Ready your lasguns, load your bolters, arm your Imperial Knights and prepare to fight to the last man. The Red Waaagh! has come to the Sanctus Reach. Want to know more? Check back on Saturday 5th July to find out what’s going on.
part of me was hoping that the Red Waaagh meant Evil Sunz and that they would come out with new buggy and/or deffkopta models...doesn't look like it but still excited nonetheless
That'd be cool, but word on the street is t hat it's a warzone expansion like the Damnos one or what have you. I would be really happy to be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's all it is.
Look, it says right in the video that Sanctus Reach is an Imperial Knight world, and of the 3 battle paintings in the video one has Baneblades and two have Knights. Not exactly starter set material.
lord_blackfang wrote: Look, it says right in the video that Sanctus Reach is an Imperial Knight world, and of the 3 battle paintings in the video one has Baneblades and two have Knights. Not exactly starter set material.
So you're saying That there's going to be a snap fit Knight & Baneblade in the starter? GR8!
I know better than to disagre with the people saying its a Damnos/pandorax/whatever book of apoc formations.
Still, I dont remember GW bothering with teaser vids for ťhe other books in tje series.
Its usually their way of giving cryptic teasing of stuff we already know, right?
And not for minor releases filling the post codex gap.
Fayric wrote: I know better than to disagre with the people saying its a Damnos/pandorax/whatever book of apoc formations.
Still, I dont remember GW bothering with teaser vids for ťhe other books in tje series.
Its usually their way of giving cryptic teasing of stuff we already know, right?
And not for minor releases filling the post codex gap.
Bothering?
It's existing picture art, some generic music and sound files with a basic rumble effect. I've never made a video and I'm sure I could hack this together in less than two hours. Really, it's not so much bother as "hey, that intern has nothing to do, give him some job"
lord_blackfang wrote: So I got this from a reliable source. You know as much as I do:
July 12th
Ork Mek Mob
Sanctus Reach: The Red Waaagh!
Sanctus Reach: Evil Sun Rising
You mean you got it from Grot Orderly?
Ork Mekmob ($170)
Big set that is going to save us 20% to when we buy all things separately.
- Ork Mek
- Meganobz
- Grot Oiler
- Ork Trukk
- Ork Boyz
- Ork Nob - probably the same we have seen on Mexican Ork pics
- Deff Dread
Sanctus Reach: The Red Waaagh! ($50)
Orky invasion on one of the Imperium worlds, where trillions of greenskins fought under Grukk FaceRippa!
- new campaign rules (Planetstrike? Huh! Didn't I tell you! - 12 scenarios
- 112 pages
- hard back
Gerantius has been floating around since the Knights stuff launched, and is the Freeblade associated with Scnatis Reach.
Would be interesting if he became a "Special Character" in his own right, because I think that's something the Knight army could really use (a system to allow each model to be truly individual, if only to allow Knight armies to pad out the points to fight at standard point sizes without allies) but I'd be highly skeptical of something that fun and interesting happening, at least not without a £20 book or download to support it.
Yeah, it's about the only way they can get som AA!
But seriously, despite myself, I've actually started creating back stories for my three (despite only one being finished, the other two are still NIB) and it would be great if the one I've finished, who became a Freeblade when the rest of his house was wiped out, and he now roams his forest planet looking for a cause worth dying for, could have scout to represent his natural affinity for navigating through heavily forested terrain, or the hot-headed young Errant could have rampage, or the experienced, steady commander be given Preferred Enemy?
It would be very cool, and would have transformed the Knight Codex.
Best I can suggest would be to write down some rules to generate your own special characters and see if people in the club will play them. Bit of playtesting and then they too could have their own special characters.
In my group we're doing a pretty large campaign and we -- well me mainly -- have written up some rules for generating our own special characters -- 10 points extra 2 rolls on a D66 chart and roll 3 warlord traits and keep one.
Bonus new skill/roll if a character survives a campaign phase.
Iron-Father Adolf Kressying has proven amazingly durable really
At the back of the Whitedwarf it says the sanctus reach saga continues. (I only have the german version, might differ)
I would assume new models are up for preorder next weekend, talking about the already sighted Waaghboss Grukk....maybe something else.
Next whitedwarf comes whith a datasheet for the imperial knight.
The Red Waaagh! is the opening instalment of the Sanctus campaign and Sanctus Reach: Volume 1 combines this campaign supplement with the Evil Sun Rising novella by Guy Haley into one exceptional collector’s edition.
These two small format hardback books are presented in sturdy slipcase and contain all the same content as the large scale editions.
A storm of violence is about to break upon the Knight world of Alaric Prime. At the head of a vast greenskin horde, Warlord Grukk Face-rippa leads the attack against the forces of the Imperium.
