Hi,
today is the Forge World Open Day 2010 over at Nottingham.
Traditionally PhilBrad2 from Warseer makes something like a live stream of the event:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=251559

I will try to keep this first post updated as a summary of the Warseer and our own thread. As it is already much work, please forgive me that I will not add explicit credits to each of the posters of said threads, who all get my sincere thanks here.

General
As usual, FW discusses future projects more openly than GW, still, there are limits like stats from the next book and anything involving the Storm Raven like lander
New FW website coming soon.
FW will increase its production with 3 IA books per year planned, including all models for them. Plus specials like the Masterclass or Apocalypse book. They will make rules updates if necessary, mostly as pdf-files, maybe even as small booklets in the FW catalogue style. FW wants to make more stand-alone books, even if some future projects turn out to be multi-parters as well.

Next after Orks (IA10?) will be Eldar vs. Imperium, possibly in two books. Still contradicting rumours whether the Ork storyline will get a second book with maybe two other clans vs. Ravenguard or Eldar are next. Once source said that IA 9 will be the second part of the campaign but instead of more Ork stuff, the Imperium finds out that Eldar herded the Orks to that planet -> Eldar stuff. Still not sure about this.

Also an IA book Slaanesh& Tzeentch vs Imperium will come, again with CSM upgrade kits, characters and daemon engines.
Some designers are keen on pre-heresy stuff and will include such SM armour in future SM releases, maybe even more pre-heresy stuff. No specific plans though. A Warlord titan will also come someday in the far future.
Nothing shown for Fantasy or historical. Epic range will come back streamlined, AI display shown on the event.
New set of weathering powders available for sale.

Fantasy related rumours are dealt with in a separate thread: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/286560.page

Death Korps of Krieg
Rules Update will be included in the reprint of the 3 Vraks books in about 2 months and then put on the website as a pdf-file.

Elysians
Valkyrie Sky Talon, seated Elysians for Valkyrie plus 4 wheeled buggy that fits into a Valk.
Valks dedicated transports.
May be featured in a later IA book as well, with new units and maybe new poses/weapons

AdMech
On their to-do-list. Huge project and therefore takes its due time. They will do it from the ground up with new units, vehicles and several Imperial Knights (maybe 3). Maybe an explorer fleet investigating a Necron tomb world! If the designer is allowed to do it his way, this may become two books as well.

Tau
Got their three new variants of the XV9 suit. Commander's name is Shas'o R'alai. Yes, really
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85667&d=1269783988

Eldar
IA10 will feature Eldar vs. Imperium. Will feature a whole craftworld army on the attack. Will perhaps include Exodite upgrade kits.
Storyline something like this: "Eldar invade some hillbilly backwater, in force, the Imperium responds in increasing force, half the planet gets redued to a charred ruin, and then, 6 months later, all the Eldar suddenly leave, mission accomplished, leaving all the Imperial forces standing around going 'Huh? Where'd everybody go?'"

First and only model shown is the WIP Phantom Titan by Will Hayes, a mock-up with only basic details, 2-2.5 feet tall. They are still working on weapons and rules. Will be available this year, maybe at Games Day UK. Will occupy Hayes for the next half year. They are in contact with Jes on the project. Model will get several variants, including a Warlock Titan.
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85626&d=1269773987
(Jes Goodwin's original Epic concept sketches http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/5168/eldartitans.jpg )

Will Hayes very passionate about Eldar. Playing with ideas of Falcons with integrated guns (Cobra-like). There will be variants, but probably nothing requiring the customer to cut up the hull badly
No plans for "Type 3" variants. There will be characters and they consider a completely new Aspect. They also consider a tank size between Falcon and Cobra.
Keep in mind that concerning the Eldar book, nothing beside the Phantom is set in stone yet, as they are still shifting ideas and concepts.

BTW GW considered making a plastic Scorpion but dropped the idea for now because of problems with the huge single piece hull.

Orks
Featured in the next IA book IA8 shown in part on the event. At the printers and expected for a may release. Features Goff's Deathskulls and Evil Sunz. IA9 will either continue the Ork storyline with 2 other clans or be a Space Marine (only) book or maybe Eldar vs. Imperium. Still contradicting rumours.

Several upgrades for the Stompa, including a new head ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85654&d=1269783506 ), belly gun ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85656&d=1269783506 ) and Lifta-Droppa arm ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85652&d=1269783506 ). Upgrades available in sets and together with the stompa kit for 125 £ ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85663&d=1269783754 )

Lifta-Droppa also available as upgrade for the battlewagon ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85661&d=1269783754 ).

Big Copter for transporting commandos:
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b226/GrimStonefire/FW%20open%20day%202010/DSCF0023.jpg
Commandos with gas mask heads and new backpacks.

Grot tanks
Several modular Grot tanks including command tank with speakers. Rules in the new book.
One tank has a Tiger turret with a Rommel, one a Sherman turret with a Monty and the third one a Darlek turret (Dr. Who).
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85658&d=1269783616
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85659&d=1269783616

Ork Meka Dread ( http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b226/GrimStonefire/FW%20open%20day%202010/DSCF0031.jpg )

New Ork Gun sprues
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85671&d=1269784190
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85670&d=1269784190
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85669&d=1269784190
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85672&d=1269784190

Raven Guard
Also featured in the upcoming IA book
Upgrade kit in old style incl beaky helmets, heresy era backpacks and Sternguard style bolters:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85666&d=1269783844
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85665&d=1269783844
Character http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85664&d=1269783844
Venerable Dread ( http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b226/GrimStonefire/FW%20open%20day%202010/DSCF0013.jpg http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b226/GrimStonefire/FW%20open%20day%202010/DSCF0018.jpg ) plus the usual doors.
SM assault vehicle work will start tomorrow, from the start. 12 men capacity but not the Storm Raven. (earlier attempt http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b226/GrimStonefire/FW%20open%20day%202010/DSCF0029.jpg )

Here a photo gallery http://picasaweb.google.com/118116636349386235476/ForgeWorld2010#

Pictures can be found here:

Phantom Titan

Raven Guard Commander with Jump Pack

Raven Guard chapter upgrade pack

Ork copter transport loaded with kommandos

Ork weapons upgrades

Lifta droppa

Well the Phantom titan still looks undetailed to me

It does have the "work in progress" tag next to it.

Raven Guard

Nice upgrades. And a SM commander posed as they should be.

Makes me a very happy Raven.

Phantom Titan?

Never thought I'd see the day.

The lifta-droppa army looks so cool.

The phantom titan would be so awesome when done.

NAVARRO wrote:Well the Phantom titan still looks undetailed to me

Well yes, it certainly doesn't beat your epic greenstuff enhanced Phantom! Not yet anyway.

Well...I'm now officially fething sold on Raven Guard as an allied contingent for my Cadians.

I must have that Phantom Titan.

Breotan wrote:Pictures can be found here:

Phantom Titan

Raven Guard Commander with Jump Pack

Raven Guard chapter upgrade pack

Ork copter transport loaded with kommandos

Ork weapons upgrades

Lifta droppa

THANK YOU for these!

You have officially made my day, while at the same time making me quite a bit poorer too!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Updated pics here:

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4523574&postcount=53

Lots of Stompa goodness, including "Gaze" heads, Lifta-Dropa arm and belly gun!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
GROT TANKS!

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4523578&postcount=54


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And what I was waiting for:

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4523587&postcount=56

MORE Raven Guard stuff!

I love the old school feel.

They're so old school that even their Commander's jump pack has a studded section! (And on the correct side too!)

I'm glad I sold my Armorcast Phantom Titan, but kinda sad that it would finally have playable rules.

NAVARRO wrote:Well the Phantom titan still looks undetailed to me

Nicely done.

I'm a little disappointed that FW is starting to get cagey about upcoming stuff. I was really hoping to hear whether or not there's a Martian project in the works.

Yeah, I'm loving the "beakie" love that the RG Sternguard are getting.

That commander is just ace.

If I was richer and wasn't already planning to do BA than RG would be my marine army.

Though I'm already planning to save up for the new XV-9's. Those things are ace.

Better pic of the XV-9's than what's previously going around.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85667&d=1269783988

Anyone see an Epic Warhounds? I still need 3 of the damn things.

Also noted in the thread - there will be a Raven Guard symbols/etc. transfer sheet as well!

The good news just keeps on coming!

FW is really putting out some awesome stuff - this has been one hell of an Open Day...

Y'know, I think the only thing I'm disappointed at not seeing?

Forge World's take on Raven Guard Scouts.

Kanluwen wrote:Y'know, I think the only thing I'm disappointed at not seeing?

Forge World's take on Raven Guard Scouts.

Good call, though I think it was a slim chance at best that we'd see them.

Outside of commander types, they seem to stick to 'upgrade' stuff only for marine infantry.

Something with a less pronounced chin would have been nice though!

I'm surprised they're showing off anything, I thought GW was keeping everything a surprise now? lol

Or are these just the pics people managed to get before FW staff frantically took all the models away so they couldn't be photographed?

The Raven Guard commander looks cool, and I like that chinook-style copter the Orks are getting.

It's not even the chin that bothers me. The arms are beefier than should be, they're wearing no sleeves and their boots look far too large for their feet.

