Movie Villains ...weather Brilliant bad guy or Maniac mad man, a good villain is the cornerstone of most great films...so, I'm wonder..who are Dakkas favorite " bad guys" and why?
..I'll kick things off with one of my personal favorites..
Michael Myers from the 1978 film Halloween..
This Murderous maniac IMO truly embodies unstoppable evil...
Relentless and absolutely with out mercy...
No amount of Courage or Bravado will stop him...
No amount of witty banter will sway him..
No amount of prayer or faith will stay his hand...
He is truly purpose personified..
..and his purpose is to kill..
Freakin raptors man! They eat you! These guys gave me nightmares as a youth, movie villains I could always root for. You cannot root for a raptor it is not human!
Automatically Appended Next Post: How disappointing.
I don't know if I could pick a favorite, but this guy sprang immediately to my mind when I thought about the question in the OP. I like him because he's not very nice, but with a little bit of empathy you can understand why is the way he is.
Evil Lord Checklist:
Evil domain? Check...
Ominous looking, spire ridden, black castle of death and doom? Check...
Armies of evil looking goons at his beck and call? Check...
Small unit of ultra creepy looking bodyguard henchmen? Check.
Black Magic? Check.
the ability to make the good guys crap their chainmail pants upon seeing him? Check.
Looks like you check out Mr. Sauron, have a nice day...
This movie scared the living gak out of me as a kid.
Give it a try! It's directed by Stan Winston, and if you fancy yourself a horror movie buff that name should mean something to you! The sequels are garbage, though.
I didnt see cartoons ruled out. I have always thought Maleficent was pretty dang evil the only reason she got mad and put the beauty to sleep on her b day was she didnt get invited to a party ...
Please don't attach non wargaming images to Dakka. thanks
REALL WHY DOES MY IMAGE GET BANNED it was a cartoon that is all ???
and FITZZ? I don't really know who those folks are? Care to enlighten me?
Grevious is an idiot, who had no good reason to be following Lord Sidious's command in fact the whole confederate army would have been better off without Sidious. While Grevious could have been a good concept
as a villain, instead he came across as a spineless moron.
He knows how much harm he is doing, and the fact that he is trying to minimize the damage being done by the aliens, who are even more evil, is no excuse.
/reopen thread (cautiously, and with all due respect to the great Hannibal)
The Joker, from The Dark Knight
He is the physical embodiment of Chaotic Evil.
He doesn't care about money. He doesn't want power. He isn't greedy.
He just wants to prove that your laws are wrong. Your society is weak and can be shaken to its core with little effort. Everyone is evil/selfish at heart if he puts pressure on them.
And he'll risk everyone's life, even his own, to prove it.
And I am still too scared to look up 'Devil's rejects' my family is not really 'into' horror, but I like 'smart horror' which is the less gory type, more philosophical. one of the best things I have read in 'smart horror' is actually a Spongebob fanfiction of all things
Michael Myers from the Halloween series was the only horror movie character I found legitimately scary. Not when he was stabbing people, but like, when a character would walk by a window, and you'd see him outside in the distance, staring in - subtly, like they don't do anymore.
I had a real hard time sleeping for a few days after seeing Halloween 5...and I was 19 at the time. The precursors also terrified me but those were more understandable since I was much younger.
ineptus astartes wrote:And I am still too scared to look up 'Devil's rejects' my family is not really 'into' horror, but I like 'smart horror' which is the less gory type, more philosophical. one of the best things I have read in 'smart horror' is actually a Spongebob fanfiction of all things
...
Then don't look it up, trust me, its not what you're looking for...
It just lurks in dark places and kills you for no particular reason when you stumble across it. Every time I pop my head into a crawl space or open the door into a dark room this thing's face is in the back of my mind.
Actually both House of 1,000 Corpses and The Devils Rejects ( The two films which tell the tale of Captain Spaulding and the Firefly Family) are a bit more than run of the mill "Slasher flicks"...
Both have a very 70's grindhouse/ Anti-Hero theme weaved throughout the films...
Actually it should be "poor Wydell's " since the " Rejects" kill two of the Wydell Brothers...George in House of a Thousand Corpses...and John Quincey In Devil's Rejects..
I'm an angel. I kill firstborns while their mamas watch. I turn cities into salt. I even, when I feel like it, rip the souls from little girls, and from now till kingdom come, the only thing you can count on in your existence is never understanding why.
Oh good grief.... Have you never seen 'Spaceballs'?
If not do yourself a huge favour and watch it. It'll change the way you look at spoof films forever.
Mel Brooks' finest moment in film making, and absolutely hilarious.....
Been sitting here resisting the power of google for 5 minutes...
Hurray! Well done, sir. Well done.
Absolutely, the suspense built in that film is one of the best I've seen. It goes to show that you don't have to have some hideous gribbly monster in order to have a truly terrifying adversary.
