed deal on daemons is what keeps me from playing them, not counting websites where I can get a bulk deal for a decent rate.

The thing that prevents them from getting a boxed deal is also what makes them a poor choice for a starter set: they're made up of four different sub-factions with almost nothing in common. You'd be better off with a broader mono-God themed force like Plague Marines + Cultists + Plaguebearers, but that can't happen unless GW combines CSM and Daemons into a single Chaos army again.

lord_blackfang wrote:OK, how did this "BT in the starter" nonsense get started?

This (supported by the BoK rumour):

ghost21 wrote:From what I heard BT will be in the new starter box ala Black Reach, quickly followed by their dex, as I really don't collect marines I kinda usually skip those meetings.(...)
The order I heard was BT just after 6th.

Malakai wrote:Is there a rumour that BT are going to be in the 6th ed box?

Yup, with Daemons apparently (odd choice I thought).

Malakai wrote:How reliable is this rumour? I know that anything this far out is sketchy, but maybe on a scale of 1-10?

I'd give it a 7, but remember I don't usually pay attention to Marines.(...)
The "prototypes" that a few people saw were BT and Daemons. I only report what I see annd hear.

Just Dave wrote:AFAIK, it's Necrons then touch and go between Sisters or Tau after them, but Kroothawk's the man to go to on such a matter...

The jury is still out what's next after Necrons. Necrons-Sisters-Tau-BT would be a plausible mix of Imperial/Xeno though, updating 3rd edition Codices first and giving Mat Ward enough time to write the next SM Codex.

Ehsteve wrote:I honestly can't see BTs in the new starter kit, I mean all you do is undercoat the miniature black and throw some deneb stone on the tabards and that's it for a basic colour scheme.

Standards are the same, but many elites and HQ look different. Looking at Space Hulk and the Fantasy starter, crazy things are possible now with moulds.

I was wondering if BT would be in the 6th starter, seems to fit with other rumours we've heard. Either way new Templar stuff is very cool news even if it's not until next year!

Phill kelly is going to write the Bt codex, so that should be great oh and new units added for bt as well. by Jared van Kell
Quote

A little but nothing solid. What I have heard.

- Phil Kelly is writing the Codex.
- More emphasis on the horde aspect of the army with lots of large units of Initiates and Neophytes.
- Emperors Champion is more in line with the company champion of the Grey Knights but is still 2 wounds. Gains preferred enemy against independent characters and monstrous creatures.

I will let you know as I hear more.



by Jared van Kell
Quote

Some additional bits.

- I forgot to mention the Rightous Zeal rule could be changing to be more along the lines of the Rage USR. Something along the lines of if they fail a Ld test then they are subject to Rage and must advance towards the nearest enemy unit. As yet the details are sketchy.
- All the current special characters (ie: Helbrect and Grimaldius) will remain. Also I had heard of an mention of a special character who is like the greatest of all of the Emperor's Champions and the greatest warrior in the Black Templars. I had heard mention of a bike mounted special character with a lance like weapon but I cannot confirm this yet.

Also I had heard of an mention of a special character who is like the greatest of all of the Emperor's Champions and the greatest warrior in the Black Templars.

Clearly this will be Matt Ward's contribution to the Codex.

What's the bet he takes down at least three Avatars, the second two after breaking his sword in the chest of the first?

dienekes96 wrote:The tears of the xenos players are delicious.

troll harder. you're bad at it.

*and off to the ignore list you go.

To be fair, complaining about too many marine codices when the release schedule has actually sped up in 5th compared to 4th ignores the fact that xenos releases haven't actually gone down.

The limiting factor for releasing new books isn't the books, or the rules. It's the models. And marine armies are cheap and easy. 75% of the models are plug and play (tacticals, rhino/predators/landraiders/etc, assault marines, devestators, scouts, dreadnoughts, terminators, bikes/attackbikes/scout bikes, etcetera)

So, whip up three to five plastic kits and voila! instant chapter codex! It worked for BA, who got the storm raven (shared with GK), furioso, death co, sang guard, and a Baal upgrade sprue. Wolves only got the wolf pack and wolf guard termies. Nilla marines got scout bikes, the drop pod, and the redeemer. Compare that to dark eldar, which got warriors, wyches, hellions, bikes, raider, and ravager. Now nids got hosed, hard, but IG also got two command boxes, new sentinel, recut Russ and Chimera, valkyrie, manticore, and hellhound. Additionally, there has been many new releases for Orks, a few for demons, and even a few new Eldar kits all in fifth.

4th edition only saw five non-marine books: nids, tau, eldar, orks, and demons, compared to nilla, black templar, dark angels, and Chaos. And demons is for intents a fifth edition book. Now, in those four releases, it's not like the xenos armies got a ton of love in plastic. Nids got the fex and new stealers. Tau got the piranha, stealths, and the skyray. Eldar got the wraithlord, warwalkers, dire avengers with the codex, and the platform and serpent at some point. Orks got recut boys, new trukk, bikes, and lootas in fourth. (plenty more came out later). Demons only got 'letters and demonettes (while they got hounds, crushers, horrors, and the prince in fifth).

So, while they're doing a lot of SM books in fifth, it's not that many more, they're doing mroe books, each with mroe kits, and the non-marines are getting deeper ranges with each release (with the notable exception of nids).

^This.

Also as an Off-topic note, News&Rumors is not the place to be wishlisting things, although I may be guilty of doing that from time to time, I do know that the wishlisting does cause a thread to get locked. In other words, if a rumor does not include your faction and you cannot contribute to the discussion, find somewhere else to post, so the discussion may continue.

Edit: changed my wording.

Who also has that weird feeling that the BTs will also become Codex Astartes compliant.......

Either way, some decent stuff is coming out within the next year or so!!