After the hubbub of the leaked prices for the new box set and the preview of both Jain Zar and Drazhar's rules I noticed there was a seemingly sharp backlash or at the very least vocal disappointment for the release of Phoenix Rising and in some cases the rest of Psychic Awakening.

I first put this poll up on a few Reddit subs but I want to see if I can hit a bigger demographic as at the time of making this thread the general consensus seems to be one of concern swinging back and forth. I tried to offer as many choices as possible, including a wait and see option, so feel free to vote and explain further in the comments below if necessary.

http://www.strawpoll.me/18768371

As a Necron player myself and someone who was on the fence about Craftworlds as a potential second army I'm cautiously optimistic as a FYI.

Totally meh for me.
I dont collect DE so dont care about them.
I do collect CWE but the release so far has (very) little to no interest.

Im hoping Crons and Nids get better loving when their sections drop.

The phoenix isn't the only thing rising around here!

Would be nice if you actually created a poll here instead of posting a link, but whatever.

Not really excited as an Eldar player at the moment. From what we've seen with Jain Zar and the banshees, GW is not capable of balancing units to what we've recently seen for marines. This will probably dictate the success of the series, a direct comparison to the level of power marines have risen to with their recent codexes. This is not a small rant about marines since I'm currently building Raven Guard, but the next few months will be a good representation for what we can expect for the rest of 8th edition.

I will probably still buy it... I love Howling Banshees and my wife really enjoys Incubi, so the set was practically made for us...

That being said, the preview yesterday was a bit of a let down. They had a chance to really take these two heroes up a step or two... neither really pop up in anything but fluffy lists, and they're not really game changers in what the bring to the table. But after the rules spoiling yesterday, they're more-or-less unchanged (or worse off in some cases).

I was really disappointed to see Jain lose Disarming Strike in favor of a blender mode. Now she really needs to chase chaff and will be just barely better than a stock HQ without aura buffs if she's not allowed to blender into some poor unit (that's probably not worth her attention in the first place). At least with Disarming Strike she could lock down some really irritating CC characters and help out in that department.

I've never been a fan of her Aspect power, either. Fight first is cool and all, but hardly a buff worth writing home about, especially when the unit engaged will either melt on contact or withdraw and not have to fight next round anyways.

The one-on-one contest went to Jain, but with Drazhar having the capability of doubling his attacks and a much more impactful aura of adding 1 to Incubi wound rolls, and all of his attacks doing flat 2 damage... I think he wins overall. I'll still play Jain with my Banshees, but I don't expect to actually get anything out of this new box worth playing outside of the customizable craftworld attributes and possibly the Howling Banshee exarch powers.

I am not an eldar player or anything, but I am very happy that they are FINALLY getting plastic models to replace those ancient sculpts.

I am more excited for the campaign books and whether they will have any good rules or models for my personal faction.

Why no poll here. An outside poll has a bad touch.

As a Drukhari player I really like the new sculpts, and the rules tweaks for Drazhar and Incubi, but they are (for now) bundled in an expensive box with a load of stuff I'm not interested in.

Some of the new Obsessions are interesting, but they aren't really a bonus, but rather a replacement for existing traits.

Overall, a bit disappointed thus far.

bullyboy wrote:Would be nice if you actually created a poll here instead of posting a link, but whatever.

wuestenfux wrote:Why no poll here. An outside poll has a bad touch.

Well originally the poll was just for Reddit so I had to use an outside source. After about 65-70 odd votes initially I kinda wanted a wider demographic as I stated before. I could have used the poll function here to compare the two results to see if there's a disparity, saying that now I will probably do that next time cause it sounds interesting, but I wanted a unified consensus.

I was going to split atlest 2 boxes with a friend, he wanted to start collecting dark elfs and he like new cool models, but after he saw the price he just say no. Even with retailers price that box is just to expensive.
All the rules leaked for now look like nothing special, if that is the case competitive players will not buy the box.

Wow, an expensive box set with half useless to me (don't collect that faction) and the other half just meh (crap units are still just crap units that nobody wants, I already have a couple of falcons - HOW many editions and these are *still* absolute garbage)...

Just... bleurgh. Could we not have had a full aspect warrior release (dual kits) ?

I'm cautiously optimistic, I don't know if I'll be buying the box yet but the campaign book would be awesome for the fluff included.

I do want to add some Incubi to my small Kabal though and I really like Drahzar!

 harlokin wrote:
As a Drukhari player I really like the new sculpts, and the rules tweaks for Drazhar and Incubi, but they are (for now) bundled in an expensive box with a load of stuff I'm not interested in.

This. Voted 'cautiously optimistic' though - expensive bundling aside, the new sculpts are great and the rules certainly look to be an improvement.

 Tyranid Horde wrote:
I'm cautiously optimistic, I don't know if I'll be buying the box yet but the campaign book would be awesome for the fluff included.

I do want to add some Incubi to my small Kabal though and I really like Drahzar!

Yeah I'm more inclined to just get the campaign books when the Necrons come around and I don't believe they'll get any crazy new models (maybe plastic flayed ones or HQs) so some of the issues are beyond my sphere of the hobby.

This is the only time in my life I've been tempted to start Eldar - which is saying something as they've been my most dislkiked faction. The idea of them having all the customizablity of an Imperial force is a really strong pull

Not certain on the box set - it has everything, but that makes it a heck of an upfront investment.

Unless they wow me with a price way lower than I expect, it’s probably a no go.
I really only “Need” 6 of the models in the box, and it’s not like they are going to suddenly go into my army. It’s a unit I have wanted to replace for something like 20 years now.

Reading there article was not impressed. I guess when I am so dispointed in the rules of the game it’s hard to get exited along with the articles tone when they are trying to impress with turn one charge.
Think of all the tactics when you don’t have to think about melee delivery methods. Or anything like that. Bleh. Made me less excited for the release.

That box set is a mess of bad decisions.

I hope the rules in the future are going to be sold without the big box. no way am I paying 250$ for models I may not want.

Yeah, the contents of the box set are just veeeery meh.

On the Eldar side, a lot has already been said about the falcon and vyper: Theyre ancient, generally useless models that GW has only really ever been able to sell as taxes (for formations, in 7th). If you want one, you've had 5 editions to buy one. If you don't, you don't want to be saddled with them.

It's like if a new Space Marine unit came out and they packaged it with the amazing VINDICATOR and everyones favorite THE LAND SPEEDER!

On the Deldar side, Venoms, Raiders, and Wyches are extremely easy to get in discounted sets. They're ALWAYS what's in the discounted sets. So while they aren't bad pieces, there's just not a ton of excitement for me with them.

2x wrack kits, a Venom and a Raider would be much more interesting to me since A) Wracks are a much more expensive kit and would make the hihg price point of the box a lot more palatable to me and B ) the alleged enmity between ynnari and Covens would make for a more interesting box.

