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So, around my FLGS there have been some new 40k players, and its been nice. I've gotten in some more PUGs than I usually do, but out of the 6ish new players, none of them have painted armies. My stuff isn't that great, but it's painted. The closest that any of then has is one guy who draws on the models with pertinent markers. It's kind of annoying honestly, because when I got into the game, it was what we did, not this amazing standout thing that happens rarely. Any of you finding this issue too?

Nah, not really. Grey legions have always been a thing...

I have a big amount of primed models but in recent months I've grown a dislike with playing with unpainted models.

Doesn't bother me that other people don't and most people at my local GW have at least a partially unpainted army

Do a search on Dakka and you will find multitudes of threads condemning those who don't paint and condemning those who condemn them.

Skriker

I don't really consider it an issue, but I'm in the group that is in the hobby for gaming first and modeling second.

My feelings about painted armies are well documented…
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2014/08/painting-matters-in-defense-of-hobby.html
...so I'll leave that alone for now.

As to the prevalence of unpainted 40k miniatures, in the FLGS's that I've seen Grey legions seem to be the norm. Our club moves our meeting (usually at member's homes) to the FLGS every other month or so and we're on 40k night. I can't recall the last time I saw a 40k night where more than half of the minis on the tables were painted. This has kind of been the norm for quite a few years, perhaps almost a decade. There was always some grey on the table, but when GW dropped the paint requirements from som tourneys and stores the grey quotient went way up. It didn't help that GW eventually got out of the tournament running business while at the same time the size of most armies has grown.

Why does this topic only seem to come up in GW subforums? Is it because the company constantly pushes for larger games, making it more difficult for new players to get their collections painted? And the seemingly daunting task of painting those large collections of minis would make starting all the jarder?

I don't know. I'd think it varies from club to club or store to store. For example, both the tournaments I've attended in the last few years and the casual pick up games at my local GW store have good majority of the armies painted - at least 70% - the quality or completeness of the paint scheme notwithstanding.

I don't look down upon those who play without their armies being painted. Sometimes one might want to test out their models, and see if a certain unit choice or setup works before committing to painting it - I've been there myself. Maybe one has trouble deciding on a chapter or hive fleet, and wants to use their expensive models in the meantime.

And it's not limited to GW games at all. I've seen plenty of Warmachine/Hordes games being played where only a few models had primer, and the rest were bare metal or plastic.

OP, are the new players still learning to paint? If they are, that's kind of understandable. They want to play with the models they've bought and assembled. But keep bringing your own painted stuff, maybe share a few tips on how to paint. Hopefully that will make them interested in painting their armies.

 infinite_array wrote:
Why does this topic only seem to come up in GW subforums? Is it because the company constantly pushes for larger games, making it more difficult for new players to get their collections painted? And the seemingly daunting task of painting those large collections of minis would make starting all the jarder?

Probably because the game is so awful that the only reason to play it is the aesthetic value of two awesome looking armies having a battle. If you just have a bunch of space marine legs glued to bases and cardboard boxes with "Rhino" written on them then what's the point of playing? There are plenty of vastly superior games available if the models are just a more expensive version of cardboard counters and hex maps.

If ya got time to play, you got time to paint. I won't play against unpainted models.

I really don't understand how you can be pride to play when you army is a grey legion. It makes me think about these 12 yo kids who get into the Hobby, buy hundreds of minis and quit after six months like they were switching TV channels.

I don't think the argument of ''it's a game above all" or "modeling is not that important" is even valid. This stuff has been made to be painted and that's why it's so important for us; who gives a damn about a grey mini? Nobody. Would you cry if your fully painted army is lost for a reason? Sure.

Playing grey army is a sign of laziness and great despise for everything that make 40k so special (fluff, customization, personal involvement, creativity). If you're in 40k just to play (i.e just to win) I don't think you deserve the attention of the majority of players who spent hours to make their armies so great.

Either you paint & play, either you change for another game. No compromise.

I don't want to strip gak paint jobs, and I don't want to paint gak onto models wasting money and time, because people who play, want to play against finished product.

Then again, I haven't played that many games.

Do you want to play against an army, testing out your builds, playing strategically? or do you want to live the fluff.

Either way people play for different reasons.

Call them Grey Knights!

