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I am aware of just three references to Orkoid snipers in ~40 years of Ork lore.

The more obvious is the recent sniper-big shoota in the Ork kommandos kill team. This seems pretty fitting to the oddboyz that are kommandos.

The next is that Ork lootas in 3rd edition could take sniper rifles using the SM scouts unit entry (only hitting on 4+ instead of the usual 2+ in 3rd edition).

The second is that gretchin snipers were present in the Siege of Broucheroc (as featured in the 15 Hours novel and associated short stories). As far as I am aware, no rules or models have ever existed for gretchin snipers, although 2nd edition gretchin could take long-arms like autoguns so it isn't outlandish (and an autogun could be used by a sniper even if not a dedicated sniper weapon).

My thoughts are that gretchin snipers make a lot of sense as part of the instinctual Ork warmachine. Troops that force an enemy to keep their heads down and prevent unimpeded observation of Ork manouevres and preparations is of obvious value in the same way sharpshooters and snipers are valuable to the other factions.

Likewise, gretchin are naturally suited to be snipers in a similar manner to ratlings- small targets, cowardly, but comparatively good shots compared to the mainline body of the army. I could see this being the most prestigious role a gretchin could get on the battlefield other than perhaps assisting the boss or being in a kan.

I think it would be quite interesting for gretchin snipers to get models, I'd love to see the crazy sniper weapons meks could produce.

Maybe? I think it's better that they're rare and unexpected.

Having Orks do un-Orky things is a great trope and it never gets old.

Another example may be the Glowy Grot Gun. An upgrade to Flakkadakka Wagons, it was a Grot with a rifle that shot tracer rounds, aiding the Ork in their accuracy.

So not a Sniper exactly, but an example of a gun designed for accuracy, just put to a non-traditional use?

I’ve been reading through Brutal Kunnin’, and in that book it refers to aiming as un-Orky. Now that is of course from a limited perspective, but our protagonist believes it’s better to just get as many shots in the air as possible, and trust Gork and Mork to figure out who gets hit.

That’s an interesting thought to me, and it fits nicely with long established Orky lore about, essentially, instant gratification. Aiming takes time. Proper accurate aiming takes even longer. Or, right, we could just run at them, showing them how tough and loud we are, whilst kicking out as much Dakka as we can between here and there.

So in terms of Ork Snipers? I agree you’re mostly looking at Grots for that. Though individual or small numbers of Grots are notoriously unreliable, as prone to sneaking off so as not to get killed as actually doing their job.

I think the better alternative would be something akin to Passion Mobs, like Burnas, Tank Bustas. Those specialised units which, to a certain degree may in fact be comprised of Oddboyz, just not ones as specialised as Doks, Meks and Runtherds. Perhaps one unique among the Bloodaxe clans?

Wasn't there a marine chapter that ticked off the Inquisition, and subsequently suffered from unusually accurate "orkish" sniper fire that nearly wiped out the chapter? The implication is that the fire wasn't actually from orks. But there would need to be orkish snipers to make the claim plausible.

On a sidenote, auto-correct somehow turned "orkish" into "Irish". Fortunately I caught it. But then it occurred to me - the Irish color is green, and the orks are green... 😅

That was the Celestial Lions, and no one believed the cover story but because the Inquisition was involved there was no pushback.

Sniper grots makes sense, but I think the tricky thing would be getting sufficiently accurate guns into their hands. Sniper rifles don't seem to be especially common pieces of kit in the imperium; despite plasma being canonically rarer, the large number of units with access to it doesn't make it feel that way. So I could see sniper rifles simply not making their way into the hands of grots very often, and meks might be too orky (mekanikal know-how aside) to *build* a game wot doesn't shoot fast and barely ever hits things wot are up close.

But then again, ratling snipers exist, and you'd think those guns would be scaled pretty well for grots...

This issue was mentioned in one of the recent Red Gobbo books. "Da Gobbo's Demise"

Specifically the Red Gobbo complained that Grots would make excellent snipers just like Ratlings, but that the orks would never trust a grot with any kind of powerful weapon.

So here's to hoping for a rebel grot sub faction.

I think it's been rotated out, because even though it sounds like a Blood Axe-y thing to do, most orks want much Dakka or a loud boom. Hence, shootas and boomstiks (shotguns). But even the Kommando speshul gun looks more like a long shoota. Recently, I'm replayed DoW 2 Retribution, and the Ork character Spookums is the Kommando type, but he's also your heavy weapon expert. Grot snipers sounds more plausible, as they're the more "Mork-Snik" kind that stab you in the back and take your stuff when you're not looking- plus they shoot better than orks... But, that'd mean orks entrusted grots with high-powered rifles. So, James Workshop- make Grot longrifle teams available in 10th codex! I want 2-3 grots aiming a big "Long-Shoota"!

