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Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/22 23:50:46


Post by: EmilCrane


Its only been about a week and there's already conspiracy theories out, some idiot on facebook posted a series of pictures trying to pin the bombings on private military companies or something. Apparently its part of the plan to "TAKE OUR GUNS!!!!!" or something.

Needless to say the evidence is shaky and ignores aspects of the case and not really worth your time. Its also frankly insulting to those that were killed in the attack.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/22 23:53:28


Post by: djones520


There have been theories since day one. You've had people on here spreading theories.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/22 23:55:26


Post by: motyak


I saw one video (well I didn't bother watching it, but the link described it) that said 'look there are some seals training and they have the same backpack as the bombs Q.E.D. Guv'ment'. Made me laugh, then move on with my day. Conspiracy theorists going to...conspirate?

edit: conspire. Silly me


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 00:01:44


Post by: Frazzled


I heard a theory it was all right wing radicals...

I heard a theory its all about gun control and now limiting reloading supplies by da evil governmentz.

Has anyone actually looked to see where Carrot Top was during these events?

I'm not saying it was aliens but, it was aliens.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 00:08:46


Post by: BaronIveagh


Until the evidence is revealed, it's all supposition. So far, we're a bunch of language ! in an internet forum speculating on a very small amount of information, some of which may be inaccurate.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 00:09:47


Post by: motyak


I don't think Frazzled's opinions on this are quite trustworthy. My source has another opinion on who's behind this



Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 01:03:08


Post by: Dreadclaw69


 Frazzled wrote:
Yes. However, in a criminal case the defendant has the option for a jury trial under the Constitution via one of those amendments no one remembers.

Thank you for clarifying


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 01:50:42


Post by: Jihadin


Its funny how military gear gets thrown into the thought process of a conspiracy theory. Its like Fort Polk, LA is the training grounds for thousands of UN troops for deployment in the the US. Its like I have the same gear (some) that the Navy Seals have access to via US Cav, Ranger Joe, and Cothing and Sales on posts. If you are "Boots on Ground" majority of everyone have access to everything that can be equipped on one's body. Most backpacks in the military are from Camelback. If someone mention "assualtpack" they're talking about a backpack


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:01:36


Post by: Bullockist




My favourite bs i heard was from some "commentator" who was being interviewed on Australian tv who on the night of the event said "these people are trying to stop our way of life" and i remember thinking I bet this ones home grown mate.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:16:41


Post by: d-usa


I'm having a hillarious time listening to our conspiracy anti-government coworker who is explaining to us how to stop an unlawful search of your car.

I know it's unrelated, but this whole Boston thing is what is setting him off.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:45:53


Post by: Bullockist


The only thing better than an anti government conspiracy theorist is a pot smoking anti govt conspiracy theorist. Those guys make me laugh, all this crap talk about the govt and how we the people can stop them, the whole while you know they are going to be at home smoking bongs and not doing anything but talking more conspiracies.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:48:09


Post by: whembly


Bullockist wrote:
The only thing better than an anti government conspiracy theorist is a pot smoking anti govt conspiracy theorist. Those guys make me laugh, all this crap talk about the govt and how we the people can stop them, the whole while you know they are going to be at home smoking bongs and not doing anything but talking more conspiracies.

Yup... they're EVERYWHERE!


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:55:52


Post by: motyak


I don't think it's fair to put michael moore in there, isn't everthing he does dodgey conspiracy theories?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:56:53


Post by: Bullockist


Wow whembley, that's the first time I've realised that your left wing in the US is as wacky as your right wing.

Scary, scary place you guys live in :/


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 02:57:38


Post by: motyak


Bullockist wrote:
Wow whembley, that's the first time I've realised that your left wing in the US is as wacky as your right wing.

Scary, scary place you guys live in :/


They have to be equally crazy, else they won't know which side they are voting for!


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 03:00:56


Post by: kronk


 motyak wrote:
I don't think it's fair to put michael moore in there, isn't everthing he does dodgey conspiracy theories?


He's still alive? I thought he died with his credibility in the early 2000s...


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 03:04:38


Post by: motyak


 kronk wrote:
 motyak wrote:
I don't think it's fair to put michael moore in there, isn't everthing he does dodgey conspiracy theories?


He's still alive? I thought he died with his credibility in the early 2000s...


Ha, well said. I'd probably consider myself leftist by American standards, but even then that guy is just way too crazy.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 03:10:06


Post by: kronk


I actually liked his Roger & Me, but after that, I realized he was doing editorial pieces and not documentaries. Big difference.

Anyhow, back to Boston!

I do hope that his trial is conducted with all due process, and that (if guilty) he gets a fitting sentence. I hope he gives us the "why"? What the hell went wrong?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 03:10:17


Post by: Jihadin


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/interactive/2013/04/22/criminal-complaint-against-boston-bombing-suspect/

Yep its Fox but its a criminal complaint that was filed in District Court of Mass.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 03:20:05


Post by: whembly


 motyak wrote:
I don't think it's fair to put michael moore in there, isn't everthing he does dodgey conspiracy theories?

Yup... just about all of them on dodgy... sicko is one of his worst.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 04:51:32


Post by: KalashnikovMarine


Every time I see Moore I expect it to be connected to a news story about his fatal coronary or that it's been revealed he eats children or something.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 05:04:51


Post by: Jihadin


A bit tired of seeing some high profile people pressing to have him classified as a Enemy Combatant so they can gather intelligence from him. If it was his older brother maybe....just a wee maybe I agree if he had survived. The kid was following his older brother who I strongly believed recieved a bit of training in preparation and placement of the IED's. Using pressure cookers you pretty much have a directional anti personnel mine like a claymore.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 08:13:11


Post by: reds8n


pressure cookers are WMDs then ?

.. Good grief, seems Bush and Blair were right then !



Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 10:34:26


Post by: Steve steveson


Stop the export of cooking gadgets to the axis of evil! No more ice cream makers for Kim Jung Un!

Thinking about it, he would probably miss ice cream alot.

Anyway, ye, this "enemy combatant" stuff was bad enough when it was in a warzone.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 11:00:08


Post by: Frazzled


Steve steveson wrote:
Stop the export of cooking gadgets to the axis of evil! No more ice cream makers for Kim Jung Un!

Thinking about it, he would probably miss ice cream alot.

Anyway, ye, this "enemy combatant" stuff was bad enough when it was in a warzone.


We need a magazine limit on pressure cookers. No more than three pressure cookers per chef, after a thorough background check and addition to your name of a list of pressure cooker owners. We also have to end cash sales of pressure cookers. Its just a common sense approach to pressure cooker control. After all, no one is trying to take away your pressure cookers.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 11:02:00


Post by: djones520


 Frazzled wrote:
Steve steveson wrote:
Stop the export of cooking gadgets to the axis of evil! No more ice cream makers for Kim Jung Un!

Thinking about it, he would probably miss ice cream alot.

Anyway, ye, this "enemy combatant" stuff was bad enough when it was in a warzone.


We need a magazine limit on pressure cookers. No more than three pressure cookers per chef, after a thorough background check and addition to your name of a list of pressure cooker owners. We also have to end cash sales of pressure cookers. Its just a common sense approach to pressure cooker control. After all, no one is trying to take away your pressure cookers.


If it could save just one life, then shouldn't we do it? Shouldn't we make the sacrifice?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 11:31:20


Post by: Frazzled


Agreed. There is no legimitate purpose to more than three pressure cookers. Won't someone please think of the children!


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 11:33:42


Post by: djones520


 Frazzled wrote:
Agreed. There is no legimitate purpose to more than three pressure cookers. Won't someone please think of the children!


Honestly, why does anyone need a pressure cooker in the first place? Why can't they just use and oven, or a grill? The general populace has no legitimate need for them. We should ensure their only able to get into the hands of highly trained chefs.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 11:39:27


Post by: Frazzled


 djones520 wrote:
 Frazzled wrote:
Agreed. There is no legimitate purpose to more than three pressure cookers. Won't someone please think of the children!


Honestly, why does anyone need a pressure cooker in the first place? Why can't they just use and oven, or a grill? The general populace has no legitimate need for them. We should ensure their only able to get into the hands of highly trained chefs.


Its the money grubbing NPA (National Pressurecooker Association) and its corporate masters that stop common sense legislation, desired by a majority of the people, from being put into place.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 11:39:28


Post by: Dreadclaw69


Link to a PDF of the criminal complaint filed against the suspect, which sets out the case against him - http://www.justice.gov/iso/opa/resources/363201342213441988148.pdf


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 13:24:41


Post by: BaronIveagh


 Jihadin wrote:
Its funny how military gear gets thrown into the thought process of a conspiracy theory. Its like Fort Polk, LA is the training grounds for thousands of UN troops for deployment in the the US. Its like I have the same gear (some) that the Navy Seals have access to via US Cav, Ranger Joe, and Cothing and Sales on posts. If you are "Boots on Ground" majority of everyone have access to everything that can be equipped on one's body. Most backpacks in the military are from Camelback. If someone mention "assualtpack" they're talking about a backpack


And yet, if I paint a French tank in UN markings and drive it down the street, the only ones that notice are the police. (Who makes sure my papers are in order and that I have the right treds on to be road legal).