Also, as a set of two armies to fight each other, they're very meh. the banshee side is basically never going to be able to fight the wyches. the Deldar side can basically not hurt the eldar tanks. Any game between these two sides would pretty much be "Falcon kills Raider, eldar tanks forced to kite the whole game to avoid Drazar, the only threat to them, Banshees hide in the falcon because they cannot under any circumstances fight wyches."

Then the final kicker to me is the full rules aren't in the box, and the box is so much pricier than other similar army boxes. Basically strikes out on every count for me.

I will still definitely buy Drazar and some Incubi.

the_scotsman wrote:
Yeah, the contents of the box set are just veeeery meh.

On the Eldar side, a lot has already been said about the falcon and vyper: Theyre ancient, generally useless models that GW has only really ever been able to sell as taxes (for formations, in 7th). If you want one, you've had 5 editions to buy one. If you don't, you don't want to be saddled with them.

It's like if a new Space Marine unit came out and they packaged it with the amazing VINDICATOR and everyones favorite THE LAND SPEEDER!

On the Deldar side, Venoms, Raiders, and Wyches are extremely easy to get in discounted sets. They're ALWAYS what's in the discounted sets. So while they aren't bad pieces, there's just not a ton of excitement for me with them.

2x wrack kits, a Venom and a Raider would be much more interesting to me since A) Wracks are a much more expensive kit and would make the hihg price point of the box a lot more palatable to me and B ) the alleged enmity between ynnari and Covens would make for a more interesting box.

Also, as a set of two armies to fight each other, they're very meh. the banshee side is basically never going to be able to fight the wyches. the Deldar side can basically not hurt the eldar tanks. Any game between these two sides would pretty much be "Falcon kills Raider, eldar tanks forced to kite the whole game to avoid Drazar, the only threat to them, Banshees hide in the falcon because they cannot under any circumstances fight wyches."

Then the final kicker to me is the full rules aren't in the box, and the box is so much pricier than other similar army boxes. Basically strikes out on every count for me.

I will still definitely buy Drazar and some Incubi.

At least give the DE a vehicle that can transport the Incubi AND Drazhar. I understand no wracks as that would not work for a Ynnari faction that could utilize the entire box.
It should have at least been Drazhar, Incubi, Raider (so they fit), Scourges and maybe some reavers. Eldar I get the falcon because it actually allows the banshees and jain Zar to ride, and the Serpent sells itself. But give us 3 windriders instead of the Vyper. Poor taste to be dumping old, poorly selling kits onto new players.

The box set seems like GWs "big ask" to me the box set is 230, that's a big price point in my opinion. If it's a straight conversion to Cdn dollars than it's gonna be over 300 before taxes. It's a little hard to justify that here for a lot of people

Isn't it a bit early? I mean the models and set aren't even out yet for people. Right now its a lot of theory and opinion thrown up in the air. At least wait for the dust to settle on things going actually for sale before trying to poll for peoples opinions on the new content.

Otherwise polls like this tend to only attract the most extreme likers/haters of the concept which can even include a lot of people for whom the content would never interest them no matter what GW did (eg those, in this case, who don't like Eldar in any form)

Completely neutral at the moment.

And the Phoenix box does absolutely nothing for me. It contains:
* 1 Falcon & 1 Vyper - No thanks, I'm good. I've had enough Falcons & Vypers for decades now.
* New sculpts of my least favorite aspect & their P.Lord. - They look good. But Banshees are still my least favorite aspect. So if I ever dig out my Eldar & for some reason feel the need to field Banshees my ages old 2e squad & Zar will do just fine.
* A bunch of DE stuff - I don't play DE & have no plans to start, so....

Looking forward to the book to see what it offers, but the box set has been a big disappointment. No way I am going to pay that much money so I can just offload GW of some old warehouse stock. Most of the time I am the idiot that gobbles up every single box set GW has to offer, but even I balk at that price point. Even my FLGS is just ordering one box because they are afraid nobody will buy it.

Don't play elder, don't care.

It's a non-factor to me, really. Will I check out the new Eldar info and stats for some of the units? Sure. The boxed set is an absolute joke, and I find most of GW's fluff and lore right now to be really lazy or ham-fisted...so I have no interest in the "story" they're putting forward.

The amount of Eldar content in the book indicates there is not a new Eldar codex in the immediate future, so that's unfortunate...but some help is better than none. As more armies get more special treatment my CSM Renegades continue to get worse...so that's fun.

So, in short: meh.

The rules look neat. Stuff like +2 to charge and +1 ap to shuriken are enough to get me excited for their book/index/whatever they want to call it.

Box is gak though

Well, I've pre-ordered Drazhar (£20) and 5 Incubi (£25), looking forward to seeing their tweaked rules in action.

Cautiously optomistic as far as the book goes. We've been a little light on rules previews for it so far but the create-your-own Craftworld/Obsession abilities look good enough to at least make use out of them and the one power we've seen from Runes of Fortune looks good. Drazhar has been buffed though sadly Jain Zar has been nerfed. Remains to be seen just how far the rules changes go.

 Overread wrote:
Isn't it a bit early? I mean the models and set aren't even out yet for people. Right now its a lot of theory and opinion thrown up in the air. At least wait for the dust to settle on things going actually for sale before trying to poll for peoples opinions on the new content.

Otherwise polls like this tend to only attract the most extreme likers/haters of the concept which can even include a lot of people for whom the content would never interest them no matter what GW did (eg those, in this case, who don't like Eldar in any form)

Actually this is pretty much why I made the poll in the first place. The internet is prone to knee-jerk itself into oblivion over anything and the 40k fanbase is no exception to the rule. My intent was to try and consolidate the early feelings people had scattered over various forums into a visible graph and I also made sure to leave a neutral option as well as a a wait and see for people like yourself.

What would be interesting would be to have a second poll a few weeks after the release of Phoenix Rising and compare the results to see if there's any change to the "general" consensus.

Still probably too early to tell, but considering how they are only showing new incubi and banshees when there so many finecast models that need to be redone, and considering how crap Jain Zar's statline is (seriously, destroyer lords are better. And destroyer lords aren't great as a beatstick unit.)... yeah, this might be a disappointment, but hopefully GW is still hiding stuff.

A big meh for me.

The contents of the box are, anemic to say the least. When I saw the box contents it was hard not to laugh at just how little is in there.

This could have been a great opportunity for GW to replace the finecast models for Eldar and Dark Eldar... As those two factions still have a lot of Finecast. Sadly GW missed this opportunity... oh well, better luck next time Eldar and Dark Eldar collectors.

What is even more insulting is when we compare it to the attention Marines get. Not even funny.

Personally I'm gobsmacked by how bad this release has been so far. Lukewarm new rules preview, underwhelming character reveal, terrible old stock bulking out a few (very overdue) resculpts, and the nagging suspicion that the new rules are tabulated to pre SM 2.0 power levels. Hope I'm wrong...

Don't like the model contents of the box.