For the 'best', as in so scary I can't even watch them... anything that is a clown! Never watched any movies that I know have evil clowns in them and if I get surprized by one in a movie... movie goes off! (Hi Fitzz! )
I'm not a huge horror film fan as I generally prefer very psycological horrors over slasher or gore based horrors... too much of 'gah those effects are terrible' from me most of the time. I wanted to be an effects artist for some time so I get picky and very bored with endless blood splatter.
Its been a while since I watched a movie with a villain that wasn't Disney based actually... the perils of kids and tiredness. So I'll go for an old favorite movie/game tie-in.... not one a lot of folks liked but I do.
I do like those evil cult leader types... realistic more than fantastic villains in horror anyhow.
My favorites had to be the Silent hill Monsters, from the film adaption of the game. Whilst they weren't the 'Bad guy' per se in the film, they were by far the most sinister. The were completely uncompromising, and inhuman. They had absolutely no emotions, and you couldn't identify with them at all, especially because the humanoid features on them were deliberately removed. They look human, but all their humanity was taken from them.
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It just lurks in dark places and kills you for no particular reason when you stumble across it. Every time I pop my head into a crawl space or open the door into a dark room this thing's face is in the back of my mind.
Sorry I always thought that was laughable.
Freaky Japanese girl appears.
Weird sound starts.
Frazzled empties clip into weird dead Japanese girl. Goes and eats Blue Hawaii pizze at Alamo Drafthouse while watching Ferris Bueller's Day off. The pizza is good.
Bill the Butcher also ranks pretty high up there, along with Umbridge, Nurse Ratchet, and the Joker.
I think that more psychological villains are some of the best, some that have nearly no morals, or an extremely twisted motive, like the above man.
mega_bassist wrote:I completely agree. Another villian that used to give me nightmares...I just wish they would make a DECENT Predator game :/
Honestly, they just need to get Bungie to reskin Halo with Predator and the flood with Aliens and a stealth emphasis. Problem solved
But yes. Predators was a good movie until the last third of the film, which just became boring and predictable. I don't think any of the films have managed to take full advantage of just how awesome the character is.
The first film isn't guilty of that. It made perfect use of the character for the time, considering it was purposefully deigned to be a nearly anonymous predator.
iproxtaco wrote:The first film isn't guilty of that. It made perfect use of the character for the time, considering it was purposefully deigned to be a nearly anonymous predator.
idk. I always watch the first one which is definitely the best but I can't help but think as I watch that it could have been better. How it could have been better, I don't really know.
They should have made three or four, each one with more Predator exposure. The first in my opinion was perfect in it's representation, they others which feature one were either horrible, AvP (both), or lacking in what would have been best, Predators and Predator 2.
For videogames, you can't get much eviler than Scolar Visari. The man who weaponized an entire planet, invaded another planet to start a war, nuked his own capitol city when the planet he invaded returned the favor, and who's death caused another heap of trouble for the good guys.
For a movie, I will have to say that the kids aren't alright.
He was pretty epic. In Pitch Black. Not the movie that shall not be named anymore than characters who should be retconned because neither should have existed.
MrDwhitey wrote:Visari's speeches were all absolutely brilliant too.
Even the one where an idiot who should be retconned to have never existed shot him.
Its Rico, and Rico is Rico. Surprised Rico and Templar were the only ones in the later games, Luger and Haka were pretty good characters.
I didn't like the speech in the third game, but the others were awesome for sure!
I've also come to terms with Rico, but I can't fething stand him...I would've liked to see at least Luger come back for a sneaky mission or something, but Sev does a good enough job for me
True, the speech in the third wasn't as good as the others.
But 3 did have the awesomeness that is Malcolm McDowell.
His last words will ever be remembered. He was a hilariously poor badguy though, doing everything wrong, but then that was the entire Helghast command in 3.
As far as guys that aren't so much scary, but that you just hate because they're so blithely evil I will have to nominate Kind Edward the Longshanks. From the beginning of the movie to the end his is just a completely insufferable bastard.
As far as guys that aren't so much scary, but that you just hate because they're so blithely evil I will have to nominate Kind Edward the Longshanks. From the beginning of the movie to the end his is just a completely insufferable bastard.
True..though in all honesty the scene where he introduces his son's " advisor" to the concept of " wingless flight" makes me crack up every time I see it.
It just lurks in dark places and kills you for no particular reason when you stumble across it. Every time I pop my head into a crawl space or open the door into a dark room this thing's face is in the back of my mind.
GOOD GOD! You even added the things fething picture....what a jerk Ill agree though, that movie creeped me out to my friggin core, and still to this day if I hear that.......sound she makes, it just sends chills down my spine. Once a chair rubbed the floo just right and made that sound, I about gak my pants
But as for mine
as well as the remake
I like Leatherface from both just as much, which I guess is good since its a remake and all and stayed true to the character. I like him because of how simple minded he is. A total brute that either honestly doesnt know its bad to chainsaw people, and stick them on meat hooks, or just doesnt care. Either way he gets the job done and people suffer because of it.
