Warriors From a Bygone Age Return for Christmas Day Pre-orders

The year was 1998, and the grim, dark future of the 41st Millennium looked very different. The third edition of the game was launched with a starter set of Black Templars and Dark Eldar. This Christmas you’ll be able to pick up these fighting forces for a limited time once more.

The Old Enemies bundle includes 10 classic Space Marines with boltguns, one Land Speeder, and 20 Dark Eldar Warriors with splinter rifles and splinter cannons. The classic Dark Eldar armour design is a perfect fit for your Archon’s Kabalite Trueborn bodyguard.

The Space Marines wear parts from multiple different armour marks, ideal for representing Company Veterans and other elite units. All of the models come in plastic.

...seriously? Wow

Wat

That’s random. Completely odd choice. Of all the plastic MTOs, they choose this?

 Albertorius wrote:
...seriously? Wow

Yeah, it is a bit random. I wonder if they just found the moulds during the factory move...

If it actually included the 3rd edition rulebook they'd have a worthwhile product

I love that it suggests using the Dark Eldar as Trueborn.

I’ve had my army for ages so most of my warriors are the old ones, they’re much slighter than the current ones who I use for Sybarites and special weapon holders.

If I were to use one type for trueborn it wouldn’t be the old ones!

Is this a joke?
Is this memes?

Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

That's sort of cool depending on the price. That's the set I first started 40k with.

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

Innit. Starstriders, 30k Ahriman, poxwalkers or even the ancient mk1 Land Raider or original Ork Battlewagon would sell like hotcakes. Instead, this…?

What on earth

I would buy the full starter again, but probably not just the old models.

Merry Christmas y'all.

Random!

 Da Boss wrote:
I would buy the full starter again, but probably not just the old models.

You can. There are still mint copies doing the rounds from time to time on eBay and similar sites.

There are thousands of those warriors out there available for cheap - even at release I managed to pick up lots real cheap from folk that didn't want them. The price is going to have to be very low for anyone to buy.

April Fools isn't in December

That is wild.

I prefer Battle for McDonald's Gaunts, because they don't have two-piece heads, but this is still a fun throwback.

Just think of all the things which aren't this which GW could have released instead of this.

The GW MTO program just completely baffles me.

Like it's a good idea in theory, but the selection of what to pick for it is awful, and incoherent, and bizarre.

Who wanted these? They're easy to get on Ebay, the DE actively look terrible and there is no demand.

Why? Why??? If you wanted to reissue a starter box at least people might have wanted the Chosen from 7th edition. They could just do Slaanesh again and it would sell better than this. Or Vect. Or the Blackstone Fortress expansion sprues.

Of all the things. Completely baffling.

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Just think of all the things which aren't this which GW could have released instead of this.

I've had people from two different sites tell me that, come The Old World, GW won't be able to re-release old plastic Fantasy kits.

This kind of proves otherwise to me...

I wonder if this is just a case of needing to have to release something? Also I wonder if this what they might do for warhammer the old world? no big release just lots for made to order of popular units, they have been doing this for blood bowl with classic teams for a while.

But it does seam a bit random

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
April Fools isn't in December

December 28th is the "Día de los Santos Inocentes", actually, which is the non-anglo Fool's Day.

So, yes, it very much is.

What a weird choice. Did they find some boxes down the back of the sofa? I wouldn't pay £10 for these, but I'm sure there will be someone out there who prefers this style of Dark Eldar.

 Albertorius wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
April Fools isn't in December

December 28th is the "Día de los Santos Inocentes", actually, which is the non-anglo Fool's Day.

So, yes, it very much is.

GW is Anglos though smh

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
April Fools isn't in December

December 28th is the "Día de los Santos Inocentes", actually, which is the non-anglo Fool's Day.

So, yes, it very much is.

GW is Anglos though smh

GW is literally an international corporation.

Also, this doesn't seem to be a joke, as weird as it is.

Cool idea, but yeah, I dunno who would want these models. They aren't old enough to have the old school nostalgia, and they aren't new enough to want to put alongside newer models.

I can only assume one of the Mail Order Trolls was lost in the archives during Lockdown, and stumbled across a forgotten container?

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

The SM are much better looking than anything primaris/gravis .

 Blackie wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

The SM are much better looking than anything primaris/gravis .

They're also inferior to the currently available Tactical Squad box.

 Lord Damocles wrote:

 Blackie wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

The SM are much better looking than anything primaris/gravis .

They're also inferior to the currently available Tactical Squad box.

Yeah, I could see if they went back to the old metals, some folk might have nostalgia for them (I loved the old metal Space Wolves), but those early multi pose kits were just like the ones we have now but worse.

It's a nice little poke at the nostalgia bones, but it would have been better as the whole box (I miss those old plastic 3rd edition ruins!)

I can't really see who the target audience for this is, but hey it's MTO, if people want to buy it, they can.

Now, if they wanted to put the 2nd edition Necromunda Bulkhead/cardboard terrain kits like the Bastion and Firebase on MTO, then they'd get my attention, and a huge amount of my money

Almost any other box from that era would be more interesting than this. Necromunda bulkheads are a great call. Or the Maccrage crashed shuttle. Or, how about, Battlefleet effin Gothic.

I actually want to play 3rd edition with era accurate models so this would be great if they’d offer a hardback reprint of the rules and you weren’t forced to buy both factions. It’s kinda cool as is but I’ll have to pass.

Oh ye spiky gods, is that the original plastic Land Speeder? The one that would only fit together if you had a vice and five hands?

yup, the one that made everyone reach for the rubber bands

I built one of those when I was 13 or 14. Sometimes I still have nightmares about it .

Charax wrote:
It's a nice little poke at the nostalgia bones, but it would have been better as the whole box (I miss those old plastic 3rd edition ruins!)

