Sweet randomized dungeons, meaningful persistence, and loot, already seem to be confirmed to at least some degree. Now add an "in between games" narrative/adventure phase, and I think i'll be in heaven.
Warhammer Quest turned out terrific, and has been a ton of fun, but it doesn't quite end up being all I wanted from my co-op, RPG dungeon crawl board-game.
4am on the 7th... I may be awake by then if my jet lag has anything to say for it!
I think the in-between portions will be a big clincher for a lot of people.
With Silver Tower already on the market, and with a very likely possibility of the RPG style campaign getting added in via expansion at some future date, more than likely before this ships, a lot of people are going to be watching this.
I still think Darklight is going to scratch that old WHQuest vibe more than anything else, but that's a bit of apples and oranges.
My hope? Tile size variations. Need me some narrow hallways.
skullking wrote: \No zombies, yet anyway. To be fair, as long as they aren't the central focus of something I'm fine with them. I'm zombie'd out.
Presumably they'll just add a few cards or whatever to support the ZBP zombies (and wolves).
That would be smart/make sense/synergy!
This would actually be the perfect scenario. Everyone who loves zombies can use the zombiecide conversion rules to add zombies from their zombicide sets into the game. And I don't have to have any in my set!
When the big baddies enter the game, they bring a random treasure with them. These beasts can only employ weapons that suit them. A bow, for instance, is useless to a melee enemy. Also, potions and other items are of no use to them, but provide a tempting loot to the daring hero who slays the creature.
In the examples depicted here, both the Goblin Warrior Boss and the Orc Agent cannot wield their equipment. The Demon, on the other hand, carries a weapon that boosts both its melee attack and defense, making any hero think twice before engaging it in battle.
Its a terrific idea that not only calls to mind how games like Diablo use prefixes and suffixes to "mod" enemies into rares/uniques, but it also directly mimes the way popular Diablo-clone, "Titan Quest" handled random loot which effected the enemy carrying it, and also could be seen by the eagle-eyed, equipped to the model.
The loot system is what sold me on this project. I absolutely love the idea of random equip-able items on bosses that you then gain after defeating it.
Honestly, something like this actually adds incredibly dynamism and system-level randomization is a really awesome way. It functionally makes exponentially more monster types whenever a single enemy is added to the game.
This kind of clever design is exactly what I want in the fundamentals of a never-ending dungeon-crawl. Its stuff like this that implies game SYSTEM, instead of just a basic board-game.
All I need now is some news on a randomness engine to the campaign, dungeons, and so on in terms of monster populations, etc...
We're yay close to this even exceeding the pure potential the original Warhammer Quest offered with its RPG book. Only a few last bits need to really deliver.
This is where I get bummed for being a small company. One of the board game projects we're working on does something similar.
If I had more funding we could have moved faster to create something. Now we'll be doing something after-wards. Not that it is a bad thing just a bummer. Not that I thought we were doing something original or unique either (so not saying they stole our idea), just utilizing mechanics differently.
Dark Severance wrote: This is where I get bummed for being a small company. One of the board game projects we're working on does something similar.
If I had more funding we could have moved faster to create something. Now we'll be doing something after-wards. Not that it is a bad thing just a bummer. Not that I thought we were doing something original or unique either (so not saying they stole our idea), just utilizing mechanics differently.
Don't worry... if you give me a deep RPG/campaign system, i'll buy your game too! (Unless its that Cones of Dunshire mess currently on Kickstarter) :-p
The gameplay stuff looks very interesting but the minis and art are not doing it for me so far. I want this kind of game with minis in the style of the rum and bones ones.These are a little too cartoony and I am not a fan if all the pointy hats.
Chikout wrote: The gameplay stuff looks very interesting but the minis and art are not doing it for me so far. I want this kind of game with minis in the style of the rum and bones ones.These are a little too cartoony and I am not a fan if all the pointy hats.
Chikout wrote: The gameplay stuff looks very interesting but the minis and art are not doing it for me so far. I want this kind of game with minis in the style of the rum and bones ones.These are a little too cartoony and I am not a fan if all the pointy hats.
And Rum & Bones isn't cartoony?
Well yes but it has a bit of a darker edge to some of the minis. It is had to put my finger on but the enemies don't look threatening enough. From the preview pic the only minis I really like are the one on the far left with the staff and the elf archer.
The art looks like some of the more recent comic book style stuff in the games workshop books that a lot of people have complained about.
I will watch the kickstarter with interest but I am definitely in the sceptical camp for now.
This kind of clever design is exactly what I want in the fundamentals of a never-ending dungeon-crawl. Its stuff like this that implies game SYSTEM, instead of just a basic board-game.
This kind of clever design is exactly what I want in the fundamentals of a never-ending dungeon-crawl. Its stuff like this that implies game SYSTEM, instead of just a basic board-game.
There is definitely a system in mind here
Tell me more? :-p
I appreciate how little can be said, and confirmed, etc... as i've been in the entertainment business long enough, but how about a wink or nod to imply how happy out-of-ten I will be, if I am looking for something with long term progression, town events, random dungeons, and on-going campaign systems that extend further than the stock scenarios in the initial box?
I appreciate how little can be said, and confirmed, etc... as i've been in the entertainment business long enough, but how about a wink or nod to imply how happy out-of-ten I will be, if I am looking for something with long term progression, town events, random dungeons, and on-going campaign systems that extend further than the stock scenarios in the initial box?
I know those are the top questions I'm waiting to get answered too!
I appreciate how little can be said, and confirmed, etc... as i've been in the entertainment business long enough, but how about a wink or nod to imply how happy out-of-ten I will be, if I am looking for something with long term progression, town events, random dungeons, and on-going campaign systems that extend further than the stock scenarios in the initial box?
