I decided to make a Blood Angel army. I have a good core group of mini's, but am curious as to where I should expand.


My List of Minis

HQ:
Termy Librarian with storm bolter
Captain
Captain with LC

Elites:
5 AOBR Terminators
AOBR Dreadnought
5 Sternguard Vets

Troops:
Tactical Squad (Flamer, Missile Launcher, Rhino)
Tactical Squad (Flamer, Missile Launcher)
Tactical Squad (Meltagun)
Scout Squad (5 Sniper Rifles)


I need to get some Assault Squads, but I was wondering what I should add to my list of minis, and what some 500 pt, 750 pt, and 1000 pt army lists might look like. Any help is much appreciated.

Well if you are doing Blood Angels at least real Blood Angels you will have you use ther codex. What you have is a space marine army from the space marines codex. Go to the GW website FAQ to download the Blood Angels codex.

I already have the Blood Angels Codex downloaded and such.

My usual advice on the new (awful) BA Codex: It's awful because some units are great, and it more or less forces you into a build...

Veteran Assault Marines are great. Honor Guards with Jump Packs are great. Assault Terminators are pretty good.

IMO, the strongest list you can build with the BA Codex is going to have a lot of Jump Packs. I can't say that based on much experience, since I've shelved my BAs when the new Codex came out, but I'm certain that the point values point that way.

A list that might be worth trying, would be lots of Jump Packs combined with Land Raider(s). The Land Raiders can bring Assault Terminators, and also screen the Pack troops.

s1gns wrote:I already have the Blood Angels Codex downloaded and such.

Aside from the fact that their codex is no longer valid in a tournament setting, you need to be beaten with a shoe.

BUY YOUR OWN BOOKS!



It can't possibly be that difficult to realize that piracy is kinda, well, wrong.

Dronze wrote:

s1gns wrote:I already have the Blood Angels Codex downloaded and such.

Aside from the fact that their codex is no longer valid in a tournament setting, you need to be beaten with a shoe.

BUY YOUR OWN BOOKS!



It can't possibly be that difficult to realize that piracy is kinda, well, wrong.

Uh. Warseer?

Dronze wrote:

Aside from the fact that their codex is no longer valid in a tournament setting, you need to be beaten with a shoe.

BUY YOUR OWN BOOKS!



It can't possibly be that difficult to realize that piracy is kinda, well, wrong.

Umm.... GW offers it free as it was in WD? Think before you post.

Anyway... BA is a rewarding list to play, but you have to make your army work for you. With the list of minis you provided, I think you'd be better off playing vanilla SM. First off, you pay points in each tactical squad for a death company marine. It is not optional. If you don't have any models for death company, the points get wasted. It equates to like 30 points or something each squad is putting in to cover the cost of said marine. Not cheap. Secondly, being a assaulty-type army, you need some assault squads to really benefit (imho). Assault squads as troop choices really help out in 5th ed objective games. Third, you need some more IC s to make the list really competitive. At least a chaplain, or Brother Corbolo, is mandatory to reign in those death company marines. 4th, the scouts count as elite choices in the BA codex, not troop. Furthermore, sternguard vets do not really have a good place in the BA codex. They could be an honor guard for an IC, but that is pretty much it. Finally, the only good librarian for BA is Mephiston, because BA psy powers suck, for the most part. Your HQ choices are better spent buying Dante and Corbolo.

Thing that you have that will fit in:
Tactical squads will be fine once you have a death company squad to make the extra points worth it
Scouts can still be used, just in more limited capacity since they aren't troops in BA.
Termies are actually one of the most cost-effective units of a BA list, because you get a bonus DC trooper for a termy squad but don't pay any more than vanilla SM do!
The dreadnought is fine, just keep in mind if you play BA then get in quick and mix it up where the multi-melta will be more effective anti-armor.
Until you buy more ICs that pertain to BA, your captain and librarian will suffice.

That being said, I can suggest what you need:
Brother Corbolo (Super important, IMHO)
Death company equivalents (I made mine out of regular SM with chainswords and bolt pistols, like an assault squad without jump packs, for a lot cheaper than the going rate is for DCs now.)
Assault squads

Everything else is just supplemental. Bottom line: YOU NEED DC MARINES TO JUSTIFY THE HIGHER COST OF THE TACTICAL SQUADS. If that is the one thing you remember from this post then I did my job.

I suggest checking out this blog, as it is a very good place to pick up new tricks to make your marines more blood angelic.
http://warhammer40kbloodangels.blogspot.com/

Ok, getting down from the soap box. Hope it helps!

on the GW site it has a death company squad for 25 bucks, and a 2nd death company squad for 12. Which one is right? haha. I bought the scout marines and i've found that they totally suck, I wish I hadn't payed for them. You were talking about 30 points a model for DC but you get one free for 6 different squads, that will most likely be taken. So, you'd pay 120 points for a squad of 10 guys. That is pretty common for SM. That's only if I am getting my gak straight. I plan on getting some assault squads, maybe an honor guard. How would that list be.

Brother Corbulo
Honor Guard
DC Squad (2 boxes will be needed)
2 Assault Squads (to start)
3 Tac Squads (Might not use them all)
Termy Squad
Dreadnought
Rhino (Might get a 2nd for the Tac Squad)
Might get a Devastator Squad later on
Maybe a Baal Predator eventually

That seems like a solid start, although now looking back on it, it's a little elite heavy.

the 1st squad (box set):
4 death company with bolt pistol and chainsword, 1 death company with bolt pistol and chainsword / power sword option.


2nd squad (blister pack):
2 death company with bolt pistol and chainsword


if your taking death company then you will need to take a chaplin as the DC will simply wander off to attack random things, with a chaplin they are controled and have more hitting power.

Dev squads are a waste in a BA army, if you want them for anti troop then take a baal, if you want them for anti tank then take a las pred.

Wow, expensive. Brother Corbulo takes care of the DC Squad, so I don't need to worry about filling the Chaplain slot. I need 2 more Assault squads, a 2nd rhino, and a Baal Predator.

i was suggesting a chappy simply so you could take jump packs
either jump packs or a basic transport work, but without either they are pretty much dead.

The enemy I'm hoping.

the FNP and 3+ save is good, but most shooty armies will destroy them early on, knowing that they can do some damage.
only thing that annoys me with DC is the lack of upgrades.

I'm going to have to read the codex because I'm not sure which units have the FNP rule, but I'm guessing the DC.

the DC are mephiston are the only FNP users from what i can remember without loading up the file.

