CyporieanMade isn't around to maintain the previous SWM thread (whose OP was for a different product, anyway), so I figure I'll start a new one, so I can maintain the subject title.
From the Reaper forums: "The Core set is going to be available for $75 as a reward that starts with one Starter Set and grows from there.There will also be an option introduced to buy a non-growing Starter, as well as options to buy various sub-sets of the Starter (like, just these x walls, just these x floors, etc.). Precise details will be revealed as the project advances." I imagine the non-growing starter was based on Bones KS feedback from international backers who did not want the offered SG's, so postage would be reduced.
Pieces will be molded in PVC plastic, similar to Reaper Bones. Accessories are compatible with Dwarven Forge. The low walls are there so top-heavy figures (eg. demons) wouldn't bump into the walls, and could be reached more easily during play. Other SWM products, such as the Malice RPG Treasure set will be available through this KS. Not revealed yet if the mine cart and tracks will be SG or add-on. SWM said there will be risers for sub-levels.
Sans stretch-goals it feels like one starter set MIGHT provide 2'x' worth of coverage. So for a single-floor, 3x3 for say, Frostgrave, you'd be looking at roughly four and a half set's worth.
Knowing Reaper, I wouldn't be shocked if the contents of a pledge double with stretch-goals, so all in all, i'm pretty impressed if that ends up the case.
And again, that's assuming you want a hypothetical, "all interior" dungeon for something like the new Breeding Pits expansion.
Well it's funded now so it can only get better from here. I think late july is a bad time for KS's though, so many companies want to launch their campaigns so they can show it off at GenCon.
Seems like a crazy good deal as it picks up, especially for those of us who don't own Dwarven Forge materials, or have cast our own tiles.
Those stretches get hit we're going to have a lot of plastic piling up.
Yea Im wondering that as well, maybe its just off to a slow start. Seems like itll be a very good deal once the first couple unlocks happen.
It has some big advantages over hirst arts stuff. Mainly not having to cast a million things and itll be much easier to transport it out of your basement.
Lower cost of entry is there as well, 75$ doesnt get you far with HA sadly. But its still the route Ill probably end up going personally. Just too many other things I could do with the bricks that arent a dungeon layout. I just dread the thought of having to cast things over and over and over... *shudder*
Given the potential shipping costs of backing this on top of all the usual KS issues (delays, etc) vs just ordering them at "retail" with free shipping from Justin, it's not really going to be nearly as worthwhile for non-US backers. Add to that the fact that the biggest single source of non-US wargaming backers has had their currency tank due to Brexit....
Yeah, 14 month development time plus actual shipping equal stay away. I'm just too unsettled in my life right now with my job and family to think that far ahead.
Hey folks - I don't think I'll be able to keep up with the thread entirely, but I wanted to chime in of course
@ Azazelx -- Backers in AUS, like yourself, will have their product shipped locally. I've already worked this out for fulfillment in the EU, UK, and AUS. No worries! But I don't offer free shipping outside of Sacramento, California and haven't in a long time now. Holding out for retail won't help when you effectively get two for one in the campaign, and local shipping...
@ Polonius -- 14 months to cut all of the tools, do all of the shots, and get everything shipped is actually very reasonable. Take a look at the Reaper Bones campaign cycles and you'll see on-time or early delivery every time. With their help, and the same factory doing production, we are not anticipating delays.
Actual shipping costs will be local for AUS, UK/EU, and USA - we are also looking at the best international rates for other countries, as folks in Canada *might* see orders ship from the UK if it's less expensive.
misterjustin wrote: @ Polonius -- 14 months to cut all of the tools, do all of the shots, and get everything shipped is actually very reasonable. Take a look at the Reaper Bones campaign cycles and you'll see on-time or early delivery every time. With their help, and the same factory doing production, we are not anticipating delays.
I wasn't trying to bust your chops, I'm just thinking more short term about my hobby spending these days. I'm hoping to move and start a family in the next 14 months, so this might not be for me right now.
Besides, I'd rather buy my stuff from you personally at Adepticon!