I know those are the top questions I'm waiting to get answered too!
I mean, we know from their little expo that characters do have about five level-ups worth of persistence and a skill-tree, but I am hopeful this is expected to be extended, and that likewise they do something for a proper ongoing, heavily randomized campaign.
Listen... we all know this thing will break a million stretch goals, and a couple will inevitably add full expansions w/tile sets. There needs to be a way for these to all become part of my "pool" for possible adventures, as stuff like Dungeon Saga petered out by making its expansions pre-baked, canned, adventure modules contained unto themselves only.
I am hoping for something light and fun that plays in 2-3 hours, with options to swap out monsters & bosses. I don't need anything particularly "deep", as I have games for that.
Put it this way John... Its easier for them to design a robust, campaign game, and then offer a quick-play, non-persistent mode for quick dungeon bashes (which i'm sure they will... this is the Zombicide team after-all), than it is for them to make a quick and light game and then bolt on ALL the stuff they need to satisfy folks like myself, and Alpharius. :-p
I have no doubt you'll get what you need out of this one... its the stuff I am hoping for which I feel may or may not happen.
JohnHwangDD wrote: I am hoping for something light and fun that plays in 2-3 hours, with options to swap out monsters & bosses. I don't need anything particularly "deep", as I have games for that.
So I think you're going to both get this and the ability to play a more fully realized campaign, especially in regards to long term progression and campaign systems. If you want to play one offs with lots of options to switch out and customize monsters, you're going to be able to (see the loot aspect previewed most recently) If you want to really dig into a fully realized campaign with hero progression and building, you'll get that too.
The game has a lot to it, and I think is going to make a lot of people that have been looking for a DM-less dungeon crawler very happy.
You'll also probably be able to vary your dungeons with some other CMON properties, but who knows
I remember in Heroquest, a Campaign meant you kept the character and loot from the previous adventures when you played the next adventure, and the Town was where you bought and sold stuff between adventures.
Any more complicated than that and you are treading into RPG territory.
adamsouza wrote: I remember in Heroquest, a Campaign meant you kept the character and loot from the previous adventures when you played the next adventure, and the Town was where you bought and sold stuff between adventures.
Any more complicated than that and you are treading into RPG territory.
We all had Heroquest before ever discovering Warhammer Quest existed, and frankly Warhammer Quest just looked like a much more expensive version of the same thing.
We all had Heroquest before ever discovering Warhammer Quest existed, and frankly Warhammer Quest just looked like a much more expensive version of the same thing.
I hope there's a tomb quest that all my Black Plague zombies and heroes can take part in. It would also be nice to get crossover cards for the characters from ZBP.
If it includes the things listed above, as well as a bestiary that allows you to use miniatures other than what comes in the box as monsters, it will have my attention.
Very impressive. Lots of content in the box and you know CMON will pile a ton more into the bargain. Coupled with Black Plague compatibility, I can see this rivaling Dark Souls' total.
I'm excited for this. Assuming I get my Black Plague sometime soon. But unlike other companies I have faith that it'll show up and be awesome so it's not a deal breaker for me.
My wife and I played an absolutely insane amount of Warhammer Quest: Silver Tower over the last four days, and while we totally love it (the moment to moment play is very clean, and light), it did remind me how much I need the more RPG/campaign style elements to bring it together.
WQ:ST feels like what I would think a Zombicide lite-rpg would feel like, honestly, so I am hopefully for that one extra tier of RPG crunch to string together really long, really random campaigns with gear, unexpected happenings, level-ups, visits to town, etc...
Psychopomp wrote: If it includes the things listed above, as well as a bestiary that allows you to use miniatures other than what comes in the box as monsters, it will have my attention.
There will likely be some cross-compatibility with the Zombicide : Black Plague monsters, but I wouldn't expect a Monster Manual of things not yet produced. I would expect an expansion or two of different monsters to fight against, perhaps more Demons.
JohnHwangDD wrote: There will likely be some cross-compatibility with the Zombicide : Black Plague monsters, but I wouldn't expect a Monster Manual of things not yet produced. I would expect an expansion or two of different monsters to fight against, perhaps more Demons.
Hmmm. I hope that's not the case. "No monsters other than what we put in the box(es)" tends to be a dungeon crawler deal-breaker for me.
JohnHwangDD wrote: There will likely be some cross-compatibility with the Zombicide : Black Plague monsters, but I wouldn't expect a Monster Manual of things not yet produced. I would expect an expansion or two of different monsters to fight against, perhaps more Demons.
Hmmm. I hope that's not the case. "No monsters other than what we put in the box(es)" tends to be a dungeon crawler deal-breaker for me.
I'm thinking this might be a broken deal for you then...
Though between the monsters in the base game, the campaign expansions revealed...during the KS campaign, the Zombicide: Black Plague crossover stuff and the inevitable "Season 2" here, well, I think there will be plenty to do here!
Seriously excited about this. Love Zombicide (the only mini's game my other half actively supports me buying instead of shaking her head and looking disappointed), love dungeon crawlers and you always get your moneys worth from a Cmon KS. Looking forward to a month of constantly checking the KS total.
It looks good from what I've seen so far, it will be interesting to see a game of it being played to see if it's as easy to pick up and play with people who don't usually play games like this, as that's one of the best things about Zombicide.
Not only will we more than likely see multiple expansions, but I can see them doing specific monster releases like the archer boxes, the ravens... stuff like that.
We get enough of those, enough expansions, enough stretch goals, then I could see them possibly putting together some sort of monster compendium.
Heck, make it a Kickstarer exclusive to encourage even more backers. Although if we don't have cards for monster from there, not sure how helpful a compendium would be then...
