skullking wrote: I'm really looking forward to this set. I held off buying expensive abberants on ebay, or converting my own, so I'm ready to get some new models for sure. Plus more Acolyte hybrids, and another icon bearer is cool (though I'll have to come up with a different icon for this guy). I have a boatload of old purestrains, but they're all VERY old (I think I got most with the Tyrannid attack board game... ), so getting some that have different build options (like feeder tendrils and scything talons) will be useful.
Ask an AdMech player for the spare head from their Techpriest Dominus.
It's totally fitting for them to have a Techpriest head on a stick IMO.
still this box and dark Imperium is a GREAT place to start with space wolves.
That sounds like a grey painted Primaris Army. With the Faction Ability shown that isn't a particularly good combo with the Primaris units in those two boxes. Not trying to discourage you. Just think you will get more mileage from units that want to be in melee, or Faction Abilities that work better with the chose units.
Justyn wrote: That sounds like a grey painted Primaris Army. With the Faction Ability shown that isn't a particularly good combo with the Primaris units in those two boxes. Not trying to discourage you. Just think you will get more mileage from units that want to be in melee, or Faction Abilities that work better with the chose units.
Except this trait does little for assault units. For maximum mileage, you want something with strong shooting that then either assaults or is assaulted. Primaris (especially Aggressors) fit the bill much better than oldmarines, granted, their HQs might be better for heroic intervention but Wolf Lord in gravis armour is no slouch either. Depends on relics/traits I suppose.
still this box and dark Imperium is a GREAT place to start with space wolves.
That sounds like a grey painted Primaris Army. With the Faction Ability shown that isn't a particularly good combo with the Primaris units in those two boxes. Not trying to discourage you. Just think you will get more mileage from units that want to be in melee, or Faction Abilities that work better with the chose units.
yeah and I already have them, I've got 3 squads of grey Hunters, 1 squad of long fangs, 1 of wulfen, Bjorn, 1 thudnerwolf cavalry and a squad of terminators currently in progress. I'm not even thinking so much for me but yeah those two boxes combined are a good place to start. That said I maintain that for a space marine army the BEST place to start is Betrayal at Calth, this applies to space wolves now too as they can use the cataphracti and contemptor as what they are.
Call me an odd cookie, but I'm very curious to see what they do with this planet. The lore behind it sounds interesting.
And I've always found Genestealer Cults to be a fascinating enemy. Something about the, "Suddenly angry cult dudes with alien DNA are rising up and overthrowing the world" seems a bit more insidious and concerning than a typical chaos cult.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: Oh look, Wolves got a bunch of the Vanilla specific toys just like the Angel's did.
Seriously what's left that's unique to the Vanilla codex outside Ironclads, Centurions, and Thunderfire Cannons?
Gulliman (I know he's a special character but he's head and shoulders above most marine special chars so deserves mention), TFCs, Centurions, Ironclad Dreads,Crusader Squads (black templar only I know but worth mentioning)
but yeah I agree, the vanilla codex lost most of it's exclusive toys, on the other hand a lot of that was arbitrarily chosen to be only vanilla and didn't make a lot of sense, and in a lot of the cases these are niche things that they didn't already have (clearly to fill those niches without making new stuff or leaving those niches unfilled) I notice with the space wolves where the niche already ahs been filled it looks like they're not getting the base thing, for example, the spacewolves seem to be getting the stormhawk but no mention of the stormtalon. My HOPE is that GW's long term plan is to use Primaris Marines to develop the space marine factions along a more intuative level of split,
BrianDavion wrote: Gulliman (I know he's a special character but he's head and shoulders above most marine special chars so deserves mention)
Except, mon cher, unless you play Ultramarines, he does exactly as much for say Salamanders or IF as he does for SW/BA/DA. So, close but no cigar, try again.
but yeah I agree, the vanilla codex lost most of it's exclusive toys, on the other hand a lot of that was arbitrarily chosen to be only vanilla and didn't make a lot of sense
What doesn't make sense is speshul snowflakes getting ridiculous gimmicks and rules that either make no sense, or their lack on other SM makes no sense. See, for one, ridiculously stupid DA rule granting them better saves if they make shield wall - not only because these shields are way too small to even cover a TDA owner, never mind form continuous cover, but also because touching storm shields is rather explosively dumb idea and there is zero reason why other chapters can't wave shields in front of them pretending that makes for in any way better protection.
Maybe lack of Tartaros TDA in non-Codex chapters doesn't make that much sense, but so does lack of Deathwing/Wolfwolf equivalents in Codex armies. Why IH or Salamanders can't field TDA elite when their HH units were actually better than these wannabes? Seriously, just fluff it as DA/SW converting theirs into their speshul gimmicky armours and let each army have unique elite TDA unit of their own. As of now, though, not only Codex armies are gimped by everyone being able to take their exclusive toys, to add insult to injury, you can often hear DA (and soon SW) players saying 'lol, why would we take that junk, our elite units are much better anyway'. So, yeah. If GW really wants to sell kits that hard, how about giving the Codex armies access to speshul snowflake stuff? Call them 'Ultra Lords' or 'Fisting Wing' and call it a day. Something tells me that complainers who protested SM having any stuff of their own would be really unhappy if tables were turned on them
Seriously, why GW couldn't solve it like on CSM side, with TS having Tartaros, DG having Cataphracts, and other CSM having Indomitus without whining they want to also field other two...?
BrianDavion wrote: Gulliman (I know he's a special character but he's head and shoulders above most marine special chars so deserves mention)
Except, mon cher, unless you play Ultramarines, he does exactly as much for say Salamanders or IF as he does for SW/BA/DA. So, close but no cigar, try again.
but yeah I agree, the vanilla codex lost most of it's exclusive toys, on the other hand a lot of that was arbitrarily chosen to be only vanilla and didn't make a lot of sense
What doesn't make sense is speshul snowflakes getting ridiculous gimmicks and rules that either make no sense, or their lack on other SM makes no sense. See, for one, ridiculously stupid DA rule granting them better saves if they make shield wall - not only because these shields are way too small to even cover a TDA owner, never mind form continuous cover, but also because touching storm shields is rather explosively dumb idea and there is zero reason why other chapters can't wave shields in front of them pretending that makes for in any way better protection.
Maybe lack of Tartaros TDA in non-Codex chapters doesn't make that much sense, but so does lack of Deathwing/Wolfwolf equivalents in Codex armies. Why IH or Salamanders can't field TDA elite when their HH units were actually better than these wannabes? Seriously, just fluff it as DA/SW converting theirs into their speshul gimmicky armours and let each army have unique elite TDA unit of their own. As of now, though, not only Codex armies are gimped by everyone being able to take their exclusive toys, to add insult to injury, you can often hear DA (and soon SW) players saying 'lol, why would we take that junk, our elite units are much better anyway'. So, yeah. If GW really wants to sell kits that hard, how about giving the Codex armies access to speshul snowflake stuff? Call them 'Ultra Lords' or 'Fisting Wing' and call it a day. Something tells me that complainers who protested SM having any stuff of their own would be really unhappy if tables were turned on them
Seriously, why GW couldn't solve it like on CSM side, with TS having Tartaros, DG having Cataphracts, and other CSM having Indomitus without whining they want to also field other two...?
proably because all of them had indomatus armor from the start? Sides it's not like cataphracti and taratos armor was carefully measured and added for a balanced degree etc. it was added in because plastic models for it existed, no reason not to give it to everyone, hell IMHO give standard CSMs access to all 3 types too. Won't hurt anyone
Not really. There're three examples shown, none of them with a two-handed weapon - but there're four in the kit. The pair of arms with the scything talon isn't used either.
The "three example" is 3 pick, they give you 3 picks in the kit, and 3 hammers, and a stop sign. The scything talon is obscured by one of the aberrant\
What doesn't make sense is speshul snowflakes getting ridiculous gimmicks and rules that either make no sense, or their lack on other SM makes no sense. See, for one, ridiculously stupid DA rule granting them better saves if they make shield wall - not only because these shields are way too small to even cover a TDA owner, never mind form continuous cover, but also because touching storm shields is rather explosively dumb idea and there is zero reason why other chapters can't wave shields in front of them pretending that makes for in any way better protection.