The Red Waaagh! is a 112-page hardback book introducing the Sanctus Reach campaign. Inside you will find: Waaagh! Grukk, which is the story of the Red Waagh! and its attack upon Alaric Prime. There are twelve scenarios that allow you to refight the battles of the Red Waaagh! and five datesheets that provide detailed rules for famous formations that fought in the war for Alaric Prime.
Planetary invasions in Warhammer 40,000 have never been more deadly, the The Red Waagh! also includes fully updated rules for Planetstrike and Planetfall missions.
As the Red Waargh! Engulfs the Sanctus Reach, orks flock to Warlord Grukk’s banner, Big Mek Uggrim and his Red sunz amongst them. But even with plenty of humans to kill, the orks can’t help fighting amongst themselves, encouraged by the psychotically unstable Grukk. The Red Sunz soon find themselves having to contend with the the attentions of Mogrok, another Big Mek who covets Uggrim’s creations. Beset by conflict with the Imperium, their rivals and each other the Red Sunz prepare for the fight of their lives.
Especially talented or popular Mekboyz will soon attract a following; these like-minded underlings are more than willing to test out the Meks latest inventions. In exchange, the Mek will kit ‘em out with the best and killiest gear.
This multi-part plastic boxed set contains 3 Meganobz (one of which can be assembled as a Big Mek in mega armour), a Trukk mob of 10 Boyz with their Truck, a Deff Dread, a Mek with a Grot Oiler.
(The Mekmob is actually kind of disappointing in my opinion, especially at $160)
Definitely one of the weaker bundles they have released. An overpriced mek (no KFF or SAG and does it count as the 15 point mek or a big mek? I can get a regular mek for 25 with 4 lootas), a dread (do people actually run dreads if they can't be in the troop slot?). The trukk boyz and mega nobz are nice but there is so much dead weight for a bundle. Hell the old kit was more usable for building a force (more boyz and bikes are always good). How do you have an Ork bundle with only 10 ork boyz?
Vankraken wrote: Definitely one of the weaker bundles they have released. An overpriced mek (no KFF or SAG and does it count as the 15 point mek or a big mek? I can get a regular mek for 25 with 4 lootas), a dread (do people actually run dreads if they can't be in the troop slot?). The trukk boyz and mega nobz are nice but there is so much dead weight for a bundle. Hell the old kit was more usable for building a force (more boyz and bikes are always good). How do you have an Ork bundle with only 10 ork boyz?
Speaking of weak bundles, the two Sanctus Reach books are $49.50 and $20 US, but you can buy them together for $85! That's right! $15.50 for the box! Great news!
Seriously, if $50 wasn't the price of new GW books, I think I'd be very happy about the Sanctus Reach supplement. 40 pages of background, some formations and battle scenarios, and a complete update of Planetstrike (according to WD)? Yay! For $30 I would be over the moon. Thanks to my local gaming store, I can functionally get it for $40, which is okay, I guess.
But charging you more for the box set of both books? Why not charge me list price and kick me in the junk?
Vankraken wrote: Definitely one of the weaker bundles they have released. An overpriced mek (no KFF or SAG and does it count as the 15 point mek or a big mek? I can get a regular mek for 25 with 4 lootas), a dread (do people actually run dreads if they can't be in the troop slot?). The trukk boyz and mega nobz are nice but there is so much dead weight for a bundle. Hell the old kit was more usable for building a force (more boyz and bikes are always good). How do you have an Ork bundle with only 10 ork boyz?
You get two Meks.
The Big Mek with KFF in Mega Armor and a Mek that can be taken without using up an HQ slot.
Okay. This is really getting insulting. There is a one-click deal (lolz) on pre-order for three Knights. This is exactly the same deal as was previously rolled out a couple of months back when the Knights were released. Now, the "old" deal is no longer available on the web site and this "new" (new meaning "exactly the same") one is on pre-order.
Breotan wrote: Okay. This is really getting insulting. There is a one-click deal (lolz) on pre-order for three Knights. This is exactly the same deal as was previously rolled out a couple of months back when the Knights were released. Now, the "old" deal is no longer available on the web site and this "new" (new meaning "exactly the same") one is on pre-order.
Vankraken wrote: Definitely one of the weaker bundles they have released. An overpriced mek (no KFF or SAG and does it count as the 15 point mek or a big mek? I can get a regular mek for 25 with 4 lootas), a dread (do people actually run dreads if they can't be in the troop slot?). The trukk boyz and mega nobz are nice but there is so much dead weight for a bundle. Hell the old kit was more usable for building a force (more boyz and bikes are always good). How do you have an Ork bundle with only 10 ork boyz?
You get two Meks.
The Big Mek with KFF in Mega Armor and a Mek that can be taken without using up an HQ slot.
