The other thread got dragged off topic and locked I think-- either way, I searched for it about five pages back in the thread list, and couldn't find it. It has been a month since any serious news on the game after all.
So here's a new thread for the latest Dawn of War 2 expansion pack: Retribution.
Steamworks networking and matchmaking to provide co-operative and competitive online play. This new back end will allow players to invite friends into matches from their Steam friends lists, and take advantage of the full set of Steam community features including groups, achievements, and Steam overlay chat channels. We are also going to include an all new matchmaking and ranking set up, built specifically for Dawn of War II – Retribution.
“The move to Steamworks will also allow us to provide features like guest passes, free multiplayer weekends, pre-loading and the ability to provide fast turn-around on future patches and updates.
“To accomplish this transition, Dawn of War II – Retribution will be a completely stand alone title in the series and will provide multiple campaigns to play, as well as all six multiplayer races, with new units for each of the existing five races and one new unannounced one. In a change from our previous strategies with expansion packs, we will not be patching this content back into Dawn of War II and Chaos Rising.
“Owners of Dawn of War II and Chaos Rising will get the chance to try out the full set of Retribution’s Steam features in a multiplayer beta that will take place in the new year. More details on the beta will be announced at a later date.
“Dawn of War II and Chaos Rising will continue to operate on Games for Windows LIVE, in order to preserve the owners of those titles ability to earn LIVE achievements as well as their established friends lists.
“We are going to have more exciting announcements in the coming weeks, so stay tuned.”
On Retribution's multiplayer beta: All DoW2 and DoW2CR owners will be able to participate. It'll take place around the new year.
So, let me get this straight. Basically anyone who owns DoW2 or DoW2CR won't be able to play online with players from retribution? That's the idea which i'm getting from that. But anyways, we're getting a new race, which will be fun as always
I think so, yes. They found that players complained about having to have both Games For Windows Live AND steam installed and logged in just in order to play even offline mode was a real turn-off. So they settled with Steam instead, as Steam has made some serious leaps and bounds since DoW2 was first developed.
Melissia wrote:Dawn of War II – Retribution will be a completely stand alone title in the series and will provide multiple campaigns to play,as well as all six multiplayer races,
Cynically I do not read that as the intention to have a campaign for all six races.
I do really hope the Imperial Guard make it into Dawn of War II....I mean, they need to be there. I'm hoping they'll get to be the new race, and it makes sense to me. The IG is a bit more central to the whole 40k universe than the Tau, and the other key races are already in the game.
So here's hoping we'll be able to spew endless waves of infantry at the enemy next time, in Dawn of War II !
Well it's possible. Orks and Tyranids are in, and both of those have equal or greater numbers than Guardsmen in many battles. And Eldar focuses on Guardians, which aren't that much better than Guardsman either. So it can't really be accurately said Guardsmen wouldn't fit in. Besides, there's always veterans, penal legionnaires, and stormtroopers to supplement them, and plenty of special weapons to choose from.
To me, this game is a lost cause. The origional was better and captured the aspect of war far better than dawn of war skirmish fighter.
Now, should they implement a system a la risk style campaign, I might get back into it. Oh and if the new race is any of the following: Imperial guard, anything space marine related; then I shall never think well of this installment again.
However as it stands, the multiplayer is still is broken as all hell.
COMMANDER SUNTZU wrote:I loved dawn of war. But dawn of war 2 is rubbish. No buildings?? What were they thinking???
They were thinking "Building buildings isn't what makes 40k."
They were thinking "watching a Space Marine captain be brutally eviscerated by a Warboss is what makes 40k." so they added in more sync kills with better animations, sounds, and voice acting. The voice acting in Essence Engine games are of unheard of quality AND quantity in the RTS genre. Huge varieties of clips for all factions, and not just responses to orders either, but even idle chatting or combat chatter-- all of which are coded to be situationally appropriate (I recall hearing some Orks saying "get those orks in da ruins to da left!" against an Ork enemy who were, guess what, hiding in some cover-- things like this are awesome and incredibly immersive). The battles themselves are fierce and brutal affairs, which brings its own tactical difficulties... but also rewards.
They were thinking "making a tactical squad mow down Tyranids from cover is what makes 40k." so they focused on better squad based combat, better squad AI, and better cover mechanics. The squad AI in DoW2 is the best in the RTS business, and the game is far more immersive for it. The cover mechanics of DoW2/CoH are intuitive and easy to grasp, while being quite useful in actual practice as well as theory.
They were thinking "buildings aren't necessary to what makes 40k cool, the units are" so they focused on making the units that were put in cool, useful, and so on. The upgradeable, three-tiered HQ is more justified as the commander asking for more advanced resources and units, rather than as a physical upgrade, which makes more sense from a fluff perspective than two forces building huge military-industrial complexes less than a mile from eachother (instead they utilize makeshift teleporters, drop pod landing sites, webway gates, etc).
They were thinking "Okay, DoW1 was good... now let's go make a BETTER game". Personally, I think they were wildly successful. DoW1 pales in comparison to DoW2 in almost every way, the only way DoW1 can even attempt to be better is by its claim of having more factions available to play than DoW2.
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HoverBoy wrote:They where thinkin CoH in 40k was gonna sell well.
If this was indeed waht they were thinking... they were right. DoW2 was commercially successful (I mean duh, if it wasn't we wouldn't be seeing Retribution right now).
Well, GFWL was a bad platform, mostly because it made the patching process slow. I am looking forward to free weekends, guest passes and the like, will make more players join the game for sure.
Exactly...I mean, as much as I enjoyed Dawn of War 1, it's not 40k enough. I mean...as long as DoW 2 runs effectively on my comp I will enjoy it more. I just don't like playing Space Marine's as much....if I can get IG in there? I would love it beyond anything else.
Juraigamer: What race do you want? Dark Eldar? Tau? Sisters? As awesome as all those are, you can do a 40k game without them. They aren't core races. The IG is one of the key races that has yet to be in the game.
As to those who complain that you can't build buildings....do you build buildings in 40k? I mean yes there are bastions, but you don't gather resources to spend on buildings and stuff, and neither do real world militaries, which is kinda what 40k is a simulation of.
Melissia wrote:They were thinking "Building buildings isn't what makes 40k."
They were thinking "making a tactical squad mow down Tyranids from cover is what makes 40k."
They were thinking "buildings aren't necessary to what makes 40k cool, the units are."
They were thinking "Okay, DoW1 was good... now let's go make a BETTER game".
Well, this is unusual. I find myself vehemently agreeing with you for once. Well played, madam.
While I'd like IG to be the new race, I can't seem them working in well in such a small-scale game, unless they seriously brake the factional mold. IG have a far greater reliance on vehicles and large, expendable infantry formations than the other factions. I'm not entirely sure how many units the engine or the format can support per player, but they'd certainly need many more than any other faction, I'd think. That said, if they can figure it out, I'd love them to include Gaurd. Especially so if it's a specialized regiment (instead of Cadians, again) such as the Elysians, which would actually make alot of sense in a game that invloves small scale surgical strikes. Add in the fact that they can easily reinforce their infantry formations (via being to grav chute in new squad members) anywhere on the map and you've got an interesting and logical new game play mechanic.
That said, I'd be equally happy with Tau, especially if I can rock a few Crisis Suits.
Melissia wrote:I think so, yes. They found that players complained about having to have both Games For Windows Live AND steam installed and logged in just in order to play even offline mode was a real turn-off. So they settled with Steam instead, as Steam has made some serious leaps and bounds since DoW2 was first developed.
What exactly about Steam has "improved" in the last 1.5 years? Unless you're considering the difficult to navigate, slowly peforming UI "enhancement" that was released, which added, so far as I know, zero new functionality.
Not that I'm complaining about Steam, which is pretty solid. Just curious what "improved".
So far as the plague that was GFWL, good riddance. It should never have shipped with both, and how GFWL survives in a world with Impulse and Steam is a mystery.
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Melissia wrote: DoW1 pales in comparison to DoW2 in almost every way, the only way DoW1 can even attempt to be better is by its claim of having more factions available to play than DoW2.
Except in all the ways that matter, I guess you're right. Specifically, and discounting Soulstorm, DOW1 had a better campaign, better writing, better voice acting, higher aggregate reviews, and of course, more Necrons.
Well, CoH has managed to show that they can render masses of infantry and several massive tanks, and still look awesome. Even if they include the IG, Relic has shown they aren't afraid to develop completely new faction systems for factions they have to. E.g. the Necrons in DoW1.
The Orks also show that a horde works in DoW2, and Ive got a few ideas for units....they could maybe make the Leman Russ a thing you can buy upgrades for? Like you get a LRB, and can change the turret and stuff? But ignore this part.....just me going off a bit.
Great news. GFWL smells. Given a choice between the two I'd vote Steam every time. Having to use both Steam and GFWL was ridiculous. Honestly why did they think someone would enjoy signing on to two services before being able to play a match. It's annoys me everytime I boot of DoW2. This will be a big improvement in my eyes.