Some good thoughts above.

Eumerin wrote:Wasn't there a marine chapter that ticked off the Inquisition, and subsequently suffered from unusually accurate "orkish" sniper fire that nearly wiped out the chapter? The implication is that the fire wasn't actually from orks. But there would need to be orkish snipers to make the claim plausible.

On a sidenote, auto-correct somehow turned "orkish" into "Irish". Fortunately I caught it. But then it occurred to me - the Irish color is green, and the orks are green... 😅

Ah, thanks for reminding me of this. Good point- "unusually accurate" strongly suggests that inaccurate sniper fire does normally occur.

Gert wrote:That was the Celestial Lions, and no one believed the cover story but because the Inquisition was involved there was no pushback.

The point isn't that anyone believed the cover story, the point is that unusually accurate suggests usually inaccurate sniper fire. It does support that harassing fire from some sort of Orkoid sharpshooter is not remarkable.

Wyldhunt wrote:Sniper grots makes sense, but I think the tricky thing would be getting sufficiently accurate guns into their hands.

Thinking about it, the usual Ork approach to accuracy issues is to do one of the following:
1) more barrels
2) faster firing
3) make the shot explosive
The kommando scoped big shoota does option 2, so I suspect any unit of grot snipas would have some really eclectic mix of scoped big shootas, rifles firing explosive rounds, and multi-barrelled rifles.

Dekskull wrote:This issue was mentioned in one of the recent Red Gobbo books. "Da Gobbo's Demise"

Specifically the Red Gobbo complained that Grots would make excellent snipers just like Ratlings, but that the orks would never trust a grot with any kind of powerful weapon.

So here's to hoping for a rebel grot sub faction.

This makes some sense... but then they trust grots to operate their artillery pieces. A lobba or kannon is much more dangerous to an Ork than a big shoota. Maybe a unit of grot snipas would need a runtherd or kommando chaperone.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 TheChrispyOne wrote:
I think it's been rotated out, because even though it sounds like a Blood Axe-y thing to do, most orks want much Dakka or a loud boom. Hence, shootas and boomstiks (shotguns). But even the Kommando speshul gun looks more like a long shoota. Recently, I'm replayed DoW 2 Retribution, and the Ork character Spookums is the Kommando type, but he's also your heavy weapon expert. Grot snipers sounds more plausible, as they're the more "Mork-Snik" kind that stab you in the back and take your stuff when you're not looking- plus they shoot better than orks... But, that'd mean orks entrusted grots with high-powered rifles. So, James Workshop- make Grot longrifle teams available in 10th codex! I want 2-3 grots aiming a big "Long-Shoota"!

To be honest, just allowing "elite" grot units with autogun equivalents again would probably be sufficient. Something with enough range to plink at enemy soldiers from further away.

 Haighus wrote:
The point isn't that anyone believed the cover story, the point is that unusually accurate suggests usually inaccurate sniper fire. It does support that harassing fire from some sort of Orkoid sharpshooter is not remarkable.

As per Lexicanum which cites Blood and Fire and Third War For Armageddon - Imperial Forces: The Celestial Lions:

Sniper fire rained down from the mountain sides, relentlessly targeting the Apothecaries. It should be noted that the sniper fire was not Ork in origin. Imperial issued longlas laser sniper rifles were used, burning holes straight through the helmet and eye-lenses of Chapter officers.

So either the Orks got magically amazing at accuracy, or as is widely known, the Inquisition lured the Celestial Lions into a trap and then had their own agents hidden to do the precision work.

I think a Grot sniper unit would be a bit of a laugh, I'm picturing 3 Grots to a base manning a .50 like a Heavy Weapon Team. I wish some of the Ork shooting would get a bit of a BS boost though, not all of it but some of the range-focused units like Gorkamorts, Shock Attack Guns, Killcannons, etc, they're still stuck in this mindset of "they must have BS5+ because they're Orks".

Modern weapons can fire a round at supersonic speeds. While it's not the typical roar associated with "dakka-dakka", there might still be some orks that appreciate the crack of a supersonic round.

I decided to brew up some Orkoid Snipers.
Just for fun.

You've got the Grots with proper snipers, and the Orks who have multibarreled rockets of death that just happen to be Precision sometimes.

orks picking up a rifle and practicing their shots is perfectly reasonable. some orks are, after all, considered quite odd by their fellows and there are always hunters. orks picked up from feral planets wouldn't mind putting their skills to use. the only question is which groups would encourage the practice on a more organised scale.