Ok so a big mek and only 2 mega nobz so you can't even field that unit. No matter how you slice it it's a poor box and if you where trying to build an army off it then it's really lacking. The biggest offender is the incredibly overpriced mek which is 21 dollars for a 15 point unit. Again you can get a mek in the loota box for 4 more dollars and get 4 lootas for free
Vankraken wrote: Definitely one of the weaker bundles they have released. An overpriced mek (no KFF or SAG and does it count as the 15 point mek or a big mek? I can get a regular mek for 25 with 4 lootas), a dread (do people actually run dreads if they can't be in the troop slot?). The trukk boyz and mega nobz are nice but there is so much dead weight for a bundle. Hell the old kit was more usable for building a force (more boyz and bikes are always good). How do you have an Ork bundle with only 10 ork boyz?
You get two Meks.
The Big Mek with KFF in Mega Armor and a Mek that can be taken without using up an HQ slot.
Ok so a big mek and only 2 mega nobz so you can't even field that unit. No matter how you slice it it's a poor box and if you where trying to build an army off it then it's really lacking.
A Big Mek and 2 Mega Nobz that can be converted into Warbosses in Mega Armor, actually. The "Ork horde" detachment gives you 3 HQs, not counting the Meks that you can get from Mekaniaks.
While I certainly agree that it's not the best box they've ever done, to pretend it's offensive is silly.
The biggest offender is the incredibly overpriced mek which is 21 dollars for a 15 point unit. Again you can get a mek in the loota box for 4 more dollars and get 4 lootas for free
No actually you can't. The bits included with that Mek are right now exclusive to him. Notably the "Killsaw".
azreal13 wrote: Lol, just realised that the zero discount bundles are on pre-order for sale on the 12th July!
So, I can buy three Knights now, for £255, or I can pre order three Knights for delivery next week.
For £255.
'This is great etc etc'
I can only fathom these bundles with zero savings attached to them are designed to appeal to the laziest gamers ever created, who not only can't be bothered to press a few buttons to arrive at a discounters site let alone ordering the models individually from GW, or to snag unwary parents who assume, like rational human beings who've never dealt with GW before, that a bundle is a discounted deal for buying bulk...
I did get excited as there was an armored bundle of leman russes, but screw paying full retail for them.
H.B.M.C. wrote: So... is this campaign book Limited Edition?
From what I can tell, no.
They have a "limited edition" version of it that comes bundled with the novella and both have variant covers...but who really cares about that.
Especially when the cover art for the main book is this awesome:
I might wait until they do the inevitable "bundle" of all the parts of the campaign itself and get it then. I have a distinct feeling that this campaign is going to be how they redo Cities of Death.
Ok, well, I've said in the past that I operate on a system of credit where credit's due, so for all I rag on GW (and boy do they deserve it), I'll also celebrate areas where I feel they're doing the right thing. I've said previously that I liked the Warzone books (if not their unnecessary limited edition nature), and the idea of releasing a series of campaign books is exactly what GW should be doing rather than WD-only DLC and datasheets and all that other nickel/dime nonsense.
The price of the book is still bonkers (really guys? Twice that of an FFG supplement?), but I'd rather the book exist than not exist.
And it doesn't help that GW's free shipping threshold is $85, and the book is $83. Bastards.
H.B.M.C. wrote: So... is this campaign book Limited Edition?
From what I can tell, no.
They have a "limited edition" version of it that comes bundled with the novella and both have variant covers...but who really cares about that.
Especially when the cover art for the main book is this awesome:
I might wait until they do the inevitable "bundle" of all the parts of the campaign itself and get it then. I have a distinct feeling that this campaign is going to be how they redo Cities of Death.
I should hope Cities of Death would get an update. It's been what, four editions since that came out? I would love for some GOOD city fighting rules.
On the Mek bundle, the MANz would also give an existing player two models with twin killsawz to add to their existing units.
I think it's a decent enough load out of minis.
This 'first phase' of the Sanctus Reach campaign doesn't touch upon CItyfight/Cities of Death, but it does present an updated version of Planetstrike in its entirety. I couldn't see how they were going to get all of Planetstrike down to 8 pages, until I went back and looked at the original book.
Planetstrike has a lot of fluff and artwork. It also has tons of rules for Fortifications, which don't need to be reprinted, since there's another book out there for that (Stronghold Assault). Jervis mentions that Sanctus Reach also includes the Planetfall mission, which tells me that they eliminated the other Planetstrike Missions (which, honestly, is okay, since they were all variations of Planetfall).
Thus, they just need the basic rules for Planetstrike, with the Detachments, and (hopefully) stratagems. I loved those things!, and I can easily see that fitting into 8 pages.