I can't really see who the target audience for this is, but hey it's MTO, if people want to buy it, they can.

Now, if they wanted to put the 2nd edition Necromunda Bulkhead/cardboard terrain kits like the Bastion and Firebase on MTO, then they'd get my attention, and a huge amount of my money

Old terrain. Who is the market for that?






I've even acquired a Bastion since that photograph.

That photograph mocks me... I almost had that Imperial Command Tower...

Looking forward to laughing at the price tomorrow.

Zenithfleet wrote:
Oh ye spiky gods, is that the original plastic Land Speeder? The one that would only fit together if you had a vice and five hands?

I assembled mine just fine way back when.

Such a strange choice by GW, I really can’t understand it. The DE warriors weren’t great when they were initially released, and they are very, very poor compared with their modern counterparts. As has been said, there is no benefit to getting the older version of the SM Tactical squad or Land Speeder.

It’s not like they will have suddenly unearthed old stock, as they will have to produce more if for some reason there is a high demand. I can’t see GW releasing them as a budget price either, as it would be seen to devalue the brand from their perspective.

There are so many other OOP plastic kits they could have re-released as MTO that would have sold like hot cakes, regardless of price. I’m thinking of all the oop Empire/Bretonnian stuff mainly, but what about the BA tactical squad, or the Space Hulk Termie/Genestealer sprues?! Or the Rogue Trader era Imperial Guard?

I mean, these are literally the worst kits to re-release. It’s utterly baffling, and equally disappointing.

I assume that GW are probably about to dispose of the old moulds, and just want one last pull on the nostalgia pump with them.

Ah, nothing quite like 3rd edition!

 Lord Damocles wrote:
I assume that GW are probably about to dispose of the old moulds, and just want one last pull on the nostalgia pump with them.

Maybe they are getting rid of the old moulds, though I'm interested in the fact they even still have the old moulds. Some folk have suggested GW would get rid of old plastic moulds due to not wanting to store or maintain them, but this suggests they do keep at least some of the old plastic moulds.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Some folk have suggested GW would get rid of old plastic moulds due to not wanting to store or maintain them,

IME those kinds of claims usually come from the sort of people who are for some reason compelled to invent excuses for GW's weird decisions.

alphaecho wrote:


I've even acquired a Bastion since that photograph.

I don't know whether to hate you or respect you. Lovely collection.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Some folk have suggested GW would get rid of old plastic moulds due to not wanting to store or maintain them,

IME those kinds of claims usually come from the sort of people who are for some reason compelled to invent excuses for GW's weird decisions.

That or they've just found some which they forgot to put in the dumpster ten years ago.

Warhammer World did manage to find a whole bunch of copies of the Gorkamorka boxed game about a decade after the game was canned (which they flogged in Bugman's Bar), so who knows..?

Good to see this come out, but I think it would have been better to sell it with the upgraded/ updated models.

Agree on all fronts though.

I can see the nostalgia value, as I've been putting together a 2nd Edition box set for E bay.

I do have to admit that these current overengineered figs do give you that wish for some older styled ones.

Maybe not THIS old, but...

Strange to see these guys. Just had a discussion not two or three days ago about that time when 2d was ending, and 3d edition came out with these "New" Dark Eldar.

Kinda an odd one! But I still have my box (very worned-out now though, it was my first "carrying case" ) and the book, but I'm not sure what happed to the models as we weren't playing those armies. Still dont so interest is very low, but with a cheap enough price it would be funny to complete the box again and paint them. But knowing GW, that silly idea will be put to bed easily when the price is announced!

Lol one could think gw assaulted them from their reactions

Always thought this box set was complete garbage, especially when compared to the contemporary fantasy starter. The fantasy set contained almost the full £50 box set of Orcs and Empire miniatures and covered most of the bases when it come to learning the game you had a unit of combat and ranged infantry, a war machine, and a leader for each faction as well as the rules and some scenery.

For the 40k starter you got 2 basic sets of infantry and a random speeder that was completely indestructible because the DEldar didn't have anything stronger than a Splinter Cannon.

Also why this and not something cooler like Assault on Black Reach or Dark Vengeance?

That 6e starter was awesome. To be fair, the 5e, 7e and 8e starters were also all really great.

Battle for Macragge was lacklustre, the only starter since 2e I didn't buy. Assault on Black Reach was awesome, really good selection of models particularly the Ork half. Dark Vengeance is also pretty nice, if a bit one sided.

3e starter I mostly remember thinking the ruins and jungle trees were awesome.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Always thought this box set was complete garbage, especially when compared to the contemporary fantasy starter. The fantasy set contained almost the full £50 box set of Orcs and Empire miniatures and covered most of the bases when it come to learning the game you had a unit of combat and ranged infantry, a war machine, and a leader for each faction as well as the rules and some scenery.

For the 40k starter you got 2 basic sets of infantry and a random speeder that was completely indestructible because the DEldar didn't have anything stronger than a Splinter Cannon.

Also why this and not something cooler like Assault on Black Reach or Dark Vengeance?

It wasn't great, no. Particularly if you take out the plastic ruins, which were the best part of it... and you know, the game. This is literally the worst part of the set, and the only part you could actually buy as updated parts. Which makes it even weirder.

It will be extra funny if it's more expensive than just buying a current tac squad box + Land Speeder box +2 Kabalite Warrior boxes... which I can totally see.

 Grot 6 wrote:
Good to see this come out, but I think it would have been better to sell it with the upgraded/ updated models.

Agree on all fronts though.

I can see the nostalgia value, as I've been putting together a 2nd Edition box set for E bay.

I do have to admit that these current overengineered figs do give you that wish for some older styled ones.

