via Warseer from B & C. Shouts out to Mr. Scorcher 505 and some bold, mysterious stranger from B & C.

here we go:

-The BA 'dex is DONE and complete already.

-New conversion kits similar to the ones made for the space wolves. These kits are said to be EXTRAORDINARY (I mean.. beautiful!), with a level of detail similar to that of the models in space hulk (or even better). (PS this seems quite certain, it has been confirmed by my local GW seller, who also stated some big news about BA may be revealed at the italian games day).

SOME informations about the rules

-The codex will allow the player to field a top notch assault army: assault squads will be a troop choice, with options similar to those of the new gray hunters in the SW dex: 2Xspecial weapons and no heavy weapons at all (of course). Sergents will be similar to those of the SM dex (more options: tunder hummer, LC and such).

- a psionic power called "vortex of blood", or something like that, will give the caster a CC attacks bonus equal to the number of models in base contact (or even in combat radius?! but it would be too powerful..)

-New indipendent characters.

I can't assure these rumors are true, of course. I just TRIED to translate them in english and posted them here.

Ah, date of release: march, after the tyrs.

The sprues etc all sound very plausible... almost like they'd had anotehr attempt recently to define the "look" of the chapter in some way.

Bit dubious about the codex being 100% done and dusted too.

Release date sounds, more or less, quite realistic too IMO.

So March sounds like a realistic release date for you, but you refuse to believe the codex is finished less than 5 months from the rumored release date?

Sidstyler wrote:So March sounds like a realistic release date for you, but you refuse to believe the codex is finished less than 5 months from the rumored release date?

The idea of an efficient GW is just too much for some of us to handle. There seems to be a fervor about the company lately...

Does make me wonder who the author for this one could be.

Sidstyler wrote:So March sounds like a realistic release date for you, but you refuse to believe the codex is finished less than 5 months from the rumored release date?

Yes, not least because I've "seen" evidence in the past of tweaks and alterations to army books less than 6 weeks away from the release date in the past.

Adding to the evidence, pre-finishing the book couldn't lead to errors, like in the lizardmen book. but BA does sound right after SH and Nids.

I'm not at all thrilled by this, but it seems that this Space Marine release doesn't stand in the way of other codecies which is good. I for one still think an combined codex for all the chapters would make the most sense. But that's not the point in this thread...

Greets
Schepp himself

Well, sounds absolutely tasty.
I have a large BA army hitting the shelf or played as vanilla.
I eagerly wait for the nex 'dex.

Well, it does make for getting a faster release of codexes viable. There isn't much in the way of models that need to be created and the rules are pretty much already complete. Like the SW, put out one plastic kit and some new metal single minis, and the line is pretty much done.

At least it gives folks something while more extensive work hopefully is getting done (rules and model wise) for the older codexes (Dark Eldar, DH/WH, Necrons).

I've been waiting for this thread to pop up here for quite awhile. I'm just hoping they make mephiston as powerful rules wise as he's supposed to be fluff wise. The characters in the SW book give me hope that he will be.

If space wolves get to ride giant wolves, will blood angels ride giant bats?

One could only pray, WD. Join me in prayer?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Finally. Finally we get a codex that doesnt involve either a sheaf of individual documents or a fething 3rd term abortion of of a "freebie" (you get what you pay for!).

reds8n wrote:Bit dubious about the codex being 100% done and dusted too.

If it's due in March it's not too far-fetched that it's done.

oh please oh please oh please.

Climbing back up to the top of the heap for assault armies would be nice.

sounds cool more op then SW I can only hope..

New Lemartes, PLEASE OH ODIN A NEW LEMARTES!

Sounds awesome

My hope is that the new codex will not be jervisified.

A fine start for 2010 ...

so may i assume the source is non-english and was translated but we dont get a link to it?
not even to the B&C 'translation' ?

To know the author of this codex would give a hint on its quality, so again : who?

The younger guys, Kelly and Cruddace, made a good job.
But when the book is already written, then it will be a third person.
Come on, not Jervis, please.

whitedragon wrote:If space wolves get to ride giant wolves, will blood angels ride giant bats?

No, they ride oddly sparkling vampires.

Disappointing, I could think of 10 armies that need a codex before the Blood Angels.

Unless of course the poster means GW will release Lord Acute and Chaplain Obtuse of the Blood Angles. In which case I'm there.

Long live the Primarch Pythagoras!

Blood Angles and Dark Angles are the lost chapters.

Mattlov wrote:

whitedragon wrote:If space wolves get to ride giant wolves, will blood angels ride giant bats?

No, they ride oddly sparkling vampires.

Did I juts experience a twilight reference on dakka? I feel violated.

Greets
Schepp himself

Gives me hope the other two (BT and DA) will be done next year as well. They already have the upgrade sprues done for both these armies. Just put out the updated dex and we're good.

But "just updating" doesn't make them much money.

Well, BA deserve a new codex release.
BA was one of the most played SM armies in the 3rd ed.
The jervisified re-release in WD made them unplayable.

Great news, now they have the marine codices done, no more excuses, get the bloody dark eldar and inquisition armies done and released, then necrons.

My local redshirt said that the Codex would be released in early spring.

He strongly implied it would have a similar release like the Space Pups. He felt GW (the accountants) was evaluating how the Space Pups release went and will take that into consideration with other items that would coincide with the BA Codex release.

I suspect Brother Corbulo will go up in cost or lose a wound in the new Codex... Boo Hoo

The new SW release should be a big success story for GW.
The codex is phantastic as are the new models.

I am very excited by this news. If BA get a Wolfpack-esque kit that is in a similar vein to the BA termies from Space Hulk, this army will look gorgeous.

In regards to the new mounts - instead of bats, I would actually wager they ride giant chalices into battle. Every time you kill a model, it adds blood to your blood pool, and you get +1 attack and +1 strength. Also you can field squadrons of tea-cups as fast attack choices, and there will be a new special character who rides into battle on a REALLY big goblet who only speaks cup-talk, because he was raised by a set of chalices when he was a lad.

GRIM DARK SUCKAAAAAAAAS

Blood Angels need no exotic mounts,
they need open-topped overcharging transports.

wuestenfux wrote:Blood Angels need no exotic mounts,
they need open-topped overcharging transports.

Will they be shapped like chalices?

Or even better, the can get surf boards and surf into battle on waves of blood!

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Blood Angels need no exotic mounts,
they need open-topped overcharging transports.

Will they be shapped like chalices?

Or even better, the can get surf boards and surf into battle on waves of blood!

Anyway, chalice-like transports could be open-topped.
Skyboards for the Death Company would be fine.

Will they be shapped like chalices?

Or even better, the can get surf boards and surf into battle on waves of blood!

Oh dear God-Emperor! That reminds me of a quote from the Old WOD Vampire! In he Gangrel Clanbook one of the example characters was a punk surfer embraced by a female Viking vampire. His signature quote was ( I am not making this up ) "Blood for the blood god, dude, blood for the god!" .

I like how GW is doing the Marines dexes. I hope they do the same for Chaos really. (After they get a re-worked main codex)

I would especially love for them to do the same to Eldar! (Iyanden, Altoic, Saim-Hann at least)

If this recent wave of codex releases truly is the sign of things to come, I am enthusiastically awaiting the Dark Eldar and Necrons when they come. Perhaps there is hope for 6th edition after all.

I think a Blood Angels/Dark Angels Angels of Death Codex is the way to go. Get both variants out of the way at once, update both the Jervis-hammered Marine dexes, move onto the poor Xenos at last.

First off, I am excited by this release. I want to play JP-based SM, so this is really good.
____

BrookM wrote:Does make me wonder who the author for this one could be.

Jervis or Robin, most likely. How bad could it be?

JohnHwangDD wrote:



Jervis or Robin, most likely. How bad could it be?

Thougth cruddace did nids.....

So who's left except JJ?

And it could be a BA dex, that follows mr swallows BA fluff.....

wuestenfux wrote:My hope is that the new codex will not be jervisified.

Christ, I hope not; but you never can tell. I mean, who else is free to be able to write it right now?

1hadhq wrote:...
To know the author of this codex would give a hint on its quality, so again : who?

I would like to know this as well.

Mattlov wrote:...
No, they ride oddly sparkling vampires.

Kinda like that brunette chick from twilight?

Kid_Kyoto wrote:Disappointing, I could think of 10 armies that need a codex before the Blood Angels.

Unless of course the poster means GW will release Lord Acute and Chaplain Obtuse of the Blood Angles. In which case I'm there.

wuestenfux wrote:Well, BA deserve a new codex release.
BA was one of the most played SM armies in the 3rd ed.
The jervisified re-release in WD made them unplayable.

Well, it made them a sight less playable. A BA Rhino Rush can be quite interesting to face.

Samus666 wrote:I think a Blood Angels/Dark Angels Angels of Death Codex is the way to go. Get both variants out of the way at once, update both the Jervis-hammered Marine dexes, move onto the poor Xenos at last.

Christ I wish they would do more of this. Just to get the releases coming in a slightly faster fashion.

wuestenfux wrote:

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Blood Angels need no exotic mounts,
they need open-topped overcharging transports.

Will they be shapped like chalices?

Or even better, the can get surf boards and surf into battle on waves of blood!

Anyway, chalice-like transports could be open-topped.
Skyboards for the Death Company would be fine.

They did have hover boards back in the early RT Era.

This is god news for my friend who plays BA. If it is true an dit probably is, then Games Workshop is really over hauling its models with great details and looks, and I like it. Like the new SW compared to the old ones, where the old ones looked like space marines that were given a different paint job, and then a little detail, where the new ones look like a breed apart from the regular space marine kits, and that is the way it should be.

Since Space Hulk is already sold out, GW might release the personalized BA Termies for the 40k table top.

So with Space Wolves, Blood Angels, and maybe a new DA book, is it safe to say that Templars cant be too far away?

extrenm(54) wrote:So with Space Wolves, Blood Angels, and maybe a new DA book, is it safe to say that Templars cant be too far away?

Not sure if a new DA book is on the way.
The jervisified DA 'dex is from Feb. 2007.

A prediction! BA and BT, followed by DA. Then it will be time for 6th and codex production will stop while it gets hammered out. For which SM will lead off again.

Because what's one more edition when you've been waiting for so long already?

The Grog wrote:A prediction! BA and BT, followed by DA. Then it will be time for 6th and codex production will stop while it gets hammered out. For which SM will lead off again.

Because what's one more edition when you've been waiting for so long already?

Sounds about right.

The Grog wrote:A prediction! BA and BT, followed by DA. Then it will be time for 6th and codex production will stop while it gets hammered out. For which SM will lead off again.

Because what's one more edition when you've been waiting for so long already?

lord_blackfang wrote:

The Grog wrote:A prediction! BA and BT, followed by DA. Then it will be time for 6th and codex production will stop while it gets hammered out. For which SM will lead off again.

Because what's one more edition when you've been waiting for so long already?

Sounds about right.

Goddamn you are all a bunch of whiny dudes.

Anyways, who else do we know has usually done a codex and isn't working on something else right now? Could Gav Thorpe be brought in?