These books are too expensive at full retail, but I do like the idea of a 'campaign' book that includes information and scenarios from a specific campaign, but also gives you a different game. I could certainly see a second phase of the Sanctus Reach campaign covering Cityfight/Cities of Death, and I could even see a supplement that snuck in Zone Mortalis rules (or Voidfighting rules). It helps that one of the armies is Orks (my skumgrods), but I feel for those poor dudes playing Necrons or CSM who have the choice of buying a book with nothing about their army to get the rules, or not getting the rules.
I still think the 'old style' of variant rules (Cityfight/Planetstrike/Battle Missions) was best, because it gave you a little bit of information for everybody, so there wasn't the feeling that you were buying 8 pages of rules and 50 pages of filler. However, it's better than a kick in the teeth.
I just got back into 40k not to long ago, but I remember the fall of Medusa V campaign and I must say that overall I loved the presentation behind that a lot more. looking at the GW website now and remembering what it used to be it disappoints me a little. I don't plan on giving 40k up again in the near future but I kind of wish GW would improve their releases.
azreal13 wrote: Lol, just realised that the zero discount bundles are on pre-order for sale on the 12th July!
So, I can buy three Knights now, for £255, or I can pre order three Knights for delivery next week.
For £255.
'This is great etc etc'
I can only fathom these bundles with zero savings attached to them are designed to appeal to the laziest gamers ever created, who not only can't be bothered to press a few buttons to arrive at a discounters site let alone ordering the models individually from GW, or to snag unwary parents who assume, like rational human beings who've never dealt with GW before, that a bundle is a discounted deal for buying bulk...
I did get excited as there was an armored bundle of leman russes, but screw paying full retail for them.
There's nothing on the GW site that says you're saving money, so I don't think they're in breach of any sort of policy there.
The thing with the bundles is, they make perfect sense. For the ten minutes it takes to set them up, if even a couple of people buy something as part of one they wouldn't have bought otherwise, it works out as a bonus for GW.
Paradigm wrote: There's nothing on the GW site that says you're saving money, so I don't think they're in breach of any sort of policy there.
The thing with the bundles is, they make perfect sense. For the ten minutes it takes to set them up, if even a couple of people buy something as part of one they wouldn't have bought otherwise, it works out as a bonus for GW.
No savings or benefits, but as with GW, no promises of "value" or "discount". They are only aimed at people for who money is no object, and as Paradigm says, there is literally no cost to them doing it.
Thanks guys for the feedback. Wow that is low of GW if they going for the crowd that doesn't know better. Is there really that many people out there, that GW rather have them for business than their actual customers or is GW really desperate now?
Just mind boggles me GW practices. It's like they don't want my money sometimes.
Davor wrote: Thanks guys for the feedback. Wow that is low of GW if they going for the crowd that doesn't know better. Is there really that many people out there, that GW rather have them for business than their actual customers or is GW really desperate now?
Just mind boggles me GW practices. It's like they don't want my money sometimes.
Sometimes they don't want your money, they might want the money of a totally different demographic. They will happily take your money if you offer it though.
Davor wrote: Thanks guys for the feedback. Wow that is low of GW if they going for the crowd that doesn't know better. Is there really that many people out there, that GW rather have them for business than their actual customers or is GW really desperate now?
Just mind boggles me GW practices. It's like they don't want my money sometimes.
How is it low? They are bundles of goods at a listed price. You may wish that you got a bulk discount, but there is nothing requiring GW to offer said discount, and nothing anywhere that even implies that the one-click collections are deals, bargins, or discounts. People who do know better usually don't buy from GW's website to begin with, going for the FLGS or online discounters.
Low would be something like advertising them as bargains, then adding an "online order service fee" or something to bring the price up higher, like many repair places, phone companies, ect do. Or if the bundle cost more than the price of the components.
GW is quite upfront. One Knight? $140. Three Knights that make up a cool squadron? $420. I may not like the prices (I miss the days of the $90 Baneblade, and wish the Knight would have been $90 or $85) but these bundles are not morally dubious at all, like you seem to be implying.
BrookM wrote: The shiny the OP didn't want to share:
Ready your lasguns, load your bolters, arm your Imperial Knights and prepare to fight to the last man. The Red Waaagh! has come to the Sanctus Reach. Want to know more? Check back on Saturday 5th July to find out what’s going on.
I really do hate these GW videos. They must be created/edited by work experience kids, they're just the worst "promotional/reveal" videos I've seen
Paradigm wrote: There's nothing on the GW site that says you're saving money, so I don't think they're in breach of any sort of policy there.
The thing with the bundles is, they make perfect sense. For the ten minutes it takes to set them up, if even a couple of people buy something as part of one they wouldn't have bought otherwise, it works out as a bonus for GW.
