Ive been hearing mixed results on the Defiler. Now I have multiple Deffy's but im not entirely sure that I want to run them. Whats your thoughts on it

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/238097.page

As to defilers, they look amazing, that's all you need

But for 150 points id like somthing that didnt have 12 armour in front and on sides. plus considering what it can do its armour is what kills it

Like a lot of Chaos stuff, overpriced and underwhelming. But with a battlecannon and 4 DCCWs, it can rip faces off if it gets left alone. Big "IF" there. Your army list needs to have plenty of other threats or someone will plink those defilers right off the board.

Love 'em. I have 3. I would have 4 if I could.



"RAAAARWWW!"

I've never really been a fan of them and I have to say that I do not entirely think that the Battlecannon fits into the Chaos Army. The reason why I don't favor them, or dreads for that matter is that they are not survivable by themselves. To get the full effect from them you need something bigger or meaner than them to make them survivable or take multiple Defilers which then starts draining points very quickly.

I have found a Defiler is most survivable when coupled with something like a Land Raider.

Generalstoner wrote:I've never really been a fan of them and I have to say that I do not entirely think that the Battlecannon fits into the Chaos Army. The reason why I don't favor them, or dreads for that matter is that they are not survivable by themselves. To get the full effect from them you need something bigger or meaner than them to make them survivable or take multiple Defilers which then starts draining points very quickly.

I have found a Defiler is most survivable when coupled with something like a Land Raider.

In a vacuum defilers are not survivable by themselves no. However when you consider that most chaos lists have at least 2 - 3 rhinos full of some very dangerous troops along with a defiler or two then target priority becomes an issue and the defilers survival rate goes up. Then add cover saves to the equation and all the viable threats to the actual defiler. Now decide how survivable they are.

Two defilers cost 300 points. A landraider and a defiler cost 370. With the current chaos codex most heavy slots are taken in pairs. If your gunna take a defiler, take two. Two landraiders, never take 1. And so on and so forth. It really depends on your list, but two defilers is very scary to a horde list. And with 5 strength 10 attacks, they are scary in CC too.

Also, one of my favorite lists i ever ran with chaos marines was a walker spam list, 3 defilers and 3 dreads at 1500 points.

i have to say when i play against chaos (i play eldar mostly) i do go to nuke those defilers... yeas 150pts is alot but like the previous posts got cc and it has a battle cannon.... i remember the first time i played against one i didnt quite realise what it was armed with and my beautiful da got turned to gooey paste.... I dont play chaos, so i cant tell you have best to make use of them but from my experience they draw alot of fire power away from the rhinos full of bezerks.... this make them a great distraction or for horde based armies a primary target.

anarchy

I looooove them. I'm currently running 3 in my 1750 and my 2000 list, run 2 in my 1500 list.

I'm not sure they if they make up their points every game, but they dramatically change the tactics my opponent has to use. I did notice that going from 2 to 3 defilers gave me an awful lot of control over the board. 3 of those battle cannons is going to melt something's face, no if's, and's, or but's.

I'm not sure I agree with 150 points being expensive. My troop squads kitted out are all well over 200 points (+rhino cost!!). My headquarters are between 150 and 200 points. A *throwaway* termicide group costs what, 110-125? My other heavy options either weigh in at...150 points for 2 oblits, 130(ish) for a auto/laz pred (Which to be honest, I've had pitiful luck with)? That 150 points buys you pretty much everything you need - there aren't any more points you need to dump into it to upgrade with what you need, it all comes standard.

I'm a little surprised at how many folks say defilers are made of paper mache, glass, and broken dreams. They're never struck me as all that fragile. First, they have insane range. With a good size board (4x8) you should have 2 or 3 turns of blasting away before even the longest range special weapons start to creep into range. You can creep around while shooting that big gun too, I've found them much more movile than pillbox predators and slow and purposeful Oblits. AV12 isn't the easiest thing to crack - perfectly doable mind you, but you still have to roll a 3 or 4+ with most special weapons. Cover is a pain in the butt because they're so freakin' big, but they do have smoke launchers. I can usually find one or two spots on the board that will give me a decent cover save and line of fire both for at least one defiler, then can manufacture cover by sticking rhinos or something in front of the others and using their smoke for a bit more cover. Anyway, if they manage to get a good hit on, YOU IGNORE 1/3 OF THE DAMAGE TABLE!. That's crazy useful. Glancing hits are pretty much irrelevant and the odds are in your favor for a penetrating. Because they're walkers, assault troops don't get a free ride like they do against your preds.