Pinhead is a friggin movie screen Dark Eldar. Its all about pain, and the sumbitch is from Hell for christ sakes!
And finally.
If you wake up in one of the multicolored rooms that look like that, just kill yourself, youll save yourself alot of grief. I personally think the Cube is a fantastic badguy, because its right in your face, the entire time, but you never think about it. Even while its slicing people up, burning them/melting them or smashing them to bits, suffocating you, you name the Cube has done it. And just when you think you figured it out....it gives you the middle finger and kills you just because
I might catch flak for this, but I actually thought the first Saw was a really freaky movie. And that Jigsaw himself was a really freaky killer. You know, before they started milking it and it descended into a senseless gore fest?
LordofHats wrote:I might catch flak for this, but I actually thought the first Saw was a really freaky movie. And that Jigsaw himself was a really freaky killer. You know, before they started milking it and it descended into a senseless gore fest?
Well if you do, Ill back ya up, because I personally LOVE the first SAW. The only thing I dont like about it, is now the secret is out there, it was that dude on the floor the whole fething time. Good flick. But yea, the rest? Pretty bad movies
ineptus astartes wrote:I don't really go for 'death horror'
We get it, youve said something very similar twice that I remember seeing
KingCracker wrote:Well if you do, Ill back ya up, because I personally LOVE the first SAW. The only thing I dont like about it, is now the secret is out there, it was that dude on the floor the whole fething time. Good flick. But yea, the rest? Pretty bad movies
The flaw of the epic plot twist. Once it happens that's it. Game ova man. Game ova. The cat can't be put back into the bag. It's a shame but thems the raps.
What I really hate about the subsequent films though, is first: the utterly senseless violence pretending it's as a mysterious thriller. (Saw II in particular is much more like a generic slasher film without the exploitation). Second, their attempts to recreate that huge "OMG!" twist. That's just not something anyone but the very best writers can pull off twice.
I agree completely, and oddly enough I hate the 2nd one the most. It makes NO sense at all. But yea, just random OH MY GOD OVERLY CLEVER KILLING MECHANISM!!!!AAAHHHhhh!!!1hh1!HH!H!! *garggle garggle dead dead* But wait.... heres the twist...that killer, IS DEAD!! MWAHAHAHAAAa
LordofHats wrote:I might catch flak for this, but I actually thought the first Saw was a really freaky movie. And that Jigsaw himself was a really freaky killer. You know, before they started milking it and it descended into a senseless gore fest?
I only ever watched the first Saw movie.
I learned my lesson from countless other horror franchises; the sequels aren't usually very special. I usually just catch them on cable years down the road.
I have to agree with jp here. After all, Miles Quaritch for example, is a 'bad guy' but also goes on the list of badass colonels in films that should have won.
Riddick was NOT a villain in Chronicles. He was a straight up anti-hero.
His role in Pitch Black is a little more ambiguous and more villain-like but I don't know if I'd outright call him a villain since he isn't really in the protagonists' way.
Unstoppable army, can control humans, infects machines, Almost unstoppable martial artist and can reproduce himself through other humans. I think Agent smith deserves a mention.
Honestly, Neo was the bad guy. The machines just wanted a power source so that they wouldn't die. In exchange, they gave humanity the ultimate, full-immersion online MMO ever created!
sarpedons-right-hand wrote:These bad guy choices are awesome guys n gals! But no vote for Mr. Patrick Bateman yet?
Christian Bale' finest moment.......
(sorry for lack of pic, doing this on my iPhone and have not figured out how to do that yet!)
AAAHHH Patrick Bateman FTW
Two scenes I'll always remeber: When he tries to "feed" the cat to the ATM, and when he runs through his apartment with the chainsaw
sarpedons-right-hand wrote:These bad guy choices are awesome guys n gals! But no vote for Mr. Patrick Bateman yet?
Christian Bale' finest moment.......
(sorry for lack of pic, doing this on my .iPhone and have not figured out how to do that yet!)
AAAHHH Patrick Bateman FTW
Two scenes I'll always remeber: When he tries to "feed" the cat to the ATM, and when he runs through his apartment with the chainsaw
Yeah, but you forgot my personal favourite part: When the escort girl is running down the staircase and Pat Bateman follows her route with the
chainsaw then drops it maybe 4 floors onto her head! Epic stuff!
sarpedons-right-hand wrote:
Yeah, but you forgot my personal favourite part: When the escort girl is running down the staircase and Pat Bateman follows her route with the
chainsaw then drops it maybe 4 floors onto her head! Epic stuff!
I consider that part of the "running through the apartment" scene LOL
For some reason, "Hollow Man" played by Kevin Bacon and some guy from the X-Files who could squeeze his body through cracks and other small spaces fethed up my childhood. After seeing a commercial with Hollow Man in it, I used to stay awake all night waiting for 5 am when my parents got up for the day and only then went to sleep. I also used to set traps around my windows and closet to prevent these villains from getting to me. Really laughable characters compared to other villains, but man did this gak feth up a few years of sleep in my early life.
