One of the reasons this Republican convention has been so deathly dull is that the real action isn't at the convention. It's at Cracker Bay. That's the name of the yacht where the Romney team just hosted 50 partiers, including some of his top donors. This was one of about a dozen events outside of the convention where they had private meetings with donors giving more than $1 million dollars to his campaign. Over $1 million a piece. Now, where do you think the real policy gets made?
You think Mitt Romney gives a damn what a delegate thinks? The only delegates that matter were on that yacht. They call this group the "Victory Council." This is made of people who are literally millionaires and billionaires and who dictate what Mitt Romney's positions will be. He's a legendary flip-flopper, but if you want to know what he really thinks you had to be on that boat.
"It was a really nice event. These are good supporters," said billionaire Wilbur Ross, an energy industry executive, according to ABC News. I bet it was. Mitt Romney just revealed his energy plan a couple of days ago. Are you going to be surprised to find out that it massively helps energy companies? A really nice event is where you pay a million bucks and you get billions back if the candidate you supported wins the presidency.
It's clear what Mitt Romney owes these people. What do you think he owes you? Ann Romney said that Mitt was a man who would not fail. She's right; he will not fail his donors. He is a good businessman, so he will give them the service they paid for.
They're so brazen the boat they were meeting on was flying a Cayman Islands flag. As one local put it, even their yacht doesn't want to pay taxes. In the old days, you'd be a little embarrassed about things like this and it would be huge news if you got caught. Now people treat it like it's perfectly normal.
Paul Ryan recently went to get the blessing of billionaire GOP donor Sheldon Adelson. Soon after he was picked and before getting ready for their convention, he had to stop everything and kiss the ring of their boss. This is sick. It is obvious legalized bribery and it's being done right in front of our eyes. And the press hardly notices as our democracy leaves shore along with that boat full of millionaires.
The candidate with more money wins 93 percent of congressional races. In the Senate, it's 94 percent. It doesn't matter if you are a Democrat or Republican, a liberal or a conservative, it doesn't matter what your ideas or values are. The only thing that matters is if you're on that yacht.
Because so much of politics today has been reduced to "this politician did something scummy, shady, or stupid" "Oh yeah? Well so did THIS guy on YOUR team"?
Because so much of politics today has been reduced to "this politician did something scummy, shady, or stupid" "Oh yeah? Well so did THIS guy on YOUR team"?
Something about casting stones and glass houses...
Because so much of politics today has been reduced to "this politician did something scummy, shady, or stupid" "Oh yeah? Well so did THIS guy on YOUR team"?
Something about casting stones and glass houses...
If Kerry has a yacht named 'Honkey Cove' I'll laugh at that as well.
whembly wrote: So... what's the problem? That he's rich?
A bigger problem is the same people who don't care that Romney flies the flag of the Cayman Islands instead of the US flag-- and this is supposed to be a potential PRESIDENT-- gladly make up nonsense bout how Obama isn't loyal to the United States.
Also, that is a nice boat, but I wonder, what's the point of the various empty decks?
I don't think they're actually empty. There'd be spacious cabins (with nice windows) a mall, resturaunts, etc inside. You just can't see it in that image as its just a concept. I don't think any formal design exists.
whembly wrote: So... what's the problem? That he's rich?
A bigger problem is the same people who don't care that Romney flies the flag of the Cayman Islands instead of the US flag-- and this is supposed to be a potential PRESIDENT-- gladly make up nonsense bout how Obama isn't loyal to the United States.
Also, that is a nice boat, but I wonder, what's the point of the various empty decks?
I think it's meant to be a floating city...eh, not sure.
As to the Romney's... yeah, I get that. Just doesn't bother me... *shrugs*
Just like it doesn't bother me that Obama goes vacationing in Hawaii (plus it's his home state)... *shrugs*
The problem is they bought romney, then had a secret meeting to discuss with him how he was going to repay them.
Those that can afford to buy the president can then have him repay the favor by passing laws that greatly benefit them and create a unequal playing field for everyone else.
Also it further shows how trickle down economics has to benefit to americans. He gets a bunch of tax breaks from the bush tax cuts, then still registers his boat in a different country because it saves him more money.
so trickle down really means, trickle down to other countries.
It started off as a boat (like aircraft carrier)... But, I think it's now like an oil rig or man-made island.
The problem is... oh forget it.... yeah.... the problem is that he is rich and I'm jealous. Happy now.
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sirlynchmob wrote: The problem is they bought romney, then had a secret meeting to discuss with him how he was going to repay them.
