I never served, so I don't know exactly how it feels to see someone wear the uniform and act as if they are a active service member. It's a dick thing to do and seems to be occurring a lot lately in the past couple of years.
Dressing as an active service member is pretty pathetic. Going to all the trouble of filming and uploading a video of you "getting" someone for doing something mildly sleazy but ultimately harmless is also pretty pathetic.
"If I was a phony, I woulnt be wearing this uniform"
I cracked up at that.
Although, I have to question why, video tape in the middle of the mall, call someone out with your kid there.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Rusty Trombone wrote: I couldn't bear watching the whole video. Dang...the only clue you need to tell you he's a fraud is his soggy middle. Seriously...Rangers ain't fat.
I remember someone telling me, when you come back from active service, your body goes to hell, you are eating more and not doing the crazy exercise stuff you where doing before.
Rusty Trombone wrote: I couldn't bear watching the whole video. Dang...the only clue you need to tell you he's a fraud is his soggy middle. Seriously...Rangers ain't fat.
I remember someone telling me, when you come back from active service, your body goes to hell, you are eating more and not doing the crazy exercise stuff you where doing before.
Yeah, everyone usually gains a few pounds after they separate, but this guy claims to be an active ranger. AFAIK infantry in general and Rangers in particular do nothing but PT all the freaking time, and none of the ones I ever met would be caught dead that fluffy or that jacked up.
Jimsolo wrote: Dressing as an active service member is pretty pathetic. Going to all the trouble of filming and uploading a video of you "getting" someone for doing something mildly sleazy but ultimately harmless is also pretty pathetic.
I'm not a lawyer but If he asked for and received a veteran/military discount and is not actually a military member or veteran, as seems to be the case, I believe he could and should be prosecuted for fraud under Pennsylvania's criminal code Title 18, Chapter 41 § 4120.
I argued that Stolen Valor was unconstitutional and still believe it was but once you cross the line from playing dress-up to actually getting things to which you are not entitled you have gone too far. As a former member of the Marine Core Seal-Snipers, there is nothing more irritating than fakes like this to me.
Jimsolo wrote: Dressing as an active service member is pretty pathetic. Going to all the trouble of filming and uploading a video of you "getting" someone for doing something mildly sleazy but ultimately harmless is also pretty pathetic.
If I recall correctly he was trying to derive financial benefit from wearing the uniform in the form of discounts, which while not entirely harmless, is pretty innocuous.
However, he didn't earn the privilege to wear the uniform and doesn't have to bear any of the responsibilities that go with wearing it. And some folks that have had to go to bad places and do bad things don't particularly appreciate Jody McFattycakes there parading around in the same uniform because he wants everybody to thank him and give him 10% off.
I think a fine thing to do would be to sentence people like this to actual Ranger or SEAL training with no dropping out allowed.
At any point they screw up, they get dropped back to day one
But then they would have a work ethic and have a generally healthier lifestyle at the end of it, you are supposed to punish people for breaking the law, not rewarding them .
Ouze wrote: I'm not a lawyer but If he asked for and received a veteran/military discount and is not actually a military member or veteran, as seems to be the case, I believe he could and should be prosecuted for fraud under Pennsylvania's criminal code Title 18, Chapter 41 § 4120.
I argued that Stolen Valor was unconstitutional and still believe it was but once you cross the line from playing dress-up to actually getting things to which you are not entitled you have gone too far. As a former member of the Marine Core Seal-Snipers, there is nothing more irritating than fakes like this to me.
You know, i'll happily criticize the military and every government department until the cows come home, and then i'll criticize the cows too. But pretending to be one of the armed forces that puts their lives in danger on behalf of the rest of us is just a low dog act, whether he's getting something free off it or not. I'm not talking about liking wearing camo (some people do it seems) or going to a fancy dress party, impersonating the armed forces is just wrong on a level that i can't begin to express. Especially in this day and age with all the **** blowing up around the world and them having to risk their lives to try and contain it. My 2 cents.
Krellnus wrote: But then they would have a work ethic and have a generally healthier lifestyle at the end of it, you are supposed to punish people for breaking the law, not rewarding them .
Depends on culture. Some places aim to rehabilitate rather than punish. Better to end up with a fixed member of society than give a broken one a vendetta, right?
Question for those in the know. Obviously, anybody can wear a uniform, but can you wear the uniform with regimental/divisional insignia and not be prosecuted? Obviously, claiming benefits fraudulently is a crime but if I were walking around dressed as 5 star general, is it a crime?
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Question for those in the know. Obviously, anybody can wear a uniform, but can you wear the uniform with regimental/divisional insignia and not be prosecuted? Obviously, claiming benefits fraudulently is a crime but if I were walking around dressed as 5 star general, is it a crime?
In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
There was previously special protection afforded to the Medal of Honor, which was then expanded with the Stolen Valor act, all of which was found unconstitutional a few years ago.
On a tangentially related note, it is unlawful to represent yourself as a (civilian) law enforcement officer.
On another tangential note, you mention specifically "regimental/divisional insignia". The US government generally cannot own copyrights to things that were produced by it's employees as part of their duties, so you also could not attempt to prosecute for copyright infringement or similar, if that is what you were thinking with that.
Relapse wrote: I think a fine thing to do would be to sentence people like this to actual Ranger or SEAL training with no dropping out allowed.
At any point they screw up, they get dropped back to day one
It would be a huge waste of resources. Slots for those school are hard to get, especially with the budget cuts. Son2 is competing this week with a few hundred other guys for about 200 ranger school slots for the next cycle. Give some crap bag a permanent slot for RAP week would cut a deserving guy out, and be a strain on the cadre they really don't need.
If we need to punish these crap bags, make them clean bed pans at the VA hospital serving the region they live in.
That was amazing. I'm not even mad you just posted a video and no text. That was awesome.
The Ranger Up guys are fantastic. Great line of military themed shirts and stuff, and they support a lot of various veterans groups/causes. Their animated The Damn Few youtube series is hysterical, the VA hospital episode is great.
Jimsolo wrote: Dressing as an active service member is pretty pathetic. Going to all the trouble of filming and uploading a video of you "getting" someone for doing something mildly sleazy but ultimately harmless is also pretty pathetic.
Stomping on the graves and memories of those who actually have served is anything but "mildly sleazy." These people are the scum of the earth and need to be publicly embarrassed wherever possible.
These types of public callouts are the only thing that keeps these idiots in check, now that Stolen Valor is no longer a thing. For more epic meltdowns, see Don Shipley:
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Question for those in the know. Obviously, anybody can wear a uniform, but can you wear the uniform with regimental/divisional insignia and not be prosecuted? Obviously, claiming benefits fraudulently is a crime but if I were walking around dressed as 5 star general, is it a crime?
In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
There was previously special protection afforded to the Medal of Honor, which was then expanded with the Stolen Valor act, all of which was found unconstitutional a few years ago.
On a tangentially related note, it is unlawful to represent yourself as a (civilian) law enforcement officer.
On another tangential note, you mention specifically "regimental/divisional insignia". The US government generally cannot own copyrights to things that were produced by it's employees as part of their duties, so you also could not attempt to prosecute for copyright infringement or similar, if that is what you were thinking with that.
So my dream of walking around wearing Santa Anna's uniform can become reality? Hurray!
I have a question for the active military and veteran guys on here:
At work I frequently run into veterans who always claim that they were all kind if things especially when they get in trouble. Sometimes it feels like I have met more Rangers than there could ever exist. They cause a scene, they run their mouth, they scream "I was special forces, I could take all of you, I have done some gak". I don't know if they don't realize that we can look up their service record and see what they actually did, but it's just weird. And the fake "I'm special forces" card gets pulled for stupid stuff: "I should get to cut in line and be seen first because I'm special forces", "I should get to scream and curse because I'm special forces".
These are not fake military guys, these are actual real veterans who do this crap. It just always baffles me to see them do that. But I was wondering how you guys felt about folks like that. Is it worse if a civilian tries to pass himself off as military or is it worse if a veteran makes up these stories?
Not trying to play the two sides against each other, but I always think "dude, you served and that's great, you made it back and many didn't, but quit bullshitting everyone".
d-usa wrote: I have a question for the active military and veteran guys on here:
At work I frequently run into veterans who always claim that they were all kind if things especially when they get in trouble. Sometimes it feels like I have met more Rangers than there could ever exist. They cause a scene, they run their mouth, they scream "I was special forces, I could take all of you, I have done some gak". I don't know if they don't realize that we can look up their service record and see what they actually did, but it's just weird. And the fake "I'm special forces" card gets pulled for stupid stuff: "I should get to cut in line and be seen first because I'm special forces", "I should get to scream and curse because I'm special forces".
These are not fake military guys, these are actual real veterans who do this crap. It just always baffles me to see them do that. But I was wondering how you guys felt about folks like that. Is it worse if a civilian tries to pass himself off as military or is it worse if a veteran makes up these stories?
Not trying to play the two sides against each other, but I always think "dude, you served and that's great, you made it back and many didn't, but quit bullshitting everyone".
Don't know and can't speak for everyone but I presume it is a case of some people simply wanting to exaggerate the danger to make themselves look/sound a bit more glamorous.
Saying that 'I went to Afghanistan and shot 1000 Taliban' sounds a lot better than 'I went to Afghanistan and was a spud jockey/pencil pusher' I guess.
Personally, I can live with it - I was a REMF and proud. My laundry went further forward than I did. The only danger I was ever in was from the RAF regiment firing in the wrong direction or a stray mortar/rocket from the locals and they were a worse shot than I was.
Jimsolo wrote: Dressing as an active service member is pretty pathetic. Going to all the trouble of filming and uploading a video of you "getting" someone for doing something mildly sleazy but ultimately harmless is also pretty pathetic.
/thread
Wearing a uniform you are not entitled to wear could reasonably cause offense to those who are entitled to it.
Fake veterans should get outed.
This is a principle not a dogma, so its doesn't include actors, re-enactors, educational uses or fancy dress parties etc.
But if the guy in the video wants to large it up to kids in shopping centres he should have served a tour.
d-usa wrote: I have a question for the active military and veteran guys on here:
At work I frequently run into veterans who always claim that they were all kind if things especially when they get in trouble. Sometimes it feels like I have met more Rangers than there could ever exist. They cause a scene, they run their mouth, they scream "I was special forces, I could take all of you, I have done some gak". I don't know if they don't realize that we can look up their service record and see what they actually did, but it's just weird. And the fake "I'm special forces" card gets pulled for stupid stuff: "I should get to cut in line and be seen first because I'm special forces", "I should get to scream and curse because I'm special forces".
These are not fake military guys, these are actual real veterans who do this crap. It just always baffles me to see them do that. But I was wondering how you guys felt about folks like that. Is it worse if a civilian tries to pass himself off as military or is it worse if a veteran makes up these stories?
Not trying to play the two sides against each other, but I always think "dude, you served and that's great, you made it back and many didn't, but quit bullshitting everyone".
IMHO, civilians acting are 10x worse.
Thing with us vets is, our stories are like fish stories. The "fish" gets bigger depending on who we're talking to, and how many times we've told the story.
I don't like it when guys try to use their former rank or supposed position (SF, Ranger, etc.) in the military to, as you say, "cut in line" or what have you, but if the guy actually served, and is entitled to the services he/she is receiving then I don't really see the harm in drumming up his/her own stories.
d-usa wrote: I have a question for the active military and veteran guys on here:
At work I frequently run into veterans who always claim that they were all kind if things especially when they get in trouble. Sometimes it feels like I have met more Rangers than there could ever exist. They cause a scene, they run their mouth, they scream "I was special forces, I could take all of you, I have done some gak". I don't know if they don't realize that we can look up their service record and see what they actually did, but it's just weird. And the fake "I'm special forces" card gets pulled for stupid stuff: "I should get to cut in line and be seen first because I'm special forces", "I should get to scream and curse because I'm special forces".
These are not fake military guys, these are actual real veterans who do this crap. It just always baffles me to see them do that. But I was wondering how you guys felt about folks like that. Is it worse if a civilian tries to pass himself off as military or is it worse if a veteran makes up these stories?