Maybe lack of Tartaros TDA in non-Codex chapters doesn't make that much sense, but so does lack of Deathwing/Wolfwolf equivalents in Codex armies. Why IH or Salamanders can't field TDA elite when their HH units were actually better than these wannabes? Seriously, just fluff it as DA/SW converting theirs into their speshul gimmicky armours and let each army have unique elite TDA unit of their own. As of now, though, not only Codex armies are gimped by everyone being able to take their exclusive toys, to add insult to injury, you can often hear DA (and soon SW) players saying 'lol, why would we take that junk, our elite units are much better anyway'. So, yeah. If GW really wants to sell kits that hard, how about giving the Codex armies access to speshul snowflake stuff? Call them 'Ultra Lords' or 'Fisting Wing' and call it a day. Something tells me that complainers who protested SM having any stuff of their own would be really unhappy if tables were turned on them
Seriously, why GW couldn't solve it like on CSM side, with TS having Tartaros, DG having Cataphracts, and other CSM having Indomitus without whining they want to also field other two...?
Could you take your insulting rambling rant to another thread possibly please?
So the Cult Gunslinger model is still nowhere to be seen correct?
Retrieving the OG 13th Great Company from Prospero gives the SW a solid background reason for the two types of HH terminator armour becoming available. The Contemptor was already available, if only via FW.
The Hunter and Stalker as AA units make sense as inclusions, though I'm less convinced by the LSS, Scout Bikers and Storm-thingy Interceptor.
GW, for the codex can we pretty please have the little power pick that the neophyte leader gets just be a totally different weapon from the aberrant's power pick? Ever since it came out it's been A) the coolest looking weapon the neo leader can take and B ) overpriced in an absolutely goofalicious manner because of the fact that the only other platform available for it is a giant hulking-ass aberrant with a huge base strength and twice the attacks.
And now it has a bonus rule relating to Rending Claws, a thing that neophyte leaders don't even have. Please don't leave it the "same weapon" for the same price when you take it on the tiny scrawny cult leader.
Facebook picture detailing the SW Lieutenant's loadout. Sorry!
Spoiler:
Text:
Who is Haldor Icepelt?
Battle Leaders are Huskarls--senior members of the Wolf Guard and respected members of their Wolf Lord's war council. Battle Leaders are often given command of a strike force of the Great Company's warriors in the absence of its Wolf Lord. As a Primaris Battle Leader, Haldor Icepelt holds a rank roughly equivalent to a Primaris Lieutenant in other Chapters of the Adeptus Astartes.
Haldor Icepelt hails from Ragnar Blackmane's Great Company. In battle, Icepelt wields a bolt carbine(!!!) and a large power axe called Fellcleaver.
I'm wondering if Lieutenants, in general, are going to get access to more kit options with a generic boxed set coming sometime soon-ish.
Aberrants have been upgraded with a brand new kit, featuring a host of grisly customisation options, a choice of weapons and mutated brethren known as Hypermorphs – especially “gifted” Aberrants with special weapon options of their own, from their mutated tails to signposts.
Could this mean Abberants are going to be a double kit and this is a new unit? They sound unique
Aberrants have been upgraded with a brand new kit, featuring a host of grisly customisation options, a choice of weapons and mutated brethren known as Hypermorphs – especially “gifted” Aberrants with special weapon options of their own, from their mutated tails to signposts.
Could this mean Abberants are going to be a double kit and this is a new unit? They sound unique
Think thats fairly given with the hypermorph being an sargeant upgrade they previously didnt have
Aberrants have been upgraded with a brand new kit, featuring a host of grisly customisation options, a choice of weapons and mutated brethren known as Hypermorphs – especially “gifted” Aberrants with special weapon options of their own, from their mutated tails to signposts.
Could this mean Abberants are going to be a double kit and this is a new unit? They sound unique
Would make sense. Hybrids build Metamorphs as well, and get access to some different mutations.
Aberrants have been upgraded with a brand new kit, featuring a host of grisly customisation options, a choice of weapons and mutated brethren known as Hypermorphs – especially “gifted” Aberrants with special weapon options of their own, from their mutated tails to signposts.
Could this mean Abberants are going to be a double kit and this is a new unit? They sound unique
Think thats fairly given with the hypermorph being an sargeant upgrade they previously didnt have
That makes sense, so it would be like an optional upgrade to Abberants to give them a sergeant equivalent?
Kanluwen wrote: Facebook picture detailing the SW Lieutenant's loadout. Sorry!
Spoiler:
Text:
Who is Haldor Icepelt?
Battle Leaders are Huskarls--senior members of the Wolf Guard and respected members of their Wolf Lord's war council. Battle Leaders are often given command of a strike force of the Great Company's warriors in the absence of its Wolf Lord. As a Primaris Battle Leader, Haldor Icepelt holds a rank roughly equivalent to a Primaris Lieutenant in other Chapters of the Adeptus Astartes.
Haldor Icepelt hails from Ragnar Blackmane's Great Company. In battle, Icepelt wields a bolt carbine(!!!) and a large power axe called Fellcleaver.
I'm wondering if Lieutenants, in general, are going to get access to more kit options with a generic boxed set coming sometime soon-ish.
I would reaaaaaaaaallly like to see a "primaris commander" box ala the old space marine force commander
I'm wondering if Lieutenants, in general, are going to get access to more kit options with a generic boxed set coming sometime soon-ish.
I really hope so! The abysmal weapon options of the characters is my biggest gripe about the Primaris.
I think it's a common gripe of a lot of us. more specialist troops is something we can work with, but being able to customize your hero is a biiiiig part of 40k. at least for marines
I think it's a common gripe of a lot of us. more specialist troops is something we can work with, but being able to customize your hero is a biiiiig part of 40k. at least for marines
Yep. I don't mind the monoweapon units, but characters are something you really need to be able to customise. It is also a bit surreal that an Intercessor sergeant (which has gak weapon options) still has more weapon option than a Primaris Lieutenant.
I think it's a common gripe of a lot of us. more specialist troops is something we can work with, but being able to customize your hero is a biiiiig part of 40k. at least for marines
Yep. I don't mind the monoweapon units, but characters are something you really need to be able to customise. It is also a bit surreal that an Intercessor sergeant (which has gak weapon options) still has more weapon option than a Primaris Lieutenant.
I'm curious if the carbine is going to be master crafted.
You can make some pretty nasty combos with the abominant. A unit of maxed aberrants with picks, abominant and primus will be hitting on 2s with 2x attacks per model and exploding hits on a 5+. Combine that with either might from beyond or the primus’ ambush control abilities and you can make it even nastier. Or just put the unit in a transport and drive it right up the board.
Asmodas wrote: You can make some pretty nasty combos with the abominant. A unit of maxed aberrants with picks, abominant and primus will be hitting on 2s with 2x attacks per model and exploding hits on a 5+. Combine that with either might from beyond or the primus’ ambush control abilities and you can make it even nastier. Or just put the unit in a transport and drive it right up the board.
The exploding rule works on an unmodified dice role. Still strong tought. And maybe even more intersting weapon rule if it is also applied to the Acolytes or genestealers.
Asmodas wrote: You can make some pretty nasty combos with the abominant. A unit of maxed aberrants with picks, abominant and primus will be hitting on 2s with 2x attacks per model and exploding hits on a 5+. Combine that with either might from beyond or the primus’ ambush control abilities and you can make it even nastier. Or just put the unit in a transport and drive it right up the board.
The exploding rule works on an unmodified dice role. Still strong tought. And maybe even more intersting weapon rule if it is also applied to the Acolytes or genestealers.
Good catch. Still, use it with might from beyond to boost the aberrants to S6 and +1 attacks per model and you can have that unit pumping out a ton of attacks. Could be quite good against anything T6 or less.
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
Justyn wrote: So about that Power Axe. Is the Large just a descriptor, or are Primaris Melee weapons going to get a +1 as well as their shooting weapons.
likely just a descriptor, but given the axe has a name I suppose it's possiable the axe is eaither mastercrafted or a frost axe.
I doubt it though, so far the canon marine Lt Loadouts have been a Mastercrafted bolt rifle (auto or stalker) and pistol, that may replace the rifle with a power sword, Dark Angels can take a plasma Pistol as well or replacing their bolt pistol apparently (I'm curious if that was intended for everyone, codex space wolves will suggest one way or another I suspect ) now let's examine the Space Wolf Leuitenant in this context.
right first of all let's compare power swords and power axes. Powersword S - AP -3 D: 1. Power Axe: S +1. AP-2 D 1. This is honestly a preferance thing although I hear Power Axes are the better choice according to the mathhammer people (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)
Now here is where things get intreasting... the Bolt Carbine is a 24 inch, assault 2 gun. stat wise it's the same as the auto bolt rifle. although the Primaris Lt autobolt rifle is master crafted. so assuming the carbine isn't, the standard autogun Leuitenant will have better ranged firepower, but the SW Lt will be the best over all Leuitenant. if the axe or gun are master crafted, the SW Leuitenant will become the undisputed best Primaris Lt avaliable right now.