Maybe not THIS old, but...

Strange to see these guys. Just had a discussion not two or three days ago about that time when 2d was ending, and 3d edition came out with these "New" Dark Eldar.

A full 2nd edition boxed set with rules and all would get my nostalgic juices flowing and I'd be inclined to buy it (assuming the price isn't insane). 2nd edition was when I started, 3rd edition just a couple of years after that, but I never bought a 2nd edition starter (one mate bought the 2nd edition 40k starter, another the 5th edition WHFB starter, and I grabbed the Epic 40k starter back in the day).

But 3rd edition, meh.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Grot 6 wrote:
Good to see this come out, but I think it would have been better to sell it with the upgraded/ updated models.

Agree on all fronts though.

I can see the nostalgia value, as I've been putting together a 2nd Edition box set for E bay.

I do have to admit that these current overengineered figs do give you that wish for some older styled ones.

Maybe not THIS old, but...

Strange to see these guys. Just had a discussion not two or three days ago about that time when 2d was ending, and 3d edition came out with these "New" Dark Eldar.

A full 2nd edition boxed set with rules and all would get my nostalgic juices flowing and I'd be inclined to buy it (assuming the price isn't insane). 2nd edition was when I started, 3rd edition just a couple of years after that, but I never bought a 2nd edition starter (one mate bought the 2nd edition 40k starter, another the 5th edition WHFB starter, and I grabbed the Epic 40k starter back in the day).

But 3rd edition, meh.

OTOH, the Epic: 40k box was totally sweet.

Honestly think that this is a really neat release from GW. Minis some of the old Warhammer Fantasy minis, between this and the Middle Earth MTO stuff...

It really is just like the old GW pamphlets inside the boxes of models I used to stare at as a teen.

Don't really understand the hate. This isn't taking any development time from any other GW products, and it is a great lot to put on display for people who viewed 3rd as the pinnacle of 40k gaming, or jumped in at that time. All the time it is taking is for a worker to swap a mold out in a machine and produce enough pre-ordered copies to ship out.

Can tell you now that everything I own from that starter box has long since been broken and trashed, really wouldn't mind owning it again just for the memory.

What hate? More like bafflement.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NH Gunsmith wrote:
Can tell you now that everything I own from that starter box has long since been broken and trashed, really wouldn't mind owning it again just for the memory.

If they did that, it would be neat... but it's not what they have said. They are rereleasing the models, which is 1) the weakest part of the box set and 2) the only part which has (better) replacements on sale.

To be honest the best news out of it is what HBMC alluded to before, the fact that they can mould plenty of earlier stuff. That's awesome news. Hopefully means more stuff is available down the line.

Nice enough release I guess, although the DE minis are terrible and I ended up converting my landspeeder into crashed speeder terrain since getting the thing together was too difficult.

What I'd really be interested in is a re-run of the WHFB 6th edition box, although it's unlikely to happen before TOW launches.

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

To be fair you have to have some context.



I mean these guys were 10x better than the ones they replaced.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Almost any other box from that era would be more interesting than this. Necromunda bulkheads are a great call. Or the Maccrage crashed shuttle. Or, how about, Battlefleet effin Gothic.

Why must you make me cry

We could have BFG plastics...

I'll never understand why GW didn't do a quick release of plastic cruisers when the PC game out. Or it's sequel.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

To be fair you have to have some context.



I mean these guys were 10x better than the ones they replaced.

OTOH, those hit me right in the nostalgia. I did print some like those a while ago just to have some xD

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

To be fair you have to have some context.



I mean these guys were 10x better than the ones they replaced.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Almost any other box from that era would be more interesting than this. Necromunda bulkheads are a great call. Or the Maccrage crashed shuttle. Or, how about, Battlefleet effin Gothic.

Why must you make me cry

We could have BFG plastics...

I'll never understand why GW didn't do a quick release of plastic cruisers when the PC game out. Or it's sequel.

It's partly any of that. Any of their back catalog, rather than an army that they've almost completely replaced and generic marines that just stand out from current marines by being so bland and un-detailed.

But also... They still have production issues for current kits. Why waste time/resources on this of all things? The opportunity cost here is baffling.

Yeah, the 2nd edition models are absolutely worse looking than the 3rd edition ones, but I'd be more inclined to buy the 2nd edition models because they're something different to what we have now. Those old monopose models had a certain charm the way you could clean and basecoat a couple of squads in a few hours to start playing a game the same weekend that you bought the set.

Or maybe it's just because I'm biased towards 2nd edition because it's when I started

And yeah, no hate here, just stating that I like the idea but they picked a set I have no interest in buying and I doubt there's too many people who do (not none, but not many would be my guess).

Yeah same, this is cool in principle but somehow they picked almost the worst possible box for it.

The fact you only get bolter guys, no sergeant/special weapon sprue, makes this seem *really* low effort and weird.

Zenithfleet wrote:
Oh ye spiky gods, is that the original plastic Land Speeder? The one that would only fit together if you had a vice and five hands?

Yep. I built three of these myself. Used rubber bands instead of a vice and a healthy dose of patience.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Grot 6 wrote:
Good to see this come out, but I think it would have been better to sell it with the upgraded/ updated models.

Agree on all fronts though.

I can see the nostalgia value, as I've been putting together a 2nd Edition box set for E bay.

I do have to admit that these current overengineered figs do give you that wish for some older styled ones.

Maybe not THIS old, but...

Strange to see these guys. Just had a discussion not two or three days ago about that time when 2d was ending, and 3d edition came out with these "New" Dark Eldar.