Not trying to play the two sides against each other, but I always think "dude, you served and that's great, you made it back and many didn't, but quit bullshitting everyone".
Heh, don't underestimate the stupidity of soldiers, either...they're still people. A bud of mine, after a unit transfer to Hawaii, was busted for 'adjusting' his awards on...whatever...paperwork the Army lists it on. His wife told mine that. Also, there was a lot of BS after the 82d dropped in to say 'Hi' to Noriega in '89. Multiple REMFs who had pull had bumped slots for the combat jump so they could get their 'mustard stain'....(gold/yellow combat jump star). Careers were flatlined for that stunt.
So, that's active duty shenanigans, where the stakes are higher. Claiming to have killed 56 NVA and only being 32 years old has little downside and mostly an upside in civilian land.
Another thing I was thinking...back when I was in the 82d, the only...only!...time I ever wore my uniform not on duty was to visit my mother at her work. It was a retirement home, and I thought the WW2 vets would get a kick out of seeing a 'cherry' in dress greens. (The nurses oggling me was a pleasant bonus.)
Edit: Someone mentioned something about soldiers letting themselves go when not actively working? I know that happens...(I weighed between 175lb and 240lb throughout my enlistment)...but nothing short a glandular condition would explain the dough boy in that video. My weight gain was from muscle, not meatball sundaes. I think the most I ever gained from a two weeks' leave was 5ish pounds.
Edit: Someone mentioned something about soldiers letting themselves go when not actively working? I know that happens...(I weighed between 175lb and 240lb throughout my enlistment)...but nothing short a glandular condition would explain the dough boy in that video. My weight gain was from muscle, not meatball sundaes. I think the most I ever gained from a two weeks' leave was 5ish pounds.
You're making the mistake of assuming that turd was in in the first place (I'm sorry, but he's to soft in my eyes to have EVER served)
Now, since I've been out, yeah, I've put on about 10lbs. of pure fast food goodness... For all my excuses to why I haven't kept up working out, I do have a plan in place to get back on the ball (rugby season is just around the corner again), but I do know plenty of guys/gals who do just simply "let it go" and never see a gym after they're out, except when they're driving by one.
My work deals 100% with veterans, so having guys lie to try to get preferential treatment over every other vet there just seems like an extra slap in the face to their fellow veterans. So I didn't know how actual vets felt about it.
d-usa wrote: My work deals 100% with veterans, so having guys lie to try to get preferential treatment over every other vet there just seems like an extra slap in the face to their fellow veterans. So I didn't know how actual vets felt about it.
It would annoy me. Integrity is supposed to mean something. Embellishing stories is one thing, out right lying about something like having been SF or ranger qualified is wrong, especially if the purpose is to screw your fellow vet.
Edit: Someone mentioned something about soldiers letting themselves go when not actively working? I know that happens...(I weighed between 175lb and 240lb throughout my enlistment)...but nothing short a glandular condition would explain the dough boy in that video. My weight gain was from muscle, not meatball sundaes. I think the most I ever gained from a two weeks' leave was 5ish pounds.
You're making the mistake of assuming that turd was in in the first place (I'm sorry, but he's to soft in my eyes to have EVER served)
No, I'm not...I was saying even assuming the impossible(that fatty here was 'on a break'), he couldn't balloon that fast. (Although, possibly worded poorly.)I never doubted he's a fraud.
Rangers, in my experience, tend to be short, sinewy/scrawny, and arrogant. It's not a perfect litmus test, but chubby here fails on all counts. That his seamstress(mommy...) sewed his patches all willy nilly is just the nail in the coffin. (Not for me, though....I'm from the woodland BDU era. I couldn't say what patches go where anymore personally!)
d-usa wrote: My work deals 100% with veterans, so having guys lie to try to get preferential treatment over every other vet there just seems like an extra slap in the face to their fellow veterans. So I didn't know how actual vets felt about it.
It would annoy me. Integrity is supposed to mean something. Embellishing stories is one thing, out right lying about something like having been SF or ranger qualified is wrong, especially if the purpose is to screw your fellow vet.
Agreed.
I tend to downplay stuff, myself. My brother as well. Heck, I'm unashamed to say I volunteered for RIP(Ranger Indoctrination Program) but backed out when I saw them doing PT. Fireman carrying someone full sprint up a steep hill? Screw that!
I tend to downplay stuff, myself. My brother as well. Heck, I'm unashamed to say I volunteered for RIP(Ranger Indoctrination Program) but backed out when I saw them doing PT. Fireman carrying someone full sprint up a steep hill? Screw that!
C'mon admit what it really was.... You didn't want to wear "Ranger panties"
As for drama at the VA, I'm basically with CptJake on this one. I was pointing out the tendency for many of our stories to become "fish stories", which is OK. Well, really, it's OK up until the point you are trying to use that for preferrential treatment, or to screw over a fellow vet. It is, to me, along the same lines as that Lt. Col's wife saying that she's a LTC at the commissary in an attempt to move ahead of people in line (or, at Ft. Campbell, when Commissary employees check for rank on spouse ID cards to move them up in line... Yeah, I went on a mini tirade at the manager for that crap)
About half of our fake "special forces" guys are trying to get some special treatment, the other half are drunk guys that the local PD drops off and who try to get into a fight with us and our VAPD guys.
Every now and then our drunk guys running their mouth results in fun stories though (I might mess up ranks and titles here since I was never military, so bear with me):
Like I said, our local PD will often drop off drunk veterans at our hospital. It's less paperwork for the officer than taking them in, and if the vet doesn't have a record they try to cut them a break and bringing them to us to sober up doesn't leave a mark on their record. Most of the guys that show up don't cause a scene and just go to sleep, happy for the break they got. Every now and then somebody tries to cause problems and then our police has to step in. Pretty much all our cops are veterans themselves and some of them still in the guard.
Local PD brings in a drunk guy who decides to push the limits and our cops get called to help us out. He acted stupid for a couple more minutes but then our officers are able to talk him down and he behaves. Turns out he is in the national guard and is getting ready to deploy in a couple of weeks so that's why he was blowing off steam. Our cops make small talk and get on the topic of his MOS and what unit he is with. Guy just continues to make small talk and then says something to the effect of "we are getting a new CO" or "we are getting a new CPT" and then just starts talking gak about him. Not sure exactly what he said since I didn't get the details until the cops took a break and came to the nurse's station to share the story with me.
Officer A is just trying to keep his gak together since the guy can see him and tells me that the guy is just running his mouth talking all kind of gak about what a giant douche his new CPT is supposed to be. Officer B is just standing next to him stone faced as Officer A explains to me that Officer B is in fact this guys new CPT who will deploy with his unit.
It was just pure gold to watch Officer A talk to the guy for the next couple of hours asking him all kinds of questions and trying to get him to talk more gak about Captain Officer B.
I would have loved to see drunk guys face when everything came together the day he actually met his new CPT.
Jimsolo wrote: Dressing as an active service member is pretty pathetic. Going to all the trouble of filming and uploading a video of you "getting" someone for doing something mildly sleazy but ultimately harmless is also pretty pathetic.
If I recall correctly he was trying to derive financial benefit from wearing the uniform in the form of discounts, which while not entirely harmless, is pretty innocuous.
However, he didn't earn the privilege to wear the uniform and doesn't have to bear any of the responsibilities that go with wearing it. And some folks that have had to go to bad places and do bad things don't particularly appreciate Jody McFattycakes there parading around in the same uniform because he wants everybody to thank him and give him 10% off.
IAmTheWalrus - Good reply. The reason why these incidents are filmed is because it gets the word out that this man is an imposter and will be posted on the Stolen Valor website. This stops these imposters from wearing the uniforms. http://guardianofvalor.com/hall-of-shame/
I'm all for public shaming of frauds like this.
I never believed in it, but when men and women come under fire together, they really do form a tighter bond that is difficult to explain. I feel a bond with soldiers of the past as well, such as my grandfather. We never understood each other until I returned home from Iraq. He was in the heart of Operation Overlord in WWII and we shared stories like equals for the first time.
People like this turd in the video are a disgrace and deserve worse than public embarrassment.
I think the most damning thing about the fake ranger, besides the lousy inform standard and physical conditioning, is that he feels the need to stay and be interrogated and to defend himself.
Surely a genuine veteran would have the self confidence to just blow them off and say "Feth you, I've served in Afghanistan and seen combat, I don't need to prove myself to you. Now get out of my way".
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Surely a genuine veteran would have the self confidence to just blow them off and say "Feth you, I've served in Afghanistan and seen combat, I don't need to prove myself to you. Now get out of my way".
Americans always seem super polite though in these videos, I find it hard to tell. Even the guy doing the calling out opens with "excuse me sir".
So far as a "calling out" goes, it was bit meh. "Where's your tan t-shirt underneath?" *dude pulls out a tan t-shirt*. According to the youtube comments this guy has been checked out and is a faker, but knowing little about the US military I'm not really sure what's going on. I just see two guys disagreeing about badges.
The dude does seem quite meek though, I can't imagine him ordering people around. My father was a corporal in the RAF, and I got the impression that he'd had some kind of special training in shouting at people and scaring the crap out of them.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Surely a genuine veteran would have the self confidence to just blow them off and say "Feth you, I've served in Afghanistan and seen combat, I don't need to prove myself to you. Now get out of my way".
Americans always seem super polite though in these videos, I find it hard to tell. Even the guy doing the calling out opens with "excuse me sir".
So far as a "calling out" goes, it was bit meh. "Where's your tan t-shirt underneath?" *dude pulls out a tan t-shirt*. According to the youtube comments this guy has been checked out and is a faker, but knowing little about the US military I'm not really sure what's going on. I just see two guys disagreeing about badges.
The dude does seem quite meek though, I can't imagine him ordering people around. My father was a corporal in the RAF, and I got the impression that he'd had some kind of special training in shouting at people and scaring the crap out of them.
My local Dairy Queen gives a 25% military discount. Of course if I were to regularly take advantage of that I would look like the fat Not-A-Ranger from the video.
Wait a minute, I already look like that after the Thanksgiving food fest!
Da Boss wrote: I think it's pretty weird that the military get discounts anyway, but seems like a very american thing!
I reckon someone like that is pretty sad, really. It's like playing pretend taken too far.
UK service personnel get all sorts of discounts on presentation of a military ID card. You get discounts (or at least, used to) at Burger King, Millets and the Sea Life Centre (well, the one in Portsmouth gave me a discount anyway) to name a few.
A Combat Infantryman badge with three gold star's.........so stupid
Edit
DENVER, CO — The Phony Veterans of Foreign Wars, the nation’s leading military fakers’ organization — representing fake members from all service branches — has gone on the offensive in the fight against military bloggers.
PVFW fired back with a public relations offensive, speaking with reporters and establishing a password-protected blog on their website devoted to peer-reviewed development of members’ stories of their superhuman valor and heroism.
“Because of these milbloggers’ relentless assault on our First Amendment-protected right to lie about brief, unglamorous or nonexistent military service,” PVFW chairman Michael Spurwick told reporters, “several of our members have suffered irreparable damage to their reputations, and a few have even had their businesses and careers ruined, after being exposed as frauds. Something had to be done.”
Spurwick, a former Army sergeant, who was promoted to General before retiring as a Captain, has a long and impressive career of made-up military service.
“We lost a lot of good men out there,” Spurwick said. “I don’t really like to talk about it.”
Born in 1965, he’s a veteran of every U.S. military action since his birth, from the Vietnam War to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Boasting unearned Special Forces and Ranger tabs, Spurwick served with both Delta Force and the Rangers during Operation Gothic Serpent in Mogadishu, Somalia. He’s participated in every combat parachute jump since 1967, when, at just fifteen months of age, he parachuted into North Vietnam with the 173rd Airborne during Operation Junction City — as well as a top-secret high altitude, high opening jump from the International Space Station during OEF VI and a LANO (low-altitude, no-opening) jump from a B-1 bomber during OIF V.