Update: "Now we’re aiming for $35,000 to unlocked the Core Wall Set – and add it to your Core Set Pledge FOR FREE! That’s an additional Wall Set in your Core Set Pledge!"
Pretty interesting that they're unlocking *entire sets* rather than a piece at a time.
That would be a cool idea.. even if they don't look right, put together some nice PDF guides for folks on what pieces they can glue together to match certain tiles for more popular dungeon crawler games
@ Azazelx -- Backers in AUS, like yourself, will have their product shipped locally. I've already worked this out for fulfillment in the EU, UK, and AUS. No worries! But I don't offer free shipping outside of Sacramento, California and haven't in a long time now. Holding out for retail won't help when you effectively get two for one in the campaign, and local shipping...
Actual shipping costs will be local for AUS, UK/EU, and USA - we are also looking at the best international rates for other countries, as folks in Canada *might* see orders ship from the UK if it's less expensive.
Thanks for the Info, Justin. Much more interesting now. When the campaign said that Reaper was doing/helping with distribution, it sounded dire for those of us outside of the US, as Reaper don't seem to have any real idea (interest?) in non-US distro. Hopefully you can get some approximate quotes before the campaign ends? Will there be the ability to add more items via a pledge manager?
If the tiles work for SDE (or even better have certain themed/ sized items) at least I know this is a guaranteed purchase for my house- whereas before it was just getting purchased regardless for my selfish own interests, but now I can use the excuse of it's for "family."
@ Azazelx -- Reaper is in the process of opening distribution centers in AUS and the UK, which means they'll sorting the parcels for us locally at both locations.... so there's that
@ highlord -- the SDE studio models arrive on Wednesday, and we're planning a snazzy update on Thursday to show them off.
It is also slow to fund because of reaper being involved. This stuff is going to show up in the normal low quality that reaper bones is know for. Reapers bones quality is terrible and WAY below Sercets very high standard of quality that Justin has built over the years. Why he is working with reaper is beyond me other then he had very few options. Was hard plastic an option early in devolpement? Which is a total shame.
I would have pledged without thought if they where hard plastic.
I dumped in the plastic tables kickstarter and got two 4x6 sets. Really not sure I will be doing this even though I really need dungeon terrain for at least half a dozen games I play. I do really like what I see as far as design. None for this cramped dungeon space that can not fit two figures side by side and crazy prices.
I just do not think $75 is worth the gamble. Those pieces will all be warped and need fixed if that is even possible. I have thrown away all 4 of the bones minis I bought as I was unable to fix them or get the bases to be flat in any way shape or form.
I dunno.
Disappointed. I have been waiting to see what secret weapon was going to do next.
In for 100$! Really looking forward to this, and already have the go-ahead from the missus on the basis of being a good toy for the girls too. Excited!
mercpancake wrote: It is also slow to fund because of reaper being involved. This stuff is going to show up in the normal low quality that reaper bones is know for. Reapers bones quality is terrible and WAY below Sercets very high standard of quality that Justin has built over the years. Why he is working with reaper is beyond me other then he had very few options. Was hard plastic an option early in devolpement? Which is a total shame.
I would have pledged without thought if they where hard plastic.
I dumped in the plastic tables kickstarter and got two 4x6 sets. Really not sure I will be doing this even though I really need dungeon terrain for at least half a dozen games I play. I do really like what I see as far as design. None for this cramped dungeon space that can not fit two figures side by side and crazy prices.
I just do not think $75 is worth the gamble. Those pieces will all be warped and need fixed if that is even possible. I have thrown away all 4 of the bones minis I bought as I was unable to fix them or get the bases to be flat in any way shape or form.
I dunno.
Disappointed. I have been waiting to see what secret weapon was going to do next.
Bones works great for bigger pieces, the bulk adds stability and prevents warping. All the giants, golems, dragons etc I have are great. In particular, the tower from "Dragons Don't Share" shows that can be done with the material on a larger scale. I have a feeling you're speaking from inexperience on how it works on bigger pieces.
