In the Storm of Magic spells, the new ogre spells reference Bloodgruel as the Lore Attribute. SO, if it's anything like our current spell, it mean our butchers will be healing back wounds. Further extrapolation could be that we no longer hurt our butchers as they cast as dealing a wound then healing right back would be needlessly complicated. Don't know how many ogre players have picked up on this yet so here it is.
New set of rumours, posted by new Warseer member Bill-Boe:
I happen to know some snippets of the forthcoming ogre book. I registred for the soul reason of posting what I was told, but take with a pinch of salt:
Phil Kelly is author.
Plastic kits: Rhinox Riders (on regular Rhinoxen) (box of 3)
Scraplauncher/Skewer-slinger (Similar to Warp-cannon/plague-claw in design)
Great Mammox with three ogre crew and plastic tyrant option (Same base as Arachnarock. Imagine a cross between a musk ox and a Mammoth)
Yhetees (More gorilla-like, and and no more 80's hairstyle manes. Really dynamic for a plastic kit)
Finecast: Jahred The Red on Rhinox
Golgfag Maneater
Redone Goldtooth, Skrag, maneaters (box of 3, female, ninja and pirate discontinued), Tyrant/bruiser, gorger.
Rules:
Bull Charge will work always, even though you're less than 3 ogres and charge less than 6".
All ogres except butchers gain a basic 6+ save from their gut plates.
Ogre Clubs negates parry save, and is a general rule for all weapons like Choppas in OnG.
All army restrictions gone, but gnoblars do not count towards minimum core.
Gnoblars T2, but Sharp stuff is March and Fire, Range 10".
Weapon options for units cheaper, and minor point reductions across the board. Bulls will stay same base cost.
Magic will be standardized. Most spells will stay similar (augments) but with greater range, and can be buffed to affect more units. May also be cast on Yhetees and Gorgers.
Rhinox Riders are super-hard. They get regular stomp and D3+1 Bull Charge, and also has Devastating Charge. (Special Choice)
Scraplauncher, same but moves to Rare.
Rhinox and Mammox are mount options for Tyrant and Hunter.
Mammox can thunderstomp everything, like the SoM Bonegrinder Giant. Insane stats, but expensive (like 290 points base.). Crew can have leadbelcher swivel guns.
Hunter greatly improved. Move and fire with harpoon and monster-killing special rules.
Yhetees as in SoM, but with options for 2HW or GW, and musician now. No standard-bearer.
Leadbelchers auto-hit, and can fire every turn, but only S4, no AP. Don't come with Light Armour.
Magic Items:
Big Names Gone.
Half of items are Magic Weapons.
Tenderizer and Siegebreaker will stay.
Halfling Cookbook grants Loremaster.
There's a banner granting the same frenzy Minotaurs have.
Plastics will be out in October. Finecast in November.
Wait, what? So now Ogres are in the coveted October release slot?
The rumour mill has been saying this for some months now. Occasionally they move forward or back a month, but October has been the favourite for a while.
Sisters get a WD Codex in Aug/Sept, but not necessarily miniatures (will feature at least one new Vampire monster). September will see a special box a la Space Hulk. October is reserved for Ogres for several months now.
September = Special
October = Ogres
November = Necrons
Daemons in December..who knows?
Dwarves? I really do not know as I play very little Fantasy, but most of the above is good news for my one army I play, Ogres! I do agree that I will most the current inclination of Gutmagic and Big Names will be missed but all the other great changes (which will fundamtally leave the the same way in terms of how they play) is all very good news!
Not really anything to comment on though, most of these changes/additions were expected. Until we get some pics or some more solid info, I'm kinda 'meh' about it... which is saying something, because I've been looking forward to an OK update for about 5 years now...
Brets need a book much more than Dwarves do. Dwarves are fairly broken in non-comp, as they can shut magic phases down (always having as many dispel as you do power, for example) and have brutal shooting.
Ah, the Necron rumor thread got it wrong then. I had heard that they were projected for October.
Wow, sounds like Ogres are going to jump up pretty high on the competitive curve. Maybe I'll get all of my Minotaurs together and run them as a Counts As Ogre Kingdoms army.
nosferatu1001 wrote:Mainly because it usually goes fantasy - 40k - fantasy. Sisters followed by necrons wouldnt be ideal.
It used to, but not really any more. Ignoring the White Dwarf article that will be Sisters, actual army book releases this year are shaping up as follows...
Orcs & Goblins - Fantasy
Grey Knights - Mat Ward's Fantasy Tomb Kings - Fantasy
Storm of Magic - Fantasy
And Ogre Kingsdoms in October - Fantasy
Ogres might be nice to do again i have half an army sitting in a closet haha its about time i bring them back out, or elves im not to sure, this is promising though.
As for december releases they usually dont have anything to look forward too, christmas and all, they just give out deals like free shipping things of that nature.
I heard a while back that wood elves are due for an update but i have no further news on this besides common guess', i suppose it would be nice.
Small but important tidbit:
The last page of WD August showing the September preview is about Ogres! Seems they are a month earlier than expected (not sure what that means for the "secret box" release).
Prior to the 'new' release format (tell you nothing until a week prior to release) GW used to preview the new army the month prior to release. Maybe GW decided to keep the 1 month preview in place for army updates?
I can do better than that and supply the correct month.
September is now SeptOgre and the Ogre Kingdoms release.
Ever since Space Hulk two years ago we get a "mystery box" rumor now every year. As I said last year when the rumor started up again, have fun waiting for that. GW is not going to do that every year just because they did it once in 2009.
@agnosto
1) expensive- almost definitely, its is GW we are talking about after all 2.) long time to paint- yeah, looks like but then it depends on personal capability as well
3.) dying to cannon fire- well, you might be surprised here
agnosto wrote:And to kick a dead horse, will be expensive, take a long time to paint and die the first turn of every game to cannon fire.
That's what hiding it behind terrain is for
Yeah, a giant elephant's going to be able to hide behind something that blocks LoS.
You know, if I ever design a fantasy wargame, no army will have access to cannons or there will be a rule that reflects the fact that it is bloody difficult to hit any given object with a single cannon shot.
Wait, it actualy said flat out that the Army Book will be released in Septogre? There is a difference between a preview and a release...You better not be lying to me Kroothawk, or I'll be eating Peking Kroothawk for dinner by the end of this week...
What is big, mean and very hungry? No, it is not our chief editor, it's of course an Ogre! Next month, the Ogre Kingdoms will spread out on the pages of the White Dwarf and bring along monsters bigger than houses and guts bigger than men. Let us all marvel at the newest army book next month and find out, how the Ogres manage in battle.
I think this means no "special box" at all. I've always been very skeptical of that one... this makes sense as it leaves more room for the necrons after.
Looking forward to Ogres being interesting and relevant again! The limited army builds for 8th were a huge bummer for most, even though the army itself was better than in 7th.
Ever since Space Hulk two years ago we get a "mystery box" rumor now every year. As I said last year when the rumor started up again, have fun waiting for that. GW is not going to do that every year just because they did it once in 2009. Even if it does materialize this year, it's not going to be an every year thing, yet the rumor will probably appear every year. 1 time does not equal "n" times.
September is SEPTOGRE. There are some really cool items coming for Ogres. Who needs a "mystery box" anyway? Besides, given the new level of secrecy at GW every box is a mystery box till just days before it's available to order.
Jervis Johnson? Has he written any rules lately? Maybe I'm just burned after his last foray into codex writing. Some of you might have heard of it, it's call the Dark Angels Codex.....
Hulksmash wrote:Jervis Johnson? Has he written any rules lately? Maybe I'm just burned after his last foray into codex writing. Some of you might have heard of it, it's call the Dark Angels Codex.....
He wrote the Battle Missions book largely.
Also, Octogre will never compare to Orktober. Orktober is my favorite month, and my favorite submarine.
I like it! Though I find it funny that they ride on the shoulders of the cat things instead of their back. Damn fatties!!!! I admist I'm a little in love with that hunter on the Stonehorn thing.
AWESOME. From Phil Kelly to the gigantic beasty kit, this is a lot of good stuff for my much maligned fatties. Being able to t-stomp everything might even be enough to keep me from throwing myself completely into playing Hordes instead of 'Hams ...
Fantastic beast models. Wonder who did those and why the SoM monsters don't look as good.
Edit: I already have several different projects for those models - a demon prince, Manticore, Thunderwold riders, some skaven action. Wow, GW will get some of my money pretty soon.
There are 3 separate kits there - the Stonehorn and the mutated mammoth thing are the same kit, and the scrap launcher and cannon are the same kit. That would mean quite a pile of extra bits once you'd built a particular version.
I like the Stonehorn, and the scrap launcher. I'm not so sure about the others, as they're very busy and kind of shapeless, and I agree that the Rhinox cavalry beasties are a bit weedy (edit: okay, they're not Rhinoxes but something cat-like, apparently). Also, the riders don't look as though they're sitting on them properly. Still, these models represent a big expansion to the OK army, and could look quite impressive on the table. I've liked the OK plastics since they first appeared, but I sold them off some time ago because I had too many WHFB models that would never get painted. I'm kind of regretting that now.