Rules wise Drazar is certainly interesting but not totally sure how you would use him. Sort of similar problem to Incubi in general tbh. Probably going to be very cool in fluffy/non-competitive games. If he is still 140 points I think thats a bit much for a guy you have jogging around looking for something to punch. Deep strike turn 2, with reroll charges, go ham? Would need to check the stats - if its effective 4 damage on 5+ to wound though hes scary to a lot of things, even if not quite a smash captain.

Jain Zar looks very meh - although I guess that time you somehow managed to get right in the middle of say an Ork Boy blob or loads of Genestealers or something and break out 15-20 attacks could be fun (I guess it would mess things up, but she should have counted as flying in the charge phase or something).

As a unit though I just think you are in this weird situation where ignoring overwatch is great for an assault army, and M8 advance and charge +3" is great for an assault army and... its just a shame Eldar don't have many other good assault units to really follow this up. This has surely been proven by the Ynnari codex.

Maybe if there is a new Avatar of Khaine and some new buffed up Scorpions etc and who knows something weird like storm guardians get a kit and love in the future it might change.

Okay; I'm hardly representative of a typical player. I only play 40k as part of a narrative campaign, and my purchases are almost always driven by story considerations. I play neither DE nor CWE yet. I've always wanted to play DE, and I've always been interested in CWE. I also love Yvraine, and I would play a campaign in which the Ynarri try to recruit from both sides. The potential for intrigue is insane.

Bare that in mind. Bias declared. Here we go:

New Models

The sculpts, IMO, are awesome.I'm so glad they maintained the aesthetic.Ever since I became interested in DE, I knew I was going to have to have incubi, and now that Drazhar actually looks like one, I want him too. Also, the choices of units to receive new sculpts were perfect for me- both of the units already have Kill Team rules, which is a really big deal to me, because almost every 40k game I play is preceded by two kill team games which set up the special conditions to be used in the 40k game. Also, all of the new scuplts are connected by story line through Yvraine. I find it particularly cool that as mercenaries, Incubi have no obsessions to lose by joining the Ynarri.

Other Models in the box

From gaming perspective, people are right, they aren't great choices. Luckily, my weirdness makes some of these choices awesome for me. First off, scourges: as with the Incubi, mercenary status means they lose nothing by joining Ynarri. It's true that the Ynarri abilities do nothing for them, but they help fill a Ynarri gap by bringing some versatile ranged fire power. Also, as it happens, I've created a pair of special scenarios for Hellions, and I can't wait to get my hands on a set.In the first mission, the Hellions are set to raid a far less mobile Kill Team- the kind of mission that should have been a cake walk. Then the Khymerae show up. Each time a Hellion takes out a Kymera, they do an opposed leadership test. If they succeed, the Khymera is not destroyed, but overawed and enthralled. After the game, the enthralled Khymerae are added to the Hellion player's roster of available models for subsequent games. Furthermore, the first Hellion to successfully enthral a Khymera is upgraded to a beast master in subsequent games. The Hellions then return to their cult to learn in both the arenas and on realspace raids. Later, once the beast master has racked up a few more packs of nasties, some experience and prestige, the Hellions will escort their beast master in a mission to recruit a Dread Ambull.

On the CWE side, I feel like I'm fine with the models, but that's because I'm new to the faction, and I have nothing for CWE yet. The models are good looking, and I think it was cool to put vehicles in a box, because it's different- most boxes are primarily infantry, and if they do have a vehicle, it's a dread or a walker. I know nothing about the rules for either of these units, so that's all I can really say about them.

Rules

I like the fact that the rules are in the book, not the box. I'm glad datacards for the units in the box are included, although this can go either way: if the units haven't received any upgrades, then this is just a convenience. But if the units did get an upgrade, GW has put themselves in a bind: if the only place the new rules are available is on the cards, Dakka will whine that they had to buy the box to get the cards; if they reprint the updated cards in the book, Dakka will whine about purchasing the same material twice; if they put it up electronically for free, Dakka will whine about needing too many documents; and if they rerelease a new dex, Dakka will whine either about how it took too long, or about how it was just a conspiracy to sell more models, more books or subvert the story line.

The rules we've seen are improvements on what was there before, or they merely provide extra options. As a campaign player, I love options. A competitve player will only ever be interested in the best three options (if that) and automatically declare all others "useless" or "garbage," but us storyfolk tend to see shades of grey a little more vividly, and what might not win you a tournament might make a great chapter in the story of an army. I need to read the whole book to give a more accurate assessment than that; itseems like it's going to be a substantial quantity of new material, but only time will tell.

Also, it remains to be seen if the Ynarri will be getting any kind of rule tweeking or merely be reprinted from the WD article. Most Dakkanauts either dislike Ynarri or are merely indifferent (in my experience), but for me, I'd like to see a little extra for them.

Campaign sets as a delivery mechanism for updated content

I think this is brilliant, and I think it's GW's new trajectory and methodology from here on in. This is the best way IMO to keep the game going forever- a few new models and a few new rules for all 20+ factions every year. I can't wait to see what Grey Knights get, because they really need a push, and this campaign in particular could be a great delivery mechanism for that content.

Psychic Awakening as a Campaign

So far, I'm on board. If each installment gives us a box with some new and some existing models from more than one faction with datacards and a campaign book, as well as a separate, stand alone book of new rules content for those factions, I think that's just great. Many of the installments to come have the potential to be better; some might be worse, but if we have this as sort of a baseline, I think we're in for some good stuff. A big factor will be how long we need to wait for the next installment- the release schedule will have a lot to do with the success or failure of the campaign as a whole.

The theme is great for me- I love cult armies, SoB, SoS and Inquisition, so I'm stoked about a story line that directly connects to the things I appreciate most about the game. I'm hoping for cool new models for wyrdvanes and Primaris (though BSF already gave us a cool new Primaris). I'd like to see some more exceptions to Battle Brothers for Inquisition, SoS and Astra Telepathica, and I think this campaign might give me what I'm after.

Anyway, sorry for the monster post- just figured you might be interested in qualitative data in addition to the qualitative stuff.

I like Eldar getting some much needed love in models. I think it sucks they are being held hostage in this crap box for such a high price.

I won't buy it and fear the precedent it sets for similar boxes and prices. Pretty cheap there GW.

Well don't have interest in eldar army so pass but if necrons get same treatment then thumbs up.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 bullyboy wrote:
Would be nice if you actually created a poll here instead of posting a link, but whatever.

Not really excited as an Eldar player at the moment. From what we've seen with Jain Zar and the banshees, GW is not capable of balancing units to what we've recently seen for marines. This will probably dictate the success of the series, a direct comparison to the level of power marines have risen to with their recent codexes. This is not a small rant about marines since I'm currently building Raven Guard, but the next few months will be a good representation for what we can expect for the rest of 8th edition.

Personally I would rather GW to nerf marines down to more reasonable level rather than up others to same level. Things were already too lethal. Making things more is bad idea. Tone down marines. Don't escalate the arms race.