The author for the new BA 'dex is Robin. You'll be able to take Baal Preds in squadrons. Corbulo has a new entry in his fluff, where he headbutts a Tyranid Warrior so hard it makes its whole squad run away.

More marines? Well lets just hope they get it over and done with and get on with releasing some more interesting stuff.
If they release new black templars before DE or Necrons...wow. Epic nerdrage.

GW treats Dark Eldar like little kids no one wanted.. Maybe if you ignore them long enough they'll go away

That's it. There's officially a clock that, if it reaches 0, GW will immediately release the new Dark Eldar codex and amazing new models and a battleforce that comes with a free cheesecake. However, the clock resets anyone complains about Dark Eldar being pushed aside for other army releases.

Get. Over. It.

bhsman wrote:Get. Over. It.

No.

Anyway, does anybody think that the new "reworked" mini's will be a set of the Space Hulk Termies when the codex comes out? How much do you think that will devalue a Space Hulk for all those resellers? :-)

I remember reading something about their CAD process allowing them to reuse sculpts and add them to new frames very easily. I can see them cutting some of the sculpts a little differently to make them more amenable to different poses, but keeping the iconography and detail intact.

whitedragon wrote:

bhsman wrote:Get. Over. It.

No.

No skin off my nose then, it's more of a "Stop stuffing rumor threads with useless replies and actually contribute you schmucks" thing than anything else.

whitedragon wrote:Anyway, does anybody think that the new "reworked" mini's will be a set of the Space Hulk Termies when the codex comes out? How much do you think that will devalue a Space Hulk for all those resellers? :-)

Well, they do have the ability to reproduce the sprues, so we'd have to see. On one hand, it would be 10 very well-sculpted Terminators, but with little or no customization. Would only work with a Blood Angels release.

If you don't like what someone has to say, you can easily skip over it. People complaining about people complaining...
Though now I'm part of the people complaining about people complaining about people complaining. Meta.

I hope this codex is as fun for Blood Angels players as the Space Wolves one looks to be for Space Wolves players.

Da Boss wrote:If you don't like what someone has to say, you can easily skip over it. People complaining about people complaining...
Though now I'm part of the people complaining about people complaining about people complaining. Meta.

I'm not complaining about the complaints, you can have a whole separate thread for that for you guys to hurf durf all day about un-updated armies. I'm complaining about seeing new posts in a rumor thread and expecting, well, rumors or speculation or perspectives about said army. Instead it's either Dark Eldar or Necrons or Daemonhunters.

Not saying that these guys don't need new rules (Necrons and Daemonhunters need it the most; Dark Eldar can be competitive but have terribly old models) but this isn't the place for it.

Da Boss wrote:I hope this codex is as fun for Blood Angels players as the Space Wolves one looks to be for Space Wolves players.

Agreed; I'm personally hoping for them to keep Assault Squads as troops and maybe access to Master-crafted weapons and Inferno Pistols for regular HQs.

Hmmm. Well, I'd see the comments you were complaing about as perfectly valid posts in a rumours thread- they are the reactions to the rumours.

I think I'd like the Blood Angels to have a nice "ornate, powerful wargear" feel too. It would help seperate them from the rest. Here's hoping for some cool fluff about Baal- always been intrigued by the idea of that planet since the short story in the old Wargear book in second edition. (I think it was wargear. The one with the blood angel marine comparing baal to armageddon.)

Also curious as to how the Death Company will be handled. I'd imagine they'll get fleet.

Maybe, but the reactions are tired and serve no purpose that other reactions would.

As for Death Company, I'm really hoping they make them an optional unit like they did in 2nd edition without forcing you to take them.

I admit to not being a huge fan of the vampirish feel of the BA but I would like a new set of rules to use for my personal chapter (especially if they are going to be very assault oriented which is something I like).

Kirasu wrote:GW treats Dark Eldar like little kids no one wanted.. Maybe if you ignore them long enough they'll go away

Yes, but this thread is about celebrating how SMs got another Codex, not whining about how (surprise, surprise) DE got nothing.

I was going to buy a reaver titan this month... but now I'm not sure if I should wait or not.

BA are the only thing in 40K I'm pasionate about anymore.

IF they did conversion kits on a par with the SW and BT sets I'll be very, very happy, and buying plenty.

They just need to have moulded shoulder pad icons.
Please, please GW provide moulded shoulder pad icons.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Kirasu wrote:GW treats Dark Eldar like little kids no one wanted.. Maybe if you ignore them long enough they'll go away

Yes, but this thread is about celebrating how SMs got another Codex, not whining about how (surprise, surprise) DE got nothing.

Thanks to the Thread Police, telling us what to talk about since 2006.

wuestenfux wrote:My hope is that the new codex will not be jervisified.

QFT, that guy needs to retire

Kid_Kyoto wrote:Disappointing, I could think of 10 armies that need a codex before the Blood Angels.

Along the lines of this sentiment I am torn. I have a BA army and as such I am very hopeful that they will get a new codex. A few months ago when I started 40K I was debating Blood Angels or Space Wolves. I was much irritated when I chose BA and SW got the codex. I do agree though that there are a couple of armies that desperately need a new book.

But, it seems like space marines sell minis and armies. I suspect GW is trying to capitalize on the success of Space Hulk and the recent release of another popular 3rd edition SM chapter, being SW of course.

Da Boss wrote:
Also curious as to how the Death Company will be handled. I'd imagine they'll get fleet.

Me too, they are one of the coolest units in the game.

whitedragon wrote:Anyway, does anybody think that the new "reworked" mini's will be a set of the Space Hulk Termies when the codex comes out? How much do you think that will devalue a Space Hulk for all those resellers? :-)

Maybe its just me, but the resellers. They are a blight on the world. Buy Space Hulk for playing the game, not for what you can get later.

I hope they rework or just include the SH sprue for BA Termies. Those figs are fantastic. And it costs GW less if they just reuse the mold.

All BA need is some bits to create a death company from tacticals or assaults. And maybe they give us some bits for vehicles.

I see resellers as very bad things, for lack of a more colorful description. Its buying things for the investment rather than the satisfaction of ownership.

I don't know how to describe it, but its like Edward Norton in the movie "Italian Job". Getting something because you want it, or taking it because someone else may want it.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Kirasu wrote:GW treats Dark Eldar like little kids no one wanted.. Maybe if you ignore them long enough they'll go away

Yes, but this thread is about celebrating how SMs got another Codex, not whining about how (surprise, surprise) DE got nothing.

I think the DE should have been retired years ago. But if GW did that than alot of self rightious "Real Gamer" would have nothing to complain about. The Ba were short changed with the pdf. Especially since they are a popular chapter 2nd in my heart after my SW. I welcome the thought of a new codex and range of mini's.

@Kid_Kyoto what 10 armies need a codex before the BA?

@ Waagh gonads. what gives your pic looks well bulked up (

Da Boss wrote:Thanks to the Thread Police, telling us what to talk about since 2006.

Save your sarcasm, it doesn't change the fact that this is the wrong thread for it.

Anyways, when the rumors were mentioned in BoLS this comment popped up:

pedrokantor wrote:These sprues are incredible btw.

You'll want to get yourself some boxes of assault terminators and assault marines ready. Don't worry there will be a bundle option like with the wolves.

The codex has some great new rules relating to blood rage!

(Thats all I can say folks!)

Bit of salt, obviously, but is it unusual to have sprues already complete by now?

BA are one of the armies that *made* the game popular in 2nd ed.. They deserve a codex with ACTUAL cool fluff

The expansion team armies can take a back seat

Waaagh_Gonads wrote:BA are the only thing in 40K I'm pasionate about anymore.

I'm the same way... except + DKoK.

This would be a long time coming and a just reward for continuing to play this army after the 'unspeakable codex' was released.

With never before seen levels of codex creep this will also a good time for blood angel players

Honestly, sarcasm aside, I just want to see point costs that make sense and stats that match the stories we read before we were plagued with James Swallow.

There needs to be no cap on death company.....make it like it was in the "real" codex, that was the a very fun part, you never knew how many you'd get.

bhsman wrote:

Da Boss wrote:Thanks to the Thread Police, telling us what to talk about since 2006.

Save your sarcasm, it doesn't change the fact that this is the wrong thread for it.

And you're borderline trolling! Hooray!

beef wrote:@ Waagh gonads. what gives your pic looks well bulked up (

A combination of 'Operation BEEFCAKE' and help with pic selection from the DCMs, all of which is covered in the entrallingly mysterious DCM forum... also I got a haircut...



Back On Topic:
I think that just releasing the Space Hulk sprue will be a mistake. Due to the repatative nature of masses of models will have.
Use them as a guide for a new sprue of add ons, definitely.

blood angel wrote:This would be a long time coming and a just reward for continuing to play this army after the 'unspeakable codex' was released.

By itself, the pdf isn't bad. There are a few mistakes like rhinos having no doors or firing points, Lemartes being made much better than a regular Chaplain for the about the same cost, Tycho not having an actual weapon or even a pisto, etc.l. The problem was the precedence set by the 3rd edition codex with access to Furious Charge (albeit at cost) and a wide range of HQs.

If given the choice, I'd like to see:

-Storm Shields, et al, brought in line (a given at this point)
-Death Company made entirely optional
-Death Company keeps Rending but can purchase a power weapon or fist for every X models (that cannot be combined with Rending)
-Artificier armor and being able to master-craft weapons (moreso because the Blood Angels are known for it rather than trying to go back to the armory options)
-Keep RAS as troops
-Tear Attack on Furiosos
-Make Death Company upgrade for Dreadnoughts similar to Possessed upgrades for CSM: lower BS but ignores stunned/shaken
-Viable HQs outside of special characters
-This one is more of an extra than anything set in fluff, but access to Inferno Pistols and Hand Flamers would be awesome as well.

so I also have heard the codex might actually be another run of "Angles of death" and actually be for BA/DA. Anyone else heard this?

also yet unconfirmed but templars will be included as part of ordo hunter dex due Aug/Sep.... Rumors as always.

A combined Angels of Death codex was quickly shot down by Harry over at Warseer, so it's very unlikely.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Kirasu wrote:GW treats Dark Eldar like little kids no one wanted.. Maybe if you ignore them long enough they'll go away

Yes, but this thread is about celebrating how SMs got another Codex, not whining about how (surprise, surprise) DE got nothing.

My impression is that DE will never get a new codex.
But now we should celebrate the new BA codex.
I'm eagerly waiting for it.

I hope it's better than the PDF, and that they replace that Lemartes model so he'll stop popping up in the "Worst sculpts" threads.

I think BA has some of the worst models in the game:
Corbulo, Lemartes, Mephiston.
They need to get an overhaul.

Mephiston? He's not that bad.

Mephiston looks a little odd, and plays badly for being a 225 point character with no inv. Dear God I hope they fix that one.

I'm hoping that Dante gets some love, he is after all 1,100 years old, so surely he's going to be more of a tank than Papa Smurf.

And I agree with bhsman, BA should be getting Master Crafting and Artificer Armour all over the place as the fluff puts it like their homeworld has more artifacts than sand...

Well I can't speak for his rules, but yeah he does look odd. I thought he was supposed to though.

Not liking for the current trend for "ancient culture/mythology but in space" Marines.

