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Not really sure about where to post it but still, I give it a try

For near a year, I build my IG army and after many friendly games, I will soon play at my FLGS against people I don't know. The "problem" is, my list is quite unorthodox, meaning I use artillery platforms from IA 1 2nd Edition as HS choices.

My friends can say these cannons are really really powerful when buffed correctly; It's 162pts 2 Earthshaker Cannon (120'' S9 AP3) with 5 crewmen each, T7 and 3+, and I generally give them a commissar/priest to boost their Ld so they can easily get orders from my CCS. As a result, I absolutely murder anything, from motojets to medium vehicules (IFire On My Target/Bring it Down orders) and I conceive it can be very annoying for my opponents. For extra cheese, I also sometimes bubble wrap them with priest+Conscripts squad, when I get the feeling to do so.

Tbh, I did not bought the FW Earthshaker batteries ; I converted two 1/32 WW2 German 88mm Flak Guns which are both more detailed and cheaper. Then I imagine the possible reactions of my next oponents facing a not-GW mini coming from a not-very-well-known book and dealing devastating firepower.

I want to highlight the fact that I never take more than one battery with two cannons, cause I'm not a WAAC and I simply don't have the minis. Haters could hate but, finally, I'm not doing anything illegal am I ?

Thanks for replies

Well if you ask the strictest of people, using anything that isn't GW is illegal in a game made by GW. The majority of people just want to play a game and are happy to do so against whatever you put on the table. It's not like you're saying the Diet Coke can is an Earthshaker and the Coke is a Medusa but the Pepsi can is three Deathstrikes. This falls under the 'rule of cool' and if you put work into these conversions and/or they look good and close enough, you're golden and shouldn't have to worry about it.

You might get complaints or astonishment for the first few games but expect people to put together hard counters to it once they are familiar with you and your units. Expect them to be little more than a distraction after your first few games because they probably aren't all that durable when properly targeted.

GW rules are not LAW

there is nothing illegal about playing with plastic men.....yet.....

You may be breaking LFG rules but thats your LFG.

As long as you run it by your opponent and they're cool with, I think you'll be fine.

Ok guys, thanks for feedback. I will make sure to inform my opponents about FW stuff and I'll check store rules about it.

I know they're not the panacea, but I find them really useful! Thanks

It's strong, yes. But it has weaknesses that tanks do not.

Poison /sniper shots and their likes decimate it, any semi competent melee unit will erase it on contact, etc.

Also considering the rules of barrage, minium range (of no less than 36) and LoS, any form of LoS blocking really hurts it's accuracy. And close enough it renders it's indirect fire option inactive. Considering just how immobile the platform is, that's a serious drawback on proper tables.

It's nasty, but fair enough.

I wouldn't care at all, this is what Outflanking is for.

I would just see if the 88's are about the same size as the actual Earthshaker. Or at least build them up to be the same size. You don't want to accidentally model for your own advantage.

I made three custom warbuggies the other day out of plasticard and cheap $2 toys. But before I made them I made sure they fit into the dimensions of the warbuggy (give or take) so at least it represented what size they really would be.

Proxy's are cool, if done right.

No problem with it here.

I run them all the time and they're the definition of a glass cannon. Get anything into hand to hand with them and they're toast.

They won't be allowed in any type of tournament setting. Other than that you'll still be facing the Forgeworldphobia that afflicts a large number of people. Keep your IA handy.

If someone hates you for outsmarting them at a strategy game well....


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 purplkrush wrote:
They won't be allowed in any type of tournament setting. Other than that you'll still be facing the Forgeworldphobia that afflicts a large number of people. Keep your IA handy.

Do they break tournament rules or do you mean because they aren't GW plastic, which I'm hoping less places care about if the conversion is good?

So long as I knew you were playing FW before we organised the game, and you were able to present legit hardcopy rules, it's no issue at all.

Other than that you'll still be facing the Forgeworldphobia that afflicts a large number of people. Keep your IA handy.

This.
That's what I think it's going to happen and honestly, it bothers me. I know the debate on FW legality has been done many times but in the age of formations and nonsensical stuff, I hope one would let me play my cannon like I want to.