Stonehorn - Epic win. GW produces an original monster, which looks eerie, magical, and yet has just enough of a naturalistic look to be believable. What happened to you, GW? You used to be about the nonsense! This guy looks like a relic of another, more primal age- everything an OK monster should be! The rider does appear to have a little more pert man-boobs than normal in the 3/4 pic. But I can forgive it for the spectacular monster. After the disappointing blandness of the SoM monsters, this is a welcome sight! -A
Rhinox? Cavalry - This is unfortunately a bit more GW's style. It's not bad... but believing that the enormous rider sits behind that enormous hump on an enormous saddle and somehow never falls off... The rhinox? faces are a bit odd as well. Are they supposed to be bears? Sabercats? Oxen? Who knows? They're just a generic angrymammal. And oddly remind me of the warhounds of chaos plastics. In a not very good way. What is it with GW and enormous back humps and tiny, tiny hindquarters? - B
Cannon of the Sky Titans - This is a fun looking model. It looks cobbled together from a pile of junk but it still retains a clear and compelling silhouette. The cannon begs further examination. The gunner is a bit bland though. You can bet if I was parked behind a *giant* erm, "extension" like that, I would at least gesture and emote.- A-
Scrap Launcha - This seems to fail in all of the ways the Cannon succeeded, which is odd because they look like variations of the same kit. It just looks like a chaotic mish-mash, and not in a good way. The old Scrap Launcha looked like a giant mess as well, but because the boring old details that held it together were boring old details like wood planks, the eye had boring bits to rest in and pull all of the mad little details together. The new kit is nothing but mad little details that simultaneously call for examination and in the end I don't feel like I examine anything. I would love to see the winding mechanism that allows all the knoblars to reset their enormous catapult. Speaking of gnoblars, kits like this succeed and fail in part by how well the gnoblars support the chaos of it all. These gnoblars look like there was an attempt made to make them "wacky" but it just looks off. Particularly the on who is holding a hammer? What's going on? Why is he precariously perched on one foot without looking like any of his weight is shifted to that foot? - C-
Hunter? Beast? - This looks like a variation of the Stonehorn, but unfortunately swaps out all of the best bits and replaces them with less inspiring design. It's not bad per se but it is much less naturalistic-looking. Why does it have two sets of tusks? Why does the larger set appear to be made out of hair at the top? Did they just bolt armour to the monsters enormous earlocks in an attempt to make some kind of super-Hasidic battering ram? The hunters have a nice set of tools and gadgets and trophies as one would think apropriate and I appreciate the attempt to try and put some reins on this guy to offset bizarre riding hump physics. The man-mammaries on the driver though are really unforgivable, and I have a sneaking suspicion that if I got a closer look at either face I would be disappointed. I applaud GW trying to put some character in the ogre faces, but these guys almost look cartoony. And they can go cartoony if they want, but mixing cartoony fat dudes with OMG OGRES EAT YOUR FACE in the same model just doesn't work. - B-
My only complaint so far is that the tiny tusks on the mount in the last pic look really superfluous and non-functional considering the beast's huge main tusks. Everything else is awesome and I will be getting at least one of each configuration (so 2 of each kit) as long as they're all plastic.
Scrap Launcha - This seems to fail in all of the ways the Cannon succeeded, which is odd because they look like variations of the same kit. It just looks like a chaotic mish-mash, and not in a good way. The old Scrap Launcha looked like a giant mess as well, but because the boring old details that held it together were boring old details like wood planks, the eye had boring bits to rest in and pull all of the mad little details together. The new kit is nothing but mad little details that simultaneously call for examination and in the end I don't feel like I examine anything. I would love to see the winding mechanism that allows all the knoblars to reset their enormous catapult. Speaking of gnoblars, kits like this succeed and fail in part by how well the gnoblars support the chaos of it all. These gnoblars look like there was an attempt made to make them "wacky" but it just looks off. Particularly the on who is holding a hammer? What's going on? Why is he precariously perched on one foot without looking like any of his weight is shifted to that foot? - C-
All I see is "Its in plastic and not metal".. Right there auto-win
Every time GW makes a new big monster kit, I wonder how long it will be til they make a squiggoth. I really like the big monster and the cannon is very cool too. Rhinoxes are okay, and I can see someone using them for Thunderwolves.
Brother SRM wrote:Every time GW makes a new big monster kit, I wonder how long it will be til they make a squiggoth. I really like the big monster and the cannon is very cool too. Rhinoxes are okay, and I can see someone using them for Thunderwolves.
Same here!
Maybe they can have a plastic Thunderhawk fly them in...
Scrap Launcha - This seems to fail in all of the ways the Cannon succeeded, which is odd because they look like variations of the same kit. It just looks like a chaotic mish-mash, and not in a good way. The old Scrap Launcha looked like a giant mess as well, but because the boring old details that held it together were boring old details like wood planks, the eye had boring bits to rest in and pull all of the mad little details together. The new kit is nothing but mad little details that simultaneously call for examination and in the end I don't feel like I examine anything. I would love to see the winding mechanism that allows all the knoblars to reset their enormous catapult. Speaking of gnoblars, kits like this succeed and fail in part by how well the gnoblars support the chaos of it all. These gnoblars look like there was an attempt made to make them "wacky" but it just looks off. Particularly the on who is holding a hammer? What's going on? Why is he precariously perched on one foot without looking like any of his weight is shifted to that foot? - C-
All I see is "Its in plastic and not metal".. Right there auto-win
I've always felt crap is crap, regardless of what it's sculpted out of. But to each their own.
Hnnnnnnggggggghhhhhh!!!!
DA BOSS YOU DO NOT NEED AN OGRE ARMY YOU SILLY BASTARD! YOU HAVE A SQUILLION UNDEAD TO PAINT! YOU DO! AND YOU WANTED TO DO HISTORICALS AFTER THAT!
But but but but-big stompy thing! Big stompy thing in the FACE?!
Monster on the top looks like a bantha, I quite like it other that the enormous nose cavity.
Cat cav seem odd, why not just rhinox cav?
Scrap launcher and cannon thing are good enough.
That mammoth thing is blindingly terrible in the face. The tusks are shoulders are tusks, it has a pin head and then other little tusks which don't have any semblance to the big tusks...
Wtf is it and why didn't it occur to them to just make a big savage looking mammoth head that would have looked great.
Again, there's a very very strong WoW graphics look to the whole lot. Which is a shame as GW had a great aesthetic to it before this 'jagged extreme' look started having a major influence.
Why is the Stonehorn making me think, finally a model that gets the scale Of Scylla Anfingrim into proportion, and wouldn't require that much green stuffing and conversion work to look right.
Some nice ideas overall though, much better beasts, (by a blinkin mile) than the Storm of Chaos monsters.
MeanGreenStompa wrote:Again, there's a very very strong WoW graphics look to the whole lot. Which is a shame as GW had a great aesthetic to it before this 'jagged extreme' look started having a major influence.
NAVARRO wrote: Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Aye, tis the reason I left the game, not the rules, or the magic, but I could see where we where headed after Orcs and Tomb Kings. I dread to think what they'll cook up for the High Elves and Empire on the next update, hell, even what the Druchii might gain. Hopefully just a manticore, but why do I sense a Sea Serpent dragged ashore by Beastmasters.
On a side note - did they drop the grey skin thing for Ogres, I thought that was one of the big things they mentioned when they first came out, to make their Ogres 'GW Unique' over other settings.
edit - just realised I got ninja'd by Flashman on that skin query, although his post wasn't there when I asked it, I swear guv.
NAVARRO wrote:
Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Aye, tis the reason I left the game, not the rules, or the magic, but I could see where we where headed after Orcs and Tomb Kings. I dread to think what they'll cook up for the High Elves
That's easy. A bigger dragon.
and Empire on the next update,
Already seen it. Landship says "Sup"
hell, even what the Druchii might gain. Hopefully just a manticore, but why do I sense a Sea Serpent dragged ashore by Beastmasters.
Because you're only thinking silly. Sea Serpents can't be "dragged ashore". But there was mention in Age of Reckoning of much bigger Hydras.
Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:I dread to think what they'll cook up for the High Elves and Empire on the next update, hell, even what the Druchii might gain.
NAVARRO wrote:Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Why else would you play Warhammer Fantasy Battles?
Indeed. I'm glad that Warhammer Fantasy Battles is finally starting to look the part. If you want to play Warhammer Ancients, just go play Warhammer Ancients.
Ogres are pretty much the only fantasy army I play now after selling my WOC and shelfing the Skaven. I'm glad to see my decision to keep them has been rewarded! I like!
For me, fantasy is all about big monsters. Without that, you're just playing a lord of the rings ripoff (the fluff not the game).
The big models are always more fun to build and paint, vs painting the same goblin 100 times. Same thing with 40K, I always use lots of tanks and as few men as possible. Maybe that's why I lose so much, but then I play like 2 times a year, yet I'm painting stuff like every other night...
NAVARRO wrote:Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Why else would you play Warhammer Fantasy Battles?
Sarcasm?
If not, well lets see... because warhammer was built inside the concept of armies of lil men beating a army of lil chaotic men and not a godzilla spam deathmatch? Yeah yeah its all Fantasy but each new update giving 2 versions of a big ass monster for each army is not only very unoriginal and boring but it gets to the point of silly all this huge monster parade... its like turning something special into something predictable and boring... thats what happening in WFB.
1.) I like how the new rumour blackout is working out 2.) Generally this is a good release, although in detail I only really love the Stonehorn model (the mammox is missing its head somehow, the rhinocats look weird, prefer the FW Rhinox Riders and the scrap laucher is good but not my cup of tea).
3.) People might also have a look at the September WarhammerForge book on Tamurkhan, as it features a lot of Chaos Ogres including one riding a Toad Dragon. The background might be interesting as well.
NAVARRO wrote:Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Why else would you play Warhammer Fantasy Battles?
Sarcasm?
If not, well lets see... because warhammer was built inside the concept of armies of lil men beating a army of lil chaotic men and not a godzilla spam deathmatch? Yeah yeah its all Fantasy but each new update giving 2 versions of a big ass monster for each army is not only very unoriginal and boring but it gets to the point of silly all this huge monster parade... its like turning something special into something predictable and boring... thats what happening in WFB.
To be fair, you can say it's a "Godzilla spam deathmatch" when you can honestly field armies consisting only of these Godzilla critters.
If not, well lets see... because warhammer was built inside the concept of armies of lil men beating a army of lil chaotic men and not a godzilla spam deathmatch? Yeah yeah its all Fantasy but each new update giving 2 versions of a big ass monster for each army is not only very unoriginal and boring but it gets to the point of silly all this huge monster parade... its like turning something special into something predictable and boring... thats what happening in WFB.
Aye, once upon a time.. Druchii where special for their many monsters.
