How useful is, "Fear" (The Special Rule)

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**Waaagh 18**

I know a lot of armies are practically immune to this rule because of special rules and really high leadership. How often is is a useful tool? What percent of armies are immune? Please rate fear on a scale of 1 to 10 and post your reason why.

**AnomanderRake**

Dead rule. I've never seen it have any impact on the outcome of any game.

**Trasvi**

How useful is the numbering on your poll?
1-2: Useless
3-4: Alright
5-6: Very useful

Its pretty useless. Most opponents are Immune to Fear (fearless or ATSKNF) OR Essentially immune to fear (Ld10).
If they aren't either immune or essentially immune, they are most likely not a combat threat to me anyway and I was already striking first and hitting on 3's - it just marginally reduces the amount of damage I take (if anything survives my attacks).

**J3f**

My solution is to change the fear rule to the following.

Fear
A unit charged by a unit that causes Fear must take a Pinning test before Overwatch is resolved. At the start of each Fight sub-phase, a unit in base contact with one or more enemy models that cause Fear must take a Leadership test (called a Fear test) at -1 Leadership before any blows are struck. If the test is passed, all is well and there is no effect. If the test is failed, the unit succumbs to fear – all models in the unit have their Weapon Skill and Initiative reduced to 1 for the remainder of that Fight sub-phase. Note that a model that causes Fear is not itself immune to Fear, and will still need to take a Fear test if it is base contact with any enemy models that cause Fear.

**Swastakowey**

I dont even know what fear does any more... Cant recall last time it was used... So useless.

**Slaanesh-Devotee**

It should be more like the old Terror rule, I think it was. Really bad in failed test, but passing the test still wasn't great. Then just change the Ignores Effect to AutoPasses, and sweet.

Like, failed equals counts as losing combat even if you kill more (so un modified ld check) and ws 1 while passing means just ws 1. Or something.

**koooaei**

It's a powerful yet cheap rule against my orkses.

**locarno24**

Agreed. It's situational, but against guard and orks I've had good use out of it on monstrous creatures.

Both armies have so-so leadership and knocking down their WS is good because tervigons and carnifex aren't exactly over-supplied with WS themselves.

going from 4+ to hit and be hit to 3+ to hit and 5+ to be hit makes a big difference when you're facing a cheap squad with krak grenades (or, hive mind help you, meltabombs).

It would in theory help against Tau but they tend not to need much help in being slaughtered in assaults.

The one other area I've seen it matter is eldar/dark eldar - they don't fail fear tests often, but it can be catastrophic when they do. Ancient Doom making slaaneshi daemons extra scary can have that effect.

**Rumbleguts**

If the CC table was organized more like the Wound table, fear might be more useful. But then, so might genestealers.

**MarsNZ**

A joke rule probably less useful than soul blaze

locarno24 wrote:
guard

have so-so leadership and knocking down their WS is good because tervigons and carnifex aren't exactly over-supplied with WS themselves.

With the exception of some trash throwaway units my guard are stubborn 9 or fearless, or reroll ld9, or ld 10 subborn, or auto-pass with execute.... etc.

**GoonBandito**

Against Orks or Guard who forget to take Priests it can be pretty good, because it will usually make them hit on 5's instead 4's or make you hit on 3's instead of 4's. That can make a real difference when fighting hoards of Guardsmen or Boyz.

Almost anything else you would want to fight in melee are either outright immune, highly resistant due to high leadership or are a small enough unit that it doesn't really matter.

I like the idea suggested above that it causes a Pinning test when you declare a charge. The only problem is that everything that is Immune/Resistant to Fear is also Immune/Resistant to Pinning. Maybe it causes a Morale Test instead? If you succeed, you rally into combat. If you fail, you flee with a chance of being swept. Sort of like how Fantasy does Charge Moves and Charge Reactions.

**vipoid**

It's basically worthless.

- Against most armies it's pointless because they're outright immune.

- Against armies like Tau and Guard, it barely makes a difference since their combat abilities are crap anyway. The only exception is a guard blob with a priest... which is Fearless.

- The only army I can think of where Fear is occasionally worthwhile is Orks, but even then it's just too unreliable to be of any tactical use (since you don't know whether it will work until you're already joined combat).

In terms of fixing it, I'd suggest making ATSKNF a reroll - not an auto-pass. Having all marine armies be auto-immune just makes the rule utterly worthless.

Another possibility would be to make the effect weaker, but automatic (e.g. -2 WS for all non-fearless units). So, it's not as strong, but you at least know if and when it will work and how much difference it will make. As it stands, I think the second biggest problem with Fear (after Marines being immune) is that it's impossible to use in any tactical way.

**Drasius**

Dark eldar can also cop a beating when they fail their fear check, since going first doesn't achieve much if you wiff all your attacks, and getting hit on 3's and being T3 with no armour to speak of usually doesn't end well.

**Zed**

Situational, just because there is so much that ignores it. But the stuff it does work on can get very gibbed indeed.

The real test is remembering that you have it in the first place, I tend to find it a bit awkwardly timed as I'll barge straight to counting up attacks.

**Jimsolo**

I voted Decent. (Apparently I'm the optimist.)

I don't think its good enough to save a bad unit, but it's still pretty useful. The toughest part, as Zed mentioned, is remembering to call for the tests.

**Makumba**

AnomanderRake wrote:
Dead rule. I've never seen it have any impact on the outcome of any game.

This one.

**lustigjh**

I've been playing Daemons since August and have probably remembered to force fear tests twice. I'm not upset at the omission.

**King Pariah**

Really think there should be at least two version of Fear.

Fear as it is with ATSKNF and Fearless being immune to it,

And then maybe Terror in which only Fearless is immune to it.