So far we have...

Romans in Space (Ultramarines)
Monks in Space (Dark Angels)
Vikings in Space (Space Wolves)
Mongols in Space (White Scars)
Knights in Space (Black Templars)
Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

And now we will have as clearly indicated by the Space Hulk Terminator Sergeant, Vampires in Space!

Daft

I hope the new codex reflects some kind of vampire feeling.

Monks in Space (Dark Angels)

Do monks use guns and swords?

Yeah, I'm just being a tit.

Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

Okay, the Marines themselves aren't dragons. A more appropriate label would be "dragonslayers in space", which you could also simplify as just another "knights in space" archetype.

Speaking of that SH terminator sergeant, I never noticed that the sword Mephiston has is the same style as the one the sergeant is wielding. Did Lorenzo fall in battle and Calistarius take the sword? Or do they just use the same kind of sword?

I hope the new codex reflects some kind of vampire feeling.

I kinda hope not, really. A little vampirism here and there is okay I guess (like Dracula-looking Mephiston), but I'd prefer if they didn't go overboard.

I'm fine with it all. I think it adds to the Space Marines being "the stuff of legends" with out forcing too much mythology down our throats.

The mythology plays a minor role.
But bringing Blood Angels in proximity to Vampires is a bit much.

Do BA really approximate anything else other than being blonde, long lived, and hungering for blood?

They're an entire chapter of Lestat de Lioncourt...

EzeKK wrote:I like how GW is doing the Marines dexes. I hope they do the same for Chaos really. (After they get a re-worked main codex)

Agreed. There are more than enough Khorne models amongst the 40k/fantasy lines to justify a Khorne codex. Release a new bits pack, a new IC and bam these pre-existing models sell like hot cakes.

Hmmm, so after Codex: Khornate Legions, GW is already making Codex: Night Lords? I wonder how long it is till Codex: Blood Rav-I mean Thousand Sons comes out.

Flashman wrote:
So far we have...

Romans in Space (Ultramarines)
Monks in Space (Dark Angels)
Vikings in Space (Space Wolves)
Mongols in Space (White Scars)
Knights in Space (Black Templars)
Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

And now we will have as clearly indicated by the Space Hulk Terminator Sergeant, Vampires in Space!

Actually, it's:

Native American Monks in Space (Dark Angels)
Werewolf Vikings in Space (Space Wolves)
Ancient Greek Vampires in Space (Blood Angels)

Some of the SM Chapters have more than one archetype written into their background. Now THAT'S daft.

Sidstyler wrote:I kinda hope not, really. A little vampirism here and there is okay I guess (like Dracula-looking Mephiston), but I'd prefer if they didn't go overboard.

I'd love to see BA get something conceptually strong like what SW got.

As I said in another thread, if I was writing it I'd downplay the vampiric stuff and play up the general sense of BA being a chapter slowly descending into madness. I just have this mental image of a sun setting on fading heroes in baroque armor that I think could be really powerful. I'd play up the sense of creeping doom, but also show them as heroically raging (if you will) against the dying of the light...even though the end is inevitable. I also think there's some room there to do something interesting with the Flesh Tearers and show them as the ultimate expression of this doom. Deep within their fortress-monastery on Baal, I can envision the great marble statue of Sanguinius weeping tears of blood for what's befallen the Flesh Tearers and what will someday befall all his children...

Of course, I'm sure what we'll get is a recycling of the nonconcept involving vamps with jump packs that Gav thought up years ago. And not to turn this into a Gav-bash, but for as good of a writer as he is, his codices really weren't conceptually strong. There's a big difference there from what you see from Phil K.

I wonder who got the job for BA? Mat Ward would seem to be next up.

so wait a sec... it's great to know that the BA will have their own codex but I have a shiver of fear.... in the new Space Hulk the fluff says that the entire BA chapter has been wiped out (at least in the Italian translation) during the assault on the Hulk "Eternal Damnation" (or however that hulk is called) leaving only 50 marines as survivors.

Could this provoke a change in story and codex rules for the Blood Angels ?

Basically they have suffered a loss worst than the one got from the Crimson Fists!!! And we are talking about one of the 1st founding chapters, not a "whatever founding number". This scares me a bit.

Flashman wrote:Not liking for the current trend for "ancient culture/mythology but in space" Marines.

Daft

Current trend? Only an ent would think 20 years is a current trend. Plus, Salamanders are as much "dragons in space" as the Rainbow Warriors are rainbows in space.

Flashman wrote:

Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

THe Sallys were Africans in Space for a while but GW has apparently decided that 'black skin' is meant to be taken literally AND it's a hideous mutation.

Ah GW stay classy.

Can we get Warhammer Armies Pygmies next?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kirasu wrote:GW treats Dark Eldar like little kids no one wanted.. Maybe if you ignore them long enough they'll go away

One can only hope

That was old fluff that was carried over, it lacks a real place in the time line. It also say 950 lost, not 50 survivors. If this occured before the legions were split up into chapters, 950 loss is not bad. Even still 950 included the entourage that composed the crew of their ships, servitors, and other non-marines. A strike cruiser carries 100 marines, but has several thousand crewmen.

I think the way SW have been done is exactly what any codex independent of the Space Marines (or Chaos Space Marines) book deserves and requires to be worth our time. If BA can achieve that same quality they deserve to be done.

I wish they would just remake Angels of Death. Dark angels and Blood Angels in one codex.

That would be great.

I fits though.

One hand you have this super assault army Blood Angels then you have the Dark Angels who are highly mobile with bikes, landspeeders etc..

aka_mythos wrote:That was old fluff that was carried over, it lacks a real place in the time line. It also say 950 lost, not 50 survivors. If this occured before the legions were split up into chapters, 950 loss is not bad. Even still 950 included the entourage that composed the crew of their ships, servitors, and other non-marines. A strike cruiser carries 100 marines, but has several thousand crewmen.

I think the way SW have been done is exactly what any codex independent of the Space Marines (or Chaos Space Marines) book deserves and requires to be worth our time. If BA can achieve that same quality they deserve to be done.

it "happened" about 1000 years before the current 5th edition story timeline (basically, warhammer 39k). this previously unknown decimation of the chapter is probably the impetus for why the black rage has become more severe in the chapter as the editions of 40k roll on by. personally, i liked it better when the BA were relatively pure with a bit of a dark side and left the whole neutral to evil space vampire schtick to the fleshtearers. also, gw revamped (or simply screwed up) the fluff by naming another chapter master of the BA at the time of the event despite the fact that according to the 2nd/3rd/4th/5th edition BA codices Dante has been chapter master for over 1200 or 1400 years (i can't remember which one). hey, it's their fluff (and like george lucas and star wars) they have the right to screw it up.

gorgon wrote:

Sidstyler wrote:I kinda hope not, really. A little vampirism here and there is okay I guess (like Dracula-looking Mephiston), but I'd prefer if they didn't go overboard.

I'd love to see BA get something conceptually strong like what SW got.

As I said in another thread, if I was writing it I'd downplay the vampiric stuff and play up the general sense of BA being a chapter slowly descending into madness. I just have this mental image of a sun setting on fading heroes in baroque armor that I think could be really powerful. I'd play up the sense of creeping doom, but also show them as heroically raging (if you will) against the dying of the light...even though the end is inevitable. I also think there's some room there to do something interesting with the Flesh Tearers and show them as the ultimate expression of this doom. Deep within their fortress-monastery on Baal, I can envision the great marble statue of Sanguinius weeping tears of blood for what's befallen the Flesh Tearers and what will someday befall all his children...

Would be a cool way to present the Blood Angels, though IIRC the fluff from Space Hulk made it sound as though the Veterans were getting better at resisting the Black Rage, giving hope to the Chapter.

I wonder who got the job for BA? Mat Ward would seem to be next up.

Wasn't he the same guy who did Daemons for Fantasy? I thought he was conscripted into working on the Necron codex...

warboss wrote:it "happened" about 1000 years before the current 5th edition story timeline (basically, warhammer 39k). this previously unknown decimation of the chapter is probably the impetus for why the black rage has become more severe in the chapter as the editions of 40k roll on by. personally, i liked it better when the BA were relatively pure with a bit of a dark side and left the whole neutral to evil space vampire schtick to the fleshtearers. also, gw revamped (or simply screwed up) the fluff by naming another chapter master of the BA at the time of the event despite the fact that according to the 2nd/3rd/4th/5th edition BA codices Dante has been chapter master for over 1200 or 1400 years (i can't remember which one). hey, it's their fluff (and like george lucas and star wars) they have the right to screw it up.

I can understand that it's their fluff... but in this way the BA's have been represented as a bunch of no goodders, and as being a first foundation chapter this gets things worst from my point of view. It might be stupid, but "ruining" backgrounds like this, could lead to a "hate" on the develepors from the old gamers. In my city on old Ork player refused to play again with the new codex because he was forced to make massive waves and an old BA player, reading the Space Hulk fluff was a bit angry about it.

I know , these are stupid facts, but maybe (sometimes) a background makes the difference.

KOS wrote:could lead to a "hate" on the develepors from the old gamers

Gamers hating the devs? That could never happen.

KOS wrote:I know , these are stupid facts, but maybe (sometimes) a background makes the difference.

i agree, which is why i said they screwed it up and i preferred the previous version more. unfortunately, all we can do is post in the occasional thread our opinions (which don't do much) and vote with our wallets. i just wanted to clarify the retcon fluff for the previous poster. GW did a poor effort with the BA in 4th and 5th edition in my opinion. my response? i'm using the SW rules to make an assaulty chapter and refuse to buy any additional GW models in the effort. In fact, the only models i'm purchasing are plastic prepainted wolves from WOTC to fill in some stuff that i can't covert using my existing models and my bits box. if they're not going to support one of my armies with models and/or rules then i won't support them.

The best news about this is that GW could possibly be releasing two 40k codexes in the same quarter. There's hope that next year we see at least 4!

Flashman wrote:Not liking for the current trend for "ancient culture/mythology but in space" Marines.

So far we have...

Romans in Space (Ultramarines)
Monks in Space (Dark Angels)
Vikings in Space (Space Wolves)
Mongols in Space (White Scars)
Knights in Space (Black Templars)
Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

And now we will have as clearly indicated by the Space Hulk Terminator Sergeant, Vampires in Space!

Daft

Where have you been? This isn't a current trend.

That is how they have been since at least 2nd edition.Well, except Black Templars, but they date back to the Armageddon book.

At any rate, its not new.

Well with the popularity of Twilight, what did you expect?

Just waiting to see if we get our first real female Marine

There is an old RT model of a female in power armor. Supposed to be a Librarian, back when the horned skull shoulderpad was a Librarian thing, and not an Exorcists Chapter thing.

I think she was carrying a sword, and wither a book or a bolter.

My dad has one in the old black DA scheme. I'll pop a pic up someday.

pombe wrote:
Native American Monks in Space (Dark Angels)

*facepalm*

And don't forget their Primarch had a little secret...

JonnyDelta wrote:There is an old RT model of a female in power armor. Supposed to be a Librarian, back when the horned skull shoulderpad was a Librarian thing, and not an Exorcists Chapter thing.

