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 azreal13 wrote:

 Compel wrote:
The new speeders still too much have the "converted deodorant " look to them of the original...

As a Rogue Trader baby, I fail to see how this is a criticism?

The point of this line is to keep the aesthetic, isn't it? Hence the rhino that looks like the second ed one, etc.

 azreal13 wrote:

 Compel wrote:
The new speeders still too much have the "converted deodorant " look to them of the original...

As a Rogue Trader baby, I fail to see how this is a criticism?

Agreed. I think FW is doing an amazing job of creating high quality new pieces that are really reminiscent of all that glorious old stuff.

The models look great, I especially like the turret on the whirlwind.

That said, is suspect its rules will probably get hit with a nerf bat here, AV13 and up to 4 AP3 blasts at less than the cost of a Basilisk is...*really* good.

I hope they sell that turret piece separately.

 kronk wrote:

I'll be honest, the first thing I thought of when I saw that was this...



Just needs some tail fins and we're good to go!

I now desperately want to make a SM Chapter based on batman, with Adam West as the Chapter Master...

 Just Dave wrote:
Wow, both models look great: particularly the Landspeeder. Forge Worlds work (particularly their HH stuff) continues to impress.

The rules for the Landspeeder are good too, way better than the standard. The Whirlwind's rules look pretty solid, providing it stays stationary.

I'm no expert on HH rules, but that land speeder is way to good for it's points for normal 40k.

A DA speeder with a typhoon is 75 points (15 cheaper then C:SM)

So the Javelin gives up the ability to squadron for +1 to F/S armor, outflank, and TLing the missiles. And that's before the upgrade options, some of which are quite nice.

It won't replace suicide speeders, but unless your FA slots are packed and you are fielding a squadron, these things make normal typhoon/HB speeders look like trash.

The whirlwind I have less problems with. It's kinda a cross between a pred and a vindi. And the points seem reasonable for what you are getting. My biggest issue with it is the "whirlwind" in the name. WWs are under-armored mobile artillery. This thing is armored like a MBT.

 Nevelon wrote:

 Just Dave wrote:
Wow, both models look great: particularly the Landspeeder. Forge Worlds work (particularly their HH stuff) continues to impress.

The rules for the Landspeeder are good too, way better than the standard. The Whirlwind's rules look pretty solid, providing it stays stationary.

I'm no expert on HH rules, but that land speeder is way to good for it's points for normal 40k.

A DA speeder with a typhoon is 75 points (15 cheaper then C:SM)

So the Javelin gives up the ability to squadron for +1 to F/S armor, outflank, and TLing the missiles. And that's before the upgrade options, some of which are quite nice.

It won't replace suicide speeders, but unless your FA slots are packed and you are fielding a squadron, these things make normal typhoon/HB speeders look like trash.

The whirlwind I have less problems with. It's kinda a cross between a pred and a vindi. And the points seem reasonable for what you are getting. My biggest issue with it is the "whirlwind" in the name. WWs are under-armored mobile artillery. This thing is armored like a MBT.

But is the current Landspeeder not already considered trash?

 Nevelon wrote:

 Just Dave wrote:
Wow, both models look great: particularly the Landspeeder. Forge Worlds work (particularly their HH stuff) continues to impress.

The rules for the Landspeeder are good too, way better than the standard. The Whirlwind's rules look pretty solid, providing it stays stationary.

I'm no expert on HH rules, but that land speeder is way to good for it's points for normal 40k.

only relative to the basic landspeeder. 75pts for an AV11 HP2 missile boat isn't going to break the game.

I'd like to replace my Exorcists with that Whirlwind turret.

Just Dave wrote:
But is the current Landspeeder not already considered trash?

Vaktathi wrote:
Only relative to the basic landspeeder. 75pts for an AV11 HP2 missile boat isn't going to break the game.

I pay 90 points for a typhoon/HB speeder as a C:SM player, and while I think they are slightly overpriced, feel they still perform well. They are not a broken, auto-include option, but still valid. I'll be a happy camper if I get the reduction in points from the DA codex. 75 is probably the right price for them.

As I said, I'm no expert on FW or HH stuff. I can only judge things relative to the basic codexes. And this thing is hands down better then it's peer in C:SM, and noticeably better then the one in the more up to date codex Dark Angels. It's not paradigm shifting enough to break the game, but is much better then the options in the normal codexes.