The only thing I've really found to be a pain is anti-tank deepstrikers, but honest, Land Raiders have trouble with anti-tank deepstrikers, so what are you going to do?

I've read before that folks don't like their "generalist" abilities. I think that's an interesting position. They're the best (Only?) long-range option in the Chaos Codex (Oblits reign supreme for Mid-range, no denying) and they're pretty darn good in close combat against anything that's not a MC or another walker. I3 sucks, but considering that you're mostly going to be worried about I1 powerfists it's really not an issue. Hell, you can even use the Defiler as a legitimate tank killer if you can get them in range of an assault (Fleet helps).

The only thing they're really awful against is Monsterous Creatures. Hordes and Light armor they're great against. They can damage heavy armor and walkers.

I do not know if 2 Defilers/2-3 Oblits are the best loadout or 3 Defilers. So far I'm really liking the 3 Defiler setup though.

I love my defiler, and it's one of my most survivable units.

If your army has 2 lash princes a defiler will not get shot at much.

Personally I go with 4CCW and I hide mine in a building along with my havocs. 12/12/10 is very survivable when it's 50% obscured for a 4+ cover save, and that is very easy to do with GW buildings because the defiler's head and gun can see over the top of a GW building for a clear shot out, while shots in can see less than 50% of the defiler. It keeps pesky fast moving assault units away from my havocs. The same tactic will work with obliterators, but with a power fist on each obliterator they need the defiler less than the havocs.

At 1,500 points they're great. I always run 2 at 1,500 points, and a possessed Vindi. Those 3 nasty pieplates make a mess out of anything when combined with a lash prince.

Once you start getting above 1,500 points, though, Obliterators become the better choice as at higher points, you're strapped for FOC slots, not points.

Im considering taking 3 squads of 3 obliterators for my heavies.

ghargatuloth wrote:Im considering taking 3 squads of 3 obliterators for my heavies.

well thats 675 points, i hope your not putting that in a 1500 list.

For what you pay, defiler's are quite good. By no means are they the most competitive Heavy Support choice (that goes to Obliterators), however they are still quite good, providing a mix of ranged and CC ability as well as armour saturation. I'd use them in semi-competitive (or even fully competitive) games all the time, however Obliterators are better in almost all cases. I just love the look and game play of Defilers.

Hence, Competitive = Obliterators. Any thing = Defilers.

Defilers have never failed me when I committed them correctly. If you can nail a meq unit with the battle cannon while you're moving up and then get into CC with all those DCCWs then they can work wonders. I run mine with 3 CCW, Battlecannon, and TL heavy flamers. Battle cannon for when they're hiking across the field, hvy flamer for the turn they assault. Never failed me.

Defilers are great you will always be amazed on how much people shoot at them. Everyone really hates battlecannons for some reason... Just always run them in at least pairs otherwise you are asking for trouble.

I personally like this HS setup:
3 Defilers or 2 Defilers 3 Obliterators or 9 Obliterators or 3 oblits, 1 defiler, and 1 vindicator. I never really like havos/predators/LR's as much in the heavy slot.

ps 9 Oblits + 2 Lash Princes = plasma cannon fun

I think defilers are great. Take 2-3. Battlecannons are helpful when you need them, auto cannons are great for popping transports and they have fleet and lots of attacks when they need to get in close. Also, daemon possession, along with the fact that they have 5 weapons, basically means that they have a 4+ from results on the damage table, since a 1 or a 2 will do nothing and it takes 4 weapon destroyed results to render a defiler non threatening.

If you do take the Defiliers, also consider what other threads you can field with all your heavy slots filled.

Double Daemon Prince and a Greater Daemon are really good threats which only add another 400 points to your list.

Put some Termies in a Land Raider (depending on your point level) and throw everything else in Rhinos and speed up to your opponent. If you put enough things in their face, the Defiliers will be ignored while more threatening things are shot at/assaulted.