[Editor’s note: According to Spurwick’s DD214, obtained by this News Source through a FOIA request, he was discharged from the Army in 1986 during basic training at Fort Sill, Okla., as an E-2.]
Such astonishing derring-do is commonplace among the PVFW’s members, with most having war records that would put Audie Murphy or Chesty Puller to shame.
One such member is Nick Androsky, a former Air Force C-130 loadmaster who was court-martialed for drug use, demoted from E-3 to E-1, and given a bad-conduct discharge.
He gained notoriety in PVFW circles when he arrived at an Army infantry basic-training graduation ceremony wearing an Air Force dress uniform, sporting master sergeant’s stripes, a ribbon rack with over 40 medals, master pilot’s wings, an Army Combat Infantryman Badge with two stars, and a number of other badges.
Completing the look was a green beret and a pair of desert-tan boots.
Androsky was outed by This Ain’t Hell — with the military blog dubbing him “Master Sergeant Soup Sandwich.”
“We live for this,” said TAH editor and actual retired Army combat infantryman Jonn Lilyea. “We’re sending a message that if you steal valor, we’re gonna catch you and publicly shame you like the douche-nozzle that you are.”
Lilyea and other milbloggers, in Spurwick’s opinion, are little more than “high-tech bullies.”
“They take sadistic pleasure in trying to ruin our lives with their endless FOIA witch-hunts and bloody-shirt DD214-waving,” Spurwick said, “just because we don’t fit their narrow, exclusionary definitions of military service.”
The PVFW blog’s primary purpose is to help its members with no actual military background, who are most vulnerable to damaging attacks from the milbloggers:
“Without any firsthand experience using authentic-sounding military lingo or properly wearing a uniform, they don’t know how to craft a persona that strikes that delicate balance of being ultra-awesome and yet still believable, without setting off the B.S.-meters of real veterans,” says Spurwick. “Here, they can get pointers and counter-counter-fakery tips from the guys who have plenty of time in fake-service. One trick I recommend if you’re about to get busted is to claim your records were classified ‘above top secret’ or lost in a fire. If all else fails, threaten to sue. That usually works.”
Military fakery is a high-stakes game, says Spurwick: “A reputation that takes years to fabricate can be destroyed in a minute by one milblog post.”
Krellnus wrote: But then they would have a work ethic and have a generally healthier lifestyle at the end of it, you are supposed to punish people for breaking the law, not rewarding them .
Punishment on its own is pointless. The goal should be rehabilitation.
Rehabilitation without punishment provides no incentive for a person to change and cooperate with said Rehabilitation. Which is something that we see in the UK quite a lot.
I've found some folks are just crap bags, and will always be crap bags. You can expend resources forever in an effort to rehabilitate them, and all you are really doing is trying to make yourself feel 'good' because you are not gonna change them.
Punishment may not be everything or even the most important thing, but it is important and I think calling it pointless on its own is just silly. Context and situation may make punishment on its own the best solution. Say fines as a punishment for illegal parking. Would you rather a fine coupled with a class or counseling to rehabilitate the offender? That would generally be a huge waste of resources, because the punishment alone (and sometimes just the threat there of) influences the desired behavior.
I've known folks more scared of 'getting caught' than scared of 'doing the wrong thing' and who when caught are sorry there were caught, but not really sorry for the action.
Well, they sort of need it. Members of the military get pretty poor pay when starting out - like, qualified for food stamps/WIC level.
Depending on duty stations, that CAN continue all the way through E-5 or even E-6.... Though you don't typically hear of or see an E-6 on food stamps or that sort of assistance, as they've become "used to" the military lifestyle and have adjusted their living standards accordingly.
Discounts for uniforms aren't that uncommon over here either. I recall receiving a bit off in the small shopping center outside my garrison while doing my mandatory service, for example. And many gas station bars offer a discount to police officers and security guards on food, maybe just to make them more likely to stop there.
No idea about using a military uniform without permission, but the documents detailing use always call it a "right" or "duty" to use one. The only non-santioned use I've heard of is people trying to collect money for veterans by posing as a serviceman, so fraud.
The other two I know to be regulated. It's a crime to pass yourself off as a guard when not (or not on duty). And the only legal use for a police uniform is on a policeman - even theaters or TV/film productions have to have permission, though it's usually granted autmatically.
No disrespect meant, but I don't see any particular reason for service members to get discounts that other public servants don't get.
Being in the army is a job, like any other in the public service.
If teachers, police, prison officers and social workers don't get discounts, I don't see a reason to give soldiers one.
Shame about the pay, though. When my brother was in the Royal Marines he said that he could have made more money working at McDonalds. But these days, without any kind of compulsory military service, I figure that was his choice. He could have chosen to do something else.
No disrespect, but there are reasons to give a discount. A store near a base giving a discount will get more business than a competitor who does not. In some places it increases even non-military business as the local community see themselves as strong supporters and frequent businesses which they see as supporting 'their' troops.
I used to get a discount at a few places when I worked EMS and volunteered with the fire department. It wasn't all that much, maybe 5% off something or a free drink with your sandwich, but it was always appreciated.
My thoughts about discount were always best summed up by our chief:
1) You never ask if they have a discount.
2) You never ask "why didn't I get my discount" even if you got it the last 10 times you ordered something there.
3) You say thank you every single time even if it is the 10th time you got the discount from that same person.
US Military is one of the things that America feel proud of.
Veteran Day Discount
4th July Discount
Memorial Day Discount
with vaild ID
There's also vehicle dealership that offer 1K discount off vehicles if your a active member of USAA
Navy Federal Credit Union is geared towards the military
Jihadin wrote: US Military is one of the things that America feel proud of.
Veteran Day Discount
4th July Discount
Memorial Day Discount
with vaild ID
There's also vehicle dealership that offer 1K discount off vehicles if your a active member of USAA
Navy Federal Credit Union is geared towards the military
I can go on and on
Germany military though suffers a stigma
Hell, it is codified into law. Veterans are eligible for for VA loans those who have not served cannot get.
Jihadin wrote: US Military is one of the things that America feel proud of.
Veteran Day Discount
4th July Discount
Memorial Day Discount
with vaild ID
There's also vehicle dealership that offer 1K discount off vehicles if your a active member of USAA
Navy Federal Credit Union is geared towards the military
I can go on and on
Germany military though suffers a stigma
Hell, it is codified into law. Veterans are eligible for for VA loans those who have not served cannot get.
Well, the Germans have a complex history with their military, especially East Germans. Mind blowing what went on out there, and fascinating.
I'm not German though, I'm Irish. We're neutral, and I guess some of us get a different perspective on military force given the excesses of the British forces in the North at times. I find the adulation of soldiers pretty weird. To me, they're people doing a job that is important, but very sad. I respect them as much as I do the police and firefighters and others who put their lives on the line, but I do get tired of hearing "I'm a vet" as a sort of catch all answer to all questions.
I mean, I think things like this faker we're discussing only really come up because of the extreme adulation that the military gets in the US. (I keep saying US, though apparently it's the same elsewhere. I got some pretty hefty vitriol for my lack of support of the Poppy appeal in my workplace).
Also, in quite a few of the places I've lived, some small businesses put up a sign outlining their "military" discount that included police, fire/ems and teachers.
There are definitely some professions outside of just the military that I think, in the US, should get the same discount for shopping at various places. Typically, police, fire and especially teachers don't make the greatest money out there, and can often use the "help".
About the discounts: Turns out my impression was pretty wrong. It's pretty cool that businesses give discounts like that to a wide range of people. I think that's something really positive that deserves major kudos.
On the asshat in question: That is really pathetic. I doubt anything we do to him would really make his life significantly worse than what it must already be for him to stoop to that for validation.
sauhwq wrote: I also think a fine thing to do would be to sentence people like this to actual Ranger or SEAL training with no dropping out allowed.
Not an original idea.
Relapse wrote: I think a fine thing to do would be to sentence people like this to actual Ranger or SEAL training with no dropping out allowed.
At any point they screw up, they get dropped back to day one
And as I said before:
It would be a huge waste of resources. Slots for those school are hard to get, especially with the budget cuts. Son2 is competing this week with a few hundred other guys for about 200 ranger school slots for the next cycle. Giving some crap bag a permanent slot for RAP week would cut a deserving guy out, and be a strain on the cadre they really don't need.
If we need to punish these crap bags, make them clean bed pans at the VA hospital serving the region they live in.
Da Boss wrote: I doubt anything we do to him would really make his life significantly worse than what it must already be for him to stoop to that for validation.
Whatever we do or don't do to a guy that makes up stories like this it will always be someone else's fault than his. Someone who lies like this in public is usually so used to it that he believes his own stories, or at least believes he has a really good reason to keep telling them. Such as "those guys" trying to put him down out of pure spite!
We had one of those at my job once. He'd ignore his duties and when called on it adamantly claim he'd handled them - someone else must have been there later and undone everything. He'd tell stories about previous jobs and future plans that maybe sounded reasonable at first but unraveled once you had time to think about them for a moment. Such as studying Spanish because he was planning to take a job as harbor diver in Spain... Knowing the language is good, sure. Except he didn't manage even common greetings when someone that knew Spanish tried some on him. And his physique was closer to the veteran impersonator up there than a well-trained diver.
I think the whole stolen valor thing is beyond scummy, but these videos aint that much better. Im waiting for the day that someone posts a valor shaming video and the guy turns out to actually be a vet (and not like that dude who was in the navy and pretneded to be in the marines instead, I mean actually telling the truth who he is.
If I had to take a guess, Id say itd be an AF TACP, nobody knows about them, they wear air force uniforms with a black beret and army patches, and are also probably more badass than most people can believe.
Ouze wrote: As a former member of the Marine Core Seal-Snipers, there is nothing more irritating than fakes like this to me.
Im pretty sure Im the first to have noticed that over these three pages lol
chaos0xomega wrote: I think the whole stolen valor thing is beyond scummy, but these videos aint that much better. Im waiting for the day that someone posts a valor shaming video and the guy turns out to actually be a vet (and not like that dude who was in the navy and pretneded to be in the marines instead, I mean actually telling the truth who he is.
If I had to take a guess, Id say itd be an AF TACP, nobody knows about them, they wear air force uniforms with a black beret and army patches, and are also probably more badass than most people can believe.
Ouze wrote: As a former member of the Marine Core Seal-Snipers, there is nothing more irritating than fakes like this to me.
Im pretty sure Im the first to have noticed that over these three pages lol
I don't think AF TACPs or PJs (or any Air Force member) can wear Army patches, except qualification badges they earn (like a Ranger tab or Airborne wings).
d-usa wrote: I used to get a discount at a few places when I worked EMS and volunteered with the fire department. It wasn't all that much, maybe 5% off something or a free drink with your sandwich, but it was always appreciated.
My thoughts about discount were always best summed up by our chief:
1) You never ask if they have a discount.
2) You never ask "why didn't I get my discount" even if you got it the last 10 times you ordered something there.
3) You say thank you every single time even if it is the 10th time you got the discount from that same person.
That is IMO the proper attitude towards those kinds of discounts .
I don't think AF TACPs or PJs (or any Air Force member) can wear Army patches, except qualification badges they earn (like a Ranger tab or Airborne wings).
I think there may be some exceptions to that rule, as I seem to recall most of the TACPs around Campbell wearing 101 patches while they were there. But, I also seem to recall that, in the field with an army unit, they're wearing army ACUs with the only difference being instead of "US ARMY" tag, it's "US AF" tag.
It could be one of those things where, while you're there, a TACP can wear the patch, but once they leave, they have to go back to AF standards. But, I could be wrong on that one, as I only played rugby with like 3 TACPs at Campbell, and never really did anything work related with them
The patch thing varies, by regulation its not really supposed to be done, but its one of those things that some TACPs/units overlook, and most people outside of the community dont know the regs on, and if they do, they dont have the balls to challenge them on. I met a TSgt once that had his ranger tab sewn on to his dress blues (which I think is a no-no no matter what unit youre with), a MSgt called him out on it, his response was "Well, what are WE going to do about that?" The MSgt dropped it and walked away lol.
