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@Kid_Kyoto, Dysartes:
Agreed, and choosing not to buy more Dorns on principle as a result is absolutely the correct choice. Mostly I just wanted to take the opportunity to make sure that Kid/any other readers who already had one are aware of it.

Tree_Beard wrote:
Hi all, I'm a pretty new Astra Militarum player.

Are there any rumors about the Leman Russ model being modernized any time soon?

To me, when I look at the model, it looks pretty dated and honestly a bit cartoonish with the comically huge main cannon. I want to start buying some tanks for my army, but I don't want to buy several Russes and then have GW come out with a newer, better model right after I do so.

Considering the infantry units got modernized somewhat recently, it seems like the Russ would also be a prime candidate to follow suit.

I don't follow 40k news and rumors that closely so would be curious what people here think.

I convert the majority of my miniatures. I actually share your take on the Leman Russ. I dislike the older kit. So I converted three tanks from Space Marine Rhino chassis and Space Marine bits. I rly like how they turned out. I will have to post the pictures of them once I get home from work. I am very proud of them... and my converted Rogal Dorn...

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
The HH version is brand new, but as other said has different turret weapons and no sponsons, an absolutely INFURIATING decision on GW's part and a return to the bad old days where they sold kits that literally could not be make the rules they wrote. Yes I know technically HH and 40k are different games but let's be serious here.

It's not "technically" it's just that they are different games and the kits are for different armies. The Aux Russ doesn't come with sponsons because the Aux Russ cannot take sponsons, it is literally a kit made with every option it can take in the Solar Aux rules. It's not a 40k kit.

I own both the 40k and solar aux Leman Russ, and while the newer solar aux tank has a lot of details, it lacks some open spaces to add your own touches. I really enjoyed building and painting the older kit, I could add a lot of my own little touches. I haven't painted the solar aux tank yet, as I'm a bit hesitant about painting the ornate trim and similar details

I extended the hull of my Leman Russes a bit and I think they look way better that way. It is relatively easy, as the sponson helps to cover most of the mess.

Brickfix wrote:
I own both the 40k and solar aux Leman Russ, and while the newer solar aux tank has a lot of details, it lacks some open spaces to add your own touches. I really enjoyed building and painting the older kit, I could add a lot of my own little touches. I haven't painted the solar aux tank yet, as I'm a bit hesitant about painting the ornate trim and similar details

The trim's easy to paint.

Spray the tank the color of the trim, then go from there. Bam!

Anyways:
the Solar Auxilia one can build basically every normal Russ. Just can't build the Punisher and the weird plasma shell one. Eradicator I think it is?

Crimson wrote:
I extended the hull of my Leman Russes a bit and I think they look way better that way. It is relatively easy, as the sponson helps to cover most of the mess.

Looks really good, well done!

Kanluwen wrote:

Brickfix wrote:
I own both the 40k and solar aux Leman Russ, and while the newer solar aux tank has a lot of details, it lacks some open spaces to add your own touches. I really enjoyed building and painting the older kit, I could add a lot of my own little touches. I haven't painted the solar aux tank yet, as I'm a bit hesitant about painting the ornate trim and similar details

The trim's easy to paint.

Spray the tank the color of the trim, then go from there. Bam!

Anyways:
the Solar Auxilia one can build basically every normal Russ. Just can't build the Punisher and the weird plasma shell one. Eradicator I think it is?

It's more that I'm actually not sure if I even want the trim. Either I paint them up as solar aux and have my armies lore that they are sacred relics (which die a lot so ... Hm), or they are an officers tank.
I own both types solar aux tanks, I build two from the box set as Vanquishers because they just look cool, the assault tank will be either plasma (I like the heresy plasma look) or volkite, which I can handwave as both executioner or punisher variants.
I will see how to attach left over sponsons, if at all.

I find it hilarious that the AM still use vehicles dependent on fossil fuels. Why is there a smoke stack/exhaust pipe on a vehicle which fires plasma cannons? They could at least trim that up a bit. Make it look like it wasn't built by Chevy/Ford. Same to same with the Baneblade lineup. Why are their barrels of fuel on the back of the baneblade? HOW IS THAT NOT a DANGER?

I recall the Chieftan has some commentary on external fuel tanks not being too bad. If they get shot, then the fuel just drips on the ground and burns there. As long as it doesn’t flow into a vent port or something else worky. Also noting that lots of tanks are even designed to have fuel dumped over the engine to form a smokescreen.

 Gert wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
The HH version is brand new, but as other said has different turret weapons and no sponsons, an absolutely INFURIATING decision on GW's part and a return to the bad old days where they sold kits that literally could not be make the rules they wrote. Yes I know technically HH and 40k are different games but let's be serious here.

