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I want to try something more aggressive. I am no fan of gun lines whatsoever. My favourite play style is in tricks, mobility, using movement phase to win and unit synergy. However, I have little experience with more proactive Tau lists, so maybe some of you can help.
Excluding the experimental Y'vahra, here are the units I am interested in:
Mark'O
Fire Warriors in Fishes
Riptides
Remora Drones
Sensor Towers
Possibly Stealth Suits for that Homing Beacon
Crisis

Any idea about general tactics and loadouts or any hints in general? Tau is my favourite army and I would hate to leave them in favour of DE for a more engaging, demanding and proactive playstyle. This is about competitive play. I highly appreciate filthy cheese moves.

Thanks

Tuppence worth: Tetras are awesome (and come with acute senses, outflank and homing beacons). It sounds like you want to play a more mobile, dynamic Tau. These really help with that.... Fire Warriors in Fish are dull and innefective. Not cheap enough or killy enough to be any cop in terms of obsec spam.

The enclaves are your friend here

I'd use Tetras instead of Stealth suits for Homing Beacons, and they already are markerlight sources.

Filth of the filthest: Triptide. 1 from Farsight Enclaves with HBC, VT, EWO and ECPA, the other 2 with IA and EWO (FnP if you want)

Broadsides with missiles to deal with everything AV12 less


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 Kholzerino wrote:
Tuppence worth: Tetras are awesome (and come with acute senses, outflank and homing beacons). It sounds like you want to play a more mobile, dynamic Tau. These really help with that.... Fire Warriors in Fish are dull and innefective. Not cheap enough or killy enough to be any cop in terms of obsec spam.

In fact, they can be. Give sensor spines to devilfishes (so you can stick to anywhere), put an ethereal in one and leave it inside,while the FWs deploy and shoot. Flat out the devifishes and stop the enemy charging your FW's

If it's not an eldar Jetbike I want it to kill stuff. Firewarriors in Devilfish fall between. But thats just my opinion.

I want to try and experiment with Sensor Towers as well. They will eithet draw fire or just stand there. They also have a small ML potential, can be a beacon and allows re-rolling 1s to hit.

I really like Tetras, but I am running low on FA slots. Tournaments usually do not allow multi CAD around here. I value Remora Drones fairly high since they have ML in the sky and good dakka as well Shrouded when in cover and hovering.
How do I get ML then? I wanted a Mark'o, but if I take Tetras, I will take two. Do I run Drones in a Crisis team? It seems like a massive target to shoot, if you ask me.

As for the Crisis, what setups would you recommend?

I'd suggest ditching the Remoras. They're not that competitive when Barracudas are better and ML sources are more vital to Tau.

For Crisis, never put different weapons in a model. Hve units with Melta, others with plasma (less necessary if Marines aren't a nuisance in your meta) and others with flamers. Burst Cannons are 'meh' when you have HYMP broadsides and fire warriors

Tetras also have a homing beacon that unlike the marine version, can be used as soon as the Tetras enters play (it has scount so you can outflank).

So a good tactic mobility wise is:

Outflank tetra ---> Precision Deepstrike (no scatter within 6" of the tetra) Crisis suits/riptides/stealth suits inter the perfect position to take out a key tank/unit/grab objective ---->win

How would you recommend running Crisis. Frankly, I have no clue which weapons are worth it at all besides the usual Deathrain and dual melta drops. I am also considering FSE, meaning that I have no Buffmander (most tournaments here ban multi cad).

Ideas how to maximise on Crisis without them seeming like a liability compared to Broadsides?

 Nilok wrote:
My personally favorite with my army is my Deep Striking Scalpel squad.

I normally take a Buffmander to maximize their effectiveness and load them up with two dual plasma suits and a dual fusion with target lock (add target locks to the plasma suits and gun drones for everyone to threaten three units a turn).

This unit design is for taking out problematic units in my opponent's army that my Kroot Snipers or Fire Warriors can't handle with more reliability than my Hammerheads or Riptides. By Deep Striking, they can go after their critical backfield targets that Missilesides sometimes can't reach and their jump move can (hopefully) move them away from danger.

This units usually gets about 5-6 wounds that ignore cover/armor for taking out an elite unit and 2 Melta tank hunter shots for a vehicle.

The way this unit is set up, it rarely needs any markerlight support and is very self contained, allowing your markerlights to be used elsewhere. Every game I have played with this guy, he has been MVP.

I run FSE with multiple scalpel squads, sans buffmander.

Farsight's useful if you have the HQ slot, if only for cheeky precision DS. Plus melta sword.

Just make sure your own backfield is strong enough to back that up if you go en masse.

Have you considered a Sun shark?