I still play both DoW1 and Dow2. They are very different games IMO, and are both fun in their own way. I couldn't be more excited about the possibility of a new ork campaign.
Vertrucio wrote:It's sounding like there will be an inquisition army that's a combination of Guard and a bunch of other inquisition elements.
I don't know where this is sounding from. That's just pure conjecture because of the =I= in the title and the fact that there's a bunch of Guard assets in-game. I mean it's reasonable, but don't get ahead of yourselves here.
I'm also going from the facts that the Imperial Guard were one of the most popular factions in DoW1 and people have been clamoring for their return in some form.
Random speculation, but I'd guess that Guard will be the new expansion race. Only because they already have unit models in-game. So they'd be pretty easy to add up. Of course that what I predicted for the first expansion and I was obviously wrong.
Aye, Guard is the most likely new race, I'll agree... but I'd love it if they threw a curve ball and gave us Tau or crons or something.
Tbh, I reckon Tau would work the mechanics really well. Comparing to the Marines...
Scouts=Pathfinders, Marines=Fire Warriors, Assault Marines=Kroot, Devastators=Broadsides etc etc.
I'd like to see either Tau or IG as the new race. But I'm not sure I like the idea of a Tyranid campaign mode, it would be awfully redundant. "Mission One Objectives - Kill and Devour. Mission Two Objectives - Kill and Devour", and you get the point though right?
What races do I want? Anything non standard would be nice but anything would help the game.
However the broken nature of the game doesn't relate to not building buildings, it's the lack of focus in combat. The retreat ability only accelerates this.
I'll summarize an old post of mine on the matter. Controlling the points on the map is the best way to victory, however without playing, say, nids or just spamming basic units you will quickly find that holding points on the map doesn't last.
It's basically 40k ring around the map. Solution: points you take spawn some basic ranged units that are ai controlled. As it stands the game doesn't feel like "war" only "small skirmish" with the above change the focus is narrowed considerably, and excellent battles in sue.
Add in the facts that the overall unit count is horribly small, combat patrol in size normally. The last stand mode saves the game as far as I'm concerned, and the single player is fun the first time through.
I just hope the expansion actually makes the game fun. If so, I might get it.
Why do they make another expansion and another race when the previous one isnt even being balanced?
Its like piling up more stuff on an already unsound (unbalanced) foundation.
This refers only to the multiplayer part. Hopefully this game will be single player campaign only.
lunarman wrote:Tau would fit the current DoW2 setup perfectly, it's true.
I absolutely agree. Their tendencies toward innovation and efficiency, along with a wide variety of upgrades, coupled with a solid, modern military feel and mentality would make them amazing subjects a DoWII style campaign. I've always wanted to play them in such a setting...
I dont play the multiplayer so I cant speak from that aspect. But I enjoy the campaign. I think guard could work best as the new race so long as they had different ways of playing. Wall o dudes and guns would be boring. But a drop troop army could be boss. Or kasrkin.
I sincerely doubt there's going to be any "inquisition" elements in the game aside from MAYBE an NPC in single player and MAYBE a single "Inquisitor" hero in multiplayer/TLS.
Keep in mind, previous news sources show that the new campaign is going to involve much greater numbers than the previous ones, including the ability to build more basic squads (having a few squads of Boyz to back your heroes up) in mission if you capture the right buildings. That in mind, Guard makes plenty of sense for something like that.
Here's hoping for the inclusion of a Leman Russ as the "Hero" vehicle for the Imperial Guard, just swap the hull, sponson and turret weapons to fit the situation like with the Dreadnought.
Not that this means anything, but a while back on the DOW2 community forums there was a longstanding poll about which race you'd like to see in the "next" update. At the time it was neck and neck between Chaos and IG, and Chaos were in the lead. Guess who was in the expansion. . . So my bet is that Relic reads their own forum and caught on that IG are the next most popular race within that community. (After Guard I think Tau and Ncrons were running 3 and 4)
Ouze wrote:I'd gladly trade all of the multi schemes for base-building.
I wouldn't. I'm glad to be done with it.
Basebuilding just doesn't fit 40k, and it was just... out of place in Dawn of War 1. Hell, so was the synchronized movement of squads, too-- I mean seriously, they were basically marching bands with guns half the time. It might fit something like SupCom, but that's because SupCom is actually designed specifically for base building and instant construction of units to actually make sense in the canon of the story as well as gameplay (justified through highly advanced nanomachines doing the construction btw).
The only exception I can think of for 40k is, say, trenches, turrets, and so on. But even then, trenches are really only used by a single faction, Turrets can be deployed via drop or built rather quickly (two grots in a can comin' up!) and other buildings... are really just converted from buildings that were already there.
I can't wait to see the next expansion pack for DOW2. Both DoW 1 and 2 are great, they are just a different way to see the 40k universe and the feeling of it.
In DoW 1 they wanted to recreate the 1500 battles of the table top and to recreate a war as we're all abituated to see in strategy games.
DoW 2 is about skirmish, the feeling of a single Marine squad as in a book. It has more in depth background than DoW 1, and I like it.
Tim the Biovore wrote:I'd like to see either Tau or IG as the new race. But I'm not sure I like the idea of a Tyranid campaign mode, it would be awfully redundant. "Mission One Objectives - Kill and Devour. Mission Two Objectives - Kill and Devour", and you get the point though right?
Well, there's always these options. Note: I haven't played DoW2, so my ideas might be completely incompatible. That said...
Mission Objective: Plant and protect multiple large spore towers until they reach maturity. New spore towers can always be grown, but they cost resources.
Mission Objective: Distract the majority of the enemy with a large-scale swarm so that you can take out their shield generator/cool crystal thingy/big honking engine with much more specialized creatures.
Mission Objective: Stop all complex Tyranid units you control from falling into enemy hands, as those could provide too much information on your genetic structure. The goal is both escape and retrieval.
Mission Objective: Cover a target in phermones so that your swarm will be able to track it later on. Obviously, this would require a Lictor.
Mission Objective: Collect enough biomass to build a Heirophant. You would have an extra resource for this mission, which can be filled by processing your own creatures: the amount of biomass added to the total is increased by how many kills the creature had. This means that you must raise your biomass total while keeping track of your other resources, and you must be balance expending troops with saving them from combat. Once you get enough biomass, you get a sweet cutscene and then get a badass titan to slaughter the enemy with.
Archonate wrote:This is good news! Any word on new races in this expansion?
One new race. Which one is unknown. Current rumors have it as either Guard, Guard with Inquisition elements, or pure Inquisition (IE, Sisters with Inquisition elements), based off of the images on the DoW2 community site (various Guard iconography, and the I in retribution looks like the Inquisition's =][=).
I don't know why I bothered to read this thread. All I'm left with is the anger that I don't have access to a machine capable of running DOW2 right now. My multiplayer "skillz" have atrophied, but hopefully muscle memory will bring me back.
RAAAAGE!
Damn I need to get in some Last Stand too. That was loads of fun.
I really hope they add some more Last Stand maps. Maybe deploy the 3 players to one of 5 different random maps. Getting all 5 characters to lvl 20 on the same map was monotonous.
Personally I wish they did Last Stand only with normal forces, IE, a skirmish game where your enemies spawned in waves walking/driving onto the map, occasionally deep striking as well, and you had to defend three power points (one per player) at all cost.
My issue with DoW2 is not the gameplay per se (even though its more an RPG than an RTS), but that the online component is friggin terrible. Any melee unit in the game is easily kited around by things like tac marines, and its quite irritating. Not only that, building units is awkward, to say the least. DoW2 captures the feel of 40k better in essence of the tabletop; but DoW1 made a far better game online. Also, DOW 2's campaign was kinda meh. I have CR but haven't cracked it open, but I hope its better. DoW1 had a far better campaign in the first/winter assault games.
However, I vehemently disagree that it completely captures the feel of the game for one reason; wheres the friggin tanks!!!! Its completely focused around infantry, and that somewhat ticks me off. Unlike real "war" each unit has a role to fill, but in DoW2 you can honestly spam boyz and achieve the same effect. 90% of your games are micro fights and you cant spit out a carnifex (which then gets mowed down by a unit of assault marines damn easy). The balancing is way off, and I really wish I could toss down a couple landraiders and squish things.
That being said, I'm hoping that they bring vehicles in, streamline how you make units online (if they have to make it like DoW1 to make online fun, playable, and balanced, fine), new online modes would be cool as well. As far as a new race goes I'm hoping for Necrons to be honest. They're unique enough to make the game interesting, aren't chapter XXXXX of marienz, and would be fun to play on the DoW2 engine.
Zid wrote:1: building units is awkward
2: Any melee unit in the game is easily kited around by things like tac marines
3: DoW1 made a far better game online.
4: wheres the friggin tanks!!!!
5: you can honestly spam boyz
6: 90% of your games are micro fights and you cant spit out a carnifex (which then gets mowed down by a unit of assault marines damn easy).
1: Wait what, clicking on a unit icon is awkward? That's... all you ahve to do.
F1: Click on picture. Or F1 and then the hotkey.
