Anyone here like this one? Of all the movies that get sequels this one had to be the one that didn't.
I went in with looooow expectations after that massive pile of steaming celuloid excrement Stallone defecated onto movie screens not long enough ago and was pleasantly shocked by the movie that greeted me.
It had minor flaws here and there but all in all I really loved this one.
I'm in the liked Stallone camp as well. It's a nicely cheesy 90s movie and it totally works in that realm. But the 2012 version is a legit awesome action movie. It does kindda suck it didn't get a sequel but by now, it'll be like the Deadpool sequel at best. By that I mean watchable but production companies will get involved and muddy the process with
"Trust us, audiences like THIS and THESE and let's put SO AND SO in it because he's hot right now"
So I'm fine with the one and done. It's a really good one and done
Dredd absolutely nailed, well, Dredd. His tight control, his assured nature. Consider his fire discipline compared to those he’s taking on. Barely a shot wasted. Completely in control.
Judge Dredd however nailed Megacity 1’s visuals. It looked exactly as it should, even if it choked pretty much everywhere else.
Me, I’m very excited for the upcoming MC-1 tv show. Karl Urban is even open to returning. But one hopes more as cameo appearances. Judge Dredd is best when the city is the main player. Really let’s it show off its insanity.
Movie podcast "Sequelisers" did a great show on both movies and the sequel that will most likely never be.
We're back for another mid-season discussion, not so much covering a good or bad sequel, so much as a non-existent one. This week we are taking a look at a sequel to 2012’s Dredd; what we liked about the film, what we would like to see in a sequel and how likely that will be.
That plugged, I love Dredd, it maintains a fine balance between the insanity of 2000AD's universe and keeping things toned down enough to not be over the top alienating for people new to the franchise. Plenty of cameos, references and whatnot are worked into the movie though for the die-hards to spot and point at.
The marketing of this film was abysmal and only drove low expectations, but it really is fantastic.
Urban's cold statement of fact when he almost whispers "I am the law", as opposed to Stallone's blustering of that line, is one of the most amazing scenes I've ever seen in a film. His portryal of a character almost entirely through scowling alone was awesome.
As an IP, “Judge Dredd” is classic comedy duo: you have a hardnosed straight man in Dredd himself who is constantly foiled by the slapstick absurdity of the Big Meg. The 2012 movie gets Dredd right but stumbles badly with Mega City One. The Stallone picture from 1995 gets Dredd catastrophically wrong but absolutely nails Mega City One.
Manchu wrote: As an IP, “Judge Dredd” is classic comedy duo: you have a hardnosed straight man in Dredd himself who is constantly foiled by the slapstick absurdity of the Big Meg. The 2012 movie gets Dredd right but stumbles badly with Mega City One. The Stallone picture from 1995 gets Dredd catastrophically wrong but absolutely nails Mega City One.
I think budget concerns is why MC looks a tad dull, no point splashing money for the brief opening prior to getting stuck in Peach Trees (which should have had a british celeb name, but global audience I guess)
I loved the new Dredd, but I think the Stallone Dredd might be more rewatchable. The old one was campy and a bit silly, but so were the Dredd comics and novels I've read. Urban Dredd may be the better Dredd, and his film may be better written and directed, but it's just a bit too serious for its source material and difficult to find joy in past the surface level story and acting.
I agree with Bob. Overall, Stallone's Dredd was a far better tonal match to the comics, where Urban's Dredd was too self-serious.
If only there were a Paul Verhooven version, like Robocop & Starship Troopers. Someone who really got the underlying parody and wouldn't be afraid to go over the top with Reagan/Thatcher. With all the news about police brutality and the whole Trump/May nonsense, you'd think someone would tackle the material properly.
Only thing I really liked in the Stallone film was the ABC bot, though I understand the consideration of how city was presented in it. The one with Karl Urban was fantastic and I even ended up buying the 3D Blu-ray of it.
Picked dread up on blu ray release as was actually surprised how good it was. It sold pretty well on disc compared to lower cinema turnover apparently. Was also the only 3D blu ray i have/had and the mini gun scene was cool to watch in 3D.
Hopefully the rebellion series when it comes out will be good.