Ahh, that's nice. Mini plague marine minus the 1 toughness.

Yeah. For cost effectiveness, take a rhino with the DC. Jump packs are just too expensive and they don't offer additional protection like a rhino does. If you can put them in a land raider, all the better, because you know they are gonna take an ungodly amount of fire. (People are just as afraid of DC as they are termies, so they tend to dump fire on them to put them down quickly.)

Yeah as I was saying, a cheaper alternative is to buy some tactical marines off ebay or something for cheap, then use chainsword and bolt pistol bits for the arms instead, and then paint them black. they make cheap and good DC. I spent 20 dollars for 2 squads of tac marines off ebay, and another 8 dollars in chainsword and bolt pistol arms, and made 10 DC. I also had the other tactical squad as a bonus! Things are just cheaper that way. The regular DC blisters are just too spendy, IMO.

What I was saying about 30 points a DC is: thats how much more tactical squads cost for BA than vanilla SM. I was just making the case to buy or make models for the DC otherwise the points are wasted.

True, plus they're metal. @_@ Where did you buy the chainswords and bolt pistol arms? eBay as well?


I'm still not sure as to what you're saying. In my current list of mini's, i would have 5 DC units, and would pay 150 points for a full squad. A regular tac squad in the Blood Angels codex is about the same if I recall correctly. It's around 150?

Yeah. For cost effectiveness, take a rhino with the DC. Jump packs are just too expensive and they don't offer additional protection like a rhino does.

So very, very wrong.

You can't assault out of a Rhino. It's AV11 in the front. What sort of protection is that? Rhinos are not effective delivery platforms for assault troops. Shooty troops, like Sisters? Maybe. Not DC. Why pay 40 points to never get to use Furious Charge?

On top of that, you're paying 40 points for a Rhino no matter how many DC you field. If you only can fit 5 in your list? Still paying 40 points. With Jump Packs, it's 5 points per model for a Pack. You can scale the cost down, and with 8 or fewer (which is probably where you'll be), it's even or cheaper to use Packs.

The best defense for strong assault troops is to get into assault. Jump Packs will do that. A Rhino won't.

Also, FWIW, normal Assault Marines are a Troops choice for BAs. A Tac squad to hold your objectives will not be amiss, but they're not a great value for BAs. Going with Assault Marines allows you to overload the enemy with fast moving hitty models.

Ok yeah, maybe I am not explaining this right.

A tactical squad in SM codex = 30 pts less than the EXACT SAME SQUAD in the BA codex.

Therefore, your "free" DC marine is not free. That was the point I was making. Since you paid for them, take the models is the point I was trying to get across.

I got my arms bits from an ebay auctioneer named Hoard O Bits, go for the auctions as the buy it now prices can be a little steep. The competition is not as fierce for MEQs arms, like Black Templar or Dark Angels, but they usually come in larger sets and they have a bunch of extra iconography on them, so it is a tradeoff.

What might a good 750 pt and 1000 pt list look like?

Ahh, alright ill check it out. Thanks FoxPhoenix

Therefore, your "free" DC marine is not free.

This is true for the Tac squads, which is why they're not great bargains. When it comes to Veteran Assault Squads, Honor Guards and Assault Terminators, the value is a lot better.

Tac squads are upcosted by 40 points (with Flamer and ML). Not very good.

Assault Squads are upcosted by 40 points as well, over the current Codex. It was only 30 points in the previous Codex, which was better. That's why I was recommending them over Tacticals. At this point, I guess they break even (my bad).

Terminators, on the other hand, are costed identically to the current SM Codex, meaning you get a FREE DC Marine. Considering how great Thunder Hammer Terminators are these days, it's not a tough call to use a squad or two.

Veteran Assault Squads are a TOTAL no brainer. Even without the DC Marine they provide, they're a deal. Compare them to Vanguard Marines. They have identical statlines, plus Jump Packs, for 30 points. The Vanguards are 35 points each with packs. Their free Power Sword makes them 3 points more in a 5 man squad. Yes, they get Heroic Intervention, but I'd gladly trade that for an extra DC Marine.

Same goes for Honor Guard, but you're limited to 5 man squads.

Could anybody help me with 500, 750, and 1k point lists?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BNIB-Space-Wolves-Blood-Claws-Squad-Save-15_W0QQitemZ260380975825QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Toys_Wargames_RL?hash=item260380975825&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1761|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318


sorry about the huge link, but theres a cheap unit of death company (10 men)
it includes all the bolt pistol and chainsword arms you will ever need for them



also, bear in mind you cant take sternguard when using the BA codex.
so just take assault vets with meltagun x2
you can also throw them in a pod to make sure you drop them when needed.

1 moment and ill start on those lists for you

500 Point BA list:



chaplin: 100

tactical squad: meltagun - 125
razorback: lascannon - 80

tactical squad: 115
razorback: lascannon - 80


BA are annoying at low points, trying to get good anti tank aswell as some normal fire power.
you can allways drop the las on one of the razors to take something else.





750 Point BA list



chaplin: 100

tactical squad: meltagun - 125
razorback: lascannon - 80

tactical squad: 115
razorback: lascannon - 80

Baal predator: heavy bolter sponsons - 125

Baal predator: heavy bolter sponsons - 125



1,000 Point BA list:



chaplin: 100

tactical squad: meltagun - 125
razorback: lascannon - 80

tactical squad: 115
razorback: lascannon - 80

Tactical squad: +5 men, heavy bolter - 200
razorback: 50

Baal predator: heavy bolter sponsons - 125

Baal predator: heavy bolter sponsons - 125



those are just a few smaller builds, i prefer to play 1,500 - 2,500 games, that way you get some better units available.
in smaller games you cant really take vets and death company due to points values, but all these lists should have an ok mix of anti tank and anti infantry.

You don't recommend Brother Corbulo instead of a Chaplain?

i chose a normaly chappy to give you room for changes.
if you need a fist in the army you can simply drop something and upgrade the chappy.
i dont really rate corbulo that highly.

only characters ill usually take are either dante in a fast assault army or meph in a all out CC army.