2: So coordinate your shootaboyz with your sluggaz, suppressing the tacs and then assaulting? You're going ot have more boyz than they have tacs anyway.
3: I don't miss gamespy in the slightest. This version is far less buggy and far easier to find a game.
4: Tier two and three.
5: Wait, you mean... Orks can do something that actually makes sense from a fluff perspective and succeed? OH NOES!
6: ... maybe you just suck? I know it sounds antagonistic, but I have completely different experiences with gameplay balance.
Melissia wrote:Personally I wish they did Last Stand only with normal forces, IE, a skirmish game where your enemies spawned in waves walking/driving onto the map, occasionally deep striking as well, and you had to defend three power points (one per player) at all cost.
Last Stand has so much potential, but they're stubbornly keeping it down to one flavor. I love the concept though.
I wish there were more playable characters per race. I think a Lictor could be a lot of fun, or a Warp Spider.
Melissia wrote:[edit note: numbered to prevent multiquote]
Zid wrote:1: building units is awkward
2: Any melee unit in the game is easily kited around by things like tac marines
3: DoW1 made a far better game online.
4: wheres the friggin tanks!!!!
5: you can honestly spam boyz
6: 90% of your games are micro fights and you cant spit out a carnifex (which then gets mowed down by a unit of assault marines damn easy).
1: Wait what, clicking on a unit icon is awkward? That's... all you ahve to do.
F1: Click on picture. Or F1 and then the hotkey.
2: So coordinate your shootaboyz with your sluggaz, suppressing the tacs and then assaulting? You're going ot have more boyz than they have tacs anyway.
3: I don't miss gamespy in the slightest. This version is far less buggy and far easier to find a game.
4: Tier two and three.
5: Wait, you mean... Orks can do something that actually makes sense from a fluff perspective and succeed? OH NOES!
6: ... maybe you just suck? I know it sounds antagonistic, but I have completely different experiences with gameplay balance.
Lol, well pretty much arrogance here. Its a difference of opinion; I said what I FOUND to be issue and you took it to offense. I have a completely different view on games than you do obviously. Ah well, thus is the interweb.
As for unit building, how awkward can simply clicking on the HQ building and choosing the icon be?
Compared to DoW1, where you have to build a gaggle of buildings for no reason other than to build more buildings to then build one type of unit. How is that not more awkward?
Eh, I think people are too hung up on the idea that they have to force themselves to jump through hoops just to have the opportunity to jump through another hoop, just to get units out into the field and actually make WAR on the other players. You know war right? As in going out and fighting and killing the enemy?
If I want to build buildings just to produce things, I'll play Sim City.
Well, personally I liked the larger scale of DoW I. That's not to say I dislike DoWII, I enjoy them both. Relic scored big with this. But, I do enjoy the larger scale games that were available in DoWI, as well as CoH. I personally had more fun when I had dozens upon dozens of Guardsmen to throw blindly into the fray, backed up with a friggin Baneblade and a small squadron of Leman Russes as compared to DoWII where I, at most, had a few squads of Marines, with maybe a Predator in support.
I personally would like to see DoW go on more of a Company of Heroes path where you don't have as many buildings to construct, but you still have fairly large armies to throw at each other.
You'll probably get your guardsmen in Retribution. At least that's what I'm betting on anyway, I doubt there will be Inquisition like some people believe.
Melissia wrote:You'll probably get your guardsmen in Retribution. At least that's what I'm betting on anyway, I doubt there will be Inquisition like some people believe.
Oh, I have no doubt about Guardsmen. I'm still wondering how they'd be run....closer to Orks is what I'm thinking. But yeah, I'm just hoping that DoWIII (however far in the future it is) swings more toward the big battles of DoWI as compared to the skirmish style in DoWII. I mean....I personally think a DoWI style game with DoWII graphics? Can anyone imagine anything that awesome?
I think IG is simply too obvious a choice. They also are hugely vehicle oriented which seems counter to the way the game is designed.
I'd put more money on something like Tau or Necron personally. I wish it was Dark Eldar though just go with the new miniatures. Hopefully if it's Necron, GW allows them to see concept art for the upcoming Necron redo.
But IG, I'd rather not. Get a completely different faction.
Now as for the game, I agree with some others that MP was a failure. That king of the hill thing was also quite meh. Hopefully they'll expand on it and introduce another game mode for us to enjoy. As others said, a mode similar to the table top or a space hulk mission would be quite fun.
Each person gets a unit and they just have to fight to the end of a space hulk or something might be fun. But more importantly, they need to better balance MP.
IG doesn't have to be hugely vehicle oriented, and never did. For that matter, quite a few Eldar player view Eldar armies as aspect warrior oriented, and yet the Eldar army is a Guardian based army with only two types of aspect warriors. And Tyranids don't have monstrous creature spam which was pervasive in fourth edition, etc. Just because it is one's interpretation of the faction doesn't mean it will be adopted in if the faction is added.
edit: Let's not let this thread turn into a "DoW1 vs DoW2" rant. Go to the DoW2 forums or the RelicNews forums if you really desire such malarkey.
PLEASE NOTE: This previous "blog post" was revealed by the DoW2 community forum's mods to be a fake. How, exactly, someone created a Relic account on the Dawn of War 2 forums in order to pull off said prank I'm still not sure about. For this reason, I've edited out all references to it.
Melissia wrote:I could, but then DoW2 as it is right now is more awesome than DoW1 with DoW2 graphics.
I want to watch Orks chop open Astartes when I play my game, not look at grots tapping away at a slowly growing building. That's just not 40k.
If I wanted to do a simcity RTS, I'd go play SupCom (which I do, by the way, regularly).
I wasn't thinking that it'd be 'grots popping at a slowly growing building', but I personally think DoW in the CoH style would be an amazing. Relic showed with CoH that a strategy game that had a large focus on vehicles, but still managed to keep infantry a key part of the game. More importantly, the game included base building, defenses, and all that traditional RTS jazz while still avoiding the grots tapping, you described. Yes, grots tapping a building is boring. But what about Orks chopping open Astartes before getting crushed by a massed clash of Predators and Battlewagon?
I'm not saying DoWII sucks, or that DoWI was the best, I enjoy both games immensely, but in my opinion the CoH formula was the most successful, and honestly? Combining a system that was successful even with a standard WWII theme with the sheer epicness that is 40k? I can not see a way that would fail to be anything but absolutely spectacular. It may be my mindset....but I honestly do prefer large scale battles over small tactical battles where micromanaging abilities is the only way you can win.
Edit: Thanks for the blog update. Looks like the multiplayer issues are being looked at and dealt with...
Melissia wrote:Wait, you're surprised that an expansion pack expands upon the game?
This is a Relic expansion pack we're talking about, not some half-assed Blizzard crap.
I'm really confused, I was talking about what I would like to see in the future for Dawn of War, and what direction Relic could take Dawn of War to make it even more amazing than it actually is....I'm not sure where you're coming from here. I'm not surprised it's expanding on the game, but I am saying what I'm hoping will be future expansion/new games.
I don't even play Blizzard games, apart from a little Starcraft II, and even that isn't overly appealing to me.
Wow that blog post was awesome! More ranks, customizable units, more wargear options, more MP modes, more Last Stand, and a new faction! So glad they're going to make getting rank points easier getting, ranking up for sweet gear was the main reason I played ranked games. Looks like I'll have to get those eldar up to 80 (DA upgrade for guardians please?). My god Relic is awesome, all we need is Homeworld 3
Btw from what it sounds like, you have the same tastes in RTS as I do Melissia. Sup Com ftw!
Melissia wrote:Sorry, I'm so used to people constantly bashing DoW2 for no apparent reason that snark becomes a default response.
Regardless, I'm looking forward to hearing what exactly their "ork sharpshooters" are next week.
Quite alright, snark is usually a great response to this kind of thing. But, yeah, I enjoy DoW2, and I'm looking forward to Retribution. Right now I'm just very upset my uni's internet doesn't let me get on Steam to RUN DoW2....
I'm wondering what those are too....sharpshooting doesn't really sound like the kind of thing Ork's are likely to do.
Any guesses on what the new units might be? Maybe fire dragons for eldar. Daemonettes would make great T1 cc units and finally represent slaanesh, on that note the sorcerer should summon flamers/horrors instead of bloodletters.
I also wish chaos had a defiler instead of a predator as its T3 vehicle.
Actually hive guard could be interesting to see, I also would like to see some sternguard but I'm not sure how they could make them anything more interesting than better tacs.
asimo77 wrote:Actually hive guard could be interesting to see, I also would like to see some sternguard but I'm not sure how they could make them anything more interesting than better tacs.
Do what they do in the game, and just have them switch ammo, and you have to pay for each upgrade? Possibly make their weapons more damaging to enemy units in exchange for slightly weaker close combat skills....I'm thinking a mix between a Devastator and a Tactical.
I know tacs already have kraken bolts and can now switch their weapons as much as they like, which is pretty similar. Plus with rank unlocks your tacs end up having enough bling to look like vets.
asimo77 wrote:I know tacs already have kraken bolts and can now switch their weapons as much as they like, which is pretty similar. Plus with rank unlocks your tacs end up having enough bling to look like vets.