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
I could see some form of "the Lost and the Damned" coming out.
likely just a descriptor, but given the axe has a name I suppose it's possiable the axe is eaither mastercrafted or a frost axe.
I doubt it though, so far the canon marine Lt Loadouts have been a Mastercrafted bolt rifle (auto or stalker) and pistol, that may replace the rifle with a power sword, Dark Angels can take a plasma Pistol as well or replacing their bolt pistol apparently (I'm curious if that was intended for everyone, codex space wolves will suggest one way or another I suspect ) now let's examine the Space Wolf Leuitenant in this context.
right first of all let's compare power swords and power axes. Powersword S - AP -3 D: 1. Power Axe: S +1. AP-2 D 1. This is honestly a preferance thing although I hear Power Axes are the better choice according to the mathhammer people (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)
Now here is where things get intreasting... the Bolt Carbine is a 24 inch, assault 2 gun. stat wise it's the same as the auto bolt rifle. although the Primaris Lt autobolt rifle is master crafted. so assuming the carbine isn't, the standard autogun Leuitenant will have better ranged firepower, but the SW Lt will be the best over all Leuitenant. if the axe or gun are master crafted, the SW Leuitenant will become the undisputed best Primaris Lt avaliable right now.
The real questions are "Is the extra wound worth the loss of wargear choices? and "Will he get the Wolf Guard keyword"?
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
I could see some form of "the Lost and the Damned" coming out.
Maybe. I doubt it though.
I could see a thing being added for "Lost and the Damned" to replace <Regiment> ala "Brood Brothers" though.
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
Black Legion was mentioned as threatening vigilus. Chaos cultists could use a multipart kit, and it would not be hard to modify the assets from the cawdor gangers to chaos.
likely just a descriptor, but given the axe has a name I suppose it's possiable the axe is eaither mastercrafted or a frost axe.
I doubt it though, so far the canon marine Lt Loadouts have been a Mastercrafted bolt rifle (auto or stalker) and pistol, that may replace the rifle with a power sword, Dark Angels can take a plasma Pistol as well or replacing their bolt pistol apparently (I'm curious if that was intended for everyone, codex space wolves will suggest one way or another I suspect ) now let's examine the Space Wolf Leuitenant in this context.
right first of all let's compare power swords and power axes. Powersword S - AP -3 D: 1. Power Axe: S +1. AP-2 D 1. This is honestly a preferance thing although I hear Power Axes are the better choice according to the mathhammer people (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)
Now here is where things get intreasting... the Bolt Carbine is a 24 inch, assault 2 gun. stat wise it's the same as the auto bolt rifle. although the Primaris Lt autobolt rifle is master crafted. so assuming the carbine isn't, the standard autogun Leuitenant will have better ranged firepower, but the SW Lt will be the best over all Leuitenant. if the axe or gun are master crafted, the SW Leuitenant will become the undisputed best Primaris Lt avaliable right now.
The real questions are "Is the extra wound worth the loss of wargear choices? and "Will he get the Wolf Guard keyword"?
Suppose it depends, if you for example where inclined to just run a Lt with a Power Axe and bolt gun anyway it might be, keep in mind you also get a second attack with a Primaris Lt.
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
Black Legion was mentioned as threatening vigilus. Chaos cultists could use a multipart kit, and it would not be hard to modify the assets from the cawdor gangers to chaos.
Yup.
Like I said, I've been kinda/sorta thinking that November and December might end up being a case this year of "Here's some cool stuff that was missing kits and some stuff that previously was only in boxed sets!".
I'm wildly speculating, with the idea being "something that can be Chapter Approved or just FAQ'd in" :
A Primaris Lieutenant two model kit for 'generic' Marines, with a few of the weapon options we've seen on the Chapter specific ones(Plasma Pistols from Dark Angels and now Bolt Carbines with Space Wolves) that can be compatible with the Chapter specific upgrade kits. Possibly a plastic TFC kit?
Chaos Cultists and an Abaddon model.
The Cryptek with scarab boogyboard and Flayed Ones.
Genestealer Cults McCree and Aberrants.
AdMech Servitors in plastic(finally!) and some kind of new HQ
Stuff like that. Done properly, it'd be an interesting way to fill up a traditionally dead couple of months for new releases.
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
Black Legion was mentioned as threatening vigilus. Chaos cultists could use a multipart kit, and it would not be hard to modify the assets from the cawdor gangers to chaos.
Yup.
Like I said, I've been kinda/sorta thinking that November and December might end up being a case this year of "Here's some cool stuff that was missing kits and some stuff that previously was only in boxed sets!".
I'm wildly speculating, with the idea being "something that can be Chapter Approved or just FAQ'd in" :
A Primaris Lieutenant two model kit for 'generic' Marines, with a few of the weapon options we've seen on the Chapter specific ones(Plasma Pistols from Dark Angels and now Bolt Carbines with Space Wolves) that can be compatible with the Chapter specific upgrade kits. Possibly a plastic TFC kit?
Chaos Cultists and an Abaddon model.
The Cryptek with scarab boogyboard and Flayed Ones.
Genestealer Cults McCree and Aberrants.
AdMech Servitors in plastic(finally!) and some kind of new HQ
Stuff like that. Done properly, it'd be an interesting way to fill up a traditionally dead couple of months for new releases.
I could definatly see them putting out some new models at the end of the year and putting theri rules in chapter approved. It seems like a good idea over all
Suppose it depends, if you for example where inclined to just run a Lt with a Power Axe and bolt gun anyway it might be, keep in mind you also get a second attack with a Primaris Lt.
WGBL and Primaris LT both currently have 4 attacks. The WGBL also has Frag and Krak which the Primaris does not at least from what I see.
Phil Kelly also mentions that, aside from the Genestealer Cults, and the Orks, "Various cults have risen up in the darkness as well". Chaos renegades? (they did remove a lot of them from Forgeworld just recently) Eldar Ynnari cults? (they still need a codex, right?) It could be a reference to the special release plague marines too.
Has anyone heard anything about what these 'Other cults' are? Is there a chance we could get something other than orks, Genestealers, and SW?
I don't think they'd be full armies, but I would not be surprised if November sees some releases of some kits that would be big for Christmas.
Black Legion was mentioned as threatening vigilus. Chaos cultists could use a multipart kit, and it would not be hard to modify the assets from the cawdor gangers to chaos.
Yup.
Like I said, I've been kinda/sorta thinking that November and December might end up being a case this year of "Here's some cool stuff that was missing kits and some stuff that previously was only in boxed sets!".
I'm wildly speculating, with the idea being "something that can be Chapter Approved or just FAQ'd in" :
A Primaris Lieutenant two model kit for 'generic' Marines, with a few of the weapon options we've seen on the Chapter specific ones(Plasma Pistols from Dark Angels and now Bolt Carbines with Space Wolves) that can be compatible with the Chapter specific upgrade kits. Possibly a plastic TFC kit?
Chaos Cultists and an Abaddon model.
The Cryptek with scarab boogyboard and Flayed Ones.
Genestealer Cults McCree and Aberrants.
AdMech Servitors in plastic(finally!) and some kind of new HQ
Stuff like that. Done properly, it'd be an interesting way to fill up a traditionally dead couple of months for new releases.
I like these as potential adds to the campaign. Gives a lot of armies a little something to enjoy. I never thought about the servitors never having had a plastic kit, WOW that's over due! Especially with AdMech as an actual army now. Maybe they could make a plastic set that can be built as servitors or Necromunda pit fighters?
Kanluwen wrote: Like I said, I've been kinda/sorta thinking that November and December might end up being a case this year of "Here's some cool stuff that was missing kits and some stuff that previously was only in boxed sets!".
I sure hope so. I need a Guardian of Souls for my Nighthaunt and a Cryptek with Canoptek Cloak for my Necrons...
Kanluwen wrote: Like I said, I've been kinda/sorta thinking that November and December might end up being a case this year of "Here's some cool stuff that was missing kits and some stuff that previously was only in boxed sets!".
I sure hope so. I need a Guardian of Souls for my Nighthaunt and a Cryptek with Canoptek Cloak for my Necrons...
I think you might be outta luck on the Guardian of Souls for the time being The store birthday one seems to be 'the other one'.
I'm hoping that the still as yet unidentified eel bit from Idoneth is going to be tied to this on the AoS side of things.
Ghaz wrote: I'm thinking the eel may have been a prototyped bit that never made it onto the final kit.
Yet it somehow made it onto the website as part of the painted stuff? It might be--but the base also doesn't seem to be 'right' for a 32mm base(which the Namarti are on).