I was thinking of getting Brother Corbulo though, plus my friends would always allow me to use him as a regular chaplain if i wanted. Dante will be later. Also, thanks for the link for those chainswords and bolt pistols

You can assault out of a close topped vehicle that hasn't moved, so a Rhino driving up 12" can then wait until the next turn to disembark the troops and have them rush out. That's what Chaos does, no reason why BA can't do the same thing.

no probs
i allways use them for assault troops.

none have wolf marks on them (they are extra parts on the sprues)
you do get some nice weapons with em though

That's pretty sweet.

I have played Blood Angels since the start of fifth edition. I have started to develop a pretty good track record with them but have yet to take them to a tournament. I started them because I liked the list, and I believe that conceptually it is the best organized SM list. I still think they should have just added the new units and tweaked the cost of other things for the new Marine Codex, but that is neither here nor there.

Here are a few general tips I have picked up, and you can apply them as you will.

Assault Marines as troops are good, but they are an all or nothing type list entry, meaning if you are going to field them, you are better putting a crap ton of Marines down, rather then the occasional one or two units. Taken in small numbers Assault Marines tend to be rather large targets and don't tend to survive long. A unit of ten works well when paired with 8 to 10 Jumping Death Company, for example.

The Tactical Marine Squad in a Rhino is our bread and butter. Generally a full 10 Man Squad with a special weapon and a powerweapon or powerfist is cheaper then a 10 Man Assault Squad, is more survivable (because of the transport) and is generally more flexible. I tend to stick to Flamer or Meltagun for the option to charge after my transport is busted. The Rhino is 50% of the time is even as quick as assault marines! Rule of thumb with them is to not be too aggressive, let your opponent either ignore them or destroy the Rhino, just make sure the squad is in position around turn two or three to be in range of an objective.

I saw your Terminator thread and I will address it here. I love BA Terminators because, technically, our Terminators are the cheapest because they come with a DC marine. Also, we can pop them in (admittedly overpriced) Drop Pods which compensates for our extreme lack of teleport homers in the list. I have found though that the best are the Assault Terminators in a Land Raider Crusader, with an attached Chaplian. My favorite mixture is 3 TH/SS and 2 Twin Lightning Claws. usually the Chaplian is making up for the lost LC attacks. Plus Nob Bikers generally don't like Thunderhammers and the more attack there the better.

Corbulo is nice, but not necessary. I have found to find more success with a carefully placed Chaplain. The problem with him is two fold. Knowing where to place him and taking advantage of his range. I have found that a good Land Raider is the best to place him is as it really expands his effective range. What I have found though is that our best assault units (Assault Terminators, Death Company) either already has the Furious Charge or has access to higher strength attacks. Sure it would be nice to get Furious Charging LC Terminators, but is it worth 100 points on a character that doesn't have a power weapon? Your results may vary, and I have had good success with him, but taking him really dictates your list and basically removes 100 points for a limited ability, at at least an ability that keeps your army close enough to take advantage of him.

Mephiston is a nice character, but I haven't had that much luck with him. In a world with PK Nobz in successful delivery systems and 3++ Thunderhammer Terminators, his lack of an invulnerable save is a big disadvantage. I have found his use not as necessary as it would seem.

Dante is the only character I haven't tried yet, but he is essential in the all jumping list.

You biggest hurdle will be with Death Company, as in what to do with them. I have found that a large squad tends to work better. They are not as good as they where in fourth with rending toned down and feel no pain not what it used to be. I have come to rely on a Chaplian with a Powerfist to baby sit them. Even though Lemartes is a cheaper option, I have found that having a fist in that squad is essential for the utility.

So far my most successful lists have been Assault Terminators in a Land Raider and a unit of at least 8 Death Company with Jump packs, flavor with characters, tanks, and other assault marines as necessary.

I will go over your minature list:

HQ:
Termy Librarian with storm bolter - Nice model, doesn't really fit our list, we have two useless powers. Though if you are going to field a Libby, Terminator Armor is neccessary.
Captain - This is the BR Captian right? You may never field him as your collection grows
Captain with LC - Stick a Jump Pack on him and let him lead some assault Marines

Elites:
5 AOBR Terminators - Try and get ahold of a Cyclon Missle Launcher or a Heavy Flamer
AOBR Dreadnought - I have fielded him "as is" and have had pretty go success, if anything to tie up oncoming units, and the Melta is the best weapon for "standard" dreadnoughts. Unfortunately a Furioso is cheaper and better, so try and get another DCCW arm if you can and convert him.
5 Sternguard Vets - Call them VAS and stick them in a Drop Pod, best as a Melta delivery system. Since the DP is essentially free, it doesn't hurt as much as the 50 point one.

Troops:
Tactical Squad (Flamer, Missile Launcher, Rhino) - Good, you have done well, thought the Missle Launcher is unnecessary,and you will find yourself keeping them 10 men more then combat squading them. I have tried the BA gunline, not so good.
Tactical Squad (Flamer, Missile Launcher) - Buy a Rhino
Tactical Squad (Meltagun) - Buy a Rhino
Scout Squad (5 Sniper Rifles) - You won't find much use for these, though I have always been tempted by the shotgun armed ones as a flanking unit.

In closing, BA makes you be a little more aggressive then standard marines. The only thing that will keep you from going crazy everytime you see the toys "real marines" get is to play what makes the BA unique. Death Comapny, the characters we have, and where are list has slight advantages over the normal list is where we thrive.

That's a very informative post. Should I put PF's on my sergeants in my squads? Should I drop the missile launchers and put a meltagun on them? I might get 1-2 full squads of assault marines, and ill have to make some DC models when I can. I might get a Chaplain with PF, but i'm going to get Brother Corbulo as well. Dante will come much later as I fine tune my list. Do you have any suggestions for a 750 pt -1000pt list?

Mahu, thats a bloody good post


just as a slight add on with the scouts though:

they dont really have much use, they drain away an elite space, so your paying those points for a unit with less chance of surviving an assault / round of fire, they cannot be used as a scoring unit.

about the only plus side is thier weapons, but in the BA dex there are units that do much better jobs all round.



after playing BA i would never use vanilla marines again
BA is the ultimate assault army when it comes to marines.

Should I put PF's on my sergeants in my squads?

You should have at least a Power Weapon or Powerfist, either one works. I currently try and match the close combat weapon with my special weapon so I know what squads they would be the most useful against. I.E. I pair the Melta and the Powerfist, so if I have to go tank hunting with them and I miss with the Melta, I can try and follow up with a charge.

Remember, your biggest temptation is going to be aggressive with them. RESIST! They are your scoring units, and it is more important that they are alive at the end of the game and on an objective, then to have won any combat.