I've found that Defilers are extremely easy to pop, based on the AV12 and the model's physical size.

Even in a CSM list my friend ran for a while- (2x DPs, Dreadnought and Defiler), i knocked the Defiler out first turn all three games due to it being the only thing on the board that couldnt be completely obscured by most terrain.... Of course this does come down to how you model your Defiler, but still.

Well, anytime you present your opponent with only two targets those two targets are dead.

^ yes.
Armor/Target Saturation is paramount in general.

I find that I only expect one shot from it...so to make sure I get one shot, it usually hangs in reserves as I do not always rely on having enough blocking line of sight for the hulking thing.

But...to be frank, I only got the Defiler cause I liked the modelling project, not exactly for board performance.

While Defilers look great at the battle field, they are not often seen in competitve CSM armies.
They might have a place in walker-heavy CSM forces.

If someone wants to destroy it, it's not that hard. It's only AV12. However, most results even on penetrating hits are rather inconsequential.

It ignores Shaken and Stunned, a Weapon Destroyed result isn't the end of the world if you're running all DCCWs, and even immobilized still lets you fire that Battle Cannon assuming it hasn't been knocked off. So really there's only a 1/3 chance in taking it out of the fight on a penetrating hit, and a 1/3 chance of doing absolutely nothing to it. Meanwhile, all the shots going at it are not going at your other things, like your Rhinos or Princes.

I find that a pair is well worth 300 points. Especially coupled with lash princes, a pair can go a long way. Against a Strakken Blob guard list the other day, the combination was horrifying. Jump 12, lash 24, guardsmen clustered up and no longer in cover, 2 battlecannons, squad's basically rendered ineffective.

Well, I think that a mech CSM force will eventually favor Vindicators instead of Defilers.
On the other hand, Obliterators are great when it comes to fire support and they hardly can be overlooked.

Too big, dies instantly.

I'm intrigued with the Defiler. I run one in my Khorne army and it usually lives the whole game. Alas as others have said that could be because there are much more threatening targets on the table.

I'm considering running a chaos list with 2 Defilers, 2 Dreads and 2 Princes. The rest of the army will form a shooting castle while those 6 units run up the board and into the enemy lines. I think in that configuration, 6 power cc units together, they can present a major threat and some of them will break through to the enemy lines.

why one earth would you run a dread? Whenever i play with 1 it blows my tanks up, and it still starts on the other side of my deployment zone. but the reason defilers die is because they are scary

ghargatuloth wrote:why one earth would you run a dread? Whenever i play with 1 it blows my tanks up, and it still starts on the other side of my deployment zone. but the reason defilers die is because they are scary

Let them die. They take an inordinate amount of fire, ignore Crew Shaken and Crew Stunned results, they don't care much about weapon destroyed, and if they're immobilized they've still got a Battle Cannon to play with!

Chaos Dreads with 2xCCW's are very cheap, and less likely to blow your own stuff up. Plus with their front fire arc only extending 45 degrees, the liklihood of them wrecking your own stuff is greatly affected by what you put in front of them.

gharg
I dont like defilers. they attract alot of fire and arent tough enough to withstand it. the close combat ability is kind of unimportant if the thing never lives long enough to get stuck in....

agree with you about dreads. they, like so much else in the current edition of our book, are silly.
AF

I like the Defiler

Sure it's a prime target, but laying waste with the BC while advancing to tear people apart in CC is always worth it

but the problem is that the Defiler is a CC unit with a long range weapon. to me that does not compute

ghargatuloth wrote:but the problem is that the Defiler is a CC unit with a long range weapon. to me that does not compute

It just means the defiler is multi-functional. Generally i go all CC arms and Battlecannon. Then i deploy as close to enemy as possible. Move and shoot as much as possible, if the battle cannon is blown off he fleets to victory! Usually works pretty well for me.

if i run 1, usually I will run it behind either a LR or 2 rhinos and pop smoke. that way it gets cover saves.

Obliterators are not more competitive or better than Defilers, Obliterators are just a lot easier to use than Defilers. If you know how to use a defiler a player can get more out of a defiler than it's equal cost in Obliterators (which is only 2 obliterators) Oblits are very easy to use, but they pay for that in the form of a high point cost. Obliterators are also very expensive for a single lascannon or single plasma cannon shot.