And further, most people have no clue. (and I'm sure some of you will insist there is irony in that statement, but it's actually dead serious.)


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 13:40:19


Post by: whembly


 djones520 wrote:
 Frazzled wrote:
Agreed. There is no legimitate purpose to more than three pressure cookers. Won't someone please think of the children!


Honestly, why does anyone need a pressure cooker in the first place? Why can't they just use and oven, or a grill? The general populace has no legitimate need for them. We should ensure their only able to get into the hands of highly trained chefs.

KFC! That's why!


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 14:23:13


Post by: Grey Templar


Sounds like a job for 4-chan, drown that facebook page.


 Frazzled wrote:
 djones520 wrote:
 Frazzled wrote:
Agreed. There is no legimitate purpose to more than three pressure cookers. Won't someone please think of the children!


Honestly, why does anyone need a pressure cooker in the first place? Why can't they just use and oven, or a grill? The general populace has no legitimate need for them. We should ensure their only able to get into the hands of highly trained chefs.


Its the money grubbing NPA (National Pressurecooker Association) and its corporate masters that stop common sense legislation, desired by a majority of the people, from being put into place.


99.9% of Wiener Dogs are in favor of this. The NCA(National Cat Association) refused to comment.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 14:25:56


Post by: Monster Rain


 reds8n wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2313303/Dzhokhar-Tsarnaev-innocent-Facebook-page-attracts-11-000-fans-worldwide.html




I blame Alex Jones.

He, and his ignorant followers, should be removed from the gene pool.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 14:26:00


Post by: Dreadclaw69


 reds8n wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2313303/Dzhokhar-Tsarnaev-innocent-Facebook-page-attracts-11-000-fans-worldwide.html



Remember what happened with Raul Moat?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 14:54:25


Post by: reds8n


yes, that did spring to mind.

I appreciate , and agree, that a person is innocent until proven guilty.

And that's why we have a trial, evidence is presented and so on... kinda like a process or something which helps people get their due, or something equally ridiculous.

What tickles me most is that the same people yelling about this then disregard the same critical faculties they implore, nay beseech, others to use and instantly support the most ludicrous theories at the drop of a tinfoil hat.

.. people eh ?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 14:57:40


Post by: Dreadclaw69


 reds8n wrote:
What tickles me most is that the same people yelling about this then disregard the same critical faculties they implore, nay beseech, others to use and instantly support the most ludicrous theories at the drop of a tinfoil hat.

.. people eh ?

People, can't live with them, can't or without them hehe


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:08:40


Post by: Experiment 626


On a rather halarious yet epic-facepalm note, it seems our new 'Chief Idiot in Waiting' has discovered the root causes of terrorisim itself:



Yep, that's right! Terrorists are just lonely, excluded people and it's society's fault for excluding them!
So the next time you see a lonely excluded terrorist, go give them a big hug and make them feel included in our society! (note: country may still explode around you, despite trying to make terrorists feel included & welcomed by society...)

This so-called theory of corse, has been debunked by pretty every think-tank & intel angency as being nothing but junk science.
As the surviving brother has communicated to Federal investigators, he and his brother were motivated by religious reasons as a main factor for planning and carrying out the bombings.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:16:15


Post by: Kilkrazy


Let's ban religion!

Oh, hang on...


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:17:24


Post by: Grey Templar


When we compare us to the rest of the world we are hardly exclusive.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:34:18


Post by: KalashnikovMarine


Leprous retards in tinfoil hats aside it's also highly amusing that the Daily Mail is calling for sanity and order for once... and is in fact in the right this time. Considering their reputation with our U.K. dakkanauts any way.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:40:26


Post by: BaronIveagh


Ok, hey, the information is in! Here's 'anonymous' officials talking about their interrogation of Bomber 2.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/boston-bombing-suspect-cites-us-wars-as-motivation-officials-say/2013/04/23/324b9cea-ac29-11e2-b6fd-ba6f5f26d70e_story_1.html

My my my.

Well, if this is true, it sounds like a confession. Just without a lawyer present. I guess we'll see how this plays out in the court.

On the up side, if this is true, he really was a domestic terrorist with no training that decided to attack the US. Seems to have had nothing to do with religion or organized terror and they simply 'self radicalized'.

I was off on his motive though.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:45:50


Post by: Grey Templar


A confession doesn't require a lawyer present IIRC. Plus there were definitely lawyers present as the article clearly states.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:46:02


Post by: reds8n



Well, if this is true, it sounds like a confession. Just without a lawyer present.



" Three defense lawyers, along with two federal prosecutors, joined Tsarnaev for the court session at his hospital bed, where the suspect is recuperating from gunshot wounds to the head, neck, legs and hands, according to a transcript provided by the court.

Federal Magistrate Judge Marianne B. Bowler advised Tsarnaev of his rights and the charges against him, the transcript said.

“How are you feeling?” a doctor, identified as Dr. Odom, asked. “Are you able to answer some questions?” Tsarnaev “nods affirmatively,’’ said the transcript, which added that the only word he spoke during the hearing was “no,” when asked whether he could afford a lawyer. William Fick, one of the defense lawyers, said he would reserve questions about bail and other matters, according to the transcript. The judge then ended the session, saying she found the defendant “alert, mentally competent, and lucid.”


article says he had 3 defense lawyers there ?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:50:07


Post by: Dreadclaw69


 reds8n wrote:
article says he had 3 defense lawyers there ?

I know in the UK that's not atypical - barrister, senior solicitor and junior solicitor. In the US his defense team might have different lawyers specialising in different areas depending on what grounds they feel they can best contest the charges e.g. criminal lawyer, constitutional lawyer and a junior partner.

I'm sure one of the more knowledgeable Dakka members could clarify this though.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:56:08


Post by: BaronIveagh


Please read again. They were present at his hearing, not his interrogation .

The officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity to describe an ongoing investigation, said Dzhokhar and his older brother, Tamerlan Tsarnaev, who was killed by police as the two attempted to avoid capture, do not appear to have been directed by a foreign terrorist organization.

Rather, the officials said, the evidence so far suggests they were “self-radicalized” through Internet sites and U.S. actions in the Muslim world. Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has specifically cited the U.S. war in Iraq, which ended in December 2011 with the removal of the last American forces, and the war in Afghanistan, where President Obama plans to end combat operations by the end of 2014.


That was not from the court transcripts or it would not have been anonymous.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:57:34


Post by: Dreadclaw69


Experiment 626 wrote:
On a rather halarious yet epic-facepalm note, it seems our new 'Chief Idiot in Waiting' has discovered the root causes of terrorisim itself:

Yep, that's right! Terrorists are just lonely, excluded people and it's society's fault for excluding them!
So the next time you see a lonely excluded terrorist, go give them a big hug and make them feel included in our society! (note: country may still explode around you, despite trying to make terrorists feel included & welcomed by society...)

This so-called theory of corse, has been debunked by pretty every think-tank & intel angency as being nothing but junk science.
As the surviving brother has communicated to Federal investigators, he and his brother were motivated by religious reasons as a main factor for planning and carrying out the bombings.


For a reasonably intelligent person to blame society almost exclusively for any act of terrorism is shocking, and very myopic to say the least.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 16:58:38


Post by: Grey Templar


Which makes no difference, having or not having a lawyer present doesn't change the validity of what someone says during an interrogation.

Otherwise, the words of someone who has not lawyered up would be invalid. Plus his Miranda rights were suspended anyway.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 17:01:52


Post by: BaronIveagh


 Grey Templar wrote:
Plus his Miranda rights were suspended anyway.


Again, that's no longer the case. Since Miranda does now apply, anything they got out of him thus is invalid (while the government held off reading him his rights, his rights still did apply, since they were not revoked). Though if he is confessing, I'm curious the reason.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 17:03:20


Post by: Grey Templar


He may just be using it as a venue for venting his beliefs.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 17:04:26


Post by: BaronIveagh


 Grey Templar wrote:
He may just be using it as a venue for venting his beliefs.


Except he hasn't. So...


Oh, My. Time for a new thread. Something more serious than the Boston Bombing just came to light.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 17:35:12


Post by: reds8n


 BaronIveagh wrote:
Please read again. They were present at his hearing, not his interrogation .

The officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity to describe an ongoing investigation, said Dzhokhar and his older brother, Tamerlan Tsarnaev, who was killed by police as the two attempted to avoid capture, do not appear to have been directed by a foreign terrorist organization.