If not, well lets see... because warhammer was built inside the concept of armies of lil men beating a army of lil chaotic men and not a godzilla spam deathmatch? Yeah yeah its all Fantasy but each new update giving 2 versions of a big ass monster for each army is not only very unoriginal and boring but it gets to the point of silly all this huge monster parade... its like turning something special into something predictable and boring... thats what happening in WFB.
Aye, once upon a time.. Druchii were special for their many monsters.
Druchii, Skaven, and Beastmen have pretty traditionally had monsters. The only difference was that the Druchii were the only ones "herding" their monsters into battle, rather than just creating the monstrosities(Skaven) or having them come along for the ride(Beastmen).
What I'd like to see for Druchii is more synergy between the monsters and infantry. Hydras being used as scaly shields for Corsairs, etc.
The monsters help each army have a centerpiece or focal point and are a welcome treat to paint! Without them each army becomes a sea of little dudes visually.
The design is amazing...they look fresh and have their own aesthetic to help them stand apart from the other wfb armies.
I'm very glad the went with normal skin tones...looks better IMO than the previous grey tones.
NAVARRO wrote:Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Why else would you play Warhammer Fantasy Battles?
Sarcasm?
No, I don't think so. WFB always had big stuff like dragons, shaggoths, mammoths and living castles floating in the sky, it just never had the tech to make them in miniature form. Now that GW have the tech people are complaining we're given the option to play with those big critters. If you're a casual gamer, skip the beasts. If you're competitive and need the monsters to win and still don't like them, maybe you're in the wrong demographic.
I'd like to make it perfectly clear though that I'm all in favor of balanced rules and Hydra casus avoidance.
Not what I was expecting, I'm assuming the lower of the two massive things is a Mammox, I would have preferred the ogres to have leadbelcher cannons rather than a whip and crossbow but otherwise both it and the Stonehorn look great
The Cannon is interesting, I think it looks like something that could be an epic conversion if it was held by a giant. The scraplauncher has a wiff of Plagueclaw Catapult, kinda like they wanted a kit to be assembled two ways, designed the cannon part and kinda cobbled the catapault together at the last minute. (The cannon also looks like it has a little Chaos Dwarf ass-cannon in it)
The Rhinox Riders (I think) aren't that good, honestly I'm gonna save up and get the FW ones instead. The creatures look more like Thunderwolves from Space Wolves than Rhinoxes and the riders look kinda spindly. If their not Rhinoxes it'll be better IMO, and given that their nothing like the other Rhinoxes, thats a possiblity
Skewer Slingers seemed to be an incorrect rumor, and I don't see new Yhetees, though they might still be there, same with Jahred The Red on Rhinox, Golgfag Maneater and the other Finecast models
Just thought on, looks to me like the Mammox ? and the Stonehorn, come from the same kit as they have the same body.
Unless the Mammox is an extra conversion kit that might make more sense, really.
Yes, like anything in Warhammer, these beasties are optional, although that argument is dependent on your gaming group also steering clear of the big stuff.
And to be fair, Ogres were conceived as THE monster army.
1. A pair of small tusks
2. A pair of giant tusks
3. A chin Horn/Tusk
4. A Forehead Horn
-Which also have two smaller horns curving down
5. A chair, made out of horns
Horns for the horn god! Tusks for the tusk throne!
How does it eat? How does it get the food to it's mouth/maw?
I thought the "thing" in the middle was a trunk at first, but I am not so sure what it is now. Even if it was a trunk it is too short to ever reach anything with all the tusks in the way.
He doesn't have two sets of tusks. Those big, curvy things are horns since they clearly don't come out of his mouth.
I guess it would have been better if the bony plates on the horns extended all the way up to the head crest. The fur there doesn't really make sense at this angle.
I like everything but the big beasties are not how i had imagined they would be , I wanted mammoths and bears and alike , but these don't look ogre-y.The rhinoxes look alright though.
NAVARRO wrote:Some nice bitz there but monstherhammer is getting silly.
Why else would you play Warhammer Fantasy Battles?
Sarcasm?
No, I don't think so. WFB always had big stuff like dragons, shaggoths, mammoths and living castles floating in the sky, it just never had the tech to make them in miniature form. Now that GW have the tech people are complaining we're given the option to play with those big critters. If you're a casual gamer, skip the beasts. If you're competitive and need the monsters to win and still don't like them, maybe you're in the wrong demographic.
I'd like to make it perfectly clear though that I'm all in favor of balanced rules and Hydra casus avoidance.
I'm not complaining that people have the option to field a monster that has always been present in WFB, and Im not even complaining the monster love parade I'm just pointing out that the fact every army gets exactly a big kit each update that doubles in 2 versions of a monster is a silly formula... some armies should have plenty of monsters others not so much but when something becomes the standart of every army its no longer a intersting fun option and becomes broken boring... one two or tree arachnocks on every army against 2 other army monsters becomes silly and adulterated way of how I envision warhammer.
As for needing something I dont like thats not even a option, 1st thing for me is cool models, the rules and companies are lateral to my enjoyment.
Why didn't GW give us Rhnox Riders? Instead we get big cat (sabertusk?) cavalry, seems kind of stupid to throw out one of the armies most favored units (which wasn't even in the army book in the first place), especially considering we now have what appears to be rhinox plastics galore...
And the mammox/stonehorn thing seems kinda on the small side, especially compared to some of the recent big beasties...
chaos0xomega wrote:
Why didn't GW give us Rhnox Riders? Instead we get big cat (sabertusk?) cavalry, seems kind of stupid to throw out one of the armies most favored units (which wasn't even in the army book in the first place)
How did they throw them out if they were never in? In all seriousness, they probably did it because the FW ones sell well and they didn't want to make them redundant.
And the mammox/stonehorn thing seems kinda on the small side, especially compared to some of the recent big beasties...
Yeah, but compare it to an arachnorok (sp?) which pretty much fills the base compared to these things which don't.
As for the Rhinox Riders, they had official rules released via White Dwarf years ago and were used by pretty much everyone and their fifth cousin. The fact that FW ones sell well is neither here nor there, consider how many other FW kits have made it into plastic. Theres also the fact that rumor mongers are saying there are no rules for Rhinox Riders in the book, which is a pretty big F-U from GW, and the rumors are cat cavalry is not nearly as good as Bull Rhinox Riders were.
NAVARRO wrote:I'm not complaining that people have the option to field a monster that has always been present in WFB, and Im not even complaining the monster love parade I'm just pointing out that the fact every army gets exactly a big kit each update that doubles in 2 versions of a monster is a silly formula... some armies should have plenty of monsters others not so much but when something becomes the standart of every army its no longer a intersting fun option and becomes broken boring... one two or tree arachnocks on every army against 2 other army monsters becomes silly and adulterated way of how I envision warhammer.
As for needing something I dont like thats not even a option, 1st thing for me is cool models, the rules and companies are lateral to my enjoyment.
Well, I'm not an expert with this whole "tactics"-thing some of you WHFB players have going on, but if I had, let's say, an Ork & Goblin army, I'd try to field the big spider only when I would also field a bunch of forest goblins so it would make sense from a fluff and asthetic point of view.
FearPeteySodes wrote:The tusks across the board look excessively angular to me, like they're going for a Blizzard aesthetic.
That said i do like them and absolutely cant wait to start cutting them to pieces.
Hey Pete, I didn't know you we're still around. Any new projects I should know about?
Back on topic: The horn overkill is just, well... overkill. And I don't like the cat cavalery. Really seems like a midded opportunity not to do Rhinox Riders. Though I expect one box with that cannon/scraplauncher will be cheaper than a Forgeworld Rhinox.
FearPeteySodes wrote:The tusks across the board look excessively angular to me, like they're going for a Blizzard aesthetic.
It's not exactly Blizzard's aesthetic, more like low poly one. Most games designed to run on low end machines adopt that kind of thing, vide Tochlight.
I guess they went for the edgy look to make them rough-cut in the extreme. A mammoth just wouldn't cut it when it's just a large cuddly elephant.
Scrap Launcha - This seems to fail in all of the ways the Cannon succeeded, which is odd because they look like variations of the same kit. It just looks like a chaotic mish-mash, and not in a good way. The old Scrap Launcha looked like a giant mess as well, but because the boring old details that held it together were boring old details like wood planks, the eye had boring bits to rest in and pull all of the mad little details together. The new kit is nothing but mad little details that simultaneously call for examination and in the end I don't feel like I examine anything. I would love to see the winding mechanism that allows all the knoblars to reset their enormous catapult. Speaking of gnoblars, kits like this succeed and fail in part by how well the gnoblars support the chaos of it all. These gnoblars look like there was an attempt made to make them "wacky" but it just looks off. Particularly the on who is holding a hammer? What's going on? Why is he precariously perched on one foot without looking like any of his weight is shifted to that foot? - C-
All I see is "Its in plastic and not metal".. Right there auto-win
/agree I own two SL's currently, both are unassembled, one used to be, then I actually played with it, and bits just kept falling off. This new kit, whic I absolutely love the look of, looks MUCH better thought out with real anchor points.
I'll probably pass on the big monster, it just screams "Hey! Shoot me with a cannon!" and there are too many dwarf and empire armies around my neck of the woods..
You know, looking more closely at the catox riders, it appears that the horn thingy that is sticking out behind the riders is in fact a horn growing out of the catoxes spine. If you look carefully, you can see what appears to be the horn going into the back of the catox between the riders legs...
If that really is the case, I'm liking them even less than before...
chaos0xomega wrote:You know, looking more closely at the catox riders, it appears that the horn thingy that is sticking out behind the riders is in fact a horn growing out of the catoxes spine. If you look carefully, you can see what appears to be the horn going into the back of the catox between the riders legs...
If that really is the case, I'm liking them even less than before...
You sure? To me, it looks like they've got a harness in front of the shoulders, with a bar extending backwards from the top that forms the basis of the saddle.
I really love the stonehorn/mammoth kit. I'm a little meh on the rhinox. The rhinox look a little small for the riders, and the cannon on the chariot is a little over the top.
I'm impressed enough that I'm rethinking whether or not to continue not buying GW product. Damn, they always lure me back in with new candy.