Then when I look at the artwork for the Scouts in the SM codex?

They'd be fantastic to make as 'real-scale' rather than the exaggerated scale. They're still human(for the most part) and the biggest changes haven't been done...yet. So something ala the Elysians? Would be amazing.

So in conclusion? Join me in whenever you are making an order for the "What would you like to see next?" by putting down "Space Marine Scouts produced to the measure of the Elysians--with complete squad weapon options. Sniper rifles, heavy bolters, etc".

TOGETHER WE CAN MAKE THIS A REALITY!

I'll give it a shot.

Though, I think SM Scouts *have* undergone quite a few changes, and would be noticeably bigger than 'normal' humans, so, I'll have to modify my request slightly!

Wow. FW is really going wild with wicked awesome stuff. And ALOT of it too

I don't know if anyone else had a look at the contents page for IA8, but I didn't seem to see the lander/drop-ship thing listed on there in the new units section.

The WIP/mock-up model that was seen at Games Day was there, though. Didn't get chance to ask the designer what was going on with it, though he had a folder with quite a cool set of concept sketches.

Hmm - has no-one else posted a pic of the Meka Dread, or is that already out there?

Mattlov wrote:Anyone see an Epic Warhounds? I still need 3 of the damn things.

was there any word on FW bringing back their Epic line? last i heard it was trashed. i remember the last exodus over at taccomms to get the last bit of epic models when they halted the line.

I'm liking the Raven Guard stuff a lot but I don't need another marine army. Looking like the Sternguard style bolters are part of the kit, judging from the exhaust vents they gave the regular marines the old school RT style backpacks which is a nice touch.

Phantom Titan while work in progress looks amazing... can't wait to see it finished and painted up.

Grot tanks are cool. Really liking those Tau suits, really make the boxy standard suits look bad.

Only thing that scares me about the Stompa add-ons will be the cost well that and keeping the arms from breaking.

Did anyone who went see/confirm any ideas on the IA8 Storm Eagle entry or Storm Raven kit?

chris13f wrote:Did anyone who went see/confirm any ideas on the IA8 Storm Eagle entry or Storm Raven kit?

I didn't see it listed on the IA8 contents page under new units, though the previously-seen mock-up was present.

Dysartes wrote:

chris13f wrote:Did anyone who went see/confirm any ideas on the IA8 Storm Eagle entry or Storm Raven kit?

I didn't see it listed on the IA8 contents page under new units, though the previously-seen mock-up was present.

However it's important to remember that IA8 is the first of this new "campaign" arc.

Very true, Kan, but it was previously listed as an entry that was due to show in IA8. It is possible that it had just been put back, of course.

Was mildly annoyed to find that they didn't have any Tauros Assault in at all, though.

I blame the Blood Angels for it being pushed back.

Well I had a grand day out at Warhammer World. Woke up early for the Grand Prix, then off to see the FW stuff. Very impressed by all the new models. Especially the Ork Kopter, especially with the Kommando-esque models on it. They look freaking awesome.

Having never seeing the Storm Raven mock-up before I took my opportunity to have a chat with the designer. Had a lovely chat about how he wanted to base it on the Thunderhawk, just smaller, but how this made it look un-proportional etc. Basically having great chats all round =D also I must say, that of all the concept art, the one they picked is possibly the best, but my favourite looked kind of like a Star Wars transport (as seen in Episode II) which I quite liked. But yeah, the 2 prong look is awesome. =]

Very glad that FW is a lot more open about what they do than general GW. Makes for a lot more excitement to be made about things.

Finally. A lifta-droppa for a Battlewagon anyone!? That's freaking awesome!!! =D

Oshova

Any details on the new Elysian stuff? I'm really hoping that they have some new D99 or similar Veteran unit rules.

Fateweaver wrote:Yeah, I'm loving the "beakie" love that the RG Sternguard are getting.

That commander is just ace.

If I was richer and wasn't already planning to do BA than RG would be my marine army.

Though I'm already planning to save up for the new XV-9's. Those things are ace.

Better pic of the XV-9's than what's previously going around.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=85667&d=1269783988

Shas O' R'alai... Really?

I just got back! Have to say it was well worth the drive, there were so many new releases on display, especialy for the Orks, which made Squil a very happy Warboss!

The queue for the sales stand was stupidly long and took the best part of 45 mins to get to the front (after 10 Mrs Squil buggered off to the bar!) but it was worth the wait as it was well stocked, appart from the new stompa upgrades, apparently there had been a "cock-up" as they were ready to go but hadn't been packed. The upgrade deal (not sure if it was on the day only or not) is/was a bargain at £125 as the stompa alone is £60 and to buy the upgrades seperately would have cost £88 so thats a saving of £23
FW must have taken a stupid amount of money on the day as I saw at least three people walk away with titans.

the stompa head is £28 as is the claw arm. The lifta dropper arm is £32. I know a lot of people have said they are underwhelmed by the upgrades but in the flesh they look the business, the claw is huge. It was just a bit of a shame that the belly gun plate wasn't ready to go on sale/pre-order

Other Orky goodies included weapon sprues, a Chinook style kopta complete with kommando upgrades (heads and backpacks), there were some mega dred upgrades and the cream on the cake were to grot tanks which were a stroke of genius

Sorry to say I wasn't paying too much attention to the other releases, however I did have a nose at the mock up of the Phantom titan, with the "wings" it looks considerably tallet than the Reaver, but head hieght is roughly the same so I would imagine the same will be true of the price.

One thing I did see which I haven't seen mentioned was an epic scale Minotaur.

All in all it was a decent day out which left my wallet considerably lighter than it was in the morning.

These two photos jumped out at me from Warseer's member "Grimstonefire"(who I get a sneaking suspicion posts here too )


Fully painted Ork "Warkopta" in Blood Axes colors. Refer to my avatar for commentary.


Again. Needs no commentary other than the avatar.

So can I have IA8 now? Because I want it. Now.

The grot tanks are great!

Why do I get the feeling the Imperium is in for another hammering in this IA?

Because we can't have them actually winning now can we Dysartes?

That warkopta looks flimsier than a DE Raider and an incredibly lazy design (engine... long plank... deffkopta cockpit... yup i'm done here)

It's Orkish.

What do you expect?

I spy autocannon Tarantulas. Ace.

And I do hope that the Elysians win this one, they've already lost two of their (soon to be) three IA books.

Nah Brook, those are the standard Lascannon Tarantulas.

They just photoshopped on a flare effect that blurs out the end of the muzzle that we usually see that screams LASCANNON LASCANNON LASCANNON

Kanluwen wrote:These two photos jumped out at me from Warseer's member "Grimstonefire"(who I get a sneaking suspicion posts here too )

Beat me to it!

Whilst I happened to be posting about this there was some talk about WHFB things, but for the moment I will need to see what someone else who went will post (as he heard the majority of the conversation).

My same post, copied and pasted

Some pics. I make no apologies if any of these pics are bad quality, most of them are good I think. If anyone is so inclined to load them up as attachments feel free.

Nothing completely new here, from the glimpse I did of the earlier pages in this thread or elsewhere.

Yes! I lured him out! Quick, someone get the nets!

Great photos though man. Seriously. Well done on getting those.

Did someone happen to notice the price on the Raven Guard Marine Upgrade kit?

And how many torsos are in it?

NAVARRO wrote:Well the Phantom titan still looks undetailed to me

I doubt it will ever be as detailed as yours Navarro

According to Warseer's RCGothic:

The Phantom Titan from the Photos is made from a polyurethane foam, and is Will Hayes Sketch model only. It is NOT a resin final, nor even a working model, and as such has no joint articulation nor any fine detail besides what is pencilled on.

Legs, hips, groin and knee joints from the actual model were displayed right next to the sketch up. The actual working model has some pretty amazing double-articulated knee joints, and the hips are looking pretty impressive as well. It was posed standing on one leg like the revenant, and from all signs the final model will be freakishly dynamic.

"The Phantom will definitely be available this year."
"For Games Day?"
"It's Possible."
- Tony Cotterell and myself.

Sources say it will be 2'-2.5' feet tall. I'm stoked that it looks like Jes' Epic concept art:



(Thanks to Warseer's Charax for posting the above pic. Been searching for it for months.)

Good Lordy....FW have definitely pulled their finger out on this one. @Squil, I'm with you on that one mate, I'm a happy bunny too with all that ork kopta-ness. Thanks guys on getting the pics uploaded. You've made my evening

Alpharius wrote:Did someone happen to notice the price on the Raven Guard Marine Upgrade kit?

And how many torsos are in it?

Making a wild, out of my arse guess on it based off the Red Scorpions kit:

16 GBP for enough upgrade parts to do 10 models and have some spares leftover.

OR
25 GBP for a complete(all the parts, including plastic sprues) 5 man squad.

If they make a Warlock version with cool retro (non-Revenant!) head...

I'll have to start saving now.

A couple more shots, a bit blurry though :(

I think someone else loaded up the Ravens upgrade set, though I'm not sure if you can see the back of the backpacks in their pics (too lazy to check). You can see it in the reflection here if you zoom in.