A full 2nd edition boxed set with rules and all would get my nostalgic juices flowing and I'd be inclined to buy it (assuming the price isn't insane). 2nd edition was when I started, 3rd edition just a couple of years after that, but I never bought a 2nd edition starter (one mate bought the 2nd edition 40k starter, another the 5th edition WHFB starter, and I grabbed the Epic 40k starter back in the day).

But 3rd edition, meh.

Agreed. I would buy a 2nd starter box without hesitation. Though it would need to include EVERYTHING which was in the box itself back in the day. Only the models wouldn´t be good enough.

I would buy all the old rulebooks, and I mean all of them, if they made them available by pdf or in print. I know I could get them on the secondary market but I'm a bit lazy about hunting around for them.

Notice how three pairs of the Marines in the picture are photoshopped copies.

I’d love to pick up a skirmish force of the old Dark Eldar. For everyone saying they are cheap and plentiful, please point me to where I can get 10 to 20 of them New On Sprue for $1 per mini or less? I’m also interested in trade.

I think this is cool. Including the terrain would have been better, but still neat.

Edit: Now do Island of Blood, GW!

"The ones they replaced" are adorably cute. I wish GW had reprinted the 2nd Ed box instead.

Blastaar wrote:
I think this is cool. Including the terrain would have been better, but still neat.

Edit: Now do Island of Blood, GW!

I bought 2 boxes of Island of Blood, when came back for a while, but I would still grab another 2, just to round up my High elf force.

Also I would throw cash at GW, if they do a Made to Order run for Bretonnian and Tomb Kings units and characters.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Also why this and not something cooler like Assault on Black Reach or Dark Vengeance?

They had DV as MTO two years ago. It wasn't that well received (price, Dark Angels...). The models from AoBR (albeit fewer) they sold as Battle for Vedros five years ago. Wasn't a major success either (the price was okay though).

The 3rd edition models are an odd choice, sure. The Dark Eldar weren't good even back then (the whole range wasn't, maybe with the exception of Rakarth and two of the Grotesques) but I guess you can loot the heads and weapons to mix them into the current kit. The Marines are... well, just generic old Marines.

I do have soem vague nostalgia for these guys, it was my first starter set.

But man do the dark eldar look... not great.

I do remember my first test game at a store was with these guys. I played dark eldar and I think got wiped out completely without causing a single casualty to my opponent.

Island of Blood was great for Skaven players.
I was a fan of Skull Pass - spider riders had me doing backflips of joy.

3rd ed. 40box was OK - I have some of the marines still in service, and some bits of dark eldar I used for spikes on my Avatar, spikes on my wraithlord, spikes on my warp spider exarch, plus some de-spiked guardian conversions.

That said, not my favorite starter box by a mile.

2nd ed, I still have maybe 40 or so grots painted nicely, and use them in my walker cult, as they have been charmed into walking up front like bug-eyed zombies, so explaining the single pose.

If I had to choose, Black Reach would be the models that I might be inclined to buy, if the price were ... impossibly reasonable.

6th and 7th were also solid. Of them, I would prefer to see the 7th ed set (cuz I collect Orks and OG marine).

Zenithfleet wrote:
Oh ye spiky gods, is that the original plastic Land Speeder? The one that would only fit together if you had a vice and five hands?

Was the Land Speeder in 2nd edition plastic and metal?

only plastic part of the 2nd ed. one was the flying stand, it was a brick

I wonder if they have a new injection machine (machines) and are using this to test how to adapt some of their older moulds to use it (with these moulds being ones they wouldn't be too sad to see fail if things go wrong)

after all they may be going back to older moulds in a big way if the Old World works out like some are predicting

Billicus wrote:
The fact you only get bolter guys, no sergeant/special weapon sprue, makes this seem *really* low effort and weird.

It’s the old multipart tactical squad kit, so it comes with a flamer and a missile launcher

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

Billicus wrote:
The fact you only get bolter guys, no sergeant/special weapon sprue, makes this seem *really* low effort and weird.

It’s the old multipart tactical squad kit, so it comes with a flamer and a missile launcher

The description given very specifically says ten bolter dudes.

The photoshopping of the unit may also reasonably imply that the sergeant, flamer, and missile have been removed from it.

In which case it is not the models from the third edition set and this is a bit naughty of GW to say it is. It should have the sergeant and special/heavy weapon sprue also.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-NZ/warhammer-40000-3rd-ed-miniatures-box-mto-2021

NZ $198 which is around £60, US$100, €80

EDIT prices checked against Ork Battlewagon

 DaveC wrote:
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-NZ/warhammer-40000-3rd-ed-miniatures-box-mto-2021

NZ $198 which is around £60, US$100, €78

EDIT updated prices - picked a non-standard piece initially

Oh wow xD.

Well, at least is least expensive than buying the same, current stuff.

A bit.

Saves ~30% over buying the current versions of the kits.

Not even nearly worth it.

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Saves ~30% over buying the current versions of the kits.

Not even nearly worth it.

I doubt anyone who buys this is doing it because they think they are getting a good deal on marines/Dark Eldar.

 streetsamurai wrote:
Why would anyone want to buy these old crappy.models?

The funny thing is, with the DE models, you can make them Aspect Warrior alt models - Banshees, Scorpions, Reapers. A few trimmed blades off them, and a decent paintjob - plastic aspects!

I know, as I finally pulled the DE out of my 3E set a few months back (putting old things to storage, pulled the unused sprues from the box) and as I was looking at the sprue, remembered my friends bought a couple boxes in the day to do that exact same thing.

Would have been tempting at $50. At $100? Absurd.

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

Billicus wrote:
The fact you only get bolter guys, no sergeant/special weapon sprue, makes this seem *really* low effort and weird.

It’s the old multipart tactical squad kit, so it comes with a flamer and a missile launcher

It does not come with those parts judging by the image and the description, "ten space marines armed with bolters".