Those that can afford to buy the president can then have him repay the favor by passing laws that greatly benefit them and create a unequal playing field for everyone else.
Also it further shows how trickle down economics has to benefit to americans. He gets a bunch of tax breaks from the bush tax cuts, then still registers his boat in a different country because it saves him more money.
so trickle down really means, trickle down to other countries.
The problem is... oh forget it.... yeah.... the problem is that he is rich and I'm jealous. Happy now.
Ah the good old 'politics of envy' excuse that has been getting wheeled out alot these days. Nevermind that the distribution of wealth is becoming increasingly top heavy (in the UK it has now reached what it was in the 1920's and before long it will reach Victorian levels).
It started off as a boat (like aircraft carrier)... But, I think it's now like an oil rig or man-made island.
[/spoiler]
That thing is a death trap waiting to spring.
True... I also think there's a cool "off-the-grid" initiative of using old barges to live...then, achor them together to form a small, self sufficient community. (looking for article... might be at WIRED).
Oh you think elected officials actually represent you and are just trying to help save america.
How quaint.
You haven't been paying attention to me, eh?
I think they're all crooks...
But to make things betta... that's easy, repeal the 17th admendment.
Really thats your solution?
You don't think ending corporate personhood would help?
ending super pacs?
Enacting laws to stop the revolving door from corporate executive to elected official to lobbyist?
ending the electoral college and make the process easier for 3rd parties to get on the ballots in all the states?
term limits?
Melissia wrote: A bigger problem is the same people who don't care that Romney flies the flag of the Cayman Islands instead of the US flag-- and this is supposed to be a potential PRESIDENT-- gladly make up nonsense bout how Obama isn't loyal to the United States.
Well, it isn't his yacht. It was rented for campaign purposes.
Just says that it's a charter vessel, not where it's registered though.
First link says this
First link wrote:The Country the Yacht is Flagged in: Cayman Islands - The official registry port is George Town and her home port is Fort Lauderdale, USA - Class society used: LR (Lloyds Register) - Completed survey under Maritime & Coastguard Agency (MCA)
It's a name not a theme...
Just like how Queen Elizabeth II wasn't the only person allowed on the Queen Elizabeth II...
Though I bet she'd have fun driving the ship on her own
Most commercial passenger vessels serving the US are flagged elsewhere, for tax or legal reasons. Certainly the majority of cruise ships and rental luxury yachts, to my recollection.
Mannahnin wrote: Most commercial passenger vessels serving the US are flagged elsewhere, for tax or legal reasons. Certainly the majority of cruise ships and rental luxury yachts, to my recollection.
Are Canadian taxes more forgiving with respect to marine vehicles?
I visited Homer Bay, AK couple of years ago and saw a gak ton of ships reg at BC.
Because so much of politics today has been reduced to "this politician did something scummy, shady, or stupid" "Oh yeah? Well so did THIS guy on YOUR team"?
Something about casting stones and glass houses...
When everyone in charge is living in a house of shattered glass, it is time to get out the broom...
A yacht with a castle on? Can't buy good taste A yacht that's actually a floating parking lot? Nooooooo.
Anyway. I'm happy with my Laser.
Aaaaand now I'm picturing a shark with a frickin' Laser on it's head. With a terrified French-Canadian in the Laser.
You picture weird stuff Just for clarification, a Laser's a dinghy. My dad being a huge sailing fan, AND and woodworker, I've had my own monosail since I was 16. Someone was about to trash it because of a few holes in the coque, so after a few months of epoxy works, I had my own free boat! Won me a few tournaments too!
Now I'm an Obama supporter, but kennedy did the same thing with his yacht I think. Didn't he have Maralin Monroe sing on that thing? Besides huff post is horribly biased to the left that even I can't stand it.
yeri wrote: Now I'm an Obama supporter, but kennedy did the same thing with his yacht I think. Didn't he have Maralin Monroe sing on that thing? Besides huff post is horribly biased to the left that even I can't stand it.
Don't you like knowing who has your potential president by the ballsack?
Yes, but every politician has corporate lobbyists that do that stuff. That's how the game is played, that's how it's always been played. We're just getting a peek behind the curtain now.
BaronIveagh wrote: The real pisser? A genuine American made super yacht, the USS Williamsburg, is sitting in Italy looking for someone to finance it's restoration.
When Harry Truman owned her
Harry Truman didn't own it, it was a Presidential Yacht.
Its also vastly inferior to the Cracker Bay in all respects, plus it would most likely be restored by European contractors at a higher price than simply chartering a functioning vessel.