Rather, the officials said, the evidence so far suggests they were “self-radicalized” through Internet sites and U.S. actions in the Muslim world. Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has specifically cited the U.S. war in Iraq, which ended in December 2011 with the removal of the last American forces, and the war in Afghanistan, where President Obama plans to end combat operations by the end of 2014.


That was not from the court transcripts or it would not have been anonymous.


It makes no mention whatsoever of lawyers being present or absent from any interrogation.

The anonymous officials aren't quoting solely or even perhaps at all from the court transcripts, but it seems are referencing from the entire investigation thus far.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 20:53:56


Post by: Kilkrazy


 BaronIveagh wrote:
 Grey Templar wrote:
He may just be using it as a venue for venting his beliefs.


Except he hasn't. So...


Oh, My. Time for a new thread. Something more serious than the Boston Bombing just came to light.


Do you mean the Seattle Shootings?


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 20:58:32


Post by: darkPrince010


I think he means the Syria Sarin gas evidence that's come to light


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/23 21:14:27


Post by: Ouze


 BaronIveagh wrote:
 Grey Templar wrote:
Plus his Miranda rights were suspended anyway.


Again, that's no longer the case. Since Miranda does now apply, anything they got out of him thus is invalid (while the government held off reading him his rights, his rights still did apply, since they were not revoked). Though if he is confessing, I'm curious the reason.


Presuming the public safety window was in effect, anything he said during it would be admissible regardless of if he had or had not been mirandized.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 00:45:28


Post by: Bullockist


 whembly wrote:
 djones520 wrote:
 Frazzled wrote:
Agreed. There is no legimitate purpose to more than three pressure cookers. Won't someone please think of the children!


Honestly, why does anyone need a pressure cooker in the first place? Why can't they just use and oven, or a grill? The general populace has no legitimate need for them. We should ensure their only able to get into the hands of highly trained chefs.

KFC! That's why!


You guys are all idiots, the answer to keep the children safe is to ban marathons.

I'm also trying to figure out what combat the bomber was a part of in order to be declared an "enemy combatant". Was there a crusade on against his family by the FBI? Where's my roll of alfoil gone, my heads cold.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 01:09:02


Post by: Jihadin


Term "enemy combatant" pretty much says we have insurgents in the US of A


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 02:09:11


Post by: Bullockist


There was I thinking "enemy combatant" was invented so people could be held without any regard to the Geneva convention.

It's a bs term which just means "they waiver all freedoms indefinately"


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 02:15:15


Post by: Bromsy


Bullockist wrote:
There was I thinking "enemy combatant" was invented so people could be held without any regard to the Geneva convention.

It's a bs term which just means "they waiver all freedoms indefinately"



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enemy_combatant

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawful_combatant

and the root of indefinitely is finite. No "A". That one always bugs me.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 03:21:13


Post by: Bullockist


sorry about indefinitely I'm having issues with that word atm causing the word to join my 2 word dyslexia with "alot" and "their"

I'm curious as why you need to declare the bomber "an .... combatant" when you can just declare them a terrorist and hit them with the book anyways.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 03:22:16


Post by: Grey Templar


Except he's also a citizen, which complicates things.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 03:45:19


Post by: Breotan


Bullockist wrote:
I'm curious as why you need to declare the bomber "an .... combatant" when you can just declare them a terrorist and hit them with the book anyways.
We can let the military or CIA interrogate him if he's designated an enemy combatant. We can even have him prosecuted in a military tribunal then. Without that designation, he's entitled to the full protection of the Constitution like every other US citizen.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 03:49:32


Post by: Jihadin


Except he's also a citizen that survived the shoot out, which complicates things.


Fixed.

If he was label enemy combatant then we could of interrogate him for info. Obama made the right call. The kid has no pertinent info to give
us. Older brother though on the other hand.......


edit
Breotan beat me......


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 04:15:07


Post by: Ouze


 Breotan wrote:
Bullockist wrote:
I'm curious as why you need to declare the bomber "an .... combatant" when you can just declare them a terrorist and hit them with the book anyways.
We can let the military or CIA interrogate him if he's designated an enemy combatant. We can even have him prosecuted in a military tribunal then. Without that designation, he's entitled to the full protection of the Constitution like every other US citizen.


Indeed, the framers were very clear when they put the phrase "enemy combatant" in the constitution for when we decide the rest of the document is too damn onerous. George Washington in particular knew that sometimes you have to throw people in an offshore gulag without ever charging them with a crime to preserve democracy.



Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 04:38:20


Post by: Jihadin


Thanks Ouze. You broaden my intellect. I actually looked up how british prisoners were kept by the Continental Army. Paroled to US Farmers to help in planting and harvesting the crops. Back then though an individual "honor" was taking seriously. American prisoners though were kept on prison ships.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 04:41:50


Post by: Monster Rain


 Ouze wrote:
 Breotan wrote:
Bullockist wrote:
I'm curious as why you need to declare the bomber "an .... combatant" when you can just declare them a terrorist and hit them with the book anyways.
We can let the military or CIA interrogate him if he's designated an enemy combatant. We can even have him prosecuted in a military tribunal then. Without that designation, he's entitled to the full protection of the Constitution like every other US citizen.


Indeed, the framers were very clear when they put the phrase "enemy combatant" in the constitution for when we decide the rest of the document is too damn onerous. George Washington in particular knew that sometimes you have to throw people in an offshore gulag without ever charging them with a crime to preserve democracy.



It's right there under women's suffrage and how many votes non-white people count as.

Which is, of course, to say that the Constitution is still a work in progress. Appealing to the intent of the framers is a common rhetorical tactic in these circumstances, but it is really a much more complicated issue.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 06:11:29


Post by: d-usa


 Jihadin wrote:
Thanks Ouze. You broaden my intellect. I actually looked up how british prisoners were kept by the Continental Army. Paroled to US Farmers to help in planting and harvesting the crops. Back then though an individual "honor" was taking seriously. American prisoners though were kept on prison ships.


Interesting (at least for me) side note:

There were quite a few Prisoner of War camps in Oklahoma during World War 2 and of course lots of Germans there. While prisoners here they would be send out to farms and such to help with the labor since the usual labor force was busy fighting the other Germans. Quite a few of the prisoners like what they found here and after the war was over they returned here with their families to settle down.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 06:25:16


Post by: KalashnikovMarine


"Hilda my love! I have returned from my long captivity in America with wondrous news! It's not frozen and/or shelled into oblivion there!"


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 06:44:05


Post by: d-usa


I'm fairly certain they are covered.

That doesn't mean that people choose to get them though.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 07:10:27


Post by: Jihadin


German prisoners were treated quite nicely here in the US. They even were allowed to apply to colleges and have course conducted on camps for them to complete their education. Some of the escapes I read were pretty funny. From one incident they had one prisoner that was quite daring and creative in his escape. Only to be picked up at the bar 2 hrs later. He was not a threat and the guards took their time retrieving him from the bar since the bar was run by a german american that sold Hefewiezen Basically the bar owner will call the camp and tell them "Heinz is here"


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 09:53:52


Post by: CptJake


 Jihadin wrote:
German prisoners were treated quite nicely here in the US. They even were allowed to apply to colleges and have course conducted on camps for them to complete their education. Some of the escapes I read were pretty funny. From one incident they had one prisoner that was quite daring and creative in his escape. Only to be picked up at the bar 2 hrs later. He was not a threat and the guards took their time retrieving him from the bar since the bar was run by a german american that sold Hefewiezen Basically the bar owner will call the camp and tell them "Heinz is here"


Conversely, the Germans that snuck in for purposes of sabotage and mayhem causing were NOT treated as nicely. In fact they were tried by a military tribunal and sentenced to death (though two had their sentence commuted to lesser penalties). Oh, and there were a couple American citizens in the group...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Pastorius



Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 13:42:55


Post by: Ouze


A prison boat sounds like a pretty substantial downgrade from a regular prison.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 13:52:42


Post by: djones520


 Ouze wrote:
A prison boat sounds like a pretty substantial downgrade from a regular prison.


They were. British Prison Boats were almost death traps.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 14:45:12


Post by: infinite_array


Well, looks like a good reason to shut Reddit down. As if we needed any more of those.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 14:45:52


Post by: Dreadclaw69


 reds8n wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2313870/Sunil-Tripathi-Police-body-missing-college-student-falsely-accused-Boston-Marathon-bomber-internet-sleuths.html


..haven't heard the end of this I reckon.

This is why I don't have any tolerance for those Anonymous members and Redditors who were posting pictures online and trying to get their Junior G-Man badges when the pictures were obviously of different people. Now it looks like their haste to "do something" may have caused a lynch mob to target an innocent person.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 14:53:58


Post by: djones520


The guy had been missing for a month prior to the bombing. I doubt an internet lynch mob was responsible for his death.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 15:28:39


Post by: Ouze


Too bad he was found dead, although I suppose it's better then never being found.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 15:32:53


Post by: Dreadclaw69


That'll teach me not to read the full article while multi-tasking


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 15:50:14


Post by: Ouze


In an update to the main topic, the Boston Bomber who died is being refused a funeral from his mosque.



Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 15:50:43


Post by: Frazzled


good deal.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 15:52:16


Post by: purplefood


Seems reasonable.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 16:15:16


Post by: Grey Templar


Now if only we can spread that attitude.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 17:27:58


Post by: MeanGreenStompa


I'm watching the service for Sean Collier and it's very moving.

Biden was particularly impressive. Angry and impressive.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 17:34:04


Post by: Monster Rain


I'm glad he's fired up.

A lot of people are angry out there. He's a good contrast to the more stoic, composed Obama that we've seen.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 19:50:12


Post by: Asherian Command


Experiment 626 wrote:
On a rather halarious yet epic-facepalm note, it seems our new 'Chief Idiot in Waiting' has discovered the root causes of terrorisim itself:



Yep, that's right! Terrorists are just lonely, excluded people and it's society's fault for excluding them!
So the next time you see a lonely excluded terrorist, go give them a big hug and make them feel included in our society! (note: country may still explode around you, despite trying to make terrorists feel included & welcomed by society...)

This so-called theory of corse, has been debunked by pretty every think-tank & intel angency as being nothing but junk science.
As the surviving brother has communicated to Federal investigators, he and his brother were motivated by religious reasons as a main factor for planning and carrying out the bombings.

What?
No thats not even what? No they are terriorists because they are not liking the way the world is changing and they want it to go back to when it was. They call tech evil.


Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/24 20:35:27


Post by: Jihadin


..haven't heard the end of this I reckon.


Red...I couldn't let this go by.....

Couldn't get more country then that. Your frat name is now "Country"




Don't make me get Bluto to back me up...



Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 02:46:37


Post by: Ouze


As a minor update to this story:

  • They haven't released the body still

  • "-- Investigators are looking into the possibility Tamerlan Tsarnaev -- who was married with a young daughter, whom he frequently cared for while his wife worked as a home health aide -- may have helped finance the bomb plot through illegal drug sales, according to a source familiar with the investigation." Man Relapse is going to love that.

  • The used a remote detonator based on a radio control car.


  • No link to a source since of course, it's CNN and they could be just making it up.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 02:48:11


    Post by: Monster Rain


     Ouze wrote:
    As a minor update to this story:

  • They haven't released the body still

  • "-- Investigators are looking into the possibility Tamerlan Tsarnaev -- who was married with a young daughter, whom he frequently cared for while his wife worked as a home health aide -- may have helped finance the bomb plot through illegal drug sales, according to a source familiar with the investigation." Man Relapse is going to love that.


  • I smell cognitive dissonance.

    I mean, if it's true, it's pretty much proof that Relapse was right in some sense. Not sure what provoked the petty slap at another poster, but since you did it I think it's open for discussion.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 02:57:12


    Post by: d-usa


    Relapse likes to go on rants about illegal drug use being the source if violent deaths everywhere. My guess is that he was referring to that with his remark.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 02:58:27


    Post by: Monster Rain


    If the fact mentioned above is verified, wouldn't that position be logically sound?


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:00:50


    Post by: Grey Templar


    Ahh but this would make this case like, the holy grail of crimes.

    Terrorism? Check!

    Drug money? Check!

    Gun battle with cops? Check!

    Islamic Extremism? check!

    Major Manhunt? Check!


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:02:21


    Post by: Monster Rain


    Delayed Red Sox and Bruins games...

    You've gone too far!


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:03:07


    Post by: Grey Templar


    I'm sure he'll get the needle now


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:06:38


    Post by: Ouze


     d-usa wrote:
    Relapse likes to go on rants about illegal drug use being the source if violent deaths everywhere. My guess is that he was referring to that with his remark.


    Indeed. He frequently has asserted that illegal drug sales fund terrorism. I think it's reasonable for him to feel vindicated, should this pan out.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:33:27


    Post by: d-usa


     Grey Templar wrote:
    Ahh but this would make this case like, the holy grail of crimes.

    Terrorism? Check!

    Drug money? Check!

    Gun battle with cops? Check!

    Islamic Extremism? check!

    Major Manhunt? Check!


    And they were white guys to boot! You would think everybody would be happy here.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:34:02


    Post by: Grey Templar


    Well, I'm sure terrorists have used drugs as a source of income.

    I doubt its their bread and butter, but as a whole they probably have as many sources as you can imagine.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:34:02


    Post by: d-usa


     Ouze wrote:
     d-usa wrote:
    Relapse likes to go on rants about illegal drug use being the source if violent deaths everywhere. My guess is that he was referring to that with his remark.


    Indeed. He frequently has asserted that illegal drug sales fund terrorism. I think it's reasonable for him to feel vindicated, should this pan out.


    Well, as vindicated as every anti-gun person is everytime somebody gets shot by a gun.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:38:33


    Post by: whembly


     Ouze wrote:
     d-usa wrote:
    Relapse likes to go on rants about illegal drug use being the source if violent deaths everywhere. My guess is that he was referring to that with his remark.


    Indeed. He frequently has asserted that illegal drug sales fund terrorism. I think it's reasonable for him to feel vindicated, should this pan out.

    See... that arguement is kinda weak, because "drugs" are fungible in the same way as oil is fungible.

    We "buy" oil mostly from Canada and Mexico (well, recently we're net exporter), but folks make a jump that because we use so much oil, we're "funding" countries that opposes US because THEY sell oil.




    Automatically Appended Next Post:
     d-usa wrote:


    Well, as vindicated as every anti-gun person is everytime somebody gets shot by a gun.

    heh... yep.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:40:55


    Post by: Grey Templar


    Well tell a stoner that all weed is the same and he'll probably have a stern conversation with you.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:48:04


    Post by: KalashnikovMarine


    AQ and the Taliban do actually make a big chunk of their money with drug sales, but it's not MJ. It's opium and heroin.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:49:04


    Post by: Grey Templar


    Yeah, a lot of Opium gets grown in the Afghanistan. IIRC that's actually the native habitat of the Opium Poppy.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 03:52:53


    Post by: whembly


     Grey Templar wrote:
    Well tell a stoner that all weed is the same and he'll probably have a stern conversation with you.

    That's true... they'll talk your ears off about that! o.O

    I meant more on the business side of the drug trade.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 09:58:09


    Post by: CptJake


     Grey Templar wrote:
    Yeah, a lot of Opium gets grown in the Afghanistan. IIRC that's actually the native habitat of the Opium Poppy.

    And a lot of it gets processed into heroin in the Pankisi Gorge.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 11:45:35


    Post by: Kilkrazy


     Monster Rain wrote:
    If the fact mentioned above is verified, wouldn't that position be logically sound?


    No, for a number of reasons.

    Most obviously, you cannot generalise from the particular.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 12:00:27


    Post by: Dreadclaw69


     Grey Templar wrote:
    Well, I'm sure terrorists have used drugs as a source of income.

    I doubt its their bread and butter, but as a whole they probably have as many sources as you can imagine.

    In Northern Ireland its a major source of their income, along with fuel laundering, cheap cigarettes, counterfeit DVDs & CDs, protection rackets etc.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 12:45:17


    Post by: MeanGreenStompa


    The IRA have been drug dealers for about 30 years, they perform many of their acts of violence over 'business' and turf wars rather than just sectarian terrorism.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 12:46:36


    Post by: Kilkrazy


    Remove the problem.

    Legalise drugs, and terrorism would disappear.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 12:46:51


    Post by: Asherian Command


     Kilkrazy wrote:
    Remove the problem.

    Legalise drugs, and terrorism would disappear.

    Ha! As if!
    More problems would arise I think. violence would escalate all over the place.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 12:47:36


    Post by: Monster Rain


     Kilkrazy wrote:
     Monster Rain wrote:
    If the fact mentioned above is verified, wouldn't that position be logically sound?


    No, for a number of reasons.

    Most obviously, you cannot generalise from the particular.


    You can generalize based off a series of facts that support your conclusion, though.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 13:08:06


    Post by: Kilkrazy


    No, that's wrong too.

    You have to look at all the possible causes of terrorism, not just one, and you have to compare those factors with their effects in non-violent, non-crime social interaction as well.

    Without that, you are simply picking evidence that supports your pre-ordained conclusion. Which can be used to prove just about anything.

    If I thought that terrorism was caused by people wearing shoes, and pointed out that 100% of terrorists were wearing shoes, would that be a sensible reason to bane shoes?


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 13:19:53


    Post by: Monster Rain


     Kilkrazy wrote:
    No, that's wrong too.

    You have to look at all the possible causes of terrorism, not just one, and you have to compare those factors with their effects in non-violent, non-crime social interaction as well.