Bones is also kid proof. It's also clumsy lummox proof. We won't mention how many times I've dropped stuff in the process of painting, only for it to shatter into a million pieces.
It is definitely not a suitable presentation material for Crystal Brush awards, no. But for gaming/ playing/ painting/ getting a nice spread of terrain for a reasonable price? Sure.
Should work just fine for MD. Each MD square is a 4x4 tile. You can either paint the "light" tiles a different color from the "dark" tiles, or use tiles from a different game tile set (eg. SWM's Malice RPG or Dwarven Forge) for the "light" (or "dark") tiles, or toss some terrain or furniture mini's for the "light" tiles or something.
Lemme know if you need a pic so you know what I'm rambling about.
...and core walls unlocked!
Next unlock at 35K!
42 pieces in base set
22 in core walls
64 total already!
ObPic for anyone who doesn't want to go back a page:
So.. are these add-ons like that wall set being added into the core box set, like for retail at the end? or are they going to be something that's packaged and sold separately? I'd love to be able to add on a couple packs of extra mine cart tracks in the end
@ Necros -- you will be able to add any of the unlocked individual sets during the campaign, and after. The Starter Set will go to retail, but what we're calling the Core Set for the campaign, with all of the free additions, is a campaign exclusive.
@ ced1106 -- thanks for posting that!!!
@ Bossk_Hogg -- Well said!
@ highlord -- well, I do think Jim Wappel did win a couple of Crystal Brush awards with Bones models, but those would be larger items like the Giantess. Also, you know, Wappel
You'd need to stick with 2" passageways for larger models, but you could absolutely run Zone Mortalis in a Mine setting.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Folks have been asking about the Core Set once the first four goals are unlocked -- and since a picture is worth a thousand words I went and made a video. Those are worth ONE MEEEELEON words
You'll find it at the top of the campaign page, just under the big layout picture and "What are..." text.
This shows everything that will be included in the $75 Core Set Pledge once we unlock the first four stretch goals...
So I'll go ahead and share the plans up to $100,000 - at $20,000 we unlocked the Core Set. At $35,000 we unlocked the Core Walls, which not only added 22 more wall pieces to every core, but also unlocked the ability to buy *just* the Core Walls (or extra copies added to your Core). At $55,000 we're unlocking the Core Passageways Set, which will add 12 Passageway (1" wide) floor tiles to every core Set (bringing the core up to 24 passageway tiles total, and also unlocking the ability to buy just the passageways, or extra passageways if you already have some. At $75,000 we're adding the Core Floors Set, which will add 2 more 4x4 floors, 2 more 2x2 floors, and 2 more quarter circle floors to every core (6 total pieces), and like the previous two, unlock the ability to buy just the Floors Set. And then at $100,000, the plan is to unlock the Core Doors Set (no pun intended), which is slightly different from the others. Right now the Core Set has 2 doors and 1 "Mine entrance" tile which is 1x4". The Doors Set adds not 2, but 4 additional doors - 2 of each type (Sculpt A, Sculpt B). Bringing the total number of doors up not to 5 but to 7. Note that the Doors Set does NOT include the Mine Entrance Tile. The doors set also unlocks the ability to buy 4 doors as an add-on.
This means at $100,000, the Core set will feature 86 total pieces, compared to 42 pieces when we hit funding goal yesterday - slightly more than doubling your initial value.
Then, at $115,000, we start showing new things that are not currently part of the core... And believe me we have so many fun features to showcase, including more parts to add in to the Core! But i'm not really supposed to talk about them... mine tracks, bridges, monster lairs... you know, secret stuff...
@Misterjustin: Could you upload a Youtube version of the KS video so I can embed them in forum posts? Or what's the code to embed it in BBCode posts? Thanks!
ObPic: Here's what you get once we hit the 55K SG! Already at 40K!
This second one, for the Core Set stretch goals, is unlisted on YouTube because we're going to give it a bit of polish.
Let me know if there's anything in particular you'd like to see, and I'll do my best to get into the studio and take some pictures.