Yacht number 2 has an anti-missile system, and is longer than the Tantive IV.
This is still a civilian boat, right? Why the hell would you need an anti-missile system? You could sink that thing without spending millions of dollars in a missile...
This is still a civilian boat, right? Why the hell would you need an anti-missile system? You could sink that thing without spending millions of dollars in a missile...
Crazy russians...
You could, but Abramovich* has a 40 man personal security staff for that. He's basically a Bond villain.
*Also, the Eclipse is only one of Abramovich's 5 yachts. Previously he had 8, but sold one, gave one away, and lost a third in a divorce settlement.
whembly wrote: So... what's the problem? That he's rich?
Yes, but that's a problem for a different thread. The primary issue is the complacency and transparency of bribery via campaign contribution in modern politics. This is of course not limited to Romney, but cracker bay, a different countries flag, and the fact that it's actually a giant Yacht makes this look really bad for him as a candidate trying to look like he's ever lived some semblance of a normal life.
Its also vastly inferior to the Cracker Bay in all respects, plus it would most likely be restored by European contractors at a higher price than simply chartering a functioning vessel.
11m-13m at last count, though 5m to get her sea worthy enough to go back to the US for restoration.
And, no, it is superior in at least one way. She's not named Cracker Bay.
She's also longer. 293 feet as opposed to 150. Despite the Williamsburg being longer, wider, and a greater displacement, Cracker Bay is slower by half a knot.
She also has a longer range than the Cracker Bay.
And was built in the US as opposed to the Netherlands.
This is still a civilian boat, right? Why the hell would you need an anti-missile system? You could sink that thing without spending millions of dollars in a missile...
Crazy russians...
You could, but Abramovich* has a 40 man personal security staff for that. He's basically a Bond villain.
*Also, the Eclipse is only one of Abramovich's 5 yachts. Previously he had 8, but sold one, gave one away, and lost a third in a divorce settlement.
Any shmug with some C4 or a couple of RPGs could probably still bring the thing down. Luxury boats aren't exactly the sturdiest or sink proofiest of all ships.
Any shmug with some C4 or a couple of RPGs could probably still bring the thing down. Luxury boats aren't exactly the sturdiest or sink proofiest of all ships.
Another good point in favor of the Williamsburg. I'm told they never removed her armor belt.
This is still a civilian boat, right? Why the hell would you need an anti-missile system? You could sink that thing without spending millions of dollars in a missile...
Crazy russians...
You could, but Abramovich* has a 40 man personal security staff for that. He's basically a Bond villain.
*Also, the Eclipse is only one of Abramovich's 5 yachts. Previously he had 8, but sold one, gave one away, and lost a third in a divorce settlement.
whembly wrote: So... what's the problem? That he's rich?
Yes, but that's a problem for a different thread. The primary issue is the complacency and transparency of bribery via campaign contribution in modern politics. This is of course not limited to Romney, but cracker bay, a different countries flag, and the fact that it's actually a giant Yacht makes this look really bad for him as a candidate trying to look like he's ever lived some semblance of a normal life.
So...
Who do you want for Prez? If you had a pick... who would it be? (I pick Frazzle).
She's also longer. 293 feet as opposed to 150. Despite the Williamsburg being longer, wider, and a greater displacement, Cracker Bay is slower by half a knot.
She also has a longer range than the Cracker Bay.
You realize that smaller doesn't mean faster, right? Nor is the only factor to consider speed. You also have to factor in stability, draught, operating cost, and cruising speed. For the purposes of the Romney campaign (I should have made that context more clear, perhaps.), the Cracker Bay is superior in every way.
Range is important, but this is the Caribbean, not a transatlantic cruise.
And was built in the US as opposed to the Netherlands.
Why does that matter when its 82 years old*? Its not like restoring it would somehow entail supporting US industry. Its ancient and essentially useless, particularly given the context of this thread.
Any shmug with some C4 or a couple of RPGs could probably still bring the thing down. Luxury boats aren't exactly the sturdiest or sink proofiest of all ships.
I'm going to assume that someone who has a yacht built with an anti-missile system, and has a 40 man personal security team, probably didn't overlook that little detail.
whembly wrote: So... what's the problem? That he's rich?
Yes, but that's a problem for a different thread. The primary issue is the complacency and transparency of bribery via campaign contribution in modern politics. This is of course not limited to Romney, but cracker bay, a different countries flag, and the fact that it's actually a giant Yacht makes this look really bad for him as a candidate trying to look like he's ever lived some semblance of a normal life.