I see this as the springboard to an army scale battles game. Seriously the expansions could be all Orcs, or undead, or werewolves, or gnolls and then do the box sets like the skeletal archers to expand the base armies.
Very excited for this. I just recieved my second wave of black plague, and the variety of enemies, heroes, etc, is astonishing. I really hope they make cards so we can use the black plague heroes (box games, artist packs, maybe promos) in massive darkness. It would be cool to use the abominations, skeleton archers, and crows too. I love dungeon crawl games, and it would be great to use my black plague stuff for more than one game!!
455_PWR wrote: Very excited for this. I just recieved my second wave of black plague, and the variety of enemies, heroes, etc, is astonishing. I really hope they make cards so we can use the black plague heroes (box games, artist packs, maybe promos) in massive darkness. It would be cool to use the abominations, skeleton archers, and crows too. I love dungeon crawl games, and it would be great to use my black plague stuff for more than one game!!
Most likely, anything that does not find its way into the KS project will find its way to the Organzied play desk ;-), perhaps as POD items, perhaps initially as digital only.
This wasn't really on my radar (so many great games out there) but having now read through the thread, this just looks the danglies. I can only echo Nostromodamus' comment from page 4 -
RiTides wrote: Argh, I think I'm going to miss the launch window! Will definitely be tracking this one, though
It's only going to 'cost' you about $5 or $10, so no big deal.
The KS server is likely to be lurching and protesting at that launch time, so I suspect there will be more than a few people upset over that $5 to $10 anyway!
RiTides wrote: Argh, I think I'm going to miss the launch window! Will definitely be tracking this one, though
It's only going to 'cost' you about $5 or $10, so no big deal.
The KS server is likely to be lurching and protesting at that launch time, so I suspect there will be more than a few people upset over that $5 to $10 anyway!
Well, if it's going to be an extra fiver, ... pitchforks and torches!
Seriously, this is obviously going to be huge. Probably no need for EBs at all.
The usual CMON formula is that the number of EB slots * the cost of EB slots = the most likely artificially low 'funding goal'.
Maybe this one has a $125K funding goal like Z: BP too?
So, something similar in terms of pricing and EBs here as well?
$140 with 900 slots (everyone else pays $150, or $100 without that extra expansion included!), snapped up in about 2.5 minutes, and funded and off and running and maybe even close to $700K on the first day?
But I don't think the initial funding goals in any of the 'big' Kickstarters mean much at all, especially when we 'know' that they'll end up pushing a million dollars or, in this case, multiple millions of dollars!
Can't see it beating Black Plague. Dungeon crawlers might appeal more to people like us, but it doesn't have the brand pulling power with non-gamers of Zombicide. I'm guessing about $2m, maybe $2.5m
Yeah, I think as long as it has a quickplay similar to even the new GW Silver Tower it'll still be a hit. And a big one. It's not zombies so it opens up that fantasy crowd even more than zombicide did. Essentially I'd expect the large number of people who CMoN kickstarted black plague to join in this one and then the new people it'll drag in that were fans of a fantasy zombicide too.
The interesting thing is that campaign mode doesn't even add pages. Simply replace a half-dozen scenarios with the campaign rules at the same page count.
I don't know how much Highlording I'll be up to at 4 in the morning, but considering how long it's taking me to get readjusted to the time difference, I very well could be awake.
Who am I kidding, I'll probably desperately try and grab an EB just like everyone else!
That depends if the funding goal is $125,000 like BP then if there is a $150 level there will be 900 at $140 EBs ($126,000) if there is only a $100 level then there would be 1,400 at $90 EBs ($126,000). CMoN set the number of EBs to match the funding goal more or less - R&B 2 had goal of $80,000 with 1,100 $90 EBs ($99,000) so a bit more in that case where as The Others had a goal of $100,000 with 1,100 $90 EBs as well. Whatever they set it at they will be gone in seconds.
Not sure whether there will be a $150 pledge as the KS trailer didn't show an expansion (like Wulfsburg, it was shown in the BP trailer) it may just be a $100 level for the game + 1 or 2 promos + stretch goals.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Size comparison pic
Not a fan of the snake lady. Her hips are far too wide, or her waist too thin. I don't like the scale texture either, but I can't think of a good replacement to suggest for it.
Although I do like the idea that she armored up her soft spots...besides her torso of course.
Of course, the Mierce Naga costs ...well, I can;t find it there actually. I guess it could be a pre-order, but their Mierce site is a mess, especially since none of the model names really mean much to the layman who isn't invested in their range.
fake edit - found it - 28.49UKP, which is roughly US$41. Which will be a good sized chunk of the base MD pledge, or pretty much the price of a full-sized add-on expansion box.
Really? I think the CMON one has a better torso, but the Mierce a better tail.
The Arens Rex one is the nicest, overall, but still not as good as their best female minis.
I will have to find one of those timezone converting sites, but I guess I'll still be at the hospital or it'll be (even later) in the night for me, so I can write off an EB, anway. Then I'll wait for my BP stuff to show up and judge the quality and even wait if cooler enemies are added via SGs
Oh, yeah, chances are still very high that I will be backing the KS, even if I don't love *all* the models. That snake lady may need some Green Stuff though.
That's actually pretty much my point. Comparing the "high end" resin Mierce Naga that costs $41 to a PVC sculpt that's part of a kickstarter boardgame isn't really the best comparison.
Ah, sorry -- I should have clarified -- I was aiming for a comparison of the design decisions involved rather than price or materials. The proportions on the MD one just look so off.
Azazelx wrote: I'm just going to assume that the completionist level of this will come to $300+, as is usual for CMON and especially Zombicide-flavoured KS.
Thank you, that answers a question I had, so probably up to about £200 inc. shipping.