Well, I'm interested in the new models: Jain Zar, Banshees, Drahzar and Incubi from the collecting point of view.
But not from the gaming point of view.
The rest of the box I have in abundance.

Overhyped.
Overpriced.
Some ancient models in there.
Jain Zar is just silly.

It looks like GW puts more effort into marketing than into their products...

The price is too darn high, I know there's been some brown nosing about how it's totally a discount on some really common and cheaply available stuff, but that's not an inducement, even for someone like me who has little to no CE/DE stuff.

I'll see what split box stuff is available on places like ebay and bartertown, but I'm not optimistic.

Don't play either faction, and I'm not a fan of Psykers in general so it's meh for me.

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I like Eldar getting some much needed love in models. I think it sucks they are being held hostage in this crap box for such a high price.

I won't buy it and fear the precedent it sets for similar boxes and prices. Pretty cheap there GW.

you make it sound like introducing new minis in a box is something new to GW.

If it was just the Eldar only set, I'd be more prone to buying. However, I'm waiting to see if the other Aspects get plastic before buying in.

Strangely, the Eldar army I possess is supposedly for my brother to use - I like the models, but don't play the army.

BrianDavion wrote:

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I like Eldar getting some much needed love in models. I think it sucks they are being held hostage in this crap box for such a high price.

I won't buy it and fear the precedent it sets for similar boxes and prices. Pretty cheap there GW.

you make it sound like introducing new minis in a box is something new to GW.

This is the most cash grabby, and awful of the boxes they did this for. That is why my feelings on it are so negative. I don't like the practice in general of doing it but in the past at least they put in some useful units and the box was for the most part good feeling.

I even got a few, with friends, like shadow spear and the one with the armigers first coming out, I declined some of the other ones. This one though feels worse, saving wise, excitement wise. So while it's not a new thing, I don't like it being a thing and if it has to be a thing at least it could feel better.

I mean aside from the tech priest Dominus, please GW stop placing them in every ad mech box deal !

I'd say wake the dead was the worst of the lost. a buncha models most people already had tons of.. and a new Primaris Leuitenant!

BrianDavion wrote:

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I like Eldar getting some much needed love in models. I think it sucks they are being held hostage in this crap box for such a high price.

I won't buy it and fear the precedent it sets for similar boxes and prices. Pretty cheap there GW.

you make it sound like introducing new minis in a box is something new to GW.

It probably isn't. But why couldn't the box be two HQs, two boxs of the new units and some support unit or character, that actually works well with the said troops., it could even be a new model or a model with changed rules to fit the force.

This follows pattern GW has been doing for years with good success selling out. It's the shadowspear that was unusual. Usually kits do not come with all new but it being marines the poster boys make.

This is 100% following pattern GW has had. Nothing new under the sky here.

They're two factions I don't collect, so I don't have a horse in this race. However, I don't think it's going to live up to the initial hype looking at this release. I'm hoping all of my factions get new models, but I feel for both CWE and DE players as both factions need new models (for different reasons). I feel like DE should have gotten some of their removed stuff back, and perhaps another Aspect or two could have been covered.

I can honestly say that nothing I have seen or heard about this release has interested me in the slightest or given me even the faintest hope that it will be in any way worth a damn.

"We're reprinting the Ynnari rules from WD!"

What, you mean the rules so bad that they basically killed Ynnari as a faction overnight? The rules that have to dedicate an entire page to the convoluted mess of army-creation rules because you were too lazy to give them a proper codex? The rules so riddles with flaws and stupidity that they didn't so much resemble a first draft as some drunken scrawls on a beermat?

Apparently we're supposed to think that reprinting godawful rules is somehow a point in the book's favour. To me it's akin to trying to market the book by claiming it contains the Ebola virus.


Speaking of marketing, the previews thus far have been (in order):
Banshees (initial announcement)
Banshees again
Incubi
Jain Zar
Drazhar
The box for the above
Inside the box for the above
Some actual rules(!!!)
Drazhar and Jain Zar again
Banshees and Jain Zar again

How anaemic does a book have to be for the marketing team to keep showing the same pictures of the same 4 units and pretending each time that they're something new and exciting?


As for the rules, the custom Obsessions just don't interest me. I'm of the opinion that the DE book already has a perfectly fine choice of Kabals, Cults and Covens. What it *doesn't* have is a good choice of actual units - especially in the HQ department. But once again any opportunity to address this problem has been carefully avoided. But I'm sure it's far more important that Marines get another dozen releases. Don't worry, I'll just sit here with my 1 generic HQ choice each for Kabal, Cult and Coven. And even if they couldn't be arsed making new models, how about at least giving our HQs tables like the ones Eldar are getting for each of their Exarchs?


As for the models, I don't play Eldar so the Banshees and Jain Zar are of minimal interest to me. I can't say that the Incubi excite me either. If anything, the models for both Drazhar and the Klaivex just illustrate how fundamentally stupid and impractical Klaives are as weapons. The poses are awkward and static, I have no interest in the stupid tassels and why is Drazhar wearing a necklace?

Finally, looking at the box set for this release, all I can say is HAHAHAHAHAHA. Dream on, GW.

the custom obsessions etc is something that we can expect to be deployed widely in 40k now. I think it's a good thing in terms of allowing us to develop individual character for our armies.

before the Marine codex came out when you asked "what chapter are you playing" the answer was always "ohh it's ultramarines but with my own custom paint job" now I ask people what army they play and they tell me about their custom chapter. it's been fun

Yeah, the custom chapters / obsessions / whatever thing is a great idea. What matters is how its done.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Yeah, the custom chapters / obsessions / whatever thing is a great idea. What matters is how its done.

yeah, the devil'll DEFINATLY be in the details. we'll see how it all works out. what I'M concerned about is if they go with the 2 trait system of codex marines, but don't update some of the current craftworld traits then a custom CW will be MAAAISVLY better then a canon one, not a big problem... until someone realizes they've basicly being penalized, harshly for taking Eldrad.

Custom chapters/obsessions is fine.

My concern is that it's going to be the only thing DE actually get in this supplement (outside of tweaked rules for Drazhar).

Tyel wrote:
Don't like the model contents of the box.

Rules wise Drazar is certainly interesting but not totally sure how you would use him. Sort of similar problem to Incubi in general tbh. Probably going to be very cool in fluffy/non-competitive games. If he is still 140 points I think thats a bit much for a guy you have jogging around looking for something to punch. Deep strike turn 2, with reroll charges, go ham? Would need to check the stats - if its effective 4 damage on 5+ to wound though hes scary to a lot of things, even if not quite a smash captain.

Jain Zar looks very meh - although I guess that time you somehow managed to get right in the middle of say an Ork Boy blob or loads of Genestealers or something and break out 15-20 attacks could be fun (I guess it would mess things up, but she should have counted as flying in the charge phase or something).

As a unit though I just think you are in this weird situation where ignoring overwatch is great for an assault army, and M8 advance and charge +3" is great for an assault army and... its just a shame Eldar don't have many other good assault units to really follow this up. This has surely been proven by the Ynnari codex.