So...
Who do you want for Prez? If you had a pick... who would it be? (I pick Frazzle).
That's kind of a loaded question, but I'll pick myself. I know where I stand on issues. I'm consistent. I've both built that and had that built for me. I'd be the best and worst president we've had in ages because I'm an absolute outsider who knows more about fixing our problems than most in Washington but I wouldn't be able to work in the system since I think that our democracy is broken and can't be fixed except outside democratic means (because Americans are dumb, corporations are uniformally corrupt, our news media is yellow, and one out of our two parties is basically racist skeletor town).
I'm going to assume that someone who has a yacht built with an anti-missile system, and has a 40 man personal security team, probably didn't overlook that little detail.
There's no countermeasure to having a brick of C4 touching the side of your boat outside of proactively preventing that from happening. There are very few ways to proactively prevent that from happening if they have a scuba tank.
A yacht with a castle on? Can't buy good taste
A yacht that's actually a floating parking lot? Nooooooo.
Anyway. I'm happy with my Laser.
Aaaaand now I'm picturing a shark with a frickin' Laser on it's head. With a terrified French-Canadian in the Laser.
You picture weird stuff Just for clarification, a Laser's a dinghy. My dad being a huge sailing fan, AND and woodworker, I've had my own monosail since I was 16. Someone was about to trash it because of a few holes in the coque, so after a few months of epoxy works, I had my own free boat! Won me a few tournaments too!
A yacht with a castle on? Can't buy good taste A yacht that's actually a floating parking lot? Nooooooo.
Anyway. I'm happy with my Laser.
Aaaaand now I'm picturing a shark with a frickin' Laser on it's head. With a terrified French-Canadian in the Laser.
You picture weird stuff Just for clarification, a Laser's a dinghy. My dad being a huge sailing fan, AND and woodworker, I've had my own monosail since I was 16. Someone was about to trash it because of a few holes in the coque, so after a few months of epoxy works, I had my own free boat! Won me a few tournaments too!
I am jealous...
Laser sailboats are awesome. You can beat those things like nothing else, and they respond incredibly to the slightess wind.
Although they'll suck if you want to throw a party for your campaign donators.
Had not seen that. The sale figures posted (admittedly in 2008 which was the last time I looked at it) stated that restoration was included. Of course, this could be why that ad was pulled, as it was being sold at the time by the shipyard it was docked at, not someone from Florida. However, it's still less than buying a new built ship the same specs.
You realize that smaller doesn't mean faster, right? Nor is the only factor to consider speed. You also have to factor in stability, draught, operating cost, and cruising speed. For the purposes of the Romney campaign (I should have made that context more clear, perhaps.), the Cracker Bay is superior in every way.
Range is important, but this is the Caribbean, not a transatlantic cruise.
Actually, it would be superior to the Romney campaign in one way as well. It's a US built ship. Made in America mean anything to you? Further, it means that the engines have superior power.
Why does that matter when its 82 years old*? Its not like restoring it would somehow entail supporting US industry. Its ancient and essentially useless, particularly given the context of this thread.
*Or even if it were brand new?
I dunno, maybe because his campaign slogan seems to be 'We Built That!'. It'd be like him giving one of those 'We built That' speeches from the back of a Ferrari. And, writing off 'ancient' as 'useless' is a bad idea. When I was a kid, my great grandfather's 'ancient and useless' fishing boat survived a storm that sent quite a few more modern boats to the bottom of Lake Erie.
Probably not, but it would come off in any restoration as its most likely unusable now.
...I was going to ask why, but I'll assume that you're going based on the exterior rust. And, no, if the hull is still as intact as they claim, then the armor belt is likely less weathered. The thing about internal armor belts is that they might slow the ship down, but they don't corrode much.
I'm going to assume that someone who has a yacht built with an anti-missile system, and has a 40 man personal security team, probably didn't overlook that little detail.
You'd be surprised. The USS Cole didn't notice men in a boat, after all.
A yacht with a castle on? Can't buy good taste
A yacht that's actually a floating parking lot? Nooooooo.
Anyway. I'm happy with my Laser.
Aaaaand now I'm picturing a shark with a frickin' Laser on it's head. With a terrified French-Canadian in the Laser.
You picture weird stuff Just for clarification, a Laser's a dinghy. My dad being a huge sailing fan, AND and woodworker, I've had my own monosail since I was 16. Someone was about to trash it because of a few holes in the coque, so after a few months of epoxy works, I had my own free boat! Won me a few tournaments too!