    Without that, you are simply picking evidence that supports your pre-ordained conclusion. Which can be used to prove just about anything.

    If I thought that terrorism was caused by people wearing shoes, and pointed out that 100% of terrorists were wearing shoes, would that be a sensible reason to bane shoes?


    We aren't talking about all of the causes of terrorism, though.

    We're talking about one specific method by which funds are generated to support it. The bit about shoes is silly, but I think you know that.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 13:23:14


    Post by: Dreadclaw69


     MeanGreenStompa wrote:
    The IRA have been drug dealers for about 30 years, they perform many of their acts of violence over 'business' and turf wars rather than just sectarian terrorism.

    It was mainly Loyalists getting money from drugs, well them and the INLA. That's why the IRA formed Republican Action Against Drugs (RAAD) and Direct Action Against Drugs (DAAD), they were upset with Catholics buying drugs when the proceeds would go to fund the Loyalists.

    Yup, Northern Ireland is a place full of acronyms

     Kilkrazy wrote:
    Legalise drugs, and terrorism would disappear.

    Might be a wee bit more complex than that. Especially when dealing with terrorism that has its roots in disputes over land, or where religion is a driving factor


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 20:31:13


    Post by: Jihadin


    Complancey rears its ugly head. If the bombs were activated by cell or remote control car controller then thats going to be a hit on LEO's. Why were the ECM's not emplaced before the race. We're talking the starting and finishing line. I'm guessing its the same spot right? Not fimiliar with the Boston Marathon Route. Still though a mass gathering like that to watch the runners finish is clue ONE to have them emplace


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 20:36:02


    Post by: Dreadclaw69


    Looks like it wasn't a loop



    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 20:37:13


    Post by: kronk


     Jihadin wrote:
    Complancey rears its ugly head. If the bombs were activated by cell or remote control car controller then thats going to be a hit on LEO's. Why were the ECM's not emplaced before the race. We're talking the starting and finishing line. I'm guessing its the same spot right?


    No, it starts and ends at different places.

    Mapus Biggimus


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 20:42:19


    Post by: Jihadin


    Going out on the limb. I bet ECM's were at start being it would be more pack with runners and supporters. Also the most covered by LEO's. If that idioit they have mention they planned it at the finish then the older brother was actually thinking.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 21:18:04


    Post by: CptJake


    They don't shut down the spectrum unless they have a specific threat, and in this case they didn't. Too many people want to be able to call their buddies and post pics of their loved ones starting/finishing right from the location and so on.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 21:28:48


    Post by: Jihadin


    IMO I would have the ECM in place and running. They can post pics later when their home or out of range of of the ECM. A mass gathering like that is a freaking target. We're getting complacent. Three dead and almost 200 wounded is not a price to pay to be reminded of complancy. I'm biased in this being that its ingrained in me to avoid complancy from deployments.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 21:44:18


    Post by: d-usa


    Stupid idea, absolutely stupid.

    My totally non-scientific gutt feeling will be that deploying large scale ECM in any event that could be a target will result in more deaths than attacks.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 21:51:01


    Post by: Dreadclaw69


     Jihadin wrote:
    IMO I would have the ECM in place and running. They can post pics later when their home or out of range of of the ECM. A mass gathering like that is a freaking target. We're getting complacent. Three dead and almost 200 wounded is not a price to pay to be reminded of complancy. I'm biased in this being that its ingrained in me to avoid complancy from deployments.

    The problem though is that we'll have people screaming "POLICE STATE!!!" if those ECMs were deployed and they weren't able to Tweet their every thought


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/25 21:52:34


    Post by: CptJake


    Big difference in the way you can operate OCONUS and CONUS...


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/30 18:52:33


    Post by: d-usa


    This might be a good finisher to this thread (a few years ago I did the Memorial 5K and I have to say that this event is amazing):

    http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/30/opinion/sutter-oklahoma-city-run/index.html?hpt=hp_t4

    Oklahoma City, Oklahoma (CNN) -- Sara Hunt, a 25-year-old with a big smile and an enormous sense of cheery determination, never seems to do anything halfway.
    She loves softball, so she plays on four teams
    .
    She felt out of shape last year, so she decided to run the Boston Marathon.

    When that race was hit with two explosions that killed three people and injured scores more, Hunt didn't want to wait until next year to complete her first marathon. She traveled to Oklahoma City over the weekend to run in one that memorializes the 1995 bombing that killed 168 people there.

    She wanted to finish what she started.

    I was struck by Hunt's courage: to want to run a marathon again after only 13 days of rest; to do so knowing that the closer she got to the finish line the more she would have to confront her memories of the bombing in Boston; to immerse herself in another city that knows tragedy all too well.

    I was so impressed by her story -- by her desire to learn from the survivors in Oklahoma City -- that I traveled there to watch her run.

    It was a homecoming of sorts for me. I grew up in the Oklahoma City area and heard the explosion that changed so many lives in my hometown.

    Perhaps that is the reason I felt a personal connection to the people who were injured and killed at the marathon in Boston. And it's probably why I was so interested in a group of people online who were pledging to "Run for Boston" in the wake of that tragedy. Instead of being afraid, they laced up their shoes and hit the pavement. There's something powerful and symbolic in that action, and I decided to join them, pledging to run a marathon by the 1-year anniversary of the Boston bombing and creating an iReport page on CNN where you can sign up to do the same. So far, more than 300 people have.

    I also used this trip as a way to explore in more detail how my home city has been able to move past the tragedy. OKC is known for all sorts of things now -- an NBA team with a humble superstar; a river that hosts world-class regattas; a weight-loss-crazy mayor; a new (and way-too-enormous) skyscraper that went up amid a recession, thanks to a boon in the natural gas industry. But when I lived here, when that bomb went off, tragedy defined the place.

    For years, when I told people I was from OKC, the next question usually was, "Were you there during the bombing?" I rarely get asked that these days.

    Hunt seemed to be on a similar journey of discovery, but for different reasons. In Boston, she had completed nearly 26 miles of the 26.2-mile route when the blasts ended the race.

    Of course, there were much greater tragedies that occurred that day. Spectators lost limbs. An 8-year-old boy was among the dead. But the attack shook Hunt. Now, sudden noises, like balloons popping, make her jump, sometimes to the point that she covers her head for protection. The sounds take her back to the moment she heard the blast and saw the smoke rising above Boston, when runners turned around in panic and rushed the other way. She was terrified, unsure what had happened.

    "It was like being in a movie," she told me. "Seeing the trucks and bomb squads ... I'm from a small town. We don't even have police where I live."

    For an hour and a half after the bombing, the young woman from Putnam, Connecticut, was unable to reach her mom, who had been standing at the finish line, near the explosions. Her mother was unharmed, but that was a frantic hour, spent begging strangers to let her use their cell phones.

    So, Hunt came to Oklahoma City with a dual mission: She wanted to finish the race she had started, but she also wanted to look for clues about how to move through a tragedy, how to process it so it will cease to haunt her.
    "It's another community that's gone through something like (the Boston bombing)," she said. "It's nice to talk to people who know what you've seen and gone through."

    As it turned out, many of the clues she received came from strangers -- those she met on the course, and those who influenced its very existence.

    'Runners are like the wind'

    The thought that Oklahoma City could be bombed again had occurred to her.

    But Hunt didn't want to let that interfere.

    When she arrived downtown, before 5 a.m., a three-quarter moon hanging in the sky, the only change she made to her routine was to bring a cell phone.

    She hadn't done that on a run before. But she wanted one in Oklahoma.

    Just in case.

    It was a chilly 50 degrees that morning. Runners gathered early for a sunrise service beneath an American Elm that locals call the "survivor tree." It nearly shriveled up and died after the bombing. Eighteen years later, it still has some scars and gnarly branches, but it's also tall and green and full of life.

    Hunt listened as a preacher told the runners who had gathered in the dark for a blessing before the race that they didn't need to think about the path ahead. A higher power would carry them onward.
    He encouraged them to think of each breath as "a sublime gift" from above.

    Hunt didn't meet him, but standing elsewhere beneath the tree was Tom Kight, a 74-year-old Oklahoma City man dressed in a red pullover, in honor of Boston's Red Sox. (He couldn't find the socks, which many runners in Oklahoma City wore as a tribute to the victims in Boston.) He comes to this spot every year to remember his stepdaughter, Frankie Ann Merrell, who was killed in the Oklahoma City bombing.

    The service beneath the tree is a highlight of Kight's year. He loves the sunrise, the anticipation. The powerful symbolism of running for progress.

    "Runners are like the wind," he said. "There's nothing that stops them."

    Kight, who has knee problems that prevent him from running, has made it his personal mission to ensure that the names of all 168 Oklahoma City bombing victims appear on the jerseys of runners in the race.

    It's important to him that the victims' names live on. Seeing the names gives new life to those who died here. And it brings him incredible comfort.