I think the ire they would earn from the customer base, from anyone with four working brain-cells or more that can see there is no saving on buying the items separately, would more than offset any 'bonus' GW would get from this.
It's not an underhand way of selling (you might get a really uninformed parent with too much money to spend thinking they are getting some kind of extra value here, on top of the standard release - although I think that unlikely), but it's just another example of the complete lack of any initiative or marketing nous to attempt to generate extra sales.
I don't know, maybe the things are selling so well that they don't need to give anything at all extra to sell the Knights, and the webstore will be full of people giggling like lunatics and exclaiming 'LOL' as they happily click on the 'add to cart' button for this deal multiple times?
I'm not sure. The ire mostly comes from those of us who are aware of cheaper retailers, 3rd party models and the hobby world in general outside of GW. The bundles are targeted at those who use the GW site anyway, and are 'used to' paying the full retail price, so they're not losing sales on the whole, and maybe gaining some.
The disillusionment with GW is probably contained to online forums, and that is no doubt a small sector of the player base. For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
It's also easier for gift buyers; rather than putting Timmy's new Space Marine army together squad-by-squad, Timmy's mother can just get a bundle which will, according to GW, give an army.
The disillusionment with GW is probably contained to online forums, and that is no doubt a small sector of the player base. For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
It's also easier for gift buyers; rather than putting Timmy's new Space Marine army together squad-by-squad, Timmy's mother can just get a bundle which will, according to GW, give an army.
Of the gaming and hobby stores I've been to on the west coast, I've not met a single person at one who had a nice thing to say about GW. Quite the contrary, most of them seem to mirror the sentiment I see on Dakka - Frustration over price-hikes, fail-cast, their callous disregard for sellers, the undermining of their own stores, their mind-boggling stupid marketing strategies / lack there of, the wonky choices they make in some codex, and massive imbalance in the game itself.
So far as gift buyers go... I donno, maybe I had a great mom when I started playing 40k back when I was 11. She picked up the other army and we'd build / paint together, she understood the game just as I did; had a codex and an army just like I did. She wasn't as good as I was, she'd forget the rules / get confused sometimes, and she didn't spend as much money on her stuff as I did on mine, but she was smarter than Timmy's mum apparently is.
Paradigm wrote: For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
I take issue with this statement. I'm sure that GW believe this to be true but their recent financials seem to suggest the opposite would be more likely.
The argument that the forums are the tiny minority and everything is fine with the majority doesn't hold wight when in some parts of the world GW was down something like 30% sales in their last half year report.
Paradigm wrote: For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
I take issue with this statement. I'm sure that GW believe this to be true but their recent financials seem to suggest the opposite would be more likely.
The argument that the forums are the tiny minority and everything is fine with the majority doesn't hold wight when in some parts of the world GW was down something like 30% sales in their last half year report.
Fair enough. I haven't read the financial reports, but I can certainly see more gamers wising up to GW's 'true nature', given the increasing community communication and the rise of alternative companies they prove you can do what GW does for half the price. So I can certainly see the ratio of those of us that know to those that don't dropping.
But the bundles will still be bought by those ignorant of the alternatives, and this is where GW make their money, especially on the bundles. The times they are a-changing, but not yet to the extent that GW can't get away with stuff like this. When all their press (I use the word loosely) and image tries to indoctrinate you with the idea that they are the be-all and end-all of the Hobby, there are bound to be susceptible kids whose parents have deep pockets.
Paradigm wrote: I'm not sure. The ire mostly comes from those of us who are aware of cheaper retailers, 3rd party models and the hobby world in general outside of GW. The bundles are targeted at those who use the GW site anyway, and are 'used to' paying the full retail price, so they're not losing sales on the whole, and maybe gaining some.
The disillusionment with GW is probably contained to online forums, and that is no doubt a small sector of the player base. For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
It's also easier for gift buyers; rather than putting Timmy's new Space Marine army together squad-by-squad, Timmy's mother can just get a bundle which will, according to GW, give an army.
The thing is Paradigm, have you ever bought anything (outside of wargaming, or specifically GW as they are the only ones who do this) where you have thought 'wow, multibuy with one click!' and where buying that bundle hasn't offered any kind of saving?
So for example: you want to buy a tin of beans. But, you can buy a pack of 4 of them, for exactly the same price as if you had bought 4 individual tins? Or, go to buy a DVD/Blue-ray, and they have special labels on them saying "£10 each, 3 for £30!"
Both of those examples above are deliberately ridiculous, because you just don't encounter them. TBH, I think the whole thing is both hilarious and also an insight into exactly how GW judges the intelligence level (or maybe awareness) of their customers.