I'm completely infatuated with the idea of this game now, despite little idea about it a week back. I've wanted to do a dungeon crawling group of heroes for ages, the somewhat cartoony stylings will suit my somewhat cartoony painting, I am reassured from some brief investigation online that the makers can probably deliver, and it gives me a year to finish other projects first.
Is anyone else such a shameless hussy when a new game flutters its eyelashes?
Zc:BP Completionist costs - I'm excluding dice and extra tiles sets. There is really no need to buy more dice for Zombicide but MD has custom dice so another set for $10 might be a consideration - you can't roll more than 3 dice of any one type though. I have never used the extra tile sets even though I own a few. The official scenarios and the extra fan made ones GG upload don't use them you would need to design your own quests to get any value from them.
without gaming aids (doors, base covers, plastic tokens, dice bag)
$410
One of everything $491 (abomination pack was part of the base pledge)
Zc:Season 3 without gaming aids
$465
One of everything $530
MD will probably be similar if your in completionist mode expect to part with $400+
The amount of guest artist boxes for BP cured me of completionist syndrome there was just to many at 10 paid and 3 added to the pledge. I only opted for 3 extra in the end. At least the CMoN Expo Q&A suggests that they have heard the complaints about to many survivors so hopefully the added sets will be different monster types this time.
Darkjim wrote: [
Is anyone else such a shameless hussy when a new game flutters its eyelashes?
...Yeah, I probably am. I find CMoN is pretty good at putting out fun games* on Kickstarter, and it's always a good value. This particular one is from the makers of Zombicide, so that's a win, and the style and idea of gameplay sound fantastic, which definitely makes it one of my more anticipated KS releases. And, yes, you've nothing to fear from backing a CMoN kickstarter (in my experience), they definitely deliver, just usually later than the "release target".
Sadly, I'll be at work when this thing goes live, so no early backer for me! No worries, I've snagged an early backer for Dark Souls, RnB 2, Black Plague... It's only fair I don't get one once in a while. Counting down the hours until I'm home from work and can back it! What are we guessing on for stretch goals? Promo heroes seem to be a sure thing, but what "inspirations" are you guys hoping for?
*Your mileage may vary, I enjoy all the games I've gotten from CMoN. Opinions are what they are.
For those that are new to CMON campaigns; if you want to ensure you "don't miss" anything, you want to focus on any items that are labeled "Kickstarter Exclusive;" increasingly, these are found almost entirely in the stretch goals and not in the add-ons.
As such, if you're patient you can most probably hold off on anything not labeled "Kickstarter Exclusive" until they're released at retail.
And always remember, you can add funds in the pledge manager afterwards, if you're someone like me that likes to spread out the costs with smaller payments.
cincydooley wrote: For those that are new to CMON campaigns; if you want to ensure you "don't miss" anything, you want to focus on any items that are labeled "Kickstarter Exclusive;" increasingly, these are found almost entirely in the stretch goals and not in the add-ons.
As such, if you're patient you can most probably hold off on anything not labeled "Kickstarter Exclusive" until they're released at retail.
And always remember, you can add funds in the pledge manager afterwards, if you're someone like me that likes to spread out the costs with smaller payments.
Do you anticipate most of the KS exclusives in Massive Darkness to require the expanded pledge like in Z:BP? Black Plague was my first CMON kickstarter, so I'm curious if that is typical or not. I'll back at whatever the Z:BP Kight level equivalent is for Massive Darkness anyway since my kids are gonna like this.
We'll find out in 4 1/2 hours but I've seen nothing yet to suggest a $150 pledge level it's more likely it will just be a single $100 pledge level (plus X no. of $90 EBs). (unless cincydooley can confirm otherwise)
DaveC wrote: We'll find out in 4 1/2 hours but I've seen nothing yet to suggest a $150 pledge level it's more likely it will just be a single $100 pledge level (plus X no. of $90 EBs). (unless cincydooley can confirm otherwise)
I was hoping for an expansion for the sake of more tiles and variety but hopefully they just add that in via stretch goals or add ons instead.
Zombicide Seasons 2 and 3 and Black Plague all had one full sized expansion available during the Kickstarter campaign, I would be very surprised if Massive Darkness didn't.
ecurtz wrote: Zombicide Seasons 2 and 3 and Black Plague all had one full sized expansion available during the Kickstarter campaign, I would be very surprised if Massive Darkness didn't.
As this is a VERY different genre of game, and considering dungeon crawls live and die on their variety, I actually expect several "mid" sized expansions, each including a new monster type or two, and some tiles. I think doing big expansions, and character packs does less good for the dungeon crawler than offering more types of dungeons to augment all the design work that already went into randomizing how gear buffs (and randomizes) enemies, etc.
ecurtz wrote: Zombicide Seasons 2 and 3 and Black Plague all had one full sized expansion available during the Kickstarter campaign, I would be very surprised if Massive Darkness didn't.
As this is a VERY different genre of game, and considering dungeon crawls live and die on their variety, I actually expect several "mid" sized expansions, each including a new monster type or two, and some tiles. I think doing big expansions, and character packs does less good for the dungeon crawler than offering more types of dungeons to augment all the design work that already went into randomizing how gear buffs (and randomizes) enemies, etc.
Yep. I'm really hoping they will add heroes/equipment/classes mostly via SG, and make several medium-sized expansion add-ons with some tile variety and different enemy types.
I'm also just hoping for that as it would also imply random dungeon-crawl modes, and not layouts married to pre-made campaigns or scenarios. Honestly, forcing a genre like this into pre-made scenarios would be a shame.
Also hoping for a book, or maybe fat card deck of "random room events" to give further flavor.
Do you anticipate most of the KS exclusives in Massive Darkness to require the expanded pledge like in Z:BP? Black Plague was my first CMON kickstarter, so I'm curious if that is typical or not. I'll back at whatever the Z:BP Kight level equivalent is for Massive Darkness anyway since my kids are gonna like this.