3 for 3 Grotsnik - every single one has appeared online weeks in advance of it appearing on GW’s site. It can’t all be deliberate, because deliberately leaking each release one after the other kinda defeats the purpose of leaking.
H.B.M.C. wrote:3 for 3 Grotsnik - every single one has appeared online weeks in advance of it appearing on GW’s site. It can’t all be deliberate, because deliberately leaking each release one after the other kinda defeats the purpose of leaking.
Maybe its a herbivore and therefore only eats from trees so not needing to put its head near the ground.... good one ogres.... ride a big scary monster in to battle.... that eats leaves.... but even though that creature looks like it should starve to death, I love the whole lot of them xD
Wow, I finally just caught up on this thread and saw all the pics. I am really impressed!
However, I'm also slightly sad. Although I'm glad Salvage & company are getting new toys... this consistent release of monsters, as Navarro was describing, is a bummer... for me it's mostly because I run a "Monster Mash" army that's looking less and less unique!
I can also assure people that, for the most part, these large monsters are not going to be all that useful in-game... mine die very consistently in 8th edition without killing hardly anything back. Monstrous Infantry, on the other hand, are quite good (i.e. regular ogres) by comparison.
Maybe if they give them really high toughness, or better, a ward save...
But kudos for going kind of out there on the models, GW! They might get more bite on these for just how far they took them, whereas the O&G releases seemed redundant and unecessary, besides the giant spider... mostly just trying to sell new models ("savage" instead of regular orcs).
H.B.M.C. wrote:3 for 3 Grotsnik - every single one has appeared online weeks in advance of it appearing on GW’s site. It can’t all be deliberate, because deliberately leaking each release one after the other kinda defeats the purpose of leaking.
I think there's a pretty good chance it is deliberate. They can "leak" photos a month or so in advance with high quality images and get people excited when they decide to.
I don't play WFB but I think all these monster releases are amazing. I want to turn that Stonehorn into some amazing Khorne super juggernaught daemon engine thing.
Herbivores tend to be much larger though than carnivores though, and tend to be just as scary!
They also tend to be more dangerous to humans and kill more of them than carnivores each year. In Africa, hippos (another pachyderm like rhinos and elephants) kill more humans each year than crocodiles. They are huge and bad-tempered highly territorial animals. In North America. pronghorns (e.g. deer, elk, moose) usually kill the most humans annually. Get too close to a stag, especially during their "angry time" while competing for mates and you'll likely not finish that army of models you were painting.
One thing I have to say is that most of these models just look too busy for their own good, there are bolts here and plates of metal there...it's more of a mess than a cool jury-rig like they had going with the metal scrap launcher.
I guess the new thing in the OK army is horns, lots and lots of horns.
Don't know why the models just can't sit on the mount, rather they have to have these over-elaborate and useless saddles which only serve to make the model look both impractical on top of being physically impractical to transport. I can see many OK models being knocked over during a battle. Another thing: why all the sharp bits? I stab myself in the finger enough with a hobby knife in general use. Why now must I suffer through this torture when not only building but painting the damn thing?
All that said, love the mammox, it's got all that yhetee appeal while looking fresh.
I guess the main issue with the aesthetic they're trying to reinvent the OK with is: it looks too intricate for a simple army. They're trying to polish the proverbial turd - Not that I dislike OK, love the tongue-in-cheek writing and general shenanigans, just that they're sticking armour plates left right and centre on a perfectly fine model and calling it a day. I would like to see that cannon or that mammox without shields being randomly thrown over non-vital areas.
I do see a lot of chaos conversions coming from these models though, fantasy and otherwise.
I agree (with some posters) that these look very busy, very visually confused, and extremely 'complex' for an army of big, lumbering simpletons. It's been all right for me that the Gnoblars have complex, impractical thingamabobs, but it really hurts the look of the ogres, in my opinion.
I don't really hate any of them, but I don't see any that I like. Given that the OK book specifically mentions rhinoxen and mammoths, and given that Forgeworld already produced both really nice, really unique looking Rhinox AND a great looking Mammoth, why invent a ton of new monsters? You did resin Rhinoxen, you are now doing plastic Rhinox, but you don't do plastic Rhinox riders? You have a great looking War Mammoth, so you instead create TWO new creatures that are roughly mammoth sized and have tusks? Why not do a War Mammoth for OK?
I'm very disappointed with most of these new releases, because I think a good plastic Mammoth and a good set of Rhinox Riders in plastic would have been a better looking, more iconic choice. I'm not opposed to big monsters, but it seems like they are cranking out big monsters for the sake of big monsters. At least I can save some money.
Sorry
They look silly to me
Too much like they have escaped from Ice Age III or some such digital animation
Like the concepts but the execution is let down by the stylisation, the ridiculously skinny waists of the beasts (you are supposed to feed your warbeasts you silly ogres) and the small size of the Rhinnox.
The last point ruins the cannon for me.
Agree with comments about the over busy detailing. Also thought it makes them look fussy and confused.
Apologies again for being negative. But am so used to seeing fine scultures that the overstylisation and cartoon appearance does nowt for me.
Far too many tusks and horns for my taste, but I'm not complainiing, tusks and horns are amongst the easiest things to replace/remove/modify.
And great to see GW are finally releasing thunderwolves, even if they look more like thundercats Seriously, they look no sillier than the one official thunderwolf model, and I'm sure someone will quickly work out a way to plonk a marine on top of one... Hmm, and maybe some third party manufacturers will make wolfy resin replacement heads too.
I'd have to see the face of the mamoth type thing for propper asessment, but the only bad thing here is the way the ogre aree mounted on the sabre-tooth cats things (which look fine to me), they look like the are floating... the rest though is a great new look for OK. The Stonehorn esp is fanastic... like nothing we've seen before.
Looking at the cavalry some more, I think it's a mix breedeof sabertusks and rhinox. Looking at the body build and the feet, it's very rhinoxish, but the head is clearly sabertuskian. Could it be that ogre's are experimenting with crossbreeding?
ChaosxVoid wrote:i was expecting a lot more then these pictures...very disappointing, i mean WTF is with all those tusks, the models are so busy *sighs*
ChaosxVoid wrote:i was expecting a lot more then these pictures...very disappointing, i mean WTF is with all those tusks, the models are so busy *sighs*
Tusks are the new skulllz
If people wern't complaining over the too many tusks/too busy models they would instead be complaining that they models were too bland. Just be happy there is as many new models as there are. You can always take off the details, it is easier to take detail off and change things than it is to add detail. Some people just can't be pleased.
ChaosxVoid wrote:i was expecting a lot more then these pictures...very disappointing, i mean WTF is with all those tusks, the models are so busy *sighs*
Tusks are the new skulllz
If people wern't complaining over the too many tusks/too busy models they would instead be complaining that they models were too bland.
Just be happy there is as many new models as there are. You can always take off the details, it is easier to take detail off and change things than it is to add detail.
Some people just can't be pleased.
Some people even complain about other people expressing diferent tastes on a subject, go figure that out... I guess its the human nature hey?
Surtur wrote:I would like to complain about people who complain about other people who complain!
You cant because thats just to much complaining and that would break the order of the universe, tsk tsk.
I don't mind the Tuskz much, yes they are plenty and everywhere but they can be used to make imposing nice terrain pieces for example... as for Skullz I thing every GW collector has a big bitz box of those.
I think the models look well sculpted, they seem a nice step over the Ogres' previous release. There are some strange design choices but no more than any normal warhammer fantasy release. If you're complaining about too many tusks or how they're infeasable there are soooooo many established things that make about as much sense. If you can suspend disbelief for a steam tanks and magic...this doesn't seem bad at all.
I'm surprised at all the negativity about these, though... I think they're pretty freaking good overall? Especially that first one... don't tell me ogre players aren't going to plop that thing down as a centerpiece and be thrilled with it?
It's also nice that they're getting new different/weird units, because the army is so 1-dimensional as is...
That said, as I posted earlier I think Navarro's point about the big 2-use monster for each fantasy army is a bit of a bummer, but ogres really can use it. However, unless the points-cost of them are quite reasonable, I'm not sure how effective they'll be...
The only model I think is silly is the sabretooth cat riders... they remind me of the savage orc board riders where they're perched on top in an unrealistic fashion. But still, I have to think that ogre players must be thrilled to have these units, and can convert accordingly?
If people wern't complaining over the too many tusks/too busy models they would instead be complaining that they models were too bland.
Just be happy there is as many new models as there are. You can always take off the details, it is easier to take detail off and change things than it is to add detail.
Some people just can't be pleased.
There is a difference between lots of well composed detail and a disorganised array of detail
The various parts don't make up a pleasing whole.
Leaving things off is a good suggestion if they are not necessary for gameplay or taste, but for my taste the mammoth has bits of skin missing and some sort of weird fisease, probably due to malnutrition.
That also contributes to making the detailing too fussy.
FWIW, this is not complaining but an aesthetic judgement and an expression of personal taste.
In the same way that many seem to like these beasties and are rightfully able express their delight.
Both views are valid on a discussion forum.
MeanGreenStompa wrote:Again, there's a very very strong WoW graphics look to the whole lot. Which is a shame as GW had a great aesthetic to it before this 'jagged extreme' look started having a major influence.
Exactly what I was thinking, it reminds me a lot of WoW's style...and I really don't want WHF or 40k turning into that. Not a fan of those unnatural-looking jagged-ass horns/tusks. I don't mind stuff being a little over-the-top now and then but this is too much for me.
Don't really understand the catbears, either. Why not rhinox cavalry? Isn't that one of the things Ogre players have been wanting/expecting this whole time? Is that the only reason, just so they can say "Boo, guess you didn't see that one coming huh?!"...the big monster will sell because people will no doubt find ways to "fix" it, these things I see people avoiding altogether though.
Maybe if the guys on the cats aren't already attached to the chairs you could forget the chair and move them down the body a bit in to a more riding pose.