I like everything other than that ork waaaghkopta.

It's fairly dreadful, ork is ramshackle not flimsy. My bloodaxes will be getting a looted valk or stormraven instead.

lmao @ "No it's not the Storm Raven".

Also...his name is Shas'O Rly.

Dysartes wrote:Why do I get the feeling the Imperium is in for another hammering in this IA?

Kanluwen wrote:Because we can't have them actually winning now can we Dysartes?

Losing is more grimdark.

Big thumbs up for Forge World once again!!

Sidstyler wrote:Losing is more grimdark.

It may be more grimdark, but for a series of books titled Imperial Armour, it isn't half getting tiresome.

These are my photos from the today: HERE

I think there may be a couple of things in there not already posted, or at least higher-res versions of some existing stuff

I managed to pick up a Runtbot, but had to queue for an hour surrounded by exceedingly whiffy indivuals to buy it. The FW stand was rammed all day, they must have made quite a killing from it! Finally I have a Warboss stand in for my Mek-themed army.

For me the highlights were the new Ork models. The Warkopter and Kommandos especially! The Kommandos are conversion kits of heads with gasmasks and backpacks full of kit, looks like Micro Art Studios have some competition!

The Mekadred was also rather pretty, it'll be interesting to see what the rules are for it's various killy bits!

The Eldar titan was freaking huge, at least 6 inches taller than the Reaver, probably more. They had alternate leg pieces on display so you can pose it as though it were running.

Edit: Remembered more stuff

Warseer.com wrote:Phantom Titan

I'm looking at this model, and thinking it's a bit off. Head's not right, and the shoulderpads seem to lack presence.

Still a very nice model, at least as a base for additional work..

Does anyone know if the Kommando upgrades will be available for sale, seperate from the 'Kopta?

The impression I got was that they'll be available separately.

I don't know for sure, but I imagine they will be seperate. It seems that most troop upgrades (renegade militia and chaos marines) are stand alone packs. It is possible they may choose to combine them with the weapon sprues?

When I asked a few of the guys at the tables said that all of the new Ork stuff was in the process of being cast and to expect it up on theonline store in the next month to six weeks, possibly sooner if they pull their fingers out.

Morskul wrote:I managed to pick up a Runtbot, but had to queue for an hour surrounded by exceedingly whiffy indivuals to buy it. The FW stand was rammed all day, they must have made quite a killing from it! Finally I have a Warboss stand in for my Mek-themed army.

I'd blame a good chunk of your queuing time on FW only having 1 credit/debit card machine up and running - when, at times, there are five staff members waiting to put a transaction through, the speed with which you can clear a queue is going to drop.

Apparently they only have one portable card-reader - I'd invest some of today's profit in at least one more, if I were them

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Warseer.com wrote:Phantom Titan

I'm looking at this model, and thinking it's a bit off. Head's not right, and the shoulderpads seem to lack presence.

Still a very nice model, at least as a base for additional work..

There's two unfinished head options shown in that picture. More to come maybe? Seeing as the Phantom has a smaller head now, but is taller than the Armorcast Phantoms, I wonder if the old Armorcast heads might fit on it. Particularly the elusive Warlock head...

OH MAN. That stuff is cool. Love the Ork copter.

I found a post from the guy I (may have) mentioned before, probably means a lot to you 40k guys, but it didn't to me.

Had a good chat to several of the designers from Forge World today, with some interesting stuff for Pre-Heresy collectors:

- Raven Guard collectors will be very well catered for. The forthcoming Ravenguard conversion kits will feature lots of Mk VI armour, including chest plates, helmets and for the first time, heresy era backpacks.They also have some very cool Sternguard style bolters whihc will be worth saving up.

- A couple of the FW designers are keen on pre-heresy, and say we could well see some other heresy era marks of armour being incorperated into future space marine releases. There is no set plans for this but it is something they are keen to do

- There will be a new small scale space marine landing craft NOT THE STORM RAVEN! which will be aimed at the Raven Guard and possibly released alongside IA:IX

I did pick up some other pieces of information which I am not allowed to share with the interweb. Suffice to say the future looks bright for pre-heresy players

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.php?showtopic=196193

Kanluwen wrote:

Alpharius wrote:Did someone happen to notice the price on the Raven Guard Marine Upgrade kit?

And how many torsos are in it?

Making a wild, out of my arse guess on it based off the Red Scorpions kit:

16 GBP for enough upgrade parts to do 10 models and have some spares leftover.

OR
25 GBP for a complete(all the parts, including plastic sprues) 5 man squad.

Since I have a ton of MKVI plastic legs, I'm hoping for the 10 for 16 GBP.

Usually the 5 for 25 GBP is for Jump Pack equipped assault troops - right?

Ironically, as big a fan of the Raven Guard as I am, my favorite new thing has to be the Ork Kopter. Incredible. Makes me want to get a codex and see if I can build a kompletely kommando themed list.

Also, good to see the Storm Eagle isn't dead. I might end up using it as a Storm Raven, though, if GW hasn't released a plastic one first.

Commander Endova wrote:Ironically, as big a fan of the Raven Guard as I am, my favorite new thing has to be the Ork Kopter. Incredible. Makes me want to get a codex and see if I can build a kompletely kommando themed list.

Also, good to see the Storm Eagle isn't dead. I might end up using it as a Storm Raven, though, if GW hasn't released a plastic one first.

Which would really be a win/win for FW/GW and a massive loss for our bank balances, I'm afraid...

I said it once - and I'll say it again.

I want that Phantom Titan.. hope it's ready by GamesDay!

Elusive71 wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Warseer.com wrote:Phantom Titan

I'm looking at this model, and thinking it's a bit off. Head's not right, and the shoulderpads seem to lack presence.

Still a very nice model, at least as a base for additional work..

There's two unfinished head options shown in that picture. More to come maybe? Seeing as the Phantom has a smaller head now, but is taller than the Armorcast Phantoms, I wonder if the old Armorcast heads might fit on it. Particularly the elusive Warlock head...

The shoulder pad is droopy , it should have 2 head options like the revenant , it better do because the one it has now is ugly.
atm , its lacking in the majestic look which the other titans have.
Which is a disappointment because i was looking forward to this model so much that i actually left aside $ just for it.

It's official. My Ork army needs more aircraft. By Gork, this is so awesome!

LunaHound wrote:

Elusive71 wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Warseer.com wrote:Phantom Titan

I'm looking at this model, and thinking it's a bit off. Head's not right, and the shoulderpads seem to lack presence.

Still a very nice model, at least as a base for additional work..

There's two unfinished head options shown in that picture. More to come maybe? Seeing as the Phantom has a smaller head now, but is taller than the Armorcast Phantoms, I wonder if the old Armorcast heads might fit on it. Particularly the elusive Warlock head...

The shoulder pad is droopy , it should have 2 head options like the revenant , it better do because the one it has now is ugly.
atm , its lacking in the majestic look which the other titans have.
Which is a disappointment because i was looking forward to this model so much that i actually left aside $ just for it.

It's a WIP mock-up.

I hope so Brook , i really do.
Because usually even its a mock up , the general shape has already taken form minus the details.

But i really hope you are right because Phantom Titan is my first resin model i own, so i always missed it after i sold it T-T

LunaHound wrote:The shoulder pad is droopy , it should have 2 head options like the revenant , it better do because the one it has now is ugly.
atm , its lacking in the majestic look which the other titans have.
Which is a disappointment because i was looking forward to this model so much that i actually left aside $ just for it.

Luna, what do you think the thing down by it's foot is?

And I'm not sure how you can claim it isn't majestic - it is noticeably taller than a Reaver, and that's without factoring in the "wings". I'm not convinced by the close combat weapon, but that's just me.

I don't get the fuss over the ork kopta, it's poor looking, front is a deffkopta from AoBR with a grot turret glued on the nose (with no legs for the grot, just the round bit stuck on) then the rest of it looks like balsa wood. It oddly reminds me of the dark eldar raider with it's odd wing design. More I sit and look at it, less and less I like it. It feels lazy to me.

Grot tanks?!?Awesome!!

"It's not the Storm Raven" HA HA!

Meka Dread and Mega Dread. I wonder what the difference will be...

Dysartes wrote:

LunaHound wrote:The shoulder pad is droopy , it should have 2 head options like the revenant , it better do because the one it has now is ugly.
atm , its lacking in the majestic look which the other titans have.
Which is a disappointment because i was looking forward to this model so much that i actually left aside $ just for it.

Luna, what do you think the thing down by it's foot is?

And I'm not sure how you can claim it isn't majestic - it is noticeably taller than a Reaver, and that's without factoring in the "wings". I'm not convinced by the close combat weapon, but that's just me.

Well , how tall something is doesnt make it majestic , atleast not to me. Because for all i care it could be in epic size , but it could still look majestic.
But to get into it in detail , i guess , its missing a very solid "core" .
Because for a model that is supposed to be agile ( hence the thin limbs ) how the core looks from where the limbs grow out from , is very important.
And the shoulder pad and the thigh pads that are supposed to help to convey the power sure isnt helping , because its drooping lol

The thing by its foot is its 2nd head , the same eldar guardian variant as i call it that the revenant has as well.
But it been a phantom , i was hoping it would have different looking head then the revenant

LunaHound wrote:I hope so Brook , i really do.
Because usually even its a mock up , the general shape has already taken form minus the details.