Oh yes -- there will be monster lairs. Lots of awesome monster lairs... and since I'm working with Reaper Miniatures there will also be options to populate those monster lairs
we're using Pantone 430C as our product color. It is a very dark grey.
@ Jonathan -- there is detail, and texture, on the top of the walls. We've left Reaper HQ for the night, but I'm already planning to get some detail photos (and video) tomorrow (Wednesday) morning. There are no plain surfaces in the set -- even the big 4x6" Stacker, which MUST be flat so you can put things on top of it, is covered in a beautiful web of cracks, and pickaxe marks.
@ Manchu -- That's fantastic work! Thanks for backing the current project too. I've had some Forgotten City tiles shipped to Reaper HQ so I can show them off WITH THE DUNGEON TILES as well
@ ironicsilence -- Thank you very much!
@ced1106 -- Thank you for the cross-posting. Much appreciated. I do my best to keep up, but...
A quick clarification -- Thomas doesn't QUITE fit on the tracks. The train wheels and the tracks are the same width -- but if you pop off the wheels that center block will fit inside the tracks in the same way that our stock mine cart does
Reaper Byran and I are also queuing up some stretch goal previews to properly show off the expansion sets.
Based on the previous comments about starter sets, I figured I'd put this here. Good comparison as it shows the amazing level of detail. This is like a quality model vs. a kids toy you had when you were 10. And of course this photo doesn't include the unlocks that have already started to arrive and make the Tablescapes set oh so much bigger. To be fair, the dwarven forge set in their photo isn't painted, but the differences in quality and detail are pretty obvious.
You should definitely be comparing it to the dwarven forge Caverns sets, including the stretch goals, rather than the dungeon / castle set (which somewhat inherently can't have as much detail as either the DF or SW carvern-type sets).
It differs for different backers. Some can afford to spend thousands of dollars on game tiles, and, if you can spend that much money, go for what you can get. I know backers who buy ten or more sets of DF at a time, easily plunking down over $1500 on a DF KS. That much money for game tiles is *way* out my monthly gaming budget, considering that I also spend it on miniatures, boardgames, snacks, etc..Also, of course, DF is no longer running their various KS, so if you're buying game tiles *today*, you have to compare DF's retail prices vs. SWM's KS prices. Of course, in three weeks, you'll have to pay "late backer" prices for the SWM tiles, and, in three months even higher.
Okay, finally some add-ons from today's update, for the $5 add-on level!
I was wondering about some of the crazy high DF pledges, I was assuming a lot of times it was gaming groups going in together for one huge pledge
I think DF just decided to pursue the whale market on backers and ditch the rest of us on their last 2 campaigns. Most of their stretch goals were more stuff to buy, rather than actually adding appreciable value through piece repetition. It was a rich guy's game, with light up pieces and motorized drawbridges ratcheting up costs. The break away walls seemed more designed as a toy than a gaming aid for dungeon masters. Which I guess is their right. It just kind of sucks when you realize you've been ditched as a target customer. $40 for a 4"x4" building is when I noped out. I can get a tabletop world piece for about that!
To celebrate the unlocking of the mine cart add-on (and to remind you to get a second set for the bad guys), here's the Indian Jones Temple of Doom minecart chase set to Mario64 music.
BANJOS FOR EVERYONE. Small child nearly torn in half over lava pit not included.
So I finally have a few seconds to jump in here and say hello.... and THANK YOU FOR THE INDIANA JONES VIDEO!
That laugh did me a lot of good
Many thanks for keeping the news up here. I always try to make it back, but these things are just crazy bonkers.
I am also very glad that we could move the tracks up. It meant shuffling a few other things, but it's totally worth it... even if there's a late night graphics scramble happening now to update all of the showcase, and target images.
The Troll Hole is a fun piece -- and that doorway make a wonderful addition to a diorama style base as well. I'm hoping to be able to offer that (and a few other small pieces) as stand-alone products. Not sure yet, but it's too cool not to try.
I'm going to need that stone pillar, the risers, and the bridges. I also hope we get to the traps.