Dredd was superb. Excellent film, and beautifully true to the comics. Also, Karl Urban is always enjoyable - props to him for being willing to keep the helmet on all movie.
That was one of his demands, along with not kissing Anderson or that stuff. He's a big fan of the source material so he knows what you should or shouldn't do.
Kilkrazy wrote: I rather enjoyed the Stallone film, too. I haven't seen the newere one but I've heard it's very good.
You are correct. It was imo the best movie of the year but I missed it in the cinema because it was advertised as a 3D special effect mumbo jumbo. The soundtrack is epic too. Karl Urban nailed the Dredd character and his female companion (Anderson) did also fine job. The slow mo effects were pretty neat as well and the depictions of Anderson´s psychic powers, too.
The Stallone movie paled in comparison. Yes, it was campy because mostly of Schneider and Stallone didn´t bother with the background material too much because he insisted on showing his face. Well, Dredd is known for never showing his face as he is depicted in his comics more than a symbol of justice and a law abiding machine than a normal human being. At least it included the psycho Angel family and an ABC warbot.
Can we also admit that Dredd was beautiful in its simplicity? In a world of overly complex movies with "try too hard" engrained into their cores...and dripping with political messages (though, let's be honest Dredd is a tongue-in-cheek quasi political commentary on lots of things), Dredd's simple plot was one of its best features.
Locked in a building, and people want to kill you.
Sometimes that's all we need. This movie could have been done a million awful ways, and we just lucked out and got a proper version. How easy would it have been to install a half dozen Hollywood tropes into the core of the story? Oh..."Mama" is just a result of police brutality from 30 years ago when her father was wrongfully executed by a Judge, so...blah blah blah. This video is pretty spot on as well:
Elbows wrote: Can we also admit that Dredd was beautiful in its simplicity? In a world of overly complex movies with "try too hard" engrained into their cores...and dripping with political messages (though, let's be honest Dredd is a tongue-in-cheek quasi political commentary on lots of things), Dredd's simple plot was one of its best features.
Locked in a building, and people want to kill you.
Sometimes that's all we need. This movie could have been done a million awful ways, and we just lucked out and got a proper version. How easy would it have been to install a half dozen Hollywood tropes into the core of the story? Oh..."Mama" is just a result of police brutality from 30 years ago when her father was wrongfully executed by a Judge, so...blah blah blah. This video is pretty spot on as well:
thank you for linking to this video. I'd never seen it before.
Manchu wrote: It doesn’t really matter that The Raid released ahead of Dredd, except it has led people to erroenously presume Dredd ripped off The Raid.
Whether or not Dredd ripped off The Raid, The Raid is easily the superior film.
Manchu wrote: It doesn’t really matter that The Raid released ahead of Dredd, except it has led people to erroenously presume Dredd ripped off The Raid.
Whether or not Dredd ripped off The Raid, The Raid is easily the superior film.
Knowingly repeating false information on the net is a crime, citizen. 30 days in an iso-cube.
As others already said Dredd was too close to The Raid, which is clearly superior. Still an average B movie that worths a watch though.
The stallone old Dredd is also nothing more than a B movie but I certainly prefer it over the 2012 remake. I managed to watch it 3 times at least while I've never wanted to watch the 2012 Dredd a second time.
@Manchu & Elbows - it's OK for you to like the inferior Dredd film, and it's OK for you to like the inferior fight-out-of-a-building film. But pretending that it's better than Judge Dredd or The Raid suggests that you're the ones taking Slo-Mo...
I was just about to say that 2012 Dredd has no Armand Assante LAAAWWWWWWGHHHHH moment to grant it true greatness.
I will reiterate though that Stallone Dredd felt more like the comics I read in tone, as well as with the craziness of the setting. Urban Dredd is too serious, too grounded. And Urban himself is just too charming, even as Dredd. There's a reason comics Dredd always has SS runes reflecting over his eyes. Sure, Stallone Dredd himself isn't really the same character, but at least he wears glorious pauldrons instead of replacing them with textured shoulder pads like he's ashamed of his source material.
I was just about to say that 2012 Dredd has no Armand Assante LAAAWWWWWWGHHHHH moment to grant it true greatness.