Should I drop the missile launchers and put a meltagun on them?

Heavy Weapons are not necessary and we don't get them for free. The only reason to take a heavy weapon is if you plan to combat squad the unit and add some fire support. You may want to try that and see how it works for you, but I can tell you that it is generally a bad idea. The leadership is low (comparatively), you are paying a premium for them (because of the cost of the unit), and you are going to have a hard time justifing the other 5 Marines. Not to mention getting boned every Dawn of War mission you play.

Having said that though, I have fielded a Corbulo list where I stuck him in a 5 Man Squad in a Razorback and had a Heavy Weapon squad. It worked fine, but it was lackluster and not really competitive.

I have tried Devestators and I own 2 10-men units. I don't ever see them outside of APOC now. We don't do gun lines well.

I might get 1-2 full squads of assault marines, and ill have to make some DC models when I can.

Don't worry about getting "official" Death Company Models. mine are Dark Angel robed model painted and converted with GS on the Pads. When players see Black Marines in a sea of Red, they know what they are.

I might get a Chaplain with PF, but i'm going to get Brother Corbulo as well. Dante will come much later as I fine tune my list.

Chaplains are essential to the list. I have every conceivable configuration in Chaplian models, but don't own a single Librarian.

I will get back to you on the example lists.

Another hell of a post Mahu. You're a great help. I'm pumped to see your example lists

Mahu makes a very good point about heavy weapons not being neccessary... In fact, I went as far as to issue each of my Tactical squad sergeants just regular bolters, because it is not their role to engage in assaults. I prefer to have that two extra shots on the move, giving the assault-specific squads some more support.

But if you think you might be facing armor, you may need the xtra oomph that the heavy weapons give. In fact, when I know I'll be facing orks (at every competition I have been to recently) I try to put in either a ML for the pie plate or a Heavy Bolter for the extra shots. Your tactical squads DO NOT want to mix it up with orks anyway, so standing off at a distance and trying to pick them apart generally is the best course of action.

I'm sure Mahu has some to add to this.

I really don't like Frag grenades though. They have a small blast and they really suck imo. I'd rather put a Heavy Bolter on a tactical squad rather then the ML if i were to face Orks.

I'm sure he does, Mahu's a wealth of information apparently

Oh, I almost forgot. Do you only get a DC soldier if you have one of each type it states, or can you have multiples. For example, if I were to field 2 Space Marine Squads, would I get 2 DC soldiers? Or can I only claim one?

If i remember correctly it states that for each selection you may take one DC marine, so you would get two,

for each unit taken of the types you get a free DC marine.
so 2 of the specific units (same type or different) would get you 2 free DC marines

Alright, just wanted to make sure.

I think the best way to go with BA is a mechanized list that has a couple of jump infantry units. Jump infantry uses the rhinos to hide until they are close enough to charge. As Mahu has pointed out tactical squads are the BA workhorse... They are much better at holding objectives than assault squads and you can take heavy weapons and assault weapons. I run two full tactical squads and one full assault squad all in rhinos. I just run a meltagun and power fist in my tactical squads but I can definitely see a place for cheap lascannons in these squads. The assault squad is my shock troop... I can afford to lose them but they force my opponents to react to them.

I also run a five man DC squad with Brother Corbulo in a rhino as well. I get all five DC Marines paid for by taking five other squads and only have to pay additional for their rhino. To be honest DC with jump packs are more powerful since they can cover more ground quickly and charge but because I run Corbulo the rhino approach is best for my style. The DC in a rhino is still a strong unit in assault and they can kill just about anything if you roll well for their rending attacks. I also use them as another shock troop but I hold them back until the latter stages of the game. A small squad does best when the enemy has been thinned down.

Our rhinos have OCE which is a huge advantage BA have over vanilla Marines. You should be able to get on top of objectives early in the game which puts the pressure on your opponent. It is very to dig out a squad of ten tactical Marines sitting on top of an objective when they are hiding behind their rhino. This is one of the main reasons why I run mine with meltaguns... It's very easy to roll up and execute a drive-by attack on enemy armor.

I very much recommend the Baal predator... It also has OCE and is basically a very cheap mobile Dev squad. Front AV13 is very resilient these days. I run two and set them up side by side... They will chew through anything in front of them. They are also great for contesting objectives late in the game since they have OCE. I think the Baal is the best tank in the game for the points.

I also run Dante with two 5 man VAS squads. Each VAS squad has two power fists and a meltagun. Remember than Dante also has a meltagun (perdition pistol). These units are great for shooting armor and excel in close combat... even moreso when escorting Dante. I have beaten job bikers on multiple occassions so I know from experience that my list is solid and I consider it a top tier army. It had mistakenly been referred to as a 4th edition army build but in fact it is a throwback to the old 3rd edition rhino rush with a small amount of jump infantry. Jump infantry is a lot more powerful now since assault is so deadly and you cannot charge out of a moving rhino.

Something important to understand when building a BA army is that most of our units are expensive and you need either a chaplain or Brother Corbulo to control the DC. You have to field DC since you are paying for them so you want to make sure that your overall build synergizes with the DC. The VAS is also one of our best units and with Dante closeby I feel they are more powerful than DC since they can take options. Dante and Corbulo is the most powerful since you get furious charge and preferred enemy plus Dante's death mask reduces enemies' WS by -1... So typically you are hitting on 3+ with a reroll... It just doesn't get any better than that and makes all those power fists even deadlier. This build is better than BT... You are hitting first on 3+ with the reroll.

G

So your list looks something like this?

HQ
-----
Dante (225)
Brother Corbulo (100)

Elites
---------
VAS (150)
VAS (150)
DC (Rhino) (40)

Troops
----------
10-Man Assault Squad (PF, Plasma Pistol, Rhino) (330)
Tactical Squad (Meltagun, PF, Rhino) (265)
Tactical Squad (Meltagun, PF, Rhino) (265)

Heavy Support
--------------------
Baal Predator (HB Sponsons) (125)
Baal Predator (HB Sponsons) (125)

1775 Pts total, which of course I'm guessing you have some variations on the list.


*Revised the list*

The assault squad has a power fist and a plasma pistol. Each VAS squad is only five Marines each so the running total is 1850.

G

Oh and both Baals have HB sponsons.

G

Oooh, alright. What a solid list. Out of curiosity, you don't find termies needed?


P.S. Was I right in saying that you put your Assault Squad in a Rhino?