Maybe if there is a new Avatar of Khaine and some new buffed up Scorpions etc and who knows something weird like storm guardians get a kit and love in the future it might change.

Storm Armdians are never getting a kit. Though, they do absolutely tempt me to attend official GW tournaments with units of completely WYSIWYG storm guardians that are just heads and arms in little piles on the board.

"What, they don't come with bases! RAW, I'm supposed to use the hull!"

the box is clearly as troll to test the faithful, I mean Helions and Vypers...really (guess you cant put wyches or bikes in as they'd show up the new hotness)

rules smacking of friday afternoon rush job and whilst 'too many good units' is a first craftworld problem, on whats been spoiled I cant see it making much, if any, impact on eldar or deldar armies

 vipoid wrote:
Custom chapters/obsessions is fine.

My concern is that it's going to be the only thing DE actually get in this supplement (outside of tweaked rules for Drazhar).

Yeah, I'd honestly like to see xenos get some more stuff. I have a hunch though that this is going to be more or less what most armies get. they can eaither give everyone a little something, or a few select armies big things.

the_scotsman wrote:
Storm Armdians are never getting a kit. Though, they do absolutely tempt me to attend official GW tournaments with units of completely WYSIWYG storm guardians that are just heads and arms in little piles on the board.

"What, they don't come with bases! RAW, I'm supposed to use the hull!"

I'm not sure how someone would react to this small disembodied pile shuffling across the table.
Still, GW will want probably to re-do guardians one day. In which case a dual kit isn't beyond the wit of man. They might even have rules to not be the most pointless unit in the game.

But then I was sure they would do new aspects in dual kits, so what do I know.

From a rules standpoint, the only thing I'm looking forward to is the custom Craftworlds. This could change if they happen to give out new relics, warlord traits etc.
One thing that would blow me away (and therefore won't be in the book) is a strategem that could make either a wraithlord or wraithknight a character and then have som relics worth taking.

The comments here are sobering - especially for GW.
Their decision to add old-school models like Falcon and Vyper to the box and a unit that is meh in the first place like Hellions seems not to convince the player base.
Scourges and Venom can be played at the competitive level, but most DE players have them at home in abundance.
So what remains are the new models which I think are sweet.
Its more for the collector and painter rather than for the player.

It can't be worse than the way they introduced Guilliman and Primaris

 wuestenfux wrote:
The comments here are sobering - especially for GW.
Their decision to add old-school models like Falcon and Vyper to the box and a unit that is meh in the first place like Hellions seems not to convince the player base.
Scourges and Venom can be played at the competitive level, but most DE players have them at home in abundance.
So what remains are the new models which I think are sweet.
Its more for the collector and painter rather than for the player.

The only good thing about owning more Scourges is that they are a wonder for kitbash. Hellions would be too if Archons and Succubi could ride skyboards.

 Eldarsif wrote:
Hellions would be too if Archons and Succubi could ride skyboards.

And here we have just one of the myriad of things I would have preferred GW to address before redoing Drazhar and Incubi.

Oof. Well now we know what the Codex B Team was working on while the A team was working on marine supplements.

Haha. True dat.

 DominayTrix wrote:
Oof. Well now we know what the Codex B Team was working on while the A team was working on marine supplements.

The B team is Phil Kelly?
The author of the new Ynnari.

Tyel wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
Storm Armdians are never getting a kit. Though, they do absolutely tempt me to attend official GW tournaments with units of completely WYSIWYG storm guardians that are just heads and arms in little piles on the board.

"What, they don't come with bases! RAW, I'm supposed to use the hull!"

I'm not sure how someone would react to this small disembodied pile shuffling across the table.
Still, GW will want probably to re-do guardians one day. In which case a dual kit isn't beyond the wit of man. They might even have rules to not be the most pointless unit in the game.

But then I was sure they would do new aspects in dual kits, so what do I know.

SG's definitely aren't the most pointless unit in the game, but they ain't a melee unit. They're 2 BS3+ meltaguns with battlefocus - I actually use them in my eldar list (which is admittedly as fluffy as they come, but they tend to do decent work tbh).

Playing SG's in a BCB-esque "by the book" model configuration would be kind of similar to how they originally released Necron Scarabs. They were just tiny little figs with no base that just sort of shuffled across the table.


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 Eldarsif wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
The comments here are sobering - especially for GW.
Their decision to add old-school models like Falcon and Vyper to the box and a unit that is meh in the first place like Hellions seems not to convince the player base.
Scourges and Venom can be played at the competitive level, but most DE players have them at home in abundance.
So what remains are the new models which I think are sweet.
Its more for the collector and painter rather than for the player.

The only good thing about owning more Scourges is that they are a wonder for kitbash. Hellions would be too if Archons and Succubi could ride skyboards.

Also, daily reminder that a couple months ago you could get 2x units of Hellions and 2x units of Reavers for like...thirty five bucks or something with Gangs of Comorragh. That box literally cost less than 1 and a half of the four kits that was in it. I don't know any human alive who plays DE and doesn't have way too many hellions.

Storm Guardians are also really cheap (for CWE) troops. 6ppm puts them *much* cheaper per model than the next cheapest (Defenders). Half the firepower same durability and a little better CC for 75% the cost? If you're looking for bodies, not a bad deal. The extra shooting is *usually* better, but not always.

They're also the cheapest troop slot for CWE.

I wish they had better purposes, but they have some purposes now.

 wuestenfux wrote:
The comments here are sobering - especially for GW.
Their decision to add old-school models like Falcon and Vyper to the box and a unit that is meh in the first place like Hellions seems not to convince the player base.
Scourges and Venom can be played at the competitive level, but most DE players have them at home in abundance.
So what remains are the new models which I think are sweet.
Its more for the collector and painter rather than for the player.

I think the real kicker is the box only gives a 33% discount compared to the 50% almost every box like it has done in the past.

Im just hoping for some new Nid goodies when they get their update.

Having now seen almost all the contents of the book, I can honestly say that this is one of the laziest cash-grabs I've ever seen. Even by GW's own dismal standards.

Don't care about xenos at all. Overpriced as always, big surprise there.

Serafimov86 wrote:
It can't be worse than the way they introduced Guilliman and Primaris

you mean a box set with 2 brand new never seen before armies (ok technicly Primaris are part of Space Marines but they can be used as a stand alone army too) with 3 differant boxes each with a differant price point to make ease of entry easy. that also came with a rule book for the brand new edition.. all for a cost LESS then what we're paying for Blood of the Pheonix?

Yes you're right it's faaaar better then that, absolutely better. ohh by the way I've got a great offer on a bridge for you!

This sums it up rather...sadly.

 vipoid wrote:
Having now seen almost all the contents of the book, I can honestly say that this is one of the laziest cash-grabs I've ever seen. Even by GW's own dismal standards.