I think she was carrying a sword, and wither a book or a bolter.

My dad has one in the old black DA scheme. I'll pop a pic up someday.

There were two of 'em actually...

Vale,

JohnS

skrulnik wrote:

Flashman wrote:Not liking for the current trend for "ancient culture/mythology but in space" Marines.

So far we have...

Romans in Space (Ultramarines)
Monks in Space (Dark Angels)
Vikings in Space (Space Wolves)
Mongols in Space (White Scars)
Knights in Space (Black Templars)
Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

And now we will have as clearly indicated by the Space Hulk Terminator Sergeant, Vampires in Space!

Daft

Where have you been? This isn't a current trend.

That is how they have been since at least 2nd edition.Well, except Black Templars, but they date back to the Armageddon book.

At any rate, its not new.

Actually, if memory served, in second edition, you had:
Ultramarines
Space Wolves
Angels of Death (Dark Angels and Blood Angels)

That was it. If you wanted a different chapter, you painted Ultras a different color.

3rd edition introduced Index Astartes where you had rules for chapters like White Scars, and the Armageddon codex for Sallies and Templars (the Templars were a codex chapter in 2nd edition).

4th brought the Templars a full codex due to their popularity at the strength of their Armageddon list.

Back OT, I'm with Gorgon, I'm hoping they do something thematic with BA, and really make their models detailed, as the BA are described as artisans as well as warriors. Baroque, filigreed armor, really fancy stuff all around would be nice. Although, I'm a Flesh Tearers player, and am just hoping that I get a codex out of it that I can 'customize' to my idea of the Tearers.

I know many people don't like some of the BA novels, but I thought Red Fury was a decent window into the various BA successors and their relationship to the Blood Angels themselves.

gorgon wrote: And not to turn this into a Gav-bash...

Aww... why not?

Hurray! Another marine codex. A true assault army as well eh? Oh that is impressive. However, I doubt a new codex can do anything to the Blood Angels that will make them superior to stormboyz.

I hope it's real and not far away after i build my tyranids up after the new codex. Will be nice to see whats marines are better then go with them. I like space wolves and blood angels would have to have some great fluff and army to sway me.

Are there already some news or rumors about the contents of the new BA 'dex?

dietrich wrote:The best news about this is that GW could possibly be releasing two 40k codexes in the same quarter. There's hope that next year we see at least 4!

Stop dreaming... GW didn't release more than 2 Codexes a year since 2000. Except Daemons, but that was just a book and 1 new plastic sprue tacked onto a Fantasy release slot.

I wonder why GW has so less game designers.
Are these guys so expensive?
Or is it just the internal organization of GW that cannot deal
with more than 2 or 3 army books and codices per year?

Are they expensive... probably at the level of middle management... but they have fewer designers simply because they keep leaving GW and there really isn't a place for GW to look to replace them. It seems at the moment GW is producing more than their marketting people will actually let them put out. There actually is alot coming out of games workshop and a lot being worked on.

wuestenfux wrote:Are these guys so expensive?

I hope not, because judging by their work GW is getting ripped off.

Sidstyler wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Are these guys so expensive?

I hope not, because judging by their work GW is getting ripped off.

No, I think not.
It's like aka_mythos said.
Its more a problem of the internal structure and organization of GW.

The other part of that is that technology has allowed their designers to do more work in less time. Rather than using that time saving to produce more, GW simply doesn't need as many designers to do as much and since they're producing more than they can release each month, why bring on new people at a time when overhead is killing your profit margin.

warboss wrote:

aka_mythos wrote:That was old fluff that was carried over, it lacks a real place in the time line. It also say 950 lost, not 50 survivors. If this occured before the legions were split up into chapters, 950 loss is not bad. Even still 950 included the entourage that composed the crew of their ships, servitors, and other non-marines. A strike cruiser carries 100 marines, but has several thousand crewmen.

I think the way SW have been done is exactly what any codex independent of the Space Marines (or Chaos Space Marines) book deserves and requires to be worth our time. If BA can achieve that same quality they deserve to be done.

it "happened" about 1000 years before the current 5th edition story timeline (basically, warhammer 39k). this previously unknown decimation of the chapter is probably the impetus for why the black rage has become more severe in the chapter as the editions of 40k roll on by. personally, i liked it better when the BA were relatively pure with a bit of a dark side and left the whole neutral to evil space vampire schtick to the fleshtearers. also, gw revamped (or simply screwed up) the fluff by naming another chapter master of the BA at the time of the event despite the fact that according to the 2nd/3rd/4th/5th edition BA codices Dante has been chapter master for over 1200 or 1400 years (i can't remember which one). hey, it's their fluff (and like george lucas and star wars) they have the right to screw it up.

According to the Codex: Angels of Death, he has ruled the Blood Angels for over 1,100 years! So he's mad freaking old.

lord_blackfang wrote:Stop dreaming... GW didn't release more than 2 Codexes a year since 2000.

Ummm... you're wrong. Orks(Jan), Dark Angels(March), and Chaos(it was either July or August) all came out in 2007. That's 3 full codecii in one year and 7 years past 2000.

GW really stepped in it with the Space Hulk background.

But then again, I'm not 100% it is 'canon' anyway, so...

That space hulk background was written for the original edition of space hulk before a timeline or chapter size had been established.

Even still if a first founding chapter were wiped out or nearly wiped out the loss of face to the imperium would be too great, they would do everything to restore the chapter to full strength. In this instance I could easily imagine the surviving Blood Angels restoring their ranks by taking a handful squads from each of their second/third/etc founding chapters. This wouldn't be too far out there of an idea and could easily be a contingency plan within the Index Astartes, maintiaining supremacy of the progenator chapters.

aka_mythos wrote:That space hulk background was written for the original edition of space hulk before a timeline or chapter size had been established.

Even still if a first founding chapter were wiped out or nearly wiped out the loss of face to the imperium would be too great, they would do everything to restore the chapter to full strength. In this instance I could easily imagine the surviving Blood Angels restoring their ranks by taking a handful squads from each of their second/third/etc founding chapters. This wouldn't be too far out there of an idea and could easily be a contingency plan within the Index Astartes, maintiaining supremacy of the progenator chapters.

Sounds exactly like the plot line of the rather forgettable Blood Angels series of books out now, especially the last book!

Once again though, GW's lack of good editorial staff rears its ugly head.

For a company so obsessed with its IP (as they should be!), they don't do nearly as good a job maintaining it as they should, or could...

Plat I don't remember Orks being released before Dark Angels. Are you sure it wasn't Eldar?

I was hoping that the BA book would be a return of the 2nd ed Angels of Death codex that had both BA and DA in it but I guess it's not to be.

Ozymandias wrote:Plat I don't remember Orks being released before Dark Angels. Are you sure it wasn't Eldar?

It was Eldar.

2007 saw Eldar, Dark Angels and Chaos Space Marines... and Apocalypse as the supplement.
2008 saw Orks, Chaos Daemons and Space Marines... and Assault on Black Reach (5th Ed 40K) and Apocalypse Reload.
2009 saw Imperial Guard and Space Wolves... and Planetstrike, Planetary Empires and Space Hulk.

Edit: And 2010 will have at least 3 Codices, I'm still yet to hear whether the 4th one is final quarter 2010 or first quarter 2011.

Predictions:

2010 will see Nids, Blood Angels, Tau
2011 will see Necrons, CSM, Eldar
...

wuestenfux wrote:Predictions:

2010 will see Nids, Blood Angels, Tau
2011 will see Necrons, CSM, Eldar
...

No Dark Eldar? hurray!!!

@wustenfux: I generally agree with your guesses, though I'd like to see Chaos Legions in 2010 (replacing Tau), followed by Chaos Guard in 2011 (replacing CSM).

olympia wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Predictions:

2010 will see Nids, Blood Angels, Tau
2011 will see Necrons, CSM, Eldar
...

No Dark Eldar? hurray!!!

Well, I guess that DE will not be considered.

@wustenfux: I generally agree with your guesses, though I'd like to see Chaos Legions in 2010 (replacing Tau), followed by Chaos Guard in 2011 (replacing CSM).

@John: not sure what you mean with Chaos Guard.

@wustenfux:

JohnHwangDD wrote:@wustenfux:

So what?

I'm a long time BA player - my first squad coming from "box set 01" in Rogue Trader days, using "terracotta" paint. *sigh*

I don't see much in the way of rumour here. The .pdf codex fills the gap, surely a bit of time spent playtesting and a new codex could easily be published. Then were simply talking about new SW-style squad embellishments. Hell, some of the SW special character models haven't even changed, have they? I'm just looking forward to nice models - like the Hulk and FW bits. I'd happily wait if that meant a new codex/army for serious non-marine players. I already have more than enough to paint.

I think the old "stereotypes" have always fallen into what people want to see for themselves. Some see werewolves, some see Norse. Some see vampires, I see blood letting and blood sacrifice. All sorts of cultures have indulged in human sacrifice and flesh and blood drinking (actual or symbolic, holy communion anyone? *ahem*).

I guess if you have a burning desire to see cool sexy vampires, you're going to see cool sexy vampires. My daughter is obssessed by the cool sexy vampires of Twilight and the thought of being an evil 600 year old dead thing hasn't occured to her because it's not cool or sexy. But you swallow a chunk of your squad mate's flesh after he's blown to bits by a grenade, oooooh, suddenly you've gone too far. Not cool or sexy.

skrulnik wrote:

Flashman wrote:Not liking for the current trend for "ancient culture/mythology but in space" Marines.

So far we have...

Romans in Space (Ultramarines)
Monks in Space (Dark Angels)
Vikings in Space (Space Wolves)
Mongols in Space (White Scars)
Knights in Space (Black Templars)
Dragons in Space (Salamanders)

And now we will have as clearly indicated by the Space Hulk Terminator Sergeant, Vampires in Space!

Daft

Where have you been? This isn't a current trend.

That is how they have been since at least 2nd edition.Well, except Black Templars, but they date back to the Armageddon book.

At any rate, its not new.

It was there in the background and the iconography, but it was subtle. Now with Space Wolves, it is quite blatant as reflected in the rules, unit choices and miniatures.

40k is this big ball of fantasy driven sci-fi... the Emperor produced all the geneseed for the space marines... nothing says one way or the other but maybe he put some DNA of some super human creatures he found on Earth or based his reasearch on the myths of those creatures.

@wustenfux: I generally agree with your guesses, though I'd like to see Chaos Legions in 2010 (replacing Tau), followed by Chaos Guard in 2011 (replacing CSM).

Replacing CSM!!
Woah woah woah Some of us like playing regular CSM although it is a challenge without all the beardy 4th edition goodies.

Church1313 wrote:

@wustenfux: I generally agree with your guesses, though I'd like to see Chaos Legions in 2010 (replacing Tau), followed by Chaos Guard in 2011 (replacing CSM).

Replacing CSM!!
Woah woah woah Some of us like playing regular CSM although it is a challenge without all the beardy 4th edition goodies.

It's more likely that his prediction was similar except for the placement of Tau and CSM, and was simply replacing them.

cygnnus wrote:

JonnyDelta wrote:There is an old RT model of a female in power armor. Supposed to be a Librarian, back when the horned skull shoulderpad was a Librarian thing, and not an Exorcists Chapter thing.