I will reiterate though that Stallone Dredd felt more like the comics I read in tone, as well as with the craziness of the setting. Urban Dredd is too serious, too grounded. And Urban himself is just too charming, even as Dredd. There's a reason comics Dredd always has SS runes reflecting over his eyes. Sure, Stallone Dredd himself isn't really the same character, but at least he wears glorious pauldrons instead of replacing them with textured shoulder pads like he's ashamed of his source material.
Judge Stallone is superficially more like the comics, in that it replicates the surface detail of aesthetic and the most obvious "text". 2012 Dredd grasps the substance of the comics, their subtext, both Dredd as a character and the casual horror of existence in Megacity One, and the reason it largely bails on the surface detail stuff is less that it's ashamed of the source material and more than it was made for ~40 sodding million dollars, whereas if the Stallone ego-vehicle had been made in 2012 it would have had a budget of over 150 million - they gave the Judges a style that would work with the aesthetic their shooting locations and CGI budget would allow.
So given the film made for less than 1/3 the cost and that wasn't able to faithfully represent the comics aesthetics is still more of a Dredd movie than the huge flashy expensive one, I'd say 2012 Dredd takes it by a country mile.
And that's just it. Demolition Man was a big hit for him, not to mention a movie rated PG15, so when he came on board for Judge Dredd he had several demands, including that it would be rewritten into a PG15 rating (got a 16 instead) and that his good friend Rob also got a part.
If Sly was as big a fan as he claimed to be, he'd keep the flipping helmet on, not kiss Hershey and be the brutal fascist he is supposed to be, lady Justice be damned. Also, Fergee is supposed to be a big moron living in the sewers, not some whiny Schneider..
Manchu wrote: It doesn’t really matter that The Raid released ahead of Dredd, except it has led people to erroenously presume Dredd ripped off The Raid.
Whether or not Dredd ripped off The Raid, The Raid is easily the superior film.
Knowingly repeating false information on the net is a crime, citizen. 30 days in an iso-cube.
Judge Strg Alt: "Judge Techpriestsupport, his goldfish pet license has expired, too. That´s a Code 10 for illegal imprisonment. I add 30 days to your sentence, creep."
Judge Dredd has a lot of problems to it and for me the root of it had to do with the whole thing being a theme-park version of the comic it was adapting. This was the standard for comic book/superhero movies at the time and can also be seen in the decline of the batman movies and other stand-alone contemporaries like Steel and Spawn, and the aversion to that is why later successful superhero films (x-men, blade) pushed a hardcore 'grounded' aesthetic until spider-man brought the spandex back.
Because Judge Dredd was such a theme park movie though, they basically had no choice but to push the grim realism angle in order to define themselves visually against it and for the most part I like the result. It's very much a 'serious 2000s' reimagining of the premise with recognizable elements from the comics like the high tech guns, distinctive helmets, eagle motiffed shoulders, and integrates them down into something more economical and therefore more grounded feeling. Likewise the character of Mega City One is very different, largely highlighting the differences between what people thought future urban blight would look like in in the 80s vs today.
All that is a difference in tone though, as a film by itself Dredd is superior: it's closed-in premise belies its lower budget (thanks largely to its opening sequence) but its entire cast keeps its plot moving and its set pieces are way more satisfying than its predecessor.
Yeah, I like it a lot. And I wish they'd Make Dredd 2:
Yodhrin wrote: Judge Stallone is superficially more like the comics, in that it replicates the surface detail of aesthetic and the most obvious "text". 2012 Dredd grasps the substance of the comics, their subtext,
On the contrary. Dredd 2012 completely fails to recognize that Judge Dredd is fundamentally a parody at its core. The only "serious" element is Judge Dredd himself, and that's because he's obviously insane. The rest is entirely over-the-top nonsense. It's aesthetically more Monty Python than Warner Dark Knight Batman, aside from the notion that we're going to spend 2 hours watching a far too self-serious man wearing a ridiculously impractical costume romp about in some dystopian version of Disneyland. Failing to capture that tonal essence completely misses the mark, and is the precise reason that "serious" Dredd 2012 is an utter failure at almost every level. The fact that Dredd 2012 might as well be a cosplay version of The Raid only underscores the point.