I don't believe GW would be lazy and cash grabby, next thing you're going to tell me is that they'd reprint an out of date rule book with a small format and a high price tag. Ha I don't believe it, this is the new GW we talking about here. They'd not do such things.

A facebook post will fix everything. Trust in GW.

BrianDavion wrote:
I'd say wake the dead was the worst of the lost. a buncha models most people already had tons of.. and a new Primaris Leuitenant!

Wake the Dead was actually a reasonable introductory box set. You got a HQ and troops for each side, and only the Reivers were really the only lackluster part of the box. I kind of view it as the Dark Imperium for people who didn't want Death Guard models.

I think any Versus box should be looked at as introductory - maybe not ground floor on an army, but a good way to expand a force, and Wake the Dead did that fine. My 1000 point Eldar project was basically SC Eldar, Wake the Dead and some leftover War Walkers/Guardians I had from 5th edition, and up to that point I had only the Dark Imperium mono-pose Primaris, so an extra Power Sword Lieutenant, multipart Intercessors and Inceptors were welcome.


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 Elbows wrote:
This sums it up rather...sadly.

Spoiler:

To this day I still consider getting Know No Fear, and I own 2 Dark Imperium boxes. Such a good starter.

Wake the dead I gave a pass too because there had been so many sets with primaris Marines in them it was just hard to care about (maybe if I was an eldar player it'd be differant) I'd have been more excited if wake the dead was Eldar vs guard or something.

BrianDavion wrote:
Wake the dead I gave a pass too because there had been so many sets with primaris Marines in them it was just hard to care about (maybe if I was an eldar player it'd be differant) I'd have been more excited if wake the dead was Eldar vs guard or something.

Oh I understand completely. Not every versus box is going to interest everyone, but we can at least appreciate them for the relative value of the contents - good units at good prices equals a good box set. By that standard, Wake the Dead wasn't perfect, but it was still pretty good and only had minor exclusives - the plastic Spiritseer isn't a huge improvement on the Finecast one, they both look good.

Well, now one can order the ''new'' Aeldari stuff, the box set for 180€ and the supplement book for 32€.
The latter is an 80 page book with the following content:

- Background that brings the full impact of the Great Rift upon the Aeldari to life, examining the rifts formed between various factions in their society, the rising belief in Ynnead, the predations of Slaanesh, and more!
- Missions that allow you to recreate some of the most pivotal battles involving the Aeldari during the psychic awakening, and war zones that let you bring your battles to some of the most pivotal sites of conflict
- Expanded army rules for the Craftworlds, including alternative Exarch abilities, updated datasheets for Jain Zar and Howling Banshees, a new Psychic Discipline, and a system that allows you to build your own Craftworld Attributes
- Expanded army rules for the Drukhari, including updated datasheers for Drazhar and Incubi, name generation tables, and a system that lets you build your own Kabals, Wych Cults and Haemonculus Covens
- Expanded army rules for the Ynnari, including army-wide abilities, datasheets and matched play points for The Visarch, The Yncarne and Yvraine, Warlord Traits, Stratagems, the Revenant Psychic Discipline, Relics of Ynnead and more!

Unless you want a Ynnari army it seems that it doesn't add very much to an Aeldari collection.
Nevertheless, as an elder Eldar player I'll buy it.

 Elbows wrote:
This sums it up rather...sadly.

That is 60$ less then I paid for my army. Almost wish I had an option to buy those two boxs. Nice for for marines too, A few tanks or a few aggressor and it is a finished army. Very good deal.

I don't believe GW would be lazy and cash grabby, next thing you're going to tell me is that they'd reprint an out of date rule book with a small format and a high price tag. Ha I don't believe it, this is the new GW we talking about here. They'd not do such things.

Or reprint an old codex, when new models come out, without updated rules, and then put the updates in a Vigilus book.

Well, the new Exarch powers are nice.
But overall it seems that that Aeldari (especially Ynnari pushed in the campaign) will not reach the level of SM.

"Dakka has a Poll option"

"Doesn't uses Dakka's poll option"

 Amishprn86 wrote:
"Dakka has a Poll option"

"Doesn't uses Dakka's poll option"

A poll maintained outside of Dakka is actually not what we want.

I don't play any stripe of Eldar, so naturally I'm underwhelmed. That is to be expected, though. I'm sure if it was a Guard an/or GSC book I would have a much more positive reaction just as when those books come along, Eldar players will be in the same boat as I am now.

The cynic that is me tells me the box set is GW testing the waters of how much people are willing to pay. I don't doubt enough fanboy whales will buy them up to 'justify' (in GW's eyes) them making every new boxset at least that price. Then again, Tooth & Claw took quite a while to actually sell out and that included Primaris, so maybe I'll be wrong (nevermind it was an okay-ish price by GW standards)

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, the new Exarch powers are nice.
But overall it seems that that Aeldari (especially Ynnari pushed in the campaign) will not reach the level of SM.

What? You mean a chapter tactic that is "+1 to hit in melee combat if a unit has died this turn, oh and also you must take one of three horrible overpriced characters per each detachment" is not on par with, let's see....

-Reroll morale
-Rapid fire weapons work out to full range if you didn't move
-+1 attack in melee if you charged or were charged
-extra AP on 1/3 of your army's weapons each turn
-extra bonus AP on some weapons depending on your chapter
-two chapter tactics per official chapter, or pick your own two from this huge list

Weird! I wonder why that is!

Having looked into the rules more, I think it's safe to say that I'm pretty disappointed from a competitive perspective. Fun rules for narrative or open missions but it's missing the oomph that marines have received.

Banshees are still rubbish

The Drukhari rules definitely feel like a damp squib overall. Incubi and Drazhar might see play, but they require a lot of investment to really get the most from them (e.g., they need to be Ynnari and have multiple buffing HQs).

Kabal traits are mostly garbage aside from a couple of mediocre ones. Cult traits are fine but aren't really going to shake up how they play in any huge way aside from suddenly making an Air Wing viable.

The biggest change is that somebody at GW's rules team apparently saw that Venom spam and Covens heavy were two of the most competitive ways to play DE, and asked themselves but what if we combined the two?

And... that's all the changes they've seen. I was expecting so much more from this book.

 Tyranid Horde wrote:
Having looked into the rules more, I think it's safe to say that I'm pretty disappointed from a competitive perspective. Fun rules for narrative or open missions but it's missing the oomph that marines have received.

Banshees are still rubbish

Yeah, overall, having now seen reviews and leaks...the basic Craftworlds stuff is hugely mediocre. The build-a-Craftworld provides little option for a cool or strong list. The Exarch powers are a huge mixed bag, and I picked out maybe 7-8 total(!) that make the Aspect Warriors useful. The rest are really, shockingly bad. So, a couple of aspect units receive a needed buff...except Banshees. Their Exarch powers are comparable garbage So the new models got some of the worst rules. A lot of the powers do double-down on the Exarch, which is logical but shows that GW has very little concept of what is wrong with the game at the moment (i.e. expensive elite units are crap...so adding a rule to one expensive elite model in an expensive elite unit isn't going to help much). The powers which impact the whole aspect squad have some solid impact.