AV12 vehicles behind cover are difficult to pop, and defilers in cover are rarely shot at early in the game as long as lash princes are alive and Rhinos still have troops inside.

The best compliment I've ever received is opponents calling my list "soft" at a tournament after I've won games. I run very light on heavy support in 2k games at a little over 300 points (defiler+ 1 squad of ML havocs). The heart of my army is mechanized troops supported by 3MC, along with the bulk of my points. I run a single firebase of the defiler, havocs, and a single PM squad with plasma guns to hold an objective in my deployment zone. Every other point in my army is invested into MC and my mechanized assault element. Most armies are so busy dealing with my troops and MC that they never get around to dealing with my firebase. Long range firepower against the firebase has to deal with a 4+ cover save, and as long as it's shooting at units in a 4+ cover save it's not shooting at my troops or MC. Assaulting the firebase is very difficult for a single unit because it could have to deal with a defiler, PM, 2 plasmaguns, and 4ML.

PM are a required element for the chaos firebase because in many missions the firebase will be on an objective, and a scoring unit on the objective is needed to win. If the PM are going to be on a static objective plasma guns work out well because they can reach out 24", and if anything starts to get close they can double tap. The weakness of PM are assault units with a lot of power weapons, and the weakness of assault units with a lot of power weapons tends to be walkers. The 2 units compliment each other quite well, and as long as the PM are on the ground floor there is still room on the top floor for Obliterators or Havocs. The addition of Oblits would make the firebase even more difficult to assault. 4 ML Havocs have more anti light/medium vehicle damage than 2 oblits (which is why I use them), but Obliterators would be far easier to use. The weakness of Obliterators in CC are units with a lot of power weapon attacks, the weakness of units with a lot a lot of power weapons are walkers. When bunkered down in a building Oblits & a defiler go together like peanut butter & jelly.

A firebase with a defiler, 3 oblits, and PM offers 3 units that complement and defend each other very well, and they will all benefit from a 4+ cover save against long ranged firepower. People can say it's "Not competitive" are either not effectively using defilers, or have never seen them used effectively.

1 defiler 1 land raider seems to be OK. Let your enemy choose which one to shoot at, and the usually choose the defiler - it's cheaper, but far spikier! Then the LR can just roll up the middle unmolested. Sad to use the defiler as a big bullseye, but most foes are terrified of seeing it reach base to base contact with their precious troops...

In a 2000+ army I run 3 Defilers and a small Termy squad in a LR. I hide a Defiler behind a smoked LR and make them choose then. Oh, it's fun to watch them deliberate in their shooting phase knowing a lot of pain is in store for them!

schadenfreude wrote:Obliterators are not more competitive or better than Defilers, Obliterators are just a lot easier to use than Defilers. If you know how to use a defiler a player can get more out of a defiler than it's equal cost in Obliterators (which is only 2 obliterators) Oblits are very easy to use, but they pay for that in the form of a high point cost. Obliterators are also very expensive for a single lascannon or single plasma cannon shot.

But I have run lists before with all obliterators and I get more out of them then I have in the past with my defilers.

ghargatuloth wrote:but the problem is that the Defiler is a CC unit with a long range weapon. to me that does not compute

That sounds like a good arrangement to me. If the Defiler was all CC and no guns, it would be useless in some games, as would the reverse be true also. There are some armies you want to get into HtH with and there are some armies you don't. The Defiler can have an active role against either type of opponent.

DarthDiggler wrote:

ghargatuloth wrote:but the problem is that the Defiler is a CC unit with a long range weapon. to me that does not compute

That sounds like a good arrangement to me. If the Defiler was all CC and no guns, it would be useless in some games, as would the reverse be true also. There are some armies you want to get into HtH with and there are some armies you don't. The Defiler can have an active role against either type of opponent.

If a defiler with 4 CCW fires it's battlecannon every round of the game it's done it's job as a long ranged unit.
If a defiler with 4 CCW parks behind cover guarding another unit or 2 that is vulnerable to assaults and they are never assaulted it's done it's job as a close combat walker.

I've had plenty of games where my defiler fulfilled both roles in the same game.