Billicus wrote:

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

Billicus wrote:
The fact you only get bolter guys, no sergeant/special weapon sprue, makes this seem *really* low effort and weird.

It’s the old multipart tactical squad kit, so it comes with a flamer and a missile launcher

It does not come with those parts judging by the image and the description, "ten space marines armed with bolters".

Yeah - it looks like it doesn't include the accessory sprue.

Gives me a lot of nostalgia for my original DE army - 60 warriors with 2 dark lances a squad. Cheaper than IG and BS 4 so it was always a win by attrition.

And depending on the edition a screening skirmish line of grotesques to absorb bolter fire.

Yeah, I was that person.

Just noticed you don't get the upgrade frame for the Marines. No Sergeant/Flamer/Missile Launcher.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Just think of all the things which aren't this which GW could have released instead of this.

I've had people from two different sites tell me that, come The Old World, GW won't be able to re-release old plastic Fantasy kits.

This kind of proves otherwise to me...

Pretty sure reproducing the Talisman Dragon sprues for the Malekith MTO already proved otherwise.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Would have been tempting at $50. At $100? Absurd.

Hey, Joe! Those old molds paid for themselves over 20 years ago. Making this set will cost a buck or two in plastic tops. Plus we don’t need to spend money on new boxes or art or anything. How much should we charge for the set?

Joe hastily scribbles an arcane formula. Then he multiplies the results by 93.6, a number that has served him well. Sure fans would be happy to get a great deal on some older stuff.
But then he remembered his master’s teachings.
If even one item sells at the price you set, you could have gotten more.

This could be a test run on the profitability of releasing older box set models. Isle of Blood? Two please. BFG? I’ll take two. Man o War? Yes please. Were it not for the Titanicus relaunch, I’d go after a set or three of Titan Legions …but I much prefer the new scale.

And that is just off the top of my head. I am certain there is a solid market for “dead” plastic sprues. After all, they are already paid for, and likely just gathering dust in storage somewhere.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Just noticed you don't get the upgrade frame for the Marines. No Sergeant/Flamer/Missile Launcher.

Ahhh... yeah, that kind of killed my positivity for this MTO wave as well once I read that. Such a silly thing to decide to leave out.

Ouch, at that price (and missing the extra sprue for the marines), I won't even consider that at all.

The nostalgia isn't strong enough on this for me. If it was second edition (worse models but stronger nostalgia), or if it was armies/models I half-cared about that could be a maybe, but here it's a big nope!

100 dollars?? Gtfo.

No way.

I see quite a few 3rd ed videos on YT. Maybe someone at gw thought its a trend and thought to capitalize.

 triplegrim wrote:
100 dollars?? Gtfo.

No way.

I see quite a few 3rd ed videos on YT. Maybe someone at gw thought its a trend and thought to capitalize.

And you can play 3rd with the much improved new warriors. So... yeah, no. Its a really weird attempt to capitalize on a passing thing, even if it is true.
Honestly if I were to ever clear out my storage shelves of GW products, the original Dark Eldar models would be the first ones getting tipped in the bin. I still have these guys. They're... really bad, they don't even hold up to models that came out a decade before they did.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Just think of all the things which aren't this which GW could have released instead of this.

I've had people from two different sites tell me that, come The Old World, GW won't be able to re-release old plastic Fantasy kits.

This kind of proves otherwise to me...

That sounds odd. Why wouldn't they be able to produce their old stuff as long as the steel molds are still viable? It's not like those molds wouldn't be able to fit into the extruding machines. Hell I bet most of the machines are still the same ones they invested in 20+ years ago with some QOL upgrades.


James Workshop, of all the editions to release why 3rd? One of the worst starter sets model wise. The DE models where horrible back then and thats the ultimate cop out, 10 bolter dudes...... you know you used to give those marines away to people to paint their first models.

So really....no MTO for BFG, you know undercut the scalpers prices on feebay/trading groups etc etc and it will sell.

 Sacredroach wrote:
This could be a test run on the profitability of releasing older box set models. Isle of Blood? Two please. BFG? I’ll take two. Man o War? Yes please. Were it not for the Titanicus relaunch, I’d go after a set or three of Titan Legions …but I much prefer the new scale.

And that is just off the top of my head. I am certain there is a solid market for “dead” plastic sprues. After all, they are already paid for, and likely just gathering dust in storage somewhere.

If they were trying to test profitability they maybe shouldn't have chosen one of the least inspiring boxed sets they've ever offered. If I go through the list of 40k boxed sets, I'd place 3rd edition at the bottom...

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/07/23/warhammer-40000-through-the-ages/

...and that's not even considering things like WHFB, Epic, BFG, Necromunda, GorkaMorka.

Yeah, if this was a market test, they’re not going to be getting good data, because this one is really unappealing. Unless they’re literally trying to find the bottom of the barrel (i.e. the limit of nostalgia value)?

Or Templars recently came out, and Dark Eldar are doing well competitively, so GW is just doing a Why Not? release.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or Templars recently came out, and Dark Eldar are doing well competitively, so GW is just doing a Why Not? release.

That's got to be on par with the why not that gave us one click bundles, though. There's nothing Black Templar about those Marines but the paint job. Considering you're buying naked Tacticals and after the Primaris release for Templars it doesn't look like the 4th ed Templar upgrade sprue is available anymore, these models have to rate among the least desirable purchases for a Templar player.

At least the Dark Eldar are somewhat functional. As has been said, the models weren't exactly considered good when they were shiny and new, but at least that's a question of aesthetics and personal preference. The Marine side can't fall back on that.

100 quid with no books, templates or dice? Nah no thanks!