Biggest winners being probably Striking Scorpions. The 5+ mandiblaster option alone makes them worth the 10 points per model (assuming they find a way into combat).

Some of the powers made me do a double-take. -1 leadership when within 6" of a Dark Reaper? Whuh? The Reaper Exarch doing bonus damage...in close combat? Pile in bonus range for Warp Spiders...a non-melee unit (further degrading the idea that the unit is solely there to suicidally charge and tie things up...). Just some really bizarre/poor options there. I did find essentially one per Aspect that might be worth running though.

 Elbows wrote:

 Tyranid Horde wrote:
Having looked into the rules more, I think it's safe to say that I'm pretty disappointed from a competitive perspective. Fun rules for narrative or open missions but it's missing the oomph that marines have received.

Banshees are still rubbish

Yeah, overall, having now seen reviews and leaks...the basic Craftworlds stuff is hugely mediocre. The build-a-Craftworld provides little option for a cool or strong list. The Exarch powers are a huge mixed bag, and I picked out maybe 7-8 total(!) that make the Aspect Warriors useful. The rest are really, shockingly bad. So, a couple of aspect units receive a needed buff...except Banshees. Their Exarch powers are comparable garbage So the new models got some of the worst rules. A lot of the powers do double-down on the Exarch, which is logical but shows that GW has very little concept of what is wrong with the game at the moment (i.e. expensive elite units are crap...so adding a rule to one expensive elite model in an expensive elite unit isn't going to help much). The powers which impact the whole aspect squad have some solid impact.

Biggest winners being probably Striking Scorpions. The 5+ mandiblaster option alone makes them worth the 10 points per model (assuming they find a way into combat).

Some of the powers made me do a double-take. -1 leadership when within 6" of a Dark Reaper? Whuh? The Reaper Exarch doing bonus damage...in close combat? Pile in bonus range for Warp Spiders...a non-melee unit (further degrading the idea that the unit is solely there to suicidally charge and tie things up...). Just some really bizarre/poor options there. I did find essentially one per Aspect that might be worth running though.

So, I kind of disagree on some of the points you make here.

First off, though I'm definitely a weirdo in this regard, the custom craftworld trait that gives +1 to charge and rr hits of 1 in melee is definitely what I'll be taking. I run a very weird eldar list. Hail of Doom also looks good (Especially if you're bringing 10-man squads of Avenging Strikes DA's in Wave Serpents). You cannot complain about Salamanders tactic, that one is always good. Wrath of the Dead looks hot with certain builds (Wraithcannon WG that reroll all wound rolls...uh...yes please.)

I think there's a lot of potential in the custom CW traits. Hail of Doom/Mobile Fighters dire avengers seem good, or Hail of Doom/Martial Citizenry if you prefer guardians as your troops. +Charge and RR 1s on the charge is exactly what I've always wanted for my melee eldar, and Wrath of the Dead/Mobile Fighters seems like the Iyanden trait that all Iyanden players actually wanted.

Drukhari traits seem a little more limited for sure. Especially Kabal. There are some sweet combos in the Wych Cult and Covens lists, but for sure they're more limited I think primarily because there's just less of them.

Runes of Fortune is a mixed bag, but there are some GOOD ass powers in that bag. A Hemlock with Impair Senses instead of Smite? Heck yeah man, I will tell that knight it can only target the closest thing outside 18". Do I want Smite on my Wraithseer, or do I want +2 damage to his melee weapon, hmmm, decisions decisions... And +2" to charge I'm always there for. Please do give me +3" to charge striking scorpions.

As for exarch powers, really, only one needs to be good per list. And I do think there is at least one good one per list

Dire Avengers: Min squads take Shredding Fire or keep the shield. Max squads in transports take Avenging Strikes. Max squads out of transports wonder why they're doing that, but they take bladestorm.

Fire Dragons take Swift Step if they're in a transport or Dragon's Bite/keep crack shot if they're webwaying. Worst list IMO, but swift step is at least quasi-helpful.

Howling Banshees: Piercing Strike for a min squad, keep War Shout and add Graceful Avoidance for a max squad. The problem of killing things with them is still there, but they'll at least stay alive pretty good. I don't see this list as particularly bad, just the base unit's not great.

Striking Scorpions: Sweet hat lasers all day erry day. These guys become the deadliest hat laser cowboys in the west. Or take -1 to hit in cover if you think they'll fail a charge roll because you're a SISSY.

Shining Spear Exarchs; 3++ power. Turn it into a 2++ rerollable if you like with Protect. Blade Master and Lancer also seem good, with one being low-risk and the other being higher reward.

Hawks: Grenades and Overwatch are both awesome IMO. Maybe if the new kit has a decent ranged weapon for the exarch then the Dakka power might be useful.

Reapers: They have 2 good ones, with the extra shot and the reroll power for the launcher.

Spiders: Surprise assault and Spider's Lair are both definitely better than rr morale, so I can't complain much.

Crimson Hunters: Lets make this unit more OP good job GW. Now they can move and fire heavy. Good stuff.

I just didn't see any Craftworld traits which blow my skirt up - or are as solid and useful across all of the units. I appreciate they're good for adjusting if you're building a certain type of list, but almost none of them match the general quality of a 6+ FNP roll, etc. I prefer simple army traits which are useful on 95% of the units in the codex. The Craftworld ones in this book let you specialize, and I can see that being a boon for tournament play, but for a general build-a-Craftworld I found them underwhelming.

Regarding the Exarch traits...you kind of made my point there. Why have a list of 6 traits when only one or two are worthwhile? I would have preferred a simpler, more focused 3-trait list. It's a bit of false advertising if half of your "options" are objectively garbage and will never be taken. As far as I'm concerned that's wasted paper you're printing at a certain point.

On a lighter note, I think "Avenging Strikes" could actually be the sleeper here. Lose a model, and you hit on 2's and damage almost anything on a 5? There could be a sneaky Asurmen/Dire Avenger combo thing here...run up the board with 4+ invulnerables and hope you lose a model or two per unit. Sadly once your opponent figures it out they'll treat them like Necrons, ensuring they destroy the unit entirely.

 Elbows wrote:
I just didn't see any Craftworld traits which blow my skirt up - or are as solid and useful across all of the units. I appreciate they're good for adjusting if you're building a certain type of list, but almost none of them match the general quality of a 6+ FNP roll, etc. I prefer simple army traits which are useful on 95% of the units in the codex. The Craftworld ones in this book let you specialize, and I can see that being a boon for tournament play, but for a general build-a-Craftworld I found them underwhelming.

Regarding the Exarch traits...you kind of made my point there. Why have a list of 6 traits when only one or two are worthwhile? I would have preferred a simpler, more focused 3-trait list. It's a bit of false advertising if half of your "options" are objectively garbage and will never be taken. As far as I'm concerned that's wasted paper you're printing at a certain point.