Would a pure Crisis + Riptide list hold water? Because I am having trouble including Riptides + Crisis + Markerlights + Firewarriors in FSE or TE.
Maybe I simply fail at list building. I am having a lot of trouble deciding or generally seeing what load out Crisis would need, because it seems to me like no setup is as efficient as Broadsides unless supported by Buffy, of which I can only have one (or none if FSE).
How many Crisis would be necessary in list and what roles would they take? I am a bit confused with FSE to be fair :O


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Well, of cause the Fire Support Cadre is always an option, but I am not sure how this many static elements (6 Broadsides) will measure up in a FSE army that is all about run and gun. I am afraid they will be blown off the board if I do not go first.

Don't mean to hijack the OP's thread but since a lot of people are talking about tetras, how many are generally taken at 1850? I'm aware it depends on how much marker light support you need, but I'd probably be most interested in a suit army (farsight/Riptides) and was looking for a general number of tetras

I like the OP's army idea of high mobility

 Trade_Prince wrote:
Would a pure Crisis + Riptide list hold water? Because I am having trouble including Riptides + Crisis + Markerlights + Firewarriors in FSE or TE.
Maybe I simply fail at list building. I am having a lot of trouble deciding or generally seeing what load out Crisis would need, because it seems to me like no setup is as efficient as Broadsides unless supported by Buffy, of which I can only have one (or none if FSE).
How many Crisis would be necessary in list and what roles would they take? I am a bit confused with FSE to be fair :O


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well, of cause the Fire Support Cadre is always an option, but I am not sure how this many static elements (6 Broadsides) will measure up in a FSE army that is all about run and gun. I am afraid they will be blown off the board if I do not go first.

Crisis Teams have low durability for thirty points (good fire power though). This makes them struggle as ttroops. Which need durability to hold objectives.

Agreed with Thaylen.

I wish Crisis Suits had the option for 2+ armor (outside iridium), T5, or were only 1W but cheaper and more suits per unit. I almost never get to use both wounds, its always they got splattered by a big gun/axe or the volley of fire was way too rapid and pen'd my armor so my 6W + however many drones i had left were wiped out anyway.

I bring one because its my marker unit w/ commander buffy. Outside that i avoid the crap out of them (plus ugly model...ughh)

I almost prefer Stealth Suits, even though theyre a little expensive, but i say "almost" because they lack weapon options and drone bubble options.

What options are left then, beyond static elements and mech? I feel that the choice is getting pretty limited now.

If you don't take any Crisis bodyguards in a FSE list then you can take some of "The Eight" farsights special group of commanders/subcommanders that come with fixed wargear.

SubCommander Torchstar has 2flamer,TL,DC,2marker drone,Ms3,NSJ for only 154 pts.
I usually stick her in a maxed out HYMP broadside group with target locks and 4Missle/4Marker drones. This gives your 3 broadsides Ignores cover and they can all shoot at different targets while your drones provide BS5 ML's and 8 missles on their target.. Missle drones there to tank wounds from your Broadsides/ML drones. This is a stationary Marko squad on steroids. I use this combo in my All crisis suit lists to provide an anchor and 36" safe zone. Anything that gets within range of this squad is going to explode.


Edit: heres a list of "The Eight".. they all use commander stats besides the broadside/riptide, all their points are the same as 85 + systems. I like them because they give FSE access to the Tau Empire sig systems

Bravestorm- iridium battlesuit,PR,flamer,stim, 2gun drones, onager

Brightsword- TLFB,ATS,stim,shield drone,fusion blades,warscaper drone

Broadside Ob'Lotai- TLHYMP,TLSMS,velo,2missle drone, seeker missle

Arra'kon- PR,CiB,AFP,CDS,2gun drones,RiF

Sha'vastos-PR,flamer,shield gen,VRT,2gun drone,PEN

Torchstar- 2flamer,TL,DC,2marker drone,Ms3,NSJ

O'Vesa-HIA,TLFB,EWO,stim,2SMdrone,ECPA

Dioxalyn wrote:
If you don't take any Crisis bodyguards in a FSE list then you can take some of "The Eight" farsights special group of commanders/subcommanders that come with fixed wargear.

SubCommander Torchstar has 2flamer,TL,DC,2marker drone,Ms3,NSJ for only 154 pts.
I usually stick her in a maxed out HYMP broadside group with target locks and 4Missle/4Marker drones. This gives your 3 broadsides Ignores cover and they can all shoot at different targets while your drones provide BS5 ML's and 8 missles on their target.. Missle drones there to tank wounds from your Broadsides/ML drones. This is a stationary Marko squad on steroids. I use this combo in my All crisis suit lists to provide an anchor and 36" safe zone. Anything that gets within range of this squad is going to explode.