PLEASE NOTE: The previous "blog post" was revealed by the DoW2 site's mods to be a fake. How, exactly, someone created a Relic account on the Dawn of War 2 forums in order to pull off said prank I'm still not sure about. For this reason, I've edited out all references to it until I see further proof of anything contained within.
Melissia wrote:PLEASE NOTE: The previous "blog post" was revealed by the DoW2 site's mods to be a fake. How, exactly, someone created a Relic account on the Dawn of War 2 forums in order to pull off said prank I'm still not sure about. For this reason, I've edited out all references to it until I see further proof of anything contained within.
Well then...that's just lovely. At least we know now, and hopefully Relic shows us what they're really up to soon. A lot of that stuff in the blog post sounded quite intriguing with a lot of potential.
I'm hoping there's more than one new army... It's pretty half-assed to release one at a time in a 40k game. There are just too many armies equally worthy of representation.
There is only one new army. This has been confirmed by Relic staff on the official DoW2 forum.
And we're not sure we'll get any more expansions. They're currently testing out a sort of free-to-play MMORTS style for Company of Heroes, and if that succeeds they have plans to use it for DoW3.
Oh lame. In that case it's gonna be IG... Which really should have been the army to accompany Chaos in the last expansion.
By the way, ChrisWWII, your signature should read "смерть к противникам человечествa". What you have means "Death to the enemies of a person." человек means man as in a singular person. человечество means man as in mankind/humanity. Sorry to be a grammar Nazi, but that's been driving me nuts...
As I've said earlier, currently it's believed to be IG, IG+Inquisition, or Sisters+Inquisition.
Relic has not released any real information on the subject, but this is just going off of what we IS known by fans about it. Namely, the =][= symbol is used for the I in retribution, leading many people (not me) to speculate that it will be Inquisition of some sort. Personally, I don't believe the Inquisition will be in in any fashion other than single player, but meh.
Archonate wrote:Oh lame. In that case it's gonna be IG... Which really should have been the army to accompany Chaos in the last expansion.
By the way, ChrisWWII, your signature should read "смерть к противникам человечествa". What you have means "Death to the enemies of a person." человек means man as in a singular person. человечество means man as in mankind/humanity.
Oh trust me, I know. I've had like 3 Russian speaking friends correct me on that...I'm currently putting my sig in line to be edited to say what I actually wanted it to say.
Curse you google translate!!!!
But yeah....I'm hoping for IG, it seems to most logical thing to have next.
Archonate wrote:Well hats off to your Russian IG. I lived in Russia for a couple years. The WWII museum in Volgograd (formerly Stalingrad) is amazing...
Thanks. Yeah, I've taken a couple tours of Russia, never gotten the chance to go to Volgograd. But yeah...haveing Russian speaking friends when making a Russian themed army is quite awesome.
But yes....I'm wondering, I don't think DoW2 had the Army Painter, right? I wonder if they'll be able to put that back in. I liked the concept, but I really wish there was more flexibility in it. It would have been utter awesomness if you were able to actually customize the LOOK of your units instead of just the color scheme.
Indeed. And more textures than standard DoW does (having metallic and fleshy textures as well as standard textures), albeit with slightly less color choice (more than enough for most people though).
This expansion would be the greatest ever if there is no SM campaign. I'll be getting it in any case.
I'm curious to see just how customized the campaigns are. Is it going to be the same campaign for every race, like Soul Storm and Dark Crusade? Or will each campaign have a completely different direction, goal and focus?
I honestly can't tell...most of the campaign trailers have just been the faction in question killing all the other guys for a few minutes while some meaningful words appear on the screen. Awesome? Yes. Informative about the nature of the campaign? Not really.
I'm hoping for a personalized campaign....I never really liked the Dark Crusade or Soulstorm campaigns. Felt too much like a series of skirmish games. The only parts that really made feel it was like a campaign were the Stronghold Assault missions. On that note, watching the trailers the best evidence I can find for a personalized campaign would be that the Ork trailer seems to feature some kind of Ork Loota Pirate Captain, so I'm hoping he'll be some kind of player character like the Force Commander was in vanilla DoW2. Of course, he could just be the general character like you had in Dark Crusade and Soulstorm, but I'm hoping that won't be the case.
Orkfantic wrote:Saw what looked like an Authauch(sp) with the eldar in that vid. Some guy with wings.
Good Call. Definitely what appears to be an Autarch...
I see Dire Avenger Helm, Wings and a cloak, standing apart from 2-3 squads of Guardians. If you pause the video around 3/4's through then you should be able to notice it around there somewhere. Quite Noticeable. If someone could get a picture as proof, that'd be dandy.
I think I can safely say for now that: Eldar Autarch Is In DOW2: Retribution
I think most farseers will be female in DOW just because people get sick of the same hard toned manly voices in 6 different characters and the Farseer seems to be the best fluffwise to get away with a female.
There is no token black guy though. What is this?! I thought we had equal rights and all that
syanticraven wrote:I think most farseers will be female in DOW just because people get sick of the same hard toned manly voices in 6 different characters and the Farseer seems to be the best fluffwise to get away with a female.
There is no token black guy though. What is this?! I thought we had equal rights and all that
I kind of liked the female farseer...and honestly it does make the most sense. There are no female Space Marines, but hey a female Inquisitor could work I guess? Or a female Guard general? But I'm thinking the female farseer is almost a running gag for the DoW games at this point.
I think the nid narration will either be a genestealer, or the swarm lord and hivemind. Other than those I haven't a clue what could even have individual thoughts from the nids.
ChrisWWII wrote:I kind of liked the female farseer...and honestly it does make the most sense. There are no female Space Marines, but hey a female Inquisitor could work I guess? Or a female Guard general? But I'm thinking the female farseer is almost a running gag for the DoW games at this point.
Lady Commissar WOULD be awesome. We already know they exist, and there's no reason why one couldn't be in a game as the IG narrator, but not as the 'leader' of the IG army, unfortunately. Well..actually, I never quite figured out how Commissar-Generals work. Oktar seemed to be in command of the regiment, while Balshin seemed to be a Commissar for the Commissars, so who knows?
Orkfantic wrote:I think the nid narration will either be a genestealer, or the swarm lord and hivemind. Other than those I haven't a clue what could even have individual thoughts from the nids.
I noticed the Tyranid narration and did not like it. I rather prefer the Tyranid Hive Mind voice when playing the Tyranids in Last Stand or Multiplayer. It's a passive, emotionless voice, neither male nor female, which states things simply and matter-of-factly. It's perfect the way it is and I hope it doesn't change.
Seconded for that, I didn't like the Tyranid voice in their trailer. If it is THE Hive Mind narrating, then it should be as it already is. Why in the God-Emperor's Holy Realm would the Hive Mind be particularly excited about anything occurring on a DoW2 scale battlefield?
Lady Commissar WOULD be awesome. We already know they exist, and there's no reason why one couldn't be in a game as the IG narrator, but not as the 'leader' of the IG army, unfortunately. Well..actually, I never quite figured out how Commissar-Generals work. Oktar seemed to be in command of the regiment, while Balshin seemed to be a Commissar for the Commissars, so who knows?
A "Lord Commissar" can take command of units for missions I think. Cain was given such a command in the first Cain book fo rexample.
Yep, and not only is he in retribution, he is the hero of the Tyranid campaign. Which actually gives the campaign some chance, as you can develop your swarmlord's "personality" (as it were) and style yourself.
I thought Toth was revealed to be part of the planets disguise in order to provide sacrifice to Chaos? Haven't played that one in a while and never read the books so I always thought that.
As far as I could tell, Toth was merely a misguided Inquisitor who suspected the wrong Blood Raven of heresy. He's also renown for being a bit of an idiot for not sensing Chaos on Tartarus despite AMPLE evidence to the contrary.
EmilCrane wrote:Anyone have any ideas what the next race will be?
Also, will there be a SM campaign, I quite like my squad leaders.
As said earlier in the thread, bets for the new race are leaning towards either: IG, Inquisition, or some kind of mixture of both.
I honestly can't see Relic taking out the SM campaign....though if the new race is IG, they could do something like WA where the Marines are more there as a side support role. Maybe the campaign could be that you're the leader of the IG Battle Group sent to investigate what in Terra's Holy Name the Blood Ravens are up to. I'd like to think that a civil war in a SM chapter (and more importantly, the Chapter Master going rogue) would be something that'd escape the local Imperial governor's attention for long.
Because they've already progressed to level thirty, one of them becoming a full fledged captain. Their abilities were highly lethal and they basically just walked through any threats before them shy of a greater daemon. They killed two avatars, and commanded tanks in a massive assault, and so on and so forth with their awesome, seemingly godlike abilities.
Unless Relic has us play the characters with all their abilities removed, I don't foresee them coming back. They're just too strong to start out with.
Plus they'd have to decide on who actually became corrupted at the end of the campaign.
If we start with new characters, then they don't have that fish to fry.