Yodhrin wrote: Judge Stallone is superficially more like the comics, in that it replicates the surface detail of aesthetic and the most obvious "text". 2012 Dredd grasps the substance of the comics, their subtext,
On the contrary. Dredd 2012 completely fails to recognize that Judge Dredd is fundamentally a parody at its core. The only "serious" element is Judge Dredd himself, and that's because he's obviously insane. The rest is entirely over-the-top nonsense. It's aesthetically more Monty Python than Warner Dark Knight Batman, aside from the notion that we're going to spend 2 hours watching a far too self-serious man wearing a ridiculously impractical costume romp about in some dystopian version of Disneyland. Failing to capture that tonal essence completely misses the mark, and is the precise reason that "serious" Dredd 2012 is an utter failure at almost every level. The fact that Dredd 2012 might as well be a cosplay version of The Raid only underscores the point.
To try and fit Judge Dredd into just one box misses the point of Dredd even more thoroughly than missing the fact it is a parody. As Mad Doc says, it varies tone, but it goes beyond that to full-on vary the message.
The 2012 version misses your idea of Dredd, and you don't have to like it, but it hits on several ideas explored in Dredd over the last 20 or more years so people who do like it are not "wrong".
Having said that, the 90s version also does hit several of the ideas bang on too. I didn't hate it, but I prefer the 2012 version.
Not at all. The Raid is not a Judge Dredd movie. You keep harping on The Raid but the fact that both movies used a similar structure for similar reasons (budget constraints) is the only relevant point. No one who likes Dredd because it’s a Judge Dredd movie is ever going to consider The Raid a preferable alternative because it’s not a Judge Dredd movie.
One of the secrets to Dredd’s longevity (and as a single, coherent timeline) is how it’s been able to vary its tone.
Sure, stuff like the utterly bonker Hottie House Siege is straight up silliness. And much of the oriiginal, early stuff was firmly tongue in cheek.
But when you start to get to stuff like Doomsday for Dredd, and the relatively recent Day Of Chaos? That stuff is played straight.
Perhaps the problem lies in which comics we have read. I've only read the early "Rogue Trader" Dredd and not the straighter "Dark Imperium" Dredd. So while I do enjoy Dredd 2012 as a movie, it feels less like the Judge Dredd I am familiar with.
Plus, LAAAWWWWWRRGHHHHH!
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JohnHwangDD wrote: To judge the 1990s Dredd against 20 years material that was created *after* the movie is even more of a mistake.
And again, if you prefer the 2012 version, then The Raid does the whole thing much better.
What does "the whole thing" mean? Are there sci fi elements in The Raid? I always thought it was just another police and/or crime movie, and had no interest in seeing it until someone up thread said it's a martial arts movie. (Is that true?) If The Raid is just another mainstream movie, I find Dredd better by default.
Forbidden Planet may just be The Tempest in space, but that "in space" part makes all the difference to me.
JohnHwangDD wrote: And again, if you prefer the 2012 version, then The Raid does the whole thing much better.
What does "the whole thing" mean? Are there sci fi elements in The Raid? I always thought it was just another police and/or crime movie, and had no interest in seeing it until someone up thread said it's a martial arts movie. (Is that true?) If The Raid is just another mainstream movie, I find Dredd better by default.
Forbidden Planet may just be The Tempest in space, but that "in space" part makes all the difference to me.
The whole "few guys against an army in a building" thing. No, it's not a sci-fi movie. It's an Asian police movie, so yes, there is some fighting. Indonesian fighting (Penjac Silat), so it looks different from what you've seen from Hong Kong / China / Japan. I wouldn't say it's mainstream in an American context, but it might be mainstream for Indonesia.
Yodhrin wrote: Judge Stallone is superficially more like the comics, in that it replicates the surface detail of aesthetic and the most obvious "text". 2012 Dredd grasps the substance of the comics, their subtext,
On the contrary. Dredd 2012 completely fails to recognize that Judge Dredd is fundamentally a parody at its core. The only "serious" element is Judge Dredd himself, and that's because he's obviously insane. The rest is entirely over-the-top nonsense. It's aesthetically more Monty Python than Warner Dark Knight Batman, aside from the notion that we're going to spend 2 hours watching a far too self-serious man wearing a ridiculously impractical costume romp about in some dystopian version of Disneyland. Failing to capture that tonal essence completely misses the mark, and is the precise reason that "serious" Dredd 2012 is an utter failure at almost every level. The fact that Dredd 2012 might as well be a cosplay version of The Raid only underscores the point.