I think she was carrying a sword, and wither a book or a bolter.

My dad has one in the old black DA scheme. I'll pop a pic up someday.

There were two of 'em actually...

Vale,

JohnS

I actually aquired one a few months back. They are the old Sisters of Battle. Man face, sword, bolter, power armor and a fantastic ass. Go figure.

Wehrkind wrote:I actually aquired one a few months back. They are the old Sisters of Battle. Man face, sword, bolter, power armor and a fantastic ass. Go figure.

Apparently, burning the witch is good for your glutes!

New vampires in space. Should make the twilight, black overcoat crowd happy.

augustus5 wrote:New vampires in space. Should make the twilight, black overcoat crowd happy.

I think you've cracked the code.

Dark Angels - marines in robes
Templars - marines in tabards
Space Wolves - marines in furs

and next

Blood Angels - marines in trenchcoats!

By jove, I think he's got it...

And, since I'm not a big fan of how 'overdone' vampires are lately, we all know that will be the part that GW will play up, to appeal more to their tween audience. Sigh. I hope for once GW takes the high road. Oh, what am I saying, nevermind

Church1313 wrote:

@wustenfux: I generally agree with your guesses, though I'd like to see Chaos Legions in 2010 (replacing Tau), followed by Chaos Guard in 2011 (replacing CSM).

Replacing CSM!!

Replacing CSM in the schedule for the year in question

You need to keep the context.

Cruentus wrote:

Blood Angels - marines in trenchcoats!

By jove, I think he's got it...

And, since I'm not a big fan of how 'overdone' vampires are lately, we all know that will be the part that GW will play up, to appeal more to their tween audience. Sigh. I hope for once GW takes the high road. Oh, what am I saying, nevermind

I think we're fairly safe from Marines in trenchcoats. Just expect lots of pointy teeth, ornate chalices and stylised blood drops.

Her Majesty's Buxom Commissar wrote:

Ozymandias wrote:Plat I don't remember Orks being released before Dark Angels. Are you sure it wasn't Eldar?

It was Eldar.

2007 saw Eldar, Dark Angels and Chaos Space Marines... and Apocalypse as the supplement.
2008 saw Orks, Chaos Daemons and Space Marines... and Assault on Black Reach (5th Ed 40K) and Apocalypse Reload.
2009 saw Imperial Guard and Space Wolves... and Planetstrike, Planetary Empires and Space Hulk.

Edit: And 2010 will have at least 3 Codices, I'm still yet to hear whether the 4th one is final quarter 2010 or first quarter 2011.

Eldar came out in 2006. First ever 'Dex I bought was Eldar in october 06.

I want Pics of these new sprues. Should be interesting to see what they do...

Vampire marines! Quick, someone photshop the kid from Twilight into some power armor! Or - better still - John C. Reilly, since apparently he's a vampire now.

So sick of bloody vampires at the moment. Can't turn on your TV, go into a bookshop, visit the cinema without being faced with somebody's pet vampire project that somehow managed to get published/made into a film.

Bloody Joss Whedon, it's all his fault...

Agreed, werewolves are much more interesting, spent many a night playing werewolf the apocalypse 2nd ed !

There is a werewolf movie coimng out in the next few months. Benecio Del Toro and Anthony Hopkins... WOLFMAN! *insert thunder*

Both werewolves and vampires are overdone. Hollywood ruins them by trying to distort and "sexy" them up. Right up there is the idea of a half-vampire or half anything... get the benefits, none of the downsides, but twice the angst. Alright, so vampires are supposed to be alluring, but only up until the point where they bite your throat open and guzzle on you like a jumbo sized coke. *Hollywood hate rant off*

I hope GW can come up with something more to add to the BA background that is less vampire. Ritual canabalism is so in this year.

Yes, sorry Vermillion but I would add werewolves to the list of gothic horror creatures that I'd like to see the back of at the moment. And zombies...

Nerdrage about vampires itt. I'd wager about half those responsible wouldn't bat an eye if GW made a Blood Angels character that with long black hair, who used two bolt pistols, and named 'Arucald'

bhsman wrote:Nerdrage about vampires itt. I'd wager about half those responsible wouldn't bat an eye if GW made a Blood Angels character that with long black hair, who used two bolt pistols, and named 'Arucald'

Cyph3r would never leave team eibldarkangle for the red-emo blondies!!

The only problem I can see with Vampire Space marines is that as soon their sgts and commanders took of their helmets to point and scream, they would die from the sunlight.

Well, for very limited values of "problem". Values that exclude "Why does it even make sense?" I really think they have tapped themselves out on loyalist chapters that justify different rules. Other than making Chaos Legions books, I think their best bet would either be a Pre-Heresy codex, or Codex: Special Marine Characters that has for each slightly divergant chapter a few characters and minor rules changes.

Was just reminising of werewolf the apocalpse was all so no problems. It does get boring after a while, sort of like marine codices (exception to the BA since all they have is a junk quickly stuck download. At least DA had a codex to screw them over:( )

aka_mythos wrote:Alright, so vampires are supposed to be alluring, but only up until the point where they bite your throat open and guzzle on you like a jumbo sized coke. *Hollywood hate rant off*.

You should go check out 'Thirst'. I think you'd like it.

Wehrkind wrote:The only problem I can see with Vampire Space marines is that as soon their sgts and commanders took of their helmets to point and scream, they would die from the sunlight.

Unless their bald heads were polished to the point where they'd reflect the deadly rays.

Well, for very limited values of "problem". Values that exclude "Why does it even make sense?" I really think they have tapped themselves out on loyalist chapters that justify different rules. Other than making Chaos Legions books, I think their best bet would either be a Pre-Heresy codex, or Codex: Special Marine Characters that has for each slightly divergant chapter a few characters and minor rules changes.

A heresy supplement would be a friggin' gold mine for them, but we've been down this path before, and it's clear GW would rather release Planetstrike and such. Never understood it and never will.

Regarding SM, I think if you had Phil Kelly writing all their books, you'd see some nicely themed and differentiated armies. I'm sure some things would be controversial a la Thunderwolf cav, but Phil just seems to get it at a conceptual level better than the rest.

gorgon wrote:

Wehrkind wrote:The only problem I can see with Vampire Space marines is that as soon their sgts and commanders took of their helmets to point and scream, they would die from the sunlight.

Unless their bald heads were polished to the point where they'd reflect the deadly rays.

All BA wear Emperor grade sunblock... UV40000?

gorgon wrote:
A heresy supplement would be a friggin' gold mine for them, but we've been down this path before, and it's clear GW would rather release Planetstrike and such. Never understood it and never will.

The BOLS heresy supplement is pretty awesome. Just sayin.

I dislike something, therefore it should not be.

It is not like they are retconning BA fluff here, they and their chapters have always been blood drinking vampires.

Right, and it's not like they will have fast attack swarms of Giant Bats or anything in the new book.........

*You joke about these things, but.......
...Canis Wolfsbutt

Actually, I sorta want Alucard Vanhammsersteine (The upcoming new BA character, don't worry I'm in the know) to be riding a coffin being pulled by swarms of vampire bats.

Maybe he can come with a whip that extends three times, from leather, to chain, to morning-star with the successful use of three power ups?

This BA dex will be good for my friend who has a whole army of assault marines led by Dante and Lemartes. Alll jet pack marines. I guess I better start putting some money aside every month.

Well, jump pack Marines can be the core of each BA army.
I hope GW stays in line with this.

they release BA DA BT and SW codexes, why the hell not realease a Thousand Sons World Eaters Death Guard and Emparors Children rules

Space Marines sell and GW don't want to go too far down the "separate Codex for each faction" road because it would take decades to get through the Codex cycle. Actually, if you're a DE player, it already takes decades to get through the Codex cycle

i should kick down the door at GW in the uk and say "O WANTEH SUMS CHAOZ CODEXEHS DAKSHUNS!!!"

physcosamatic wrote:they release BA DA BT and SW codexes, why the hell not realease a Thousand Sons World Eaters Death Guard and Emparors Children rules

GW has talked about doing Legion-specific codices down the line, but they're probably further on the backburner than Daemonhunters at this point. Eventually, though...

physcosamatic wrote:i should kick down the door at GW in the uk and say "O WANTEH SUMS CHAOZ CODEXEHS DAKSHUNS!!!"

They're not clever enough to understand German

Flashman wrote:Yes, sorry Vermillion but I would add werewolves to the list of gothic horror creatures that I'd like to see the back of at the moment. And zombies...

So, what about my Fishmen and Frankenstein's Monster custom chapter I'm working on?

Valhallan42nd wrote:So, what about my Fishmen and Frankenstein's Monster custom chapter I'm working on?

They're called Tau and Death Guard!

If the blood angles weren't blond emo vampires (well, actually if they just weren't blond- no self respecting vampire can be blond, and not be considered 'the lame' by non blond vampires- and red headed vampires are just right out of the picture) I'd be excited.

But what I'd prefer, if a Marine codex HAS to come out, is Codex Iron Snakes

Carlovonsexron wrote:Codex Iron Snakes

I could go for that.

Carlovonsexron wrote:But what I'd prefer, if a Marine codex HAS to come out, is Codex Iron Snakes

They're a Codex Chapter, so just use Codex: SM. If you really want to play them, use the Red Scorpion rules from Imperial Armour and upgrade a model to an Apothecary for X points or so. Or, just start a letter-writing campaign to GW and ask them to do stuff like Index Astartes again

@Carlvonsexron

I've been watching True Blood with my wife (she's my excuse), and I'm MORE THAN HAPPY with the redheaded vampire they've got...

JonnyDelta wrote:@Carlvonsexron

I've been watching True Blood with my wife (she's my excuse), and I'm MORE THAN HAPPY with the redheaded vampire they've got...

Actually both red heads are worth the watch, Jessica and the Queen

Re: Codex Iron Snakes

I'm not familiar with this Chapter, but as I interpreted the last Codex: SM, all you need is a Chapter Master with the appropriate Chapter Tactics trait. Coming up with one of your own shouldn't be too hard either - just getting the points cost for him right would be the trick - as well as your opponents consent.

Iron Snakes Universal Rule: They're all really, really good at killing Dark Eldar. After deployment but before the game starts, count the number of Iron Snakes models on the table. Take this number and multiply it by two. Remove that many Dark Eldar models from the table.(FAQ: The Iron Snakes player chooses which models)

lol

just read the Lexicaium article on them.

I would just add a few points for each marine equipped with his little fishing spear (j/k) and represent the ShieldWall tactic by sacrificing an attack per model for them to be power weapon hits.
(ShieldWalls not being big on broad sweeping attacks).

Or models in the ShieldWall get a 6+(i) if they are formed properly.