The defiler for me is a 50/50 unit. thats why im asking opinons on it

personally, the defiler is 1 of my most favourite units. You have a close combat monster and artillery to boot. His down side is his armor of 12 but keep him safe and you've got yourself a deadly unit be it melee or ranged

Thats the problem I have with it. Its a CC unit with artillery. It just dosent seem to work with me........

ghargatuloth wrote:Thats the problem I have with it. Its a CC unit with artillery. It just dosent seem to work with me........

By a similar comparison. Obliterators have terminator armor, a powerfist, short range anti-troop, long range anti-troop, long range anti-tank, and short range anti-tank. They can do some damage in CC and have multiple uses in shooting. Not so different from the defiler who has long range and close range abilities. Versatility is always a good thing to have. Think about broadsides, they carry a twin-linked railgun. Railgun is extremely good anti-tank but has no other possibilities. And while is is strength 10 ap1 it is still only 1 shot. A whorde ork army isnt going to fear this at all. Without a tank to fire at, the usefullness of a broadside is drastically decreased due to being so specifically set to anti-tank.

Defilers have the ability to adapt to different game situations how is this a bad thing?

mrwittwer wrote:A whorde ork army isnt going to fear this at all. Without a tank to fire at, the usefullness of a broadside is drastically decreased due to being so specifically set to anti-tank.

Agree with your main point, but the comparison doesn't work. The broadside is also armed with the Smart Missile System at range 24", S5, AP 5, Heavy 4. So, actually, they follow similar function, but different form.

mrwittwer wrote:

ghargatuloth wrote:Thats the problem I have with it. Its a CC unit with artillery. It just dosent seem to work with me........

By a similar comparison. Obliterators have terminator armor, a powerfist, short range anti-troop, long range anti-troop, long range anti-tank, and short range anti-tank. They can do some damage in CC and have multiple uses in shooting. Not so different from the defiler who has long range and close range abilities. Versatility is always a good thing to have. Think about broadsides, they carry a twin-linked railgun. Railgun is extremely good anti-tank but has no other possibilities. And while is is strength 10 ap1 it is still only 1 shot. A whorde ork army isnt going to fear this at all. Without a tank to fire at, the usefullness of a broadside is drastically decreased due to being so specifically set to anti-tank.

Defilers have the ability to adapt to different game situations how is this a bad thing?

but a defiler is either a CC unit or a long range unit. thats why I like the obliterators because they can do some damage at any range

ghargatuloth wrote:
but a defiler is either a CC unit or a long range unit. thats why I like the obliterators because they can do some damage at any range

Battlecannon has 72" range (longer than anything oblits have) and a 13" - 18" assault range.

But do what you wanna in the end.

They're nice because they force target prioritization : Do I want to kill the Battlecannon that will flatten my troops in a turn or the LR coming towards my lines?
If you do end up taking them, take a minimum of 2.

mrwittwer wrote:

ghargatuloth wrote:
but a defiler is either a CC unit or a long range unit. thats why I like the obliterators because they can do some damage at any range

Battlecannon has 72" range (longer than anything oblits have) and a 13" - 18" assault range.

But do what you wanna in the end.

Battle Cannon is large pie str8 ap3 shot, it's not chopped liver at long range.
Point for point 1 battlecannon is very comparable to 2 plasma cannons making a defiler comparable to 2 oblits in a pie throwing contest.

People never seem to complain about oblits going an entire 6 turn game without once using their power fists, so why is anybody complaining about a defiler shooting 6 battlecannon rounds in a battle without engaging in CC?

Defilers are awsome... One of my mates uses them and he wipes out anything in his way and the only time they die is when it gets into assults...............

schadenfreude wrote:

mrwittwer wrote:

ghargatuloth wrote:
but a defiler is either a CC unit or a long range unit. thats why I like the obliterators because they can do some damage at any range

Battlecannon has 72" range (longer than anything oblits have) and a 13" - 18" assault range.

But do what you wanna in the end.

Battle Cannon is large pie str8 ap3 shot, it's not chopped liver at long range.
Point for point 1 battlecannon is very comparable to 2 plasma cannons making a defiler comparable to 2 oblits in a pie throwing contest.