P.S.S. Could you check the revised list? I feel like I'm leaving out points since you said its an 1850 pt list.

P.S.S.S. (Hopefully the last edit to this damn post) Could you go over some match-ups? I play against SoB, Eldar (NOT mechanized yet, but will soon), Tau, Nurgle CSM, Orks (Which is my 2nd army that I lend to others to play), and 'Nids. How will BA fair against those armies. Pro's/Con's to the BA list against those armies, and what I could expect / should-dos while playing would be much appreciated.

Thanks to all who have been helping me with BA. You're all such an informative bunch.

Termies usually get singled out quickly, so actually have a LOWER survival rate due to their small squad sizes. If played right, your DC should equate to a termy squad.

Yes my assault squad has a rhino. Termies don't work well in a BA army... Too slow unless you put them in a landraider which is a lot of points when you already have DC or could field VAS.

I match up well against most armies. Mech eldar and mech dark eldar you have to really put some thought into your movement. Dark lances pretty much bounce off of AV13 which hurts DE since the Baals absolutely eat them alive.

G

ive tried to get termies working in a BA army, but there are just much better choices you can take instead.

if your taking vet. assault squads they can be used for tank hunting.
throw them in a pod and give them 2 meltaguns, drop them near any armour, 2 of them have a great chance of killing most vehicles, however, against some armies its not really worth dropping that many points in the middle of an army to kill a basic vehicle.
things like land raiders are fair game due to thier cost and destructive capabilities.

I would rather have vets with jump packs because they are great in assaults. If you put them in a pod they will get shot up and they are too expensive to lose them like that.

G

i know GBF, but i would use them as a drop suicide unit if it ment taking out an enemy land raider in the process

I think the best way to go with BA is a mechanized list that has a couple of jump infantry units. Jump infantry uses the rhinos to hide until they are close enough to charge. As Mahu has pointed out tactical squads are the BA workhorse... They are much better at holding objectives than assault squads and you can take heavy weapons and assault weapons. I run two full tactical squads and one full assault squad all in rhinos. I just run a meltagun and power fist in my tactical squads but I can definitely see a place for cheap lascannons in these squads. The assault squad is my shock troop... I can afford to lose them but they force my opponents to react to them.

I agree.

I tend to run two full tactical squads in Rhinos and a full 10-man Assault Squad with Jump Packs. I usually pair the Assault Squad with a Large Jumping Death Company Squad for mutual support.

Unless you are really good with Rhinos, hiding Assault Marines are usually problematic, with true line of sight justifying targeting them more. I have found that you either have to support them with additional Jump Units or you hold them back and just use them to "retake" your home field objective late game.

I also run a five man DC squad with Brother Corbulo in a rhino as well. I get all five DC Marines paid for by taking five other squads and only have to pay additional for their rhino. To be honest DC with jump packs are more powerful since they can cover more ground quickly and charge but because I run Corbulo the rhino approach is best for my style. The DC in a rhino is still a strong unit in assault and they can kill just about anything if you roll well for their rending attacks. I also use them as another shock troop but I hold them back until the latter stages of the game. A small squad does best when the enemy has been thinned down.

I have found small units of Death Company to be lackluster, especially in the face of what you can tend to face on the table top. Death Company are usually either a small suicide unit, or a big game changer unit. But that is just me, I tend to not find rending all that great, your results may vary, but I find putting Death Company on "softer" target to be better and use units like Terminators with a lot of high str. attacks tackle the big stuff.

Our rhinos have OCE which is a huge advantage BA have over vanilla Marines. You should be able to get on top of objectives early in the game which puts the pressure on your opponent. It is very to dig out a squad of ten tactical Marines sitting on top of an objective when they are hiding behind their rhino. This is one of the main reasons why I run mine with meltaguns... It's very easy to roll up and execute a drive-by attack on enemy armor.

I agree but I have also found use in Flamers, but I play against a lot of Orks (and soon a lot of IG).

Anti-tank in my list usually comes in the form of Attack Bikes, Meltaguns, Land Raider Crusaders, Vindicators, and good old close combat.

Mahu wrote:

I think the best way to go with BA is a mechanized list that has a couple of jump infantry units. Jump infantry uses the rhinos to hide until they are close enough to charge. As Mahu has pointed out tactical squads are the BA workhorse... They are much better at holding objectives than assault squads and you can take heavy weapons and assault weapons. I run two full tactical squads and one full assault squad all in rhinos. I just run a meltagun and power fist in my tactical squads but I can definitely see a place for cheap lascannons in these squads. The assault squad is my shock troop... I can afford to lose them but they force my opponents to react to them.

I agree.

I tend to run two full tactical squads in Rhinos and a full 10-man Assault Squad with Jump Packs. I usually pair the Assault Squad with a Large Jumping Death Company Squad for mutual support.

Unless you are really good with Rhinos, hiding Assault Marines are usually problematic, with true line of sight justifying targeting them more. I have found that you either have to support them with additional Jump Units or you hold them back and just use them to "retake" your home field objective late game.

I also run a five man DC squad with Brother Corbulo in a rhino as well. I get all five DC Marines paid for by taking five other squads and only have to pay additional for their rhino. To be honest DC with jump packs are more powerful since they can cover more ground quickly and charge but because I run Corbulo the rhino approach is best for my style. The DC in a rhino is still a strong unit in assault and they can kill just about anything if you roll well for their rending attacks. I also use them as another shock troop but I hold them back until the latter stages of the game. A small squad does best when the enemy has been thinned down.

I have found small units of Death Company to be lackluster, especially in the face of what you can tend to face on the table top. Death Company are usually either a small suicide unit, or a big game changer unit. But that is just me, I tend to not find rending all that great, your results may vary, but I find putting Death Company on "softer" target to be better and use units like Terminators with a lot of high str. attacks tackle the big stuff.

Our rhinos have OCE which is a huge advantage BA have over vanilla Marines. You should be able to get on top of objectives early in the game which puts the pressure on your opponent. It is very to dig out a squad of ten tactical Marines sitting on top of an objective when they are hiding behind their rhino. This is one of the main reasons why I run mine with meltaguns... It's very easy to roll up and execute a drive-by attack on enemy armor.

I agree but I have also found use in Flamers, but I play against a lot of Orks (and soon a lot of IG).

Anti-tank in my list usually comes in the form of Attack Bikes, Meltaguns, Land Raider Crusaders, Vindicators, and good old close combat.