RiTides wrote:I'm surprised at all the negativity about these, though... I think they're pretty freaking good overall? Especially that first one... don't tell me ogre players aren't going to plop that thing down as a centerpiece and be thrilled with it?
I would like to buy it, but I probably won't. It'd be too much work assembling it and painting it just to watch it die on the first turn to cannon.
I know I keep harping on this but it just beggars the imagination why they keep making these monsters and none of them will survive a fight vs. empire or dwarfs past the first turn of shooting. Unless they're 200 pts each, then maybe they'd be worth it and take the place of my poor slave giant that usually serves as my cannon attractant for the first turn.
Surtur wrote:I would like to complain about people who complain about other people who complain!
You cant because thats just to much complaining and that would break the order of the universe, tsk tsk.
I don't mind the Tuskz much, yes they are plenty and everywhere but they can be used to make imposing nice terrain pieces for example... as for Skullz I thing every GW collector has a big bitz box of those.
lol guys. There is already too much complaining in this forum and that was kinda my original complaint.
I understand why people might think these are OTT, but IMO Ogres were badly in need of some style. More fat guys riding nondescript furry beasts weren't going to move the needle. Plus, Ogres are probably the army most deserving of OTT large monsters.
Yeah, I agree, but I would have liked more Neolithic like they'd gone for with the beasties to that point. The monsters they got here are ok, I like that stonehorn thing, but the fat sabretusks and the pinheaded not-mammoth could really have been done better with some style rather than stylised.
Consider how much better ogres riding these would have looked:
I think the high hopes I (and others) had for Rhinox and Mammoth pieces is part of why some of us don't like the new monsters. We've seen and liked what Forgeworld has already made, but then GW puts out something else. Not only is the look of the monsters quite different (is part of its actual face turning to stone?), the monsters seem to violate some of the 'fantasy rules' we've generally expected with Warhammer.
Most Warhammer monsters seem to fit into three categories (this is, of course, a gross generalization, but bear with me).
There are Warhammer analogues of 'real' mythological creatures, such as dragons, cockatrices, hydras, etc. These creatures help keep the Warhammer world familiar to us as a fantasy analogue of Germany and the surrounding areas. While they might be different in appearance, these monsters spring from a cultural background that we already know about. Even some of the 'exotic' monsters, like the Yhetee, still spring from actual mythology.
There are daemons. While demons are clearly a part of actual, real world mythology, the Warhammer daemons embody both that mythology, and the warping effects of Chaos which is more distinctive to the Warhammer world.
Then, the Lizardmen (and previously, the Ogres) introduced prehistoric creatures (from the real world) as fantasy creatures in Warhammer. Dinosaurs became the Lizardmen monsters, and Woolly Rhinos, Mammoths, and saber tooth tigers all came over and were mentioned, if not actually appearing, in the Ogre Kingdoms.
I'm here excluding the Skaven, which are both a product of Chaos, and a long-established part of Warhammer, and constructs, such as the Tomb Kings constructs and Abominations. Constructs are effectively, 'one-offs' and can pop up anywhere.
Now, we are seeing Ogre Kingdoms monsters which aren't clearly prehistoric monsters (no prehistoric animals had stone body parts) and which don't seem to have a clear reason for having a strong Chaotic element. Even if I liked the sculpts, which I don't, I still think that they 'weaken the brand'.
Skaven had ramshackle constructs and surgically altered beasts.
Elves have dragons (and other stuff, depending on the flavor of elf).
Lizardmen had dinosaurs.
Tomb Kings have constructs.
Vampire Counts have skeletal beasties.
Ogre Kingdoms had prehistoric mammals.
Now, both they and their gnoblars seem to have a lot of ramshackle constructions. They seem to have prehistoric beasties which are altered by Chaos (or something) as well as having armor plates hammered on.
Maybe if they had "filled out" the line with Rhinox riders and Mammoths and saber tooths and cave bears and THEN introduced other stuff, I wouldn't have minded, but it just seems not to fit. I'm also just amazed. I thought the rhinos riders were ridiculously popular (and every OK player I know who didn't have them made that decision due to cost, not to desire). Yet, no Rhinox? Instead, we get riding cats? I thought that having the ponderous, chubby ogres on ponderous, chunky mounts would make more sense than mounting them on lean, barrel chested felines.
Eh. Enough people seem to like them, though, so it's clearly just a matter of opinion.
I'm suprised there are no new Rhinox models. FW having them doesn't mean GW is prevented from making them. After all, we saw the Drop Pod and Valkry ported over. I guess it's possible Rhinox models will make an appearance in a subsequent wave and that these pictures are just for the first batch. Have to wait and see, I guess.
Da Butcha wrote:(no prehistoric animals had stone body parts)
Theres nothing to suggest that these critters have stone body parts either. A Rock Lobster is not made of rock, nor is a Stonefish made of stone.
and which don't seem to have a clear reason for having a strong Chaotic element. Even if I liked the sculpts, which I don't, I still think that they 'weaken the brand'.
Skaven had ramshackle constructs and surgically altered beasts.
Elves have dragons (and other stuff, depending on the flavor of elf).
Lizardmen had dinosaurs.
Tomb Kings have constructs.
Vampire Counts have skeletal beasties.
Ogre Kingdoms had prehistoric mammals.
Now, both they and their gnoblars seem to have a lot of ramshackle constructions. They seem to have prehistoric beasties which are altered by Chaos (or something) as well as having armor plates hammered on.
Aside from the fact that Chaos has a hold on the northern reaches of the Mountains of Mourn, and the Ogres biggest trading partner are the Chaos Dwarves...
Maybe if they had "filled out" the line with Rhinox riders and Mammoths and saber tooths and cave bears and THEN introduced other stuff, I wouldn't have minded, but it just seems not to fit. I'm also just amazed. I thought the rhinos riders were ridiculously popular (and every OK player I know who didn't have them made that decision due to cost, not to desire). Yet, no Rhinox? Instead, we get riding cats? I thought that having the ponderous, chubby ogres on ponderous, chunky mounts would make more sense than mounting them on lean, barrel chested felines.
Completely agreed. I blame Jervis. No doubt we'll get a standard bearer article in a couple months about how we as a community are so demanding for new minis and rules they simply couldn't include Rhinox Riders because we didnt want boring old stuff or because his son couldn't figure out how a rhino and an ox could mate like that or some dumb excuse.
Eh. Enough people seem to like them, though, so it's clearly just a matter of opinion.
I'm with you (but for different reasons), not the biggest fan, its all alright, except for the saberkitties.
The more I see it the more I like the Stonehorn, but I just can't wrap my head around on why and how they came up those cats. Hopefully a picture from another angle will make them look less ridicoulus, but I have my doubts.
The rumours posted by eastern barbarian over at Warseer are still a bit difficult to get, here a summary by him (modified to show the correct position according to him):
LORDS:
- Tyrant
- Slaughtermaster
+2 special characters
HEROES:
- Butcher
- Hunter (Stonehorn mount option?)
- Bruiser
- fire wizard thingy
+2 special characters
CORE: Sparse compared to other races, trends in counts-towards-minimum core units (and total) -- SK: 4(6), BM: 4(5), OG: 7(??), TK: 5(5)
- Bulls
- Ironguts
- Gnoblar Fighters
SPECIAL: 6+ options is typical trend (SK: 6, BM: 6, OG: 10, TK: 8)
- Leadbelchers
- Yhetees
- Maneaters
- Sabertusk Riders
- Sabertusks packs
- Gorger
-- Gnoblar Trappers are rumoured to not be in the new book (maybe an upgrade for Fighters?) - got that second bit right by the sound of it.
OK ,few answers to few questions to the best of my knowledge:
There is no special character called Jared and Golfang/Golfgang (not sure how you spell him?) will NOT be a n unit upgrade. That is of course not confirmed, but so far my source had been really spot on.
As for magic- all i managed to find is that ogres have 3 augment spells, direct damage spell, hex spell and magic missile spell . Signature spell is also an augment.
(...)
I dont know the points exactly but I have been told scrappy went downa bit, nothing too major but more than just "cosmetic" change.
Big gribblies SLIGHTLY north... (if I remember correctly) and cannon well south of the given value. Hope that helps.
(...)
I imagine it might be the same thing like with Arachnarok spiders- sure, there is a way to fit 3 of them in your army and initially lots of people were going "wow, I am taking three!!!" but then actually you realise they take too many points and you are usually sticking with one. I imagine it might be the same case here. Although personally having cannon that can move and fire and can handle itsle fin CC meaning puny skirmishers/warmachine hunters will not have an easy job of killing it makes it almost an obligatory choice in my books ha ha!
BTW, guess most posters can agree on the following:
1.) High quality release
2.) Stonehorn favorite
3.) Head on mammoth-thing a bit weird, esp. the many tusks.
4.) Might have been better to just make Plastic rhinoxes than those new thundercats
I dont mind that they decided to make a plastic kit for cat cav, what upsets me is the lack of rules for rhinox riders. They were a unit much beloved by the Ogre Kingdoms community, a lot of the current players already have them, they were treated as part of the Army Book by most (though not all) for the past 5+ years, why the hell wouldn't they include them? I have nothing against options for other stuff, but the fact they completely replaced rhinox riders with that... If JJ was at all intelligent he would have realized (mostly by browsing the Ogre Stronghold) that Rhinox Riders were pretty much expected to be in the new book (we were excited for it).
Besides that, it looks like he missed the point of the sabertusk cavalry suggestions that have long existed online (again, Ogre Stronghold). Many veteran Ogre players thought it would be a cool idea to have gnoblars riding sabertusks as a fast cav unit to augment the Ogres. It looks like he said, screw it, Ogres riding cats is where its at and gave us that monstrosity... actually, it looks like he gave a pretty big 'screw you' to gnoblars in general... there looks like there is pretty much nothing new for the little 'uns in this book, in fact, it looks like he removed options if anything
1.) Maybe the old Rhinox cavalry has the same rules as the new Thundercat cavalry ... or could at least be used "counting as".
2.) Maybe the "new" WD will include rules for Rhinox cavalry.