So long as I knew you were playing FW before we organised the game, and you were able to present legit hardcopy rules, it's no issue at all.

Mmmh... That is a problem as my copy of the book is not really one ...

My group plays with FW and I'd play against your conversion so long as it looks reasonable and is similar in size to the FW pieces.

 RazgrizOne wrote:

So long as I knew you were playing FW before we organised the game, and you were able to present legit hardcopy rules, it's no issue at all.

Mmmh... That is a problem as my copy of the book is not really one ...

However, my group frowns on scribd copies of in-print rules and codecies.

Belly wrote:
So long as I knew you were playing FW before we organised the game, and you were able to present legit hardcopy rules, it's no issue at all.

the fact that you said "hard copy".... hahaha


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As long as it is similar for targeting no one should care

Four years ago, people had a reason to fear forgeworld. now with all the power that is on the board and in the standard GW codecis, it may actually be a refreshing force to go against.

Four years ago, people had a reason to fear forgeworld. now with all the power that is on the board and in the standard GW codecis, it may actually be a refreshing force to go against.

Sure! Throwing no cover saves 5'' plates at jetbikes could be refreshing and have a good surprise effect at first. After this, things would become different I guess. But I don't really care about power level, I play these cause I find them cool!

Illegal Ischmegal.... The point is you still have to get people to play you. And lets be honest: You're taking them to get earthshakers at 75 points a piece, instead of 125 like in the Astra Militarum book.

Perhaps you could play without the FW a couple of times in the gaming store, just to show people that you're a cool guy who doesnt drag in FW that is sometimes frowned upon, and with models you dont have?

Anyway. If you're worried you could meet reactions, I would do the following to reduce the flak:
1. Have the Imperial Armor book physically there. It relaxes a whole lot of people to actually see a published book with the rules.
2. Dont say you proxy the cannon, say that you "customized" it since you didnt like the model. It sounds nicer. In fact, if it looks anything like the original model, you probably wont have to bring it up, unless your oppponent does.
3. Have a second list ready if people wont play forgeworld.


Not liking FW comes from the fact that the rules seems half-cooked sometimes, with rules printed from the net etc.

The stuff is also ridiculously cheap. I brought a Daemos predator with 3 plasmacannon shots a turn for less than 120 points. Then I discovered that it was possible to take 3 of them. The opponent complained as his meqs was turned to slag for a few matches. It took me some time to understand that it was a dick move to bring something just because it had awesomsauce power. Kind of like if FW offered Heldrakes for 115 points apiece. So be humble and think through if you would have fielded these units if you had to pay codex prices for the same equipment.

Why are there so many words in this thread?

Do the models look very similar? If so it is fine. FW is basically universally accepted by anyone who plays regularly

1. Have the Imperial Armor book physically there. It relaxes a whole lot of people to actually see a published book with the rules.
2. Dont say you proxy the cannon, say that you "customized" it since you didnt like the model. It sounds nicer. In fact, if it looks anything like the original model, you probably wont have to bring it up, unless your oppponent does.
3. Have a second list ready if people wont play forgeworld.


Not liking FW comes from the fact that the rules seems half-cooked sometimes, with rules printed from the net etc.

The stuff is also ridiculously cheap. I brought a Daemos predator with 3 plasmacannon shots a turn for less than 120 points. Then I discovered that it was possible to take 3 of them. The opponent complained as his meqs was turned to slag for a few matches. It took me some time to understand that it was a dick move to bring something just because it had awesomsauce power. Kind of like if FW offered Heldrakes for 115 points apiece. So be humble and think through if you would have fielded these units if you had to pay codex prices for the same equipment.

Thanks for the 3 advices, saying it is a customization is a smart move. I think I'm going to play some games without FW to get known by my net gaming group and then, I'll bring my cannons.

Regarding the alternative list, I am from those who think FW is legal and if the FLGS does not prohibit it, I see no reason to refuse to play against it when it is used in a moderated manner in a list. Frankly, some new codecies from GW have also stuff one could qualified OP/undercosted and still, people play with it. FW has the 40k stamp, then it should be accepted as such.