People never seem to complain about oblits going an entire 6 turn game without once using their power fists, so why is anybody complaining about a defiler shooting 6 battlecannon rounds in a battle without engaging in CC?

Thats why i run 3 obliterators

BTW, despite being only AV12, they can actually be used to tar-pit scary units much in the same way as Dreadnoughts.

Last game I played, a pair of Defilers wiped a squad of Death Company (no fists, hammers, or meltabombs in the squad lol) and an Assault Squad, then went on to tie up the Sanguinor and another Assault Squad.

A lot of units put out a ton of medium S Power Weapon attacks.


Any non-MC lacking a Power Fist, Melta Bombs, a Thunder Hammer, or another equivalent can be tar-pitted fairly well by Defilers.



They really are incredibly versatile.

Ghargatuloth you aren't making sense.

i do agree y obliterators are used tha y i have 3 of them and im planing on getting 6 more( its sounds a bit crazy0 but it going 2 screw some of my mates up big time..

schadenfreude wrote:pie throwing contest.

I see what you did there

DarkHound wrote:Ghargatuloth you aren't making sense.[/quot

I was beginning to think it was just me but someone else also doesn't understand his train of thought.

I run both, they're that sick nasty! I wish I could have more than 3 Oblits in a unit though :(

Telemicus wrote:



Also, one of my favorite lists i ever ran with chaos marines was a walker spam lnd 3 dreads at 1500 points.

Add two Deamon Princes and a Greater Deamon and you can see the sweat gush as your opponent tries to choose the biggest threat.

I totally agree with warone i found if you throw other threats in their face your defilers wont even get shot at DPs,greaters,and a LR full of termis are good distractions and i would use three defilers with a WS of three it brightens you odds of createring a squad or a rhino w/a squad or multiple plates on a HQ

Should I bother with chaos dreadnoughts? I've been hearing mixed things about them, but they don't seem that bad, for 90 points. I mean really. There's very little worth using in the elites section anyway, so my approach is basically "what the hell...."

They retain the good ol' 4 WS and 4 BS, which is nice, and they can take plasma cannons, which I want. The only problem is the model, which is solid pewter and it's 50 bucks with no options....Should I go for it?

If I really had to, I could just get the venerable dreadnought and totally destroy it into chaos-ness.

Samus_aran115 wrote:Should I bother with chaos dreadnoughts? I've been hearing mixed things about them, but they don't seem that bad, for 90 points. I mean really. There's very little worth using in the elites section anyway, so my approach is basically "what the hell...."

They retain the good ol' 4 WS and 4 BS, which is nice, and they can take plasma cannons, which I want. The only problem is the model, which is solid pewter and it's 50 bucks with no options....Should I go for it?

If I really had to, I could just get the venerable dreadnought and totally destroy it into chaos-ness.

A lot of it depends on if you follow the "Crazy Dread shoots what's in front of it" or the "Crazy Dread shoots whatever is closest to it" dogma. The first makes it more viable, although really they're pretty tolerable regardless.

Personally, I find them to be somewhat under-gunned, but I'm too chicken to give them anything that could threaten my rhinos. I also tend to play the shoots closest idea, though I might discuss with my opponents the possibility of using the more liberal interpretation of the rule.

The AOBR dread is easy to convert into a Chaos dread with the chaos tank upgrade sprue. If you've put together any Rhinos you should have *more* than enough leftover spikey bits to a nice looking chaos dread. Just takes a minimum of filing to take off the imperial iconography/purity seals. They're pretty cheap too, you can get them for $16 shipped all day long and can sometimes weasel $12 shipped.

I would use my own AoBR dreadnought, but I'm actual proud of it

I'll ask around to see if any of my friends will pawn me their dreadnoughts. I've gotten roughly 3 of those tank sprues, so yeah, it should be easy enough. I'll drill some holes in the dreadnought and just stick spikes down there, BOOM! Chaos dreadnought.

I'm rather worried about it looking too loyalist though, so I'll have to scrape off the entire front of the sarcophagus....

OMG I LOVE EBAY. 1.70$ for 5 terminators 2.80$ for 10 marines

I must get a paypal account.