Kroothawk wrote:1.) Maybe the old Rhinox cavalry has the same rules as the new Thundercat cavalry ... or could at least be used "counting as".
That would be wonderful if they had the same rules, but I really have to ask what would be the point of making something else entirely for something that already exists?
2.) Maybe the "new" WD will include rules for Rhinox cavalry.
I'd bank on them making these new models like this because it doubles, not just as a calvary unit but as a beast unit (sabretusk unit). Two units with one stone. People that love their Rhinox riders can just counts-as and maybe buy the kitties for a different unit. At least that's the only logic I can get out of it
Da Butcha wrote:I think the high hopes I (and others) had for Rhinox and Mammoth pieces is part of why some of us don't like the new monsters. We've seen and liked what Forgeworld has already made, but then GW puts out something else. Not only is the look of the monsters quite different (is part of its actual face turning to stone?), the monsters seem to violate some of the 'fantasy rules' we've generally expected with Warhammer.
Most Warhammer monsters seem to fit into three categories (this is, of course, a gross generalization, but bear with me).
There are Warhammer analogues of 'real' mythological creatures, such as dragons, cockatrices, hydras, etc. These creatures help keep the Warhammer world familiar to us as a fantasy analogue of Germany and the surrounding areas. While they might be different in appearance, these monsters spring from a cultural background that we already know about. Even some of the 'exotic' monsters, like the Yhetee, still spring from actual mythology.
There are daemons. While demons are clearly a part of actual, real world mythology, the Warhammer daemons embody both that mythology, and the warping effects of Chaos which is more distinctive to the Warhammer world.
Then, the Lizardmen (and previously, the Ogres) introduced prehistoric creatures (from the real world) as fantasy creatures in Warhammer. Dinosaurs became the Lizardmen monsters, and Woolly Rhinos, Mammoths, and saber tooth tigers all came over and were mentioned, if not actually appearing, in the Ogre Kingdoms.
I'm here excluding the Skaven, which are both a product of Chaos, and a long-established part of Warhammer, and constructs, such as the Tomb Kings constructs and Abominations. Constructs are effectively, 'one-offs' and can pop up anywhere.
Now, we are seeing Ogre Kingdoms monsters which aren't clearly prehistoric monsters (no prehistoric animals had stone body parts) and which don't seem to have a clear reason for having a strong Chaotic element. Even if I liked the sculpts, which I don't, I still think that they 'weaken the brand'.
Skaven had ramshackle constructs and surgically altered beasts.
Elves have dragons (and other stuff, depending on the flavor of elf).
Lizardmen had dinosaurs.
Tomb Kings have constructs.
Vampire Counts have skeletal beasties.
Ogre Kingdoms had prehistoric mammals.
Now, both they and their gnoblars seem to have a lot of ramshackle constructions. They seem to have prehistoric beasties which are altered by Chaos (or something) as well as having armor plates hammered on.
Maybe if they had "filled out" the line with Rhinox riders and Mammoths and saber tooths and cave bears and THEN introduced other stuff, I wouldn't have minded, but it just seems not to fit. I'm also just amazed. I thought the rhinos riders were ridiculously popular (and every OK player I know who didn't have them made that decision due to cost, not to desire). Yet, no Rhinox? Instead, we get riding cats? I thought that having the ponderous, chubby ogres on ponderous, chunky mounts would make more sense than mounting them on lean, barrel chested felines.
Eh. Enough people seem to like them, though, so it's clearly just a matter of opinion.
Nice post! I wanted to requote it because I think you describe quite well what puts me and some others off slightly about these models... but I think I'll come around on them.
lord_blackfang wrote:Is this really an issue? Is anyone actually afraid that his opponents will not let him field FW Rhinox riders as Cat Riders?
It depends on the basing. IIRC,the FW Rhinox are Bull Rhinox (aside from being total beasts of epic awesomesauce) come on Chariot Bases. I can't really tell what sort of bases these cats come on, but it'll be an issue if its a smaller base.
I'd bank on them making these new models like this because it doubles, not just as a calvary unit but as a beast unit (sabretusk unit). Two units with one stone. People that love their Rhinox riders can just counts-as and maybe buy the kitties for a different unit. At least that's the only logic I can get out of it
I just don't understand why they couldn't give us rules for rhinox riders (with minis to come later) and then rules for a gnoblar fast cav sabertusk unit like so many people hoped for. It certainly would make more sense than ogres on cats, wouldn't it
You can get the metal baby rhinox from the scraplauncher secondhand, and it fits nicely on a smaller base... but yes, the forgeworld rhinox are "full grown" I believe, and come on chariot bases... i.e. they're gigantic!
chaos0xomega wrote:I just don't understand why they couldn't give us rules for rhinox riders (with minis to come later) and then rules for a gnoblar fast cav sabertusk unit like so many people hoped for. It certainly would make more sense than ogres on cats, wouldn't it
That would've been sweet! Ah well :-/ conversion potential, perhaps...
RiTides wrote:You can get the metal baby rhinox from the scraplauncher secondhand, and it fits nicely on a smaller base... but yes, the forgeworld rhinox are "full grown" I believe, and come on chariot bases... i.e. they're gigantic!
Interestingly enough, GW's also started selling it in pewter.
The Sabretusks look so similar to the Rhinox that I didn't notice they weren't Rhinox till I saw someone complaining about the change on this forum the other day. It doesn't matter to me either way, it's a cool model kit of Ogres riding monsters and I'm glad to see it.
Gnoblars? I always felt that were a poor excuse for goblins and an unnecessary evil added to the Ogre range so that they'd have a cheap troop choice for games of Warhammer. I've never found them particularly interesting. It's the Ogres, an entire army of huge monsters, that makes Ogre Kingdoms interesting, not some cheap goblin knock-off from the Orc and Goblin range.
I like gnoblars (although I didn't originally), I think they keep them distinct enough from "standard" goblins to add value to the ogre look/feel. It also makes sense that these lumbering brutes would have some smaller helpers/snacks/etc around.
I feel the sabercats are much too small, as has been said, and I hope GW aren't passing off the scraplauncher rhinox as full grown now. The forgeworld ones are so much bigger (at least twice as big, right?) and I thought that was supposed to be their "actual" mature size...
Still, pretty cool that they're offering it separately (for storm of magic use, right? like the wild cold ones) so people could use them instead, if they liked!
Da Butcha wrote:Now, we are seeing Ogre Kingdoms monsters which aren't clearly prehistoric monsters (no prehistoric animals had stone body parts) and which don't seem to have a clear reason for having a strong Chaotic element. Even if I liked the sculpts, which I don't, I still think that they 'weaken the brand'.
That...is a really good point.
IMO the cats are ridiculous. The back legs don't even look like they could support an Ogre, much less charge one into battle. They look like they can barely stand up on the table. And as people have said, I don't see how the Mammox could eat. It's an absurd animal. Yes it's Fantasy, but models usually look better when they are physically plausible. The Scraplauncher & Cannon look fine to me. Nothing jaw-dropping, but nice. And like everyone who ever assembled a metal Scraplauncher, I appreciate the plasticness of it all.
Now that that's out of the way...that Stonehorn made me laugh with joy. That thing is awesome. And it does, IMO, look prehistoric-ish. It's different, but still primitive. Also, it is awesome. Did I mention that it was awesome already?
So give a B for the Launcher/Cannon, maybe a C for the Mammox (or maybe an Incomplete - maybe it looks better from different angles), a D for the kittiecats, an A++ for the Stonehorn, and a crocodile in Spelling.
I also have high hopes for the new Ogre heroes. IMOGW's been knocking the new characters out of the park.
Actually the sabertusk things (what ever they are called) remind me a lot of warg riders. Not the GW ones, that look like they could probably do with a good dinner, but the ones from the film.
Seen as the idea could have been to simply include Rhinox cavelry they seem to have gone to some effort to have come up with a new idea, couldn't think of one then gone with this.
Regarding the stonehorn/thunderwhateverits called (Mammox apparently is not the name of anything in the book according to warseer), it seems like they had a lapse of logic: I.E. they looked at pics of wooly mammoths, elephants, etc. and said "yeah, lets go with that, but with a more monstrous face, you know, without a trunk, etc." not realizing that the trunk is the only way those animals can eat or drink anything...
chaos0xomega wrote:It depends on the basing. IIRC,the FW Rhinox are Bull Rhinox (aside from being total beasts of epic awesomesauce) come on Chariot Bases. I can't really tell what sort of bases these cats come on, but it'll be an issue if its a smaller base.
Those almost certainly look like chariot sized from the pictures from what i can tell.
Heres a theory the sabertusks (or whatever) represent the "light" (releatively speaking) cavelry and the Rhinox represent ogre heavy cavelry.
If that holds up I think sabertusks should certainly get the fast cavelry special rule.
That might make them worth taking when stood next to their Rhinox friends.
It does seem to me that the not-quite feline and not-quite-canine approach to those cav models does seem to make for a decent thunderwolf cav stand in.
And I shudder at the notion of Ogres getting Vanguard moves.
Kanluwen wrote:Might not even be a feline, but maybe a canine of some sort?
If I sculpted those things, I'd be very worried that people think "Is it feline or canine?" is a legitimate question.
(I do think it's a legitimate question BTW.)
That is not itself a problem, if it is meant to represent an animal that is neither feline nor canine (some sabre-toothed "cats" were actually marsupials). The bigger problem is that it doesn't look good doing it.
I loved the Ogre models but hated to have to use the gnoblars. The new army seems to rely on the Ogre trooper more than the old book. Am I correct in this thinking or will I build another O.K. army only to find that you can't be competitive unless you use large blocks of gnoblars?
Y'know, I feel like Eastern Barbarian (the newbie rumor-monger that has been providing us with a lot of this seemingly accurate information) isn't giving us the whole story (or maybe its just wishful thinking on my part). Aside from the fact that he hinted that his source is possibly misinformed or not fully informing him, I checked the TK and OnG books. TK has 31 units, OnG 51 (this does not include mount options for characters). Now, Orcs n Goblins (written by Jeremy Vettock) are kinda inflated due to the fact that its effectively two armies in one, but its still a good measure for the number of units that GW is pushing/using as a standard for the new books.
