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Good evening, dashing and unwashed highwaymen of the information superhighway!

So, for a whole host of reasons, I'm not buying any new plastic for a while. To celebrate a year in my job, I decided, however, to treat myself to an oddity I had been drooling over on a Japanese second hand website - this metal Zoanthrope. She's a bit dinged up here and there, and far from as menacing as she could be right now, not to mention, a far cry from her progeny Zoanthropes of the grim dark future of 2020. With this in mind, my initial plan was to turn her into a GSC patriarch.
To add a bit of trademark PoserMcBogus flair, I decided to try (possibly?) to add a halo of arms, like those often depicted on divine entities in Hindu/Buddhist/other asian devotional art. However, once I got this bad sucker in my hands, I realized...

...2nd ed minis were a little small. Anyone have any pictures of a patriarch either compared to this, or a space marine? Also, how big is the base?

...and the connection between the head and the torso is pretty dire. The pin that holds the head to the body is completely missing (and sanded off? I'm not sure how the original went together, as the mandibles weren't included, and I don't think I was born when this mini came out...), the female part completely filled with superglue, and the connection area as it is looks a bit vulnerable. If my beloved metal St. Celestine is anything to go by, this is going to just break and break and break.
Now, from what I've heard from other warhammer stuff (mostly LeakyCheese on Youtube) pinning is what I wanna do here.

But, as I'm already pinning...

And as I've been turning my hand to sculpting, with reasonable success...

And as I have some armor plates and stuff left over from my old OLD gaunts, I might try...

...sculpting a neck onto this mini, to compensate, in a single brilliant, signature McBogus stroke, to compensate for the size difference, for the lack of space for arms, and the neck connection point.

Can any more experienced modelers give me some pointers for this? Specifically, how I want to pin/skeleton the neck. ATM, I'm planning on trying to get a reasonably thick wire, and maybe have it work in tandem with some thinner ones for added stability, then drill out the female hole joint in the bottom of the head part, and then another on the shoulders (both for the main wire). Then I'm gonna bend the main wire into shape, followed by drilling holes for and fixing those thinner wires. After that, epoxy sculpt the rest of the neck, and then we all good. Right?

Thanks for looking, and I'm waiting anxiously for your guidance! Take care!

I am not familiar with the model besides your pictures (and I can't see much under the head) but...you shouldn't need more than a 1/16th strength wire for pinning. 1/16th is 16 gauge on other scales. I use this, bought from gardening/hobby style stores:
https://www.michaels.com/green-stem-wire-16-gauge-by-ashland/10345652.html

It is called stem wire and comes in various gauges. I use this one because it is easy to use a 1/16th drill bit, it fits it almost perfectly, and the coating sticks to super glue very easily. It is strong enough you will only need one wire. Now, drilling into lead with the bit is a tricky thing, but I've seen your work and think you have the skills. Both the head and body look capable of taking a decent depth hole, and this wire is strong enough it will not bend even if you wanted an inch long neck. Surround the wire with GS and your in business.
I also like the idea of an armored neck etc.
Hope this has helped a little. I look forward to seeing what you do. I do a lot of pinning and GS work (look in my gallery or here: so please if I might help, ask.
https://edwardmystcreations.weebly.com/sculpts1.html


PS: I have some warriors from the same generation...given I'm old, I bought them when they came out. Hideous and clunky...

You could extend the legs too for more height.

For pinning, get a powered drill. trying to drill metal using a pin vise is just awful. but be careful. slow and steady.

There's an assembly guide here, might help a bit? http://www.solegends.com/citcat1997/1997p085-00.htm - also, this one's so old it's one of the 40k models that came with a square base ^^

Seconding the power drill. I always use my dewalt multi-speed portable. Great control, the trigger can control speed, etc. Mini in a vice (with rubber grips), generally placed so I am drilling "downward" and can use the weight of the drill instead of pressure to do the work.

Cheers for all the replys, guys!

edwardmyst wrote:I am not familiar with the model besides your pictures (and I can't see much under the head) but...you shouldn't need more than a 1/16th strength wire for pinning. 1/16th is 16 gauge on other scales. I use this, bought from gardening/hobby style stores:
https://www.michaels.com/green-stem-wire-16-gauge-by-ashland/10345652.html

It is called stem wire and comes in various gauges. I use this one because it is easy to use a 1/16th drill bit, it fits it almost perfectly, and the coating sticks to super glue very easily. It is strong enough you will only need one wire. Now, drilling into lead with the bit is a tricky thing, but I've seen your work and think you have the skills. Both the head and body look capable of taking a decent depth hole, and this wire is strong enough it will not bend even if you wanted an inch long neck. Surround the wire with GS and your in business.
I also like the idea of an armored neck etc.
Hope this has helped a little. I look forward to seeing what you do. I do a lot of pinning and GS work (look in my gallery or here: so please if I might help, ask.
https://edwardmystcreations.weebly.com/sculpts1.html


PS: I have some warriors from the same generation...given I'm old, I bought them when they came out. Hideous and clunky...