Urban's Dredd is obviously insane in the movie. The way he "hotshots" the hostage taker was utterly insane. They guy could have pulled the trigger on the victim. A regular bullet to the mouth would have instantly severed his spine at the brainstem and made it impossible for him to shoot. The hotshot was insane and sadistic.
Anderson hinted at something deep in dredd but the chief judge cut her off.
Mama recognized the similarities between herself and dredd.
Dredd's disposal of mama was again sadistic and insane. Why give her the slomo? Sadism. Also use if an illegal drugs, something dredd wouldn't do. His sadism backfired on him tho he never knew it. I think mama kind of enjoyed her fall. Hey, she said it herself, dying violently was part of the life she was in.
Dredd also did not know for certain her trigger wouldn't work. He made an educated guess. But the way he let his breath out and said "Yeah" when the bombs didn't go off, he wasn't sure but was willing risk the block to kill mama.
Also saying that dredd wasn't like the comic is only slightly correct. Earlier dredd comics where schlocky and comedic, with silly overtimes. Later comics like "America" adopted a much more serious tone. A lot of later dredd stories went more mature, even using the s word in them. There we're hokey older comics with ridiculous tech and silly characters, there are also darker and more serious comics. The dredd movie was set in the latter era.
JohnHwangDD wrote: To judge the 1990s Dredd against 20 years material that was created *after* the movie is even more of a mistake.
And again, if you prefer the 2012 version, then The Raid does the whole thing much better.
When did I judge the 1996 version against material made after it? I don't even dislike the 1996 version. I judge 1996 against 1996, and 2012 against 2012 and prefer 2012. And they are so different that it is a little bit like like saying Brooklyn 99 is better than The Wire. They just don't compare directly anyway. If I could only watch one ever again, I would choose The Wire, but it is not as if I hate Brooklyn 99.
Similarly, I like Star Trek:TNG AND I like Battlestar Galactica. One being better doesn't make the other one bad, no matter how similar they are. I've not seen The Raid, bit part of the reason I like Dredd is that it has Dredd in it. Does The Raid have Dredd in it?
You seem to have an irrational dislike of this movie and be unable to cope with other people having a different opinion...
Dredd 2012 also has a better character study of Justice Department, and indeed Judge Dredd.
Consider. Anderson was a wash out. She'd failed. Dredd took her out, and ultimately, she should've been a failure. Worse, she's a mutie.
But, we see Dredd discover what the Chief Judge was angling at. Had it not been for Anderson's presence in Peach Trees, they never would've caught Mama in time. Remember, Mama was looking to start pedalling her filth in other blocks - and Slo-Mo was already becoming a threat to the city.
I'd argue it's a better intro to the unaware than Judge Dredd. It's about Justice Department, and Dredd being the living embodiment of it's absolute ruthlessness. He's controlled. He's precise, and yes, he's vindictive.
Throwing Mama off the balcony is one. Throwing her henchmen is another. But even so - he's still less sadistic than those he's up against. He didn't skin either of them before throwing them. Mama left him no choice on her count. Yes it was a risk with the detonator, but the only other choice is unconscionable. Letting Mama live. What sort of a message does that send to other Citizens? Especially when it's Dredd being seen to compromise.
The difference between the two? When Urban's Dredd says that immortal line 'I am, The Law' - he really, really means it. He is an avatar of The Law. At all times.
I think to some degree dredd did care about people in some ways. Just in a kind of distant way.
When he saw the massacre mama committed to take him and the gang member out, I think it bothered him to see so many peopel massacred so casually. Throwing mama's boy down the shaft in front of her was his declaration of war, as in "Yeah, you're gonna pay for this."
BTW, was it kinda cold of me to sing the line "It's raining men! " when mama's gang tossed the guys off the balcony?
One point: Anderson didn't fail her assessment because she lost her primary weapon. She never lost her psi power, and that was her primary weapon. Lawgiver pistols roll off assembly lines. Her psi powers don't.