Now the rumors for the new Ogre book indicate a total of 23 units (24 if Gnoblar Trappers make it into the book). Thats less than half of OnG and only about 2/3 of TK. Now, 2 eigth edition books is not a lot to go on, but a few of the more recent 7th edition books also give us some more insight:
Skaven (also written by Jeremy Vetock) has 35 (33 if you dont count the Screaming Bell/Plague Furnace)
Beastmen has 31 (and they are widely regarded as being pretty lame it seems)
Lizardmen has 27 (28 if you separate the Stegadon and Ancient Stegadon)
Vampire Counts only has 23 (26 if you include the three new White Dwarf units, and about 30 if you include mounts like the Abyssal Terror, Nightmare, Zombie Dragon, etc.).
Again, none of those numbers include the (unique (as in dragons, manticores, etc. not like the ones that can be purchased separately as a special/rare choice)) mount options, which brings the totals up even higher. Its possible that Ogres will get 7 or 8 mount options to bring them up to similar totals I suppose, but its highly unlikely, as they presently have 0 mount options (1 if you count the seemingly non-present Rhinox). From what we've seen there is the possibility that they will be getting 2 or 3 tops, but all of these are present in other parts of the list, so they don't really raise the total, as they are not 'unique'.
As an aside, Vetock was also responsible for the Generals Compendium. This is a guy that is very much about the fluff and an immersive experience. I can't see him giving us so little to work with.
The only thing that could possibly explain this is JJ's involvement (responsible for Dark Angels and Battle Missions, two of the most looked down upon books GW has put out in a long time) and his minimalist, back to basics, KISS (I would call it hum-drum) design philosophy. If he's really involved in the project, then he no doubt had a hand in limiting Vetock's creativity and giving us a more limited/minimalized book in the same vein as Dark Angels. If thats really the case I'm going to be a super-sad panda-ogre, because I'm now going to have to through another entire edition with what can only described as a very tame and very restrained book, while pretty much everyone else is going to be running around with these awesome books filled with all sorts of crazy options and a wide variety of units and varying builds.
Maybe I'm overreacting, but I honestly think I'm cursed. I've played Tau since almost the beginning, and got into Tyranids right after the 4th edition codex came out. Both of those armies latest books are widely regarded as weak (even Tau when it came out received a lot of flack for useless special characters, ethereals, vespids, sniper drone teams, etc.) in content and/or battlefield ability. I was in the process of starting up Chaos Space Marines at the time the new book for them came out (as you can imagine, I kinda put my efforts on hold at that point). Pretty much every army I play seems to get the shaft when it comes time for an update (in comparison to the other factions). I would like to think that its a 'the grass is always greener on the other side' type situation, but I can't see that being the case when such large portions of the community share those sentiments.
I can't imagine physically transporting an OK army after this release. With so many broad tall models it makes a full cavalry army like Bretonnians look like a walk in the park.
GW Y U NO MAKE EASY TO TRANSPORT MODELS?!
I guess they're really trying to flog their monster carry case...
Ogre Kingdoms: less transportable than ever before, watch as your army tears your foam up like a rabid sabretooth on crack. BUY MORE CASES! ONE IS NEVER ENOUGH!
I was thinking the sabertooth kitty-bear-oxs might look a little better if:
a) You file down the ridiculous tusks, so that they are small enough the creature could lift its own head.
b) If the saddle isn't attached (hopefully) you could just slide the rider down the kitty-bear-ox and imagine that beneath the sadddle/Ogre the beast has a proper, nay a firm, sculpted, ass.
The stonehorn needs some work too - but I don't see what you could do easily when half of its face is sculpted to look like stone for some reason. The mammoth thing just might be beyond saving.
chaos0xomega wrote:Now the rumors for the new Ogre book indicate a total of 23 units (24 if Gnoblar Trappers make it into the book). Thats less than half of OnG and only about 2/3 of TK. Now, 2 eigth edition books is not a lot to go on, but a few of the more recent 7th edition books also give us some more insight:
Skaven (also written by Jeremy Vetock) has 35 (33 if you dont count the Screaming Bell/Plague Furnace)
Beastmen has 31 (and they are widely regarded as being pretty lame it seems)
Lizardmen has 27 (28 if you separate the Stegadon and Ancient Stegadon)
Vampire Counts only has 23 (26 if you include the three new White Dwarf units, and about 30 if you include mounts like the Abyssal Terror, Nightmare, Zombie Dragon, etc.).
Again, none of those numbers include the (unique (as in dragons, manticores, etc. not like the ones that can be purchased separately as a special/rare choice)) mount options, which brings the totals up even higher. Its possible that Ogres will get 7 or 8 mount options to bring them up to similar totals I suppose, but its highly unlikely, as they presently have 0 mount options (1 if you count the seemingly non-present Rhinox). From what we've seen there is the possibility that they will be getting 2 or 3 tops, but all of these are present in other parts of the list, so they don't really raise the total, as they are not 'unique'.
As an aside, Vetock was also responsible for the Generals Compendium. This is a guy that is very much about the fluff and an immersive experience. I can't see him giving us so little to work with.
The only thing that could possibly explain this is JJ's involvement (responsible for Dark Angels and Battle Missions, two of the most looked down upon books GW has put out in a long time) and his minimalist, back to basics, KISS (I would call it hum-drum) design philosophy. If he's really involved in the project, then he no doubt had a hand in limiting Vetock's creativity and giving us a more limited/minimalized book in the same vein as Dark Angels. If thats really the case I'm going to be a super-sad panda-ogre, because I'm now going to have to through another entire edition with what can only described as a very tame and very restrained book, while pretty much everyone else is going to be running around with these awesome books filled with all sorts of crazy options and a wide variety of units and varying builds.
If the Ogres are getting a 23ish+ unit count in the new book, then its a sign of an upward trend, as the soon to be outdated book only has 15-16 counting Lords/Heroes if my memory serves correct (I don't have the book in front of me). Respectively, every army has a theme and basic playstyle and I think comparing unit counts isn't a good measurement of how well a book might or might not be written. Some armies have more core/special/rare units then others because there is only so far you can take a theme before you run into redundancy or bloat (or bloat runs into you, in the case of this codex).
In regards to the blandization of codexes, aside from a reduction in magic items in the recent Army books (which is fine in my opinion, as there is an incredibly diverse and useful magic item selection in the main rulebook) that much rightfully maligned design philosophy never really hit the Fantasy books as far as I'm aware (aside from the splitting of the Chaos books). I also remember an interview with Alessio Cavatore in which he stated that he didn't want any of the codex authors blamed because he was the driving force behind "streamlining" the army lists, to make army list building a much quicker affair and to make it more accessible to newbies, so I think blaming Jervis is ill informed, especially with all of the mostly diverse(or attempt at diverse) codex/army books that have come out under his watch. I think the dev team is well and truly over that bland design mindset. I wouldn't put it past them to think reverting back to it is a good decision though.
I'm not sure what role Alessio played, but I recall Jervis was the one that pushed the design philosophy for 40k which resulted in Dark Angels and a couple other books that came after that. There were Standard Bearer articles written on the subject where he championed it, and JJ was appointed head of the design studio prior to the switch. If Alessio was the driving force, then JJ was his pawn and is just as guilty, if not moreso because he had the power to prevent it from occurring in the first place.
As for number of units yes, its an upward trend. Ogres currently have 17 units, 18 if you include the WD Rhinox Rider rules. I'm not really familiar with the old Tomb Kings books, but I seem to recall that O&G received a good bit more than that for new stuff, and I think Tomb Kings did as well (I counted 6 units that I'm 99% certain are new, and that didn't include the Lords and Heroes choices of which I'm fairly certain they got a bunch of new special characters if nothing else). Still, it seems to me that its a pretty big difference between Ogres and everything else out there (Vampire Counts excluded, although again, between mounts and the white dwarf units they definitely come up to par with the other armies released since 7th).
Assuming that really is all we're getting (again, I very much doubt it), then I blame it on anti-gnoblar bias on the part of the design team. Not exploring the gnoblar-ogre relationship further is a mistake IMO, especially given all the units they had available in the White Dwarf Gnoblar list. Perhaps it is a bit of a knockoff of the Orc n Goblin relationship, but I don't mind it.
I loved Gnoblars, and found their inclusion to be a way to add just a hint of dark humor to the rather dark ogres. Seeing a small swarm of the ogre's eternal victims on the field always made me giggle.
I always saw alot of potential in the all gnoblar list presented in the WD, especially with a few hero choices or magic items. I am glad that there isn't a hero for them in this new book (or at least, i hope there isn't.) as I prefer the idea of them being downtrodden masses who manage to get their revenge in only small, mean ways.
Certainly Flingers, Manbiters, Lucky Gits, and Boglars (especially Toad Gnoblars) were worthy of another look for inclusion. I agree that there should not be any sort of Gnoblar hero present in the list, but I always kinda liked the idea that Ogre armies were pretty much just Ogres looking for some food (rather than a fight), with the gnoblars tagging along for protection and to make themselves feel important, and in the process bringing the heavier machinery of war that truly made it an army rather than just a shambling horde. IMO, the Ironblaster should have been another Gnoblar contraption, rather than an Ogre one,etc.
Kroothawk wrote:SPECIAL: 6+ options is typical trend (SK: 6, BM: 6, OG: 10, TK: 8)
- Leadbelchers
- Yhetees
- Maneaters
- Sabertusk Riders
- Sabertusks packs - Gorger
-- Gnoblar Trappers are rumoured to not be in the new book (maybe an upgrade for Fighters?) - got that second bit right by the sound of it.
That's cool that they can be taken in packs (I assume without riders)!
The only bummer, is no rules for rhinox cavalry? I find that hard to believe... unless they don't want to steal the thunder of their sabertusk riders. But I have an idea for all of you dismayed by the lack of a rhinox cavalry model, if the rules are there (or WD ones still valid, etc). Simply buy the sabertusks to use in packs, save the riders, and put 'em on that metal rhinox from the scraplauncher posted a page or so ago . Expensive, but cheaper than FW certainly...