Ooh, okay, I've been meaning to toddle down to my local hobby shop for a while, with a the railways stuff he does, I'm bound to find something. Nice work on the sculpting, I hope I can pull something off that looks approximate to what I'm imagining!

I've attached some pics of both sides of the throat join. You can see both where the male part has been cut off, and the female part, filled with glue.

If I'm honest, the leg joins were in a similar state, only with the male parts intact. I seem to have had reasonable success just drilling out the glue, there, so I'm toying with doing it again, though I also feel a bit like it isn't necessary.

queen_annes_revenge wrote:You could extend the legs too for more height.

For pinning, get a powered drill. trying to drill metal using a pin vise is just awful. but be careful. slow and steady.

Ohh, nice hint - got any reccomendations? I'm assuming she's made of lead, right? Feels much harder and heavier than my white metal minis (That spikey head has already put a dent in my coffee table )

MobileSuitRandom wrote:There's an assembly guide here, might help a bit? http://www.solegends.com/citcat1997/1997p085-00.htm - also, this one's so old it's one of the 40k models that came with a square base ^^

Thanks very much! Wondered were those missing mandibles were meant to go...

...also, neat! I knew it came with a square base, thanks to google, but had no idea it's a year younger than me. I love perusing older GW magazines, so this is very appreciated.

Yeah that will be one of the models made of lead - note its not solid lead but a mix of metals that includes lead. Poisoning shouldn't be an issue - wash your hands as normal and don't suck/swallow bits. Once primed and painted it will be perfectly safe.


I recall that the mandibles were a part added to this kit at a later date. I believe an earlier version didn't have them. Of course this was back in the days of metal moulds which are replaced more often than plastic ones are (and for a fraction of the cost). So considering there's the empty slot for them under the head clearly this one has lost them. You could try finding them (hard); sculpt something to replace them or simply fill the gap with a little greenstuff and assemble without them.



Ps whilst most tyranids have no "gender" as such I'd never viewed zoanthropes are female no matter their generation. At least until now for this first gen version.

Good to know! I had wondered about the toxcicity element a little...

I'm not super duper bothered about the missing mandibles tbh, but there are odd little scrape marks on the temples that you can't really see (my pics are horizontal for some reason, but only on this one page as far as I can tell, and I took those first pics at night, so the quality is far from stellar) unless the mini is in your hand, but the details have been obliterated in a really ugly way, that's going to require a bit of cleaning up. ATM, I'm planning to use some parts left over from my gaunts to make some kind of antennae/mantible/spike things in line with the rest of the crown of pointy bits on the head, but I may be less ambitious, as I'm very aware that my MANY ARMS plan could make the model too cluttered, and with so little space to work with on the shoulders, I'm already beginning to question the practicallity of that plan.

I was also toying with (so hear me out, I'm starting to get okay at re-casting with greenstuff) re-posing one of the hands, and using a leftover GSC torso to make a dying cultist (think The Death of Marat) being cradled by the Patriarch.

I guess I always thought that nids were all female because so are (most) ants and bees? IDK xenobiology probably gets really exciting and funky.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also! I'm still hoping someone might be able to give me an idea of the dimensions of a Patriarch, and what size base they go on!

The good news is you can clearly still see where the "male" attachement was on the neck. This will let you line up a drill hole. Drill in the center of the "female side". Not sure how thick that head is so obviously be careful there, although if you do drill through a bit of Greenstuff always fixes that. For me, that is a perfect pinning situation, especially if you want to add more neck.
However...
I do have another recommendation if Pinning is something you aren't too sure of. Again, an old lead guy like that will absolutely need a power drill. A hand drill will take time, although sometimes there is a hard crust and softer center. Here in the USA we have a product called GOOP. It is a thick gell glue thing. It is messy, and not for delicate work, but for this it would be really nice. Rough up both sides, a drop of goop, and press together. Takes all night to fully dry, but turns to rubber in about 20 minutes.
https://www.acehardware.com/departments/automotive-rv-and-marine/auto-tools-and-maintenance/automotive-adhesives/8009843?x429=true&gclid=CjwKCAjw95D0BRBFEiwAcO1KDNTx0efBWDejzmTiKO4n4XHi7TZhoJfxvXFTFxBJgRCDOmXw4H3enRoC2BgQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

As to your other question. My broodlord is on the pipe...the sewer pipe base, and he stands 70mm from bottom of base to spikes on back He is hunching). Wide he is 25mm at the shoulders. His base is a 40mm.