I was thinking of using terminators in my list, since you get a free DC soldier. The termies would be a much better option to use against the tougher melee unites such as my friends scorpions and would romp Plague marines in an assault. The DC I would have to worry about, plus rending is only so-so unless you roll a lot of 6's. Theres just so many options to consider in building my army that it's tough to decide what elites to play. I'm definitely taking 2 Tac Squads in Rhinos with the wargear in my list above. 2 Baal Pred's is also a definite. I'm definitely going to take Dante and Brother Corbulo because they're too good. I'm unsure as to what wargear I'm going to deck out my Termies with. 3 TH/SS and 2 Dual LC I'm thinking. I need to print out my codex, and sit down and read it.

JD21290 wrote:i know GBF, but i would use them as a drop suicide unit if it ment taking out an enemy land raider in the process

That is an un-necessary waste of a great unit... see what listening to Beetlejuice causes...

G

Termies don't work for BA. If you are going to take a unit because you get one free DC Marine this army is not for you.

G

Termies work for BA. If you build your list right.

BA is the ultimate assault army when it comes to marines.

I disagree. Templars got BA beat in the assault department...LOL. 10 Assault Terminators with FC, 5 LC's and 5 TH's lead by Grimaldus kills everything it touches.


Capt K

BA has all that plus -1 to your WS and furious charge.

G

I think that it is inappropriate to discuss black templar in this thread. This thread pertains only to Blood Angel tactics, not a contrast and comparison to other MEQs or races.

I agree that terminators CAN work in a BA list, but I use them sparingly. I would rather pay the 30 points for an extra DC marine than tie up another 200 for the same DC marine. I only take termies when I have the points available after everything else I want has already been picked.

True, I didn't exactly mean to only take termies instead of other things. That wasn't exactly what I meant. A terminator squad is the same as in the SM codex, so in a sense it's a free DC soldier. I would always choose them after all the other stuff I wanted, as FoxPhoenix already mentioned.

I like Terminators as a support Assault unit that brings a lot of high strength attacks to the list which I believe to be essential in 5th Edition.

I disagree with GBF on two points:

1. Baal Predators are the win! - Baal Predators are good, don't get me wrong, and they are pretty much the only Predator varient you should consider on getting for your list, but they are not the only Heavy Support choice we have to be competitive. I tend to lean towards Vindicators as they have a higher strength, and tend to do about the same about of damage to Infantry units on the move as the Baal but with a better chance at taking out a tank. I also personally like the Vindicator, so that may inform why I put more emphasis on it. Now this is my own personal preference and I am not saying the Baal is a bad tank, I am just saying it is not our only choice.

2. The use of small squads - I generally dislike small squads for a few reasons. They are very fragile in assault, they tend to raise your kill point amount, and they tend to be not very effective, at least in my hands. I understand why he does it, he brings multiple squads to keep his DC "free", I disagree with this philosophy. I tend to look at the Death Company as a unit I want to take anyways, so I don't mind paying for them. And when it comes to it, the DC are never free, our units are more expensive to account for the Marine that we get. When I build lists for my BA, I tend to go in either two directions, either I add the DC last and just fit what I can in the points I have left, or I take the DC unit I want and slowly subtract the difference as I add other units in the list. Army Builder is actually quite good with this (it automatically subtracts the cost of a DC marine every time you add the appropriate unit to the list), and I tend to rely on it now when I build my lists as it lets me account for the DC easier.

For your reference, here is my current list, roughly, as I don't have the points cost on me:

-HQ-

Chaplain with Powerfist and Jump pack
Chaplain with Terminator Armor

-Elites-

Assault Terminators (3 TH/SS, 2 LC)
8 Death Company with Jump Packs

-Troops-

10-man Tactical Squad w/ Flamer, Powerweapon in Rhino
10-man Tactical Squad w/ Meltagun, Powerfist in Rhino
10-man Assault Squad w/ Powerweapon

-Fast Attack-

Attack Bike w/ Multimelta

-Heavy Support-

Land Raider Crusader
Vindicator w/ Dozerblade, Storm Bolter



Basically I send the Death Company, Assault Marines and Land Raider at the enemy. Sometimes I try and flank with the DC and Assault Marines and use the Land Raider and Vindicator as a stop gap measure for the enemies advance. The Tactical Squads either hang back or conservatively head towards the enemy. SInce 5th edition is more about being at the right place at the right time more then just straight killing, I tend to be a little more conservative. With the early game dedicate to getting into position and eliminating the greater threats and the late gem being about a push towards the objectives. So I tend to be more concerned with my manuvers then the amount of damage I can do.

There is nothing wrong with small powerful units. Use the wolf pack strategy to win with them.

I think the vindi is a great tank too but it will draw more fire plus you need two of them to make sure they perform well for what they can do. I prefer Baals for mass firepower and OCE.

G

So you only take 1 assault squad? They really attract that much fire?

They attract fire only if you don't give your opponent any other options.

In my list, I have a Land Raider filled with goodies, a Vindicator, and a large DC squad coming at you. Suddenly your opponent is not paying that much attention to the Assault Squad. Even if they do, I usually position the DC between enemy shooting and the assault squad. So your opponent either shoots the DC with their feel no pain or they shoot at the assault squad with a 4+ cover save, both are rather survivable in that concept.

My earlier argument was about fielding assault marines on their own. I support mine with Jumping Death Company, if I didn't I would take at least two Assault Squads.

I still want to eventually build the "jump death" army where every model is a jump infantry model supported by Dante, that would be fun.

Here are the considerations I usually take when building my list in 5th edition: how many kill points does it give up, are my scoring units fast enough and durable enough for objectives, and what would my opponent consider the greater threats.

I mean the Vindicator is nice, but one of the primary reasons I field it is the pure panic factor it brings to your opponent. Any early game shooting at the Vindicator is a good thing to me, because it leaves the rest of my list free to advance. The Land Raider is a big threat but it is durable enough to take it. Most of the time my Land Raider is barely scathed in games because opponents seem to be more afraid of the Vindicator. You have done something right if you are find your opponent more afraid of something that cost a third of your biggest units combinations.

So take that into consideration. Before every game think "if I was playing my opponents army, what would I be the most afraid of" and try to use that to your advantage.

Mahu wrote:

2. The use of small squads - I generally dislike small squads for a few reasons. They are very fragile in assault, they tend to raise your kill point amount, and they tend to be not very effective, at least in my hands. I understand why he does it, he brings multiple squads to keep his DC "free", I disagree with this philosophy.