But i really hope you are right because Phantom Titan is my first resin model i own, so i always missed it after i sold it T-T

Luna, it is a mock up. From page 2 of this thread:

Elusive71 wrote:According to Warseer's RCGothic:

The Phantom Titan from the Photos is made from a polyurethane foam, and is Will Hayes Sketch model only. It is NOT a resin final, nor even a working model, and as such has no joint articulation nor any fine detail besides what is pencilled on.

Legs, hips, groin and knee joints from the actual model were displayed right next to the sketch up. The actual working model has some pretty amazing double-articulated knee joints, and the hips are looking pretty impressive as well. It was posed standing on one leg like the revenant, and from all signs the final model will be freakishly dynamic.

And if you read my post (that you quoted), you'll note that I pointed out that there is a second head option in that picture. It's by its foot as mentioned by Dysartes.

@Elusive i know its a mock up , brookm said that as well.
Im just saying even if its a mock up the over all form /shape of a model is already decided.

And yes i saw the 2 heads , they look too similar to the revenant ones , which is disappointment.

Keep in mind too that the Reaver's shoulders, torso and legs underwent changes between Forge World's previewed prototype and the final kit, so this Phantom may not be final.

Elusive71 wrote:Keep in mind too that the Reaver's shoulders, torso and legs underwent changes between Forge World's previewed prototype and the final kit, so this Phantom may not be final.

Hmm... the drawing from page 2 you mean?

I know it might not be final! mister , thats why i kept saying "i really hope you are right"

lol because im dead serious about my love for the phantom titan.

I edited my first post to include a summary of all information gathered at Warseer and here.

IIRC, the drawing shown on page 2 was Jes Goodwin's sketches for Revenants/Phantoms for either Epic 40k or Epic: Armageddon: Stormwind, though I can't remember which.

The model I saw had a very strong resemblance to the Titan Legions era Phantom.

I do remember Will saying he'd tried shoulder-mounting a pulse laser, but took it out as, if you looked at the titan from the side, it seemed to be smoking a cigarette in an unusual-shaped holder.

Thanks Kroothawk

Kroothawk wrote:I edited my first post to include a summary of all information gathered at Warseer and here.

Super :3

Looking at that photo of the Phantom again, I'm thinking that the perceived droopiness and lack of majesty may be due to the angle of the photo. I like it, but not quite enough to buy one yet. That will probably change once I see more photos of it.

Kroothawk wrote:I edited my first post to include a summary of all information gathered at Warseer and here.

Why not just post all the pictures directly and save us even more time?

Also, everytime I see your Avatar I think it's a Predator.

Sweet! The storm eagle lives!!!!!!!!!!! Im so glad that al the people who said it was dead on my thread were wrong.

I'm digging the Ravenguard stuff, other then the RT backpacks. Do we know if those are part of the upgrade pack or not?

Anung Un Rama wrote:Why not just post all the pictures directly and save us even more time?

Because most pics are Warseer attachments that can't be copied directly. I would have to upload all into some gallery.
And it would have made the post unreadable.

Alpharius wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Alpharius wrote:Did someone happen to notice the price on the Raven Guard Marine Upgrade kit?

And how many torsos are in it?

Making a wild, out of my arse guess on it based off the Red Scorpions kit:

16 GBP for enough upgrade parts to do 10 models and have some spares leftover.

OR
25 GBP for a complete(all the parts, including plastic sprues) 5 man squad.

Since I have a ton of MKVI plastic legs, I'm hoping for the 10 for 16 GBP.

Usually the 5 for 25 GBP is for Jump Pack equipped assault troops - right?

Yep.

<< NERD BONER!!!!>>

Nurgleboy77 wrote:<< NERD BONER!!!!>>

excuse me while i shudder in the corner...


welcome to the club



so i guess im the only one here who is exited for the resin ork kommando`s here?

Hell NO! I love that big Kopta full of Kommandos!

Going through this bit by bit...

Psyched that they are updating the books. A little irked that getting it first will often mean getting it wrong. My Imperial Armour Apocalypse book is sad.

SUPER happy about the next book being Eldar/Imperium. I want some freaking Eldar!

New epic sounds great, honestly. I hope it does well.

Love the DKoK and Elysians, but I'm also glad that they are taking a break from them. FW can do amazing stuff, and they need to spread the love.

Ad-mech is a must for FW. They're perfect for it. If it can accompany new Necrons, better still. I would buy all three Imperial Knights. those are my favorite titan class.

Tau stuff looks wicked, Phantom looks like it has great potential. I really hope they do Exodites!

Those Orks are mad. the Copter is okay... not ace, but cool. I love the Kommandos though, and I want some. the Grot tanks are also money. How big are they? Anyone really know?

Ork gun sprues are cool too.

Ravenguard are not my cup of tea, but certainly neat models. A little underwhelmed by he Vets, but I'm sure they're more versatile than they appear in the pictures.

Lastly, did anyone see the new Space Wolf Transfers? I'm buying some, but only need the Great Wolf ones. Anyone want to split the cost on others?

It's not "the next book" that'll be Eldar/Imperium.

It's the "next book after they finish this storyline, which is supposed to be at least two books".

Oh Feth, I'm going to be in such trouble once the bill comes in after Games Day.

Im not sure how I feel about the overall design of the Phantom Titan... I find the armor style veering too much towards 'guy in the suit', especially around the torso. Also, the revenant style heads are also disapointing atm A because they are obviously not particularly original and B again, they have a man in the suit aesthetic. I quite miss the original style phantom heads, which were very Eldar like yet retained a giant machine/robotic feel.

Apart from the head and torso being a little too anthropomorphic, the rest doesnt look too bad to me, although I agree with Luna that the shoulderpads also don't quite fit.

IMO, Navarro did a better job on his Phantom Titan commision job, modding and updating an epicast titan from back in the day -
http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/8288/torsobackak6.jpg&imgrefurl=http://s11.invisionfree.com/Work_In_Progress/ar/t7957.htm&usg=__ZyrsAeFAt-y45Gy9HusU6JIhyG4=&h=1000&w=600&sz=139&hl=en&start=7&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=1XaqLzZlRDIMDM:&tbnh=149&tbnw=89&prev=/images%3Fq%3Deldar%2Bphantom%2Btitan%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3Dq5Q%26sa%3DX%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-USfficial%26tbs%3Disch:1

The "shoulderpads don't quite fit" because it's a polystyrene mock-up.

What part of polystyrene mockup's translates to 'we will definitely drastically change this therefore anyone who has an opinion is a jerk'?

My critique is obviously not of the final product, it is of the polystyrene mock-up. Besides, just because it is a mock-up doesn't mean it cannot look bad subjectively, even in concept stage, those design elements represent a route that could very well be continued right? In my professional experience with physical prototyping, at this stage of production you have already iterated many, many concept sketches, and you only start building physical mockups/cg when you have more or less cemented the direction. After all, sketching ideas takes a much smaller time/salary/material investment than modeling cg or scratch-building physical collateral.

It's just a few of us giving opinions for what was shown guys, no need to get defensive on Forgeworld's behalf or pre-empt our reactions because it's not final... if they didn't want people to have opinions logic follows they wouldn't show the model lol.

Your complaint is the "parts don't look right in their fit".

The fit won't be right because they're using polystyrene.

Do you see the dilemma or do you want to keep talking?

MajorTom11 wrote:What part of polystyrene mockup's translates to 'we will definitely drastically change this therefore anyone who has an opinion is a jerk'?

No idea

When I said don't quite fit I meant their design, not the quality of their installation. And again, just because it's a mockup doesn't automomatically mean it was put together badly or drastically mis-represents the designers intent lol.

Do you not see the dilemma of defending something from any and all negative impressions as if it was flawless based on the preposition that it is inherently and fundamentally flawed as a mockup? Do you think they put it on display because they think it looks like crap and has nothing to do with their intended design route? Come on man...

Kanluwen wrote:Your complaint is the "parts don't look right in their fit".

The fit won't be right because they're using polystyrene.

Do you see the dilemma or do you want to keep talking?

His meaning of "fit" has nothing to do with it physically "fitting"

Im 100% sure the "design doesnt fit" , is as in not suitable aesthetically.

Oops Ninja edited xD

Don't ya wish you weren't a polite Canadian sometimes Luna?

It's so odd what people get internet sensitive about... Truth is criticism is a massively important part of the design process, and any professional not only lives with it but invites it... I always find it odd when people take explained and subjectively based criticism as rude... it's not like we simply said 'It sucks and so do you' and left lol.

MajorTom11 wrote:Don't ya wish you weren't a polite Canadian sometimes Luna?

It's so odd what people get internet about... Truth is criticism is a massively important part of the design process, and any professional not only lives with it but invites it... I always find it odd when people take explained and subjectively based criticism as rude... it's not like we simply said 'It sucks and so do you' and left lol.

I understand what you mean , however

This forum is GW related , as in more people will openly allow praises to GW then opinions against what GW do.
Thus when an opinion arises , the minority will usually get hammered to the ground.