The funny thing is, wayyyyy back in the day, people would play unpainted Grey Knights, and they would be.... beige. The color of the old old old space marine plastics .

Then there were the guys who bought an airbrush, primed everything black and airbrushed it on an angle and BOOM. 3 Colors required? Airbrush a second tone at an angle. Yipee.

The hobby and game are what you put into it. Frankly, I have found that the people who put a lot of effort into their armies to be more entertaining to play. I'm not being a paint snob, and it isn't about how good the finished army is -- it's just about people putting *effort* into their army and caring what it looks like; they tend to be more engaging and interested in the same sorts of things as me.

I don't want to strip gak paint jobs, and I don't want to paint gak onto models wasting money and time, because people who play, want to play against finished product.

That's sad for you but IMO, you're missing the whole point of why playing 40k. And you will never prevent real 40k fans (understand : painters) from judging you for this. Whether you like it or not, there's a hierarchy between painters and non painters.

I'm not being a paint snob

I don't think there is such thing as paint snobs. As you said yourself, painting is great, painters are more entertaining and people who make great efforts to have decent armies should make feel to lazy grey-lovers that it is just not the way 40k is.

Perhaps I sound harsh, but I play Inquisition for a reason

 RazgrizOne wrote:
Perhaps I sound harsh, but I play Inquisition for a reason

I have some REALLY old Inquisitor models (like, 80s?) that I felt like painting Those were such awesome metal minis, excellent even by today's design standards. I have no idea why they got discontinued.

You also have to understand that it take time to paint an army. I re-start 40k only few month back and only 25% of my army is paint.

I can paint an average of 10 models per month…. and/or 2 tanks.

If you are talking about people who never paint it, them mix-feeling. As much as I found the painting part as (maybe more) interesting as the game, some people are only attract by the game itself.

You are free to not play agains an un-paint army but here is a rule that my FLGS apply when organizing a tournament:

- All models have "un-painted preferred enemy" as well as any prefer enemy rules the model might have.

It reward player who spend time and passion building a painted army.

I have some REALLY old Inquisitor models (like, 80s?) that I felt like painting

Lucky you. I'll be curious to see them.

I wasn't even born in the 80's but, I have the Inquisitor Coteaz mini which is not that bad in terms of awesomeness either !

You also have to understand that it take time to paint an army. I re-start 40k only few month back and only 25% of my army is paint.

I can paint an average of 10 models per month…. and/or 2 tanks.

If you are talking about people who never paint it, them mix-feeling. As much as I found the painting part as (maybe more) interesting as the game, some people are only attract by the game itself.

You are free to not play agains an un-paint army but here is a rule that my FLGS apply when organizing a tournament:

- All models have "un-painted preferred enemy" as well as any prefer enemy rules the model might have.

I do understand it takes a ton of time to paint everything. I respect people who try to paint despite being busy with plenty of other things and I will never cast the stone at them. At least they try, they are not like "Nah, painting is just stupid". Plus; you FLGS rule is really nice !

Love modelling and playing. Don't like painting. But playing with painted models feels better. So, the painting process goes on, albeit slooooooooooowly.

Just continually shame them as half humans and non participant neck beards....

Until their army looks better than yours....

Then condemn them for not having a life and being savant paint a holic neck beards.

At my FLGS, there's no prohibition on unpainted armies, but people will offer to show you how to paint. Like, you will not stop hearing about it until you finally paint your models.

You would be surprised what passes for a 3 stage paint job these days.

@RazgrizOne -- Here are a couple that I just grabbed off my shelf. The half painted one has literally been half painted since the 80s. The dude in Terminator armor, I love. Look at all the Inquisition badging!



That was back from when GW paints were in pots that look like the current P3 pots! Happy times.

Nice ones. I especially like the Terminator! The other one is quite.... weird ahah.

 RazgrizOne wrote:
Nice ones. I especially like the Terminator! The other one is quite.... weird ahah.

Yeah I have this habit of buying really old 40K stuffs off ebay or some other sources. I bought the 40K Rogue Trader rulebook this way.
I have a bunch of metal minis that I liked at first, but after assembling them I find my enthusiasm vanishes rapidly as a good many of them look really... silly. I especially hate the current SM range -- the older models all looked awkward. Only the relatively new character models looks slightly more anatomically correct (especially in comparison to the CSM Chosen models, the proportion makes a bit more sense). On one hand I'd love to see a new and better range for SM/CSM, on the other I'd hate to force myself to replace all the old ones. The day they update the style for the SM range for the better would be the day I play unpainted for a decade...