Paradigm wrote: I'm not sure. The ire mostly comes from those of us who are aware of cheaper retailers, 3rd party models and the hobby world in general outside of GW. The bundles are targeted at those who use the GW site anyway, and are 'used to' paying the full retail price, so they're not losing sales on the whole, and maybe gaining some.
The disillusionment with GW is probably contained to online forums, and that is no doubt a small sector of the player base. For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
It's also easier for gift buyers; rather than putting Timmy's new Space Marine army together squad-by-squad, Timmy's mother can just get a bundle which will, according to GW, give an army.
The thing is Paradigm, have you ever bought anything (outside of wargaming, or specifically GW as they are the only ones who do this) where you have thought 'wow, multibuy with one click!' and where buying that bundle hasn't offered any kind of saving?
So for example: you want to buy a tin of beans. But, you can buy a pack of 4 of them, for exactly the same price as if you had bought 4 individual tins? Or, go to buy a DVD/Blue-ray, and they have special labels on them saying "£10 each, 3 for £30!"
Both of those examples above are deliberately ridiculous, because you just don't encounter them. TBH, I think the whole thing is both hilarious and also an insight into exactly how GW judges the intelligence level (or maybe awareness) of their customers.
Personally, I haven't, but the practice does exist outside of GW. Amazon frequently list 'buy [the product you are viewing] + [related product] + [related product] for [no saving]', and it's really just for convenience. And if, for example, I were a child asking my parents for a new army for Christmas, it'd be much easier to point them to a single page with the bundle than list everything separately.
And I do know people in real life who have bought these bundles. There was a guy at a club I attended that was looking at starting a Raven Guard army, saw the Shrike+VV+Tactical Squad bundle (or whatever it was) and just bought it. He recognised that there were no savings, but figured it would be a good starting point for an army, and if you're going to use everything in it, then you might as well.
And, for the effort it takes GW to set these up, any sales they make are really a bonus. For example, the Ultramarines Chapter bundle was mental, but if anyone did buy it, then that's loads of cash for them that otherwise would probably not have been spent. This is an extreme example, but the principle is the same; it's potentially more sales for minimal effort.
I don't think they can be condemned for the practice, as they don't advertise it as offering any savings, so they're not being misleading or false. I agree it is annoying and probably stupid that they don't offer discount deals, but that's their call. Of the list of grievances most of us have with GW, I don't think no-saving-bundles are really near the top...
Pacific wrote: [
The thing is Paradigm, have you ever bought anything (outside of wargaming, or specifically GW as they are the only ones who do this) where you have thought 'wow, multibuy with one click!' and where buying that bundle hasn't offered any kind of saving?
So for example: you want to buy a tin of beans. But, you can buy a pack of 4 of them, for exactly the same price as if you had bought 4 individual tins? Or, go to buy a DVD/Blue-ray, and they have special labels on them saying "£10 each, 3 for £30!"
Both of those examples above are deliberately ridiculous, because you just don't encounter them. TBH, I think the whole thing is both hilarious and also an insight into exactly how GW judges the intelligence level (or maybe awareness) of their customers.
However, you can sometimes find that on occasions four individual tins of Heinz beans may be less than the multipack of four tins.
Other firms have schemes/ marketing ploys to get that little extra bit of money from you:
For example, from Warlord Games and the new plastic Universal Carrier:
The section was the first release. Three carriers and crews PLUS 15 infantry for £45. Its a good price.
All are good prices for a nice product but, seeing as I already have plenty of British Infantry figures, if I had jumped straight in on the Carrier Section release, I would have spent £45 instead of £32.40.
However, unlike GW's "marketing", if you are starting from scratch, the section IS the better deal as you are paying £9.00 for 15 infantry (60 pence each) rather than £24 for 25(the standard infantry set).
Davor wrote: Thanks guys for the feedback. Wow that is low of GW if they going for the crowd that doesn't know better. Is there really that many people out there, that GW rather have them for business than their actual customers or is GW really desperate now?
Just mind boggles me GW practices. It's like they don't want my money sometimes.
How is it low? They are bundles of goods at a listed price. You may wish that you got a bulk discount, but there is nothing requiring GW to offer said discount, and nothing anywhere that even implies that the one-click collections are deals, bargins, or discounts. People who do know better usually don't buy from GW's website to begin with, going for the FLGS or online discounters.
Low would be something like advertising them as bargains, then adding an "online order service fee" or something to bring the price up higher, like many repair places, phone companies, ect do. Or if the bundle cost more than the price of the components.
GW is quite upfront. One Knight? $140. Three Knights that make up a cool squadron? $420. I may not like the prices (I miss the days of the $90 Baneblade, and wish the Knight would have been $90 or $85) but these bundles are not morally dubious at all, like you seem to be implying.