Kroothawk wrote:SPECIAL: 6+ options is typical trend (SK: 6, BM: 6, OG: 10, TK: 8)
- Leadbelchers
- Yhetees
- Maneaters
- Sabertusk Riders
- Sabertusks packs - Gorger
-- Gnoblar Trappers are rumoured to not be in the new book (maybe an upgrade for Fighters?) - got that second bit right by the sound of it.
That's cool that they can be taken in packs (I assume without riders)!
The only bummer, is no rules for rhinox cavalry? I find that hard to believe... unless they don't want to steal the thunder of their sabertusk riders. But I have an idea for all of you dismayed by the lack of a rhinox cavalry model, if the rules are there (or WD ones still valid, etc). Simply buy the sabertusks to use in packs, save the riders, and put 'em on that metal rhinox from the scraplauncher posted a page or so ago . Expensive, but cheaper than FW certainly...
More likely it's because GW has been trying to make it so that FW and GW proper have a very clear distinction. The Rhinox Riders likely were considered and then tossed because they are such 'big' models and would be impractical in many cases to produce in plastic or resin for GW.
Kroothawk wrote:SPECIAL: 6+ options is typical trend (SK: 6, BM: 6, OG: 10, TK: 8)
- Leadbelchers
- Yhetees
- Maneaters
- Sabertusk Riders
- Sabertusks packs - Gorger
-- Gnoblar Trappers are rumoured to not be in the new book (maybe an upgrade for Fighters?) - got that second bit right by the sound of it.
That's cool that they can be taken in packs (I assume without riders)!
The only bummer, is no rules for rhinox cavalry? I find that hard to believe... unless they don't want to steal the thunder of their sabertusk riders. But I have an idea for all of you dismayed by the lack of a rhinox cavalry model, if the rules are there (or WD ones still valid, etc). Simply buy the sabertusks to use in packs, save the riders, and put 'em on that metal rhinox from the scraplauncher posted a page or so ago . Expensive, but cheaper than FW certainly...
More likely it's because GW has been trying to make it so that FW and GW proper have a very clear distinction. The Rhinox Riders likely were considered and then tossed because they are such 'big' models and would be impractical in many cases to produce in plastic or resin for GW.
Considering that
1. GW is producing rhinoxes in plastic for the Scraplauncher kit
2. The new cat cav are apparently mounted on chariot bases (and thus just as big as FW bull rhinoxen)
3. The new Stonehorn and Thundertusks are even larger
4. GW hasn't been trying to make a clear distinction between FW and GW by any means (Look at the number of FW kits that have become Citadel plastics)
I see no reason for them to not produce Rhinox Riders.
BTW, I think I missed the sabertusk packs in my previous count.
chaos0xomega wrote:Certainly Flingers, Manbiters, Lucky Gits, and Boglars (especially Toad Gnoblars) were worthy of another look for inclusion. I agree that there should not be any sort of Gnoblar hero present in the list, but I always kinda liked the idea that Ogre armies were pretty much just Ogres looking for some food (rather than a fight), with the gnoblars tagging along for protection and to make themselves feel important, and in the process bringing the heavier machinery of war that truly made it an army rather than just a shambling horde. IMO, the Ironblaster should have been another Gnoblar contraption, rather than an Ogre one,etc.
The game is called Warhammer Fantasy Battles. I know what you're trying to say but the way WHFB works, especially if you take the whole formation thing into account, it's a game about battles, not skirmishes. And as far as I know, that's what makes it so interesting for so many people. The only way they could've solved this would be by giving Ogres more of those units that don't have to stay in formation. (Forgot what they're called. It's "Plänkler" in German)
Also, while the Gnoblar list was funny and counts-as units are always fun to make/use most army books come with a pre-determined idea for the setting. The Toad Gnoblars, while something you should certainly be able to find in some swampier regions of the old world, don't really fit with the whole "frozen north" thing they have going on here.
And while I don't mind if I won't have to field large blocks of Gnoblars, I have a few models I was hoping to use as trappers.
With the other bits companies outhere I think they could pick up and do some generic fantasy rhinoceros heads to go on cats... that would be interesting.
NAVARRO wrote:With the other bits companies outhere I think they could pick up and do some generic fantasy rhinoceros heads to go on cats... that would be interesting.
I just don't understand the desire to put saddles on predators. Wolves and cats just aren't designed to carry things (other than maybe gnoblars) the way horses, cattle, and elephants are. I think GW would have been much better off making the Rhinox mount or using some form of bison type critter instead.
MeanGreenStompa wrote:Will there be any scope to take Ogre units as mercenaries in other armies?
I doubt anything like Dogs of War will be seen anytime soon; however, I don't imagine anyone would have trouble with you fielding Ogres in a storm of magic game, especially the big gribblies that are coming out soon...
MeanGreenStompa wrote:Will there be any scope to take Ogre units as mercenaries in other armies?
Sure, GW loves and supports Dogs of War wherever they can
Anung Un Rama wrote:The game is called Warhammer Fantasy Battles. I know what you're trying to say but the way WHFB works, especially if you take the whole formation thing into account, it's a game about battles, not skirmishes. And as far as I know, that's what makes it so interesting for so many people.
The only way they could've solved this would be by giving Ogres more of those units that don't have to stay in formation. (Forgot what they're called. It's "Plänkler" in German)
As an aside, a poster on Ogre Stronghold made an interesting point. If you look closely at the white thing (Thundertusk is apparently the name) the big grey armored things that everyone is assuming are tusks which would make it impossible to eat... those aren't tusks. One poster has suggested they may be mandibles, another has suggested they may be appendages like arms or somesuch. I'm thinking that they may be stone/metal (possibly even bone) 'weapons' for all intents and purposes that are worn like a sleeve and bolted onto whatever is underneath. If you look at the top of them, where they meet the furry bits, they appear to have metal studs/bolts/rivets/nails hammered into it.
Because the fur is part of the appendage to which the tusk is bolted on to. The better question is, if it is a tusk, then why is there fur there in the first place? The tusks are in no way attached to the head, instead it looks like they are coming out of the body in what could be described as the shoulder region, to me that suggests a limb/appendage rather than tusks/horns.
OMFG?? Do we really care if "imaginary" monsters can eat or poop for that matter? If an extra horn coming out of it's bum gave me an advantage rules wise, guess what? It would have an e tar horn coming out of it's bum. As a matter of fact, I hope their are extra horn/tusks on the sprue. I want to model as many as possible on their. Oh, and a lascannon on it's frigging head.
It's obvious - the Ogres give it a straw and feed it a nice hot bowl of chicken soup each morning. And this ends the discussion of the eating habits of the imaginary plastic monster, can we move on now?
They're clearly tusks. Why would they bolt on fake "battle tusks" and then attach little armour plates to the ends? Those "bolts" are calcified growths or whatever.
Why would you attach bolts/rivets to the tusk if it wasn't there to hold it on? You'll notice that the armor plates at the ends aren't bolted, they are tied on. Similar looking bolts/rivets can also be seen on other parts of the body, used to hold on armor plating in otherwise inconvenient areas. The bolts on the don't really add any sort of protection, so they are most likely being used to hold something on, and it most certainly does not appear to be armor.
Puscifer wrote:Well, I can safely say I wasted cash on some Ogres a couple months ago.
They will now be Ebayd.
I would say it's a bit premature to be saying all of that; we haven't seen the army book yet after all.... I for one do not plan on purchasing any of the large monsters, they're expensive, time consuming to assemble and paint and will die during the first turn of shooting against half of the armies in my area. I'm fairly certain that we'll be able to build a viable army without having any of the large monsters and from the sounds of it, the cannon of the gods thing is just another stone thrower so why bother when most of us already have scraplaunchers anyway.
Puscifer wrote:Those new models are the worst I've seen from GW.
Hideous.
Your troll fu is weak old man.
jspyd3rx wrote:OMFG?? Do we really care if "imaginary" monsters can eat or poop for that matter?
Yes?
agnosto wrote:I for one do not plan on purchasing any of the large monsters.
Every one of my armies has large monsters in it. Well, except for my Bretonnians. King Liquor's feeling like the fat kid who always gets picked last for dodgeball.
Breotan wrote:Every one of my armies has large monsters in it. Well, except for my Bretonnians. King Liquor's feeling like the fat kid who always gets picked last for dodgeball.
Breotan wrote:Every one of my armies has large monsters in it. Well, except for my Bretonnians. King Liquor's feeling like the fat kid who always gets picked last for dodgeball.
Yeah, but when Tug-Of-War comes along he'll be in the first draft! And maybe for a brief moment he'll be happy about finally being accepted for who he is until he remembers he was only chosen first because he's fat and other kids have trouble moving him.
Well, Plantuan4th, if he were talking about the new Finecast Lammasu then no, it wouldn't be trolling. Somehow I don't think he was talking about that one though. Still, if he want's to dump his ogres, I'm sure there will be plenty of buyers.
One of the reasons I wanted to play Ogres was that a old colleague from GWHQ said the new OK stuff was huge and were all really awesome looking models.
Breotan wrote:Well, Plantuan4th, if he were talking about the new Finecast Lammasu then no, it wouldn't be trolling. Somehow I don't think he was talking about that one though. Still, if he want's to dump his ogres, I'm sure there will be plenty of buyers.
But it's not new, they just released it in finecast; it's the same old sculpt that's in my closet, in metal form.
Puscifer wrote:Those new models are the worst I've seen from GW.
Hideous.
Your troll fu is weak old man.
It's now trolling to point out that a horrendous model is horrendous?
To be fair, this is the kind of thing that's frowned upon when posting in non-GW model threads.
Saying a model is "horrendous" is fine, so long as you go a bit deeper and explain what you don't like about the model. Even if it's just something as far as "There's just something that doesn't fit right about the model".
Simply saying that a model is "horrendous" isn't okay.