By regs though I believe wbile youre attached to the army unit youre supporting you can wear their patches and CIB/spurs (if youve earned em) but when youre back at your home squadron you go back to being air force standard.
I don't think AF TACPs or PJs (or any Air Force member) can wear Army patches, except qualification badges they earn (like a Ranger tab or Airborne wings).
I think there may be some exceptions to that rule, as I seem to recall most of the TACPs around Campbell wearing 101 patches while they were there. But, I also seem to recall that, in the field with an army unit, they're wearing army ACUs with the only difference being instead of "US ARMY" tag, it's "US AF" tag.
It could be one of those things where, while you're there, a TACP can wear the patch, but once they leave, they have to go back to AF standards. But, I could be wrong on that one, as I only played rugby with like 3 TACPs at Campbell, and never really did anything work related with them
Yep, further research shows they can wear the organizational patch of the unit they are supporting (attached to).
Fairly sure I've mentioned this before, but the whole 'I'm gonna go to the mall and tool around in my uniform' thing is so weird to me. I was OCONUS for pretty much my entire military career, so maybe things are different in the states - but we couldn't wait to get out of our duty uniforms.
Wandering the mall in uniform is for Nasty Girls and guys straight out of basic.
d-usa wrote: I have a question for the active military and veteran guys on here:
At work I frequently run into veterans who always claim that they were all kind if things especially when they get in trouble. Sometimes it feels like I have met more Rangers than there could ever exist. They cause a scene, they run their mouth, they scream "I was special forces, I could take all of you, I have done some gak". I don't know if they don't realize that we can look up their service record and see what they actually did, but it's just weird. And the fake "I'm special forces" card gets pulled for stupid stuff: "I should get to cut in line and be seen first because I'm special forces", "I should get to scream and curse because I'm special forces".
These are not fake military guys, these are actual real veterans who do this crap. It just always baffles me to see them do that. But I was wondering how you guys felt about folks like that. Is it worse if a civilian tries to pass himself off as military or is it worse if a veteran makes up these stories?
Not trying to play the two sides against each other, but I always think "dude, you served and that's great, you made it back and many didn't, but quit bullshitting everyone".
IMHO, civilians acting are 10x worse.
Thing with us vets is, our stories are like fish stories. The "fish" gets bigger depending on who we're talking to, and how many times we've told the story.
I don't like it when guys try to use their former rank or supposed position (SF, Ranger, etc.) in the military to, as you say, "cut in line" or what have you, but if the guy actually served, and is entitled to the services he/she is receiving then I don't really see the harm in drumming up his/her own stories.
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I love that people take the time to point out fakes and put them on the internet. Why not? I dont see how people think it's sleazy or pathetic. It's making sure to show that people DO care about fakes. after the video goes online, and goes viral, which most of the veteran fakes videos do, the person will more than likely be called out more and more.
yeah lol... off duty/off base every member I know keeps a low profile for the most part.
nothing sucks more then being in camo fatigues and having people asking you about :"the sheet" or the front lines or whatever.
and then having to tell them you dont know, you just fix the worlds cruddiest jeeps and do lots of PT
was acquainted with a local sheriff a while back, actively hid the fact he was LEO for a while, cause honestly, hes just tired of the same conversation/questions every time, or worse, having to deal with FOTM SJW's who get uppity with him
Around most of the CONUS bases I've been at you see troops in uniform at local chow places for lunch, and at Wal-Mart or the grocery store or what ever as they pick up stuff on the way home after work quite a bit.
Ive only ever seen Soldiers out and about in uniform, I onow the Marines, and I believe the Navy are expressly forbidden from doing that (unless its a sporting event etc), and I believe AF might be but Im not positive on that (I know as a cadet it was verboten, but cadetland is cadetland)
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited
Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited
Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
That's just the costume department not doing their due diligence.
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
That's just the costume department not doing their due diligence.
Jihadin's actually correct on this one. Movie productions(at least in the US) aren't, by law, allowed to use accurate and full uniforms.
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited
Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
That's just the costume department not doing their due diligence.
Jihadin's actually correct on this one. Movie productions(at least in the US) aren't, by law, allowed to use accurate and full uniforms.
No, that's not true. It's a rumor I've heard a lot of people repeat, but it's false.
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
That's just the costume department not doing their due diligence.
Jihadin's actually correct on this one. Movie productions(at least in the US) aren't, by law, allowed to use accurate and full uniforms.
No, that's not true. It's a rumor I've heard a lot of people repeat, but it's false.
If it's a rumor, it's one perpetuated by the movie industry and the military. I've heard it multiple times from military personnel who've worked in and on movies.
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited
Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
That's just the costume department not doing their due diligence.
Jihadin's actually correct on this one. Movie productions(at least in the US) aren't, by law, allowed to use accurate and full uniforms.
No, that's not true. It's a rumor I've heard a lot of people repeat, but it's false.
If it's a rumor, it's one perpetuated by the movie industry and the military. I've heard it multiple times from military personnel who've worked in and on movies.
I've heard it a bunch of times as well, and it's wrong. Check my edit, I posted the US legal code involving it. Hollywood just tends to often jack up uniforms in some way, and because of that people have started assuming it's because they "have" to, but that's wrong.
Ouze wrote: In the US it is lawful to wear the uniform, rank, and awards of any branch of the armed forces and even to to represent yourself as the same. If you want to pretend to be a Brigadier General or one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, you're free to do so unless you attempt to gain something of tangible value from doing so.
It's not technically legally allowed, but doing so is not a criminal offense:
10 USC § 771 - Unauthorized wearing prohibited Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may wear— (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps.
Why those actor in uniform are so out of reg's for a purpose
That's just the costume department not doing their due diligence.
Jihadin's actually correct on this one. Movie productions(at least in the US) aren't, by law, allowed to use accurate and full uniforms.
No, that's not true. It's a rumor I've heard a lot of people repeat, but it's false.
If it's a rumor, it's one perpetuated by the movie industry and the military. I've heard it multiple times from military personnel who've worked in and on movies.
I've heard it a bunch of times as well, and it's wrong. Check my edit, I posted the US legal code involving it. Hollywood just tends to often jack up uniforms in some way, and because of that people have started assuming it's because they "have" to, but that's wrong.
Yeah, I saw it, you posted before I could address it.
Looking into it, the Supreme Court also ruled that the "does not discredit" part impedes their First Amendment right. Interesting to know.
2. The words "if the portrayal does not tend to discredit that armed force" in 772 (f) impose an unconstitutional restraint on freedom of speech and must be stricken from the section to preserve its constitutionality. Pp. 62-63.
They don't have to follow that law, but I imagine that the military doesn't have to work with any studio either. So I guess that there is some "enforcement" of the law that way...
d-usa wrote: They don't have to follow that law, but I imagine that the military doesn't have to work with any studio either. So I guess that there is some "enforcement" of the law that way...
It'd be easy to look up the regulations or get a prior service member to be a consultant though. The only reason Hollywood messes it up is because they don't put the time or the work in to do it right.
In dress uniforms of military branches the Order of Precedence" of ribbons are wrong In Field Uniforms its something that a actual NCO would harp on to another soldier
Jihadin wrote: In dress uniforms of military branches the Order of Precedence" of ribbons are wrong In Field Uniforms its something that a actual NCO would harp on to another soldier
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Back in the day when I was a victorious soldier in Task Force Smith in my capacity as CaptainSgt. I turned back those russian T34's with a Bazooka....
I actually really like Heartbreak Ridge, but there are more problems with it than the uniforms. A career Marine who won the Medal of Honor but can't get promoted past Gunnery Sergeant? Yeah, okay.
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Back in the day when I was a victorious soldier in Task Force Smith in my capacity as CaptainSgt. I turned back those russian T34's with a Bazooka....
Puss. I used a bayonet with a broken tip and well packed snow balls.
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Back in the day when I was a victorious soldier in Task Force Smith in my capacity as CaptainSgt. I turned back those russian T34's with a Bazooka....
Puss. I used a bayonet with a broken tip and well packed snow balls.
Real men use sharpened e-tools. Lot easier to get back.
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Back in the day when I was a victorious soldier in Task Force Smith in my capacity as CaptainSgt. I turned back those russian T34's with a Bazooka....
Puss. I used a bayonet with a broken tip and well packed snow balls.
Real men use sharpened e-tools. Lot easier to get back.
Should have gone with the classic "et-tool". I heard that so many times and just....why. Why.
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Back in the day when I was a victorious soldier in Task Force Smith in my capacity as CaptainSgt. I turned back those russian T34's with a Bazooka....
Puss. I used a bayonet with a broken tip and well packed snow balls.
Real men use sharpened e-tools. Lot easier to get back.
So they teach Army Rangers these days to walk around shopping malls and make smart phone videos to post on YouTube so they can get lots of hits...maybe get on Bill O'Reilley for an interview?
Growing up in a military family I have nothing but the utmost respect for the members of the armed forces. And one of the things that angers me most are people who disrespect them
I don't know. Seeking fame by way of embarrassing people wasn't part of my military training.
The guy who made this video, tailor made to make himself out to be a hero or something, is a douche. The the guy playing soldier may have serious mental health issues, for all we know.
jasper76 wrote: I don't know. Seeking fame by way of embarrassing people wasn't part of my military training.
The guy who made this video, tailor made to make himself out to be a hero or something, is a douche. The the guy playing soldier may have serious mental health issues, for all we know.
jasper76 wrote: I don't know. Seeking fame by way of embarrassing people wasn't part of my military training.
The guy who made this video, tailor made to make himself out to be a hero or something, is a douche. The the guy playing soldier may have serious mental health issues, for all we know.
the shrouded lord wrote: no. that's quite simply wrong. the guy who made the video wants this guy shamed, not fame or whatever. and honesty, I strongly agree with him.
Yes, because shaming people is a noble passtime.
It should immediately occur to you that the subject of the video may have incredibly low self esteem, and is trying to get some positive attention by exploiting our country's largely irrational worship of military personnel...in other words, this guy might need help, not ridicule.
IMO, this is internet bullying plain and simple. Whoever posted this video should do some soul searching as to why he felt the need to do so.
Flag a No Go in placement. Suppose to be on Pocket Flap
missing one additional tab
The top badge is a Combat Infantry Badge. Yetman badge indicated three awards
major issue here. Convo is best description on earning a Combat Infantry Badge
Yetman’s uniform has three CIBs, or Combat Infantry Badges. Initially he tells the veteran he received all three of his CIBs in Afghanistan.
“You know you need to be in three different campaigns to get three CIBs, right?” Berk says.
Yetman then changed his answer, saying he received one CIB each during two tours to Afghanistan and another from a stint in Iraq.
“You know, no matter how many [tours] you do, you can only get one,” says Berk.
So I sucked it up and watched the whole thing (it's difficult for me to watch people bully other people as it makes me quite angry). It's noteworthy that even the guys wife or girlfriend recognizes he's being a douchebag and a bully. She says "stop it" towards the end. Perhaps she didn't want her son to end up treating people the same way by imitation, or perhaps she'd witnessed him go down this path of anger before and was afraid of what might happen next.
The guy who recorded this video has clearly wrapped up his own sense of identity far too much into his time in the Army. Why else would he become so enraged by someone parading as a soldier? He mentions he lost friends during his service (this is when his anger explodes), and clearly generally he has very bad anger issues to the point where he is using very foul language in front of his child, and watching the video, one wonders if he will at some point break down into physical violence.
Yeah, civvies are worse. I was a fobbit and proud (don't be mad 'cause I got a good ASVAB score ) but the fish stories comparison is apt. Of course, don't completely make stuff up; you're 30, I don't think you went into Grenada.
I had a good ASVAB as well.... It sure helped me out LOADS in 'Nam!!
Back in the day when I was a victorious soldier in Task Force Smith in my capacity as CaptainSgt. I turned back those russian T34's with a Bazooka....