And every squad gets FNP from their apothecary and invulnerable saves from shields...

bhsman wrote:

Carlovonsexron wrote:But what I'd prefer, if a Marine codex HAS to come out, is Codex Iron Snakes

They're a Codex Chapter, so just use Codex: SM. If you really want to play them, use the Red Scorpion rules from Imperial Armour and upgrade a model to an Apothecary for X points or so. Or, just start a letter-writing campaign to GW and ask them to do stuff like Index Astartes again

They arnt a codex chapter at all- I mean, while I'm not to familiar with the history fo the blood angles, or dark angels, they [The Iron Snakes] rub off as way more unique then either of them [The angel chapters, amongst others who actually dont have codex's', so I don't have a gripe with]. And you get to add in a bit of mystery connected maybe to the two unknown legions, since they have an unknown primarch themselves...

I wouldnt mind having specific rules for creating independent characters who can act independent of a squad entirely like Priad did in the opening section of the Iron Snakes book. For all the stuff people say about space wolf fluff bucking authority and such, its the Iron Snakes strike as the most independent minded chapter (after all, what other chapter has democratic elements in place in the grimdark universe of 40K? )


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Though annoyingly, reading over the the Iron Snakes entry on lexicanum, someone edited out all the primarch stuff, and put them under the Utramarines name. Which is totally unfounded, IMO.

Yeah, every chapter should get their own codex. Every single chapter. Codex: SM is only really for Ultramarines anyway, everyone else says feth the codex and does their own thing, and are so wildly divergent they need their own books.

How about no? We've got enough with SW, SM, BA, DA, and BT. We don't need more Marines.

Aw, stop the cryin' already. If the market can support an Iron Snakes codex, so be it. If the idea bothers you, blame Abnett for writing an interesting book about an oddly divergent chapter.

You're never going to get an equal treatment of all the factions until all the factions have parity in sales and you can't magically create those sales just be releasing stuff for non-marine factions. Affirmative Action for 40k armies won't work because you can't tell people which armies to like, collect and play. If people are happy playing marines against marines, who has the right to tell them they're wrong?

You're never going to get an equal treatment of all the factions until all the factions have parity in sales and you can't magically create those sales just be releasing stuff for non-marine factions.

You'll never get those sales if you keep making more and more Marine gak and leaving said armies in the dust, either.

Marines make up such a large percentage of GW overall sales that they pay for everything else to happen. Without all this marine stuff there would be disproportionally less or no 40k all.

You won't get those sales up either if you don't give non marine options to new players.

I went to a GW store once and said I was looking to start playing. The first thing they did was say "Here's the Space Marines, the most all around army you can play." They didn't even bother to ask about what I was looking for.

Don't bother, those redshirts are often not very smart.

Sidstyler wrote:Yeah, every chapter should get their own codex. Every single chapter. Codex: SM is only really for Ultramarines anyway, everyone else says feth the codex and does their own thing, and are so wildly divergent they need their own books.

How about no? We've got enough with SW, SM, BA, DA, and BT. We don't need more Marines.

You really misunderstood my original post, I think. My opinion is that there should NOT necessarily be more marine codexes. BUT if they are totally unavoidable, I'd much prefer really cool, interesting, and unique chapters like the Iron snakes to get these slots, rather then the Blood Angels who seem much more similar to the Ultras. Though generally speaking, I find many of the original Legion based chapters boring (though, ironically, of them I actually like both the BA, and the Ultramarines alot). That said, I'd be curious about a Raven Guard Codex if that ever came out.

It seems I did.

Carlovonsexron wrote:

Sidstyler wrote:Yeah, every chapter should get their own codex. Every single chapter. Codex: SM is only really for Ultramarines anyway, everyone else says feth the codex and does their own thing, and are so wildly divergent they need their own books.

How about no? We've got enough with SW, SM, BA, DA, and BT. We don't need more Marines.

You really misunderstood my original post, I think. My opinion is that there should NOT necessarily be more marine codexes. BUT if they are totally unavoidable, I'd much prefer really cool, interesting, and unique chapters like the Iron snakes to get these slots, rather then the Blood Angels who seem much more similar to the Ultras. Though generally speaking, I find many of the original Legion based chapters boring (though, ironically, of them I actually like both the BA, and the Ultramarines alot). That said, I'd be curious about a Raven Guard Codex if that ever came out.

Well, BA should not be similar to vanilla Marines.
For this, I'd refer to the BA codex in 3rd ed.
The whole army had furious charge.
GW, bring it back!

Having way more JPs and HtH options is good enough to differentiate them for me. But BA do need lower JP costs to get competitive with the newly-cheap (and tough) 5E Rhinos. 4 pts /model is probably about right.

To imagine that a JP used to cost +10 pts on a basic AM...


Army-wide Furious Charge isn't what BA need, as they would mass-DS via JPs. What BA need is the Vanguard rule made army wide (may Assault after DS).

Yeah! 50 or 60 roid raging Space Marines riding rockets of fire straight into the heart of the enemy!! That's a marine army I could spend some money on!

Centurion.

JohnHwangDD wrote:Army-wide Furious Charge isn't what BA need, as they would mass-DS via JPs. What BA need is the Vanguard rule made army wide (may Assault after DS).

I agree that an army-wide furious charge is not very helpful.
It does not improve the game dynamics for BA.
What I could imagine is furious charge for JP Marines and Termies, maybe optional.
Moreover, the possibility to rage (move forward D6'') for some units prior to the game.
Assault after DS (for JP and Termies) would be a very nice option.

Are you guys high?

Furious charge is an amazing ability for BA. The ability to swing BEFORE your enemy (well anything I4 or slower) with an easier change to would is amazingly helpful, especially in the new edition. I would be greatly disappointed if we lost FA in the new Dex, as i cannot count how many times my VAS has eliminated 10 model Space marine squads before they even get a chance to swing.

FC is nice, provided you get to charge, assuming you survive the enemy's massed fire when you DS.

DS&Assault means you get to Assault in the first place - this promotes very aggressive play.

I think DS+Assault in the same turn for an entire army would make them a bit of a no brainer. I can't see GW giving it out.

All of the stuff you mentioned are in the blood angels codex that you can download from the gw site.

Da Boss wrote:I think DS+Assault in the same turn for an entire army would make them a bit of a no brainer. I can't see GW giving it out.

Because it's totally b0rken IMBA OP on Vanguard right now?

BA need an actual, tactical reason to take Assault Termies, along with JPs over Rhinos, and that would do it.

The catch with is that you need to land the Assault Squad within 6+d6" (assuming you can still Run) of an enemy, *after* scatter. Play too "safe", and they're stranded, and can't even shoot. Play too close, and you suffer a DS mishap, probably taking them out of the game.

Not being able to shoot, and the DS mishap table balance things, just fine I think.

I could easily see GW doing this, and I could easily see BA players using it.

BA need an actual, tactical reason to take Assault Termies, along with JPs over Rhinos, and that would do it.

This would be a swing in a direction that is worth to be considered:
Assault Termies and JP with FC and mechanisms to bring them early into assault range.

I don't see that working. It pushes on broken. The whole purpose for not allowing DS+assault is a fairness thing. Ranged units have to actually have some chance of staving off an attack. As it is, things are as balanced as they can be between assault and ranged combat something like that sets a precedent that swings the pendulum further back in favor to assault.

If the issue is JP over rhinos, its simply JP's get to deep strike and rhinos don't its otherwise a direct trade off with little need to be improved. Advantage is that the JP's deepstrike can get a unit to an enemy sooner, regardless of otherwise intervenening terrain.

I think just updating the Assault Terminators rules and points to be "standard" is enough to make them worth while; it makes little sense to make them anything more when it isn't something they're reknowned for.

itys about time they got a face lift since they dont technically have a codex (im sorry but a pdf just isnt a codex to me!)

Technically they DO have a codex. Technically it is a Tijuana back-alley abortion, replete with lighter and coat hanger.

How about deepstriking onto a unit doesn't kill you? I don't understand how squishy things can kill armoured things that have landed on them anyway. "mishap" is fine for teleportation but it makes deepstriking jumpers look weak next to infiltrators. And lets face it, if I was dropping from the sky in the 41st millenia with an powered, armoured suit, I'd be shooting at s*!t all the way down... oh yeah!

Because they want to make deep strike as awful as possible except for vets in valks

gruntboy wrote:How about deepstriking onto a unit doesn't kill you? I don't understand how squishy things can kill armoured things that have landed on them anyway. "mishap" is fine for teleportation but it makes deepstriking jumpers look weak next to infiltrators. And lets face it, if I was dropping from the sky in the 41st millenia with an powered, armoured suit, I'd be shooting at s*!t all the way down... oh yeah!

This happens far more than you'd think was feasable IRL.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Da Boss wrote:I think DS+Assault in the same turn for an entire army would make them a bit of a no brainer. I can't see GW giving it out.

Because it's totally b0rken IMBA OP on Vanguard right now?

Vanguard are limited by being Elites, being way too overpriced and competing with better stuff.
Which means you can't have that many of them, and they can be gunned down after they do their thing. If you had lots of units doing it, and they were cheap to have other toys too, then it gets nastier.

If anyone deserves DS+Assault, it's Daemons. Marines should get tech, not outlandish megaultrasuperhuman abilities. Cuz ya know, converting to Chaos makes you lose all your special powers to gain mediocre ones :p

Arschbombe wrote: Affirmative Action for 40k armies won't work because you can't tell people which armies to like, collect and play. If people are happy playing marines against marines, who has the right to tell them they're wrong?

QFT and quite possibly sigged.

Somnicide wrote:

Arschbombe wrote: Affirmative Action for 40k armies won't work because you can't tell people which armies to like, collect and play. If people are happy playing marines against marines, who has the right to tell them they're wrong?

QFT and quite possibly sigged.

But you can tell people which armies not to like. By not updating its rules or models for a decade, for example. GW should stop telling people to not like DE.

Da Boss wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Da Boss wrote:I think DS+Assault in the same turn for an entire army would make them a bit of a no brainer. I can't see GW giving it out.

Because it's totally b0rken IMBA OP on Vanguard right now?

Vanguard are limited by being Elites, being way too overpriced and competing with better stuff.
Which means you can't have that many of them, and they can be gunned down after they do their thing. If you had lots of units doing it, and they were cheap to have other toys too, then it gets nastier.

So I guess the real solution is that BA should have discounted Vanguard or assault marines.

dont know if its true or not but i heard black templars are going to be getting an update the same time as ba codex is released

Kharnflakes wrote:dont know if its true or not but i heard black templars are going to be getting an update the same time as ba codex is released

AC shut that down.

ac? and damn i was hoping it was true

Alessio cava, caba, cara, casa ... Alessio.

ah ok .. damn still was hoping for an update at least guess we will have to wait for the new codex then

Da Boss wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Da Boss wrote:I think DS+Assault in the same turn for an entire army would make them a bit of a no brainer. I can't see GW giving it out.

Because it's totally b0rken IMBA OP on Vanguard right now?

Vanguard are limited by being Elites, being way too overpriced and competing with better stuff.
Which means you can't have that many of them, and they can be gunned down after they do their thing. If you had lots of units doing it, and they were cheap to have other toys too, then it gets nastier.

You mean like Daemons DS & Assault being totally bOrken IMBA OP right now?

aka_mythos wrote:So I guess the real solution is that BA should have discounted Vanguard or assault marines.

Yeah. They can take them as Troops, for example.

Niccolo wrote:Plus, Salamanders are as much "dragons in space" as the Rainbow Warriors are rainbows in space.