I think you can expect the large bulk of the KS exclusive items to come via the 'standard' pledge level.
IIRC, there were....8-10 of about 30 KS exclusive stretches in BP that were for the knight level? I'd have to look.
But again, I think you can expect most of them to come with your base package,which is probably the only pledge level
Automatically Appended Next Post:
RoninXiC wrote: Well.. I wonder how many seconds it will take to get funded.
Like 12?
It'll fund in about 5 seconds, but the system will freeze for the next 30 mins.
Azazelx wrote: That's actually pretty much my point. Comparing the "high end" resin Mierce Naga that costs $41 to a PVC sculpt that's part of a kickstarter boardgame isn't really the best comparison.
OTOH, the Kei Lun model from Journey : Wrath of Demons is fantastic and compares quite well to any other non-resin model:
It took more than 12 seconds to fully fund.. what a DISASTER OH MY GOD THE SKY IS FALLING.
Didn't get any early birds.. which is probably almost impossible to do.
It finished processing. It shows that I have a EB selected as a pledge. I got the congrats you've backed page, but I haven't gotten my email yet. Most likely it will be what happened last time and apparently didn't go through. :(
RoninXiC wrote: It took more than 12 seconds to fully fund.. what a DISASTER OH MY GOD THE SKY IS FALLING.
Didn't get any early birds.. which is probably almost impossible to do.
Less than 10 mins and I think that was due to the time it took for people to complete the pledge process. All the EBs were gone well before there were 1820 backers in the total.
John where are you getting your prices, I know CA is higher than most states, but $120+ $10-15 does not equal $150. Unless your guessing $30 for shipping to you.
Surely the Wolbomination sculpt from BP is better? I've not had mine arrive yet and obviously it's a bit zombified, but it looked a pretty respectable sculpt from what I recall. (not that I actually mind that werewolf, it looks alright to me)
BigOscar wrote: Surely the Wolbomination sculpt from BP is better? I've not had mine arrive yet and obviously it's a bit zombified, but it looked a pretty respectable sculpt from what I recall. (not that I actually mind that werewolf, it looks alright to me)
Wolfbomination is ok, nothing special imho. I think this Werewolf looks like it has more promise.
If we're going to be railing over anything, it should be that shaved female Dwarf. Everybody knows that female Dwarves have lush, full beards that they grow out nearly as long as their male counterparts. Without her beard, she's a dishonor to her clan.
The sculpts are a mixed bag for me. But me and my son love to play the Zombicide games and since he came up with a Dungeon crawler rpg (a 9yr old version anyway) I have a feeling he will love this.
I think a Rum & Bones conversion set would be kind of cool.
Have a character sheet for the 5 basic classes of pirate. That way you could just use whichever figures you liked.
Or you could have it so you could fight through a pirate lair even- give the fodder crew encounter cards, and have rival pirates as roaming monsters, or as agents and bosses.
Have a character sheet for the 5 basic classes of pirate. That way you could just use whichever figures you liked.
Or you could have it so you could fight through a pirate lair even- give the fodder crew encounter cards, and have rival pirates as roaming monsters, or as agents and bosses.
Good chance this will come as free material from CMON Organized Play.
And I absolutely could NOT have been ANY faster than I was (mashing F5 from about 2:58PM on), and I was backer number 844 on Massive Darkness - huzzah!
Can't wait for the expansion reveals, and more of the bigger wandering monsters!
More demons and hopefully a dragon on two, please!
Weren't most of the Zombicide boxes 3 figures for around 20?
3 heroes and a big monster for 30 is fair I suppose.
Do we know how many sheets there will be in a character pad?
I'm really weird about using those pads of paper included in games, and will always go out of my way to either write out my own or find an acceptable alternative on BGG.
3 heroes and a big monster for 30 is fair I suppose.
Guest boxes were 4 miniatures for $20 KS price, $25 retail. These sets are 3 Heroes plus a large monster plus a character pad for probably $25 KS price - $30 is the retail price, so it seems about right to me.
We were varying between $35K, $40K and $50K earlier, depending on what we were aiming for (paper, small mini, large min?), but maybe we're now settled in to $50K?
That Weretiger is great. I hope there'll be an unarmoured one so I can have Rei from BoF4, though. I've waited decades for such a model.
The female barb has the most hilarious string aemout, but I guess she's Red Sonja with a backpack? Kinda fits, then.
Edit: The Golem is also neat. I just wish that they'd do different poses for the mooks instead spending so much money on tooling for KS exclusives. Four more heroes or four more poses four a guy you get a dozen of? Easy choice, but apparently not what the market wants
Having looked through a handful of the minis from my ZBP pledge I'm even more keen on this.
Seriously impressive casts for 'boardgame' minis.
Several steps above Imperial Assault in terms of detail IMO.
My Zombicide BP pledge just arrived in the post, and I have to say it's made me even more excited about this one. I feel like a kid at Christmas, sooo much stuff and it's all so pretty!
Alpharius wrote: 1)
2) I cannot believe the lack of Highlords Highlording it up in here - or keeping this thread updated appropriate. As his duty as the OP!
Yeah, pretty lame. I feel like that should be a N&R rule. If you aren't going to keep OP up to date, don't make the OP.
Nostromodamus wrote: Need some non-aztec lizardmen for Highlording to occur methinks.
Common monster warbands we have:
Goblins
Dwarves
Orcs
Zombies (Z:BP)
Skeletons (Z:BP)
Common monster warbands we could still use: (In Order of chance to appear)
Kobolds
Gnolls
Dark Elves
Human Bandits/Thieves/Cultists
Lizard People (The Non-Kobold kind)
Sneeple (Snake People!)