I'd like to see it drop down to AV10, or pick up an extra 15-25 points. I think that would bring it into line with other codex units. My opinion, obviously. YMMV.

Hi there,
This week we have some new vehicles rolling out for pre-order; the Whirlwind Scorpius and the Javelin Attack Speeder, which is available in two weapons variants. Relics of the dark age of the Horus Heresy, examples of these revered war machines still remain in the armouries of the Space Marines of the 41st Millennium. We also have a new Mechanicum Thallax Cohort bundle.

Whirlwind Scorpius



An ancient variant of the more common Whirlwind missile tank, the Scorpius was designed with a single purpose in mind – the destruction of heavily armoured infantry. The Scorpius variant replaces the Whirlwind’s multiple missile launcher system with the intricate drum-fed scorpius launcher, whose implosive warheads are devastating to armoured infantry and light vehicles. The Whirlwind Scorpius’ origins lie in the dark days of the Horus Heresy and, in more recent times, it has become an all but forgotten relic amongst some Chapters as the ability to manufacture its complex munitions has become a lost art, but for other Chapters it still remains a potent weapon of war.

The Whirlwind Scorpius, designed by Israel Gonzalez, is a complete multi-part resin and plastic kit that is available to pre-order now for despatch from Friday 26th July.

Rules for this vehicle will be found in our forthcoming Horus Heresy book. In addition, experimental rules for its use before this book's publication and in your games of Warhammer 40,000 are presented here.

Javelin Attack Speeders



Larger and more heavily armoured than the common pattern of Land Speeder, the Javelin Attack Speeder is a nigh-irreplaceable relic of a bygone age of technological mastery. Gravitic nullification plates, the secret of whose production and maintenance have long since been lost, enable the Javelin to mount an array of heavy weaponry, allowing them to make pinpoint strikes on enemy armour or infantry with devastating lascannon or missile barrage. Those Chapters of Space Marines whose histories stretch back into the grim days of the Imperium’s founding may, if they are fortunate, still possess a few justly revered Javelins within the sanctified depths of their armouries.

Designed by Daren Parrwood, the Javelin Attack Speeder is a multi-part resin kit. There are two variants available with either twin-linked lascannon or twin-linked Cyclone missile launchers. These models are available to pre-order now and will be despatched from Friday 26th July.

Rules for this vehicle will be found in our forthcoming Horus Heresy book. In addition, experimental rules for its use before this book's publication and in your games of Warhammer 40,000 are presented here.

Mechanicum Thallax Cohort Bundle


We've put together a bundle which includes three sets of the Mechanicum Thallax Cohorts, enough for a full sized unit of nine Thallaxii.



Event News
Games Day Germany
We are attending Games Day Germany which will be held at the Gürzenich in Cologne on Sunday 11th August, and are still taking reservation orders for this event. Click here to find out how to place a reservation order for this event. We must receive your order by midday UK time on Monday 29th July.

Our studio guests at this show will be model designer Phil Stutcinskas and graphic artist Dominik Oedinger.

Gencon
We will be heading over to Indianapolis on August 15th-18th for Gencon, a huge gaming convention held at the Indiana Convention Center. We are taking reservation orders for this event. Click here to find out how to place a reservation order for this event. We must receive your order by midday UK time on Friday 26th July.

Thanks,

Forge World Sales Team

Wow, that Whirlwind variant would be perfect as a way for my BT to handle Tau. Needless to say, no one's going to let me play it because it's "too powerful"...

I hope they seriously tone down these rules. This is exactly what people who oppose FW stuff fear it is: stuff that is just plain better than normal codex options. This is unacceptable.

(it also bugs me that the tank has side armour of 12. No Rhino based vehicle has that, not even Vindicator that visibly has way thicker side armour.)

These are basically playtest rules, and FW does take emails from people playing with the rules for their product...

Test it out, see what's good and what's bad about it, and alert your local FW representative.

Aren't these also for "Warhammer 30k" and not necessarily regular 40k, or did I miss that. The Heresy stuff, afaik, is better overall than the current stuff but it can still work.

Edit: Oh, and yes, I'll take some speeders. Those are great!

 Cruentus wrote:
Aren't these also for "Warhammer 30k" and not necessarily regular 40k, or did I miss that. The Heresy stuff, afaik, is better overall than the current stuff but it can still work.

Edit: Oh, and yes, I'll take some speeders. Those are great!

The experimental rules were for 40K.