It's not "technically" it's just that they are different games and the kits are for different armies. The Aux Russ doesn't come with sponsons because the Aux Russ cannot take sponsons, it is literally a kit made with every option it can take in the Solar Aux rules. It's not a 40k kit.

I don't have the SA list for HH, so I'm not sure if they're specific unit options, but if you want all the turret options it is two kits, not one.

I've picked the Command one up to use as a Tank Commander in 40k, when I get to it. Need to eBay some sponson sprues and see how tricky it'll be to add them when I get to it.

 Dysartes wrote:

 Gert wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
The HH version is brand new, but as other said has different turret weapons and no sponsons, an absolutely INFURIATING decision on GW's part and a return to the bad old days where they sold kits that literally could not be make the rules they wrote. Yes I know technically HH and 40k are different games but let's be serious here.

It's not "technically" it's just that they are different games and the kits are for different armies. The Aux Russ doesn't come with sponsons because the Aux Russ cannot take sponsons, it is literally a kit made with every option it can take in the Solar Aux rules. It's not a 40k kit.

I don't have the SA list for HH, so I'm not sure if they're specific unit options, but if you want all the turret options it is two kits, not one.

I've picked the Command one up to use as a Tank Commander in 40k, when I get to it. Need to eBay some sponson sprues and see how tricky it'll be to add them when I get to it.

I can help with that. I have a few spare sets of sponsons. I would trade for a few choice bits if you have them. Let me know.

 Flinty wrote:
I recall the Chieftan has some commentary on external fuel tanks not being too bad. If they get shot, then the fuel just drips on the ground and burns there. As long as it doesn’t flow into a vent port or something else worky. Also noting that lots of tanks are even designed to have fuel dumped over the engine to form a smokescreen.

It can be a danger in regards to the engine being fitted behind on many tanks, in that case, it is feared that if this fuel catches fire, it will in turn ignite the tank's engine. At least on Leclerc tanks that why we wouldn't use them, because they were too close to the engine, but they are supposed to be dropped on entering the combat area anyway.

However, if we, for example, assume that the Baneblade's engine is somehow insulated hermetically from the barrels of fuel, then there would be no danger.

 Gert wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
The HH version is brand new, but as other said has different turret weapons and no sponsons, an absolutely INFURIATING decision on GW's part and a return to the bad old days where they sold kits that literally could not be make the rules they wrote. Yes I know technically HH and 40k are different games but let's be serious here.

It's not "technically" it's just that they are different games and the kits are for different armies. The Aux Russ doesn't come with sponsons because the Aux Russ cannot take sponsons, it is literally a kit made with every option it can take in the Solar Aux rules. It's not a 40k kit.

They're two 28mm games set in the same universe using the exact same tank. I think the persnickety differences like sponsons are just annoying. I won't buy one for just that reason.

On the other hand, you can imagine so many patterns of leman russ that i'm willing to say why not, maybe one pattern ended up replacing the other. Taht's also a fun reason to make your own stuff via conversions.

I love the older metal leman russes that I've got, but i'm quite fond of the "recent one as well". I wouldn't be against a new kit, but these ones look just great to me.

Tree_Beard wrote:
Hi all, I'm a pretty new Astra Militarum player.

Are there any rumors about the Leman Russ model being modernized any time soon?

To me, when I look at the model, it looks pretty dated and honestly a bit cartoonish with the comically huge main cannon. I want to start buying some tanks for my army, but I don't want to buy several Russes and then have GW come out with a newer, better model right after I do so.

Considering the infantry units got modernized somewhat recently, it seems like the Russ would also be a prime candidate to follow suit.

I don't follow 40k news and rumors that closely so would be curious what people here think.

Sounds like you simply dont like the Leman Russ. No pun intended,dont take it this the wrong way. You should simply go Rogal Dorn instead if you like a less cartoonish tank.

The Leman Russ, just like the Basilisk Chimera, Valkyrie or Baneblade, ain't gonna recieve much changes to the their hull and silouette. These vehicles are the most iconic of their respective vehicle from all 40k categories (tank, artillery, transport, flier and titanic respectively).

If anything, they'll receive small upgrade sprues or slight improvements like they got in the past. But nothing fancy. And thats okey. They are already perfect in their own way. Out of these I mentioned, the Basilisk is the only one that needs an update, or at least an upgrade sprue with guys to man it.

 Dysartes wrote:
I don't have the SA list for HH, so I'm not sure if they're specific unit options, but if you want all the turret options it is two kits, not one.