Rosebuddy wrote:
orks picking up a rifle and practicing their shots is perfectly reasonable. some orks are, after all, considered quite odd by their fellows and there are always hunters. orks picked up from feral planets wouldn't mind putting their skills to use. the only question is which groups would encourage the practice on a more organised scale.

Blood Axes, I would think. Maybe Snake Bites depending on how common aiming is among ork hunters.

Snakebites don't much trust modern, fancy technology so an old-fashioned enormous bolt-action beast would be pretty characterful for them to lug around.

Snipers are perfect for ork cruelty, the behavior where if they see a family walking with children and a dog, the first thing they do is shoot the dog. I'm thinking of troops who are driving in their vehicle, call a halt and dismount to pull this kind of stunt just to entertain the other orks.

Black Linrary novels in the past ten years have used very pornographic scenes of orks roasting human prisoners in the yarrick novel or pulling out their teeth like de-beaked chickens in war of the beast. If anything, the sadistic sniper trope is a bit more true to life than that sensationalized torture porn. Snipers are also used on purpose as a terror weapon, like at the siege of Sarajevo, so if they can use industrial torture of prisoners (lurid and bad writing IMO) then they can use it on besieged cities too, which is more consistent with stochastic violence for fun that orks are known for.

Only if they are purple

That’s more sharp shooters though. A Sniper requires position and patience. The latter not being something Orks tend to be predisposed toward as a species.

As noted of course I wouldn’t rule out rare examples as another low-level Oddboy/Cult. Certainly they could be existent but rare enough that nobody ever really notices them.

As for Hunting? Feral Orks and Snakebitez seem more “just nut it into submission” hunters, as would be of more appeal and greater bragging rights. Getting up close and personal, rather than hanging back and being sneaky.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
That’s more sharp shooters though. A Sniper requires position and patience. The latter not being something Orks tend to be predisposed toward as a species.

As noted of course I wouldn’t rule out rare examples as another low-level Oddboy/Cult. Certainly they could be existent but rare enough that nobody ever really notices them.

As for Hunting? Feral Orks and Snakebitez seem more “just nut it into submission” hunters, as would be of more appeal and greater bragging rights. Getting up close and personal, rather than hanging back and being sneaky.

Pretty much all snipers in the 40k game are being used as sharpshooters in a tactical battlefield though.

Feral Orks are canonically better shots than more advanced Orks due to their need to hunt.

That and they tend to lack automatic weapons. Pretty confident if you gave a Feral Ork a Shoota, it’d be just as trigger happy as a more civilised Ork.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
That and they tend to lack automatic weapons. Pretty confident if you gave a Feral Ork a Shoota, it’d be just as trigger happy as a more civilised Ork.

Er... They do have shootas. There has been a feral Ork army list, and the basic boyz unit (Huntas) is a bunch of ladz with BS3 (vs BS2 on regular boyz in the era) and shootas.

Forgotten about that.

White Dwarf list if memory serves?

Assuming the Orks were a genetic weapon created by the old ones it seems unlikely that they would have snipers as what we have seen tell us they were created to be an overwhelming force of brutes.

However we do know that orks evolve very quickly as their numbers grow so it could be that they were designed to grow into a very sophisticated strategic force

I need to see this feral orks list

This thread has me fantasizing about a Blood Axe army with all the common Astra Militarum tropes, bastardized into Orky forms again..

Tin Boyz, sharpshooters, the whole works..

I dont see why Kunnin tactics of Blood Axe Bosses couldnt include deliberate use of sharpshootaz

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
I need to see this feral orks list

The most up-to-date version was in Chapter Approved: 2004.

 tauist wrote:
This thread has me fantasizing about a Blood Axe army with all the common Astra Militarum tropes, bastardized into Orky forms again..

Tin Boyz, sharpshooters, the whole works..

I dont see why Kunnin tactics of Blood Axe Bosses couldnt include deliberate use of sharpshootaz

How do you make them orky? Shock attack biped rifles? Sniper rockets? Sniper snotlings?

mrFickle wrote:

 tauist wrote:
This thread has me fantasizing about a Blood Axe army with all the common Astra Militarum tropes, bastardized into Orky forms again..

Tin Boyz, sharpshooters, the whole works..

I dont see why Kunnin tactics of Blood Axe Bosses couldnt include deliberate use of sharpshootaz

How do you make them orky? Shock attack biped rifles? Sniper rockets? Sniper snotlings?

how do you make a sniper rifle orky? paint flames on it. add hydraulics. put an axe head on the end of the barrel as well as the stock. add a cage with a snotling who has a pair of binoculars and can tell you were to aim