Without any consequences

MajorTom11 wrote:Don't ya wish you weren't a polite Canadian sometimes Luna?

It's so odd what people get internet sensitive about... Truth is criticism is a massively important part of the design process, and any professional not only lives with it but invites it... I always find it odd when people take explained and subjectively based criticism as rude... it's not like we simply said 'It sucks and so do you' and left lol.

Sorry, where did I get sensitive about anything?

Your complaint is a ridiculous one. You complain that the new Titan design is too "anthropomorphic". Compare the one in what you linked to the WIP shot.

The ONLY difference(outside of the work that Navarro did) is the heads.

Shame, I'm not hammered in the ground type

Besides, Kanluwen is welcome to debate the merits of mock-up etiquette and the merits of strategic development and design with me if he wants to, I've got a little experience in that kind of thing

Kanluwen wrote:Your complaint is the "parts don't look right in their fit".

The fit won't be right because they're using polystyrene.

Do you see the dilemma or do you want to keep talking?

I made a similar comment that the shoulderpads didn't work with the rest of the model. From a design standpoint, the shoulderpads are easily the weakest visual element of the model. The head is also quite poor, but should be much easier to fix.

MajorTom was talking about aesthetics and style, which has absolutely nothing to do with using polystyrene vs resin.

IMO, you ought to step off, because you're going at this all wrong...

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Your complaint is the "parts don't look right in their fit".

The fit won't be right because they're using polystyrene.

Do you see the dilemma or do you want to keep talking?

I made a similar comment that the shoulderpads didn't work with the rest of the model. From a design standpoint, the shoulderpads are easily the weakest visual element of the model. The head is also quite poor, but should be much easier to fix.

MajorTom was talking about aesthetics and style, which has absolutely nothing to do with using polystyrene vs resin.

IMO, you ought to step off, because you're going at this all wrong...

What exactly, do you see as making them weak John?

What would you do to change them or make them more in line with the rest of the model?

They're shoulderpads. There's not much that really can be done with them.

Plus, it's entirely likely that the same sculptor is planning on doing a detailing set for that space and the torso to make it more intricate.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

MajorTom11 wrote:Shame, I'm not hammered in the ground type

Besides, Kanluwen is welcome to debate the merits of mock-up etiquette and the merits of strategic development and design with me if he wants to, I've got a little experience in that kind of thing

By the by:

Feel free to actually make criticisms that make sense. Seriously. But don't resort to the "Well, I don't like suchandsuchpart of the model--and if you do like it, you're obviously eSensitive and a company lapdog!" garbage.

Well Tom , and John , im going to list you what i think would make it look better ,
and you tell me if you agree or not.

I wont get into the technical details to why i point them out just yet.

1) The shoulder pad is abit too big

2) The shoulder pad is indeed droopy

3) The pelvic is too wide , the legs are too wide apart

4) The D cannon ( right arm ) is too long

Damn it stop arguing and reply to ^ already -_-

Kanluwen wrote:

MajorTom11 wrote:Don't ya wish you weren't a polite Canadian sometimes Luna?

It's so odd what people get internet sensitive about... Truth is criticism is a massively important part of the design process, and any professional not only lives with it but invites it... I always find it odd when people take explained and subjectively based criticism as rude... it's not like we simply said 'It sucks and so do you' and left lol.

Sorry, where did I get sensitive about anything?

Your complaint is a ridiculous one. You complain that the new Titan design is too "anthropomorphic". Compare the one in what you linked to the WIP shot.

The ONLY difference(outside of the work that Navarro did) is the heads.

Your arguements are literally pointless Kan, the new one has pecs and ribs/ab like areas, the other one has lobstered plate. The shoulders on one are indented quarter spheres, the other has multicurved, scooped and fluted pads. And that's just the torso. Nevermind the arms, hips, back vanes, legs, feet and general proportions.

Where did you get sensitive? You defend it like you built it like it's a picture of your kids, and better yet, you defend where no defense is needed. If I don't like those elements much I don't like them, and frankly it's none of your damn business to inform me whether or not I am allowed to have that opinion. Especially since your 'rebutals' are factually incorrect, overly aggressive and in my humble opinion, childish. But by all means, keep typing and hijack this thread from people looking to have open discussions. I won't be addressing you directly again, I will do something more productive like argue politics with a squirrel or paint my toes goblin green.

Commander Endova wrote:...my favorite new thing has to be the Ork Kopter. Incredible.

I saw a pic of it without the kommands and was struck how it connected visually with the Dark Eldar raider. :/

LunaHound wrote:Well Tom , and John , im going to list you what i think would make it look better ,
and you tell me if you agree or not.

I wont get into the technical details to why i point them out just yet.

1) The shoulder pad is abit too big

2) The shoulder pad is indeed droopy

3) The pelvic is too wide , the legs are too wide apart

4) The D cannon ( right arm ) is too long

Damn it stop arguing and reply to ^ already -_-

lol, yes back OT

1/2) I'm not sure its the size of them so much as the flow and design of them. The diagonally downwards direction of the pads doesn't sit too well with me, but they are not hideous or anything, I just prefer the spherical pad style of the previous generation. Frankly they also don't fit with the current Wraithlord or Revenant style pads either, it sticks out to me. I prefer more geometric shapes for the Eldar. Usually they go for connical, spherical of cylindrical shapes for eldar, so this sillouette is out of the ordinary.

3) I don't think the pelvis is too wide, I think it looks off because the torso is too short and the anthropomorphized musculature'ish armor give the impression of wearing his belt under the ribs. Does that make sense?

4) Not bothered with that one, I dont mind the lance like look, and there may be more bits added to it to bulk it out a bit and make it look necessarily long.

on to better news, those grot tanks and stompa kits are awesome lol! Did anyone manage to snag one of those runtbots???

MajorTom11 wrote:
lol, yes back OT

1/2) I'm not sure its the size of them so much as the flow and design of them. The diagonally downwards direction of the pads doesn't sit too well with me, but they are not hideous or anything, I just prefer the spherical pad style of the previous generation. Frankly they also don't fit with the current Wraithlord or Revenant style pads either, it sticks out to me. I prefer more geometric shapes for the Eldar. Usually they go for connical, spherical of cylindrical shapes for eldar, so this sillouette is out of the ordinary.

3) I don't think the pelvis is too wide, I think it looks off because the torso is too short and the anthropomorphized musculature'ish armor give the impression of wearing his belt under the ribs. Does that make sense?

4) Not bothered with that one, I dont mind the lance like look, and there may be more bits added to it to bulk it out a bit and make it look necessarily long.

on to better news, those grot tanks and stompa kits are awesome lol! Did anyone manage to snag one of those runtbots???

Ok , now take everything that just doesnt look right. Dont compare the ratio of the parts because it'll make it hard to see.
Look at the chest piece , look at the abdominal piece , and look at the 2 missile launchers ( the 2 strips between chest and shoulder pad )

The whole thing that made it look weird but cant put a finger on it? is how wide the chest piece is.
It been wide pushed the missile launchers too far out , which in turn pushed the shoulder pads out.
Which the shoulder pad is indeed in ratio to the chest , but not the whole body. The sculptor knew that , so tried to fix it
by pushing the shoulder pad downwards , to "meld" it together if you will.

Then the wide ab armor contributed to the extra wide pelvic and legs , which is around 15% too wide.

Long story short , they tried to buff the Phantom so it wont look as fragile as Revenant , and failed.

Could be you are right, he does look a little buff for an Eldar machine... After all, they rely on speed and holofields not bulk and power as far as I remember. I find the revenant conveyed a good sense of speed and stealth while still keeping that old school long and lean eldar titan look. Graceful but not gangly...

I think the best thing to do is agree the silhouette of the mock-up is marginally 'off' design wise to us...

Kanluwen wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:I made a similar comment that the shoulderpads didn't work with the rest of the model. From a design standpoint, the shoulderpads are easily the weakest visual element of the model.

What exactly, do you see as making them weak John?

What would you do to change them or make them more in line with the rest of the model?

They're shoulderpads. There's not much that really can be done with them.

Plus, it's entirely likely that the same sculptor is planning on doing a detailing set for that space and the torso to make it more intricate.

Feel free to actually make criticisms that make sense. Seriously.

But don't resort to the "Well, I don't like suchandsuchpart of the model--and if you do like it, you're obviously eSensitive and a company lapdog!" garbage.

To be honest, I have the feeling that this is going to be like discussing single-malt Scotch with someone who's only ever drank cheap beer, or fine dining with someone whose idea of a great meal is McDonalds.

Anyhoo, when I say "weak", I don't mean physically or structurally weak - I mean aesthetically, stylistically. As I see it the problem with the shoulderpads is that they simply don't match the rest of the model.

Most of the model has a strong upward sweep, which is formed by the wide hip-narrow chest-pointed head triangle. This is further accentuated very strongly by the very light and dynamic wing vanes going up and out of the models' back. Not to mention the legs tapering upward from the thick shins to the narrow thighs. Pretty much any pose is going to sweep the eye from the fairly heavy ankle, up through the knee (with a further upward point on the kneeguard and secondary upward point on the knee vane), into the hip tapering into the chest, up to the top of the head.