I subscribe to that philosophy but for more than just keeping the DC "free." For whatever reason, there is a point efficiency built into the current BA list when you take small assault squads. If you buy two 5-man assault squads and put them in Rhinos you're getting about 310 points of stuff for 280 points. If you buy a 10-man assault squad and leave them with their packs you're breaking even at 250 points. Giving them a rhino has you overpaying by 10 points (effectively paid 50 for packs, got a rhino worth 40). The only real downside to taking the 2 small squads is the extra kill point. The upsides are 2 DC models, 2 veteran sergeants, 2 rhinos, and the ability to take upgrades on the two sergeants instead of just one.

I disagree. 2 small squads means that you have 2 squads that will be vunerable to morale checks after losing 3 models. You may say "but if you double that for a large squad, that is six, so it is the same, what's your point?"

Well my point is, with 2 small squads, an enemy can concentrate fire on a single squad and put it below the 50% mark a lot quicker, meaning you can possibly lose that unit to morale failure. With one large squad, it will take more firepower to put down 6 models in one turn and force a morale check. If they can put down that much firepower easily than you have bigger things to worry about than your squad size.

That's a valid point, but it strikes me as more relevant to the jump infantry configuration where the unit can be targeted on its way into melee. Even then it's a judgment call based on more factors than just how you configured your assault squad. What is the rest of your army? Do you have veterans, death company or honor guard on the board? If so why is your opponent targeting the assault squad? There is also a little bit of a fire break effect to consider when you have two squads. Fire directed at one won't affect the other. A 10 man squad could run after losing 3 models where it would take 4 to get both 5 man squads to test and the odds are that they won't both fail. I think it's complex enough that it doesn't lend itself to a hard and fast rule that says 1 10-man unit is always better than 2 5-man units.

Thanks to FoxPheonix for posting the link to Jawaballs blood angels blog. That is a great wealth of information complete with a lot of video battle reports.

I started reading this thread because I am building a blood angels army, and I am a total blood angels noob. All this info has been really helpful.

Have you thought about working up jump packs and back packs with magnets so that you can run your assault squads and DC both ways. Run them as infantry in Rhinos one game, and run them as jump infantry another game.

Options, man. Options . . .

If my input helped even one, then it was all worth it....

Feldmarshal Goehring wrote:
Have you thought about working up jump packs and back packs with magnets so that you can run your assault squads and DC both ways. Run them as infantry in Rhinos one game, and run them as jump infantry another game.

Options, man. Options . . .

Yeah, I thought about that, but then I didn't do it. It's certainly the cheaper way to go. I just built models both ways. So I have 8 DC models with jump packs and 6 without, but I have more waiting to be built. I've done with same with my assault marines.

I have magnetized my JPs on my assault troopers. I haven't magnetized the normal backpacks yet because I havent had a game where I actually wanted them in a rhino instead of jumping along on their own.

Magnetizing the packs is a good idea. I want the option of choosing packs or rhino transport during games.

Yeah I agree, that sounds like an awesome idea... I wish I had done that but getting the extra jump packs used to be a huge hassle. Now GW offers them direct from their bits, for 8 bucks per 5 packs. Pretty good deal, considering ebay used to auction them for like 15 bucks just for the packs.

I am also thinking of going BA (they loook way cooler than the other chapters ) Can someone post a competitive 1500pnt list?

See some of the earlier posts: there are differing opinions of competitive lists. Also see Jawaballs list at http://warhammer40kbloodangels.blogspot.com/

I won my first BA battle against my friends SoB. It was a pretty intense game and my MVP was my tactical squad which killed a cannoness and her retinue, an exorcist, an immolator, and one of the assassins. The game was tight, but my Tactical Squad, Terminator Squad, and DC ripped through almost everything once I got into range. The only problems I've been facing is the lack of dreadnought use. I use it but I must play it too stupidly because it always gets immobilized fairly early leaving it useless. Any tips on using a dreadnought with a Multi-Melta effectively?

With the new edition, it makes it so that a vehicle can hide. Vehicles benefit from cover, but unfortunately it still takes quite a bit to cover at least half of it from view, so that is dependent on your terrain.

Also, you can run with a dreadnought like you do infantry. That might help get you into melta range faster.

Being venerable can have its advantages, but its downsides too. Usually you only want to re-roll vehicle damage results if you roll an DESTROYED result. It gives you approximately a 66% chance of avoiding that result (Unless there is a modifier involved). If you reroll for anything less, it just gives your dred a 33% chance of dying, so its not a good idea.

I generally leave out the dread and take more tactical marines, but if you take him, either hide him or run him to get him in range. That's the best advice I can offer.

Edit: I am such a jerk that I forgot to congratulate you on your victory! That's awesome!

I forgot the dread could run :( The game was a blast, I still can't believe how much my 1 tactical squad did.

Thanks on the congratulations FoxPhoenix.

I run my DC behind 2 DC dreads or a LR it works out well for me. Lemarties helps controll the 2 dreads and the DC thus the dreads tarpit for me. It works out real well because I mainly play Orks and Tryanids. I also run 1 ten man tac squad an honor guard, dc and then assult squad. I Don't have terminators in my BA army list. I find the DC dread works out better. Hope my opinions help.

So what was your total army list? I know you get most of your models from AoBR but what else have you added aside from the DC?

my 1000 list was as follows:

HQ
-----
Brother Corbulo

Elites
--------
3 DC
Dreadnought (Multi-Melta)
Terminator Squad (3 Chainfists)

Troops
----------
Tactical Squad (PF, Meltagun, Flamer, Rhino)
Tactical Squad (PF, Flamer, Missile Launcher, Rhino)


It ran REALLY well. As I said earlier, my one tactical squad killed a cannoness and her retinue, immolator, exorcist, and a callidus assassin.

Sounds solid. Don't have the codex with me right now but do you have the points for a furioso dread? I find them quite useful.

P.S. Love the love that the BA are getting. First and still favorite army to play.

Yeah, BA are wild.

They are a lot of fun for sure.

G

Congratulations on the win, S1gns.

I envy you . . .
I have been painting away trying to get my Blood Angels ready to hit the table.

Same here. My wife and I have been meaning to play a game for the last 2 weeks, but I keep putting it off because I want to have more painted.