Anderon's use to Justice Department goes beyond The Slab. She can crack people that would resist standard interrogation. And often does in the comics.
Justice Department is a fascistic organisation. It's downright cruel to it's Citizens. They don't like something? They'll make it illegal, and come after you.
I think the main flaw for me in Dredd is that it could've spent a bit more time explaining why Justice Department is the way it is. You get Dredd's monologue at the beginning, and his primer to Anderson about 'we can respond to X%, your show, Rookie'. But we didn't really see the sorts of crimes they're up against in MC-1.
Also, Dredd doesn't care for people. That's not his training. That's not his (literal) breeding. He cares for the city. That is his charge. That is his duty.
Though comics wise, he really starts to develop as a character when he starts doubting things. His former Mentor, Judge Minty advises it's normal, and to start wearing boots one size too small. The pinching takes your mind off it.
They are putting out prequel novels that delve into how the system came into being. Also one or two prequel strips following the first proto judges around a crappy America as it shambles towards the nuclear war that will ruin everything.
And Dredd does change over time, even pushing through laws that improve things for some or revising his views on things like say, democracy.
The first time there was a march for democracy he thoroughly sabotaged it with the Wally squad sowing dissent, but the second time around, post-America IIRC, he just let them have their march followed by a vote to see if the Judges should remain in power and they did, because he knew that the majority of people just couldn't care enough about it.
BrookM wrote: ...the second time around, post-America IIRC, he just let them have their march followed by a vote to see if the Judges should remain in power and they did, because he knew that the majority of people just couldn't care enough about it.
Even that was twenty years ago now though, and he is still hard-line though. Arguably because of circumstances, of course.
That is totally incorrect. The Raid straight up ripped off Dredd; Dredd was in development before The Raid and when The Raid creators realized their movie was a complete clone of the Dredd film that was in-development, they rushed it to get it released first.
timeline: Dredd film announced 2008, and a complete draft of the script was leaked in 2010. The Raid began production in March of 2011.
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Manchu wrote: Not at all. The Raid is not a Judge Dredd movie. You keep harping on The Raid but the fact that both movies used a similar structure for similar reasons (budget constraints) is the only relevant point. No one who likes Dredd because it’s a Judge Dredd movie is ever going to consider The Raid a preferable alternative because it’s not a Judge Dredd movie.
Especially because The Raid is not a very good film.
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Luciferian wrote: Dredd 2012 has way more of a sense of humor than people are giving it credit for, it's just in the details.
This is correct. Tonally, Dredd is far more accurate to all eras of the comics. While big colors and lumpy city-blocks make the JD95 film seem "more accurate", there is nothing even remotely similar in that film compared to the comics, except for some character names.
Dredd has definitely evolved over time with lots of stylistic and tonal changes, and I dont think either flick encompasses the totality of that, nor could they really, and thats fine. That said, the 2012 flick really did it for me, I don't have much against it. Though someone else said the 95 movie captured MC1 better, and in some ways, especially the earlier stories, thats true.
The difference between the two? When Urban's Dredd says that immortal line 'I am, The Law' - he really, really means it. He is an avatar of The Law. At all times.
^^^^
Urban's Dredd calmly, almost whispering "I am the law" as a simple statement of fact was an order of magnitude more threatening and impressive than Stallone's Dredd blustering out that line as a defense against a criminal charge.
I had minor issues with dredd but they were MINOR.
The "incendiary" scene. I jsut find it impossible that a shot the size of a 9mm bullet could produce a burst of flaming fragments that could immolate a pretty large area and set over a dozen spread out people on fire. It was a nicely done scene but it was just impossible to believe.
Also who wants to start a fire that large in a densely populated area?
If dredd had pulled something off his belt like the save of an egg or something smiliar, clipped it to his barrel and then fired i could have bought that. But it was minor.
Also dredd hitting mama with slomo just seemed wrong. Slomo is illegal, y'know, tho I wonder why since it's users seemed pretty placid while under it.
What did Mama do at the start? Did Dredd meet her level of cruelty, or dispense Justice?