It's still on there, I might add. In case anyone's wondering what I'm referring to:
Spoiler:
This bit is not present in any of the Idoneth range. I own at least one of everything (barring Lotann) and it just plain isn't there.
I've been thinking it's for an Akhelian character that we haven't seen yet, as it was surprising that we didn't get a "character on big mount"--or heck, it's surprising we didn't get one on a plain old Fangmora Eel.
Any confirmation on the primaris stuff being regular kits with just a wolf upgrade sprue? Just looking to get that half to bolster my regular primaris army. I'd probably paint up the leader for fun.
Kalashnichris wrote: Any confirmation on the primaris stuff being regular kits with just a wolf upgrade sprue? Just looking to get that half to bolster my regular primaris army. I'd probably paint up the leader for fun.
Pretty sure they called it out as such at the start.
Kalashnichris wrote: Any confirmation on the primaris stuff being regular kits with just a wolf upgrade sprue? Just looking to get that half to bolster my regular primaris army. I'd probably paint up the leader for fun.
Yeah, they've outright said as much, and hinted that even for non space wolf players it's a great way to expand your primaris Army.
Suppose it depends, if you for example where inclined to just run a Lt with a Power Axe and bolt gun anyway it might be, keep in mind you also get a second attack with a Primaris Lt.
WGBL and Primaris LT both currently have 4 attacks. The WGBL also has Frag and Krak which the Primaris does not at least from what I see.
Well, the Primaris Lieutenants in Index Imperium 1 & Codex: SM both feature Frag & Krak grenades, so it'd be odd for the SW version not to.
I'd be stoked if the options for Primaris Lieutenants opened up Power Axes after this. But I also wouldn't be too bothered if it was a 'Space Wolf Only' thing, either.
Seems like every Lieutenant comes along and opens up a new weapon option for Primaris Sergeants from before...
...which I'm sure someone sees as a sign of the end times for the OldMarines being phased out.
Adeptus Doritos wrote: I'd be stoked if the options for Primaris Lieutenants opened up Power Axes after this. But I also wouldn't be too bothered if it was a 'Space Wolf Only' thing, either.
Seems like every Lieutenant comes along and opens up a new weapon option for Primaris Sergeants from before...
...which I'm sure someone sees as a sign of the end times for the OldMarines being phased out.
THE END IS NEIGH! REPENT ALL YOU SINNERS AND MAIL YOUR OLD MARINES TO ME!
people who think Old Marines are going anywhere need to consider that the space marine kits are not very old. The bsic Tac Squad kit was released with codex space marines 6th edition, and is thus only 5 years old (introdued in 2013) the assault marine and vestator squad kits are even newer, being only 3 years old, (released in 2015 with the 7th edition Marine Dex) Meanwhile they've also released betrayal at calath with the MK IV space marines, which was late 2015 and Burning of prosperio about a year later. which added MK 3 space Marines.
so yeah given that we've 20 year old kits, why anyone would assume brand new tac squads are going aywhere anytime soon...
BrianDavion wrote: people who think Old Marines are going anywhere need to consider that the space marine kits are not very old. The bsic Tac Squad kit was released with codex space marines 6th edition, and is thus only 5 years old (introdued in 2013) the assault marine and vestator squad kits are even newer, being only 3 years old, (released in 2015 with the 7th edition Marine Dex) Meanwhile they've also released betrayal at calath with the MK IV space marines, which was late 2015 and Burning of prosperio about a year later. which added MK 3 space Marines.
Being perfectly honest, I don't see "Regular Astartes" going away, either. I don't think it will be "Primaris replacing them" at all. I do have a weird and outlandish theory, but a few people agree so it can't be that crazy.
I think over time we will see the two lines slowly phased together. There won't be any "Primaris", they'll all just be different variations of Space Marines and things like Intercessors, Hellblasters, and Reivers will just be another 'squad type' rather than an entirely different type of Space Marine altogether.
Regular bolters will become bolt carbines, so you'd still be able to use them from your old kits. All the heads and shoulder pads are still interchangeable. A lot of parts are just easy to swap out and move around at will, so it's not like they're COMPLETELY incompatible as it is. I've not tested out making "Truescale" marines with any Primaris stuff and original Astartes, just a few head and hand swaps here and there, some shoulder pads obviously.
We'll just see new kits that make "Regular Astartes" bigger and feature the classic look from older armor types with longer legs and bigger arms/hips. They'll all be pretty similar in terms of size and all, and it'll at least keep people a bit less angry that they can use most of their old parts from classic marines to make 'bigger space marines' that are still pretty much Devastators, Assault Marines, Tacticals, etc.
So 'Primaris' will probably just be a footnote in the history of Space Marines, some phase where the geneseed flaws were worked on and stabilized, chapters were reinforced with troops of a new doctrine, and things will just sort of 'blend together' in terms of their differences (and perhaps even retconned entirely while keeping all the 'Formerly Known as Primaris' stuff around).
It really is such a bizarre policy. Like, functionally, what on earth is the difference between swapping in a bit from a Primaris model and swapping one in from a minimarine model? It's a kitbash either way, whether or not GW get money in any given individual case is unaffected, it doesn't help drive Primaris sales because once the equipment is "unlocked" people can just use any source of bits as they wanted to from the beginning.
BrianDavion wrote: people who think Old Marines are going anywhere need to consider that the space marine kits are not very old. The bsic Tac Squad kit was released with codex space marines 6th edition, and is thus only 5 years old (introdued in 2013) the assault marine and vestator squad kits are even newer, being only 3 years old, (released in 2015 with the 7th edition Marine Dex) Meanwhile they've also released betrayal at calath with the MK IV space marines, which was late 2015 and Burning of prosperio about a year later. which added MK 3 space Marines.
Being perfectly honest, I don't see "Regular Astartes" going away, either. I don't think it will be "Primaris replacing them" at all. I do have a weird and outlandish theory, but a few people agree so it can't be that crazy.
I think over time we will see the two lines slowly phased together. There won't be any "Primaris", they'll all just be different variations of Space Marines and things like Intercessors, Hellblasters, and Reivers will just be another 'squad type' rather than an entirely different type of Space Marine altogether.
Regular bolters will become bolt carbines, so you'd still be able to use them from your old kits. All the heads and shoulder pads are still interchangeable. A lot of parts are just easy to swap out and move around at will, so it's not like they're COMPLETELY incompatible as it is. I've not tested out making "Truescale" marines with any Primaris stuff and original Astartes, just a few head and hand swaps here and there, some shoulder pads obviously.
We'll just see new kits that make "Regular Astartes" bigger and feature the classic look from older armor types with longer legs and bigger arms/hips. They'll all be pretty similar in terms of size and all, and it'll at least keep people a bit less angry that they can use most of their old parts from classic marines to make 'bigger space marines' that are still pretty much Devastators, Assault Marines, Tacticals, etc.
So 'Primaris' will probably just be a footnote in the history of Space Marines, some phase where the geneseed flaws were worked on and stabilized, chapters were reinforced with troops of a new doctrine, and things will just sort of 'blend together' in terms of their differences (and perhaps even retconned entirely while keeping all the 'Formerly Known as Primaris' stuff around).
So do I, and I admit I may be more 'wishlisting' than I am pushing out a plausible theory with real concrete evidence that points toward it. But it does seem like things that Primaris didn't have when the Space Marine Codex dropped are starting to creep in with every release. First it was chainswords, then power swords, then plasma pistols and power fists, now a power axe and a 'bolt carbine' on a Lietenant.
So I wouldn't be shocked if we was other weapons systems gradually integrated into the Primaris line, like other power weapons, Heavy Bolters with a fancy name, and maybe even melta weapons or something.
I like Primaris Marines in terms of how they look, and that I've always thought regular marines were a disappointment and probably always should have had 2 wounds. But I figured that would be too much, I suppose. So I do hope there's some way to merge the classics with the new stuff.
Latro_ wrote: woot does that mean a lone terminator has 6 wounds?!
No you use this on a last survivor of a unit. So a lone terminator would jump from 2 wounds to 4 if he hadn't taken any damage. It's a fun stratagem but situational. I can see it being good if your opponent fails to clear all your grey hunters in the shooting phase and is relying on assault to get an objective from him, only for you to give him additional wounds and make it more difficult but generally I doubt it will see action over other better stratagems.
What looked nice to me was a captain with saga of the beastslayer and frostfury, bassically wounding vehicles and monsters on a 4+ and causing a mortal wound after. Pretty solid actually when you consider how cheap he would be, seems like a good trait for a warlord sitting back buffing your long fangs.
The big winner by far is living lightning though, late game that power can change games. I have won more then a few games because I have too many small units of fearless dark eldar around the objectives, that power has the ability to leap all over the table clearing away chaf remnants.