I just saw on the DOW website that in a interview the developers said that all the campaigns may not be taking place at the same time. So we could keep the marines as we have them and pick up the story were chaos rising left off.
ChrisWWII wrote:As far as I could tell, Toth was merely a misguided Inquisitor who suspected the wrong Blood Raven of heresy. He's also renown for being a bit of an idiot for not sensing Chaos on Tartarus despite AMPLE evidence to the contrary.
He new there was some Chaos he just didn't know to what degree, there was an Ork War going on that was a huge distraction as was planned by the Alpha Legion. He felt that Gabriel was corrupted do to the events that took place on Cyrenne.
- 4 squads instead of 6 , if you dont want to field all 4, they can be replaced with standard units.
- Find and capture command posts to be able to field bigger units / more little units what ever you want. and how many you can build depends on your pop cap,
- you can decide to shelve a commander in favour of being able to have for example a seer council , basically double edged sword to what unit you decide to take with you.
-Autarch picture
"As you can tell , your decision about who to take often comes down t what abilities and kit you've unlocked for your heroes. The clever thing is that your not just upgrading the heroes themselves ; if there is one you dont like and never take , that would be a pretty boring process , so alot of their traits are double edged , they unlock an ability for themselves but also change or upgrade the squad his replaced with you if you bench him."
basically means you arent locking yourself into one set of units.
- more of an army building game
- resources are back
- Points / power and other stuff to further increase your population cap
- So you can choose to go off course on the mission to unlock more and better units or you can still use micromanagement well to win the day.
-upgrades at the end of mission , choice between elite army or eliter commanders etc
-Four races have four heroes each more than four alternatives to those heroes , and a whole army with seven different kinds of units each with two unique upgrades , so basically 40 units to play with.
-Tyranids have only one hero in the campaign , the swarm lord.
- tyranids have up to around 140 units , carnifex worth roughly 25 pop cap for SP
- The ork warboss has a "battlewagon" basically rams stuff , is it a new unit or a Truk modified idk.
- Missions are similar to Chaos rising in the fact they are carefully scripted but dont always end up like boss battles ! hurray !
-Alot of missions are unique to each race , with only a few being common to each campaign.
- Each races campaign might not be in the same time period , the guy just said " it would give away the plot too much".
- Tyraninds fight tyraninds ( disconnected from hivemind)
-Orkz fight Orkz (different clans)
-Eldar fight eldar (different craftworlds)
- somtimes you have to capture a headquarters before you can start building up more units.
- Crates are back but now contain resources as well as wargear.
- Mid mission upgrades were also mentioned , were they just for the ordinary units or commanders ? probably ordinary.
Dow2 was supposedly going to be shipped with multiple campaign races but due to lack of time it wasnt.
So retribution has bigger armies and more to field but they claim to hold on to the roleplaying still.
Eldar fighting Eldar? I hope it actually makes sense and doesn't subscribe to the Gotoverse.
Also, does the Autarch's head look the same as the Warp Spider Exarch's head?
Either way, if Tyranids can actually field up to 140 units, then this standalone game is actually becoming more and more interesting to me. Perhaps it'll be more like DoW1.
Well, 140 units being 140 gaunts/gants, not actually 140 squads of course.
If you mean "more like DoW1" as in "you'll be building a huge complex of buildings and watching grots tapping away at things", the answer is no, it won't. If you mean "more like DoW1" as in "you'll see lots of units of completely identical squad members marching and fighting in perfect formation with perfectly timed footsteps", the answer is no again. If you mean "more like DoW1" as in "a single squad of guardsmen with a commissar beats a squad of tacticals", the answer is also probably going to be no. If you mean "more like DoW1" in that cover doesn't matter and most maps don't even have it to begin with, then the answer is definitely going to be no. DoW1 was, and remains, a heavily flawed game.
Melissia wrote:Well, 140 units being 140 gaunts/gants, not actually 140 squads of course.
If you mean "more like DoW1" as in "you'll be building a huge complex of buildings and watching grots tapping away at things", the answer is no, it won't. If you mean "more like DoW1" as in "you'll see lots of units of completely identical squad members marching and fighting in perfect formation with perfectly timed footsteps", the answer is no again. If you mean "more like DoW1" as in "a single squad of guardsmen with a commissar beats a squad of tacticals", the answer is also probably going to be no. If you mean "more like DoW1" in that cover doesn't matter and most maps don't even have it to begin with, then the answer is definitely going to be no. DoW1 was, and remains, a heavily flawed game.
Edit: Manchu edited the original post, so I see no need to keep a record.
But in all honesty, the one thing I did like about DoW1, that DoW2 just can't offer me is the scale. Were things a little weird in that the squads lined up in perfect rows to shoot at each other? Yeah, definitely. As was said, DoW1 was not perfect in any sense of the word. What it was, however, was a fun game that was great for getting people interested in the universe with just the sheer scale of things blowing up. It's the scale of DoW1, I want to return to, not the mechanics, and I'm sure that's what Absolutionis was going for too.
I could deal with both ways to be honest. I miss the economics aspects and basebuilding, it's such an intrinsic part of the rts experience for me. (Currently enjoying SCII)
That being said, DOW2 was fun for me, but it felt to me too much like a normal rts, and what they took away wasnt outweighed by the additions in terms of stuff to do and manage. A little more control somehow, or a more dynamic system for combat in the DOW2 style would do it for me. Killteam type stuff as opposed to 4 squads that function as 4 individuals (except the revive mechanic). Would prefer 4 ultra badass characters with a more rubust combat engine for resolving fights, not to the point of taking direct control of their actions, but something a little deeper than stand beside this and shoot til he is dead or you are.
Absolutionis wrote:Eldar fighting Eldar? I hope it actually makes sense and doesn't subscribe to the Gotoverse.
Also, does the Autarch's head look the same as the Warp Spider Exarch's head?
The faces are somewhat similar. But the Autarch appears to add a hime-cut while iirc the Warp Spider Exarch didn't do anything with his hair.
Regarding cover - DoW1 had it. Things like craters would provide a defensive benefit to your troops, while being caught in water would actually increase the damage you'd take from enemy fire. DoW2 has a nice cover system except that...
- Every time I try to line up my guys with the cover, the little colored dots seem to end up on the wrong side of the terrain or don't connect to it at all.
- There are too many ways to easily destroy cover. The Space Marine Commander's charge ability comes to mind...
- Building use all too frequently amounts to piling all of your guys into a building, and then immediately piling them all back out again before the grenade timer counts down to 0.
Because they've already progressed to level thirty, one of them becoming a full fledged captain. Their abilities were highly lethal and they basically just walked through any threats before them shy of a greater daemon. They killed two avatars, and commanded tanks in a massive assault, and so on and so forth with their awesome, seemingly godlike abilities.
lol Sounds like ADB or Reynolds wrote the characters. I mean invulnerable gods anyone?
It isn't so much the writing as simply building your characters to be more powerful through proper management of leveling up, like in any roleplaying game certain combinations can be quite broken.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Eumerin wrote: - Every time I try to line up my guys with the cover, the little colored dots seem to end up on the wrong side of the terrain or don't connect to it at all.
- There are too many ways to easily destroy cover. The Space Marine Commander's charge ability comes to mind...
- Building use all too frequently amounts to piling all of your guys into a building, and then immediately piling them all back out again before the grenade timer counts down to 0.
1: Right click and hold, move the mouse in the direction you wnat the squad to face. An arrow will show up, and the dots will move to the appropriate facing. Alternatively, try clicking behind rather than on the terrain.
2: There's also ways to create cover. Would you rather the FC stop at every little piece of terrain that gets into him? Some places can have quite a bit of said terrain blocking his charge.
3: It can be, but in my experience putting Avitus in a building can quite easily keep most enemies away from it long enough for Thaddeus to jump in and get them to focus on him. If all else fails, Tarkus' taunt will keep them from grenading the building if he's not in it.
Melissia wrote:1: Right click and hold, move the mouse in the direction you wnat the squad to face. An arrow will show up, and the dots will move to the appropriate facing. Alternatively, try clicking behind rather than on the terrain.
Blame it on cludgy mouse skills if you want, but even knowing how it's supposed to work doesn't seem to solve the issues.
2: There's also ways to create cover. Would you rather the FC stop at every little piece of terrain that gets into him? Some places can have quite a bit of said terrain blocking his charge.
Have the FC hop over the terrain if you must. But having him "explode" multiple low-wall sections just because he kinda sorta happened to get close to it while charging is a bit silly. The jump troops are similar, with their ability to "explode" terrain that they land somewhat close to.
Ill say here what i said over at 40k online
my money is on the daemon hunters being the new race for these reasons
1- The =I= symbol cannot be simply misplaced and is clearly a giveaway, also the title of retribution meaning 'Punishment' which the Inq as a whole is fond of delivering.
2- Gabriel has ties with the Ordo Malleus through Inquisitor Toth, who kinda owes him one for saving his girly ass.