Edit: heres a list of "The Eight".. they all use commander stats besides the broadside/riptide, all their points are the same as 85 + systems. I like them because they give FSE access to the Tau Empire sig systems

Bravestorm- iridium battlesuit,PR,flamer,stim, 2gun drones, onager

Brightsword- TLFB,ATS,stim,shield drone,fusion blades,warscaper drone

Broadside Ob'Lotai- TLHYMP,TLSMS,velo,2missle drone, seeker missle

Arra'kon- PR,CiB,AFP,CDS,2gun drones,RiF

Sha'vastos-PR,flamer,shield gen,VRT,2gun drone,PEN

Torchstar- 2flamer,TL,DC,2marker drone,Ms3,NSJ

O'Vesa-HIA,TLFB,EWO,stim,2SMdrone,ECPA

I hope your not playing the missile drones as BS5 as they cant benefit from the drone controller so would still be BS2.

Okay, I have come up with something that, in theory, I could live with. It is not as complex as DE, but it still might offer a fairly interesting experience:



My main concern are the Broadsides. If I am not going first, the enemy long ranged guns will tear them apart. I would love to squeeze in a few Missile Drones as ablative wounds, but that would mean dropping either the mono suits or a skyray. Neither sounds like a good idea.

Any idea how to improve this army? Or maybe different ideas altogether?

 Messy0 wrote:

I hope your not playing the missile drones as BS5 as they cant benefit from the drone controller so would still be BS2.

I might consider dropping a Skyray. I really like this alpha strike with the Seeker Missiles though. Not too worries about flying units, to be fair.
But wouldn't a single Skyray be too much of a target? Every Lascannon in the game will shoot it. Okay, that may be an advantage in itself, since no one is attacking the Broadsides or Riptides, but still.

Maybe it's just me, but I always find my Broadsides underperforming. They're great in Dawn of War, but in football field or Vanguard they can struggle. Opponents are also universally terrified of them, so they're often target priority 1.

I usually run my HS with triple Skyray. Rarely let's me down. They're cheap, provide ancillary marker support, check the AA box and give me a decent alpha strike if necessary.

I also think an underrated HS option is 9 sniper drones if you bring an Ethereal.

Fire Support Cadre has Tank Hunter and PE (SM), which makes them ideal for busting armour and intercepting pods.
Usually I would agree about Broadsides not being all that great, but with Tank Hunter and the lack of good missile spam options in the FSE (read: no buffmander for Deathrain Crisis), I think they can do well.

Haven't played much Tau yet, but even 1 drone (usually 2) on my FBx2 Crisis Suit deep striker has been invaluable.

Bharring wrote:
Haven't played much Tau yet, but even 1 drone (usually 2) on my FBx2 Crisis Suit deep striker has been invaluable.

What purpose would they have?

More likely to deep strike into fusion range/LOS, slightly less likely to mishap, and the first hit isn't on the Suit, so low-ROF s8+ aren't as perfect for killing it.

I missed the title of the thread, somehow. Just meant to lurk. I can't speak/don't care to speak to competitive builds.

Well, going over the list you mentioned:

Mark'o-solid pick, one of the best support units around. but yo gotta know when and where to use him.

Fire Warriors in Fishes-AKA "fish of fury" tactics. not top tier, mostly because the fish is lousy, but its decent. requires an ethreal for the storm of fire though.

Riptide-can't go wrong. the HBC reptide is pretty good, the IA riptide is absurdly OP (that upgrade is a no-brainer, take it always unless you are in enclaves and plan on taking the ECPA relic)

Remoras-not very good, but a barrel of fun. the more you got, the stronger the are. a pack of 5 will cost a fortune in points, but will make pretty much anything else in the air have a very bad day (unless they got alot of AV12)

Sensor towers-unfortunatly, not great. cost too much for an effect too little.

Stealths-as said, tetras provide better beacons. stealth suits in general are supbar, but workable is you put effort into it.

Crisis suits-they were the workhorse of the tau before riptides, and now they are "just" good. anything you need done, they can do. enclaves wil allow you to spam them like no tommorow, just accept a model count lower than GK if you go that path.

Low model count is my middle name

Any more opinions on the 1850 list I posted a few posts further up?


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 luke1705 wrote:
Don't mean to hijack the OP's thread but since a lot of people are talking about tetras, how many are generally taken at 1850? I'm aware it depends on how much marker light support you need, but I'd probably be most interested in a suit army (farsight/Riptides) and was looking for a general number of tetras

I like the OP's army idea of high mobility

I mostly see two units, but mainly because the last FA slot is taken. But two is a solid number in most lists as long as other ML sources are available.

at 1850, I'd take 2 units of 3 tetras.

Here is a version of a 1850 list that I actually like a lot. Have a peak:


It does not use the Formation like the last list. However, it has now spare points for Drones on the Broadsides to give them much needed durability. A third Riptide has been added (I opted for a third IA, because I did not have enough points to get in a ECPA for a HBC). Two Skyrays are still here for redundancy, missile alpha strike and anti-air.
It has the low model count that I like in order to get real personal with the army, meaning giving everyone a name a back story and his own custom marking. Nothing says 'elite rogue trader strike force' like a few guys with mechs kicking arses in the name of profit (and sometimes the Emperor).

Thoughts on the list?