BTW how lame is it that this release happened mid week and is largely buried among this box game release? I wonder how many folks don't even realize this book is going on preorder lol.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Latro_ wrote: ah yea i read it wrong, kinda like increase the meter then fill it up.
Yea, it can't be a character either, I thought it would be sweet on a TWC but then noticed it's infantry only as well. It's more a flavor stratagem that once in a while could prove great, but I like those. I imagine they will also get the counter part to the dark angel stratagem about the wolf and lion as well.
Lone Wolf will win you games. If you have a remaining model, then suddenly become a character that can't be targeted unless they are closest and can go and hide on objectives, etc.
rollawaythestone wrote: Lone Wolf will win you games. If you have a remaining model, then suddenly become a character that can't be targeted unless they are closest and can go and hide on objectives, etc.
I could win games sure, I don't think anyone said it couldn't. I just think it is situational and fluffy, which is also good. I think it could get CP expensive though, if a unit gets shot down to 1 man and you burn a CP at the end of phase your probably not going to risk a moral check, so it can easily end up costing you 3CP.
Also, depending on mission format, in ITC for example, you could end up creating VP's by making another character out of a unit as well. Here have head hunter to boot.
Plus your opponent has to be tactically naive /unlucky enough to leave that lone squad member near an objective. That said it is a fun and fluffy strategem, I like it a lot. Hopefully the rest of the Codex lives up to the hopes of our Lupine brethren.
I'm looking at the armor of Russ and I'm thinking it's kina crap compared to just about every other relic suit of armor I've seen,. the 4++ is nice, but the lack of a 2+ armor save is dissappointing. Still handy way to get a 4++ save on a primaris battle leader I guess
Lone wolf will never get used, people can't help themselves burning command points on frivolous re-rolls. I really really really wish they would take command point re rolls out of the game, or just limited them to 1 per turn total, they are a significant reason to why stratagems are not used to their potential currently.
endlesswaltz123 wrote: Lone wolf will never get used, people can't help themselves burning command points on frivolous re-rolls. I really really really wish they would take command point re rolls out of the game, or just limited them to 1 per turn total, they are a significant reason to why stratagems are not used to their potential currently.
it'll get used, go over to the space wolves tactica thread on the tactics forum and you'll see there are a lotta people eager to use the ability just for the sheer fun factor. I don't think it will be judged "compeitive" and it's going to be the rare situation where you CAN use it, but it'll get used. it's fun and fluffy, a great little trick
This includes City of Traps rules, which simulate the devious Genestealer Cults’ methods of fighting on home turf
Wonder if this will be part of their Battleforged Benefits?
Sure it’s not for Kill Team? Setting traps is part of the scout phase rules.
This big box isn't a Kill Team box, so yes I'm fairly sure.
Always a time for the first time to include rules for more than one game in a single box. Would be a neat little addon, and besides the characters and Dread it’s all usuable in KT.
This includes City of Traps rules, which simulate the devious Genestealer Cults’ methods of fighting on home turf
Wonder if this will be part of their Battleforged Benefits?
Sure it’s not for Kill Team? Setting traps is part of the scout phase rules.
This big box isn't a Kill Team box, so yes I'm fairly sure.
Always a time for the first time to include rules for more than one game in a single box. Would be a neat little addon, and besides the characters and Dread it’s all usuable in KT.
Not disagreeing, but I think if it were meant to be for Kill Team they'd have pointed it out as a Kill Team rule. They tend to be pretty good about that kind of stuff.
This includes City of Traps rules, which simulate the devious Genestealer Cults’ methods of fighting on home turf
Wonder if this will be part of their Battleforged Benefits?
Sure it’s not for Kill Team? Setting traps is part of the scout phase rules.
This big box isn't a Kill Team box, so yes I'm fairly sure.
Always a time for the first time to include rules for more than one game in a single box. Would be a neat little addon, and besides the characters and Dread it’s all usuable in KT.
Not disagreeing, but I think if it were meant to be for Kill Team they'd have pointed it out as a Kill Team rule. They tend to be pretty good about that kind of stuff.
Agreed. If there were Kill Team rules that would be a selling point that they wouldn't forget to mention.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I love that Storm Bolter relic because, ya know, what other Chapter would deserve probably the best range relic in the entire frickin game?
I think the helfrost round special ability pushes it a bit over the top, if it had JUST been the stats it would have been a stormbolter equivilant of Primarch's Wraith, good but.... but yeah this absolutely is Better then Primarch's wraith... and my Wolflord conveniantly HAS a stormbolter.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I love that Storm Bolter relic because, ya know, what other Chapter would deserve probably the best range relic in the entire frickin game?
I think the helfrost round special ability pushes it a bit over the top, if it had JUST been the stats it would have been a stormbolter equivilant of Primarch's Wraith, good but.... but yeah this absolutely is Better then Primarch's wraith... and my Wolflord conveniantly HAS a stormbolter.
Even without the Helfrost part, Assault 4 makes it better than the S5, because now you can advance and fire. And I'll bet you anything they get a Strategem that'll let you advance and charge too!
Ghaz wrote: I'm thinking the eel may have been a prototyped bit that never made it onto the final kit.
Yet it somehow made it onto the website as part of the painted stuff? It might be--but the base also doesn't seem to be 'right' for a 32mm base(which the Namarti are on).
It's still on there, I might add. In case anyone's wondering what I'm referring to:
Spoiler:
This bit is not present in any of the Idoneth range. I own at least one of everything (barring Lotann) and it just plain isn't there.
I've been thinking it's for an Akhelian character that we haven't seen yet, as it was surprising that we didn't get a "character on big mount"--or heck, it's surprising we didn't get one on a plain old Fangmora Eel.
edit:NVM, the eel does look different. My mistake.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I love that Storm Bolter relic because, ya know, what other Chapter would deserve probably the best range relic in the entire frickin game?
I think the helfrost round special ability pushes it a bit over the top, if it had JUST been the stats it would have been a stormbolter equivilant of Primarch's Wraith, good but.... but yeah this absolutely is Better then Primarch's wraith... and my Wolflord conveniantly HAS a stormbolter.
Even without the Helfrost part, Assault 4 makes it better than the S5, because now you can advance and fire. And I'll bet you anything they get a Strategem that'll let you advance and charge too!
ahh my bad I thought Primarchs' wraith was assault 2 it's rapid fire 2. but yeah the additional STR damage is pretty situational. that said, (this BTW is a very VERY minor issue here but it's worth noting) the Primarch's wraith is a boltgun, conmpared with frost fury being a stormbolter. so space wolves DO pay an additional two points for their relic. Meanwhile, barring the codex changing it, the burning blade is straight up BETTER then the Krakenbone sword, and the Krakenbone sword is a frost sword so it would cost more to boot.
NZ$83? For 3 Plague Marine models? The other three are NZ$30? The regular Plague Marine box is NZ$16 more and you get 4 more miniatures and tons more options.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I love that Storm Bolter relic because, ya know, what other Chapter would deserve probably the best range relic in the entire frickin game?
I think the helfrost round special ability pushes it a bit over the top, if it had JUST been the stats it would have been a stormbolter equivilant of Primarch's Wraith, good but.... but yeah this absolutely is Better then Primarch's wraith... and my Wolflord conveniantly HAS a stormbolter.
Even without the Helfrost part, Assault 4 makes it better than the S5, because now you can advance and fire. And I'll bet you anything they get a Strategem that'll let you advance and charge too!
ahh my bad I thought Primarchs' wraith was assault 2 it's rapid fire 2. but yeah the additional STR damage is pretty situational. that said, (this BTW is a very VERY minor issue here but it's worth noting) the Primarch's wraith is a boltgun, conmpared with frost fury being a stormbolter. so space wolves DO pay an additional two points for their relic. Meanwhile, barring the codex changing it, the burning blade is straight up BETTER then the Krakenbone sword, and the Krakenbone sword is a frost sword so it would cost more to boot.
Doesn't the Krakenbone reroll all wounds? I'd argue that to be better than the AP-5 S+3.
NZ$83? For 3 Plague Marine models? The other three are NZ$30? The regular Plague Marine box is NZ$16 more and you get 4 more miniatures and tons more options.
WTF???
jesus and people thought AT was insanely expensive
Is that a reprint of the bizarre three collectors edition guys who came out shortly after the game was released? If I recall they were stupid expensive then, but the only way to get a plasma gun or something? (or a melta?). I think they came with a printed picture or something completely inane at the time.
Elbows wrote: Is that a reprint of the bizarre three collectors edition guys who came out shortly after the game was released? If I recall they were stupid expensive then, but the only way to get a plasma gun or something? (or a melta?). I think they came with a printed picture or something completely inane at the time.