... maybe a third called, "NOPE! NOPE! NOPE!" to which no one is immune... except maybe Slaanesh or Nurgle... can't think of anything they'd go "NOPE! NOPE! NOPE!" to.

**the_scotsman**

As someone trying out the new harlequins, it's a non-factor. I mean, our freaking vehicles have it.

**Poly Ranger**

Fear:
If a unit which causes fear breaks an opponents unit in combat, all opponents units which have a model within 6" of the unit which falls back, when it makes it's initial leadership test, must immediately take a leadership test or fall back themselves.

That would make fear a little more relevant.

**TheAvengingKnee**

To many armies pass the test easily and most are just flat immune to it most of the time, the few armies who are vulnerable to it generally aren't very affected("oh no the Tau are WS 1").

It needs a 100% revamp it is completely useless or they could just remove it from the game.

**vipoid**

I think the worst part is that they keep shoehorning it everywhere. If it was rare, it might be easier to just dismiss. But, no, it's like every single codex has to have a minimum number of Fear-causing rubbish.

e.g. DE have:
- A (worthless Warlord Trait that hands out fear)
- A SC with said worthless Warlord Trait
- Ur-ghuls have it
- Mandrakes have it
- One of our artefacts has it
- Coven Haemonculi, Grotesques and Wracks all get it from the pfp chart

Why? I mean, what's the point? You could just as easily replace those references with pictures of the GW design team mooning us.

And, as if that wasn't bad enough, they gave us an entire class of weapon that marines are auto-immune to. I guess them being immune to all our Fear still wasn't good enough.

**krodarklorr**

My most recent game with Newcrons, I failed 3 Fear tests. And it certainly mattered, as in those combats I didn't hit once. It certainly impacted the game.

That being said, I still think it's situational at best. Most things in the game ignore it, so there's little point to it.

**TheAvengingKnee**

vipoid wrote:
I think the worst part is that they keep shoehorning it everywhere. If it was rare, it might be easier to just dismiss. But, no, it's like every single codex has to have a minimum number of Fear-causing rubbish.

e.g. DE have:
- A (worthless Warlord Trait that hands out fear)
- A SC with said worthless Warlord Trait
- Ur-ghuls have it
- Mandrakes have it
- One of our artefacts has it
- Coven Haemonculi, Grotesques and Wracks all get it from the pfp chart

Why? I mean, what's the point? You could just as easily replace those references with pictures of the GW design team mooning us.

And, as if that wasn't bad enough, they gave us an entire class of weapon that marines are auto-immune to. I guess them being immune to all our Fear still wasn't good enough.

It is just dumb, they act like it is something good that nobody uses(it's not is

useless), and cram it in everywhere they can, it is just terrible.

**krodarklorr**

TheAvengingKnee wrote:
vipoid wrote:
I think the worst part is that they keep shoehorning it everywhere. If it was rare, it might be easier to just dismiss. But, no, it's like every single codex has to have a minimum number of Fear-causing rubbish.

e.g. DE have:
- A (worthless Warlord Trait that hands out fear)
- A SC with said worthless Warlord Trait
- Ur-ghuls have it
- Mandrakes have it
- One of our artefacts has it
- Coven Haemonculi, Grotesques and Wracks all get it from the pfp chart

Why? I mean, what's the point? You could just as easily replace those references with pictures of the GW design team mooning us.

And, as if that wasn't bad enough, they gave us an entire class of weapon that marines are auto-immune to. I guess them being immune to all our Fear still wasn't good enough.

It is just dumb, they act like it is something good that nobody uses(it's not is useless), and cram it in everywhere they can, it is just terrible.

At least you didn't have one of your most useful pieces of wargear turn into Fear. Woooooo.

**Desubot**

On a scale from 1-10. its just awful. There is nearly no situation where it matters.

**Vaktathi**

The biggest issue with Fear is that typically whatever is actually vulnerable to it, is usually something that you don't really need it against.

Most things you'd need/want it against, are immune to it or have such a high chance of passing as to be functionally so.

**TheAvengingKnee**

krodarklorr wrote:
TheAvengingKnee wrote:
vipoid wrote:
I think the worst part is that they keep shoehorning it everywhere. If it was rare, it might be easier to just dismiss. But, no, it's like every single codex has to have a minimum number of Fear-causing rubbish.

e.g. DE have:
- A (worthless Warlord Trait that hands out fear)
- A SC with said worthless Warlord Trait
- Ur-ghuls have it
- Mandrakes have it
- One of our artefacts has it
- Coven Haemonculi, Grotesques and Wracks all get it from the pfp chart

Why? I mean, what's the point? You could just as easily replace those references with pictures of the GW design team mooning us.

And, as if that wasn't bad enough, they gave us an entire class of weapon that marines are auto-immune to. I guess them being immune to all our Fear still wasn't good enough.

It is just dumb, they act like it is something good that nobody uses(it's not is useless), and cram it in everywhere they can, it is just terrible.

At least you didn't have one of your most useful pieces of wargear turn into Fear. Woooooo.

I play Necron, so yes I did as well.

**CrownAxe**

Fear is terrible. A lot of armies are immune to it (All Marines, Daemons, Nids). Then a couple armies have good enough Ld that they will pretty much never fail the test (Necrons, Eldar, Sisters, CSM and Dark Eldar can). Then there are a few armies that are susceptible but were already bad at combat so failing Fear does nothing (Guard, Tau)

The only army that is actually worried about Fear is now Orks and that's only because their current codex removed their immunity to Fear. But even then the units that you really need to fail it will probably have a fearless Warboss with them.

**vipoid**

I didn't think Ork warbosses were Fearless?