    "We're not going to forget the people in Boston," he said. "You can rest assured."

    'We will finish this race'

    If the bombing wasn't already on Hunt's mind, it would have been impossible to escape it in the early morning hours in Oklahoma City.

    Helicopters circled like buzzards. Police were everywhere. A moment of silence was held for the victims -- 168 seconds for Oklahoma City; three for Boston.

    And then there was the location.

    The race starts where the Alfred P. Murrah building once stood -- until the bombing on April 19, 1995. The memorial to that site -- a field with one empty chair for each victim and two large metal gates, marked 9:01 and 9:03, bookending that moment in time -- butts right up against the starting line.

    The race begins on the 9:03 side, a symbol of moving forward.

    But it's also a reminder that tragedy can strike anywhere, anytime.

    Crowds were thick as more than 25,000 runners geared up to start. Some ran in quick circles to get loose. Others leaned on each other for warmth. One man swooshed his hips around in a hula-hooping motion. (Aren't these people about to get enough exercise?) A man barked over a loudspeaker in a voice that seemed more fit for a football stadium: "We stand as one, showing the world that good always overcomes evil ..." the voice said. "We will finish this race."

    Even at the start, Hunt was unwaveringly sure she could do just that.

    "I have good endurance," she told me beforehand. "I don't give up on things."

    She wore a "Boston Strong" sign on her stomach and her race number from the April 15 Boston Marathon on her back. Two Boston bracelets dangled on her wrist.

    Her get-up attracted the attention of another Boston runner, who decided to run the start of the race by her side. It turned out both had been turned around by the blast in Boston at nearly the same time. Both offered words of encouragement, Hunt told me. Together, they vowed to cross the finish, for themselves and for Boston.

    'I couldn't move'

    It wasn't long before Hunt's new running mate had left her behind. She didn't take offense at that -- this was her race and she intended to run it on her own terms.

    The cheers of the crowd fueled her.

    About an hour into the race, Hunt ran by Terri Talley, 45, who was dumping pitcher after pitcher of a yellow sports drink into tiny paper cups. Others passed the cups to the runners. Down the road, volunteers used rakes to scrape the empty cups into piles, as if they were cleaning up leaves from an autumn yard. "Celebration" was playing on an outdoor sound system when I walked up. A woman cheered through a megaphone. Others danced with pom-poms.

    She doesn't tell any of the runners about it, but Talley, a peppy woman with blond highlights in her hair and small rhinestones on the temples of her glasses, worked on the third floor of the building that was bombed in 1995.

    She was buried in the rubble and nearly died.

    "I couldn't move," she said. "As hard as I tried to move, I couldn't move."

    Talley was coming in and out of consciousness when rescue workers found her trapped in a vertical wall of rubble and debris. All they could see, she said, was her butt, which caught their attention in part because she was wearing a suit with a loud houndstooth pattern. She jokes that it's her backside that saved her.

    "I always say, 'Thank you, Mom and Dad for giving me a nice size booty,'" she told me, laughing. That's something she's only been able to do with distance.
    Three rescuers stayed through a second bomb scare, she said, to pull her from the rubble when others had left the disaster site, fearing for their lives.

    "When they pulled me out, I was blue and I was losing oxygen. I probably would have died if they had left me" during the second scare, she said.

    She still keeps in touch with one rescuer and her ambulance driver.

    Talley said she'll never put the tragedy behind her. Eighteen of her 33 coworkers at a credit union were killed that day, she said. For years, she had nightmares. Blooming trees and flowers can cause her to slide into depression.

    "Everything about the month of April makes you really, really think about that. Even though it's been 18 years, it seems like not so long ago."

    On Sunday, the sun was out and flowers were in bloom. But Talley was in high spirits. Seeing all these strangers running for her friends who died, and in support of her ongoing recovery, is an intense and meaningful experience.

    Her advice for runners like Hunt who experienced something in Boston that may change them for a long time, if not permanently?

    Keep doing marathons -- or get deeply involved in another community activity.

    "Always be around a marathon," she said. "Whether you can run it or not, there's such energy from a marathon."

    'I'm not in New England anymore'

    Hunt's energy reserves seemed nearly exhausted around the halfway mark. It's not that she was out of fuel, but she could feel a new tightness in her legs; she figured it was residual from the marathon she ran less than two weeks before.

    I caught up with her briefly between miles 17 and 18.

    She had spoken with her mom on the phone a mile or so before. That was a good pick-me-up, she said. Her mom is one reason she was running in the first place.

    Hunt had never run a marathon before Boston, and was able to enter that time-regulated race because she was raising money -- about $3,000 -- for cancer research and the Dana-Farber Cancer Institute. Her mom was diagnosed with a rare, cancerous tumor on her face about two years ago, she said. The treatment was "hard to watch," she said, because it involved radiation that burned her mother's face.

    Hunt also had scares with cancerous cells in her cervix a few years ago.

    She had only taken up running about a year before Boston. It started with a one-mile run -- she wanted to test herself. With characteristic gusto, she ended up running more than a dozen races over the course of the year.

    Hearing her story makes me believe I'll be able to complete a marathon by next year. She makes it sound so easy. You just have to commit. And then go.

    She trained largely by herself, and lost more than 50 pounds in the process.

    As I trotted along beside her for five or 10 minutes, I noticed she was sweating, and she told me she hadn't expected it to be this hot or hilly in Oklahoma. Temperatures topped 80 degrees that afternoon. When I found her, she was walking down a hill in a neighborhood, conserving energy and taking it slow because of the heat.

    "I'm not in New England anymore," she said.

    Throughout the morning, she kept hearing sirens, too.

    At one point an ambulance drove by, and she covered her ears. Those noises put her back in Boston, and the panic that followed the bombs.

    'You gotta pay it forward'

    Early in the morning, the pack of runners looked like a pulsing river of humanity, thousands of heads bobbing down the same stream, churning in a sort of collective, perpetual energy. From afar, it looked like no individual had to expend any effort.

    Anyone could do this, I thought. It's like "Finding Nemo." Just keep running.

    But around the halfway point, the runners, including Hunt, had thinned out into individual dribs and drabs. It became clear that some might not make it. There were people whose feet barely looked to be leaving the ground. Others were so drenched in sweat they almost looked as though they just popped out of a lake. It was sometimes frantic and painful to watch.

    It suddenly made sense why there were medic tents nearby.

    Apparently some people's nipples bleed by the time they reach the finish.

    Running a marathon really is no joke.

    Another person I saw near mile 17 was Gary Woodbridge, 47. He said he was so tired that he had left his earphones in his ears even though his phone had lost power.

    Taking out the earphones would be too much effort, he said, smiling.

    Woodbridge ran with a name on his bib: Ronota Newberry-Woodbridge.

    That's the wife he lost in the Oklahoma City bombing.

    "She always wanted to run a marathon and I finally lost enough weight where I thought I could try," he told me before the race. "I'm not getting any younger."

    Memories of her, and their runs together, occupied his thoughts.

    "I'm still moving," he said. "I feel every step."

    Woodbridge waited 11 days to learn his wife was dead. He spent much of that time at First Christian Church, another site on the marathon route, which became a support center for families who were in that limbo. The thing that has helped him move forward from her death is talking to
    other people, he said. "Your grief is going to be very unique. It's going to be very unique to you," he said. "But there are people who have been through what you've been through."

    Reaching out to help others was also important for him. He has volunteered to talk to kids who have lost loved ones. And he went to New York after the 9/11 attacks.

    "I was shown so much love" after the Oklahoma City bombing, he said. "You gotta pay it forward."

    As I walked back to the car from that spot in the course, I saw a man on one knee in front of a lamppost, one hand on the pole and head bowed.
    I assumed he was vomiting. That wouldn't have seemed out of place.

    But then I realized there was a banner at the top of the pole -- one of 168 signs with a name of an Oklahoma City victim on it. I gave him some space and then asked, after he'd rejoined the runners, if Antonio "Tony" C. Reyes, the name on the banner, was someone he'd known personally.

    A friend? A family member?

    No, he said. "That's someone I run for every year."

    He ran in honor of a stranger.

    'Well, run with me'

    Hunt found a bigger challenge at the 20-mile mark.

    Before the race, she had insisted on not knowing the course route.

    "If it's a hill, it's a hill," she said. "I'll have to run it.

    So no one had told her that the last several miles of the Oklahoma City marathon course go gradually uphill toward the finish line.

    Discouraged by the heat and the elevation changes, Hunt started walking again. The pain of the race was setting in. Maybe her legs weren't invincible after all.

    But a woman from Tennessee came to her rescue.

    She approached her and asked about the Boston number on her back. Hunt told her the story: the training, the bombing, the disappointment. And the fear. How it was too soon for even a serious marathoner to be running a race again.

    How she was really just a beginner.

    "She was like, 'well, run with me,'" Hunt recalled.