You're so full of crap. I happen to know you were only a Lance Gunny that had barely gotten promoted from gak bird of the Corps.
jasper76 wrote: So I sucked it up and watched the whole thing (it's difficult for me to watch people bully other people as it makes me quite angry). It's noteworthy that even the guys wife or girlfriend recognizes he's being a douchebag and a bully. She says "stop it" towards the end. Perhaps she didn't want her son to end up treating people the same way by imitation, or perhaps she'd witnessed him go down this path of anger before and was afraid of what might happen next.
The guy who recorded this video has clearly wrapped up his own sense of identity far too much into his time in the Army. Why else would he become so enraged by someone parading as a soldier? He mentions he lost friends during his service (this is when his anger explodes), and clearly generally he has very bad anger issues to the point where he is using very foul language in front of his child, and watching the video, one wonders if he will at some point break down into physical violence.
Armchair internet diagnosis = untreated PTSD.
Please. Just stop. That wasn't bullying. That wasn't PTSD. That wasn't someone losing control and being on the edge of 'physical violence'... That was anger. It's a normal human emotion. It happens. Don't try to wave it off and defend that gakbag for whatever reason. Who is the 'douche' in this situation is pretty clear.
I don't understand why you are hanging your hat on defending this individual - who in case you missed it was pointed out in this thread as having also been called out for impersonating a police officer - which is actually a crime. Stop inventing narrative from whole cloth to try to portray the guy who had the audacity to get angry for a reasonably legitimate reason as some sort of monster whilst defending a waste of a human being who at best is a liar and at worst is a criminal and fraud.
I'm not defending the subject of the video at all. I either pity him, or think he's scum.
If he's out trying to get somebody to be friendly with him by wearing a soldier (or earlker, as you say, police) outfit, then I pity him, and I hope he gets help.
If he's wearing the uniform to cash in on Black Friday sales, then I think he's scum.
It's hard to tell from the video what's up with him.
In either case, the bully and his motives are more interesting to me. No one would get that angry over this trivia unless they had problems....and his problems are on full display. Who curses that much in front of their wife/girlfriend and son? Who would take the time and energy to interrogate someone like that? What would cause them to do such a thing, embarrassing their wife and child in the process? What would drive them to post a shaming video on YoUTube (more time and energy , after the fact)? Anger? Desire for fame? Cruelty?....my conclusion is PTSD, likely combined with egomaniacal impulses.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I dont know...don't know how old you are, but maybe it's a generational thing.
I grew up before YouTube and smart phone video recorders. To me, the behavior of this dude is quite odd.
jasper76 wrote: I'm not defending the subject of the video at all. I either pity him, or think he's scum.
If he's out trying to get somebody to be friendly with him by wearing a soldier outfit, then I pity him, and I hope he gets help.
If he's wearing the uniform to cash in on Black Friday sales, then I think he's scum.
It's hard to tell from the video what's up with him.
In either case, the bully and his motives are more interesting to me. No one would get that angry over this trivia unless they had problems....and his problems are on full display. Who curses that much in front of their wife/girlfriend and son? Who would take the time and energy to interrogate someone like that? What would cause them to do such a thing, embarrassing their wife and child in the process? What would drive them to post a shaming video on YoUTube (more time and energy , after the fact)? Anger? Desire for fame? Cruelty?....my conclusion is PTSD, likely combined with egomaniacal impulses.
Ah, so someone having different priorities and caring about things at different levels of vehemence than you means they have mental problems? Calling someone out for being a liar and fraudster over the course of four to five minutes makes you a bully?
Seriously dude, stop. Don't armchair diagnose people for psychological problems based off of a tiny snippet of video. It is not a sane or healthy way to interact with the world through the medium of the internet. It's bad form.
Not to be overly nitpicky, because this guy is an obvious fake, but not everyone in the Ranger Regiment has a Ranger tab, so a scroll without a tab isn't necessarily a sign of a faker. That said, a Staff Sergeant in the Regiment without a tab is probably pretty unlikely.
jasper76 wrote: So I sucked it up and watched the whole thing (it's difficult for me to watch people bully other people as it makes me quite angry). It's noteworthy that even the guys wife or girlfriend recognizes he's being a douchebag and a bully. She says "stop it" towards the end. Perhaps she didn't want her son to end up treating people the same way by imitation, or perhaps she'd witnessed him go down this path of anger before and was afraid of what might happen next.
The guy who recorded this video has clearly wrapped up his own sense of identity far too much into his time in the Army. Why else would he become so enraged by someone parading as a soldier? He mentions he lost friends during his service (this is when his anger explodes), and clearly generally he has very bad anger issues to the point where he is using very foul language in front of his child, and watching the video, one wonders if he will at some point break down into physical violence.
Armchair internet diagnosis = untreated PTSD.
Please. Just stop. That wasn't bullying. That wasn't PTSD. That wasn't someone losing control and being on the edge of 'physical violence'... That was anger. It's a normal human emotion. It happens. Don't try to wave it off and defend that gakbag for whatever reason. Who is the 'douche' in this situation is pretty clear.
I don't understand why you are hanging your hat on defending this individual - who in case you missed it was pointed out in this thread as having also been called out for impersonating a police officer - which is actually a crime. Stop inventing narrative from whole cloth to try to portray the guy who had the audacity to get angry for a reasonably legitimate reason as some sort of monster whilst defending a waste of a human being who at best is a liar and at worst is a criminal and fraud.
Not to be overly nitpicky, because this guy is an obvious fake, but not everyone in the Ranger Regiment has a Ranger tab, so a scroll without a tab isn't necessarily a sign of a faker. That said, a Staff Sergeant in the Regiment without a tab is probably pretty unlikely.
To lead troops in a Ranger Bat you have to be tabbed.
@Concer: I'm not saying you shouldn't be angry by people impersonating soldiers. I'm saying going to the trouble of filming your own interrogation video, badgering someone in public to the obvious embarrassment of your wife and child, then posting that video on YoUTube to get your 15 minutes sort of begs the question of the guys own mental health.
As I said, maybe this is a generational thing. I grew up before YouTube and websites dedicated to yourself. This strikes me as very odd behavior. If I grew up with this stuff, maybe I wouldn't see a problem.
This guy could have just left his wife and child to go shopping and confronted the person on his own. If he felt a crime was being committed, he could have reported it to an authoritu. But instead, he chose to make it about himself, and went further down that road by posting it to YouTube.
jasper76 wrote: @Concer: I'm not saying you shouldn't be angry by people impersonating soldiers. I'm saying going to the trouble of filming your own interrogation video, badgering someone in public to the obvious embarrassment of your wife and child, then posting that video on YoUTube to get your 15 minutes sort of begs the question of the guys own mental health.
As I said, maybe this is a generational thing. I grew up before YouTube and websites dedicated to yourself. This strikes me as very odd behavior. If I grew up with this stuff, maybe I wouldn't see a problem.
This guy could have just left his wife and child to go shopping and confronted the person on his own. If he felt a crime was being committed, he could have reported it to an authoritu. But instead, he chose to make it about himself, and went further down that road by posting it to YouTube.
I be a bit pissed to
Ryan Berk, a Purple Heart recipient, spotted the man - who was dressed in camouflage fatigues and who identified himself as Sean Yetman - at the Oxford Valley Mall and was immediately suspicious of his mismatched uniform.
Along with an American flag patch in the wrong spot, Berk noticed that Yetman was wearing three Combat Infantryman Badges (CIBs) on his shoulder – an extremely rare honor.
I served in Afghanistan and have several friend who were seriously wounded and a couple who were killed in action who wore that same uniform and to see someone try and claim that type of sacrifice really irked me,’ said Berk
That he was wounded in action only furthers my suspicion that he has PTSD...there is no shame in having PTSD.
I understand his anger. I can even relate to his impulse to confront the person. The only thing that I cant relate to is why he felt the need to record this interchange and post it to YoUTube, and I guess this may be a generational thing, because it doesn't strike a couple younger fellows here as narcissistic.
jasper76 wrote: That he was wounded in action only furthers my suspicion that he has PTSD...there is no shame in having PTSD.
I understand his anger. I can even relate to his impulse to confront the person. The only thing that I cant relate to is why he felt the need to record this interchange and post it to YoUTube, and I guess this may be a generational thing, because it doesn't strike a couple younger fellows here as narcissistic.
Well, if its a crime, recording the perp would be valuable evidence for the Police.
But questioning his motives for going public with the video and encouraging mob justice / public shaming is a legitmate complaint I guess. The only way justice will be served is if the perp is prosecuted and convicted, not public shaming.
You also film in case the crap bag faker decides to take a swing at you, so you can show the LEOs what happened.
You post it to YouTube so that others can see who the crap bag is.
Not sure how any of that would be an indicator of PTSD.
As for public shaming, I guess I don't see that as a bad thing. If your actions embarrass you when made public, perhaps you ought to reconsider your actions?
Bromsy wrote: You film it so that other people know what the guy looks like. It's not narcissism. Jesus.
To what end? This obviously wasn't meant primarily as a video to hand over to the police...if that were the prime motive, the guy would have just recorded a vid, taken photos, and shown the cops what was wrong with his uniform. But he felt a need to shame the guy in the process.
Regarding Narcissim, look under Traits and Signs in this Wikipedia link, and you'll know what I mean by that.
Difficulty with empathy (he can't imagine that the person might actually have bad mental health and is seeking positive feedback from others by way of wearing a military uniform in a country which to some degree idolizes military personnel)
Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults
Pretending to be more important than they really are (a case could be made)
Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements
Claiming to be an "expert" at many things
You are missing something, and it is a BIG thing. If you don't confront the guy, and just ignore it, you are basically stating what he is doing is okay and not worth correcting. In the military leaders are taught to correct wrongs, on their troops and on other troops. See a guy in the PX in uniform who has not shaved? You correct him. See a guy walking in the parking lot without his cover on (assuming you are not on a flight line) you correct him. See a troop off post in uniform doing something wrong? You correct him. If you don't, you are accepting a new and lower standard.
As for public shaming, I guess I don't see that as a bad thing. If your actions embarrass you when made public, perhaps you ought to reconsider your actions?
At this point, I will just recommend that you read or re-read The Scarlet Letter. It is probably more pertinent now than ever in this age of near-universal access to video recorders.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CptJake wrote: You are missing something, and it is a BIG thing. If you don't confront the guy, and just ignore it, you are basically stating what he is doing is okay and not worth correcting. In the military leaders are taught to correct wrongs, on their troops and on others. See a guy in the PX in uniform who has not shaved? You correct him. See a guy walking in the parking lot without his cover on (assuming you are not on a flight line) you correct him. See a troop off post in uniform doing something wrong? You correct him. If you don't, you are accepting a new and lower standard.
It has been a while, but I don't recall public shaming of civilians in shopping malls to be part of my military training on keeping a neat uniform.
And why on earth would someone who's not even in the military anymore be on the hunt for uniform problems?
As for public shaming, I guess I don't see that as a bad thing. If your actions embarrass you when made public, perhaps you ought to reconsider your actions?
At this point, I will just recommend that you read or re-read The Scarlet Letter. It is probably more pertinent now than ever in this age of near-universal access to video recorders.
I used to have a Wall Of Shame in both of my company HQs. My 1SG would post UCMJ results, APFT and marksmanship scores, and other relevant stats. So you're barking up the wrong tree if you think I'll feel remorse for my position on this.
As for public shaming, I guess I don't see that as a bad thing. If your actions embarrass you when made public, perhaps you ought to reconsider your actions?
At this point, I will just recommend that you read or re-read The Scarlet Letter. It is probably more pertinent now than ever in this age of near-universal access to video recorders.
I used to have a Wall Of Shame in both of my company HQs. My 1SG would post UCMJ results, APFT and marksmanship scores, and other relevant stats. So you're barking up the wrong tree if you think I'll feel remorse for my position on this.