Why does this topic only seem to come up in GW subforums? Is it because the company constantly pushes for larger games, making it more difficult for new players to get their collections painted? And the seemingly daunting task of painting those large collections of minis would make starting all the jarder?

Ah come on now. We all know GW do some things that are wrong but are you seriously blaming them for hobbyists lack of painting?
There are tonnes of reasons models remain unpainted from kids/work to shakey hand syndrome and everything in between.. Blaming GW on this one is fairly lame.

Probably because the game is so awful that the only reason to play it is the aesthetic value of two awesome looking armies having a battle. If you just have a bunch of space marine legs glued to bases and cardboard boxes with "Rhino" written on them then what's the point of playing? There are plenty of vastly superior games available if the models are just a more expensive version of cardboard counters and hex maps.

You too Peregrine
Do you honestly believe the thousands of us that still play 40k regularly and at all levels do it purely for a visual aesthetic? A visual aesthetic does not equate to fun, which by and large 40k provides. It has some issues sure but at its core. Its Fun.

The sheer amount of people who like Wh40k but can't paint their models makes me deeply regret that I allowed my psychologist to convince me that I shouldn't spend 7 hours a day doing sculpting/painting and should seek a "realistic" career.

Every time there's a complaint about unpainted models, I strip and clean one of my half-painted models and immediately play a game with it.

If GW is pumping out updated codex and new models at their current rate, expect lots more games against the Great Unpainted.
FotM is a bigger problem now than it has been, and it's all GW's fault.

 Crablezworth wrote:
If ya got time to play, you got time to paint. I won't play against unpainted models.

Yeah, a 2-3 hour game totally compares to painting 1500+ points of mini's, especially things like Imperial Guard, Orks, etc. Good comparison.

 Ratius wrote:

Why does this topic only seem to come up in GW subforums? Is it because the company constantly pushes for larger games, making it more difficult for new players to get their collections painted? And the seemingly daunting task of painting those large collections of minis would make starting all the jarder?

Ah come on now. We all know GW do some things that are wrong but are you seriously blaming them for hobbyists lack of painting?

GW bears much of the blame, but it should be noted that even though it doesn't come up as much on other sub-forums, GW/40k is by no means the only or worst example of not painting.

For example, When our club first formed, for a years or so we played at another FLGS that had a very large WM presence. If our current FLGS and it's 40k club (meets on the same night as we do) usually only has 50% or less painted on the table, the WM players at our previous location were much worse. Maybe 30-40% painted on most evenings. I recall seeing one player open his locker (they had some school style lockers in the FLGS) and seeing 3-4 shelves packed with upainted metal. The tables were often fields of raw pewter. At first I thought this was unusual given the low model count of WM games, but then it was explained to me how many players will buy nearly the entire range of figures for a faction at one time just to have all the options available to them. Not really that different from buying a huge 40k army.

It is interesting that you don't see much of this on the PP sub-forum, I wonder if it could have something to do with WM being a comparatively young game (1 decade vs 3 for GW). WM has existed mostly in the time of wider acceptance of grey hordes and maybe the expectation for fully painted armies just hasn't been as strong in the WM community. I could be very wrong on this, it's just one possible explanation.

I for one play the game for the game first, modelling second and then painting. I hate painting models, and I'm not good at it either, further pushing it to the bottom of the priority list. And the cost of painting alone doesn't exactly help either. Especially if you want an airbrush and need to buy a decent tank etc along with it.

I don't feel a lick of shame for playing unpainted minis. That said however, painted minis are awesome. I would love to play with a painted army. But I very very rarely get past priming them.

The last time I was in the process of paining minis was 4ed sisters, with the witch hunter codex. And then came the white dwarf codex and I kinda shelved them until...god knows when. That put me off painting even more.

So anytime I have the opportunity to paint, I rather convert or build some other kit instead. And yet I would rather paint my minis myself than have them painted by some service. But I'm at a point where I don't think I'm ever going to paint them so I'm considering to get them painted anyway.