Now the shoulderpads simply don't fit. They droop downward from the top of the shoulder forward, and backward, and along the shoulderline. The tiny upward tips end below the shoulder tops, so net out with a downward shrug. Further, the "arch" in the design reinforces this downward motion by drives the eye up off the body and then downward to the lower points on the outer edges of the shoulder. Furthermore, with most of the model being relatively "light" due to having proportions of roughly 3:1 or slimmer, the shoulderpads being more like 1:1 or 1.5:1, and solid elements means they don't match the perceived "weight", either. Basically, the designer here is replicating the mistakes that Privateer made with their Scyrah elves.

I'd suggest a multi-floating design similar to the hip & knee armor (but with more pronounced upward vane elements). Tho if the current basic design must be adhered to, then something as simple as using a longer, slimmer design that inverse mirrors the existing sweep to go up following the arcs of the rear wing vanes, with the tips rising to the height of the forehead.

Being what is fundamentally a decorative item, the shoulderpads could be fixed in any number of ways. The notion that somehow the current design is the only one, without room for improvement is pretty ridiculous. I bet if we were to get a half-dozen sculptors to take a crack at it, each of them could come up with a different, yet effective alternative that is more true to rest of the model.

Any detailing would be polishing a turd. The fundamental problem isn't with the surfacing - even a plainly undetailed part, properly sculpted and proportioned, would look better.

You do realise that you've just create a pot-kettle situation by making that remark, right?

Given the emotional investment that you're projecting, I have to agree with Tom that you're awfully sensitive here, and I can't fathom why that is the case.

____

LunaHound wrote:Well Tom , and John , im going to list you what i think would make it look better ,
and you tell me if you agree or not.

1) Agree that the shoulder pad is abit too big ("heavy", as I put it).

2) Completely agree that the shoulder pad is indeed "droopy" (downward sweeping, as I put it).

3) Do NOT agree that the pelvic is too wide, nor that the legs are too wide apart - it's OK for the pelvis to be a bit wide, as Eldar models are somewhat "feminine" in design, and the wider hips / legs carry that through.

4) Completely disagree that the D cannon ( right arm ) is too long - Eldar weapons can be very delicate, and I have no criticism here.
____

LunaHound wrote:Long story short , they tried to buff the Phantom so it wont look as fragile as Revenant , and failed.

The reason they failed is because this is fundamentally a female model, and adding buff shoulderpads that point downward simply doesn't work. It's failing Fashion design 101. You can have horizontal or upward shoulderpads on a woman, and it looks fine, but going for a broad linebacker shoulder on an otherwise female form is horrific.

MajorTom11 wrote:Did anyone manage to snag one of those runtbots???

I picked up one for a friend yesterday, and am getting one for me sent out with one of the never-even-in-stock Tauros Assault's.

If you want sprue pics, I'll take 'em when mine turns up, as I don't have time this morning.

Huh, did they have any of the pre-orders up for sale besides the Runtbot?

I do hope that they put the Tauros Assault up for sale soon.

Whats a runtbot?

LunaHound wrote:Whats a runtbot?

Luna I do believe this:

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/runt.htm

...is a Runtbot.

I'm really digging the Raven guard stuff, might have to start saving.

Kroothawk wrote:
Death Korps of Krieg
Rules Update will be included in the reprint of the 3 Vraks books in about 2 months and then put on the website as a pdf-file.

Hm. A reprint of the Vraks books? Had considered buying them come april as a birthday gift, but if they are gonna receive an update in a few months I would rather wait. Anyone know the extent of this update and should I wait?

Woo thats like a super rivet bot so many rivets o_o

Gorlack wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:
Death Korps of Krieg
Rules Update will be included in the reprint of the 3 Vraks books in about 2 months and then put on the website as a pdf-file.

Hm. A reprint of the Vraks books? Had considered buying them come april as a birthday gift, but if they are gonna receive an update in a few months I would rather wait. Anyone know the extent of this update and should I wait?

My guess is that it's just the armylists they are putting online, not the rest.

@Kanluwen: Edited the first post so that Eldar storyline begins with IA10. And I have heard another version that IA 9 will be "a Space Marine book" ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4524990&postcount=166 ). This sounds like not continuing the Ork storyline. What have you heard?

Gorlack wrote:Anyone know the extent of this update and should I wait?

My guess (!) is that it just replaces the old DKoK rules/list chapter with an updated one and keeps everything else including typing errors

Hm. The Phantom is large and all, but really, the basic Armorcast model still cannot really be improved upon (not even by Navarro slapping 500 greenstuff nicknacks and ornaments on it).

Agamemnon2 wrote:Hm. The Phantom is large and all, but really, the basic Armorcast model still cannot really be improved upon (not even by Navarro slapping 500 greenstuff nicknacks and ornaments on it).

I have to back that up. As neat as that was, and impressively skilled, it didn't really make the model more modern. they should just reproduce the Armorcast figure, but with more articulation.

Ok, having read exactly what my friend was told, and having reviewed what I was told, there was some significant news for WHFB stuff at the open day.

To try and put into context, it's fairly big news, even considering we've had no news on this. I think I will actually make a new thread for it, and leave this one to the tread heads.

I've asked him to post what he heard on warseer, then I will copy it over here. I need to decide how much to post from what I heard, as some of it I don't think I should have been told and I don't want to get people in trouble.

On 40k news, I read over on warseer that the guys are planning to do more stand alone IA books in the future (no doubt because they want to bring out 3 a year, I think that's what I read). So theoretically the next book could just be stand alone eldar.

Agamemnon2 wrote:Hm. The Phantom is large and all, but really, the basic Armorcast model still cannot really be improved upon (not even by Navarro slapping 500 greenstuff nicknacks and ornaments on it).

The classic design is indeed the best.

Navarro also did some difficult repositioning of the legs which added dynamism to the model. Your description of his work is not reflective, it was, frankly put, a masterpiece and one of the bravest undertakings in greenstuffing I've ever seen.

How would you use the Runt bot in games of 40k?? Or is it more of a showpiece?

No doubt some wretch has put one on ebay already........'RARE OOP, RUNT BOT,FORGEWORLD,BUY IT NOW £300'......

Grimstonefire wrote:Ok, having read exactly what my friend was told, and having reviewed what I was told, there was some significant news for WHFB stuff at the open day.

To try and put into context, it's fairly big news, even considering we've had no news on this. I think I will actually make a new thread for it, and leave this one to the tread heads.

I've asked him to post what he heard on warseer, then I will copy it over here. I need to decide how much to post from what I heard, as some of it I don't think I should have been told and I don't want to get people in trouble.

I suppose that depends on where you were when you heard it?

Out in the open, on Open Day?

Probably OK.

Still, your better judgment is the best way to go.

BUT, I am certainly interested!

re the Phantom -
I remember when we all saw Big Bird as a wip and all thinking that the only thing unfinished were the crappy wings.
How wrong were we??

Love the idea of the grot tanks and the Raven Guard is looking quite sext too.

Kroothawk wrote:@Kanluwen: Edited the first post so that Eldar storyline begins with IA10. And I have heard another version that IA 9 will be "a Space Marine book" ( http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4524990&postcount=166 ). This sounds like not continuing the Ork storyline. What have you heard?

Gorlack wrote:Anyone know the extent of this update and should I wait?

My guess (!) is that it just replaces the old DKoK rules/list chapter with an updated one and keeps everything else including typing errors

Everything I've heard about IA9 suggests that it continues this storyline, just with a larger emphasis on Raven Guard rather than Elysians.

Bash the Bosh wrote:How would you use the Runt bot in games of 40k?? Or is it more of a showpiece?

Mine is going to stand in for a Warboss

Wait, so IA10 is Eldar? I thought IA9 was going to be Imperial vs Orks w/Eldar showing up.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Wait, so IA10 is Eldar? I thought IA9 was going to be Imperial vs Orks w/Eldar showing up.

That was a theory that's been floating around.
It's possible, but I don't think they'll do it because they like to keep IAs as "Imperium v. 1 Enemy".

Don't you mean "Imperial losing v. 1 Enemy".

MeanGreenStompa wrote:I don't get the fuss over the ork kopta, it's poor looking, front is a deffkopta from AoBR with a grot turret glued on the nose (with no legs for the grot, just the round bit stuck on) then the rest of it looks like balsa wood. It oddly reminds me of the dark eldar raider with it's odd wing design. More I sit and look at it, less and less I like it. It feels lazy to me.

I was there myself and saw the kopter from all angles, it was easily my most anticpated new thing to see and yeah I was fairly let down by it. The idea is very cool but the model doesn't live up to it. it is imo just too flimsy looking. Yes Orks build their stuff out of scrap, that's awesome, that's why I collect Orks but they build their stuff solidily. The kopter doesn't look at all solid, it looks as though just the chain linking the two rotors could rip the thing apart if a boy got caught up in it.

It's hard to say why I think it looks wrong but I think you can sum it up by saying that it's just a flying platform, I like the idea and I'll probably use it but I'll be building my own I suspect.

Fortunately everything else was awesome, the grot tanks are great looking models, rammed full of character as just about anything grotty from forgeworld is and the mekadread is superbly detailed, almost made the mega dred standing next to it look plain!