Clearly, it’s the latter. Near Biblical Judgement. Do unto others and so on. Even when Mama’s demise is entirely upon her own shoulders, Dredd does not match her blow for blow. No skinning. Just a shot of her own poison, and a long, slow drop.*
As for the phosphor shot? Somewhere as cramped as MC-1 (and I accept the external shots didn’t really get that across), a starburst phosphor flare is possibly the very dab?
*Did anyone else get a visceral thrill when seeing how the CGI effect had her face properly split on impact? I did. Not in a kinky way, just an ‘actually, yeah. The body would do that’ way.
What did Mama do at the start? Did Dredd meet her level of cruelty, or dispense Justice?
Clearly, it’s the latter. Near Biblical Judgement. Do unto others and so on. Even when Mama’s demise is entirely upon her own shoulders, Dredd does not match her blow for blow. No skinning. Just a shot of her own poison, and a long, slow drop.*
As for the phosphor shot? Somewhere as cramped as MC-1 (and I accept the external shots didn’t really get that across), a starburst phosphor flare is possibly the very dab?
*Did anyone else get a visceral thrill when seeing how the CGI effect had her face properly split on impact? I did. Not in a kinky way, just an ‘actually, yeah. The body would do that’ way.
I have ZERO problem with dredd tossing her off the balcony. That was about saving the people in the block from her FU bombs. That was actually explained in the movie. That wasn't a crimes that was a necessity created by mama herself.
The slomo was unnecessary and use of an illegal drug. Did dredd think it might keep heartbeat even during the fall? Well, ok. But if he did it to make her suffer I think it mega failed. The whole falling scene suggested she accepted her death and kind of enjoyed the fall. And earlier she'd said she always knew death was part of the life she was in.
Nows trying to translate English to American, i'm assuming your phrase "possibly the very dab" means in American "it was no big deal". Well, normally in a very dense high population area a fire is a bit of a big deal as fire has a tendency to spread when given a chance. . Maybe MC1 architecture focuses on making fire spread less likely.
One of the high-level themes of the film is, who decides what order means? Mama runs Peach Trees as her own empire in a city where, as we learn, only a tiny fraction of the vast amount of crime can even be contemplated by the “legitimate” government. The audience is asked to consider, is Mama’s reign any worse, or put it another way, any less legitimate than the Justice Department’s? And moreover, doesn’t the inability of the Justice Department to actually govern Mega City One sort of justify the ambitions of smart, ruthless gangsters like Mama?
The movie depicts three visions of justice. The first and most pragmatic is that might makes right. This is Mama’s theory, except she doens’t really care what is “right” in any idealistic sense. She was used and abused and has built up her power mostly as a way to make sure she never gets used and abused again, which means she will be the one using and abusing from here out. For her, power is about never being the victim again because you are the highest on the food chain. The second vision holds that the law itself is sacrosanct and violators deserve the harshest punishment. Judge Dredd himself is the symbol of this philosophy. Lastly, there is the notion that laws exist to protect the weak from the predations of the strong, which is Cass Anderson’s idealistic POV.
The movie doesn’t tell us which is correct; it just asks us to think about these theories and their strong points as well as their flaws.
You can perfectly well consider that Dredd uses the slo-mo on Mama because he really is just a fascistic, sadistic bully boy. Or you can consider that Mama’s punishment fits the crime (lex talionis), as MDS argued above. Or you can guess that the slo-mo had something to do with Dredd saving Peach Trees.
The ambiguity is only reinforced by Dredd’s decision to pass Anderson even considering that Anderson herself thinks she has failed. Both Dredd and Anderson, like the audience, have occasion to reconsider the views they begin the movie with — and I like to think that right before she hits, Mama does some rethinking, too.
Dredd had a minor change, he realized that despite "duh roolz" saying Anderson wasn't fit to be a judge, she was.
Anderson changed a little. Early on dredd had to push her to execute a wounded perp on his knees. Near the end she headshot a wounded man without a millisecond hesitation or even a side long glance.
I just watched dredd again, and noted everything in MC1 had a very heavy duty, durable, built to last look. Speakers had heavy steel mesh cages over them, cable connections looked old fashioned and made to last. So did keyboards, etc.
The meme seemed to me that in MC1 the idea of stuff being cheap and disposable was no longer in vouge. Things were meant to last as long as possible. They were built big, durable, simple to use, not like a lot of stuff meant to wear out in couple years like today. MC1 could not support that level of waste like we have today.