Stephen King's "IT" also scared the feth out of me when I was younger.
That guy who could squeeze through cracks terrified me. Somehow it was made worse by having a really softly voiced guy doing the audiobook. For some reason my mind keeps telling me it was Mark Hamill.
hands down for me this dude was the worst of the worst.
He's not a demon, monster, mutant or anything that is supernatural.
he's human. a Fraking evil human.
Spoiler:
It's Vidal from Pan's Labyrinth incase you aren't sure.
hands down for me this dude was the worst of the worst.
He's not a demon, monster, mutant or anything that is supernatural.
he's human. a Fraking evil human.
Spoiler:
It's Vidal from Pan's Labyrinth incase you aren't sure.
Oh yea that guy was a total evil donkey-cave. Great movie to boot though
anyone who burns money,feeds a guy to dogs, sets it up to were his whole team kills each other, makes a guy a bomb,and thinks of it as a fun game gets my vote,and respect....and possibly becomes a hero in my eyes
anyone who burns money,feeds a guy to dogs, sets it up to were his whole team kills each other, makes a guy a bomb,and thinks of it as a fun game gets my vote,and respect....and possibly becomes a hero in my eyes
Why yes...he is a fabulous baddie...which is quite possiablly why he showed up on page 1 of this very thread...
anyone who burns money,feeds a guy to dogs, sets it up to were his whole team kills each other, makes a guy a bomb,and thinks of it as a fun game gets my vote,and respect....and possibly becomes a hero in my eyes
Why yes...he is a fabulous baddie...which is quite possibly why he showed up on page 1 of this very thread...
yeah i saw that,just wanted to give my own reasons.plus i liked this picture more. its sucks that the actor died......
KingCracker wrote:I blame his actting as the Joker tbh. At least a part of it. He went a bit deep to come off that good on screen.
There's a story that my stepbrother (who is really into Batman) told me that Heath Ledger asked a few questions to Jack Nickleson (the original Joker) about the part to which he got a response that equates to "Don't do it, it messes with your head..."
Well apparently Heath didn't take the advice as he was in the movie, when Nickleson heard about his death he was reported to say "I told him..."
Bill the Butcher also ranks pretty high up there, along with Umbridge, Nurse Ratchet, and the Joker.
I think that more psychological villains are some of the best, some that have nearly no morals, or an extremely twisted motive, like the above man.
Are you seriously implying that Andrew Ryan had no moral code? Everything he did was a reflection of his morals. He created a world were the fruits of one's efforts were the property the individual. A place where the state exists only to further prosperity of the individuals residing within. A place where science cannot be held back by petty religious beliefs or social values. A place where the inventor was free to invent, where the salesman was free to sell, and where the only the market could decide what was good and what was bad; a true laissez-faire economy.
You really should go read the Ayn Rand novel Atlas Shrugged, which the entire first 2/3rds of the first Bioshock game is based on.
One might even find it enlightening, especially given today's political climate, both in the US and globally.
"So you think that money is the root of all evil? Have you ever asked what is the root of money? Money is a tool of exchange, which can't exist unless there are goods produced and men able to produce them. Money is the material shape of the principle that men who wish to deal with one another must deal by trade and give value for value. Money is not the tool of the moochers, who claim your product by tears or of the looters, who take it from you by force. Money is made possible only by the men who produce. Is this what you consider evil?"
FITZZ wrote: Movie Villains ...weather Brilliant bad guy or Maniac mad man, a good villain is the cornerstone of most great films...so, I'm wonder..who are Dakkas favorite " bad guys" and why?
..I'll kick things off with one of my personal favorites..
Michael Myers from the 1978 film Halloween..
This Murderous maniac IMO truly embodies unstoppable evil...
Relentless and absolutely with out mercy...
No amount of Courage or Bravado will stop him...
No amount of witty banter will sway him..
No amount of prayer or faith will stay his hand...
He is truly purpose personified..
..and his purpose is to kill..
And he's wearing a William Shatner mask painted white. He ... kills, by ... singing.
I'll +1 Pumpkinhead, Pinhead and Alex DeLarge and add this charming family.
I think there are probably a lot of things wrong with the Street Fighter movie, but Raul Julia's Bison was pretty awesome.
Chun-Li: It was twenty years ago. You hadn't promoted yourself to general yet. You were just a petty drug lord. You and your gang of murderers gathered your small ounce of courage to raid across the border for food, weapons, slave labor...my father was the village magistrate. A simple man with a simple code: justice. He gathered the few people that he could to stand against you. You and your bullies were driven back by farmers with pitchforks! My father saved his village at the cost of his own life. You had him shot as you ran away! A hero... at a thousand paces.
M. Bison: I'm sorry... I don't remember any of it.
Chun-Li: You don't remember?!