It really shows how GW has changed over the years, they removed half of the things from the box and yet are charging way more than they used to when it actually came out.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
It really shows how GW has changed over the years, they removed half of the things from the box and yet are charging way more than they used to when it actually came out.

I see what you mean but let's face it. Hoping for something to be priced the same as it was in the 90s is delusional. I know houses have x5 in price round then.

you cant compare houses with plastic, i want to know what poeple are going to buy this. i play bouth armys but it had to be very low would i even thing about is (about 10 euros)

Ragweek wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
It really shows how GW has changed over the years, they removed half of the things from the box and yet are charging way more than they used to when it actually came out.

I see what you mean but let's face it. Hoping for something to be priced the same as it was in the 90s is delusional. I know houses have x5 in price round then.

Comparing the vastly out of whack UK housing market to GW prices to make it seem reasonable? Will wonders never cease?

I think the box was £50 when it was released (some later versions also included a limited release metal Captain model)?

That would equate to £89.98 now, according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator.

But this new bundle is missing the Marine upgrade sprue, the gothic ruins, the jungle trees, the rulebook, templates, dice, range rulers, or fancy box.

So whatever way you look at it, you're now being asked to pay more for significantly less.

Ragweek wrote:
I know houses have x5 in price round then.

or being 1/4 of the price from back than depending on the condition and region

it is just the models, not a retro-boxed set with everything from the past and I have to say that I never got the original one, a re-print for 50-70€ with models, terrain and rules and I would have bought without a second thought

but for models only, never worth the price, specially with the old DE ones going for 5-10€ per 10 models on ebay

for a models only set, Black Reach would have been a much better choice

 kodos wrote:

Ragweek wrote:
I know houses have x5 in price round then.

it is just the models, not a retro-boxed set with everything from the past and I have to say that I never got the original one, a re-print for 50-70€ with models, terrain and rules and I would have bought without a second thought

but for models only, never worth the price, specially with the old DE ones going for 5-10€ per 10 models on ebay

for a models only set, Black Reach would have been a much better choice

It's not even all the models, they removed the sergant and special weapon sprues from Space Marines

Hahaha

The image on the front page of the webstore only shows seven Marines, because they didn't include the photoshopped ones.

Pathetic.

Ragweek wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
It really shows how GW has changed over the years, they removed half of the things from the box and yet are charging way more than they used to when it actually came out.

I see what you mean but let's face it. Hoping for something to be priced the same as it was in the 90s is delusional. I know houses have x5 in price round then.

So, a house in the UK costs five times as much to buy now than it did in '98? That's something

Still, the average even in the UK seems to be twice, not five times as much:

https://www.allagents.co.uk/house-prices-adjusted/

And yes, even so, plastic minis are not houses, and the comparison is more than a bit naff.

As everyone else says, WFB 6th, 7th or 8th would probably all sell. So would Epic 40,000 and BFG. Perhaps also Gorkamorka or Mordhiem, though this is more speculative. As for 40k, this is the second worst start.

I mean, almost every other starter beyond 4th WFB and 2nd 40K (technically Gorkamorka also) has either models that do not have superior versions available today or have unique characters.

 Da Boss wrote:
100 quid with no books, templates or dice? Nah no thanks!

Err, it's 60 quid.

 Albertorius wrote:

Ragweek wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
It really shows how GW has changed over the years, they removed half of the things from the box and yet are charging way more than they used to when it actually came out.

I see what you mean but let's face it. Hoping for something to be priced the same as it was in the 90s is delusional. I know houses have x5 in price round then.

So, a house in the UK costs five times as much to buy now than it did in '98? That's something

Still, the average even in the UK seems to be twice, not five times as much:

https://www.allagents.co.uk/house-prices-adjusted/

And yes, even so, plastic minis are not houses, and the comparison is more than a bit naff.

Houses have got expensive largely because of high demand, so by that argument these models should have gotten cheaper

I was using quid in a more loose sense, sorry to have caused confusion.

 Strg Alt wrote:

Zenithfleet wrote:
Oh ye spiky gods, is that the original plastic Land Speeder? The one that would only fit together if you had a vice and five hands?

Yep. I built three of these myself. Used rubber bands instead of a vice and a healthy dose of patience.

Actually, I think we managed to put together two of them without rubber bands, a vice or five hands. Just bloody-minded Aussie determination. But it wasn't easy.

I still have that pair of speeders in a box somewhere--they served the Ultramarines well, and we never got around to replacing them with updated models.

 Jadenim wrote:
Yeah, if this was a market test, they’re not going to be getting good data, because this one is really unappealing. Unless they’re literally trying to find the bottom of the barrel (i.e. the limit of nostalgia value)?

*dons tinfoil hat* Maybe someone at GW is trying to sabotage someone else's bright idea?

"Oh no, here comes Ned again, I can't stand that annoying piece of $#%@ ... ahem, hi Ned! How are you today? Oh, you reckon we should release old plastic minis that are popular on the secondhand market? You reckon BFG plastic cruisers or Necromunda terrain or a WFB starter set would be perfect to test the waters? Great, great, I'll take care of it, don't you worry. And I'll make sure you get all the credit. Heh, heh, heh..."

Well, it's not impossible. Something really weird happened with the release of that 6mm scale Battle of Five Armies boxed game they did years ago...

It is said that this is the main reason why we got Shadow War Armageddon, because someone was pissed that Necromunda was given to a different department

I can honestly see not reprinting the big book.

But leaving out the terrain is just plain a shame.

 krijthebold wrote:
I can honestly see not reprinting the big book.

But leaving out the terrain is just plain a shame.