3- There is a greater daemon bound into aurelia, and word of the Blood Ravens chaotic heresies are probably on inquisitorial ears, meaning that the Grey Knights, Not Sisters or Deathwatch would be called in on the matter.
smithmyster666 wrote:Ill say here what i said over at 40k online
my money is on the daemon hunters being the new race for these reasons
1- The =I= symbol cannot be simply misplaced and is clearly a giveaway, also the title of retribution meaning 'Punishment' which the Inq as a whole is fond of delivering.
2- Gabriel has ties with the Ordo Malleus through Inquisitor Toth, who kinda owes him one for saving his girly ass.
3- There is a greater daemon bound into aurelia, and word of the Blood Ravens chaotic heresies are probably on inquisitorial ears, meaning that the Grey Knights, Not Sisters or Deathwatch would be called in on the matter.
also, it would coincide with the possible release of codex: GK, which would actually be good marketing for GW, I expect the world to end in the coming months.
If a GK codex ever comes out I will finally take up a SM army, they are just so cool. Unless the codex does them no justice Also nice sig there Grundz, gotta ask - Why would a psychic ability be stopped by a few brambles or trees? I always wonder how you get cover saves from them.
And Space Marines aren't 'elite shooty' with 'elite choppy' CSM? And don't forget Eldar! Which are just plain 'elite everything'. THat's three elite armies right there.
What I'm imaginging from the Guard right now, is that maybe you choose some kind of doctrine or regimental type. E.g. Infantry Company, Armored Fist Platoon, Artillery Battery, etc. From there you get to choose what direction you go. Infantry Company would lead up to getting something like Storm Troopers, with lots of Heavy Weapons teams.
Armoured will give you Chimeras, and maybe take a Leman Russ or 2 as the top unit, potentially having multiple types of LR.
Artillery is pretty much self explanatory. Basilsks, Basilisks, and more Basilisks!
Marines: Elite, durable shooty, with some assault elements
Chaos: Elite durable assaulty, with some horde elements.
Eldar: Elite fast shooty, with some assault elements
Orks: Durable horde assaulty, with waaagh!
Tyranids: More specialized horde assaulty, with synapse
Add in Guard and you'd have:
Guard: Cheap horde shooty, with vehicle/arty support
By arty I'm thinking primarily mortar barrages, with bassilisk barrages as the bombardment option (the last support ability).
Yeah, let's face it, bassies are too OP for this game outside of the single player. Which if Guard gets in and gets its own campaign, you can bet you'll see basilisk bombardments.
Didn't we already have bassie support in the single player so far? I think thats what the signum (not sure if thats what it is called) and that doctrine idea sounds like how company of heroes works so I could see that in if they want.
xxmatt85 wrote:I really hope that IG would finally be a playable faction.
I second this, The renderings are already in the game from the original DOW 2. Why not just add some vehicles and call it another cheap way to make money and make people happy.
Orkfantic wrote:Didn't we already have bassie support in the single player so far? I think thats what the signum (not sure if thats what it is called) and that doctrine idea sounds like how company of heroes works so I could see that in if they want.
Nope, the arty support provided by the PDF is probably mortars or somesuch. The basilisk bombardment is in the first level of Chaos Rising and is a MUCH larger blast and deadlier effect (which is why you don't want to get hit by it).
You say OP as if the table top performance of the unit is gonna be duplicated exactly when it is included. I on the other hand believe THQ can ballance whatever they include quite well, if not initially then in a patch or two things should be working well.
That is true, and that's what they did in DoW1 (we didn't see Basilisks one shotting Marine Squads on the far side of the map there, did we? )
BUt going off the scale they're using for DoW2, I have to agree with Melissia....it's unlikely they'll be putting Basilisks in, just because Basilisks are first and foremost, long range toys. They like being killy from much further away than the edge of the map, so I'm thinking THQ will recognize this. But yes....so yeah, maybe we'll see Colossuses, or maybe even Medusas as those seem like the kinds of things that'd be fighting closer to the front....ESPECIALLY the Medusa.
Actually yes, tabletop performance IS represented in DoW2.
Plasma cannons, for example, destroy almost anything they hit unles you're behind cover, while grenades often just knock Marines around instead of killing htem.
I just thought of a scenario where you could play with Basilisks on the map itself. Maybe as the IG, you have to play a mission with you being forced to defend your artillery against a Tyranid attack, and after fighting off a few waves of bugs, you get to take control of the Bassies to clear the map.
I thought that artillery was really well represented in Company of Heroes... I doubt it would be that hard to properly represent it in Dawn of War 2 if they really wanted to.
It's the balance that matters. Keep in mind, there's no munitions resource in DoW2-- but there IS a tertiary resource for all factions, which is generated slightly differently for each. Which means that munitions is replaced by, say, Zeal for Space Marines. Space Marines spend 450(?) Zeal for Orbital Bombardment, which is three orbital lance strikes in a triangle formation. I can very much imagine that a Basilisk/Earthshaker Bombardment would be Guard's version of this, with several Earthshaker rounds landing within a certain area.
Mortars (possibly the heavy support vehicle-mounted mortars as tier three units) would be the mobile equivalent which does not cost tertiary resources to fire.
Autarch and Battlewagon were confirmed in a PC Gamer magazine.
With a Battlewagon, it means that it's possible the scale will move up, but they were only mentioned for single player so it has yet to be seen if it will for multiplayer.
“The dead will bear death, the damned shall be damned, every soul of a craftworld lost, slain without a word.” - Veldoran
The Eldar are an ancient race of aliens, whose soldiers spend lifetimes mastering their path in warfare. Many Eldar possess strong psychic abilities, including the ability to see into the future. With their psychic abilities and advanced technology, highly mobile Eldar forces can leave an enemy reeling and chasing shadows.
The Eldar in sub-sector Aurelia are an unseen hand in many events. The Eldar of Craftworld Alaitoc are led by Autarch Kayleth, and her elite force is the focus of the Eldar campaign in Dawn of War II: Retribution.
Kayleth is cold, curt, and pragmatic. She is a master of the art of warfare and strategy, focused on victory and how best to achieve it for her people in each engagement. As a master warrior, she has an arsenal of lethal abilities at her disposal to throw the enemy off balance or eliminate them. Her standard Jump ability will put her right in the thick of the fight, where Kayleth truly shines. A fully upgraded ability called Skyleap far exceeds the distance that the Jump ability allows her to cover, and along the route of her travel during the leap volleys of grenades drop. This path of destruction is followed by Kayleth dropping in just as the dust begins to settle, to lay waste to any survivors.
Ronahn is a former Pathfinder of Ulthwe, but he has renounced his ties to the Seer-led craftworld and now wanders the stars. He remains loyal to his race, assisting them when called upon, and finds himself allied with Kayleth. Ronahn’s abilities involve infiltration and dealing damage from a distance. His base Infiltrate ability that allows him to go unseen by the enemy can be upgraded to include a Holo-field that will also camouflage nearby infantry units. Ronahn epitomizes the Eldar ability to get the enemy to chase shadows.
Veldoran is an aged and experienced Warlock accompanying Kayleth on her mission. As a powerful psyker, he interprets the prophetic visions of the Farseers and brings his power to bear during combat in a variety of ways. His basic starting ability is Immolate, which sets an area on fire and engulfs anyone in the vicinity in flames. In addition to dealing damage, Veldoran’s talents can also be used to heal himself. His Siphon ability will take the life force from nearby enemy units, granting Veldoran more health and the ability to stay in the fight longer.
Elenwe is a Farseer, a master of prediction, helping to guide Kayleth on her mission. In addition to using her powers to preserve Eldar lives and determine the best path for the group to travel, Elenwe’s powers can be brought down on enemy units. Her base ability, Spiritual Rites, heals nearby friendly units, but her Time Field ability shows the true power of the Farseer. When activated, time slows down for enemy units in the given area but not for the Eldar. Few abilities can change the face of battle as those possessed by Elenwe.
Prophecy guides the Eldar Campaign in Dawn of War II: Retribution. Opening the campaign is Kayleth on a mission to reach a human, a “Scion of the Emperor”, before the Ork savages that are patrolling the area. The Ork Freebooters are getting in the way of their mission, and must be dealt with.
Definitely sounds suitably interesting....I'm already asking questions about the fluff with this game. Hopefully, they answer these questions reasonably...
I'd be dissapointed as hell if they fail horribly with this.....
I'm just glad the "player character" (IE, Kayleth) is female. And an autarch!
Yes, that does make a difference to me. Call me petty if ya want, but it's nice to see a female lead for once.
And one that is a complete badass to boot.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Another entry, this one on the Autarch in multiplayer. Sadly, she is not a hero unit, but a called-in summonable unit:
In Dawn of War II: Retribution, all races will have access to a fearsome new unit in multiplayer games. For the Eldar that will be the Autarch, a powerful commander of their forces with unparalleled strategic abilities. When called upon the Autarch will engage in combat, bringing a deep understanding of the art of war to bear on the enemy.
The Autarch is quite a unique unit in the game because it is not trained or created as other units are. It is actually called upon from the global ability bar, where you can call in game changing powers like the Eldritch Storm.