To be honest I have yet to paint my army. I just haven't had the time required to sit down and paint a mini nicely, so I chose not to start it and half-ass it. Hopefully during spring break I'll have time since my girlfriend is going away with her family.

I need to repaint most of my BA army. Since it was my first army and is still very small I plan on doing so over time. Greatest thing ever was in a 1500 points game my friend shot his entire eldar army at my DC and one still survived as well as Lemartes. They charge some guardians and then were thus killed off during the next shooting phase.

Congratulations on the win!

Just a quick FYI, if you get the Assault Terminators boxed set, that will give you enough arms to turn both of your Terminator units into assault terminators. All you have to worry about is shoulder pads, but some careful conversions can fix that.

I was practically unemployed when my started my Blood Angels, so you can get some tips from me on how to build BA on a budget.

It'll be enough for 10 assault terminators? I already have 5 from the AOBR box and an assault terminator box will give me 5 guys and extra arms?

It will take a little bit of converting, but yeah that should be about right.

Well You will get 5 pairs of LC and then 5 sets of TH and SS.

Oh, yeah that works then. I will have two squads of terms with 3 TH/SS and 2 LC. That'll be damn good.

0ldsk00l wrote:I have magnetized my JPs on my assault troopers. I haven't magnetized the normal backpacks yet because I havent had a game where I actually wanted them in a rhino instead of jumping along on their own.

That's exactly what I've run across as well. All my JP's are magnetized (initially for ease of painting, but also with the idea of doing normal backpacks down the road in the back of my mind), but I've never felt the desire to go with "normal" ones.

Vale,

JohnS

Where and what type of magnets did you get cygnnus?

http://www.kjmagnetics.com/products.asp?cat=10

Try these guys, a lot of the right size magnets for cheap!

BTW, right size being 1/16" x 1/32" round.

s1gns wrote:Where and what type of magnets did you get cygnnus?

What FoxPhoenix said.

The one bit of advice I'd add is to have a "master" to use to make sure that you have your magnets on correctly. I used a wooden dowel drilled out to fit a magnet. I used that master to make sure I had all the rest of the magnets in correctly. I also used some other dowels with magnets to hold the jumppacks when I painted/primed them.

Vale,

JohnS

FoxPhoenix135 wrote:BTW, right size being 1/16" x 1/32" round.

Does that actually work well for you? I find them too weak for much of anything. I would want something stronger. I thought about using the 1/8" size, but really I would want something like 3/32" or 5/64".

For a simple termy arm, they should be sufficient. For doing a tank, probably should get the next size up, which is 1/8" i guess. I never done magnetizing but most tutorials for termy arms suggest 1/16", so i dunno for sure if it will be strong enough but for plastic I suspect it would be.

On a scale of 1-5, how difficult is it to magnetize arms and vehicle weapons? What is the process in magnetizing arms and weapons as well?

http://theangelstalon.blogspot.com/2009/04/terminator-weapon-swaps-made-easy-with_9084.html

For the process.

Difficulty I wouldn't know about, I've never done it, myself.

2-3, depending on the part, some extreme cases probubly 4, but basicly, drill a hole the right size make sure it works, and bung the hole in with green stuff(make sure there isnt too much as then it wont work. that is the basic idea, or you can have a shallow hole and just show the magneted,

So how is it coming, s1gns? Get any termies magnetized yet?

I can't say that I have. I've been really busy after school so I haven't had much time. I have vacation and I plan on painting my army as much as possible. I'll buy a box of termies when I'm done with vacation since I'll have money left over. I just wish I had a lot more time to do things. I'm actually going to go play a game with my friends tonight. Wish me luck

I just bought magnets from the link posted above. It was easy to shop and buy. Furthermore, they accept paypal for payment.

I won my match

Good job! Details on the match?

Congrats S1gns. Nice job.

To be honest, it was REALLY boring. I played a FFA with orks/tau/SM. I won by 2 objectives, followed by a 2nd place ork, and a tie for 3rd at 0 objectives between the tau and SM. Only really amazing thing was my friends tau contested the SM players only objective and his fire warriors survived an assault against the SM's Captain and Dreadnought on the final turn. Quite funny.

Ah well, boring or not, add +1 notch to your win belt!

So what kind of list did the ork player field? Last time I played orks was a few weeks ago with a vanilla SM list and I got stomped by a massive horde (130 models in his 1500 pt list). How did you fend them off?

We played 750 points per army. The ork had 30 shoota boyz (Nob, PK, BP, 3 Rokkit Launchas) 3 Deffkoptas, 5 Warbikers, 2 Big Mek's (KFF) and a warbuggy (for extra points) He bum rushed the tau. The other SM bum rushed the other side of the tau army. I walked my way into 2 objectives and held them all game. It was boring... The ork would've steam rolled me, but turn 6 came around and ended the game. He had his entire squad of boys practically, and his 2 hq's and Koptas. I would've lost my dread easily imo. I got lucky that they all went for my friends tau though haha. Either way, a win is a win.

I had a short game the other night, against vanilla SM, and put together a couple of tips on the subject on my blog, if anybody's interested.

http://foxphoenix40k.blogspot.com/2009/04/lets-talk-tactics-1-ba-vs-sm_07.html

I played against my friends tau tonight. 1000 pts a piece. I steam rolled him Basically assaulted everything and romped him. He played silly and such. (I played Vanilla SM because I forgot my codex @ home.)

Ah, for smaller games sometimes vanilla is better anyway. It is too hard to make the DC worth it in games less than 1000 points, because the DC unit is only 2-3 free, and you have to buy the rest. That gets expensive.

True, i played with corbulo and 4 DC together. Worked like a charm.


P.S. I FINALLY STARTED PAINTING SOME OF MY MINI'S. ALMOST HAVE MY TERMINATOR SQUAD COMPLETED!!! WOOHOO

Awesome! I anxiously await the pics.

Some tips on photography that I picked up:

Do NOT use flash

DO use the macro function (looks like a little flower on most cameras)

Don't zoom in too much or macro won't work.

That should be enough to get you started, so your first pics don't look as bad as mine did... lol.

My gf comes home from vacation on friday. Maybe then I'll upload a photo and get some comments.

I'll look forward to it, then.

Sadly, my own BA will get a little neglected from this week on. Off to the workforce I go! No more college for me, my semester ended last week and I can't afford to go another semester ('cuz my wife is pregnant AGAIN. Doh!).

I still got a lot to do, so hopefully I can get in a few models a week or so.