M. Bison: For you, the day Bison graced your village was the most important day of your life. But for me... it was Tuesday
Amazing performance from Norton. He plays a villain with depth and his arc is believable, meaning that his character isn't just one-dimensional, unlike many movie villains.
you know,i always liked movies like Godzilla or the thing better than today's movies.why? because the special effects look real,because it was all actually real,not computer.well,at least mostly.
dogma wrote:Littlefinger, though he may not count.
Counting or not, that guy is my favourite character in the series so far (he even tops Tyrion for me).
Also:
I pretty much think all the Lannisters are awesome. Tywin being the most... cold. The thing he did to Tyrion to make him the way he was, was pretty damn heartless. And awesome.
MrDwhitey wrote:
I pretty much think all the Lannisters are awesome. Tywin being the most... cold. The thing he did to Tyrion to make him the way he was, was pretty damn heartless. And awesome.
Tywin was stupid. He got shot with a crossbow by a midget after banging said midget's whore (and goading said midget); giving him a clear reason to shoot him with a crossbow. Cersei is even less intelligent, and succeeds only because daddy was better at politics than an insane King and a guy who liked to hit things with weapons more than pay attention.
Only Jaimie and Tyrion are smart. Tyrion because he's a midget, and knows it, Jaimie because he knows he isn't intellectual.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
WARORK93 wrote:
I wouldn't consider him a villain, sure he had a dark moment but in the end he died a hero...
As noted, the film was "Near Dark" (made by the same director of "the hurt locker", and "strange days").
He's been in quite a few of James Cameron's movies, and Kathryn Bigelow asked JC for permission to 'poach' his cast for her movie (it was made after ALIENS, and they spend a fair amount of ALIENS commentary time talking about Near Dark).
Bill Paxton started out in movies the same way James Cameron did.
Doing special effects for Roger Corman.
WARORK93 wrote:
I wouldn't consider him a villain, sure he had a dark moment but in the end he died a hero...
So did Vader.
No, Vader was a dark lord for decades, was the ringmaster of Imperial oppression galaxy wide, orchestrated several ethnic cleansings and ruthlessly upheld the Emperor's will in all parts of the Empire...Then he had a change of heart...
Boromir on the other hand, had a moment, a singular moment of mania, and then came to his senses...
The two are similar yes but whereas I'd consider Vader a true villain, Boromir simply didn't rack up a long list of evil things he did before his end...the worst thing he did was unsuccessfully chase a hobbit around the woods for a bit before being given the slip...
Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
FITZZ wrote: Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
Huh, that is rather perplexing...I would at least consider them "antagonists" as they serve as the "enemy" in the two books...
FITZZ wrote: Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
Huh, that is rather perplexing...I would at least consider them "antagonists" as they serve as the "enemy" in the two books...
yeah, they do, but they fall under my jurisdiction of 'bad' because they target humans specifically, mainly it would seem, because animals cant catch 'zombie'
FITZZ wrote: Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
Huh, that is rather perplexing...I would at least consider them "antagonists" as they serve as the "enemy" in the two books...
yeah, they do, but they fall under my jurisdiction of 'bad' because they target humans specifically, mainly it would seem, because animals cant catch 'zombie'
FITZZ wrote: Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
Huh, that is rather perplexing...I would at least consider them "antagonists" as they serve as the "enemy" in the two books...
Antagonist...yeah, but hardly "voluntary antagonist"...if you follow..
Zombies don't choose to be " evil" ( in fact I don't consider them evil at all)...their actions are simply a byproduct of their condition.
Yes, but the same with mentally unstable killers. therefore, while not being 'evil' they are certainly 'bad enemies'
In fact, that is some of the horror of fighting zombies, they have no concept of right or wrong, even animals can get scared off. but zombies have lost all mental abilities besides 'move' and 'eat'
WARORK93 wrote:
No, Vader was a dark lord for decades, was the ringmaster of Imperial oppression galaxy wide, orchestrated several ethnic cleansings and ruthlessly upheld the Emperor's will in all parts of the Empire...Then he had a change of heart...
Boromir on the other hand, had a moment, a singular moment of mania, and then came to his senses...
The two are similar yes but whereas I'd consider Vader a true villain, Boromir simply didn't rack up a long list of evil things he did before his end...the worst thing he did was unsuccessfully chase a hobbit around the woods for a bit before being given the slip...
You don't need to be evil to be a villain. Just read some Moore.
yeah. all boromir did was e all brave, strike manly poses, give obsessive forshadowings, give in to said obsession, chase frodo because he wanted the ring, lost frodo, broke down when he realized that he had been a jerk, defended mary and pippen from the big bad black orcs , get shot by said big bad orcs, get shot again, get shot again, acted heroic while getting shot YET AGAIN, got shot a fifth time, then got all apolagetic.
Toastedandy wrote:Boromir highlighted the evil and redemption in every mans heart. I though he was the best character in the trilogy.