Unit: Autarch
Availability: Tier 2
Abilities:
Fleet of Foot – Greatly increases the unit’s speed but reduces the Autarch’s damage output for the duration of the ability.
Leap – Soar through the air and land at the targeted location. Upon landing the Autarch increases the speed, damage, health and of nearby infantry units.
Skyleap – The Autarch jumps high into the atmosphere, returning to the global ability bar to be called in for a reduced cost.
The Autarch descends to the battlefield when called in from the global ability bar. The unit can be dropped into any hot spot on the map, provided you have line of sight on the drop zone. A volley of grenades dropped from the sky precedes the Autarch, and you can strategically place where each of the grenades lands. Do you want them all to drop on an enemy strong point? No problem. Want one to fall on each of the three enemy squads you’re facing? Done. While they’re picking up the pieces, the Autarch lands to engage the survivors.
With the versatility of being called in anywhere your forces are, the Autarch can be just what you need to swing the outcome of a critical battle in your favor. Once the battle is won, use Skyleap to return the Autarch to the global ability bar to be called on at a reduced cost, and with another volley of grenades to announce its arrival.
No, it's nice to see some break away from the 'gruff, manly, over dosed testosterone man' lead from video games. Even I get tired of playing as that at some point. This is a nice change, and the fact that they're not playing up the fact that the character is female is a welcome plus.
I'm just getting very excited to see where they're going with this. So far, the fluff and story sound good, the characters mildly interesting....though I'm still dying of curiosity to see confirmations about our suspicions for the new race.
Edit:
Bad 40k fanfiction? Oh gods, that sounds like it could be dangerous....I've tried to keep myself to the tvtropes 'recommended works' page. Cancels out Sturgeon's Law rather nicely.
Edit 2:
As far as the new race goes, current betting on dakka says either Imperial Guard or some kind of Inquisition force.
I don't think we have to worry about Relic screwing up story wise. They have had a long time of working with the 40k IP. They know how the universe works and if the Chaos Rising campaign is anything to go by they are getting better with practice.
Melissia wrote:Because they've already progressed to level thirty, one of them becoming a full fledged captain. Their abilities were highly lethal and they basically just walked through any threats before them shy of a greater daemon. They killed two avatars, and commanded tanks in a massive assault, and so on and so forth with their awesome, seemingly godlike abilities.
Unless Relic has us play the characters with all their abilities removed, I don't foresee them coming back. They're just too strong to start out with.
Actually, wouldn't it be nice to see them as Captains, as Thule's spot is vacated? I mean, I normally dont get attached to characters in games, but this little band of brothers, its good work with immersion. Plus, we still have the rest of the blood ravens to... meet and greet?
Autarch is confirmed for multiplayer. It is not a new commander, instead it's a unit that's similar to the Librarian or Weirdboy but is called in via a global ability.
Confirmed abilities are Fleet of Foot (of course), but he also has a Leap ability, like the ASM jump, except that where he lands he basically gives a buff similar to the Avatar aura.
A third ability is called: Skyleap – The Autarch jumps high into the atmosphere, returning to the global ability bar to be called in for a reduced cost.
I picked this DOW up a couple of weeks ago. I tried to get it to play on my laptop and it doesn't work for me. If anyone is interested, I'll sell it to you for 40 bucks. ( I have the one with both games)
Looked like a great game until I tried to play it.
(PM me so as not to sidebar the conversation, please.)
I really like this game, but the dual sign up really doesn't do it for me.
Patch? No. It's something they signed up for that they're now regreatting, as they had thought that Games for Windows Live had a decent matchup service. They don't, so they're having their next expansion be Steam only. There's not much they can do about DoW2 and its first expansion, unfortunately.
Automatically Appended Next Post: As a side note, your CD key is tied to your live account and your steam account, so trying to resell the game is kinda ripping someone off.
Melissia wrote:I'm just glad the "player character" (IE, Kayleth) is female. And an autarch!
Yes, that does make a difference to me. Call me petty if ya want, but it's nice to see a female lead for once.
Seems to be an Eldar thing with Relic. Their Farseers are always female, and they had a female Eldar as the player in the various Eldar campaigns for DoW1 (no doubt due to the fact that the Farseers was set as female in the original campaign). The Harlequin was also female, iirc.
Of course, other than making the Inquisitor female, there wasn't much leeway with the other races...
Unit: Autarch
Availability: Tier 2
Abilities:
Fleet of Foot – Greatly increases the unit’s speed but reduces the Autarch’s damage output for the duration of the ability.
Leap – Soar through the air and land at the targeted location. Upon landing the Autarch increases the speed, damage, health and of nearby infantry units.
Skyleap – The Autarch jumps high into the atmosphere, returning to the global ability bar to be called in for a reduced cost.
The Autarch descends to the battlefield when called in from the global ability bar. The unit can be dropped into any hot spot on the map, provided you have line of sight on the drop zone. A volley of grenades dropped from the sky precedes the Autarch, and you can strategically place where each of the grenades lands. Do you want them all to drop on an enemy strong point? No problem. Want one to fall on each of the three enemy squads you’re facing? Done. While they’re picking up the pieces, the Autarch lands to engage the survivors.
With the versatility of being called in anywhere your forces are, the Autarch can be just what you need to swing the outcome of a critical battle in your favor. Once the battle is won, use Skyleap to return the Autarch to the global ability bar to be called on at a reduced cost, and with another volley of grenades to announce its arrival.
Sounds suspiciously like a Swooping Hawk. Will she be armed with a LasBlaster as well?
Autarchs bounced between several aspect paths, I believe, before settling on the battlefield commander job. So they can use a number of the aspect weapons & abilities.
Eumerin wrote:Of course, other than making the Inquisitor female, there wasn't much leeway with the other races...
Any Guard officer, commissar, priest, techpriest, stormtrooper, etc can be female. Necrons can be either gender, assuming the Necrontyr had genders to begin with the C'tan didn't likely notice any difference between male or female Necrontyr. Tau commanders can be male or female. Chaos cultists are not restricted based off of gender (nor, arguably, are chaos space marines). Sisters naturally are all-female.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Grog wrote:Autarchs bounced between several aspect paths, I believe, before settling on the battlefield commander job. So they can use a number of the aspect weapons & abilities.
Right.
In the campaign, the wings are default equipment, but likely not the only equipment. They probably also have access to warp spider backpacks, banshee masks, and so on. If the Force Commander can have a teleporter and jump pack, I don't see why an Autarch can't.
Getting information out of the DoW2 forums is a pain. They always revert to jokes bout a fictional wookie army any time someone mentions... well, anything relevant. Even the Eldar campaign characters topic devolved into a "wookie faction" thread.
Somehow the mods there are bigger trolls than the rest of the posters.
In the picture for the Swarmlord, I think I see pieces of flak armor, and regular human (non-PAd) body parts on the ground...more evidence for Guard?
I do rather like this though, Tyranid campaign definitely does seem interesting. I was worried it'd just be a 'attack, nom, attack, nom' repeated ad nauseum, but it looks like they've managed to work out a prety good plot for the 'Nids.
ChrisWWII wrote:In the picture for the Swarmlord, I think I see pieces of flak armor, and regular human (non-PAd) body parts on the ground...more evidence for Guard?
I do rather like this though, Tyranid campaign definitely does seem interesting. I was worried it'd just be a 'attack, nom, attack, nom' repeated ad nauseum, but it looks like they've managed to work out a prety good plot for the 'Nids.
And it looks like that helmet is falling to the ground as well. Who knows, but I bet it is guard or Inquisition. (Look at the I in Retribution, dosen't that look familiar?)
Melissia wrote:Getting information out of the DoW2 forums is a pain. They always revert to jokes bout a fictional wookie army any time someone mentions... well, anything relevant. Even the Eldar campaign characters topic devolved into a "wookie faction" thread.
Somehow the mods there are bigger trolls than the rest of the posters.
This is why I left those forums long ago. I got tired of their Mods arbitrarily locking interesting threads just because they're not interested in the subject.
Melissia wrote:Patch? No. It's something they signed up for that they're now regreatting, as they had thought that Games for Windows Live had a decent matchup service. They don't, so they're having their next expansion be Steam only. There's not much they can do about DoW2 and its first expansion, unfortunately.
Automatically Appended Next Post: As a side note, your CD key is tied to your live account and your steam account, so trying to resell the game is kinda ripping someone off.
My game does not even load, so the CD key hasn't even been used yet. I can't access any accounts, so the game is pretty much new and opened.
Doesn't load on my computer, no steam account, so it is what it is. A game who needs a home in someone elses house.
ChrisWWII wrote:In the picture for the Swarmlord, I think I see pieces of flak armor, and regular human (non-PAd) body parts on the ground...more evidence for Guard?
Personally I wouldn't read too much into that. I agree that the Guard is the most likely new faction. But since they already exist as a computer controlled army within the original release, I suspect that they'll appear in the single-player campaigns regardless of whether or not they're also made playable.
Not really. After the patches, SS is definitely better than DC.