I remember reading GW website or was it a WD, hyping up the One Click Deals. To hype that up, usually means getting a good deal off it. Hence saving money. So that is why I say it's mighty low of them to do that. If I didn't read them hyping it up, I would say yes they are doing nothing wrong. To hype it up "misleads" to something special even if they are not "misleading".
In most business parlance, the terms "bundle" indicates a discount due to buying in bulk. The fact that GW offers a bundle with no discount could potentially indicate a desire to mislead customers, since the assumption is that purchasing a bundle offers a discount off the normal price of the contents. So it's not out of the realm of possibility to think GW deliberately calls these things "bundles" to give the impression that it's discounted.
Although I think they've been stated as saying they feel discounts devalue the product, so their bundles don't give discounts. Which is just plain silly and arrogant (yet par for the course).
WayneTheGame wrote: In most business parlance, the terms "bundle" indicates a discount due to buying in bulk. The fact that GW offers a bundle with no discount could potentially indicate a desire to mislead customers, since the assumption is that purchasing a bundle offers a discount off the normal price of the contents.
That's why the term "bundle" hasn't really appeared since the earliest ones they did. They call them "One-Click Collections".
Back on Topic, I am interested to see what the guard formation will be, seeing as the description for the IG side of the conflict talks a lot about "The Steel Host".
Gerantius has been floating around since the Knights stuff launched, and is the Freeblade associated with Scnatis Reach.
Would be interesting if he became a "Special Character" in his own right, because I think that's something the Knight army could really use (a system to allow each model to be truly individual, if only to allow Knight armies to pad out the points to fight at standard point sizes without allies) but I'd be highly skeptical of something that fun and interesting happening, at least not without a £20 book or download to support it.
From the latest WD, Gerantius is listed as getting a data sheet in the next one. Some Knights may become Special Characters?
Paradigm wrote: I'm not sure. The ire mostly comes from those of us who are aware of cheaper retailers, 3rd party models and the hobby world in general outside of GW. The bundles are targeted at those who use the GW site anyway, and are 'used to' paying the full retail price, so they're not losing sales on the whole, and maybe gaining some.
The disillusionment with GW is probably contained to online forums, and that is no doubt a small sector of the player base. For each one of us with the will to grumble, there are half a dozen that will see the bundles and click 'buy'.
It's also easier for gift buyers; rather than putting Timmy's new Space Marine army together squad-by-squad, Timmy's mother can just get a bundle which will, according to GW, give an army.
The thing is Paradigm, have you ever bought anything (outside of wargaming, or specifically GW as they are the only ones who do this) where you have thought 'wow, multibuy with one click!' and where buying that bundle hasn't offered any kind of saving?
So for example: you want to buy a tin of beans. But, you can buy a pack of 4 of them, for exactly the same price as if you had bought 4 individual tins? Or, go to buy a DVD/Blue-ray, and they have special labels on them saying "£10 each, 3 for £30!"
Both of those examples above are deliberately ridiculous, because you just don't encounter them. TBH, I think the whole thing is both hilarious and also an insight into exactly how GW judges the intelligence level (or maybe awareness) of their customers.
Not to defend these bundle (they are garbage and ridiculous), but I must say that in In canada, in grocery store, it,s common to see ads announcing buy x products for y amount, where the unitary price is exactly the same as if you only bought one.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I rebember reading in here that in some country, it's illegal to make bundle discount if the packaging for the products are distinct. By that, I mean that if you advertise 3 knights for 300, you were obligated to sell one knight for 100$, unless you packaged them in a way that made it impossible to sell one indivudually. Wonder if their is any lawyer in here that can disproof of confirm this.
happy about the Knight as that is the one I wanted to build (but paint more similar to the Fantasy Green Knight), however, just getting back into the game I can't believe all these $50+ books GW releases. It's obscene. New rulebook bundle $85, Codexes $50, Campaign supplements $50, and so on... I won't be buying these added campaigns/supplements as it just gets beyond ridiculous.
They totally need to start doing Chapter Approved compendiums again and combine WD datasheets and BL ones in a nice hard cover. That would be excellent.
cromagz wrote: how despicable of GW to put rules in WD after people spent years clamouring for uhhhh rules in WD
Yet again, it's a good idea which GW have managed to somehow corrupt.
People were clamouring for rules in WD you're quite right.
Then GW made the whole magazine much more inaccessible by making it available for a week and only through specialist retailers, as opposed to a monthly publication available from pretty much every newsagent.
It's like they can't do something positive without simultaneously doing something to spoil it.
That said, I'm a Knight fanboy, and I'll get an ePub copy for the rules (despite the atrocious formatting that will inflict on my poor eyes)
Tis awful pointy though.
EDIT
Just spotted IWND hiding off to the left, looks better value now!
You can, but they're a crime against editing. They're seriously the worst professional digital or paper publication I can recall encountering.