In general normal men come off as villainous in the trilogy, only being heroic when guided by Maia, Elves, or Numernorean descendants. This was intentional of course, as Tolkien was aping European myths and epics in which men generally do good because their betters want them to for some reason.
Frieza was one of the most dangerous bad guys EVER. This guy blew up a planet just because Super Sayian legend *might* be true. Plus, he had oodles of planets under his control.
FITZZ wrote: Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
Huh, that is rather perplexing...I would at least consider them "antagonists" as they serve as the "enemy" in the two books...
Antagonist...yeah, but hardly "voluntary antagonist"...if you follow..
Zombies don't choose to be " evil" ( in fact I don't consider them evil at all)...their actions are simply a byproduct of their condition.
Antagonists don't have to be evil, in some stories the weather is the main antagonist and I wouldn't call the weather a villain.
FITZZ wrote: Ha, Ineptus' post puts me a bit at odds with myself...
On one hand, I am perhaps the biggest fan of our flesh eating friends that has ever walked the earth...
But, on the other hand...I don't really see zombies as " bad guys"...they have no conscience of what they are...no agenda ...no schemes...they are simply victims of a virus/disease , who have become "monsters"...
Huh, that is rather perplexing...I would at least consider them "antagonists" as they serve as the "enemy" in the two books...
Antagonist...yeah, but hardly "voluntary antagonist"...if you follow..
Zombies don't choose to be " evil" ( in fact I don't consider them evil at all)...their actions are simply a byproduct of their condition.
Antagonists don't have to be evil, in some stories the weather is the main antagonist and I wouldn't call the weather a villain.
Funny you'd mention forces of nature as antagonist MilkDog, as that's basically how I see zombies ( in a sense)...as a "warped force of nature", much like a storm or fire...they don't have any real thought process about the devestation and death they cause...they simply do it...they function outside the perimeters of " good and evil".
For me the most horrifiying, evil thing ever created is this:
A gremlin, i watched "The gremlins" when i was a kid, and it scared me to death. I couldn't sleep for a week. I thought that everything cute and cuddly could turn into a monster.
And frankly these things still creep me out today.
ineptus astartes wrote:Yeah, but Grand Moff Tarkin blew up a planet because he felt like it.
that is better (or worse.)
True, but he had to use a Space Station to do it...last time I checked, Frieza used HIS OWN engery attack to blow up a planet. Not only evil, but scary strong.
htj wrote:Oh, I just remembered one of the most vicious and nasty villains in cinema: Joe Pesci's character in Goodfellas. Genuinely horrible.
He wasn't a very nice guy in Casino, either.
True, but in both films I found both of Pesci's characters likeable...maybe it's just me, but I didn't really see either character as "evil"...Criminal yes..but not evil.
Monster Rain wrote:Yeah, he's kind of got the whole "Boondock Saints" thing going.
It's not like the people he's killing are particularly friendly either.
Exactly..it's not as though he extends his violent activities to include shooting Sam and Sally Suburbanite or Joe Q Citizen...
In Goodfella's for example, Tommy doesn't kill anyone who isn't some how involved in his "gangster world"...it's more a matter of "business" than " butchery"...
Monster Rain wrote:Not to mention the fact that any of the people he whacks would do the exact same thing to him.
"Now go home and get your shinebox!"
...Loved that scene.
And yeah, with the exceptions of "Stacks Edwards" and " Muray the wig Guy"...he didn't kill anyone who didn't pose some sort of risk..
And hell, Stacks came back as a Gangster himself in Pulp Fiction..and as a Jedi Master..
Plus Muray the wig Guy was a rat..he deserved that ice pick in the noggin.
KingCracker wrote:Have you actually watched psycho? Its ok...but its pretty dull in my opinion.
I...um...wow, I'm a bit stunned that you'd describe one of the greatest psychological thrillers of all time as "dull" KC...
Sure...it's not a "BANGBOOMPOW"! sort of film , but that's due to the fact that Hitchcock weaved a great deal of subtle complexity into his movies..which,in my opinion, make them far more interesting .
KingCracker wrote:Have you actually watched psycho? Its ok...but its pretty dull in my opinion.
I...um...wow, I'm a bit stunned that you'd describe one of the greatest psychological thrillers of all time as "dull" KC...
Sure...it's not a "BANGBOOMPOW"! sort of film , but that's due to the fact that Hitchcock weaved a great deal of subtle complexity into his movies..which,in my opinion, make them far more interesting .
I've seen Alfred Hitchcock's "The Birds", "North by Northwest" and "Rear Window" but haven't seen "Psycho" yet, I like his films though.
KingCracker wrote:Have you actually watched psycho? Its ok...but its pretty dull in my opinion.
I...um...wow, I'm a bit stunned that you'd describe one of the greatest psychological thrillers of all time as "dull" KC...
Sure...it's not a "BANGBOOMPOW"! sort of film , but that's due to the fact that Hitchcock weaved a great deal of subtle complexity into his movies..which,in my opinion, make them far more interesting .