I wonder if the terrain was cast in China? I never got any of that terrain so I dunno, but a lot of terrain is cast outside of GW, especially the ones on larger sprues.

 kodos wrote:
It is said that this is the main reason why we got Shadow War Armageddon, because someone was pissed that Necromunda was given to a different department

I thought it was to push the sector mechanicus terrain, with kill team coming out later with sector imperialis?

 Shakalooloo wrote:
There are thousands of those warriors out there available for cheap - even at release I managed to pick up lots real cheap from folk that didn't want them. The price is going to have to be very low for anyone to buy.

Not picking on you per se but everyone always says this and then a week later the thing that they say it about always sells out and then they're all like "wait, people actually bought this?"

The could put the existing Sprues in the Box as a redux, but with those bad Minis, nope.

Why not 2nd Edition Starter, or WHFB..

In a World where nostalgia is an ever increasing cash cow I can understand why they have done this particular MTO, the execution and value is just a bit off though. The lack of upgrade sprue for the Marines is doubly puzzling as well.

The current dream MTO for me would be the original plastic Ork Battlewagon...no idea if they have the moulds or expertise to do that though but I think that could really make a mint.

GW have been doing a few interesting things with MTO of late, notably the extended lead times also.

If they still have the moulds to produce BFG, I actually think they will, but possible with a 12 month lead time, allowing them to take up to 12 months to deliver your box set. It may not take this long but it is long enough for them to plan for the increase in production and slowing down other production just incase orders are insane and they don't want to hamper their other plans in the 12 months.

They also do not necessarily need to spend the time and money sourcing all the paper materials, just release the rules digitally, it doesn't need to be a complete game re-print.

Mordheim
Epic 40000
BFG

I think I'd buy all 3 if they were re-released.

 Togusa wrote:

 Shakalooloo wrote:
There are thousands of those warriors out there available for cheap - even at release I managed to pick up lots real cheap from folk that didn't want them. The price is going to have to be very low for anyone to buy.

Not picking on you per se but everyone always says this and then a week later the thing that they say it about always sells out and then they're all like "wait, people actually bought this?"

Well, in this case it's MTO, so I feel confident in saying that it won't sell out this time!

FWIW, new and old warriors fit pretty well together if painted the same, and I've even managed to upgrade a few oldies with spare arms from the newer set (with a little bodging).

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

Mordheim
Epic 40000
BFG

I think I'd buy all 3 if they were re-released.

They still sell the Skaven from Mordheim and they are as ugly as in the 90s. They won't re-release any models without a game they could be used in (except maybe Dreadfleet or Inquisitor) or any rules without models. Mordheim... maybe ( fun fact: it was Mortheim in Germany, as Mord just means murder here and it is just a silly pseudo German name in actual German).

Other people have moved in to the vacuum left by GW dropping support for Mordheim, BFG, and Epic, and to be honest I'm just as happy it staying that way - diversity in the market is objectively a good thing for gamers, a lot of those smaller games would struggle if GW returned to them in force

Billicus wrote:
Other people have moved in to the vacuum left by GW dropping support for Mordheim, BFG, and Epic, and to be honest I'm just as happy it staying that way - diversity in the market is objectively a good thing for gamers, a lot of those smaller games would struggle if GW returned to them in force

Dunno, it's the same situation as Necromunda, and... well, the current game is an unholy mess, but the minis are selling.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 krijthebold wrote:
I can honestly see not reprinting the big book.

But leaving out the terrain is just plain a shame.

I wonder if the terrain was cast in China? I never got any of that terrain so I dunno, but a lot of terrain is cast outside of GW, especially the ones on larger sprues.

I wonder that too now. I had that terrain back when it came out but I didn't really check that sort of thing in those days, ha.

Does anyhow know how GW handled terrain like that back in the 90's?

GW - "Now, Drukhari players, we know you might be feeling a little left out after we cut a third of the units from your codex and haven't released a single new Drukhari unit in over a decade, so we're pleased to finally announce a new Drukhari release!"

Players - "Let us guess, another resculpt of an existing unit, except worse in every way bar the material?"

GW - "No, no, we promise it isn't a resculpt."

Players - "Huh. Okay, we're interested, what is it?"

GW - "We're re-releasing a box of Warriors from 3rd edition!"

Players - ". . ."

 krijthebold wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 krijthebold wrote:
I can honestly see not reprinting the big book.

But leaving out the terrain is just plain a shame.

I wonder if the terrain was cast in China? I never got any of that terrain so I dunno, but a lot of terrain is cast outside of GW, especially the ones on larger sprues.

I wonder that too now. I had that terrain back when it came out but I didn't really check that sort of thing in those days, ha.

Does anyhow know how GW handled terrain like that back in the 90's?

While I don't know, I'm willing to go out on a limb and say GW produced the early plastic terrain kits in house and only switched to production in China after 2010.

The 3rd ed ruins, trees, the earlier bulkheads all felt like the same plastic used on non-terrain models.

I don't think China has anything to do with it. It certainly doesn't explain why GW decided to leave out the Sergeant sprue for the Marines. But for the terrain specifically I figure it was more an attempt not to throw in more random stuff. If you buy into the MTO, you already accept that you get models for two different armies. Fewer people will be interested in that combination if they also have to pay extra for two ruins and four trees.

 vipoid wrote:
GW - "Now, Drukhari players, we know you might be feeling a little left out after we cut a third of the units from your codex and haven't released a single new Drukhari unit in over a decade, so we're pleased to finally announce a new Drukhari release!"

Players - "Let us guess, another resculpt of an existing unit, except worse in every way bar the material?"

GW - "No, no, we promise it isn't a resculpt."

Players - "Huh. Okay, we're interested, what is it?"

GW - "We're re-releasing a box of Warriors from 3rd edition!"

Players - ". . ."

Wouldn't it be fun if they made a MTO run for Vect, but refused to give him rules?