I know the prices are a steal but this is going to take a massive bite out of my kickstarter budget. It's so tempting to go overboard with this. If Secret Weapon uses the Bones 3 model of allowing backers to add to their pledge for a few months after the campaign ends it's going to be brutal.
I was thinking of a scenario that used multiple dungeon sections along with an outdoor area, where any miniatures moving outdoors need to make checks or succumb to paralysis and/or death from the cold. A couple of these sets would work fine for that.
Preview! 120K has four doors added to each pledge, 140K has the bridge add-on.
Reaper: "The bridges are multipart, the pillar for support, the frame, and the planks, which can be arranged to leave larger or smaller gaps at your discretion."
I'm a bit surprised this project isn't higher, I hope we can fund the bridges and there aren't a ton of sculpts that will be left potentially unfunded. Just under 3 days left..
Cryptek of Awesome wrote: They delved too greedily and too deep. You know what they awoke in the darkness...Mr. Whiskers.
Heh. If I were cynical I'd suggest that the $35 of the core set price is essentially an add-on for the SGs.
I haven't decided on this one yet, but I imagine that the relatively low total is because it's just not that compelling - and the biggest (KS) market for these things has probably already sunk their money into DF's KS on the high end, or Battle Systems on the more affordable end.
To me at least, they look great - but I don't trust Bones' gakky PVC to not turn everything sticky if I try to paint them using normal means - and/or warp horribly. I don't even know what I'd actually do with them exactly, and obviously you need at least 2 sets to make anything substantial, so....
willb2064 wrote: I'm a bit surprised this project isn't higher, I hope we can fund the bridges and there aren't a ton of sculpts that will be left potentially unfunded. Just under 3 days left..
Cryptek of Awesome wrote: They delved too greedily and too deep. You know what they awoke in the darkness...Mr. Whiskers.
"We have some Bones add-on sets that we were going to save until we had unlocked their corresponding creature lairs... but those are available NOW as add-on items as well. "
Looks like there was going to be a monster themed add on for each creature but funding wasn't even close. We got a troll hole and MAY see an ork lair. They didn't want to adjust stretch goals when it was clear this wasn't going to blow up and here we are.
One set's fine to add as a subsection of a larger dungeon, or as terrain for a miniatures wargame.
Personally, I think they could have gone with a "Monsters and Mines" direction, rather than just "mines". Anyone who already has enough game tiles would be interested in the monster lairs. The orc lair game tiles from the video look great.
Still, $75 for 89 pieces is a pretty good price if you're looking for game tiles. Same goes for the $10 paint sets, and 1/2 off Bones miniatures.
Track Wall Set add-on now available in the Pledge Manager!
Some cool stuff there. Good prices (I wish the stairs were a little cheaper or were available in multi-packs). Don't need the core set though (as great as it looks), so probably in for the Mine add-on.
Another posted mentioned how he'll use the pieces for Frostgrave, and I found this pic of the similar SWM "Malice RPG" tiles set. I was fiddling around with the game tiles, and, while this pic isn't exactly a wargame miniatures setup, it should give you an idea how you can use the Tablescapes walls for miniature wargaming. (The Tower is by Epix Haven, and comes prepainted with removable floors.)
EDIT: Possible unlocks after funding ends. Orc lair at 170K!
$6 for the two-wall set (each set has five pieces total).
Next SG at 190K: 4-piece stacker set!
(SG's may be unlocked after the funding period is over if enough funds are added while the Pledge Manager is still open. Join during the funding period for access to the Pledge Manager.)
I'm in for two core sets and a few add-ons. I'm going to have to add the rest of the sets I need in the pledge manager. So many things I can use these for.
Exciting news today as we unlock a post-campaign stretch goal. Wait, what? YES! We have raised enough additional funds after the campaign to unlock an additional item. The 2x2" Stacker is now available to add to your pledge.
Interesting. Backing via the PM gives a price of $95 per base set rather than $75 via the KS. First time I've seen increasing prices for late/PM backers. I'll pass.
Solid names behind it so fingers crossed!