Still, though, an AV13 variant of the Whirlwind... this is eery, first the BT rumors line up with what I've predicted, then an AV13 variant of the Whirlwind shows up shortly after I create custom rules for an AV13 Whirlwind variant. Maybe I should take to rumor mongring?

Those armor values are a bit much. I suspect they will get changed (might even have been a typo to begin with), If anything, the ability for it to sit still and fire of D3+1 shots is a bit over the top. Given that most Whirlwinds usually sit still for most of a game anyway (hiding behind cover), it isn't exactly hard to potentially wipe out an entire Space Marine squad every turn. Maybe just let it fire twice or be twin-linked if it doesn't move would be enough.

In a game where Battlecannons already exist, I think people are perhaps over estimating exactly how effective the new Whirlwind will be. Nasty, quite possibly, but nothing to get too worried about.

 azreal13 wrote:
In a game where Heldrakes already exist, I think people are perhaps over estimating exactly how effective the new Whirlwind will be. Nasty, quite possibly, but nothing to get too worried about.

Fixed that for you.

I find the mention of a first Inter-Legion Civil War in the Scorpius flufftext pretty interesting.

 Seneca wrote:
I find the mention of a first Inter-Legion Civil War in the Scorpius flufftext pretty interesting.

Isn't that just the Horus Heresy?

Are you sure you're not reading it as an intra-legion civil war, such as with the Dark Angels?

 Just Dave wrote:

 Seneca wrote:
I find the mention of a first Inter-Legion Civil War in the Scorpius flufftext pretty interesting.

Isn't that just the Horus Heresy?

Are you sure you're not reading it as an intra-legion civil war, such as with the Dark Angels?

If it's the Horus Heresy then why call it differently?

Maybe a very vague hint at what happened to the two missing legions?

 Just Dave wrote:

 Seneca wrote:
I find the mention of a first Inter-Legion Civil War in the Scorpius flufftext pretty interesting.

Isn't that just the Horus Heresy?

Are you sure you're not reading it as an intra-legion civil war, such as with the Dark Angels?

It depends whether the fluff is being written from the perspective of 30K or 40K, the blurbs on the FW site have a nasty habit of jumping back and forth between the two even within the same paragraph. If the latter, it means the Heresy, if the former, it could be anything from a quick mention of the whole "humbling of Angron" thing, or yet another "hee hee, we're never going to tell you what happened to the missing legions, but that won't stop us from continually throwing mutually-contradictory hints at you!" reference.

anyone digging the night lords paint scheme?

Is it just because its FW that people start whining about units being OP? At least they modify the rules on official release dependant on feedback. I'd hate to see this nerfed like they did DKOK Hades breaching drill.

I'm also thinking, 'Scorpius'? does this mean we will see a handful of variants - Skyfire/interceptor variants perhaps?

Im stuck for potential names though - Sagitarius? Blastius?

badgermeister wrote:

Is it just because its FW that people start whining about units being OP?

No. It is because they're OP (FW stuff generally isn't.) That Typhoon land speeder is just plain better than the codex version for the same price (or even cheaper, if you compare to older codices.)

badgermeister wrote:


I'm also thinking, 'Scorpius'? does this mean we will see a handful of variants - Skyfire/interceptor variants perhaps?

Im stuck for potential names though - Sagitarius? Blastius?

Already exists, its the Hyperios

Edit: Its under 100 pts fires missiles that pack the punch of a battle cannon.

Is it wrong to like that Landspeeder's look wayyyy more than the current 40k one?

 Crimson wrote:
That Typhoon land speeder is just plain better than the codex version for the same price (or even cheaper, if you compare to older codices.)

So what? Codex typhoon speeders aren't all that impressive, so making a better one isn't really a problem. It's ok to improve on and replace weaker units, whether that source is FW or a new codex.

Also, the loss of squadroning is not a trivial drawback.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Given that most Whirlwinds usually sit still for most of a game anyway (hiding behind cover), it isn't exactly hard to potentially wipe out an entire Space Marine squad every turn.

Maybe if you play against bad players who never space out their models. It's D3+1 small blasts, which means you should be hitting an average of 3-4 models per turn at most. Add in a potential cover save from area terrain and you're looking at decent firepower, but far short of "an entire space marine squad every turn".

Just for comparison, the average of three shots per turn covers an area of 21 square inches, while the 5" shot from a Basilisk covers 19.6 square inches. Add in the coherency distance factor and the Basilisk is almost always going to be doing more damage.