I am jealous...
Laser sailboats are awesome. You can beat those things like nothing else, and they respond incredibly to the slightess wind.
Although they'll suck if you want to throw a party for your campaign donators.
Well my campaign donors would consist of me and a bottle of port...
Worth it. I'm not entirely shoddy when drunk...
Though it does depend how drunk...
You British are lucky. You can buy good ships for less than you can in the US. And don't have to deal with legal stupidity trying to buy Dunkirk little ships.
Worth it. I'm not entirely shoddy when drunk...
Though it does depend how drunk...
You British are lucky. You can buy good ships for less than you can in the US. And don't have to deal with legal stupidity trying to buy Dunkirk little ships.
What's the problem there?
Unless you're trying to buy one of the original ones...
What's the problem there?
Unless you're trying to buy one of the original ones...
That was exactly the problem. Better, it was the Count Dracula (formerly the pinnace of the German Battlecruiser Hindenburg and a survivor of Jutland, Dogger Bank, and the scuttling at Scapa Flow, and later used to evacuate from Dunkirk.) They kept dropping the price further and further, but wouldn't sell outside of Britain. I guess they finally sold her for 60k pounds.
It was one of the few things I would have been willing to send my muskets to Sotheby's for.
What's the problem there?
Unless you're trying to buy one of the original ones...
That was exactly the problem. Better, it was the Count Dracula (formerly the pinnace of the German Battlecruiser Hindenburg and a survivor of Jutland, Dogger Bank, and the scuttling at Scapa Flow, and later used to evacuate from Dunkirk.) They kept dropping the price further and further, but wouldn't sell outside of Britain. I guess they finally sold her for 60k pounds.
What's the problem there?
Unless you're trying to buy one of the original ones...
That was exactly the problem. Better, it was the Count Dracula (formerly the pinnace of the German Battlecruiser Hindenburg and a survivor of Jutland, Dogger Bank, and the scuttling at Scapa Flow, and later used to evacuate from Dunkirk.) They kept dropping the price further and further, but wouldn't sell outside of Britain. I guess they finally sold her for 60k pounds.
60k for that seems a crime. That's a pretty boat.
The issue with that is that it's a part of a fairly important event in national history i'd assume.
The same issue with the last Vulcan bomber...
Yeah, I'm sure that once he began touting that it would be horribly difficult to find examples where Romney chose foreign manufactured goods, or failed to support American workers* (which is for some reason an issue).
I dunno, maybe because his campaign slogan seems to be 'We Built That!'.
That isn't his campaign slogan. He doesn't really have one. The closest thing is "Americans deserve more jobs and more money." which is his present webpage headline.
It'd be like him giving one of those 'We built That' speeches from the back of a Ferrari.
Yeah, because giving a speech off the back of a yacht when you're talking about the economy being bad is a great plan. Especially one you spent ~140 million dollars on.
...I was going to ask why, but I'll assume that you're going based on the exterior rust. And, no, if the hull is still as intact as they claim, then the armor belt is likely less weathered. The thing about internal armor belts is that they might slow the ship down, but they don't corrode much.
First, who are "they"?
Second, the armor belt is probably not internal as its a retrofit. It was a yacht first.
You'd be surprised. The USS Cole didn't notice men in a boat, after all.
The USS Cole was a blue water ship, designed to engaged blue water forces. The Eclipse is also a blue water ship, but it also isn't designed to engage blue water forces. It isn't going to be shot at by regular military.
The issue with that is that it's a part of a fairly important event in national history i'd assume.
The same issue with the last Vulcan bomber...
Two of them, actually. 4 if you count Scapa Flow and Dogger Bank.
Not that I wasn't willing to part with some equally Warehouse 13 stuff, mind you. I'd tell you about it, but dogma would gak, call me a liar, and then say that any photos are shopped, (and I'm betting a few of you would start asking me for prices) so I'll just say it was really good and leave it at that, as that little ship was about the only thing that would have gotten me to part with what I've got.
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dogma wrote: [
Yeah, because giving a speech off the back of a yacht when you're talking about the economy being bad is a great plan. Especially one you spent ~140 million dollars on.
If he bought American and put Americans to work with that 140m dollars (which is possible) I'd call it putting your money where your mouth is. He says that giving tax breaks to the rich will improve the economy, that would be a great example of rich people employing Americans with their economic largess.
Mannahnin wrote: If you rent a nice yacht, odds are it's going to be registered somewhere else. They fly the flag of the country in which they're registered.
