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Made in us
Stalwart Tribune






An exarch is born when an eldar can no longer remove their war mask.

A warlock is a seer who has once walked the warrior's path, when battle comes they go back to their former shrine and are granted a unique helmet by the shrine's exarch and then they don their war mask.

Farseers (depending on the current fluff) are those on the path of the seer but can no longer turn away.

So what happens when a warlock can no longer separate his seer self from his war mask. They are now walking two paths, they may even be lost down both (making an assumption that some warlocks are already lost down the path of the seer and will one day advance to the status of farseers). I can imagine that this would be necessarily a bad thing for the craft world. Perhaps they would serve as an advisor to the autarchs or farseers as exarchs and other seers do. Perhaps there are shrine's dedicated to this aspect of Khaine's glory, there have been a few aspects mentioned here and there that have never been elaborated on.

Mostly this is just curiosity but I am considering a modeling project, maybe doing a warlock council modding from a dire avenger base. Maybe add them to my Iyanden, perhaps with the collapse of so many aspect shrine's and so few warriors left warlocks are now forced to form their own shrine's or rather than forced perhaps some warlocks merely succumbed to their war masks after their great loss. What would they be, no longer true warlocks, warseers? Red Seers (after the white seers that work with the harlequins, red to symbolize the bloody hand)?

On a second thought (running with Iyanden now) it's often the case that eldar are fairly adept at salvaging exarchs armor as some suits have even a dozen previous hosts. But when it's not a case of recovery but a case of a host (or lack thereof) are there other options. Does anyone else imagine spiritseers setting an exarchs armor's spirit stones into a wraithguard or wraithlord body (Iyanna Arienal had an exarch wraithlord bodyguard) I can imagine a new path forming from this, from so many ghost warriors being awake for so long (some fluff describes some wraithguard as being awake all the time now never returning to the infinity circuit) the path of the revenant, the shrine of the lost.

   
Made in gb
Courageous Space Marine Captain






Glasgow, Scotland

If the Warlock was already lost down the path to Seer, they wouldn't go back to their shrine for a Warmask. And they wouldn't be lost down that path. it's a metaphorical "can't remove" their war mask, in that they become so lost and focused on that one aspect, be it ambush warfare (Scorpions) or fiery destruction (Dragons). If they moved on to another path they wouldn't be focused on that Aspect enough to become lost to it.

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Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





If they did eventually get lost to an Aspect after becoming a Warlock, they wouldn't be a Warlock anymore.

Being "lost on a path" is inherently incompatible with being lost on any other path, as you aren't capable of walking any other path.

Its like being so obsessed with Song of Ice and Fire, that you do nothing else but read them. Perhaps Lord of the Rings could similarly drive you to obsession, but it can't happen because you aren't reading it - you're reading SoIaF.

For the Eldar, once obsessed in this way, it never ends. So they would spend the rest of their lives reading the series they picked up, never touching the other.
   
Made in us
Stalwart Tribune






I viewed the idea of the war mask as separate from the aspect itself, every aspect and the warlocks uses the war mask so I always figured that it was a general ritual. Also I never viewed exarchs as being lost on an aspect path as there is no such thing, they are but divisions of the path of the warrior. There's old fluff about exarchs with no shrine, wandering about never being part of one aspect. Reading Path of the Warrior I got the impression that exarchs were only focused on one shrine because that may be the only aspect they were trained in, or perhaps it was the shrine that called to them the most.

The war mask isn't a metaphor for being lost down the path exactly, the war mask is a descriptor of the eldar's ability to segment their mind and separate their destructive impulses from the rest of their mind. Now only aspect warriors are taught this act though many retain the ability to use it after leaving the path (old fluff talks about guardian officers who were once aspect warriors, autarchs, and warlocks). A warlock is not lost on on the path of the seer just walking it. When this seer is called to war she returns to (one of or the only) former aspect shrine where she dons her war mask and receives the warlock helm from the exarch there.

So what happens if the warlock succumbs to the destructive impulses in their own mind. Again in path of the warrior we see an exarch's birth as an aspect warrior succumbs not to his aspect training but just his war mask. He finds himself unable to segment hit him any longer and has now "fallen down the path".

The entire path system system is a metaphor for obsession, the war mask is a bit more literal involving a specific act of mental fortitude be it ceremonial or meditative. When a warlock dons her war mask and receives her helmet she is essentially walking two separate paths, she is a seer seer who is walking the path of the warrior.

I suppose if the warlock loses themselves in their war mask they could give up their seer training and simply surrender to a suit of exarch armor. But since there are exarchs who wander shrine to shrine obviously skills still carry with them. So could there be warlock exarchs, seers who dedicate themselves to Khaine. They say each aspect represents a facet of Khaine, Dire avengers are balance, Scorpions are brutal strength and stealth, fire dragons are destruction and consuming fire, and so on and so forth. So what about the Will of Khaine?

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





If they get lost on the Seer path, truly consumed with obsession, but in a warlike manner, I'm fairly sure that way leads to the Path of Damnation.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





I got the impression that they need to "compartmentalize" and focus quite a lot, and this is something all Eldar train to do in order to keep their emotions and desires in check.

I recall a story in the older books that mentions an Eldar who was gentle, literally would not hurt a fly while gardening (perhaps on his gardening "path"), turning into someone very different and violent when he put on his armour. Like an entirely different personality.

I don't think you can be walking two paths at the same time. I think it is more like when you pick up a path there is a lot of ritual and meditation involved, wherein you put the other paths down and lock them away. This is why it is so horrifying for Eldar to become lost on path, as all the other aspects of their personality will be locked away forever.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/05/13 01:09:25


 
   
Made in gb
Snord






Fairly certain Farseers are what happen when a warlock is lost on the path of the seer.

A warlock is the name given to anyone on the path of the seer who are capable of join war (aka, they have a war mask and so can wield a witchblade)

A farseer is what happens to those who get lost. The only farseers who go to war are the ones who once trod the path of the warrior, and so can use a witch blade and have a war mask.

So, to answer your question, someone lost on the path of the Seer is a Farseer. Someone on the path of the seer is a warlock.
Only farseers and warlocks who have trodden the path of the warrior at some point join battle. The rest stay on the craftworld and guide it, or learn to guide it.

For more in deapth explanation, I'd suggest reading the Path of the Seer by Gav Thorpe. Explains it all from a new warlock's perspective. Those who join the path of the seer don't do so to go to war as a warlock, it's just a necessary thing the eldar have to do to ensure victory and survival.

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Made in au
Anti-Armour Swiss Guard






Newcastle, OZ

The mask is a metaphor.

It refers to what shrinks call a "dissociative state" - it allows them to do unspeakable acts because "it wasn't me".

It also allows them to compartmentalise.

Being lost on the path means they can no longer separate the warrior from their true self. They hear nothing but the hot blood rushing through them, the call from Khaine.

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Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





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