TLDR: GW has made unbalanced codecies then, I guess FW is not going to change what people are used to.

Do the models look very similar? If so it is fine. FW is basically universally accepted by anyone who plays regularly

Yes they do. It's artillery platforms with a big gun on it. I even stuck an IG crew on it to show how I'm not completly screwing GW with my models.

I wouldn't care as long as your using current GW rules nothing from previous editions. The fact you put your own model together is awesome as long as its dimensions are similar it shouldn't matter mainly for side, front etc. for armor results but don't go into a GW official store with those the person working there will understandably ask you to not use those. But if your going to your local gaming club I don't think it will matter I've seen some pretty awesome conversions and hope to make my own sometime especially when I start guard.

i have no problem with this what so ever

but i do have one question for the OP, would you not get bored knowing that all of your games are a massacre and you have buffed up the key units so much you opponents will probably not be able to deal with it?

I know if i could smash every game it would bore the crap out of me.

If it's a similar profile, I wouldn't care.

 RazgrizOne wrote:
Not really sure about where to post it but still, I give it a try

For near a year, I build my IG army and after many friendly games, I will soon play at my FLGS against people I don't know. The "problem" is, my list is quite unorthodox, meaning I use artillery platforms from IA 1 2nd Edition as HS choices.

My friends can say these cannons are really really powerful when buffed correctly; It's 162pts 2 Earthshaker Cannon (120'' S9 AP3) with 5 crewmen each, T7 and 3+, and I generally give them a commissar/priest to boost their Ld so they can easily get orders from my CCS. As a result, I absolutely murder anything, from motojets to medium vehicules (IFire On My Target/Bring it Down orders) and I conceive it can be very annoying for my opponents. For extra cheese, I also sometimes bubble wrap them with priest+Conscripts squad, when I get the feeling to do so.

Tbh, I did not bought the FW Earthshaker batteries ; I converted two 1/32 WW2 German 88mm Flak Guns which are both more detailed and cheaper. Then I imagine the possible reactions of my next oponents facing a not-GW mini coming from a not-very-well-known book and dealing devastating firepower.

I want to highlight the fact that I never take more than one battery with two cannons, cause I'm not a WAAC and I simply don't have the minis. Haters could hate but, finally, I'm not doing anything illegal am I ?

Thanks for replies

Renegades are able to run ES cannons for 55pts each in their most current book. I think you are fine considering this.

Sometimes people in pick up games are blindsided when something's not from GW "prime" and is from Forgeworld instead. That being said, there's so many different releases from GW coming out all the time, I don't think a lot of people can even keep up with core GW releases!

Personally, I don't think you're doing anything wrong and I'd be happy to play against an army with Forgeworld units, even if they're not using the official models. Those sound like suitable proxies, without a doubt.

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Well if you ask the strictest of people, using anything that isn't GW is illegal in a game made by GW. The majority of people just want to play a game and are happy to do so against whatever you put on the table. It's not like you're saying the Diet Coke can is an Earthshaker and the Coke is a Medusa but the Pepsi can is three Deathstrikes. This falls under the 'rule of cool' and if you put work into these conversions and/or they look good and close enough, you're golden and shouldn't have to worry about it.

FW = GW though, ignorance has been the only thing that's let that fly for most of the time.

Not to turn this into a FW vs GW thread, but OP asks if we would hate him for that.

FW isnt in the codex though, so its kind of bonus or extra package. Some people really gets blindsided by it. Especially when taken in trios.

I took 3 Damocles predators (w/MoForge) against a Meq army. I didnt warn him, and he never wanted to play again with me.

Tbh I built my Thudd guns out of 4 batteries and some wheels, covered the lot in camo netting and some dkk artillery loader models and painted it up and no one at my local gw store, even the manager, has said anything.

With regards to the IA rules they are good, the arty is good, but no one minds playing against it I've found, theres always a lot more broken stuff in the other books.

Just let your opponent know before hand and they shouldn't mind!