OK. I mean I just don't admire Walls of Shame, public shaming, YouTube shaming videos, etc. The only thing I can think of off the top of my head that I'd really be happy to see someone shamed for publicly is exploitation of defenseless people or violation of the public trust, and I don't personally think playing soldier at a shopping mall qualifies. We can just agree to disagree on the value of shaming others.
jasper76 wrote: So I sucked it up and watched the whole thing (it's difficult for me to watch people bully other people as it makes me quite angry). It's noteworthy that even the guys wife or girlfriend recognizes he's being a douchebag and a bully. She says "stop it" towards the end. Perhaps she didn't want her son to end up treating people the same way by imitation, or perhaps she'd witnessed him go down this path of anger before and was afraid of what might happen next.
The guy who recorded this video has clearly wrapped up his own sense of identity far too much into his time in the Army. Why else would he become so enraged by someone parading as a soldier? He mentions he lost friends during his service (this is when his anger explodes), and clearly generally he has very bad anger issues to the point where he is using very foul language in front of his child, and watching the video, one wonders if he will at some point break down into physical violence.
Armchair internet diagnosis = untreated PTSD.
Quite frankly, I think the fact he did it infron of his kid is horrible to. You make your kid watch as you embarrass a man in public and relentlessly hammer the guy as he is trying to get away?
I mean, Yeah the guy is doing something duechy, but jesus dont be an donkey-cave infront of your kid and in public like that.
jasper76 wrote: So I sucked it up and watched the whole thing (it's difficult for me to watch people bully other people as it makes me quite angry). It's noteworthy that even the guys wife or girlfriend recognizes he's being a douchebag and a bully. She says "stop it" towards the end. Perhaps she didn't want her son to end up treating people the same way by imitation, or perhaps she'd witnessed him go down this path of anger before and was afraid of what might happen next.
The guy who recorded this video has clearly wrapped up his own sense of identity far too much into his time in the Army. Why else would he become so enraged by someone parading as a soldier? He mentions he lost friends during his service (this is when his anger explodes), and clearly generally he has very bad anger issues to the point where he is using very foul language in front of his child, and watching the video, one wonders if he will at some point break down into physical violence.
Armchair internet diagnosis = untreated PTSD.
Quite frankly, I think the fact he did it infron of his kid is horrible to. You make your kid watch as you embarrass a man in public and relentlessly hammer the guy as he is trying to get away?
I mean, Yeah the guy is doing something duechy, but jesus dont be an donkey-cave infront of your kid and in public like that.
He even used his child as a tool. To his child "Don't say anything OK. Come here. Come Here."
TO the man "Hey sir, my son would really like to meet you."
Ummm...no he wouldn't. Why are you dragging your son into this? He's got nothing to do with the anger you're feeling and your little video plan.
jasper76 wrote: I'm not defending the subject of the video at all. I either pity him, or think he's scum.
If he's out trying to get somebody to be friendly with him by wearing a soldier (or earlker, as you say, police) outfit, then I pity him, and I hope he gets help.
If he's wearing the uniform to cash in on Black Friday sales, then I think he's scum.
It's hard to tell from the video what's up with him.
In either case, the bully and his motives are more interesting to me. No one would get that angry over this trivia unless they had problems....and his problems are on full display. Who curses that much in front of their wife/girlfriend and son? Who would take the time and energy to interrogate someone like that? What would cause them to do such a thing, embarrassing their wife and child in the process? What would drive them to post a shaming video on YoUTube (more time and energy , after the fact)? Anger? Desire for fame? Cruelty?....my conclusion is PTSD, likely combined with egomaniacal impulses.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I dont know...don't know how old you are, but maybe it's a generational thing.
I grew up before YouTube and smart phone video recorders. To me, the behavior of this dude is quite odd.
How old are you? Why would your formative years, sans interwebz, make it unlikely your(my!?!) generation would understand the motivations here? I'm not a confrontational person, but I can totally get behind the public outing of this fraudster. You don't need PTSD to feel righteous anger. And as others said, a public video makes it a point of record. Besides, as this POS was in a mall, methinks the public display, with camera rolling(I remember Super 8 film being the norm...) helped ensure the cretin would C&D his ruse.
I liken this to a citizen's arrest. It rarely happens, looks odd when being enacted, but it has it's uses. No one, barring fraudulent detainment, would blame a citizen for apprehending a criminal caught in the act...even if said citizen appears pretty PO'd at the time.
jasper76 wrote: So I sucked it up and watched the whole thing (it's difficult for me to watch people bully other people as it makes me quite angry). It's noteworthy that even the guys wife or girlfriend recognizes he's being a douchebag and a bully. She says "stop it" towards the end. Perhaps she didn't want her son to end up treating people the same way by imitation, or perhaps she'd witnessed him go down this path of anger before and was afraid of what might happen next.
The guy who recorded this video has clearly wrapped up his own sense of identity far too much into his time in the Army. Why else would he become so enraged by someone parading as a soldier? He mentions he lost friends during his service (this is when his anger explodes), and clearly generally he has very bad anger issues to the point where he is using very foul language in front of his child, and watching the video, one wonders if he will at some point break down into physical violence.
Armchair internet diagnosis = untreated PTSD.
Quite frankly, I think the fact he did it infron of his kid is horrible to. You make your kid watch as you embarrass a man in public and relentlessly hammer the guy as he is trying to get away?
I mean, Yeah the guy is doing something duechy, but jesus dont be an donkey-cave infront of your kid and in public like that.
He even used his child as a tool. To his child "Don't say anything OK. Come here. Come Here."
TO the man "Hey sir, my son would really like to meet you."
Ummm...no he wouldn't. Why are you dragging your son into this? He's got nothing to do with the anger you're feeling and your little video plan.
Quite Frankly, I dont get why it matters so much to film the damn thing. Why put so much effort into shaming the damn guy? To be honest, I felt kinda sorry for him, the wa that guy was laying into him.
@Rusty Trombone: I'm 38. To me, it seems very odd that someone would go to all the trouble of creating a ruse to capture on video an interrogstion of a guy impersonating an Army Ranger and posting it on YouTube.
I honestly wouldn't care if I saw this dude in a mall. Military uniforms impress me about as much as coal miner outfits. But if I did have a problem, I'd either (a) confront the guy without my wife and child present, (b) just tell someone with actual auhauthority to do something about it.
The impulse to video record it and post it on YouTube would be the last thing to cross my mind, because I didn't grow up with YouTube, I don't think vigilante public shaming campaigns are noble, and I don't feel a need to make and publish videos about my private life and post them to the internet...that strikes me as odd.
The impulse to video record it and post it on YouTube would be the last thing to cross my mind, because I didn't grow up with YouTube, I don't think vigilante public shaming campaigns are noble, and I don't feel a need to make and publish videos about my private life and post them to the internet...that strikes me as odd.
It's not so much that there's an impulse to put it on YouTube (which gets you wider viewing), but almost ALL of these situations that are filmed, are done so as evidence and sent to the various "Stolen Valor" websites that have been set up. IIRC, some of them actually act as lobby groups to affect local policy to make the sort of people who fake being military/fire/police, etc really think about doing it, due to the potential punishment.
There is nothing wrong with righteous anger, and I don't think that anybody is saying that the fake is right for walking around as a fake.
But there are different ways to respond to the guy:
1) be silent and just be angry in private 2) call him out in private and let him know that it is easy to tell that he is a fake and that you are disappointed/angry. 3) make a scene and call him out. 4) make such a scene that you embarrass your own family 5) put the whole thing on YouTube
There is not even anything inherently wrong with posting stolen valor guys on youtube IMO. You can have cordial confrontations that you can record and post.
But then there are times when it turns into a giant attention seeking dick-measuring contest with both sides going "I'm special because I wear the uniform" and both guys wanting the public to adore them for their actions.
Neither side wins there and the military gets dragged down in the court of public opinion by both the "fat ranger" and the "psycho veteran".
Edit: I understand why the vets that call them out do it, I just think that you can go too far and turn a good intention into a bad thing.
jasper76 wrote: @Rusty Trombone: I'm 38. To me, it seems very odd that someone would go to all the trouble of creating a ruse to capture on video an interrogstion of a guy impersonating an Army Ranger and posting it on YouTube.
I honestly wouldn't care if I saw this dude in a mall. Military uniforms impress me about as much as coal miner outfits. But if I did have a problem, I'd either (a) confront the guy without my wife and child present, (b) just tell someone with actual auhauthority to do something about it.
The impulse to video record it and post it on YouTube would be the last thing to cross my mind, because I didn't grow up with YouTube, I don't think vigilante public shaming campaigns are noble, and I don't feel a need to make and publish videos about my private life and post them to the internet...that strikes me as odd.
Fair enough sentiment, I guess, but not everyone thinks the same. Me, for one. I disagree in your using the term vigilante, as well. Are investigative journalists vigilantes now, too? They also 'out' people for being sleazoids...and get paid for the privilege. Public service of a higher order, or bottom feeding muckrakers? I sometimes wince in empathy for the uncomfortableness they give their targets, but it's an artifact of my soft heartedness. I get over it quickly.
The impulse to video record it and post it on YouTube would be the last thing to cross my mind, because I didn't grow up with YouTube, I don't think vigilante public shaming campaigns are noble, and I don't feel a need to make and publish videos about my private life and post them to the internet...that strikes me as odd.
It's not so much that there's an impulse to put it on YouTube (which gets you wider viewing), but almost ALL of these situations that are filmed, are done so as evidence and sent to the various "Stolen Valor" websites that have been set up. IIRC, some of them actually act as lobby groups to affect local policy to make the sort of people who fake being military/fire/police, etc really think about doing it, due to the potential punishment.
Thats another thing, This kinda stuff should not be illegal, Unless they gain a benefit from it, It should be protected from free speech.
I imagine when one derives their sense of self-worth and identity from belonging to a special club, one will get offended when someone else tries to co-opt that sense of self-worth and identity without suffering the same trials.
If I were to feel the need to play dress up in order to fraudulently obtain high fives from strangers, I'd go as a fireman. Smarter, braver, and sexy as feth, right?
The impulse to video record it and post it on YouTube would be the last thing to cross my mind, because I didn't grow up with YouTube, I don't think vigilante public shaming campaigns are noble, and I don't feel a need to make and publish videos about my private life and post them to the internet...that strikes me as odd.
It's not so much that there's an impulse to put it on YouTube (which gets you wider viewing), but almost ALL of these situations that are filmed, are done so as evidence and sent to the various "Stolen Valor" websites that have been set up. IIRC, some of them actually act as lobby groups to affect local policy to make the sort of people who fake being military/fire/police, etc really think about doing it, due to the potential punishment.
Thats another thing, This kinda stuff should not be illegal, Unless they gain a benefit from it, It should be protected from free speech.
What shouldn't be illegal? Dressing in a uniform or calling someone out on it?
The impulse to video record it and post it on YouTube would be the last thing to cross my mind, because I didn't grow up with YouTube, I don't think vigilante public shaming campaigns are noble, and I don't feel a need to make and publish videos about my private life and post them to the internet...that strikes me as odd.
It's not so much that there's an impulse to put it on YouTube (which gets you wider viewing), but almost ALL of these situations that are filmed, are done so as evidence and sent to the various "Stolen Valor" websites that have been set up. IIRC, some of them actually act as lobby groups to affect local policy to make the sort of people who fake being military/fire/police, etc really think about doing it, due to the potential punishment.
Thats another thing, This kinda stuff should not be illegal, Unless they gain a benefit from it, It should be protected from free speech.
And it is legal, as long as you don't get or attempt to get some benefit, which the faker in this case did...
Automatically Appended Next Post: I will say, if he were to walk around with a 1st Bat scroll around here near HAAF, he could run into real Bat Boys, and it might not have turned out as politely as it did in this video.
Humiliating a person can be justified but it doesn't make it any more pleasant to watch.
Obviously these people need to be called out for their bs but the people doing the calling out should remember to keep their dignity while doing so.
If you were active service and did this kind of thing would their not be some disciplinary ramifications? I know it would be punishing the wrong person but most jobs require you to have a modicum of restraint when you are seen to be representing your employer.