I've seen Alfred Hitchcock's "The Birds", "North by Northwest" and "Rear Window" but haven't seen "Psycho" yet, I like his films though.
All very good movies, but Psycho, IMO...is an absolute Masterpiece ...definitely give it a watch MilkDog.
KingCracker wrote:Have you actually watched psycho? Its ok...but its pretty dull in my opinion.
I...um...wow, I'm a bit stunned that you'd describe one of the greatest psychological thrillers of all time as "dull" KC...
Sure...it's not a "BANGBOOMPOW"! sort of film , but that's due to the fact that Hitchcock weaved a great deal of subtle complexity into his movies..which,in my opinion, make them far more interesting .
I've seen Alfred Hitchcock's "The Birds", "North by Northwest" and "Rear Window" but haven't seen "Psycho" yet, I like his films though.
All very good movies, but Psycho, IMO...is an absolute Masterpiece ...definitely give it a watch MilkDog.
You called him ' MilkDog '!! That's frakin' hillarious!
And got to agree, Psycho is a must see classic.
For me, the truely scary part of his character was he could be the "guy next door".
KingCracker wrote:Have you actually watched psycho? Its ok...but its pretty dull in my opinion.
How did you think Psycho was dull?
It is the turning point for horror films.
Basically horror films break down into two era's.
Everything before Psycho, and everything after Psycho.
look at the mise-en-scene for Psycho, It is brilliant!
The fact that the old spooky house on the hill, which people think they should be afraid of, overshadows the modern welcoming hotel down below, yet all the action happens at the motel and the house is the safest structure in the frame.
The suspense is done very well, the lighting, and camera angles, are superb as well.
It was really the first Psychological horror film, and it did everything very well.
It was nominated fora an Oscar in the following categories: Best Art Direction-Set Decoration, Black-and-White Best Cinematography, Black-and-White And Alfred Hitchcock was nominated for an Oscar for Best Director.
While he isn't exactly the "villain" per-se, (there really isn't a villain in The Merchant of Venice, in my opinion) the whole, "I will have my pound of flesh" thing is rather gruesome and Al Pacino played the role better than anyone ever has in my opinion.
Say what you want about Psycho, I just dont like the movie, and personally I think its really over rated as a horror movie. I was told for years growing up how awesome a movie it was, and when I watched it, it was rather disappointing.
KingCracker wrote:Say what you want about Psycho, I just dont like the movie, and personally I think its really over rated as a horror movie. I was told for years growing up how awesome a movie it was, and when I watched it, it was rather disappointing.
Matter of taste I suppose, though I do understand your viewpoint KC...I had much the same reaction when I read LOTR...heard how absolutely wonderful it was, but found it utterly dull...different strokes and all.
The one bad guy who has appeared or been a major player in a lot of movies, the ultimate villain, Satan.
Whether its creating a demon spawn, bringing about the end of the world, or just trying to steal someone's soul, Satan is probably the evilest of all movie villains.
halonachos wrote:The one bad guy who has appeared or been a major player in a lot of movies, the ultimate villain, Satan.
Whether its creating a demon spawn, bringing about the end of the world, or just trying to steal someone's soul, Satan is probably the evilest of all movie villains.
But he's still a bad villain. He's never got an interesting backstory, he's never believable. Being the evillest doesn't make him the "best of the bad", it makes him the villain equivalent of superman. Broken and uninteresting in all but the best writers' hands.
The BEST villains are the ones that are fully realized characters with depth and believably (or in the case of chaotic evil villains, believable craziness, see ledger's joker)
Rented Tritium wrote: He's never got an interesting backstory, he's never believable.
Really? fighting the creator of everything(according to legend) for control of everything isn't an interesting backstory?
and lying was always one of his strongest talents. you're not supposed to believe him!
Rented Tritium wrote: He's never got an interesting backstory, he's never believable.
Really? fighting the creator of everything(according to legend) for control of everything isn't an interesting backstory?
and lying was always one of his strongest talents. you're not supposed to believe him!
Except that his fight is never actually explored. he's used as a generic boogeyman with magic powers. Almost nobody actually writes anything interesting into him besides making him automatically evil with no actual characterization.
And when I say believable, I don't mean it like "do I believe what this character is saying", its "does this character seem real"
Bottom line, satan is almost never written well. He's always a flat unrealized character without any well defined motivations.
Rented Tritium wrote: He's never got an interesting backstory, he's never believable.
Really? fighting the creator of everything(according to legend) for control of everything isn't an interesting backstory?
and lying was always one of his strongest talents. you're not supposed to believe him!
Except that his fight is never actually explored. he's used as a generic boogeyman with magic powers. Almost nobody actually writes anything interesting into him besides making him automatically evil with no actual characterization.
And when I say believable, I don't mean it like "do I believe what this character is saying", its "does this character seem real"
Bottom line, satan is almost never written well. He's always a flat unrealized character without any well defined motivations.