Ork weapon sprues were great, more variety and lots of different bits, included a twin linked big shoota quite clearly intended for the plastic deffkopta.

Had a flick through some pages from the new book, loads of new stuff there and more to come I suspect, no rules present for the warkopta or the grot tanks sadly but there was some nice line drawings for new buggies, very mad max looking, big all over roll bars like that one from the last next gen star trek movie. Artwork for the ork big bomma plane available for epic, no idea if it's coming for 40k or not, forgot to ask.

This book only covers goff's deathskulls and evil sunz so there'll defintely be a second book for ork players to look forward to. The warboss on bike model was seen in some artwork, labelled as an evil sunz biker boss. That's all I can really remember, it was a hell of a lot to take in and we were talking with Alan Bligh at the same time.

Tau suits were absolute sex, I'll be collecting tau at some point in the future so I look forward to seeing more of these.

The new eldar titan was huge and really impressive looking, eldar players are in for a treat.

I came away with a runtbot, grot krew set and the aforementioned warboss on bike so was very happy. A great event all round, we were both glad we made the effort to get up and go.

With all the mentions of the Imperium always losing in IA, I feel I should point out that technically speaking, they did win IA8.

The Dreadnote wrote:With all the mentions of the Imperium always losing in IA, I feel I should point out that technically speaking, they did win IA8.

A pyrrhic victory at that. Bitter sweet.

@Morskul. I like that idea. Uber hard boss

@Gargskull and Meangreenstompa. I have to agree with you both. I love the idea, but the model just dosen't flick my switch. I may have to go with a bastardised 1:35 scale Chinook. That should be a laugh building that monstrousity

Scottywan82 wrote:

Agamemnon2 wrote:Hm. The Phantom is large and all, but really, the basic Armorcast model still cannot really be improved upon (not even by Navarro slapping 500 greenstuff nicknacks and ornaments on it).

I have to back that up. As neat as that was, and impressively skilled, it didn't really make the model more modern. they should just reproduce the Armorcast figure, but with more articulation.

In the interests of pedantry (and for anyone who doesn't know), the Phantom's not original to Armorcast, it's a scaled up, but otherwise identical version of Jes Goodwin's original metal Adeptus Titanicus Phantoms from the late '80s.

That said, I agree that they don't need to update it.

They need to update it , atleast so it doesnt look like the armorcast version. If they dont , it'll be pretty hard to convince customers to pay FW price for something that has been done and around for decades.

Just so every Dakkite knows I'm uploading more pics here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/images-11360-7339_Open%20Day.html

Thanks Bloodthirster! Especially for the the shot of the Phantom's leg articulation that we'd heard about. Can you imagine one of those things in a full on gallop? Yikes!

yeah,
Grot Tanks FTW! I'll have a full set please.

The eldar phantom looks great, I think the shoulderpads are fine, any more up turned and/or pointy and they'd start to go dark.

Panic...

No prop Elusive, happy to provide!

Edit: Some info from the event;

In IA9, Part two of the campaign, the Eldar are discovered by the Imperium acting like they did in DOW2. ie; Herding the Orks to this world.

I asked about Mechanicum Knights, one of the designers looked uneasy when I asked, while an other talked as he was hiding something.

The Tauros AV costs 60pts and comes with the GL as standard.

The others clans are unlikely to be covered in the next book, but rather in a future one.

Here's some info on Buzzgobs role in the campaign;










Painboy can now be taken as HQ choices, their called Pain Boss's.

As for other news I was a bit miffed, the winning raffle ticket for the Reaver was No;42, one of my tickets was 24. Otherall though a great weekend Pics to follow soon. Cheers, BT

Oh and before I post this, in the participation games I took out two Warhounds One in each game, with my Stompa's. I was also about two kill a Reaver Titan just when all the Imperial players cleared off!

Bloodthirster wrote:
Painboy can now be taken as HQ choices, their called Pain Boss's.

Not big Pain's?

Bloodthirster wrote:
Painboy can now be taken as HQ choices, their called Pain Boss's.

Yeah! I was waiting for that.

I want that Phantom!

LunaHound wrote:They need to update it , atleast so it doesnt look like the armorcast version. If they dont , it'll be pretty hard to convince customers to pay FW price for something that has been done and around for decades.

It won't be that hard. The Armorcast one is relatively difficult to get a hold of, tends to go for silly money as a result, and there's a whole generation of gamers who don't even know it exists.

Gargskull wrote:
This book only covers goff's deathskulls and evil sunz so there'll defintely be a second book for ork players to look forward to.

Bloodthirster wrote:
The others clans are unlikely to be covered in the next book, but rather in a future one.

...the feth... Why? Where the hell are the clan specific conversion kits for Nobs and Boyz? The Specific Clan Warbosses? Dun't fergit bout us blud-axez or yer gunna land yerselfz wif a choppa to yer noggin an a tank-ammer to yer crown jewelz...

Bash the Bosh wrote:
@Gargskull and Meangreenstompa. I have to agree with you both. I love the idea, but the model just dosen't flick my switch. I may have to go with a bastardised 1:35 scale Chinook. That should be a laugh building that monstrousity

I'd personally prefer using a Russian hind as the starter, drippin in dakka! (trumpeter do one at 1:35 scale)

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Bash the Bosh wrote:@Gargskull and Meangreenstompa. I have to agree with you both. I love the idea, but the model just dosen't flick my switch. I may have to go with a bastardised 1:35 scale Chinook. That should be a laugh building that monstrousity

I'd personally prefer using a Russian hind as the starter, drippin in dakka! (trumpeter do one at 1:35 scale)

Two words: looted Valkyrie!

Anung Un Rama wrote:

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Bash the Bosh wrote:@Gargskull and Meangreenstompa. I have to agree with you both. I love the idea, but the model just dosen't flick my switch. I may have to go with a bastardised 1:35 scale Chinook. That should be a laugh building that monstrousity

I'd personally prefer using a Russian hind as the starter, drippin in dakka! (trumpeter do one at 1:35 scale)

Two words: looted Valkyrie!

I'm waiting till the storm raven comes out, then I'm taking the buzz saw to it... mwahahahahahahaha!!!

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Anung Un Rama wrote:

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Bash the Bosh wrote:@Gargskull and Meangreenstompa. I have to agree with you both. I love the idea, but the model just dosen't flick my switch. I may have to go with a bastardised 1:35 scale Chinook. That should be a laugh building that monstrousity

I'd personally prefer using a Russian hind as the starter, drippin in dakka! (trumpeter do one at 1:35 scale)

Two words: looted Valkyrie!

I'm waiting till the storm raven comes out, then I'm taking the buzz saw to it... mwahahahahahahaha!!!

I just love the idea of a flyer transporting a heavy walker.
Three words: Dreadnought with Parachute.

I'm pretty sure that Trumpeter's 1/35 Hind is out of production.
Or at least I can't scare up any reference to it in Squadron's catalogs, at least any catalog I have that's newer than 2005.

On Warseer there are some rumours that the IA book on Eldar takes place on an Ice planet, with Space Wolves (incl. Thunderwolves) as the opponent. Wishlisters want to have new Valhallans, too.

Gargskull wrote:
The others clans are unlikely to be covered in the next book, but rather in a future one.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:...the feth... Why? Where the hell are the clan specific conversion kits for Nobs and Boyz? The Specific Clan Warbosses? Dun't fergit bout us blud-axez or yer gunna land yerselfz wif a choppa to yer noggin an a tank-ammer to yer crown jewelz...

The loose leaf example book had a double page spread with an evil sunz biker boss with art depicting their already released boss on bike model so I'm sure they'll be plenty of clan specific stuff. to come.

As the next Ork IA book (in however many years that will be) will have bad moons I'm already looking forward to it, hoping for flash gitz and meganobz models from FW.

Anyone know of the release date on the Raven Guard troop upgrades and the character model?

The doors and dread are already available.

Probably "soon".

Kanluwen wrote:Probably "soon".

Thanks! That helps a ton!

Forge World doesn't exactly make their release schedules common knowledge. Best bet is to call them and ask, or just wait.

Point of interest, got chatting with Warwick, asked about mutant Ravenguard, he said he had asked if he could include them, but the ip guys said no, so no mutant Ravenguard failed experiments into cloning! Damn shame!

Shame indeed. Now what will the cool thing be that Raven Guard have which other Marine chapters don't? It won't be Jump Marines as troops.

Jump marines with wings! No... wait...

http://www.scalehobbyist.com/catagories/Model_Aircraft/TRP00005103/product.php?micr=363

@Grimstonefire:
You see my problem... -_-

@skkipper: I doubt it. Not with the Stormraven and the new Forgeworld transport on the way.

Anung Un Rama wrote:Shame indeed. Now what will the cool thing be that Raven Guard have which other Marine chapters don't? It won't be Jump Marines as troops.

I think the cool stuff that the RG will get will mostly revolve around Landspeeder and Scouts. With the use of precision stikes, RG rely most heavily on Scouts, as such I would imagine RG could have some uniquely veteran scouts. Imagine a veteran scout squad with some sternguard ammo choices, or multiple Telions, or auxiliary grenade launchers, or something in that vein. Not the biggest deal but its something.