Automatically Appended Next Post: As a more on topic note, patch 2.6 is announced, Relic is attempting to fix the bugs caused by Games For Windows Live's most recent release. Yeah, screw you too Microsoft.
Melissia wrote:Not really. After the patches, SS is definitely better than DC.
Automatically Appended Next Post: As a more on topic note, patch 2.6 is announced, Relic is attempting to fix the bugs caused by Games For Windows Live's most recent release. Yeah, screw you too Microsoft.
I just thought DC was smaller and the campaign made more sense, so I liked it more. And if we can top using fething windows live. (That program disconnect my headphones, they are plugged in but it dosent pick them up, or dose and just continues to play through my laptops crappy speakers) So when in 2011 do we get the DoW2: Retribution beta?
Yes, but it's not installed right now. I'm kinda waiting for retribution. Logging in to windows live is annoying as all hell.
By the way, the battlewagon is confirmed for Orks. It's a combination heavy transport, artillery unit, and heavy tank, with a deff rolla ability which allows them to decimate things which get in their path while the deff rolla is activated (I imagine it costs tertiary resource to activate). Dunno about Marines-- their new unit will be released this upcoming thursday/friday (either them or chaos at any rate).
My guess is that after the marines and chaos get their new units / campaign characters announced (it's been confirmed that all factions have a new campaign), they'll announce the new faction, and begin a rundown of its units, leading up to the public beta.
Steam may or may not have screwed up on revealing the new race. I added Retribution to my wishlist and I'm staring at a witchhunter right now for it's game picture under my wishlist.
Enemies of the Emperor take heed, the Space Marine Land Raider will be taking the field in Dawn of War II: Retribution. One of the most powerful battle tanks in the Imperium’s arsenal, the Land Raider carries a number of different types of weapons to deal with enemy threats, laying down a tremendous amount of fire. Capable of transporting troops and shrugging off attacks from all but the most destructive weaponry, the Land Raider is a major force on the battlefield whether it is supporting or spearheading an attack.
Unit: Land Raider Redeemer
Availability: Tier 3
Abilities:
Frag Assault – Launch a volley of grenades, knocking back and dealing heavy damage to most infantry units.
Retreat Beacon – When activated, all squads will retreat to the Land Raider beacon.
A late game behemoth, the Land Raider Redeemer is expensive and powerful. Although it is not particularly agile or quick, it’s dual Flamestorm Cannons spew enough fire to melt any infantry to get near. The Land Raider can serve as a base of operations for Space Marine players. With the Retreat Beacon activated, squads can quickly retreat to the Land Raider instead of the Space Marine base. Squads near the Land Raider can be reinforced, replacing lost squad members, and get back in the fight much more quickly than having to make the run to and from their base.
A Land Raider Redeemer parked near a strategically important sector, be it a power generator farm or Victory Point, can be a strong deterrent to enemy attack. Anything that comes close will have to be set to deal with a wall of fire, bolts, and frags.
Besides who's to say if we get sisters or simly an inquisition led guard. The guard option gives a cool campaing base and fancervice for mutiplayer, while the sister otion gives THQ a chance to implement a tabletop race just before GW are supposed to redesign it. Need i remind how much gripe DoW 1 got for having ugly wraithlords in it.
Kanluwen wrote:It's easier to implement a Guard force that uses Elysian D-99 or the Cadian Kasrkin Regiments as a base.
It's not an 'easier' way, it's just 'another' way.
My point is you can have 'bits' of Guard with an Inquisitorial force whilst maintaining the 'skirmish' level combat of DoWII. Guard are, by their nature, far more expansive than a skirmish force. The theme of the Guard is legions of men and tanks. That may have (almost) worked in DoWI, but not so much DoWII unless they change the scale of the game.
And yes, they could choose one of the more elite small-scale Guard forces, but why bother? Just to say they included Guard? As I said, the Inquisitorial side of things requires no work, and no fancy shenanigans with Veteran/Elysian/Kasrkin forces to shoe-horn it into DoW's style of game play. That's 'easier'.
I do not know if this has been covered but they have listed the Marine campaign charters. Its Apollo, Cyrus, Martellus, and some dude named the Ancient.
On a side note who was the traitor according to the canon?
Kanluwen wrote:It's easier to implement a Guard force that uses Elysian D-99 or the Cadian Kasrkin Regiments as a base.
It's not an 'easier' way, it's just 'another' way.
My point is you can have 'bits' of Guard with an Inquisitorial force whilst maintaining the 'skirmish' level combat of DoWII. Guard are, by their nature, far more expansive than a skirmish force. The theme of the Guard is legions of men and tanks. That may have (almost) worked in DoWI, but not so much DoWII unless they change the scale of the game.
I'll agree with you on the scale of the game bit.
Hopefully they finally just buck up and use the Company of Heroes unit caps. That would solve alot of the "skirmish" issues.
And yes, they could choose one of the more elite small-scale Guard forces, but why bother? Just to say they included Guard? As I said, the Inquisitorial side of things requires no work, and no fancy shenanigans with Veteran/Elysian/Kasrkin forces to shoe-horn it into DoW's style of game play. That's 'easier'.
There's no shoehorning it in or fancy shenanigans. Those forces exist, it's not a Mary Sue like Starkiller or C.S. Goto.
Orkfantic wrote:I do not know if this has been covered but they have listed the Marine campaign charters. Its Apollo, Cyrus, Martellus, and some dude named the Ancient.
On a side note who was the traitor according to the canon?
Apollo as in Apollo Diomedes? And how is Martellus going to be in the game? That just seems odd
Btw the traitor(s):
Spoiler:
If you go corrupt then it can be any of your squadmates save for the FC and Thule, if you are pure it's Martellus, also Apollo can die making your list of playable characters even weirder
I'm so confused about the canon now. Does that mean that there's no save importing of any kind? I have a corrupt save and a pure save. Both would be completely incompatible with the new SM roster.
I have no idea who got corrupted officially, I assumed it was Martellus. This is just baffling now. But only 2 previous members are carrying over, so take that as you will.
Surtur wrote:I have no idea who got corrupted officially, I assumed it was Martellus. This is just baffling now. But only 2 previous members are carrying over, so take that as you will.
I also thought Martellus was evil, and I killed him! I'm guessing this means the pure good storyline is not canon!
Did they ever give a reason for why Eliphas ditched the Word Bearers and joined the Black Legion?
Also, hold on, I notice that the Redeemer and the Battlewagon are listed as "Multiplayer" units. Is this saying that these units will not be available in single-player?
I think that just means skirmish in general whether it be custom, public, or private.
But I bet there'll be a climactic, epic, mission where you command the Land Raider/Battlewagon.
As for Eliphas he's a self-serving, power-hungry,evil space jockey. He probably thought the Black Legion would serve his ambitions better than Word Bearers. Though seems a little unfaithful for a Word Bearer.
Also it is confirmed that the chaos campaign is Black Legion again right?
Orkfantic wrote:http://gnews.com/dawn-of-war-2-retribution-peers-into-the-darkness-15201057125323/
Well I think this is conformation of Sisters in Retribution or at least a huge arrow pointing towards them.
I fail to see how this points towards Sisters. Explain.
Orkfantic wrote:http://gnews.com/dawn-of-war-2-retribution-peers-into-the-darkness-15201057125323/
Well I think this is conformation of Sisters in Retribution or at least a huge arrow pointing towards them.
I fail to see how this points towards Sisters. Explain.
It simple really, it... erm... so like...
Nope i got nothing.
BTW Dunno if it has been said but On my steam profile I looked at my wishlist and the picture is of a person in a dark robe with a possible I on their hat.
ThatMG wrote:BTW Dunno if it has been said but On my steam profile I looked at my wishlist and the picture is of a person in a dark robe with a possible I on their hat.
This was confirmed on the last page. Literally the page before this one.
spireland wrote:Can't wait for this one, these guys really capture the 40k universe. THQ rocks.
THQ is only the publisher. Relic actually developed the game.
assassin wrote:if we get the inquisition I wont buy the game at all
not using gfwl makes me happy as mine started to not log me in anymore exept at 11pm :/
Why won't you buy the game if there's Inquisition in it? That seems like a really stupid reason not to buy a game. You don't have to play them if you don't want to you know.
Based on what I saw posted elsewhere, I got the impression that at least officially both Cyrus and Martellus have been declared traitors but Apollo has chosen to ignore those charges while he figures out exactly what is going on.
Or in other words, the only member of Apollo's group that could identify Martellus as the traitor is Cyrus. And Cyrus is under a cloud of suspicion himself. Which means that Martellus could still be the traitor - it's just that the loyalists from the previous expansion haven't been able to get the charges to stick.
Eumerin wrote:Based on what I saw posted elsewhere, I got the impression that at least officially both Cyrus and Martellus have been declared traitors but Apollo has chosen to ignore those charges while he figures out exactly what is going on.
Or in other words, the only member of Apollo's group that could identify Martellus as the traitor is Cyrus. And Cyrus is under a cloud of suspicion himself. Which means that Martellus could still be the traitor - it's just that the loyalists from the previous expansion haven't been able to get the charges to stick.