The question is not whether they are real or seem real, the question is who's the best bad guy and that would be Satan. He's OP and evil, an incredibly dangerous combination for an evil villain.
Rented Tritium wrote: He's never got an interesting backstory, he's never believable.
Really? fighting the creator of everything(according to legend) for control of everything isn't an interesting backstory?
and lying was always one of his strongest talents. you're not supposed to believe him!
Except that his fight is never actually explored. he's used as a generic boogeyman with magic powers. Almost nobody actually writes anything interesting into him besides making him automatically evil with no actual characterization.
And when I say believable, I don't mean it like "do I believe what this character is saying", its "does this character seem real"
Bottom line, satan is almost never written well. He's always a flat unrealized character without any well defined motivations.
The question is not whether they are real or seem real, the question is who's the best bad guy and that would be Satan. He's OP and evil, an incredibly dangerous combination for an evil villain.
See, those are the exact things that make him a BAD villain. Power without characterization makes him an awful villain. He might as well be a natural disaster at that point. The devil is a profoundly boring villain.
The best villains are the ones that have layers and motivations. The devil is just derp evil derp.
Being believable or not is ABSOLUTELY a part of what makes the best villains.
Automatically Appended Next Post: That's not to say you can't probably find some specific movie that did satan really well, but I can't think of one.
Rented Tritium wrote: He's never got an interesting backstory, he's never believable.
Really? fighting the creator of everything(according to legend) for control of everything isn't an interesting backstory?
and lying was always one of his strongest talents. you're not supposed to believe him!
Except that his fight is never actually explored. he's used as a generic boogeyman with magic powers. Almost nobody actually writes anything interesting into him besides making him automatically evil with no actual characterization.
And when I say believable, I don't mean it like "do I believe what this character is saying", its "does this character seem real"
Bottom line, satan is almost never written well. He's always a flat unrealized character without any well defined motivations.
The question is not whether they are real or seem real, the question is who's the best bad guy and that would be Satan. He's OP and evil, an incredibly dangerous combination for an evil villain.
See, those are the exact things that make him a BAD villain. Power without characterization makes him an awful villain. He might as well be a natural disaster at that point. The devil is a profoundly boring villain.
The best villains are the ones that have layers and motivations. The devil is just derp evil derp.
Being believable or not is ABSOLUTELY a part of what makes the best villains.
Automatically Appended Next Post: That's not to say you can't probably find some specific movie that did satan really well, but I can't think of one.
Really depends on the story itself, in a lot of films/ books,etc..." The Devil" is depicted as a " generic boogeyman" with no real depth, existing only as an "antagonist" for the " good guys" to pit themselves against in an effort to show how " good" they are...
But in some media, Memnoch the Devil springs instantly to mind, " Satan" is shown as quite the dimensional fellow...being much more than just " Dark" to gods "light".
Rented Tritium wrote:That's a good example. Memnoch was a great use of the character!
Even then, I still contend that more than 90% of the time, the devil is used ineffectively and is a bad villain.
This means he doesn't count as "best of the bad" to me, but a SPECIFIC version of the devil from a specific work absolutely can count.
Yeah, I can definitely agree with you...in most media not enough time is spent delving into what really makes " Old Scratch" a true antagonist ( or even if he's truly an antagonist to began with)...and he is used simply in a " boogey boogey , I'm here to be evil ..rawr!" capacity....which, with some rare exceptions ( Memnoch, The Exorcist...The original Omen films) comes off a bit...meh.
alarmingrick wrote:I thought he (satan) was played/portrayed pretty well in Mister Frost.
Also in The Prophecy, albeit way too short.
And how can any of us forget his chilling representation in South Park?!?!
... ...Along with Harvey Keitel's performance in Little Nickey, I find the South Park Satan to be one of my favorites...
...And yeah, The Prophecy depiction was good as well.
He was scary in South Park, evil man of the year in my opinion. But if you want a villain from South Park, I would say Cartman fits.
But he's so versatile is the thing. Sure he can have meh interpretations but as a whole he can be anything and do anything for any reason. Hell, he doesn't even have to be there in person to screw somebody over and in Paradise Lost he's rather... "humanized" and the entire book is from his perspective.
KingCracker wrote:Ill admit, I liked the Devil in Constantine. He just had a style to him. And for some reason, I loved the tar on his feet for some reason
God, i can't believe i forgot that one! great call, KC!
KingCracker wrote:Ill admit, I liked the Devil in Constantine. He just had a style to him. And for some reason, I loved the tar on his feet for some reason
God, i can't believe i forgot that one! great call, KC!
I loved how he saved Constantine's life just because Constantine managed to get into heaven.
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epic. In Pitch Black. Not the movie that shall not be named anymore than characters who should be retconned because neither should have existed.
as well as the remake
I...um...wow, I'm a bit stunned that you'd describe one of the greatest psychological thrillers of all time as "dull" KC...