    "It definitely helped."

    So did the cheers from anonymous fans.

    Soon, Hunt was approaching the mile-marker in the race where the bomb went off in Boston, when she saw the cloud of smoke rising from the city and the runners frantically turning the other direction and running in panic, fearing for their lives.
    Instead of being afraid, she felt motivated.

    "Once I hit the point where I stopped in Boston, I was like, 'No more walking. I'm running this. This race, this is for Boston. I'm finishing.'"

    'On top of the world'

    I saw Hunt on the home stretch, headed for the core of downtown Oklahoma City, with a smile plastered across her face. Fans stood on both sides of Broadway Avenue, ringing cowbells, shouting "woo!!" and "you got it!!" and "let's go!!!" All of that stuff would seem annoyingly over-energized on any normal Sunday morning. But here it was infectious. I found myself joining in, cheering hardest for the people who were walking or jogging the slowest, those who looked like they would barely make it. I saw one man stop to vomit and then continue toward the finish. I mean, wow.

    No one seemed concerned about bombs or terror.

    "We all run for a reason here!" an announcer said. "We run to remember!"

    Hunt said she left the traumatic memories mostly behind on that last stretch.

    When she crossed the finish line, after having that experience robbed from her in Boston, and knowing that so many people had so much more taken from them on that day, she threw her arms into the air. Tears came to her eyes, but she quickly wiped them away. She's too tough for that.

    "When I saw (the finish) I couldn't stop running," she said. "Even though I was dying, I wanted to keep going."

    She added: "I'm on top of the world right now."

    The thing that kept her moving was the aid of complete strangers.

    'A step in her healing'

    Earlier in the week, before the marathon, I met with Ernestine Clark, 69, who was in a library near the Murrah Building when it was bombed. I'd read about her story online and was amazed by the steps she'd taken to create something positive out of a horrifying experience.

    I wanted to learn something from her about paying it forward. I thought it might help with my Run for Boston project, which essentially is trying to bring strangers together to support the people of that community.

    And I also thought it might help Hunt.

    Clark greeted me at her door with a smile on Saturday morning, wearing pearl earrings and red glasses. We talked for a while in her living room and then she told me she wanted to show me something in her backyard, which is well gardened and is filled with the soothing clang of wind chimes.

    It was an elm, taller than her house.

    She told me it grew from a tiny sapling from the survivor tree at the bombing site.

    She put a metal sign at the base of the tree, explaining its origins -- that this tree grew out of tragedy and was now probably the best and sturdiest plant in the yard. When she dies and the house goes to someone else, she said, she wants the new buyer to know about the tree. That way, if he or she cuts it down, they'll know they're going straight to hell, she told me, laughing wildly.

    Clark told me about the nightmares she had after the bombing. They lasted for three years. Many nights she dreamed she knew of an imminent bomb attack, but that she was unable to evacuate or warn people in time. She worked in the Oklahoma City library at the time of the bombing. It shattered the window and blew her out of a room and into a hallway. She told me how she staggered around downtown in a daze. All the buildings seemed like they were bending toward her.

    "At times, I felt I was crazy," she told me. "I would look into the mirror and I would just not know who that person was. It took me down to the quick."

    In an experience that parallels Hunt's, Clark once jumped under a table at dinner when the restaurant's air conditioner popped on suddenly. Shattering a drinking glass once brought her to tears. It reminded her of the glass that was broken in the bombing, that stuck in the sides of the survivor tree, and that made its way between the pages of many of the library's books.

    When she couldn't sleep, Clark made a pact with another survivor to go sit in the dark at the bombing memorial downtown, where the OKC marathon begins.

    They would sit in the dark in silence holding hands.

    Just for comfort. Just to be there.

    She also wrote. She bought her first computer after the bombing and she told that machine about what she had seen in 1995 before she could tell another person.

    Clark isn't able to walk well enough to go to the marathon these days, but she was instrumental in planning and shaping the memorial that it commemorates. She's been a quiet but adamant representative for victims of the tragedy and their families.

    I told Clark a little bit about Hunt, the runner from Connecticut. How she wanted to finish what she'd started. How she was looking for answers in this city. Clark said the Oklahoma City marathon "will be a step in her healing."

    "There will be many, many more," she said.

    And then she said something kind of amazing.

    She offered to help a stranger.

    It's something she's done many times. She received letters from all over the country after the Oklahoma City bombing. Talking to strangers shortly after the blast was easier than speaking to her own family members, she said. They brought her comfort. They helped her get to the point where she could join society again.

    She's done a great deal to pay that back. She visited Cameroon to meet with people who live in a village that was decimated by a volcanic eruption in the 1980s. She befriended her translator there and eventually helped him earn a scholarship to attend graduate school at her alma mater, Oklahoma State University.

    She wrote letters to people in Columbine. After the Boston Marathon bombing, she encouraged church members to make a sign showing support for the victims. They sent it to another church of the same denomination in Boston.

    "The day of the Boston Marathon, that just put me in a deep hole," she said. "I cried all day. (Tragedies like that) can throw you back there.

    "The difference is, after 18 years, I can pull myself out of it."

    When I mentioned Hunt, she didn't hesitate to say that if the young woman from the Boston area ever needs to talk to someone, she should get her number from me and give her a call.
    After all, what are strangers for?


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/04/30 18:58:57


    Post by: kronk


    That's a good story. Thank you.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 14:44:49


    Post by: Sigvatr


    So right now, there's a debate on what to do with its corpse, with gravekeepers deyning to have it buried on their grounds...understandable, I wouldn't want to have a terrorist to be buried among humans either.

    Isn't shipping it to its home country and the burying it there an option? (with its family fully paying it of course).


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 14:45:48


    Post by: whembly


     Sigvatr wrote:
    So right now, there's a debate on what to do with its corpse, with gravekeepers deyning to have it buried on their grounds...understandable, I wouldn't want to have a terrorist to be buried among humans either.

    Isn't shipping it to its home country and the burying it there an option? (with its family fully paying it of course).

    There's some pig farms that I'm sure will take it...


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 14:49:01


    Post by: Grey Templar


    Pigs have delicate taste buds, this would make them sick. Although it would be properly insulting to his supposed cause.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 14:56:11


    Post by: Sigvatr


     whembly wrote:
     Sigvatr wrote:
    So right now, there's a debate on what to do with its corpse, with gravekeepers deyning to have it buried on their grounds...understandable, I wouldn't want to have a terrorist to be buried among humans either.

    Isn't shipping it to its home country and the burying it there an option? (with its family fully paying it of course).

    There's some pig farms that I'm sure will take it...


    Would you want to eat pigs that ate a terrorist's remains?

    On the other hand, I like the idea due to the bitter irony it bears


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 15:18:09


    Post by: whembly


     Sigvatr wrote:
     whembly wrote:
     Sigvatr wrote:
    So right now, there's a debate on what to do with its corpse, with gravekeepers deyning to have it buried on their grounds...understandable, I wouldn't want to have a terrorist to be buried among humans either.

    Isn't shipping it to its home country and the burying it there an option? (with its family fully paying it of course).

    There's some pig farms that I'm sure will take it...


    Would you want to eat pigs that ate a terrorist's remains?

    On the other hand, I like the idea due to the bitter irony it bears

    Who says to let the piggy eat the remains? (would they even do that?)

    Just bury the remains in the "unclean" pig sty to deny the virginial afterlife rewards. Ala the fake John Pershing's tactic.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 15:54:37


    Post by: Ouze


    While I'm glad that the terrorist is dead, I have to say that treating his body with disrespect posthumously as has been suggested here kind of reflects more poorly on us than on him.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 15:56:40


    Post by: whembly


     Ouze wrote:
    While I'm glad that the terrorist is dead, I have to say that treating his body with disrespect posthumously as has been suggested here kind of reflects more poorly on us than on him.

    eh... morally (in Western world), yes you have a point.

    But... lemme ask you. If this has a chance to act as a deterrence, would you at least consider this?



    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 15:58:33


    Post by: Ouze


    No.

    Also all this talk of pigs has got me craving ribs super, super bad.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 16:00:02


    Post by: Sigvatr


    By my morals, he is worth less than the dirt under my shoes.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 16:01:32


    Post by: CptJake


    I don't see the issue. Pack him in dry ice or embalm him and pass him off to his consulate and make them deal with getting it back to his home country and family. Either his family or the consulate take care of it. That is the way it usually works when a foreigner dies (or conversely, when a US citizen dies overseas).

    No point in being disrespectful or overly respectful. He is cargo at this point. Ship him out.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 16:01:40


    Post by: whembly



    Fair enough.

    I have my doubts that it would even work... might instead "inflame" the situation.

    However, the reason I brought it up is how do you fight fanaticals (of any group)? Know what I mean? If they're willing to die in the first place... how do you combat that? Take our lickings first, then respond?