There's no sign of the morning coming.
You've been left on your own.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

aka_mythos wrote:So I guess the real solution is that BA should have discounted Vanguard or assault marines.

Yeah. They can take them as Troops, for example.

Scoring Vanguard maybe, assault marine troops definitely.
.

In fact, I'm eagerly waiting for the new BA codex.
I already have a large BA army, but it hit the shelf when the jervisified 'dex came out.

Baah! We Totally need Codex: Rainbow Warriors

Talkin to plants, being purged by the SoB, and oil slicks on the forehead... I see much win
------
But seriously all we BA players need is some Assault Marines with fleet.

Like wuestenfux I am waiting for the new BA codex. With a real dex instead of that Jervy dex my friend would have done a lot better in the Ardboyz semi earlier this year. My BA are waiting while I play Eldar for now.

rzsanguine wrote:Like wuestenfux I am waiting for the new BA codex. With a real dex instead of that Jervy dex my friend would have done a lot better in the Ardboyz semi earlier this year. My BA are waiting while I play Eldar for now.

I even put my Eldar on the shelf when the 5th ed came out.
Now I play DW or vanilla SM or CSM.

Latest rumors at Warseer say that BA will be released earlier than March 2010.
January seems to be an option. That would be absolutely great!

wuestenfux wrote:Latest rumors at Warseer say that BA will be released earlier than March 2010.
January seems to be an option. That would be absolutely great!

Don't think so. Jan is 'Nids.

Though the two armies were kind of packaged together with Space Hulk - I can see them continuing that theme.

Double release?
Or twin -dex? Maybe like old WD ( turn the mag to read the "other stuff" )

UltraPrime wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:Latest rumors at Warseer say that BA will be released earlier than March 2010.
January seems to be an option. That would be absolutely great!

Don't think so. Jan is 'Nids.

December or February:?

Oh, so there is going to be a double release of Nids and Blood Angels in January.

I guess that's what the cryptic Brimstone comment meant.

No way, a double release has never been done before!

GW can't put out two releases in the same month. We'll see I guess, but I think it's bs.

I hope that everyone is wrong and they do Angels of Death again and Dark Angels get even more overcosted and worthless that people destroy the internet under the weight of NerdRage.

C'mon Jervis you've thought about it haven't you?

But seriously what happened to the codex book Rowboat says? Blood Angels misplaced their copy?

Sneak peak form the flavour text of the new Dex.

Brother Lestat:"My lord Dante, our recent shipment appears incorrect, Instead of Landraider Redeemers, we got 666 jumppacks."

Dante: "Jumpacks for Everyone! I'll show that Shrike chump! Blood for the Blood Angel God Emperor!!!"

Weeeelp. Hopefully I'll beat my friend's BA army before they make Mephiston more kickass. So far if I don't shove Runes of Warding halfway down his throat he turns into Alucard and rips my Eldar to shreds. The good thing about a real BA codex is that I can show him where it says no Death Company Terminators with wargear.

For the record, could we get the quote in here or a link to it?

Shaman wrote:I hope that everyone is wrong and they do Angels of Death again and Dark Angels get even more overcosted and worthless that people destroy the internet under the weight of NerdRage.

C'mon Jervis you've thought about it haven't you?

But seriously what happened to the codex book Rowboat says? Blood Angels misplaced their copy?

Sneak peak form the flavour text of the new Dex.

Brother Lestat:"My lord Dante, our recent shipment appears incorrect, Instead of Landraider Redeemers, we got 666 jumppacks."

Dante: "Jumpacks for Everyone! I'll show that Shrike chump! Blood for the Blood Angel God Emperor!!!"

Haha, look at this guy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFKylgGk73I

Careful, bad language.

hehe, good one

bhsman wrote:For the record, could we get the quote in here or a link to it?

Shaman wrote:I hope that everyone is wrong and they do Angels of Death again and Dark Angels get even more overcosted and worthless that people destroy the internet under the weight of NerdRage.

C'mon Jervis you've thought about it haven't you?

But seriously what happened to the codex book Rowboat says? Blood Angels misplaced their copy?

Sneak peak form the flavour text of the new Dex.

Brother Lestat:"My lord Dante, our recent shipment appears incorrect, Instead of Landraider Redeemers, we got 666 jumppacks."

Dante: "Jumpacks for Everyone! I'll show that Shrike chump! Blood for the Blood Angel God Emperor!!!"

Haha, look at this guy

Look at Warseer: http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=224507&page=28 (Fraggle's comments).

Da Boss wrote:Vanguard are limited by being Elites...

Now listen carefully, for I will say this only once....

Vanguard are Fast Attack ffs, read the codex! Seems everyone thinks they're Elite but they're not. I can see a lot of p***ed off BA players if the VAS don't become Fast Attack as well.

I have fear.... if they are going to release the BA with a Codex of their own, I might even start a little army just for fun.

@ Shaman = LOL that could happen indeed.

I have fear.... if they are going to release the BA with a Codex of their own, I might even start a little army just for fun.

Don't fear it.
Go for it!

Grim.Badger wrote:Now listen carefully, for I will say this only once....

Vanguard are Fast Attack ffs, read the codex! Seems everyone thinks they're Elite but they're not. I can see a lot of p***ed off BA players if the VAS don't become Fast Attack as well.

Uh, what are you talking about FFS? Making them Fast Attack means less slots for Speeders and Bikes. Besides, they've always been elites.

Anyways, thanks for linking to the bit about an earlier release schedule. My only concern is that Harry seemed to think it was too early, but who knows?

VAS should be Elites. They're VETERANS.

Sure, but if you take Dante you should get veteran assault marines squads as elites, troops and fast attack and they're all scoring.

bhsman wrote:

Grim.Badger wrote:Now listen carefully, for I will say this only once....

Vanguard are Fast Attack ffs, read the codex! Seems everyone thinks they're Elite but they're not. I can see a lot of p***ed off BA players if the VAS don't become Fast Attack as well.

Uh, what are you talking about FFS? Making them Fast Attack means less slots for Speeders and Bikes. Besides, they've always been elites.

Anyways, thanks for linking to the bit about an earlier release schedule. My only concern is that Harry seemed to think it was too early, but who knows?

I have never taken, nor wanted to take speeders or bikes for my BA.
More jump packs, most definitely.
Maybe they need to create a FA jumppacker now that they have shifted them to troops.
Or give a thematic choice in the FA slots.

Same.

If I wanted Speeders & Bikes, I'd play as DA (RW) or basic SM (WS).

However, mass JPs are unique to BAs, so I'd like that.

Being able to take Landspeeders as Fast to support AM Troops works fine for me.

BA can already take up to twelve Jump Pack units, though, and shifting them to FA wouldn't change that. The only thing it would do would be to cut down on the overall anti-tank of the list.

Is it just me or does there seem like not too much interest in a blood angels codex..

I know the codex is far far away but I'm surprised that space wolves have such a greater reaction.. (people love or hate wolves)

Maybe blood angel palyers dont say too much.

Shaman wrote:Is it just me or does there seem like not too much interest in a blood angels codex..

I know the codex is far far away but I'm surprised that space wolves have such a greater reaction.. (people love or hate wolves)

Maybe blood angel palyers dont say too much.

It isn't THAT far away, actually...

And, I think there's a fair amount of interest in it, but yes, a Xenos or revamped Inquisition Codex would probably generate a lot more heat.

246 replies to a rumor post is not saying much?

I think a big factor is that the PDF codex was much more recent than the SW book that ran for 3rd, all of 4th and up until recently.

Also it isn't all powerful, but it isn't stupid broken weak either.

Well, a big part of it has to be that we haven't gotten any juicy tidbits about what's in it or what comes with it. We figure they'll be a new plastic kit or two, maybe a resculpted character (lemartes!), but it's all speculation. We can take cues from the depth of the SW dex that the BA dex will be similarly flavorful, but really none of has a clue to what it'l be.

Arschbombe wrote:Well, a big part of it has to be that we haven't gotten any juicy tidbits about what's in it or what comes with it. We figure they'll be a new plastic kit or two, maybe a resculpted character (lemartes!), but it's all speculation. We can take cues from the depth of the SW dex that the BA dex will be similarly flavorful, but really none of has a clue to what it'l be.

Oh god, PLEASE resculpt Lemartes He's had the same model for as long as I can remember. It's the same for other BA characters, but at least those look decent.

I'd like it if Moriar the Chosen was brought back too, I miss a Dread with D6+2 attacks

Double Post Daemon. AGH my first post has gone!!

lame.

Oh well What I said was I was thinking about it and the reason this thread is so short is that no one hates blood angels..

Whats their derogative name?

Cause we have smurfs, furries and lame monks. Red marines ooooh.

Neith wrote:Oh god, PLEASE resculpt Lemartes He's had the same model for as long as I can remember. It's the same for other BA characters, but at least those look decent.

ironically, you've chosen the model in the blood angel range that is the NEWEST SCULPT outside of space hulk!! lol the rest of the characters are all second edition or older. that being said, he's definitely the ugliest. he looks like he tripped into a vat of glue over in the baal armory and then fell into a pile of purity seals; later that same day, he decided to test out his new jump pack in the local chapter wind tunnel. and that's when GW decided to sculpt him...

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't Lemartes a Mike McVey sculpt?

Maybe he did it as a joke before he left for PP, and GW, just like with Morley's Nagash, took it happily.

I hope they give some DC-type bits for the Dread on a BA sprue. Or maybe 2 dread plates.

Yeah I don't use Lemartes. I converted a SM chap with a JP and just use him as counts as Lemartes. It looks so much better.

warboss wrote:

Neith wrote:Oh god, PLEASE resculpt Lemartes He's had the same model for as long as I can remember. It's the same for other BA characters, but at least those look decent.

ironically, you've chosen the model in the blood angel range that is the NEWEST SCULPT outside of space hulk!! lol the rest of the characters are all second edition or older. that being said, he's definitely the ugliest. he looks like he tripped into a vat of glue over in the baal armory and then fell into a pile of purity seals; later that same day, he decided to test out his new jump pack in the local chapter wind tunnel. and that's when GW decided to sculpt him...

Wow, that I didn't know. I joined in early Third Edition, and didn't collect BA until late third. I just assumed Lemartes was an ancient model because of how bad it looks in comparison to say...Dante or Mephiston. I mean, those two are pretty generic posed, but Lemartes looks like he's stood in a wind tunnel for no apparent reason other than to look stupid.

Shaman wrote:Is it just me or does there seem like not too much interest in a blood angels codex..

GW's clampdown on public information release has a side effect of supressing buildup.

@ DD It also supresses ZOMG my codex is ruined (sorta) before the codex comes out.

The gnashing of teeth factor. "Jump packs fast again I quit blood angels!"


I still think theres no interest cause no one hates blood angels, without complaining dakka would be about 30 threads a year.

@Shaman: No arguments there.

Shaman wrote:@ DD It also supresses ZOMG my codex is ruined (sorta) before the codex comes out.

The gnashing of teeth factor. "Jump packs fast again I quit blood angels!"


I still think theres no interest cause no one hates blood angels, without complaining dakka would be about 30 threads a year.

Well, thankfully that's not true.