On a lighter note, I think "Avenging Strikes" could actually be the sleeper here. Lose a model, and you hit on 2's and damage almost anything on a 5? There could be a sneaky Asurmen/Dire Avenger combo thing here...run up the board with 4+ invulnerables and hope you lose a model or two per unit. Sadly once your opponent figures it out they'll treat them like Necrons, ensuring they destroy the unit entirely.

There are several good traits that affect everything (or most things) 6+ invuln+Salamander Reroll is the first example that comes to mind, and I think that's solidly better than ulthwe. Certainly less fiddly.

I don't think there are any that fully supplant ulthwe or alaitoc, but honestly...is that the point? I thought the point was to have options, and have those options stand up against the standards. And barring a few clear stinkers (+1" to range wtf?? +1 to hit if half your unit is dead?) I can come up with an army build that works for almost every trait and several traits that work with any army build.

Generic Traits:

-Reroll morale
-Extra AP on shurikens
-6++ invuln
-1s are 2s for Psy powers (This is a lot better than you'd think)
-Master of Concealment
-Salamanders Reroll

Strike and Fade is ridiculously good with a heavy Shining Spears build. like RIDICULOUSLY good. Remember, units that didn't charge don't even get to activate if you don't have enemies within 1" - all your spears get to charge, fight first because they charged, and consolidate 3" backwards.....no fighting in the fight phase for your enemy, lol. Students of Vaul+Expert Crafters is IMO better than Alaitoc on flyer builds, since so often to play the objective game you need to deny movement and that means you're within 12" of enemies.

A more focused 3-trait version of the aspect warrior traits would just be...the 2-3 good ones per aspect warrior type we have now, and none of the silly ones. so what difference does it make?

I think there are some good combos but it helps to do it on a detachment by detachment basis which I'm not a big fan of since my stuff is painted in a single style.

After going through the proper PDF last night...I'll have to stick with a big bunch of "meh".

Story
Awful. Just lazy and poorly written. Hamfisted at parts and just rushing to get to a point to justify stuff. Very akin to the Vigilus books, where I feel like they just tried too hard to be clever...and ended up with a mediocre pile. Nothing to get excited about here.

Exarch Powers
Mixed bag. Mostly good. In general the lists have one or two options that are suitably good and actually elevate the Aspect Warrior squads to be worthwhile. This is something that was really needed. Scorpions are big winners here. 5+ mandiblasters are absolutely worthwhile. I had excellent results in a few games this past weekend with them. Are they a world-beating tournament option? No, but they're no longer insulting when you run them. Dire Avengers scored big with avenging strikes. Running 10-man units, if you lose one or two guys suddenly you're shooting on 2's and wounding marines on 3's, etc. I had excellent use out of this one as well (running several Dire Avenger squads it added up). Again, do Dire Avengers become meta-breaking? Not even close, but once again they no longer feel insulting, considering their cost. Shining Spears have a couple options, but the best is the simple +1 to charge roll. Reliable, simple, and good. Warp Spiders have a gimmick. Dark Reapers benefit from the tempest launcher option, and Swooping Hawks have a couple of interesting options. Fire Dragons have a more reliable advance but are still wildly expensive/pointless. Who loses big time? Banshees. The poster-girls of the release. The boost to Scorpions make the Banshees even worse...and that's massively disappointing. The basic Exarch power is still likely the best choice. Really disappointing actually...

Runes of Fortune
These range from "eh, okay" to "that's insulting...". Almost none of them are better than Smite, but it does give Warlocks an option to replace their garbage Destructor instead....so that's where these will find service. Definitely some room for these to work if you keep a Warlock embedded with a unit and you're dedicating your power to that unit. Some are laughably bad ...such as the witch strike one. No one will ever take that as long as witch weapons inexplicably have no AP. Absolute trash. One noticeable change is that, similar to the marine books, casting costs are down. All six powers are 4 or 6 to cast. They're little boosts and can help the Warlocks (which are horribly over-costed as-is). Will you replace proper Smite on a Spiritseer or Farseer? Unlikely. Could you be sneaky and slot one in on a Bonesinger? Sure. If the Bonesinger is hanging out to repair vehicles, he could make use of Fateful Divergence to help a Fire Prism or something? Overall, pretty uninspiring, but better than a one-damage Smite for Warlocks.

Craftworld Traits
I'll take back a bit of what I said earlier. I maintain there's very little to interest me here, but I concur that there are strong options. However, the strong options here are lazy re-prints of various other army traits. There is room here for a tournament player to get tricksy, and that's fine. However there seem to be very few interesting middle-of-the-road options. It's either comically useless narrative stuff (and not even cool narrative stuff), or rather strong tournament stuff. The list could be half as long as no one would have noticed the 50% of these traits that will never be taken by any player in the world....even in a narrative setting. A lot of missed opportunities here.

Bonus of the book is actually the name generator. That's cool and handy, and a nice little addition.

Overall Highlight: A handful of the Exarch powers absolutely transform Aspect Warrior squads...and this was needed, and it helps. That's probably the most worthwhile thing you'll get out of the book. The custom Craftworld traits will offer something for the tournament folks (being able to build specifically around unique options), but will be relatively disappointing to the narrative folks.

As a narrative player myself, I greatly appreciate being able to bring an army trait that benefits the following focuses:

-Wraith Units (Iyanden is a joke compared to wrath of the dead+regeneration fir an actual wraith focused army)

-melee units (Saim-hamn forces you into specific builds way more than headstrong+Savage blades)

-Guardian units (biel tan is an option as is ulthwe but I love master artisans and 6++ Inv to make your guardians special weapons feel better)

The DE traits fell so flat for me because the stupid triple division in the deldar range makes building a themed army basically impossible within the three options.

Like, you cannot build a melee Kabal list. There are no melee Kabal units. You cannot build a tanky or shooty cults list. When both the troops and hq slot are totally fixed no variation is possible. So every custom trait that doesn't boost the one thing the subfaction does is just pointless.

Add in the fact that gw purposefully made the already trisected range even more threadbare by classifying a huge number of the units "mercenaries" that can never get any trait, and it's just kind of impossible.

For reference, that's a full 1/3 of the unit entries in the book. If I could take incubi, drazar, mandrakes, etc in my custom Kabal maybe some of these melee traits wouldn't be useless....but I can't.

I have no horse in this race and I've said it elsewhere, but from what I've seen it really really really makes me think that we're going to see updated codices for these factions within the next year--and I would expect a decent sized release alongside of the book.

I wouldn't be shocked if things like your Wraith comparison there, Scotsman, are what the Iyanden trait will actually end up being. I also wouldn't be shocked if Drazhar+Incubi and Jain Zar and Howling Banshees are just a teaser of what might be in the pipe.

Box is junk, book seems a surcharge to fill out a couple pages of eldar codexes that aren't standing up well.

If this is the release model for the next year+, its going to be an ignorable string of pointless releases.