Mushroom People (Myconds)
Frog People (Bullywugs)
Fishman People (Deep Ones/Murlocs)
HMV, CMON seem to have gotten pretty good at PVC casting. I got the Blood Rage Kickstarter last year and every cast was good. Had to take mold lines off most of them but no significant issues.
These numbers are obviously going to change, most likely already did by the time I made this post. Since it has gotten to a mostly stable position I wanted to take a look at where we were numbers.
478 pledges are most likely $1 pledges at a minimum, bringing the known total to $906,638.
There is a $11,312 difference. Since they don't include shipping, some people add it to their campaign now so they don't have to pay it later. Others have added on money for eventual add-ons and expansions that will come.
3600 backers are from the United States. 735 from United Kingdom. 574 from Germany. 571 from Canada.
There are 311 new backers who have never backed a Kickstarter project. There are 7,870 returning backers who have backed Kickstarters before.
JohnHwangDD wrote: Dude, we're not even 24 hours into the campaign... And we have nearly a month to go...
I am sure there will be plenty more to come over the next 4+ weeks.
Not sure if this was directed at my comment but if it was maybe a reread is in order. I was basically praising the totAL without them even having put up a single paid add on yet.
They'll be no banning Highlord Tamburlaine, but Baning is not out of the picture .
I'm not thrilled with either of these next two stretch goals to be honest. I have mordheim chests and ones from dungeon saga as well and the mummy doesn't strike me as a great model.
I just hope (wallet cringes) at the thought of the minion hordes being purchasable separately as there are so many possibilities for KOW armies in them.
Theophony wrote: They'll be no banning Highlord Tamburlaine, but Baning is not out of the picture .
I'm not thrilled with either of these next two stretch goals to be honest. I have mordheim chests and ones from dungeon saga as well and the mummy doesn't strike me as a great model.
I just hope (wallet cringes) at the thought of the minion hordes being purchasable separately as there are so many possibilities for KOW armies in them.
The most "efficient" way to do so might well be to get 2x or 3x the $120 base pledge...
Also anyone else think we will get busted columns?
And hopefully a column that is actually a monster.
Looks like we will have several more levels of chests to unlock.
I haven't had time to watch the videos yet. Are there 'bosses' in a campaign sense or are the wandering monsters always going to be the biggest thing you'll face?
I wasn't going to back this for a number of personal reasons, but just yesterday Black Plague was delivered to my house and now I'm all excited again at the thought of pre-ordering plastic toy soldiers a year in advance. Most suspicious this delivery timing.
I'm tentatively in on this one, I'm waiting for more gameplay videos before I decide. Or for some kimd of BP compatibility, that would probably push me over the edge.
MLaw wrote: Yeah, a pledge level breakdown would be awesome.. they're throwing a lot of images out but it's hard to see what's included where atm..
There's only one pledge level, only difference is if you got an EB. So far every backer gets the base game plus everything unlocked so far. They haven't introduced any add ons yet just new monsters and heroes and additional copies of minions and minion bosses already in the base game that everybody gets.
MLaw wrote: Yeah, a pledge level breakdown would be awesome.. they're throwing a lot of images out but it's hard to see what's included where atm..
There's only one pledge level, only difference is if you got an EB. So far every backer gets the base game plus everything unlocked so far. They haven't introduced any add ons yet just new monsters and heroes and additional copies of minions and minion bosses already in the base game that everybody gets.
You beat me too it!
Yes, EVERYTHING shown to date is included with EVERY pledge!
The only thing left to unlock right now is the Mummy at $1.1M.
I think we'll see paid add-ons soon enough, but don't expect to see many until the inevitable mid-campaign sow down period.
I just wonder if there will be enough minions in the set and if it will have the same rules as zombicide with the monsters get an extra activation if you don't have enough of them to place. It looked scary in the video when 8 archers and their boss showed up at one time. What if the next card was the same thing, or you had 6 players so it would have been 12 archers and a boss.
@Alex Taylor: Generally all enemies give 1XP, to keep things simple and progression under control. We're studying a few variables for Roaming Monsters, though.
Thiago is your guy to look for in the KS Comments section - otherwise, there's a whole lot of noise in there...
Where did you get the pic, or did you make it? (Thanks even more if you did!)
In the pic, are all the miniatures within a group (large mini's, small mini's, terrain) the same scale to each other? I was a little confused until I saw the pic what size which mini was what!
Reaper's charging $5+ for a large mini, so we're already at $40+ in large mini's alone on the second day! (:
Yeah I had a spare half hour this morning while I was waiting for a shade wash to dry so I put it together from the updates while we wait for the official one. I rescaled the images from the updates to 66% of the original (except the cyclops which is 50%) so if the original images are all to scale then the image above should be as well - I wouldn't rely on it though the heroes may be in scale relative to each other but they are probably a bit too big relative to the monsters and the minions look a little small. The terrain isn't to scale at all so as to make it all fit the image.
Hopefully some wow factor kicks in soon, 50k for a sorcerer and another 35kfor the printed pad of his skills is pretty lame especially after the mummy. I think we need an add on to bump the numbers.
Ajax use of Magic is ruthless and efficient. He has little interest in fancy tricks or showy demonstrations. He uses his power to annihilate those who stand against him, plain and simple. All of his Magic attacks roll an extra Yellow die and deal an extra Wound. His Sorcerer free class skill may grant even more Wounds to his Magic attacks, if Bams are rolled. Fear Ajax!
Theophony wrote: Hopefully some wow factor kicks in soon, 50k for a sorcerer and another 35kfor the printed pad of his skills is pretty lame especially after the mummy. I think we need an add on to bump the numbers.
The "wow factor" is that the campaign is already over $1M after barely 24 hours going live.