But remember, it is up to YOU to help make Dakka even better than it already is.

And, er, go Blood Angels!

Grim.Badger wrote:

Da Boss wrote:Vanguard are limited by being Elites...

Now listen carefully, for I will say this only once....

Vanguard are Fast Attack ffs, read the codex! Seems everyone thinks they're Elite but they're not. I can see a lot of p***ed off BA players if the VAS don't become Fast Attack as well.

Elite, FA, it doesn't matter too much- either way they're limited to maximum three, and are competing with much better options like Speeders and Attack Bikes.
Thanks for the correction though.

Hmm, March? I wonder if that's early March...in time for Adepticon?

skrulnik wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but isn't Lemartes a Mike McVey sculpt?

He is, yes. Towards the end of his time with GW, McVey suddenly started producing greens as well as painting... Came out about the same time as the rather odd-looking Wolf Scouts that GW are for some reason selling through the webstore instead of the much better (and more appropriately veteran-looking) ones that were released three and a half minutes later.

Not knocking McVey... the man is incredibly talented with a paintbrush. But those first few sculpts really weren't up to the standard that GW was generally hitting at that time.

Youre being way too nice Insaniak.. Lemartes is one of the worst sculpts post 2nd ed models (IE no rogue trader blobs of pewter)

It is garbage that is rivaled only by dark eldar and I consider it to be far worse considering the rest of the marine line is stellar

Mike McVey is a great modeller and painter but man oh man that Lemartes sculpt was rough.

Yes, he looks like he tripped on a rock and twisted his ankle. Poor Lemartes, is there another 40K model out there that is the suject of more hate?

Cue photos of Dark Eldar miniatures...

Kirasu wrote:Youre being way too nice Insaniak.. Lemartes is one of the worst sculpts post 2nd ed models (IE no rogue trader blobs of pewter)

Yet is still infinitely better than Cortez.

Yeah I forgot about Captain Anorexia

It almost makes one long for the generic Morley poses...

And of course, let's not forget Doomrider.

No, on second thought, let's forget Doomrider.

He comes, he goes!

I've always thought it was rather limiting that The Death Company was so dependent on the number of troops choices (or infantry choices for that matter) one took in the army. I do not recall the exact rules in the former codex; but as I remember the rules were an attempt at reconciling the fluff with the rules: each member of the death company was picked from each infantry squad as the marine "succumbed" to the thirst. I hope in a re-visit to the codex a much better set of rules for the Death company is created... something in the same spirit as the Wolf Guard for the space wolves.

Rikhjard wrote:I've always thought it was rather limiting that The Death Company was so dependent on the number of troops choices (or infantry choices for that matter) one took in the army. I do not recall the exact rules in the former codex; but as I remember the rules were an attempt at reconciling the fluff with the rules: each member of the death company was picked from each infantry squad as the marine "succumbed" to the thirst. I hope in a re-visit to the codex a much better set of rules for the Death company is created... something in the same spirit as the Wolf Guard for the space wolves.

Yeah, in the hard-copy Codex, you rolled a D6 at the start of the battle for each Infantry unit. On a roll of 4+, one member joined the Death Company, and on a 6 you had to add a member and roll again for that squad.

It was a great rule that really emphasised the fluff of BA. Now what do we have?

...but...I don't have time to paint their armor black before the game starts!

Sidstyler wrote:...but...I don't have time to paint their armor black before the game starts!

"If you have insufficent Death Company models, any excess models are lost".

Yes, I still have the old Codex, as it actually shows me how to paint each unit. >_>

So basically it counts on you having a big pool of DC models ready to go.

Bah, I could see that rule coming back then, GW would sell more models.

im eagerly waiting for the new codex, but it does mean that i have to stop building my army now so i dont buy models ill never play since we really have no idea whats coming.

I remember seeing someone play with that rules set. It was the first 40k game I ever saw. I loved that idea and really in a 1500 point game its not like you are really ever going to get over 10 DC models on the board anyways.

Neith wrote:It was a great rule that really emphasized the fluff of BA. Now what do we have?

Emphasized Flesh Tearers fluff, more likely. The current system isn't much better, I admit.

Neith wrote:Yeah, in the hard-copy Codex, you rolled a D6 at the start of the battle for each Infantry unit. On a roll of 4+, one member joined the Death Company, and on a 6 you had to add a member and roll again for that squad.

It was a great rule that really emphasised the fluff of BA. Now what do we have?

1000%, 100 Folds QFT.....IMHO

In an FAQ is said you could field 2 DC Chaplains (D3+3 Each, in addition to Squad rolls) counting as one unit and at a tourney I rolled sickly well and ended up with 18 DC and 2 Chaps all with jumppacks.......Attacks got rolled and pants got pee'ed! But it's all the luck of the roll....and I had 26 painted DC with JP's just in case!

Take rending away... it got nerfed anyway. Give them Preferred Enemy and FNP now that's a unit! I know they will basically have Preferred Enemy with the Chaplain, but maybe give the Chaplain a new ability or make him cheaper.

I'm sorry you all hate the new codex. At the time it was printed, it was balanced and in-line with the DA, Eldar and Chaos codex. Army-wide FC was insane and unbalanced.

Rending isn't what it was, but I still like it.

Then the C:SM came out, with it's 3+ inv saves for th/ss, more capacity for it's transports, game changing special characters, etc, etc. and that threw everything into the bin.

Neith wrote:

Rikhjard wrote:I've always thought it was rather limiting that The Death Company was so dependent on the number of troops choices (or infantry choices for that matter) one took in the army. I do not recall the exact rules in the former codex; but as I remember the rules were an attempt at reconciling the fluff with the rules: each member of the death company was picked from each infantry squad as the marine "succumbed" to the thirst. I hope in a re-visit to the codex a much better set of rules for the Death company is created... something in the same spirit as the Wolf Guard for the space wolves.

Yeah, in the hard-copy Codex, you rolled a D6 at the start of the battle for each Infantry unit. On a roll of 4+, one member joined the Death Company, and on a 6 you had to add a member and roll again for that squad.

It was a great rule that really emphasised the fluff of BA. Now what do we have?

Yeah, but it also wasn't very fair. You were getting a 25-30 point model for 16 points. But that was back then. I personally think that the DC need to just be bought with points. It might be a little less fluffy, but ultimately its more balanced.

Jayden63 wrote:Yeah, but it also wasn't very fair. You were getting a 25-30 point model for 16 points. But that was back then. I personally think that the DC need to just be bought with points. It might be a little less fluffy, but ultimately its more balanced.

I agree. But don't forget taking your "naked" vet sgt out of the squad and getting a DC with a power-fist for free. Cheesy gits.

Just make DC optional and we'll be square.

No making DC optional would take away a HUGE part of what makes blood angels blood angles! If I didn't want to have DC I would play regular marines.

Edit: As it is now you don't have to take DC if you don't want to take them. Granted you pay the points for them so it dosent make much sense not to take them but still there is nothing that says you must take them.

Just because you (as the player of the game) make the decision to have or not have a unit of Death Company Marines in your army, doesn't mean it wasn't a group being crazed at random by visions of the dead primarch.

Rules are not fluff.

Jack

IMHO i liked the old rules for (more numerous) DC.
Wonder if they'll give DC back they're wargear...?

Knowing GW atm you'll get 1000 DC for 10 points (this is overexaggeration).

As a BA opponent I'd love to see the Special Characters get a higher potential threat while increased risk at slaughtering themselves/others in their team. They see visions of sugar-demons.

the_ferrett wrote:Knowing GW atm you'll get 1000 DC for 10 points (this is overexaggeration).

I'll take 2000 points worth......

Neith wrote:

Rikhjard wrote:I've always thought it was rather limiting that The Death Company was so dependent on the number of troops choices (or infantry choices for that matter) one took in the army. I do not recall the exact rules in the former codex; but as I remember the rules were an attempt at reconciling the fluff with the rules: each member of the death company was picked from each infantry squad as the marine "succumbed" to the thirst. I hope in a re-visit to the codex a much better set of rules for the Death company is created... something in the same spirit as the Wolf Guard for the space wolves.

Yeah, in the hard-copy Codex, you rolled a D6 at the start of the battle for each Infantry unit. On a roll of 4+, one member joined the Death Company, and on a 6 you had to add a member and roll again for that squad.

It was a great rule that really emphasised the fluff of BA. Now what do we have?

It was a crap rule. Not knowing how many DC you had at the start of the game blew. The current rules are much more balanced. I'd rather pay extra and get a firm count ahead of time. Yes, the rules are currently less powerful (potentially, you could have crap rolling). But more powerful does not equal better for the game.

Emrab wrote:No making DC optional would take away a HUGE part of what makes blood angels blood angles! If I didn't want to have DC I would play regular marines.

Edit: As it is now you don't have to take DC if you don't want to take them. Granted you pay the points for them so it dosent make much sense not to take them but still there is nothing that says you must take them.

So? Blood Claws are a huge part of what makes the Space Wolves the Space Wolves, but you aren't required to field them in every game. I love the Death Company, but damn if I hate having to account for them in every. Damn. List. Oh, and you have to have a plan to control them, either with Corbulo or a Chaplain, or else you'll be at the mercy of a smart player. And telling someone to just not field the Death Company that you already overpaid for is like telling someone to spend $100 on food and then immediately throwing it away.

It'd be like forcing Marine players to take a Thunderfire Cannon in every list. Oh sure it's an awesome unit but it really screws with your game plan. Or forcing Orkz to take Lootas. Or Dark Eldar and Grotesques. Or Daemonhunters and Daemonhosts.

Besides, in no way does being optional = removed from the codex.

wooo cant wait, my white dwarf with the BA codex in it is falling to pieces lol

@bhsman, Ok yeah I see what you are saying but to me it just seems like they are a key part of playing the army. While getting the Baal Predators and Furioso dreads and jump packs as troops are also nice I always viewed DC as whats makes BA stand out. To each his own. I just don't want to see them get made into something thats an option that everyone refuses to take because of how much they suck compared to other options.

steveb93 wrote:wooo cant wait, my white dwarf with the BA codex in it is falling to pieces lol

Its free online :p and also the white dwarf copy is incorrect as it has many errors and changes were made to the online version

Kirasu wrote:

steveb93 wrote:wooo cant wait, my white dwarf with the BA codex in it is falling to pieces lol

Its free online :p and also the white dwarf copy is incorrect as it has many errors and changes were made to the online version

Yeah, like that pesky error of Mephiston having a good power. Good thing they fixed that for us, and not say adding the stats for missing wargear or giving our rhinos doors. Sigh...

Oh, as for the DC, I like how they are stat wise tbh and I do not want to have to model more of them to give them all disparate gear. Basically, as anyone facing a new codex, I don't want my old models to now be invalid or not good enough. Their rules are fine imho though, I could wishlist things and ask for fleet or charging out of DS, but honestly they're pretty good how they are. I don't have a problem with them being optional though. Even fluffwise if that many marines were going crazy and dieing in every damn skirmish we fight, well the BA would have died out long ago. There are certainly plenty of battles that the BA would fight without the aid of DC members too. I do love the crazy bastards though, delusional psychopathic zealots :')