Look at the likes of Figure Painter that are being produced with a fraction of the resources and it looks worse.
In fact, typing this, I might well have persuaded myself to drive over to the next town to buy a paper copy to avoid giving GW the impression that the digital copies are in any way worthwhile!
HAs anyone noticed that the special space wolves character model is th eart work from the 3rd ed sw codex or at least in the same pose and painted with the same hair ;lol
They totally need to start doing Chapter Approved compendiums again and combine WD datasheets and BL ones in a nice hard cover. That would be excellent.
Or maybe just release them on the website in PDF format like they did with Apoc.
They totally need to start doing Chapter Approved compendiums again and combine WD datasheets and BL ones in a nice hard cover. That would be excellent.
Or maybe just release them on the website in PDF fkrmat like they did with Apoc.
They totally need to start doing Chapter Approved compendiums again and combine WD datasheets and BL ones in a nice hard cover. That would be excellent.
Or maybe just release them on the website in PDF format like they did with Apoc.
It'll be in ePub, and they'll be £1.99 per sheet. You know I'm right.
They totally need to start doing Chapter Approved compendiums again and combine WD datasheets and BL ones in a nice hard cover. That would be excellent.
Or maybe just release them on the website in PDF format like they did with Apoc.
That'd be nice, but unrealistic for GW to change tact from pay to play to free. At least my idea was still pay.
Agreed, it is a thumping amount of points, but if you make the assumption that the basic Errant is costed about right, then I think the upgrades are about fair.
Anyone want to call on whether you can only shoot after running, or do you think you can shoot then run?
azreal13 wrote: It's only ~100 points more than standard, with boosted durability, speed and damage output, it's not ludicrous.
I dont have the codex in front of me but i think its more like 155 points more. As far as a superheavy goes 500 is a lot imo and should have somthing really good. I just dont think its worth it personally i would take the lancer and make it the warlod and give it a 3++ for 400 points.
azreal13 wrote: It's only ~100 points more than standard, with boosted durability, speed and damage output, it's not ludicrous.
I dont have the codex in front of me but i think its more like 155 points more. As far as a superheavy goes 500 is a lot imo and should have somthing really good. I just dont think its worth it personally i would take the lancer and make it the warlod and give it a 3++ for 400 points.
Its 125-130 points more than the normal ones. Making him your warlord doesn't give him 3++ and you would have to roll on the table with the chance of becoming worse off. 135 for certainty that your knight is a badass is a small price to pay. Not only that but you are more resilient with IWND and more agile.
Still not a compulsory choice, but not a bad one at all.
azreal13 wrote: It's only ~100 points more than standard, with boosted durability, speed and damage output, it's not ludicrous.
I dont have the codex in front of me but i think its more like 155 points more. As far as a superheavy goes 500 is a lot imo and should have somthing really good. I just dont think its worth it personally i would take the lancer and make it the warlod and give it a 3++ for 400 points.
Its 125-130 points more than the normal ones. Making him your warlord doesn't give him 3++ and you would have to roll on the table with the chance of becoming worse off. 135 for certainty that your knight is a badass is a small price to pay. Not only that but you are more resilient with IWND and more agile.
Still not a compulsory choice, but not a bad one at all.
You dont have to roll on the table, you can automatically make one the warlord and give him the 3++, and you dont have to roll on the table for any other knights either, its all optional.
oh yeah that's true! I missed that part. Well so you can have two seneschal level knights in your army without rolling on a table. There is value in that.
MasterSlowPoke wrote: They ran out of the regular Knight transfer set so they started throwing the larger one into the boxes. I guess they ran out of the larger one too?
The larger one was sold by itself, not as part of the box.
deffrekka wrote: What do the ork formations do in the red waaagh! Campaign book?
Mogrok's Bossboyz: 3 Big Meks, 1 Warboss, 1 Lvl 2 Weirdboy - 1 Big Mek nominated as Warlord, and has Kunnin' But Brutal trait. Before deployment, D3 units gain Acute Senses and Outflank. +1 to Seize the Initiative.
Just some quick knightly point comparisons
Knight Errant 370 points
WSBS S F S R I A HP 4 4 10 13 12 12 4 3 6
Gerantius 500 points
WSBS S F S R I A HP 5 5 * 13 12 12 4 3 6
Plus
It Will Not Die
The Forgotten Knight
Striker
* S not in datasheet
Knight Paladin 375 points
WSBS S F S R I A HP 4 4 10 13 12 12 4 3 6
The Obsidian Knight 400 points
WSBS S F S R I A HP 6 6 10 13 12 12 4 3 6
Plus
Outflank
Rage
Preferred Enemy (Tau)
It’s nice to see the some of the freeblades made in to special characters. Sorry I could not make the tables prettier.