We won't need an add on for at least a week.
The campaign is doing just fine.
Although, to be honest, I am really hoping for extra dice sets in a couple different flavors, as 3 of each die is simply not enough. For comparison, I have enough Zombicide dice that each player can use their own set. If Massive Darkness could see 1 black set w/ colored symbols and 1 white set w/ colored symbols, that would bring us to 3 full sets of dice, which would be really great. And if we could get a translucent set, that would be really awesome!
We're past the 48 hour mark John, but yeah, 1.1 million is nothing to sneeze at. I was just saying the sculpts aren't killing it like the zombicide ones were. Also the monsters are just soooooo random, I'd like to see more like a lizardman bunch of stretches to have a lizard lair, or a bunch of gnolls or a bunch of kobolds. I like my dungeons controlled by one species not a come as you are party. Call me racist or whatever but golems and werewolves just don't go together , especially with evil dwarf servants.
I would love to see some miniatures for this game paying homage to some of the classic Fighting Fantasy Gamebook minions and characters. Still love those books...
I like that they seemingly backpeddaled on the space between SGs. I'm not a backer yet, but that's more laziness on my end and wanting to check my Z:BP stuff out on the weekend. If that stuff is as good as Blood Rage I'll likely pledge for stuff like the Weretiger(S, hopefully) and the cockatrice alone.
And I still think the gnome dwarves could make some nice big hat Chaos Dwarfs with some sculpting. Stealing a couple of those for BB or having them pull double duty should work.
This first expansion just went up, and at $40 for four wandering, large, monsters i'm not sure I am wildly excited.
I think the dilemma for me is that so far I don't think they've shown just how exciting wandering monsters should be. So my mindset is all about bands of small, diverse gribblies, not just big set-piece enemies.
Also, no new loot or campaign stuff yet? I'd think those would make good, cheap, intermediary stretch-goals early on.
For $40 i would have expected some 10 minions, couple new tiles and some loot cards on top of the current contents for that price. I know they are big miniatures but even compared with the addons for The Others this one is a bit lacking.
This doesn't feel like $40 worth more $30 worth compare it to The Others Apocalypse which had 5 large miniatures 2 regular sized miniatures 4 tiles and some cards for the same price
So these are the Elementals:
Yes, it's a new take on Elementals, but the designs just don't work for me.
When I look at the Air Elemental, if I didn't know that it was supposed to be an Air Elemental, I never would have guessed it. The Air Elemental doesn't convey air or elemental at all - it looks like a giantess of some sort (but at least it's female, which is good for variety).
The Earth Elemental simply awful. He's got branches and is holding a piece of dressed brickwork, instead of a giant boulder? With beady, expressionless little eyes? I hate this model so much.
The Fire Elemental is very inconsistent, and lacks internal consistency. He's wearing heavy leg armor, but appears to be wearing iron grating over much of the rest of his body, but not all of his body. But at least there are flames, and that part is well-textured. Too bad his face doesn't look like a face at all.
The Water Elemental is OK, having water designs. I do not understand why he's holding a water staff.
They're not so compelling that I want them right now. If the sculpts were better, and the air / fire / water elementals were molded in translucent plastic, then sure. But right now? Pass. Wait for retail discount, if at all.
I agree with you guys.
Not too impressed and the $40 cost makes me even less so.
I hope this isn't their add-on strategy moving forward or, if it is, I hope they revise it based on backer comments.
That Water Elemental is 10/10 awesomesauce. Rest is fine. 40$ is ... hard to say. It is way more expensive than other and older addons. But a single one of them from other manufacturers like GW or PP would've cost at least 30$
A bit difficult to tell from the comparison image on the update, but if these elementals are close to the size of the large Wrath of Kings models then this is not as bad a deal as I originally thought (the WoK large models were $20 each at KS prices). Either way I will likely wait for retail on anything not in the base pledge unless it really catches my fancy.
Incidentally, all Wandering Monsters so far come with two cards. Does anyone know why? I assume one is a standard stat card... the other explaining special rules? An "advanced" version???
I like them, but I'm not sure I $40 like them. Will have to wait to see other add ons. I pledged $200 off the rip, assuming I'd get at least $80 of add ons. Zombicide has taught me well.
This was a discussion in one of the Facebook groups about the AI. Some people don't like how simplified it was, which I wasn't too surprised about. There are some things that are done differently with this that I believe provides enough variety. But that is besides the point.
Apps were brought up. I am surprised with how the tiles for CMoN style games are setup, that they haven't started work on companion apps. Just select the tiles, type of gameplay and it will randomly place certain elements and can even change up the AI a bit with some encounters.
There are apps for many games. Zombicide has an app. But only for Zombicide 1. If you only own Rue Morgue, it's like $10 extra, just for that. And if you have all the extra dashboards, those are extra $$$ unlocks, too.
Yeah but does it change gameplay or bring anything else to gameplay that isn't already there by creating new experiences? Isn't it just a character item/exp tracker, dice roller, etc.
I just got to see my BP stuff and those giant abominations are mouth watering good. And should be great for BB Big guys if the can balance on smaller bases. Pure dynamite in the posing. Makes me want to pledge for more CMON stuff. Those things don't. IMO they all have cool bits and bobs, but don't fit together very well. For that money and the higher starting price...I hope CMON puts out a Blood Rage successor and the HATE game real quick, before their prices soar even higher.
PS: also got to check my bitsandkits order, half of a crypt ghoul belly and a whole Cauldron of Blood witch elf missing :/ Sucked the joy right outof the "evening of checking your huge nerd stuff parcels".