The separate kits are the two loadout options, Strike and Assault. Sponsons aren't a thing for Auxilia Russes which is what the Mars pattern kit represents. Kid is whinging because a kit that is for one army in one system isn't exactly the same as the rules for another army in another system.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
They're two 28mm games set in the same universe using the exact same tank. I think the persnickety differences like sponsons are just annoying. I won't buy one for just that reason.

It's not persnickety at all though. Auxilia Russes don't get sponsons, so putting sponsons in the kit would make no sense.
The Deimos Rhino comes with a Havoc Launcher, a weapon that cannot be taken by Space Marine Rhinos, why did GW do that? Maybe its because the Deimos Rhino is for HH and not 40k?

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Gert wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
The HH version is brand new, but as other said has different turret weapons and no sponsons, an absolutely INFURIATING decision on GW's part and a return to the bad old days where they sold kits that literally could not be make the rules they wrote. Yes I know technically HH and 40k are different games but let's be serious here.

It's not "technically" it's just that they are different games and the kits are for different armies. The Aux Russ doesn't come with sponsons because the Aux Russ cannot take sponsons, it is literally a kit made with every option it can take in the Solar Aux rules. It's not a 40k kit.

They're two 28mm games set in the same universe using the exact same tank. I think the persnickety differences like sponsons are just annoying. I won't buy one for just that reason.

But gamesworkshop is trying to separate the two systems to reduce model overlap, to sell more stuff. Why would they offer options for a model it’s doesn’t have in the game it’s designed for??? They want you to buy two tanks, one for each game.

As for he hole in the dorn, I never got the complaints, there is literally no way the hoe, will be visible when you are using the tank. I’d rather they made it as is with all the options it had than lose stowage or crew bits to make the floor piece you will never see.

 Gert wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:
I don't have the SA list for HH, so I'm not sure if they're specific unit options, but if you want all the turret options it is two kits, not one.

The separate kits are the two loadout options, Strike and Assault. Sponsons aren't a thing for Auxilia Russes which is what the Mars pattern kit represents. Kid is whinging because a kit that is for one army in one system isn't exactly the same as the rules for another army in another system.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
They're two 28mm games set in the same universe using the exact same tank. I think the persnickety differences like sponsons are just annoying. I won't buy one for just that reason.

It's not persnickety at all though. Auxilia Russes don't get sponsons, so putting sponsons in the kit would make no sense.
The Deimos Rhino comes with a Havoc Launcher, a weapon that cannot be taken by Space Marine Rhinos, why did GW do that? Maybe its because the Deimos Rhino is for HH and not 40k?

The 40k Russ comes with all of its turret options (including a second turret) and all of its sponson options (including an extra set). The HH version is a rip-off. If they put all of its options in the kit I might have bought a few but without all of its parts I have no interest. And I'm one of the whales that blows around $400 a month on warhammer.

The Demios Rhino has a havoc launcher because they had them in the Heresy era... And thats why Chaos Marines can still use them. Demios is perfectly usable as is in a modern 40k army.

Uptonius wrote:
The Demios Rhino has a havoc launcher because they had them in the Heresy era... And thats why Chaos Marines can still use them. Demios is perfectly usable as is in a modern 40k army.

Perhaps I should make my point more clearly. The Legion Tactical Squad only comes with Bolters and some Sergeant options. How can GW release this HH kit and not give it all the things it has for its 40k rules?
Is that a bit more obvious?

Andykp wrote:
But gamesworkshop is trying to separate the two systems to reduce model overlap, to sell more stuff. Why would they offer options for a model it’s doesn’t have in the game it’s designed for??? They want you to buy two tanks, one for each game.

Heresy has been a separate system for years, this is not a new thing. It started off as a supplement to the 6th Ed rules then mid 7th it was adapted to its own ruleset when GW was making 8th. There is no "trying to separate" they are separate systems.

 Gert wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:
I don't have the SA list for HH, so I'm not sure if they're specific unit options, but if you want all the turret options it is two kits, not one.

The separate kits are the two loadout options, Strike and Assault. Sponsons aren't a thing for Auxilia Russes which is what the Mars pattern kit represents. Kid is whinging because a kit that is for one army in one system isn't exactly the same as the rules for another army in another system.

From my POV, it's odd that the HH Leman Russ doesn't have sponsons while the 40k one does - for what the Russ is used for, sponsons are an improvement, and it is odd to see something better in 40k than in HH.

Has anything addressed why they don't have them in HH, but do in 40k?

Scuttlebutt is that the FW designers didn't like sponsons, hence why they rarely appeared in FW photos and also why coaxial weapons were a thing for the FW variant turrets back in the day.

 Dysartes wrote:
From my POV, it's odd that the HH Leman Russ doesn't have sponsons while the 40k one does - for what the Russ is used for, sponsons are an improvement, and it is odd to see something better in 40k than in HH.