Samus
Chaos dreads are fine if you can deliver them. but theyre av12 and have to walk. id put my money on this guy getting blown away before he can enter close combat. then basically your paying 100+ points for a twin linked lascannon/autocannon whatever. not worth it AF

AbaddonFidelis wrote:Samus
Chaos dreads are fine if you can deliver them. but theyre av12 and have to walk. id put my money on this guy getting blown away before he can enter close combat. then basically your paying 100+ points for a twin linked lascannon/autocannon whatever. not worth it AF

Then I guess I'll wait until we get drop pods then (hopefully next codex, I've been hearing rumors) I just realized that if he goes berserk in the first couple turns, he can just shoot at the drop pod!

Samus_aran115 wrote: I mean really. There's very little worth using in the elites section anyway, so my approach is basically "what the hell...."

well the chosen are worth it you can infiltrate with 5 meltas or come in with an icon for daemons to drop in with by the next turn and dont forget termis they have a multitude of uses

[img]http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/118780-Scorpion%20Defiler%20pic2.html

I've had some success with my defiler. Just one doesn't seem to be enough though. Explodes too often, you see. I have all the parts for a second scorpion, just lazy. I think I'll get on it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
How do i put the damn picture up?

@Kilwar324:
Infiltrating Chosen are pretty sad.
They are heavily dependent on terrain game to game.

Getting the initial 12" means they can get a shot with the meltas, but it will never be with 2D6.

If there's poor terrain, that means 18", which means they can never get a shot with the meltas.

Termies are shoe-horned into one role: termicides, anything else, and you'd be better with just more troops.

Face it, the defiler is a 'fun'/'themed' option. It can perform, but it's not gonna be a consistant performer due to mainly the identity crisis issues it has.

annabelle wrote:[img]http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/118780-Scorpion%20Defiler%20pic2.html

I've had some success with my defiler. Just one doesn't seem to be enough though. Explodes too often, you see. I have all the parts for a second scorpion, just lazy. I think I'll get on it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
How do i put the damn picture up?

You need an [/img] at the end of the HTML. Or hit the "image" button again once you paste the link in.

Like So:



There!


Also with Dakkas Gallery I always must go to the pic itself and right click on it and hit "copy image location" instead of using the actual html in the bar above the page.

Thanks so much. Now I need to build number 2 so I can post him.

Apoc game this weekend - four defilers in my command. The old chaos LR blew up with one shot - while the defilers cut a swathe of destruction from afar with battlecannons, ripping up several dreadnaughts, chimaera etc and immobilizing a Russ, de-weaponing a Baal etc. If they'd gotten into CC it would have been even better! So, the upshot is, my army grew by one more Defiler. Defile 'em all!

I wonder if people would take Defilers more if they could get 4 DCCW's and replace the cannon with a TL Multi-melta. That way it has a clear reason to rush up field and can really threaten tanks.

It's not a better option, but I think it's one more people would get.

So, I can't say how well a defiler works with the rest of the chaos codex, but as I guard player, if I had the chance to take a LRBT and give up +2 front armor for FOUR DCCW's and the ability to always take close combat hits on the front, I'd take it in a heartbeat.

yea but you also would take meltas over autocannons at long range (just bustin balls Ailaros no harm intended )
Hey how does that 4 DCCW thing work? does it give him like, rerolls or something? cause i know he only get 1 attack in addition for having two single handed weapons...

Each additional Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon gives him +1 attack, as per the Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon rules. So, if he has 4 CCWs, and 2 attacks base, he has a total of 5 attacks. Granted, they're at WS and Initiative 3 so he'll die horribly to any other MCs or Walkers. He is well and truly a bully unit, meant to hit targets that can't hurt him back.

Samus_aran115 wrote:Should I bother with chaos dreadnoughts? I've been hearing mixed things about them, but they don't seem that bad, for 90 points. I mean really. There's very little worth using in the elites section anyway, so my approach is basically "what the hell...."

They retain the good ol' 4 WS and 4 BS, which is nice, and they can take plasma cannons, which I want. The only problem is the model, which is solid pewter and it's 50 bucks with no options....Should I go for it?

If I really had to, I could just get the venerable dreadnought and totally destroy it into chaos-ness.

Convert plastic SM Dreads its fun and adds flavor .Look for them on ebay or Apocabits