I like 'water', I can see what they were going for in 'fire',
but I dislike 'earth' and 'air' is too far removed from what I think of as an air elemental
and unless they get extra stuff added to the box (unlikely since they've shown the box art) they're too expensive
Thiago has explained the price is to do with them needing factory assembly, not sure if this is now more expensive for cmon (chinese workers get raised too) or whether they're just passing more of the cost along to the KS backers now
RoninXiC wrote: That Water Elemental is 10/10 awesomesauce. Rest is fine. 40$ is ... hard to say. It is way more expensive than other and older addons. But a single one of them from other manufacturers like GW or PP would've cost at least 30$
Once again, I don't think we can reasonably compare CMON's Boardgame PVC to GW's HIPS and so forth. How much from Reaper in (tinted/clear) Bonesium at RRP? Remember, this is Kickstarter, so the fairest comparison would be a similar product sold by the same company for the same price point. If only there were such a thing...
5 Big Figures
4 New Tiles
1 New Story Board
1 New Apocalypse Track Board
5 Monster Reference Cards
12 new Upgrade Cards
1 Rules and Maps Leaflet
Backers can get this Optional Buy for $40, and it will available at retail later on for an estimated MSRP of $50. But those who get this item during the Kickstarter campaign, will also get 2 Kickstarter Exclusive Heroes: Kwanita, the Bruiser, and Benoit, the Sniper!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Looks like some assembly probably required on those large figures as well...
Dark Severance wrote: This was a discussion in one of the Facebook groups about the AI. Some people don't like how simplified it was, which I wasn't too surprised about. There are some things that are done differently with this that I believe provides enough variety. But that is besides the point.
While not "realistic", a simplified AI lets players make better gamey tactical decisions, for better or for worse. A BGG'er suggested that the game can use a dungeon master instead of the AI rules. You can also make a deck (cf. Descent's coop games) which determine how the monsters react.
ced1106 wrote: While not "realistic", a simplified AI lets players make better gamey tactical decisions, for better or for worse. A BGG'er suggested that the game can use a dungeon master instead of the AI rules. You can also make a deck (cf. Descent's coop games) which determine how the monsters react.
I do understand it isn't realistic and simplified but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.
I don't believe the game will play the same with with a DM controlling the monsters, but I wouldn't know for sure until I played it more. Generally though they play differently. Creating a deck of actions or reactions would probably work better. It just would be nice to have alternate methods or advanced methods to expand on gameplay officially as part of it, instead of having to house-rule something.
I think the one thing that has kept me from being absolutely in love with these models is that they are all computer sculpted. Most of the other KS models from zombicide were hand sculpted and to me there's still a big gap between the two styles.
Like others have mentioned I'm hoping that some more coherent themes emerge.
Agree. This is a different-looking monster to my eyes, too.
I'm not sure we'll get so much "coherence", aside from minion packs, and then, only because of the sheer number of minions required for 6 Heroes. I see a lot of this as rolling on the random monster chart in 1E D&D.
I'm surprised to find myself still on the fence on this one. I love the Sorcerer and the Cyclops, but none of the other minis stand out as must-haves. The price is REALLY good, and I know the casting should be good because Blood Rage was amazing in that regard.
I should probably take the time to watch the gameplay videos.
I guess it will likely be almost as successful as BR which means I could quadruple my investment if I just eBayed it a month or two after arrival...
I am OK with the gameplay and the way most of the minis look. I think that the total price is kinda high, and hope it'll justify $120 + S&H when this is all done.
I think even just thinking of the minis unlocked so far, which I make it to be 113 minis and a bit of scenery for $120, some of the minis pretty big, it's a great deal. I almost always pay either S&H or train fare if I buy minus anyway...
I don't think we'll see any blockbuster expansions/ add ons for another week or so.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
BigDaddio wrote: Had already planned on backing this, but am even more stoked after receiving the rest of my Z:BP stuff today. So many possibilities...
I'm almost more excited about using all the ZBP stuff in a crawl than the current minions.
Sorry, but no. The Elementals box is what it is, and it costs what it costs. I perfectly understand that some people loved it and bought it, others didn't like it, others found it too expensive, others will wait for retail. That's all perfectly OK, folks. We don't want you to buy any more than what you want to buy. We make the product and we offer it, the rest is up to you. :-)
Azazelx wrote: Thanks Dave - that's unfortunate. I guess CMON have gotten big enough that they'll try on things like this now and be obstinate about it as well.
We can always wait for retail on this one - but I'm also not 100% sure who carries CMON stuff at a discount online...
We can always wait for retail on this one - but I'm also not 100% sure who carries CMON stuff at a discount online...
Miniatures Market will generally get one big shipment on release, that they discount 20-25% They don't tend to restock it much after that.
They get restock pretty often, I've been watching for certain things like zombie dogs, but they come in when I'm cash strapped. You can watch their daily feed and see what and how much of each come in.
Yeah at this point I think my $120+ shipping is all I'm in for. It might be their strategy this time around. If all the add ons are over priced then it means more people will wait till retail and that will help them get more of a retail presence instead of just Kickstarter sales. Also it will help packing be better/quicker if a majority of pledges are just base set. If they need to they can make a bundle deal later of buy the core and 3 add ons and get those 3 for cheaper (but make it a specific set of add ons).
Plus the high end trending of this KS is at $7.5 million, so I think they are okay
Quite frankly, CMoN should prefer KS$ upfront and direct, rather than giving wholesale discounts to product down the line. Also, retail is driven by KS backers seeding retail. The idea that they want a smaller KS makes little sense when they get far better economies of scale with a bigger KS.
At $120 + S&H base, CMoN pushed the price and value too far on this one. And the $40 Elemental expansion is exceedingly disappointing. But they have plenty of time to course correct. In the mean time, I look for an EB to drop out.
can't get the Dr. evil pic to link 
bigger just got bigger 
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