That’s a very insightful point. I think it visually supports the thematic suggestion that, by and large, citizens are mostly on their own because there is no way the Justice Department, or any aspect of society, can keep up with the burgeoning population and by extension the depredations of human nature.
Seeing it for £3.99 on Prime, got a digital copy of the Stallone one.
You know, it’s not as bad as I remember. Plot wise it’s a hitch potch of various Dredd Epics. And I still stand by the argument it got the look of MC-1 absolutely spot on.
But man. There are still so, so many flaws with it. No Eagles on anyone but Dredd. Bent Judges going to Aspen. Dredd and Rico not being identical. Dredd’s ‘I knew you’d say that’ thing.
Dredd is still the better movie and representation of the man himself. But Judge Dredd still has stuff to enjoy.
My favorite thing about Stallone Dredd is that you get to see Cursed Earth and the Angel Gang, both of which feature prominently in the comics. It's fun, even if they're just a symptom of the filmmakers trying to pack in as many of the iconic visual elements of the comics as they could.
Dredd is much more a "day in the life" film that gives you a glimpse into an average day in MC1, with a "minor" villain and self-contained storyline. As such, it's more like a single issue of the comic rather than being a conglomeration of lots of representative imagery and ideas from across the whole series. I'm glad they both exist because both approaches still have their merits, but I still think Dredd 2012 is a better film and a better representation of what reading the comics is like.
It should come as no surprise I am a bit of a fan of Dredd (I do like the rurus after all). While I didn't enjoy the Stallone Movie when it came out, it spurred me to find out about the (obviously better) source material.
Dredd 2012 actually succeeds at being a Dredd film, while the Stallone movie is nothing but a thin paintjob over a generic action flick.
I think budget concerns is why MC looks a tad dull, no point splashing money for the brief opening prior to getting stuck in Peach Trees (which should have had a british celeb name, but global audience I guess)
still a great movie mind
IIRC, "Peach Trees" is the name of the restaurant where the director first met with the IP holders to discuss the project.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Seeing it for £3.99 on Prime, got a digital copy of the Stallone one.
You know, it’s not as bad as I remember. Plot wise it’s a hitch potch of various Dredd Epics. And I still stand by the argument it got the look of MC-1 absolutely spot on.
But man. There are still so, so many flaws with it. No Eagles on anyone but Dredd. Bent Judges going to Aspen. Dredd and Rico not being identical. Dredd’s ‘I knew you’d say that’ thing.
Dredd is still the better movie and representation of the man himself. But Judge Dredd still has stuff to enjoy.
Fun fact about the eagle and Stallone's costume in general is that he pushed for that himself. He actually went behind the producers back to the costume department and told them to make his costume as comic accurate as possible. Sly did respect the source material a lot and I do remember him talking about being very peeved at the fact that he was made to remove his helmet in the movie.
I didn't like the Stallone Dredd because they tried to carm it full of every story arc out of the comics. Too much bloat. Just stick to one story arc and make it interesting. If you gonna visit the cursed eart, make the movie about cursed earth. Not just a stupid short hop into it and back again...
They used just about every major arc in the movie as a cameo, exept maybe Judge Death... Bleargh.
I liked the 2012 Dredd much more. Nice tight story. No world shattering stuff, but just a day in a Judges life.
Raid was kind of fun at the start, but the constant action grew old pretty fast. I very much prefer the original (Dredd) over the copy (Raid).
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: According to my sources, he didn't really know Dredd at all, and did the opposite?
I mean, a lovey dovey scene with Hershey? Puhlease.
I'd heard that yes, he wasn't aware of the character, but that when he found out that people were upset about seeing Dredd's face he said he'd have been fine with leaving the helmet on. I mean, his voice is as well-known as his face - we'd all have known it was him anyway.
I think budget concerns is why MC looks a tad dull, no point splashing money for the brief opening prior to getting stuck in Peach Trees (which should have had a british celeb name, but global audience I guess)
still a great movie mind
IIRC, "Peach Trees" is the name of the restaurant where the director first met with the IP holders to discuss the project.
That's not a very good inside joke, then. It isn't amusing even if you're in on it.