According to the early index of IA8, some number of Landspeeder variants are planned, so thats a straight forward addition. What options and weapons they have is widely open to speculation. With heavy flamer, heavy bolter, assault cannon, multi-meltas, and better missile launchers all covered as standards, what could RG recieve to distinguish their's. Wide spread proliferation of plasma cannons on landspeeders might be fun; or some bigger more specialized missiles. Mayb they could get a more practical variant of the Landspeeder storm that can be taken as a dedicated transport choice or in squadrons.

The Storm Eagle, if and when it gets done for RG, will be something unique so it will be worth the wait. But are those 3 basic things enough to distinguish them?
I don't think so. It amounts to less distinction than the add-on BA and DA codices of 3rd Ed. They might not need much more, but anything on the same level as 3rd edition effort isn't worthwhile.

I wanted mutant RG too. :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grimstonefire wrote:Jump marines with wings! No... wait...

There is a certain painful irony, that the BA codex reinvented them too well. It did so well that it represents certain flavors of Space Marines better than Codex: SM. Blood Angels, can represent the jump pack troop formations of the RG or the massed dreadnought forces of the Iron Hands.

Bear in mind that I'm not a 40k follower, but I always thought the RG were supposed to be masters of guerilla warfare (or unconventional war). Not just hit and run, or just hit (which is the BA approach).

This would mean they would need to figure out how to deploy all the machines of war they need in a very quiet and sneaky way. Drop pods isn't going to be quiet...

Really they just need the whole army to scout (using the warhammer term for it).

Grimstonefire wrote:Bear in mind that I'm not a 40k follower, but I always thought the RG were supposed to be masters of guerilla warfare (or unconventional war). Not just hit and run, or just hit (which is the BA approach).

This would mean they would need to figure out how to deploy all the machines of war they need in a very quiet and sneaky way. Drop pods isn't going to be quiet...

Yes and no. Guerilla warfare and hit and run are a big part of their tactics, but so are precision strikes by Terminators and armour guided in by Scouts.

Phew (got some of it right). That is ideally where FW should focus then, maybe giving them land speeders with really 'eavy weapons?

Or mortar teams for scouts? Give the scouts a much bigger role in the list. Laser targeters as well.

Why mortar teams for Scouts? Veteran Scout teams, maybe with an ability to have Terminators "lock on" to them far more accurately than normal? Sure, could see it. Veteran Scout teams with a markerlight equivalent? Again, could see it.
But they're still a Codex Chapter, for the most part, with the exception of the amount of independence they give their Captains in deploying their forces...which doesn't really translate to the tabletop well, I'd think.

Also : it's really important to remember that the "mutants" that the Raven Guard had were purged by the Raven Guard themselves after they were used and found unstable.

Kanluwen wrote:Why mortar teams for Scouts? Veteran Scout teams, maybe with an ability to have Terminators "lock on" to them far more accurately than normal? Sure, could see it. Veteran Scout teams with a markerlight equivalent? Again, could see it.
But they're still a Codex Chapter, for the most part, with the exception of the amount of independence they give their Captains in deploying their forces...which doesn't really translate to the tabletop well, I'd think.

I don't think mortars are quite right for a space marine force of any flavor. With the current Codex SM scouts are 75% support role, 25% line troop. In a more guerrilla force there would be a higher emphasis on their ability to act in the troop role.

As far as a captain's independence to deploying troops, that'd be represented by a special rule allowing "any one unit may redeploy". Or something in that vein.

Kanluwen wrote:Also : it's really important to remember that the "mutants" that the Raven Guard had were purged by the Raven Guard themselves after they were used and found unstable.

Thats just what they tell the Inquisition.

Fluff is flexible and could be rewritten to accomodate. For example, just imagine if similar to the degeneration of the Blood Angels, the Raven Guard see one in a couple hundred neophytes degenerate into a monster when they get their marine organs.

Weren't the mutants the result of cloning attempts, and nothing to do with the implantation itself?

I absolutely love the Raven Guard commander! I might have to pick him up just to paint him .

Kanluwen wrote:Weren't the mutants the result of cloning attempts, and nothing to do with the implantation itself?

All that the fluff says is they were the unintended consequence of Corax utilizing cloning technology to replenish the Raven Guards ranks. Was Corax cloning entire marines or just organs? Nothing says. The fluff states there was a written account of Raven Guard herding these beasts toward an Iron Warrior fortification, with no statement of when it occured, so it could very well have occured after Corax's supposed "disposal" of them.

Yeah, we'll probably see that being cleaned up in IA8.

aka_mythos wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Why mortar teams for Scouts? Veteran Scout teams, maybe with an ability to have Terminators "lock on" to them far more accurately than normal? Sure, could see it. Veteran Scout teams with a markerlight equivalent? Again, could see it.
But they're still a Codex Chapter, for the most part, with the exception of the amount of independence they give their Captains in deploying their forces...which doesn't really translate to the tabletop well, I'd think.

I don't think mortars are quite right for a space marine force of any flavor. With the current Codex SM scouts are 75% support role, 25% line troop. In a more guerrilla force there would be a higher emphasis on their ability to act in the troop role.

As far as a captain's independence to deploying troops, that'd be represented by a special rule allowing "any one unit may redeploy". Or something in that vein.

Kanluwen wrote:Also : it's really important to remember that the "mutants" that the Raven Guard had were purged by the Raven Guard themselves after they were used and found unstable.

Thats just what they tell the Inquisition.

Fluff is flexible and could be rewritten to accomodate. For example, just imagine if similar to the degeneration of the Blood Angels, the Raven Guard see one in a couple hundred neophytes degenerate into a monster when they get their marine organs.

Kanluwen wrote:Weren't the mutants the result of cloning attempts, and nothing to do with the implantation itself?

The mutations were DEFINITELY a byproduct of Corax trying to force grow marines in a short period of time after the Drop Site Massacre.

The flaws in their gene-seed are related to pigmentation (pale skin and black eyes as they age) and possibly some of the less useful crap not working right (spitting acid and such)...

I was just trying to make the point it was written vague enough that it could easily be rewritten which ever way a game designer would want it. As opposed to a major turn around.

Alpharius wrote:

aka_mythos wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Why mortar teams for Scouts? Veteran Scout teams, maybe with an ability to have Terminators "lock on" to them far more accurately than normal? Sure, could see it. Veteran Scout teams with a markerlight equivalent? Again, could see it.
But they're still a Codex Chapter, for the most part, with the exception of the amount of independence they give their Captains in deploying their forces...which doesn't really translate to the tabletop well, I'd think.

I don't think mortars are quite right for a space marine force of any flavor. With the current Codex SM scouts are 75% support role, 25% line troop. In a more guerrilla force there would be a higher emphasis on their ability to act in the troop role.

As far as a captain's independence to deploying troops, that'd be represented by a special rule allowing "any one unit may redeploy". Or something in that vein.

Kanluwen wrote:Also : it's really important to remember that the "mutants" that the Raven Guard had were purged by the Raven Guard themselves after they were used and found unstable.

Thats just what they tell the Inquisition.

Fluff is flexible and could be rewritten to accomodate. For example, just imagine if similar to the degeneration of the Blood Angels, the Raven Guard see one in a couple hundred neophytes degenerate into a monster when they get their marine organs.

Kanluwen wrote:Weren't the mutants the result of cloning attempts, and nothing to do with the implantation itself?

The mutations were DEFINITELY a byproduct of Corax trying to force grow marines in a short period of time after the Drop Site Massacre.

The flaws in their gene-seed are related to pigmentation (pale skin and black eyes as they age) and possibly some of the less useful crap not working right (spitting acid and such)...

well it is a good thing all my RG have there helmets on, well the full marines anyways scouts are not full marines.

Has anyone else noticed that at least some Forge World items are now made in China? Not a suprise really since GW has been moving many bits of their production process to GW Shanghai, but I recently encountered my first Forge World item that said "made in China" on it. In this case it was a Vendetta conversion kit, a relatively small item. I wonder if some of the larger more complicated models will be made in China as well.

Something I mentioned months ago.

Sonofruss wrote:well it is a good thing all my RG have there helmets on, well the full marines anyways scouts are not full marines.

Debatable. Some Chapters have full Battle-Brothers in their Scout companies due to the experience factor it adds in, and the Brothers in question's aptitude for insurgency/guerilla warfare.

Kanluwen wrote:

Sonofruss wrote:well it is a good thing all my RG have there helmets on, well the full marines anyways scouts are not full marines.

Debatable. ALL Chapters have full Battle-Brothers in their Scout companies due to the experience factor it adds in, and the Brothers in question's aptitude for insurgency/guerilla warfare.

FYP. All Scout Sergeants are full marines. You can't have recruits training recruits.

I don't know how much FW wants to give RG their own list, or variant units, but having different types of Scout squads would be a simple one. Have the "elite" guerilla warfare fighting veteran one and then the fresh off the gunship recruit "troop" choice. Veteran scouts with full marine veteran stats could be armed with silenced bolters (like Telion), sniper rifles, a demo-charge type thing and improved homer.