I do hope to see what you manage with this. Very interested.

I have the same model!

My first thought was to dig it up to find the mandibles and offer them to you... but I am also missing the same piece! At least we know it's apparently a common problem.

I seriously doubt you have a lead cast of this model. Mine is pewter. The vast majority of my lead GW figures have a slight rounded or melted look to them from aging, like the fine edges have been worn off. My 2nd Ed tyranids do not seem to be affected this way, even the unpainted ones, which have been stored loose in an un-cushioned box for ten years that gets jostled and moved quite frequently (it's in the way of the boxes with stuff that I actually need access to!)

I do really love this model. Unfortunately it's a perfect example of a model which has been vastly outdone by each of it's predecessors, so it's design feels really dated, so I love your idea of repurposing it.

Looking at it now, I can say a pin job between the head and torso will be very easy and secure fix. Unless a pin is holding a serious amount of weight then I actually simply use paper clips. There is enough room on both ends to make a really long pin, so this really shouldn't give you any trouble. Be sure to use a pair of snips that you don't care about tearing up a bit, because paper clips will leave marks to light weight clippers (like the GW ones)

I do see you're planning on making a long neck. How long? If you're adding more than two millimeters of length, I would actually back off of my previous statement and say that yes, multiple pins, or a stronger gauge would definitely be a good idea.

I second the notion of using a powered drill of some kind for making the holes. Just be careful not to go too fast; if the bit doesn't grab the metal, you'll actually be wearing it down. Also if you're not aligned well enough and going to fast the bit will snap off inside of the hole you're making.

Be sure to chip off any dried glue anywhere you see it. It will prevent your own glue from forming a proper bond.

 queen_annes_revenge wrote:
You could extend the legs too for more height.

For pinning, get a powered drill. trying to drill metal using a pin vise is just awful. but be careful. slow and steady.

You get far easier results if you keep a small tube of lip balm with your modelling stuff. Just roll the drill in it before drilling and the pin vise is nice and lubed up. Works great for me every time.

I'm fairly sure Patriarchs go on 40mm bases. Sizing is difficult as the new model is perched on a piece of pipe which makes his height quite tall, but it reality, I'd say around the same size as one of primarchs, To be fair though, it should be fairly obvious that he's your cults daddy surely?

queen_annes_revenge wrote:I'm fairly sure Patriarchs go on 40mm bases. Sizing is difficult as the new model is perched on a piece of pipe which makes his height quite tall, but it reality, I'd say around the same size as one of primarchs, To be fair though, it should be fairly obvious that he's your cults daddy surely?

Excellent, I have some bases that will match in that case - think the on I provisionally blu-takked her too is a winner.

My main thing with the height is that I don't wanna be too "modelling for advantage" with him - the true plastic model has quite an imposing, tall frame, and this guy sits quite a bit lower. I don't really play much, but I'd like to someday, but unless the broodcoven kit drops below its current ８０００￥　pricetag, I won't be picking it up to swap out to draw a more fair line of sight. I feel like most opponents would be cool about it, but at the same time, I'd like to be fair.

Grimtuff wrote:

 queen_annes_revenge wrote:
You could extend the legs too for more height.

For pinning, get a powered drill. trying to drill metal using a pin vise is just awful. but be careful. slow and steady.

You get far easier results if you keep a small tube of lip balm with your modelling stuff. Just roll the drill in it before drilling and the pin vise is nice and lubed up. Works great for me every time.

Interesting, I could easily do the hand drill stuff with what I have to hand atm, might give it a try tonight, after work. If anyone wants to warn me off hand drilling very hard, speak now, or forever hold your peace! I'm a little reluctant to go for the electric drill because money's a little tight atm (nothing desperate, I'm just trying to spread my fun money out a bit more), and I'm not sure where to begin - if anyone has a particular fav drill, lemme know!

edwardmyst wrote:
I am not familiar with the model besides your pictures (and I can't see much under the head) but...you shouldn't need more than a 1/16th strength wire for pinning. 1/16th is 16 gauge on other scales. I use this, bought from gardening/hobby style stores:
https://www.michaels.com/green-stem-wire-16-gauge-by-ashland/10345652.html

Any idea what that might be in metric? I have a local １００￥ shop, that probably has something very similar - you reckon I should just go with something that matches one of my chunkier drillbits?

As always, thanks a lot, gents! Very interesting stuff here!

My conversion chart shows a 1/16th bit being a wonderfully useless 1.52 mm....maybe find a wire and match to bit