They came in a special little collector's box with art prints of the design process for Death Guard stuff. Poxwalkers, Mortarion, Plague Marines, etc. They were not "the only way to get" anything specific, they were just an expensive little "collector's" item that had Blanche artwork and was apparently popular enough to warrant bringing back.
NZ$83? For 3 Plague Marine models? The other three are NZ$30? The regular Plague Marine box is NZ$16 more and you get 4 more miniatures and tons more options.
WTF???
It's The Plague Brethren which were always NZ$83. The only difference now is the kit doesn't come with the extra content.
That lightning power is awesome. It is going to win games. My last game it would have got three units. What works me is it is only 6 to cast yet doom bolt is somehow 9?
NZ$83? For 3 Plague Marine models? The other three are NZ$30? The regular Plague Marine box is NZ$16 more and you get 4 more miniatures and tons more options.
WTF???
It's The Plague Brethren which were always NZ$83. The only difference now is the kit doesn't come with the extra content.
I'm sure those will sell not at all
Automatically Appended Next Post:
xeen wrote: That lightning power is awesome. It is going to win games. My last game it would have got three units. What works me is it is only 6 to cast yet doom bolt is somehow 9?
BrookM wrote: Which is the average voice they do for their audio dramas.
I wouldn't know. I've never listened to one and even my Black Library books read count has dropped down to one in the last 12 months... and even then I skimmed it skipping the bolter porn.
Since this thread is effectively doubling as the Space Wolf codex thread, has anyone seen/heard about whether the Space Wolves get any special snowflake additions to their primaris entries beyond an axe? I'm curious if intercessors get chainswords. I doubt it as I haven't heard any mention of it on YouTube but most reviewers seem to be glossing over the primaris parts.
Since this thread is effectively doubling as the Space Wolf codex thread, has anyone seen/heard about whether the Space Wolves get any special snowflake additions to their primaris entries beyond an axe? I'm curious if intercessors get chainswords. I doubt it as I haven't heard any mention of it on YouTube but most reviewers seem to be glossing over the primaris parts.
they get chainswords yes, an easy way to check is by looking at the upgrade sprue
Since this thread is effectively doubling as the Space Wolf codex thread, has anyone seen/heard about whether the Space Wolves get any special snowflake additions to their primaris entries beyond an axe? I'm curious if intercessors get chainswords. I doubt it as I haven't heard any mention of it on YouTube but most reviewers seem to be glossing over the primaris parts.
they get chainswords yes, an easy way to check is by looking at the upgrade sprue
The sergeant does from the pics but I'm asking if every one of the intercessors can get them (whether for points or free as is traditional with SW). Regardless, the accessory sprue hasn't been posted here so it's good that you brought it up.
I have to say that I prefer the old one a little bit. The lack of a wolfshead backpack and wolf belt back torso is a bit disappointing. Hopefully the old one won't go OOP.
Since this thread is effectively doubling as the Space Wolf codex thread, has anyone seen/heard about whether the Space Wolves get any special snowflake additions to their primaris entries beyond an axe? I'm curious if intercessors get chainswords. I doubt it as I haven't heard any mention of it on YouTube but most reviewers seem to be glossing over the primaris parts.
they get chainswords yes, an easy way to check is by looking at the upgrade sprue
The sergeant does from the pics but I'm asking if every one of the intercessors can get them (whether for points or free as is traditional with SW). Regardless, the accessory sprue hasn't been posted here so it's good that you brought it up.
Spoiler:
I have to say that I prefer the old one a little bit. The lack of a wolfshead backpack and wolf belt back torso is a bit disappointing. Hopefully the old one won't go OOP.
no space wolf intercessors won't be able to take chainswords. they'd have mentioned it if they got addtional wargear. intercessors however have 2 attacks base anyway so we don't lose anything by upgrading from grey hunters
So I was flicking through the pictures of the contents on the GW webstore and I said to myself "Yep, full sprues of all the units." Then I saw the Genestealer sprue and I said to myself, "Oh, those desperately need to be redone." The Tyranids need new kits for almost all their units.
DarkSoldier wrote: So I was flicking through the pictures of the contents on the GW webstore and I said to myself "Yep, full sprues of all the units." Then I saw the Genestealer sprue and I said to myself, "Oh, those desperately need to be redone." The Tyranids need new kits for almost all their units.
Not all. Genestealers do, gants of both forms do, and they still need lictors, biovores, and pyrovores in plastic. The rest of the nid kits are fine. CSM, Orks, Eldar are all in the same boat or worse.
Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
H.B.M.C. wrote: Do 'Stealers need a re-do? I mean, does their kit have any gaps as far as options/weapons are concerned?
No, but it’s vile to assemble due to awful mould lines and the sprues are sparse in comparison to modern ones. I finally, finally assembled the last few of the pile I acquired years ago and hope to never assemble another! The retro ones from DW:Overkill were far crisper and more pleasant to put together.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Do 'Stealers need a re-do? I mean, does their kit have any gaps as far as options/weapons are concerned?
No, but it’s vile to assemble due to awful mould lines and the sprues are sparse in comparison to modern ones. I finally, finally assembled the last few of the pile I acquired years ago and hope to never assemble another! The retro ones from DW:Overkill were far crisper and more pleasant to put together.
But is it worth say having new stealer box rather than plastic pyrovore/biovore?
I don't think any post-2000 pladtic kit is so bad that the army would be better off replacing it than updating a metal/finecast unit to plastic. The stealers are fine anyway, they were on the high end of quality for their time.
Spending the weekend periodically refreshing Bits & Kits has paid off. Got to their Tooth and Claw stock before they even sent out a newsletter about it.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Do 'Stealers need a re-do? I mean, does their kit have any gaps as far as options/weapons are concerned?
No, but it’s vile to assemble due to awful mould lines and the sprues are sparse in comparison to modern ones. I finally, finally assembled the last few of the pile I acquired years ago and hope to never assemble another! The retro ones from DW:Overkill were far crisper and more pleasant to put together.
I agree with you that the overkill stealers were way better than the current kit’s stealers. Yet, I can’t really rate a re-do of that kit too highly compared to some other things I wish they’d do for Nids, such as lictors and shrikes.
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
Oh! Thank you, that's probably what I was doing. I'm back to being happy!
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
Oh! Thank you, that's probably what I was doing. I'm back to being happy!
I did the same thing and was going halfsies with a buddy.
We had planned on $160 since that was Forgebane's price.
I kept double checking to make sure I hadn't clicked on Australia's link.
Pleasantly surprised it was $150 in the end.
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
Oh! Thank you, that's probably what I was doing. I'm back to being happy!
I did the same thing and was going halfsies with a buddy.
We had planned on $160 since that was Forgebane's price.
I kept double checking to make sure I hadn't clicked on Australia's link.
Pleasantly surprised it was $150 in the end.
Hey, I did the same thing. I was disappointed and then happy. Part of me thinks they did it on purpose....
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
Or he was on the Canadian site. Us Canadians know how the Aussies feel.
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
Or he was on the Canadian site. Us Canadians know how the Aussies feel.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Do 'Stealers need a re-do? I mean, does their kit have any gaps as far as options/weapons are concerned?
No, but it’s vile to assemble due to awful mould lines and the sprues are sparse in comparison to modern ones. I finally, finally assembled the last few of the pile I acquired years ago and hope to never assemble another! The retro ones from DW:Overkill were far crisper and more pleasant to put together.
But is it worth say having new stealer box rather than plastic pyrovore/biovore?
Oh gods no, but that wasn’t the question I was answering. And nuGW prefers not to redo anyway.
I imagine the genestealer cult portion I am surprised that the rules for Abominat/new Abberants haven't even be hinted at frankly, since the SW codex got dumped late friday night/saturday morning. I guess that all the guys who get to preview the codex dont get to preview the actual product, so we'll be waiting until Wednesday/thursday when stores get their copies in.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Do 'Stealers need a re-do? I mean, does their kit have any gaps as far as options/weapons are concerned?
No, but it’s vile to assemble due to awful mould lines and the sprues are sparse in comparison to modern ones. I finally, finally assembled the last few of the pile I acquired years ago and hope to never assemble another! The retro ones from DW:Overkill were far crisper and more pleasant to put together.
But is it worth say having new stealer box rather than plastic pyrovore/biovore?
Oh gods no, but that wasn’t the question I was answering. And nuGW prefers not to redo anyway.