So he couldn't even rent American? I might, I grant, really not like the US. But guys like Romney I reserve an especial hate, with the burning heat of a thousand exploding suns. It's just the in your face hypocrisy.
The issue with that is that it's a part of a fairly important event in national history i'd assume.
The same issue with the last Vulcan bomber...
Two of them, actually. 4 if you count Scapa Flow and Dogger Bank.
Not that I wasn't willing to part with some equally Warehouse 13 stuff, mind you. I'd tell you about it, but dogma would gak, call me a liar, and then say that any photos are shopped, (and I'm betting a few of you would start asking me for prices) so I'll just say it was really good and leave it at that, as that little ship was about the only thing that would have gotten me to part with what I've got.
Dunkirk is probably counted more in the national memory than Dogger Bank or Scapa Flow...
Dunkirk is something i would lay odds on almost everyone in the UK having heard of if not knowing about it.
If he bought American and put Americans to work with that 140m dollars (which is possible) I'd call it putting your money where your mouth is. He says that giving tax breaks to the rich will improve the economy, that would be a great example of rich people employing Americans with their economic largess.
No, its really not possible. At best he's funding European contractors to restore some obscure piece of Presidential history using money he could have spent on advertising, at worst he's wasting campaign funds he could have donated to charitable causes.
Regardless, who is he hosting on this yacht if he bought it last year? And why would he buy it last year?
More importantly, he would be artificially subsidizing the American market, which is really easy line of attack.
More importantly, he would be artificially subsidizing the American market, which is really easy line of attack.
I think that creating any jobs at all, subsidizing or not, would be seen as a good thing by the general public. Except maybe by his running mate, who has some peculiar ideas of his own. (Ayn Rand? REALLY?!?)
More importantly, he would be artificially subsidizing the American market, which is really easy line of attack.
I think that creating any jobs at all, subsidizing or not, would be seen as a good thing by the general public. Except maybe by his running mate, who has some peculiar ideas of his own. (Ayn Rand? REALLY?!?)
Only so long as conservative media in America thought it was ok. The moment they change their mind to sell a few commercial spots via controversy the conservative public would turn against their officeholders in a heartbeat. They're easily led by bright pictures and angry old white dudes. They don't understand when their ideologies conflict except when told so.
Only so long as conservative media in America thought it was ok. The moment they change their mind to sell a few commercial spots via controversy the conservative public would turn against their officeholders in a heartbeat. They're easily led by bright pictures and angry old white dudes. They don't understand when their ideologies conflict except when told so.
Yeah, I'm still working out how Fundamentalist Christianity and Objectivism are both endorsed by the Republicans... It's like endorsing the temperatures on the surface of Pluto and the surface of the Sun in the same sentence.
Only so long as conservative media in America thought it was ok. The moment they change their mind to sell a few commercial spots via controversy the conservative public would turn against their officeholders in a heartbeat. They're easily led by bright pictures and angry old white dudes. They don't understand when their ideologies conflict except when told so.
Yeah, I'm still working out how Fundamentalist Christianity and Objectivism are both endorsed by the Republicans... It's like endorsing the temperatures on the surface of Pluto and the surface of the Sun in the same sentence.
It's like this: Ayn Rand (and objectivisim by nature) is inherently pro choice. Paul Ryan is pro rand and anti-abortion. And this works because opposing abortion is in his 'enlightened self-interest'.
The real problem is when you get into God and Objectivism. One of the fundamental tenets of objectivism is that only once something is given form does it exist. God is, by nature, formless, and therefor does not exist. And yet, soemhow, these yahoos are running on a pro-God, Pro-Objectivism platform.
One can only marvel at the naked hypocrisy going on at the Republican convention this year.
azazel the cat wrote:This year is not special. There was no need to qualify that.
Much moreso than usual, acutally. Most previous occasions, they at least made a marginal effort to cover it up. This year it's walking around on stage, buck ass nude.
dogma wrote:
Yeah, totally. Its not like the stimulus package is a big political issue.
Actually it isn't, but the Republicans are trying hard to make it one, since they really don't have anything.
You'd be surprised. The USS Cole didn't notice men in a boat, after all.
From that laughing face you posted about the Cole, you make it seem that it was funny to you that U.S. servicemen died. Would you be willing to stand face to face with one of the crew that was on the ship that day, crack off your little one liner and start laughing? If so, let me know so I can be on hand to witness the rest of the hilarity that will ensue.
You haven't been paying attention to me, eh?