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 16:06:18


    Post by: Ouze


     whembly wrote:
    However, the reason I brought it up is how do you fight fanaticals (of any group)? Know what I mean? If they're willing to die in the first place... how do you combat that? Take our lickings first, then respond?


    Great question. I totally, utterly, do not know the answer. In my opinion, however, it's not becoming equally reprehensible - I think, not to be all 5th elementy here, hate truly breeds more hate.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 16:11:26


    Post by: Grey Templar


     whembly wrote:
     Sigvatr wrote:
     whembly wrote:
     Sigvatr wrote:
    So right now, there's a debate on what to do with its corpse, with gravekeepers deyning to have it buried on their grounds...understandable, I wouldn't want to have a terrorist to be buried among humans either.

    Isn't shipping it to its home country and the burying it there an option? (with its family fully paying it of course).

    There's some pig farms that I'm sure will take it...


    Would you want to eat pigs that ate a terrorist's remains?

    On the other hand, I like the idea due to the bitter irony it bears

    Who says to let the piggy eat the remains? (would they even do that?)

    Just bury the remains in the "unclean" pig sty to deny the virginial afterlife rewards. Ala the fake John Pershing's tactic.


    Yes they would. Pigs are omnivores and will eat meat. They'll even hunt and kill animals they can catch.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 16:12:22


    Post by: Frazzled


    Enough pigs will eat a human body in eat minutes, if my English speaking friends are right....


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
     CptJake wrote:
    I don't see the issue. Pack him in dry ice or embalm him and pass him off to his consulate and make them deal with getting it back to his home country and family. Either his family or the consulate take care of it. That is the way it usually works when a foreigner dies (or conversely, when a US citizen dies overseas).

    No point in being disrespectful or overly respectful. He is cargo at this point. Ship him out.


    Captain Jake has the way of it.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 17:26:54


    Post by: Sigvatr


    Ship it to another country? Looks like it's...

    *puts sunglasses on*

    ...dead weight.

    YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAH.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 22:32:20


    Post by: Monster Rain


    They could always do an "Osama".

    A weighted coffin into the briny deep and we're all done. A quiet burial at sea is more than this animal deserves.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/08 22:44:11


    Post by: Grey Templar


    How about the gibbet? Let him poison the crows.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/09 17:46:17


    Post by: Dreadclaw69


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22471443

    Boston bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev buried

    Boston bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev has been buried at an undisclosed location, Massachusetts police say.

    Tsarnaev's body "is no longer in the City of Worcester and is now entombed", a police statement said.

    Tsarnaev was killed during a manhunt after last month's bombing, which killed three and injured more than 260.

    Authorities had been struggling to find a community willing to accept Tsarnaev's body.

    Dozens of protesters picketed the Worcester funeral home holding his body last week.

    "As a result of our public appeal for help, a courageous and compassionate individual came forward to provide the assistance needed to properly bury the deceased," a police statement said.

    The statement also thanked "the community that provided the burial site".

    Tsarnaev and his brother are accused of planting two bombs near the finishing-line of the Boston Marathon on 15 April.

    After being hit in a shoot-out with police, Tsarnaev was reportedly run over by his younger brother as he escaped from the scene in a car.

    Surviving brother Dzhokhar is in a prison hospital after being shot and injured during the police manhunt.

    The two are also suspected of shooting dead one policeman and injuring another.

    The family are ethnic Chechen Muslims from Russia and had been living in the US for about a decade. Tamerlan was drawn to radical Islam.

    His wife, Katherine Russell, declined to pick up his body from the medical examiner's office, allowing his relatives to claim the remains instead and arrange for a funeral


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/05/09 19:44:51


    Post by: Sigvatr


    Someone will get the adress and sort it out.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/07/10 20:16:19


    Post by: Sigvatr


    *shouts* I RESURRECT THEE, THREAD!

    Ye, I know, old n' stuff, but didn't want to create a shiny new thread just to say that the Boston Bomber decided to pledge "Not Guilty". I don't know if, or why, its lawyer decided to tell it that but seriously, just put it in a trasher and we're over with it.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/07/10 20:18:39


    Post by: Dreadclaw69


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23264940

    Boston Marathon bomb suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has pleaded not guilty to all charges in his first appearance before a court filled with blast victims.

    Mr Tsarnaev, 19, faces 30 counts of using a weapon of mass destruction in the two 15 April blasts that killed three, including an eight-year-old boy.

    He appeared in shackles and an orange prison suit, and replied "not guilty" as the charges were read to the court.

    Prosecutors could press for the death penalty for some counts.

    People appeared outside the courthouse as early as 07:30 EST (12:30 BST) to claim a seat inside the court for a hearing that lasted just seven minutes.

    Two of the suspect's sisters appeared in court in Muslim garb. One sobbed during the hearing while the other held a baby.

    Mr Tsarnaev's older brother, Tamerlan, was killed days after the attack during a massive police operation. He is also suspected of carrying out the attacks.

    The brothers are from a family of ethnic Chechen Muslims from Russia and had been living in the US for about a decade.

    More than 260 people were injured when two pressure cooker bombs packed with nails, ball bearings and other shrapnel were detonated at the finish line of the Boston Marathon.

    The bombing was the worst mass-casualty attack on US soil since 11 September 2001.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/07/10 20:27:19


    Post by: Chongara


     Sigvatr wrote:
    *shouts* I RESURRECT THEE, THREAD!

    Ye, I know, old n' stuff, but didn't want to create a shiny new thread just to say that the Boston Bomber decided to pledge "Not Guilty". I don't know if, or why, its lawyer decided to tell it that but seriously, just put it in a trasher and we're over with it.


    If he enters a guilty plea things wrap up relatively quietly. If he enters plea of not guilty you get a more extended process and further media attention. You don't bomb a big event in a public place in hopes things blow over quietly. The point of the bombing was to get attention and cause a stir, this has similar purpose for him.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/07/10 20:36:45


    Post by: Ouze


    Chongara wrote:
    The point of the bombing was to get attention and cause a stir, this has similar purpose for him.


    I have no problem with showing the world, as we have done time and time again, that this is a country with a rule of law.

    We do not need to upend our rights, we do not need to explore extrajudicial remedies - we will simply dispense justice in a fair and open courtroom.

    If we find this man guilty of his crimes, he will not be a martyr for Allah. He will not be some kind of larger-than-life figurehead, a boogeyman we use to drive foreign policy, to drive up defense spending to unsustainable levels, to drum up fear, and ultimately to alter our way of life as he would like us to. We will simply find him guilty with evidence we obtained via good policework (and not via torture), and when found guilty of his crimes, we will send him to a supermax prison with the rest of the murderers, thieves, and rapists which are his peers.

    Then we will go on with our lives, unafraid and free.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/07/10 20:42:18


    Post by: whembly


     Ouze wrote:
    Chongara wrote:
    The point of the bombing was to get attention and cause a stir, this has similar purpose for him.


    I have no problem with showing the world, as we have done time and time again, that this is a country with a rule of law.

    We do not need to upend our rights, we do not need to explore extrajudicial remedies - we will simply dispense justice in a fair and open courtroom.

    If we find this man guilty of his crimes, he will not be a martyr for Allah. He will not be some kind of larger-than-life figurehead, a boogeyman we use to drive foreign policy, to drive up defense spending to unsustainable levels, to drum up fear, and ultimately to alter our way of life as he would like us to. We will simply find him guilty with evidence we obtained via good policework (and not via torture), and when found guilty of his crimes, we will send him to a supermax prison with the rest of the murderers, thieves, and rapists which are his peers.

    Then we will go on with our lives, unafraid and free.

    Exalted.

    Everyone has their rights in our courts.


    Boston Marathon Bombing Discussion @ 2013/07/10 20:47:42


    Post by: Chongara


     Ouze wrote:
    Chongara wrote:
    The point of the bombing was to get attention and cause a stir, this has similar purpose for him.


    I have no problem with showing the world, as we have done time and time again, that this is a country with a rule of law.

    We do not need to upend our rights, we do not need to explore extrajudicial remedies - we will simply dispense justice in a fair and open courtroom.

    If we find this man guilty of his crimes, he will not be a martyr for Allah. He will not be some kind of larger-than-life figurehead, a boogeyman we use to drive foreign policy, to drive up defense spending to unsustainable levels, to drum up fear, and ultimately to alter our way of life as he would like us to. We will simply find him guilty with evidence we obtained via good policework (and not via torture), and when found guilty of his crimes, we will send him to a supermax prison with the rest of the murderers, thieves, and rapists which are his peers.

    Then we will go on with our lives, unafraid and free.


    I wasn't saying he shouldn't get a trial, far from it. I largely agree with this post, except for the part about thieves being in the same general class as rapists or mass-murders. I was just explaining to the dude I quoted why he's going for a not guilty plea in a trial that might safely called a forgone conclusion.