Thats not true. Plague Marines, Nurgle Beast, Ork Buggies, etc...
jifel wrote: I imagine the genestealer cult portion I am surprised that the rules for Abominat/new Abberants haven't even be hinted at frankly, since the SW codex got dumped late friday night/saturday morning. I guess that all the guys who get to preview the codex dont get to preview the actual product, so we'll be waiting until Wednesday/thursday when stores get their copies in.
it was up on the community site last night - Abberants with picks now also get to make a rending claw attack on top of the pick attacks, adn the Abominant's sledge is a S12 D6dmg (1-3 count as 3dmg) weapon with no penalties to hit.
He also has some anti-psyker capability via his little familiar on the base, but they didn't say what the rules actually were.
jifel wrote: I imagine the genestealer cult portion I am surprised that the rules for Abominat/new Abberants haven't even be hinted at frankly, since the SW codex got dumped late friday night/saturday morning. I guess that all the guys who get to preview the codex dont get to preview the actual product, so we'll be waiting until Wednesday/thursday when stores get their copies in.
it was up on the community site last night - Abberants with picks now also get to make a rending claw attack on top of the pick attacks, adn the Abominant's sledge is a S12 D6dmg (1-3 count as 3dmg) weapon with no penalties to hit.
He also has some anti-psyker capability via his little familiar on the base, but they didn't say what the rules actually were.
Sorry, I phrased that poorly. Haven't been leaked yet. Given that the SW codex and box set drop on the same day, I figured that they would both get leaked around the same time, but the SW book got revealed online two days ago with no GSC leaks in sight.
jifel wrote: I imagine the genestealer cult portion I am surprised that the rules for Abominat/new Abberants haven't even be hinted at frankly, since the SW codex got dumped late friday night/saturday morning. I guess that all the guys who get to preview the codex dont get to preview the actual product, so we'll be waiting until Wednesday/thursday when stores get their copies in.
it was up on the community site last night - Abberants with picks now also get to make a rending claw attack on top of the pick attacks, adn the Abominant's sledge is a S12 D6dmg (1-3 count as 3dmg) weapon with no penalties to hit.
He also has some anti-psyker capability via his little familiar on the base, but they didn't say what the rules actually were.
Sorry, I phrased that poorly. Haven't been leaked yet. Given that the SW codex and box set drop on the same day, I figured that they would both get leaked around the same time, but the SW book got revealed online two days ago with no GSC leaks in sight.
They went over some of the specifics on Warhammer Community. Exact details aren't given on some stuff(the Familiar notably) but it's very likely the guys getting books didn't get the boxed set.
Hanksingle wrote: Anyone else pale a little at Tooth and Claw going for 190? I was thinking I'd be happy at 150, and satisfied at 165 - but 190 for seven unique models and some upgrade sprues feels...like a lot.
It is 150 USD. You might be looking at the tooth and claw collection, which is box + codex SW
Oh! Thank you, that's probably what I was doing. I'm back to being happy!
Don't feel bad when i first looked it up I said the same thing. $190 I wasn't going to order it. $150 I did.
Anyone managed to find the Abominant sprue anywhere yet? Annoying that they still haven’t corrected the issue on the store page. Hoping for some customisation options!
jifel wrote: I imagine the genestealer cult portion I am surprised that the rules for Abominat/new Abberants haven't even be hinted at frankly, since the SW codex got dumped late friday night/saturday morning. I guess that all the guys who get to preview the codex dont get to preview the actual product, so we'll be waiting until Wednesday/thursday when stores get their copies in.
it was up on the community site last night - Abberants with picks now also get to make a rending claw attack on top of the pick attacks, adn the Abominant's sledge is a S12 D6dmg (1-3 count as 3dmg) weapon with no penalties to hit.
He also has some anti-psyker capability via his little familiar on the base, but they didn't say what the rules actually were.
Sorry, I phrased that poorly. Haven't been leaked yet. Given that the SW codex and box set drop on the same day, I figured that they would both get leaked around the same time, but the SW book got revealed online two days ago with no GSC leaks in sight.
They went over some of the specifics on Warhammer Community. Exact details aren't given on some stuff(the Familiar notably) but it's very likely the guys getting books didn't get the boxed set.
You really do need leaks. Points cost are the most important part, that abominant could be an auto-take or hot trash. We know every space wolf stratagem, power, and warlord trait, as well as their points costs. Far beyond what was previewed, but we do not know what the new costs or weapons of the Abberants are, or what the stats on the Abominant are, or his points.
I doubt it. These kinds of boxed sets are really just model-combinations and not much in the way of a new game, etc. I haven't seen any of the big channels get copies of Imperial Knight Renegades, or Forgebane, etc.
It's a shame we don't seem to have a <CULT> keyword (like a <CHAPTER> or <DYNASTY> keyword for subfaction bonuses). It looks like we won't have subfaction traits.
Bestial Vigor is now also a 5+ Feel No Pain, in addition to subtracting 1 from damage. The mindwyrm familiar is a -1 to psychic tests for non-Tyranid Psykers. The Abominant is 4 PL, so likely about 80pts. There's a decent amount of information to be gained just from the pages they've shown.
Aeneades wrote: Anyone managed to find the Abominant sprue anywhere yet? Annoying that they still haven’t corrected the issue on the store page. Hoping for some customisation options!
On a single sprue character? I’d severely doubt it. He’ll be mono build like the Wolf McWolfleader guy.
Abominant:
S6 WS3 5W 5T 3A
Regenerates D3 Wounds every round.
Mindwyrm Familiar grants "mini-Shadow in the Warp"
Bestial Vigor: Damage dealt is reduced by 1 for each time
AND a 5+ Feel No Pain
Well, damn...that's impressive.
It's a shame we don't seem to have a <CULT> keyword (like a <CHAPTER> or <DYNASTY> keyword for subfaction bonuses). It looks like we won't have subfaction traits.
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights, and Dark Angels all didn't see <Thingies> bits. I think GSC were never going to get <Thingy> simply because...well, it'd be weird right?
"We've risen up to be devoured by the great sky-gods!"
"OH NO IT'S THOSE GUYS WHO GET EATEN REALLY WELL!"
It just seems...odd to have Cults of Renown in that vein.
It's a shame we don't seem to have a <CULT> keyword (like a <CHAPTER> or <DYNASTY> keyword for subfaction bonuses). It looks like we won't have subfaction traits.
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights, and Dark Angels all didn't see <Thingies> bits. I think GSC were never going to get <Thingy> simply because...well, it'd be weird right?
"We've risen up to be devoured by the great sky-gods!"
"OH NO IT'S THOSE GUYS WHO GET EATEN REALLY WELL!"
It just seems...odd to have Cults of Renown in that vein.
While any individual cult may not be noteworthy because it's isolated and short-lived, it wouldn't be out of character to have a trait system based on the world that got infiltrated. Mining world, agri-world, hive world, stuff like that. That may not be enticing to GW because the models are heavily mining themed, though.
Personally I'm going to hold off of reading anything into the campaign set rules with the codex so far away. GW is notoriously paranoid about giving future stuff away and until I see proof to the contrary I'm going to assume these are solely meant to be compatible with the index, not the yet to be released codex.
Some of the recent background has described certain cults as being fairly widespread - across multiple systems, although perhaps not as a single political entity. I think any sub-factions will be for those "super-cults".
Abominant:
S6 WS3 5W 5T 3A
Regenerates D3 Wounds every round.
Mindwyrm Familiar grants "mini-Shadow in the Warp"
Bestial Vigor: Damage dealt is reduced by 1 for each time
AND a 5+ Feel No Pain
Well, damn...that's impressive.
In addition, Aberrants now get the 5++ too. No change in power value, although the unit size is now 5+5 rather than 4+4. You can upgrade one to a Hypermorph (basically a sergeant) which has +1 standard attack and a bonus AP-1 tail attack. The "improvised weapon" is Sx2, AP-1, D2 and makes 2 hit rolls per attack but is -1 to hit.
So a Hypermorph attacking with the signpost near an Abominant gets the tail attack and six S10 AP-1 D2 attacks hitting on 4+, with each natural six to hit landing two hits.
Abominant:
S6 WS3 5W 5T 3A
Regenerates D3 Wounds every round.
Mindwyrm Familiar grants "mini-Shadow in the Warp"
Bestial Vigor: Damage dealt is reduced by 1 for each time
AND a 5+ Feel No Pain
Well, damn...that's impressive.
In addition, Aberrants now get the 5++ too. No change in power value, although the unit size is now 5+5 rather than 4+4. You can upgrade one to a Hypermorph (basically a sergeant) which has +1 standard attack and a bonus AP-1 tail attack. The "improvised weapon" is Sx2, AP-1, D2 and makes 2 hit rolls per attack but is -1 to hit.