The Solar Aux uses tanks properly while the Guard (generally speaking) uses them as blunt objects. The Solar Aux also has the full capabilities of a more modern army, especially in terms of command structure and tactics while the Guard is essentially Napoleonic warfare with fancier guns.

Has anything addressed why they don't have them in HH, but do in 40k?

Not that I've ever seen, however, one of the POVs in Warhawk is a Russ tank crew and the commander notes that the sponsons are of little to no use in tank warfare. They took up more space, added more weight, and created an exposed weak point. If a sponson gets shot off after all, there's now a big gaping hole in the side of the tank.

LOL, OK then, no sponsons! They're like capes.

If I were designing the game, I'd have them slow the tank by 2" or so, enough to make a player question the need for them.

I remain slightly irked that GW now has 2 lines of 28mm plastics for 30-40k but I will survive.

Technically, I suppose that the wider silhouette should be an hindrance in and of itself to cross terrain and when determining LoS.

Plus when you couldn't fire 360 degrees in 3rd to 7th it was an added cost that wouldn't always be worth unless you could get into positions that allowed it, which is not alwaus the case, for example, in very crowded terrains.


But I guess I'm just being the spectre of the past here.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I find it hilarious that the AM still use vehicles dependent on fossil fuels. Why is there a smoke stack/exhaust pipe on a vehicle which fires plasma cannons? They could at least trim that up a bit. Make it look like it wasn't built by Chevy/Ford. Same to same with the Baneblade lineup. Why are their barrels of fuel on the back of the baneblade? HOW IS THAT NOT a DANGER?

A) a lot of the tanks have a port plugged into the barrel so that the oil in there is used first and the barrel is essentially an empty shell once you get to combat, B) if enemy can shoot rear of your tank there is a lot better targets than the oil barrel in there, C) they are dependent on fossil fuels because it's very energy dense power source that is easy to get even on low tech planets. Certainly much better than reactors burning fancy purified plasma or refined plutonium, where are you going to get that gak month into years long campaign?

Fun fact - German logistics at the end of WW2 was basically running on trucks burning wood (or coal if they had some on hand). Yes, literally, they had extra generator turning it into fuel because it turns out fancy high tech fuels are easy to cut off at multiple stages so the simpler you can make your supply the better, and Imperial stuff having engines that can run on any burnable stuff makes a lot of sense: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_gas

 Arschbombe wrote:
Rogal Dorn, like a lot of imperial kit, looks like it was designed by a 7-year-old.

It's literally WW2 era inspired US tank

Though I suppose you're kinda correct from certain point of view

Imperial tech is supposed to be brutalist and inefficient in stark contrast to the sleek efficiency of the Xenos factions who do not have a religious relationship with technology.

And yet, it's these 'inefficient' imperial tanks who understand the concept of 'armored front' while Tau and Eldar tanks have these gigantic, unarmored air intakes facing forward making the tank engine easy to blow up even with a laspistol, plus front plate shaped so perfectly (lacking roundstopper, tech so advanced it's on every Soviet tank starting in 1950s) any non penetrating hit is guided straight into ring turret, by far the weakest point on any tank, go figure

Andykp wrote:
As for he hole in the dorn, I never got the complaints, there is literally no way the hoe, will be visible when you are using the tank. I’d rather they made it as is with all the options it had than lose stowage or crew bits to make the floor piece you will never see.

Yeah, never got that particular 4chan amplified memewhining. Not only you never look at it from below, but if it really is that big of a problem, just cut piece of cardboard from the box it came in, glue it in hole glossy side up, prime, spray paint, presto, no hole

 Crimson wrote:

I extended the hull of my Leman Russes a bit and I think they look way better that way. It is relatively easy, as the sponson helps to cover most of the mess.

Nice, this does look way better than stock. Also helps to have the double auto cannons on the turret instead of the Wile E Coyote looking battle cannon.

I find the Leman Russ and Chimera (and even more so the SOB vehicles) to be horrible looking models, as a former Tanker, these things would be impossible to work on and have terrible armor angles. For me, they just kill my suspension of disbelief "Too Much". That being said the Eldar and Custodes vehicles are very cool and evoke a real Sci Fi image. The Space Marine Flying Boxes are meh. The Rogal Dorn is slightly better and reminds me of a T-26 Pershing.

Do we agree that the possibly worst part of it all is the pilot's hatch? I mean, from were it's placed, you actually would get one side of the tank completely obscured.

In fact the tracks might be the worst, but this pilot hatch is what bogged me the most from a faulty design standpoint. But 40k is about looking cool, not making sense, so I welcome it with a giggle.