Jasper what branch and how many years? Obviously the Fake was successful in getting something with his "Smaj" (So the Smaj of Ranger Bat was also in the Mall shopping in uniform with his SSG WTF?)
Navy...not even 2 years. Discharged for medical problems.
Also, it's not clear that this guy got anything out of wearing that uniform, except the attention of the guy doing the recording. He is carrying a shopping bag. That doesn't conclusively mean he was seeking or obtained a veteran discount.
And for all we know, the "Sergeant Major" doesn't even exist.
jasper76 wrote: Navy...not even 2 years. Separated for medical problems.
Also, it's not clear that this guy got anything out of wearing that uniform, except the attention of the guy doing the recording. He is carrying a shopping bag. That doesn't conclusively mean he was seeking or obtained a veteran discount.
When in uniform its a automatic discount since he did not have to show his "valid" ID CAC Card. 23 years and retired I know this dirt bag got a discount for being in "uniform" Either 5 or 10% discount. On Black Friday at that. I'm not going to second guess how your NCO's/Instructors mentored you but you seem to be missing the "integrity" part.
Also you seem to have missed this part in the thread where I mention he also faked a LEO by wearing his uniform (LEO was killed in line of duty)
A Philadelphia man apparently likes dressing up in uniforms.
Last week, he was wearing Army fatigues at the Oxford Valley Mall in Middletown when he was confronted by an Army veteran who suspected that the man never served in the military. The veteran of Afghanistan who lives in Northampton Township, Bucks County, posted the video of the confrontation on YouTube and it has since generated more than 2.8 million views and incensed military families nationwide.
Back in 2003, his uniform of choice was a police coat.
The now 30-year-old Sean Yetman was arrested while wearing the coat of a Philadelphia officer who died in the line of duty. He pleaded guilty in Bucks County Court in May of that year to impersonating a public servant, a second-degree misdemeanor. He was sentenced to three months of probation for that crime along with a summary offense of driving with a suspended or revoked license, according to online court records.
Yetman was arrested after being stopped on North Main Street in Doylestown during a routine traffic safety checkpoint while wearing the coat and displaying a Philadelphia police badge, according to court records obtained by Calkins Media. Both items belonged to the late Robert Hays, who was killed in the line of duty in 1995, the Philadelphia Police Department confirmed.
Yetman told the Doylestown officers that he worked out of the city's 26th District in Fishtown, but then added that he was in the police academy and working in the 26th as a drive-along, court documents show. The police coat, he said, belonged to his uncle.
He was unable to produce a valid driver’s license or any other identification to verify that he was a Philadelphia police officer, Doylestown officers said. They found out that Yetman had a Pennsylvania Identification Card, which came back showing his driver's license had been suspended, officers said.
Doylestown police later spoke with Hays' widow, who said that she had given her son one of her husband’s coats and badges after his death. She also said her son knew Yetman through his girlfriend, according to the court records.
“She said she did not know how Yetman had come into possession of the jacket and the badge,” police said.
A woman who answered the door of Yetman's house on Saturday claimed that Yetman had a military background but declined to provide details. She said the family had no comment on the issue. Phone numbers listed under Yetman's name have been disconnected and his Facebook account was taken down Saturday.
According to a story in the "Army Times," Yetman's fiancee said in an email that "the blow-back to Yetman and his family has been vicious."
The newspaper reported that the woman said Yetman has lost his job.
"We are now hearing death threats. All of this has us concerned for our children and their safety," she wrote, according to the Army Times. "He is a good man with a very big heart and this backlash has spiraled him into a deep depression."
In the YouTube video that went viral and was shot on Black Friday, Yetman tells veteran Ryan Berk, who was a sergeant while serving in Afghanistan, that he is a staff sergeant in the U.S. Army Rangers and claims he recently returned from Fort Lewis, Washington, which is the base for the 75th Ranger Regiment, 2nd Battalion.
Yetman doesn't appear in the U.S. Army's database, according to retired Col. Richard Nurnberg, the executive director of the National Infantry Association at Fort Benning, Georgia. That means he is not active duty or recently retired. The database covers reservists as well as Army Rangers, an elite special operations unit.
Yetman's name also was not found in any database of Army members who have undergone Ranger training at Fort Benning, according to Nurnberg.
He added that a misdemeanor conviction, such as impersonating a police officer, would not keep someone out of the Army.
During the 3-minute, 26-second video, Berk becomes furious with Yetman for wearing the uniform without ever having served. Berk suspected Yetman was not a soldier because elements of his uniform didn't appear correct and he had trouble answering some basic military service questions, including how he received the three Combat Infantrymen Badges he wore, Berk added.
Berk, who was awarded a Purple Heart after he was wounded in Afghanistan, told Yetman that he would need to be in three different campaigns. Yetman responded that one badge was for service in Iraq and the others for different tours of Afghanistan.
But military authorities, including the National Infantry Association, confirmed that only one CIB would be awarded for service in Afghanistan (Operation Enduring Freedom) and/or Iraq (Operation Iraqi Freedom/Operation New Dawn).
Middletown police and a U.S. Army investigator are reviewing all available video footage to determine if a crime was committed by Yetman while wearing the uniform.
U.S. Rep. Mike Fitzpatrick, R-8, who represents Bucks County sent a letter to Philadelphia-area U.S. attorney Zane Memeger on Monday, notifying him that the video could “possibly” contain evidence of a federal crime under the Stolen Valor Act.
Civilian and military authorities are looking into whether Yetman sought or received military discounts while at the mall on Black Friday or if he violated a state law that forbids the unauthorized wearing of military decorations.
Falsely claiming to be a member of the military is not illegal, but under the Stolen Valor Act of 2013, it’s against federal law for an individual to fraudulently portray him or herself as a recipient of any of several specified military decorations or medals with the intent to obtain money, property or other “tangible” benefit.
Surplus military uniforms, fatigues and other items, including badges, are available for sale in Army Navy stores, and online. But Nurnberg said that if a military service member wants to give away a uniform, he or she must remove the “U.S. Army” identification badge above the left pocket. That identification marker appears on the uniform Yetman is wearing in the YouTube video, he added.
Under Pennsylvania law it is a summary offense to wear a uniform, decoration insignia or other distinctive emblems of any branch of the armed forces of the United States for the purpose of obtaining aid, profit or while soliciting contributions or subscriptions. It is also a summary offense to, without authority, knowingly wear, exhibit, display or use for any purpose any military or veteran insignia.
Also, it is a third-degree misdemeanor in the state if a person, without authority, purchases, sells, offers for sale or accepts as a "pledge or pawn," any medal, insignia or decoration granted for service in the armed forces.
On Wednesday, Bucks County's chief of prosecutions, Matt Weintraub, said that in order to pursue the misdemeanor offense involving military decorations, authorities would need to prove that Yetman purchased the CIB badges in Pennsylvania and without authority.
And no offense, but I learned well more about integrity from my family than the military could ever teach me.
That additional information about the police uniform makes me suspect even more that this Yetman guy had serious psychological problems, and needs help, which I hope he gets. Maybe its easier to gak all over him as a jackass worthy of this public ridicule campaign, but I cannot do so. It is not within me to join the choir.
And no offense, but I learned well more about integrity from my family than the military could ever teach me.
That is another thing I will like to address.
Being in the military does not automatically make you a great person or have integrity.
I have met some real donkey-caves who are in the military. Like, They shouldnt represent anything donkey-caves.
Yep. Anyone who has been in the military knows it is peopled by both admirable and unadmirable characters, just like everywhere else. There is no magic that eliminates your character flaws by putting on a uniform.
Stop assuming I question YOUR integrity. You are defending a guy who took advantage of the uniform for personal gain for that individual has no integrity. Would you slap on a current naval uniform and portray yourself as a Combat Veteran like Yetman did? I highly doubt it. Now tell me why you wouldn't do it and who did you learn that from. I'm Army your Navy. Two different environments for NCO's but I've a feeling you know where I am going with this. If not then there's no point in this discussion.
BTW They are pressing charges on Yetman for the auto discount he received while wearing the uniform.
@Jihadin: Great...now you are dumping on the United States Navy. Whatever. My self esteem is comprised absolutely 0% by my time in the Navy. It was a job which I volunteered for, and for which I was paid.
I've said before that if this guy was wearing the uniform just to gets sales, that's pretty low. However, getting 5% off at JC Pennys or whatever isn't exactly Auschwitz.
All I'll ask is that you imagine the possibility that Yetman might be a very sad and lonely individual seeking to get some kind of positive attention in this grim world before you light your torch and join the mob.
jasper76 wrote: I've said before that if this guy was wearing the uniform just to gets sales, that's pretty low. However, getting 5% off at JC Pennys or whatever isn't exactly Auschwitz.
No, of course not. But if indeed he asked for, and received a veteran discount, as some of the reporting has said - and what got the attention of the person who did the recording - I personally still feel he should be prosecuted. I think it's a pretty crappy thing to do - our armed forces are asked to put their lives on the line all for the promise of poor money and lousy physical and mental care if they do get injured, worse job prospects, and so on, and have this dude unjustly enrich himself to one of the few perks - it's pretty crappy.
I agree with you the guy who taped it seems like maybe he has some anger issues, though, especially at the end there where he clearly is losing it.
But you know what was the craziest part of this video to me? That the dude stood there, being questioned and eventually berated. Why not just walk the hell away, right off the bat? I mean he has to know where this is going, right?
Anyway, he might face charges after all. There have also been some other consequences for him.
Man at center of Stolen Valor case once impersonated dead cop
A man purporting to be an Army Ranger at Oxford Valley Mall in Bucks County was confronted by a soldier who called him out for Stolen Valor.
By Jo Ciavaglia,
Last week, he was wearing Army fatigues at the Oxford Valley Mall in Middletown when he was confronted by an Army veteran who suspected that the man never served in the military. The veteran of Afghanistan who lives in Northampton Township, Bucks County, posted the video of the confrontation on YouTube and it has since generated more than 2.8 million views and incensed military families nationwide.
Back in 2003, his uniform of choice was a police coat.
The now 30-year-old Sean Yetman was arrested while wearing the coat of a Philadelphia officer who died in the line of duty. He pleaded guilty in Bucks County Court in May of that year to impersonating a public servant, a second-degree misdemeanor. He was sentenced to three months of probation for that crime along with a summary offense of driving with a suspended or revoked license, according to online court records.
Stolen Valor Happens More Than You Think
Meeting a decorated veteran is a big honor. But what if those medals and ribbons are fake. Stolen Valor happens more than you think.
Yetman was arrested after being stopped on North Main Street in Doylestown during a routine traffic safety checkpoint while wearing the coat and displaying a Philadelphia police badge, according to court records obtained by Calkins Media. Both items belonged to the late Robert Hays, who was killed in the line of duty in 1995, the Philadelphia Police Department confirmed.
Yetman told the Doylestown officers that he worked out of the city's 26th District in Fishtown, but then added that he was in the police academy and working in the 26th as a drive-along, court documents show. The police coat, he said, belonged to his uncle.
He was unable to produce a valid driver’s license or any other identification to verify that he was a Philadelphia police officer, Doylestown officers said. They found out that Yetman had a Pennsylvania Identification Card, which came back showing his driver's license had been suspended, officers said.
Doylestown police later spoke with Hays' widow, who said that she had given her son one of her husband’s coats and badges after his death. She also said her son knew Yetman through his girlfriend, according to the court records.
“She said she did not know how Yetman had come into possession of the jacket and the badge,” police said.
A woman who answered the door of Yetman's house on Saturday claimed that Yetman had a military background but declined to provide details. She said the family had no comment on the issue. Phone numbers listed under Yetman's name have been disconnected and his Facebook account was taken down Saturday.
According to a story in the "Army Times," Yetman's fiancee said in an email that "the blow-back to Yetman and his family has been vicious."
The newspaper reported that the woman said Yetman has lost his job.
"We are now hearing death threats. All of this has us concerned for our children and their safety," she wrote, according to the Army Times. "He is a good man with a very big heart and this backlash has spiraled him into a deep depression."