So a Hypermorph attacking with the signpost near an Abominant gets the tail attack and six S10 AP-1 D2 attacks hitting on 4+, with each natural six to hit landing two hits.
So, which weapon is better, the improvised or the other?
xttz wrote: So a Hypermorph attacking with the signpost near an Abominant gets the tail attack and six S10 AP-1 D2 attacks hitting on 4+, with each natural six to hit landing two hits.
xttz wrote: So a Hypermorph attacking with the signpost near an Abominant gets the tail attack and six S10 AP-1 D2 attacks hitting on 4+, with each natural six to hit landing two hits.
Why is a signpost better than a powerhammer/pick?
because it stops the enemy in their tracks, showing them that there's only one way to react to the Cult: yield.
xttz wrote: So a Hypermorph attacking with the signpost near an Abominant gets the tail attack and six S10 AP-1 D2 attacks hitting on 4+, with each natural six to hit landing two hits.
Why is a signpost better than a powerhammer/pick?
Theres nothing more powerfull than workplace safety.
xttz wrote: So a Hypermorph attacking with the signpost near an Abominant gets the tail attack and six S10 AP-1 D2 attacks hitting on 4+, with each natural six to hit landing two hits.
Why is a signpost better than a powerhammer/pick?
Theres nothing more powerfull than workplace safety.
oh MAN my sign is going to be a "days without an accident" sign for sure.
It's a shame we don't seem to have a <CULT> keyword (like a <CHAPTER> or <DYNASTY> keyword for subfaction bonuses). It looks like we won't have subfaction traits.
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights, and Dark Angels all didn't see <Thingies> bits. I think GSC were never going to get <Thingy> simply because...well, it'd be weird right?
"We've risen up to be devoured by the great sky-gods!"
"OH NO IT'S THOSE GUYS WHO GET EATEN REALLY WELL!"
It just seems...odd to have Cults of Renown in that vein.
A) First point is wrong, half of them do have subfaction traits (which is why Phoros, Seth, and Dante can't be combined in one BA detachment), B ) You know the exact same point applies to tyranids, right? Every single tyranid army that wins is eaten to the last drone. In fact, compared to literally everyone else GSC is the faction that should have subfactions, because you can divide them in dozens of fluffy ways - tactics, gene traits, kind of worlds they infiltrate, social strata they target, they are literally the most diverse faction in the setting and them not having these would be a real shame...
Tyranids have Hyve Fleets adaptations... the army isn't important. Is the tendril what evolves.
Genestealer Cults normally aren't devoured if they are sucesfull. The biggest Genestealer Cults infect other worlds before being consumed by the Hive Mind, so it totally makes sense to have "famous" Genestealer Cults (We have those already, like the Cult of the Four Arms Emperor or whatever it is called) that have infected many other worlds.
It's a shame we don't seem to have a <CULT> keyword (like a <CHAPTER> or <DYNASTY> keyword for subfaction bonuses). It looks like we won't have subfaction traits.
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights, and Dark Angels all didn't see <Thingies> bits. I think GSC were never going to get <Thingy> simply because...well, it'd be weird right?
"We've risen up to be devoured by the great sky-gods!"
"OH NO IT'S THOSE GUYS WHO GET EATEN REALLY WELL!"
It just seems...odd to have Cults of Renown in that vein.
A) First point is wrong, half of them do have subfaction traits (which is why Phoros, Seth, and Dante can't be combined in one BA detachment)
So you have an example of the Successor Chapter rules with Blood Angels.
Do Flesh Tearers change their rules to the point of being another faction? Do Death Guard have Successors? How about Thousand Sons?
You gave Blood Angels alone as an example.
B ) You know the exact same point applies to tyranids, right? Every single tyranid army that wins is eaten to the last drone. In fact, compared to literally everyone else GSC is the faction that should have subfactions, because you can divide them in dozens of fluffy ways - tactics, gene traits, kind of worlds they infiltrate, social strata they target, they are literally the most diverse faction in the setting and them not having these would be a real shame...
Hive Fleets have unique traits. Each Hive Fleet that's been observed has had some kind of distinctive mechanism that was unique to it.
GSCs, while they might have what you're viewing as unique things might not have key features that would make for a more interesting army.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Galas wrote: Tyranids have Hyve Fleets adaptations... the army isn't important. Is the tendril what evolves.
Genestealer Cults normally aren't devoured if they are sucesfull. The biggest Genestealer Cults infect other worlds before being consumed by the Hive Mind, so it totally makes sense to have "famous" Genestealer Cults (We have those already, like the Cult of the Four Arms Emperor or whatever it is called) that have infected many other worlds.
The "rising up" part of the GSC is when they trigger what amounts to a giant psychic beacon.
It's important to make a distinction between "famous cults" and "common threads". "Cult of the Four Armed Emperor" seems to be a recurring trend, not necessarily an actual Cult if that makes sense. The big thing that tends to 'escape' from the Hive Fleets are the Genestealers themselves--fleeing in advance of them.
It's a shame we don't seem to have a <CULT> keyword (like a <CHAPTER> or <DYNASTY> keyword for subfaction bonuses). It looks like we won't have subfaction traits.
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights, and Dark Angels all didn't see <Thingies> bits. I think GSC were never going to get <Thingy> simply because...well, it'd be weird right?
"We've risen up to be devoured by the great sky-gods!"
"OH NO IT'S THOSE GUYS WHO GET EATEN REALLY WELL!"
It just seems...odd to have Cults of Renown in that vein.
A) First point is wrong, half of them do have subfaction traits (which is why Phoros, Seth, and Dante can't be combined in one BA detachment)
So you have an example of the Successor Chapter rules with Blood Angels.
Do Flesh Tearers change their rules to the point of being another faction? Do Death Guard have Successors? How about Thousand Sons?
You gave Blood Angels alone as an example.
B ) You know the exact same point applies to tyranids, right? Every single tyranid army that wins is eaten to the last drone. In fact, compared to literally everyone else GSC is the faction that should have subfactions, because you can divide them in dozens of fluffy ways - tactics, gene traits, kind of worlds they infiltrate, social strata they target, they are literally the most diverse faction in the setting and them not having these would be a real shame...
Hive Fleets have unique traits. Each Hive Fleet that's been observed has had some kind of distinctive mechanism that was unique to it.
GSCs, while they might have what you're viewing as unique things might not have key features that would make for a more interesting army.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Galas wrote: Tyranids have Hyve Fleets adaptations... the army isn't important. Is the tendril what evolves.
Genestealer Cults normally aren't devoured if they are sucesfull. The biggest Genestealer Cults infect other worlds before being consumed by the Hive Mind, so it totally makes sense to have "famous" Genestealer Cults (We have those already, like the Cult of the Four Arms Emperor or whatever it is called) that have infected many other worlds.
The "rising up" part of the GSC is when they trigger what amounts to a giant psychic beacon.
It's important to make a distinction between "famous cults" and "common threads". "Cult of the Four Armed Emperor" seems to be a recurring trend, not necessarily an actual Cult if that makes sense. The big thing that tends to 'escape' from the Hive Fleets are the Genestealers themselves--fleeing in advance of them.
Cults will take their fanatical crusade to spread their Genestealer brethren to the stars. The Primus will lead military expeditions to spread the Cult out to other planets.
The hive fleet eat the cult if they invade the system successfully. The cult need to spread over the whole star system before they call a fleet, and that'd take a very long time. That's why most cults didn't call the fleet after they took over a planet. Took over a planet is no simple task, most cults will be stuck in a constant state of war.
The only exception to this is if a hive fleet plan to attack a system, the cult will reveal themselves to assist.
So havin it here.
Metamorphweapons are still ...well not good.
The big one comes for 80 points.
The rest stays the same points as in the index.
Which, and before rage think at that, means nothing, because the codex will update ...well something at least I hope.
Seito O wrote: So havin it here.
Metamorphweapons are still ...well not good.
The big one comes for 80 points.
The rest stays the same points as in the index.
Which, and before rage think at that, means nothing, because the codex will update ...well something at least I hope.
What are the points for the new Abberant weapons? Sign post especially...
Why would the absence of "cult tactics" in Tooth&Claw be indicative of the future codex? Datasheets will all be updated in the codex, there's no need to print a large part of future mechanics just for this 1 new unit in an army box.
Definitely picking this up, was going to buy a box of aggressors and a rule book anyways so might as well just get this set and flog the GSC... Although the guy with the road sign very much appeals to me.
), so getting some that have different build options (like feeder tendrils and scything talons) will be useful. 
I am surprised that the rules for Abominat/new Abberants haven't even be hinted at frankly, since the 