In the YouTube video that went viral and was shot on Black Friday, Yetman tells veteran Ryan Berk, who was a sergeant while serving in Afghanistan, that he is a staff sergeant in the U.S. Army Rangers and claims he recently returned from Fort Lewis, Washington, which is the base for the 75th Ranger Regiment, 2nd Battalion.
Yetman doesn't appear in the U.S. Army's database, according to retired Col. Richard Nurnberg, the executive director of the National Infantry Association at Fort Benning, Georgia. That means he is not active duty or recently retired. The database covers reservists as well as Army Rangers, an elite special operations unit.
Yetman's name also was not found in any database of Army members who have undergone Ranger training at Fort Benning, according to Nurnberg.
He added that a misdemeanor conviction, such as impersonating a police officer, would not keep someone out of the Army.
During the 3-minute, 26-second video, Berk becomes furious with Yetman for wearing the uniform without ever having served. Berk suspected Yetman was not a soldier because elements of his uniform didn't appear correct and he had trouble answering some basic military service questions, including how he received the three Combat Infantrymen Badges he wore, Berk added.
Berk, who was awarded a Purple Heart after he was wounded in Afghanistan, told Yetman that he would need to be in three different campaigns. Yetman responded that one badge was for service in Iraq and the others for different tours of Afghanistan.
But military authorities, including the National Infantry Association, confirmed that only one CIB would be awarded for service in Afghanistan (Operation Enduring Freedom) and/or Iraq (Operation Iraqi Freedom/Operation New Dawn).
Middletown police and a U.S. Army investigator are reviewing all available video footage to determine if a crime was committed by Yetman while wearing the uniform.
U.S. Rep. Mike Fitzpatrick, R-8, who represents Bucks County sent a letter to Philadelphia-area U.S. attorney Zane Memeger on Monday, notifying him that the video could “possibly” contain evidence of a federal crime under the Stolen Valor Act.
Civilian and military authorities are looking into whether Yetman sought or received military discounts while at the mall on Black Friday or if he violated a state law that forbids the unauthorized wearing of military decorations.
Falsely claiming to be a member of the military is not illegal, but under the Stolen Valor Act of 2013, it’s against federal law for an individual to fraudulently portray him or herself as a recipient of any of several specified military decorations or medals with the intent to obtain money, property or other “tangible” benefit.
Surplus military uniforms, fatigues and other items, including badges, are available for sale in Army Navy stores, and online. But Nurnberg said that if a military service member wants to give away a uniform, he or she must remove the “U.S. Army” identification badge above the left pocket. That identification marker appears on the uniform Yetman is wearing in the YouTube video, he added.
Under Pennsylvania law it is a summary offense to wear a uniform, decoration insignia or other distinctive emblems of any branch of the armed forces of the United States for the purpose of obtaining aid, profit or while soliciting contributions or subscriptions. It is also a summary offense to, without authority, knowingly wear, exhibit, display or use for any purpose any military or veteran insignia.
Also, it is a third-degree misdemeanor in the state if a person, without authority, purchases, sells, offers for sale or accepts as a "pledge or pawn," any medal, insignia or decoration granted for service in the armed forces.
On Wednesday, Bucks County's chief of prosecutions, Matt Weintraub, said that in order to pursue the misdemeanor offense involving military decorations, authorities would need to prove that Yetman purchased the CIB badges in Pennsylvania and without authority.
I italicized that sentence because it's not true. I googled the section of the PA code that covers it. The previous sentence is accurate. I suspect the italicised sentence was supposed to be removed and was just sloppy editing, but the rule as always is it's legal to play dress-up, the line is when you try to gain something tangible.
I find it a little bit concerning that when a veteran gets angry and confronts an obvious faker for stolen valor, that some posters just assume he has PTSD.
Yeah, Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned that (although I do suspect it...he lost friends, and was himself injured...it would be unusual if he did not have PTSD under those circumstances). Anyways, I was just trying to explain why he might have let himself get so angry over such trivia.
Anyways, he's clearly not Captain Hero in this interchange.
He lies, uses horrible language in front of his child, uses his kid as a tool for his own personal anger, and embarrasses his family by making a scene. PTSD? Who knows. Difficulty dealing with anger management? Check.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, I find this phrase "stolen valor" to be weird. Being present in a war or conflict does not imply valor. Wearing a uniform does not imply valor. It's a cheapening of the word, and IMO disrepects people who have received commendations for actual valor. Not everyone in the military is brave in the face of actual danger, and not everyone in the military has performed valorous acts.
Let's call it what it is: impersonating a soldier.
I think "Stolen Valor" is stupid since it seems to imply that CptJake now has less valor because this guy got a uniform of the internet and used it to save 5% of his purchase.
Nothing that guy did "steals" any valor from real soldiers or veterans.
d-usa wrote: I think "Stolen Valor" is stupid since it seems to imply that CptJake now has less valor because this guy got a uniform of the internet and used it to save 5% of his purchase.
D, You don't know anything. Every time a military member gets enough xp to level up - that works in the other way, too. It's a finite pool, man. Every time someone does what this guy does, the actual military members lose some XP - so CptJake (for example) is in very real danger of again becoming 1LTJake.
d-usa wrote: I think "Stolen Valor" is stupid since it seems to imply that CptJake now has less valor because this guy got a uniform of the internet and used it to save 5% of his purchase.
D, You don't know anything. Every time a military member gets enough xp to level up - that works in the other way, too. It's a finite pool, man. Every time someone does what this guy does, the actual military members lose some XP - so CptJake (for example) is in very real danger of again becoming 1LTJake.
Ninja'd!
So it's like WoW, where I'm doing a Warrior Quest and some Rogue is killing all the enemies and looting their corpses? He's not even a Warrior, what's he doing on my quest? Stealing Warrior XP?
d-usa wrote: I think "Stolen Valor" is stupid since it seems to imply that CptJake now has less valor because this guy got a uniform of the internet and used it to save 5% of his purchase.
I never had valor. I'm scared of heights, 'little people', spiders, thunder storms, snakes, power tools, deep water, the dark, asking out girls, clowns (but who isn't?), any type of conflict, and once pooped myself when I heard a loud noise.
d-usa wrote: I think "Stolen Valor" is stupid since it seems to imply that CptJake now has less valor because this guy got a uniform of the internet and used it to save 5% of his purchase.
I never had valor. I'm scared of heights, 'little people', spiders, thunder storms, snakes, power tools, deep water, the dark, asking out girls, clowns (but who isn't?), any type of conflict, and once pooped myself when I heard a loud noise.
jasper76 wrote: Yeah, Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned that (although I do suspect it...he lost friends, and was himself injured...it would be unusual if he did not have PTSD under those circumstances). Anyways, I was just trying to explain why he might have let himself get so angry over such trivia.
It's one thing that I've noticed about many Vets who have served around me, that they take extreme pride in the uniform and its proper wear, and how it "represents" all the dead who have served previously, etc.
Hell, I had a 1sg in actual tears, chewing out soldiers at a Class-A uniform re-inspection, because he had lost a number of close friends in Iraq and even previous engagements (he was a 1sg, he'd been around since Desert Storm at least)
So, to me, I can envision many circumstances where a guy's emotional response is much greater than would otherwise be "normal" for that situation without it being PTSD.
Wearing a Combat Infantry badge with three mustard stains on indicating he fought in three theaters of war is pretty much Stolen Valor.
That he shows Airborne Wings indicating he is a Paratrooper As for the third badge I swear that thing looks like a CAB (Combat Action Badge) By wearing those badges he is indicating his accomplishments
99% of the military going to get this but when you see another trooper you look at his/her badges which we refer to as "Stacks". When you hear the term "Tower of Power" then you look at tabs on shoulder.
As for me dumping on the Navy Jasper then you fail to see what I was getting at.
The PTSD label is a catch all phrase for us then been to the Box.
Everyone that goes into the Box gets PTSD
Then you get some like me with PTSD and TBI which is a good combo so when I get angry then its because my PTSD and TBI kicked in and I rant on you all because I have not medicated myself.
@Jihadin: I was wrong to have mentioned PTSD. I was obviously a bit peeved by the recorder's behavior, and his automatic assumption that the guy's sole intent was to get some discounts. Maybe I'm too soft...my gut reaction to seeing this guy impersonating a soldier is that he might be a sad and lonely person just trying to get attention.
jasper76 wrote: Yeah, Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned that (although I do suspect it...he lost friends, and was himself injured...it would be unusual if he did not have PTSD under those circumstances). Anyways, I was just trying to explain why he might have let himself get so angry over such trivia.
It's one thing that I've noticed about many Vets who have served around me, that they take extreme pride in the uniform and its proper wear, and how it "represents" all the dead who have served previously, etc.
Hell, I had a 1sg in actual tears, chewing out soldiers at a Class-A uniform re-inspection, because he had lost a number of close friends in Iraq and even previous engagements (he was a 1sg, he'd been around since Desert Storm at least)
So, to me, I can envision many circumstances where a guy's emotional response is much greater than would otherwise be "normal" for that situation without it being PTSD.
I may be too close to the problem here. The one thing I absolutely could not stand about military life was the uniform business. To me, it was a huge PITA. And although the Navy did have some cool-ish uniforms, they made me wear this:
I mean, come on! That's just cruel and unusual.
I suppose I should be happy that I never had to wear this:
I agree about the uniforms bit. I wouldn't of fathomed walking about in one, off hours. The last thing I desired was undue attention. Wearing the uniform to a mall no where near your supposed duty station/base, though, goes even further down the rabbit hole of crazy. Homey wanted his scented candles discounted...bad.
If this waste of space wanted a discount and be noticed, all he had to do was make a poor attempt at shoplifting. Less money wasted on the wardrobe.
I may be too close to the problem here. The one thing I absolutely could not stand about military life was the uniform business. To me, it was a huge PITA. And although the Navy did have some cool-ish uniforms, they made me wear this:
Yeah... I think the Navy in particular has some issues with uniforms. I mean, I know there's a crap load of different uniforms, and you have to know which one gets worn on Mon or Tuesday, vs. Thursday and Friday... THEN you have to know what the day's date is... if its late in the year, do I wear khaki? Or do I wear blue? Is the temperature low enough that Im supposed to wear long sleeves and a jacket, or do I wear short sleeves?
I mean... I remember a Duffelblog article about the "38" uniform combinations the Navy has... and It quite often feels like that article isn't even satirical
I may be too close to the problem here. The one thing I absolutely could not stand about military life was the uniform business. To me, it was a huge PITA. And although the Navy did have some cool-ish uniforms, they made me wear this:
Yeah... I think the Navy in particular has some issues with uniforms. I mean, I know there's a crap load of different uniforms, and you have to know which one gets worn on Mon or Tuesday, vs. Thursday and Friday... THEN you have to know what the day's date is... if its late in the year, do I wear khaki? Or do I wear blue? Is the temperature low enough that Im supposed to wear long sleeves and a jacket, or do I wear short sleeves?
I mean... I remember a Duffelblog article about the "38" uniform combinations the Navy has... and It quite often feels like that article isn't even satirical
And then if you're assigned to some sort of FMF duty you have to have a bunch of Marine uniform items on top of that.
I may be too close to the problem here. The one thing I absolutely could not stand about military life was the uniform business. To me, it was a huge PITA. And although the Navy did have some cool-ish uniforms, they made me wear this:
Yeah... I think the Navy in particular has some issues with uniforms. I mean, I know there's a crap load of different uniforms, and you have to know which one gets worn on Mon or Tuesday, vs. Thursday and Friday... THEN you have to know what the day's date is... if its late in the year, do I wear khaki? Or do I wear blue? Is the temperature low enough that Im supposed to wear long sleeves and a jacket, or do I wear short sleeves?
I mean... I remember a Duffelblog article about the "38" uniform combinations the Navy has... and It quite often feels like that article isn't even satirical
And then if you're assigned to some sort of FMF duty you have to have a bunch of Marine uniform items on top of that.
.
and guys straight out of basic.