Re-releasing old sets again for a short period makes sense, but both choosing this particular set and they way they've done it are just baffling. The Dark Eldar side of it I can sort of understand, but a set with classic Space Marines without their upgrade sprue, in a box set without the rest of the stuff that make it a start set like the rules and templates, and without any of the classic scenery either? Presumably without a recreation of the box too.

If this was an actual fairly close approximation of the 3rd edition starter set then that would be one thing, but it seems like an attempt to appeal to nostalgia but it's missing half of what is needed to adequately do so.

The classic Dark Eldar armour design is a perfect fit for your Archon’s Kabalite Trueborn bodyguard.

multiple different armour marks, ideal for representing Company Veterans and other elite units.

What drugs do they take?

That product text is the dumbest and most stupid I have ever read.

 vipoid wrote:
GW - "Now, Drukhari players, we know you might be feeling a little left out after we cut a third of the units from your codex and haven't released a single new Drukhari unit in over a decade, so we're pleased to finally announce a new Drukhari release!"

Players - "Let us guess, another resculpt of an existing unit, except worse in every way bar the material?"

GW - "No, no, we promise it isn't a resculpt."

Players - "Huh. Okay, we're interested, what is it?"

GW - "We're re-releasing a box of Warriors from 3rd edition!"

Players - ". . ."

Well, technically it is a resculpt of an existing unit, just not in the direction you are traditionally thinking of...

 Togusa wrote:

 Shakalooloo wrote:
There are thousands of those warriors out there available for cheap - even at release I managed to pick up lots real cheap from folk that didn't want them. The price is going to have to be very low for anyone to buy.

Not picking on you per se but everyone always says this and then a week later the thing that they say it about always sells out and then they're all like "wait, people actually bought this?"

Well, it all depends how many they make, doesn't it? If GW think something won't be popular they likely don't manufacture as much. I'm sure some of the Aeronautica Imperialis stuff that sold out did so due to lack of stock initially rather than huge amounts of popularity.

But I think in this case, being sceptical is a reasonable position, in this whole thread I've only seen a couple of people express an interest, and even then it wasn't like they were jumping up and down over it or qualified it by saying only if it's a good price.

When it comes to a nostalgia driven product it's not a great sign when a forum full of your most rabid and long serving nerds is not excited.

 Dryaktylus wrote:

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

Mordheim
Epic 40000
BFG

I think I'd buy all 3 if they were re-released.

They still sell the Skaven from Mordheim and they are as ugly as in the 90s. They won't re-release any models without a game they could be used in (except maybe Dreadfleet or Inquisitor) or any rules without models. Mordheim... maybe ( fun fact: it was Mortheim in Germany, as Mord just means murder here and it is just a silly pseudo German name in actual German).

Some years ago ( maybe when Necromunda was released again ) they said that they want to do relaunch Mordheim again. Just they said its further down the line ( like really further down the line ).

 Grimtuff wrote:

 vipoid wrote:
GW - "Now, Drukhari players, we know you might be feeling a little left out after we cut a third of the units from your codex and haven't released a single new Drukhari unit in over a decade, so we're pleased to finally announce a new Drukhari release!"

Players - "Let us guess, another resculpt of an existing unit, except worse in every way bar the material?"

GW - "No, no, we promise it isn't a resculpt."

Players - "Huh. Okay, we're interested, what is it?"

GW - "We're re-releasing a box of Warriors from 3rd edition!"

Players - ". . ."

Well, technically it is a resculpt of an existing unit, just not in the direction you are traditionally thinking of...

There is no technicality by which rereleasing the original sculpt of a model can count as a "resculpt".

This feels entirely like someone was cleaning out a warehouse, found the crate of old mold plates, and there ensued a bet between members of the production staff.

Terrain was generally molded in the UK, right along with the models. The China thing didn’t really get going until a few years ago, with the initial release of Age of Sigmar in 2015. It was accompanied by a wave of terrain that people noted was inferior in detail and quality of the plastic to GW’s usual standards. Although not in price, of course - they were still charging premium price for a markedly inferior product. Then people noticed the ‘Made in China’ on the terrain boxes…

 totalfailure wrote:
Terrain was generally molded in the UK, right along with the models. The China thing didn’t really get going until a few years ago, with the initial release of Age of Sigmar in 2015. It was accompanied by a wave of terrain that people noted was inferior in detail and quality of the plastic to GW’s usual standards. Although not in price, of course - they were still charging premium price for a markedly inferior product. Then people noticed the ‘Made in China’ on the terrain boxes…

Are you sure it doesn't go back further than 2015? I thought they started doing China casting for the large terrain sprues long before that. I thought there were some sprues that were at the time bigger than what they could cast in house. The stuff that used a darker plastic than what you normally find in GW kits. I guess it could have been cast externally but still in the UK.

ListenToMeWarriors wrote:

The current dream MTO for me would be the original plastic Ork Battlewagon...no idea if they have the moulds or expertise to do that though but I think that could really make a mint.

Someone else with a long memory might be able to add to this story, but as I recall it the mold for the plastic Ork battlewagon was damaged at an early point in its lifespan - even before the release of second edition.
It was indeed a fabulous kit, but it disappeared from shelves relatively quickly and I never even got to enjoy building one as I got mine off someone second hand around 1991 or 1992.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:


Are you sure it doesn't go back further than 2015? I thought they started doing China casting for the large terrain sprues long before that. I thought there were some sprues that were at the time bigger than what they could cast in house. The stuff that used a darker plastic than what you normally find in GW kits. I guess it could have been cast externally but still in the UK.

It definitely goes back before 2015. My Skyshield landing pad(2009) box says "Made in China" on it.

The vacuum formed Planetstrike terrain was heavily criticised at the time for being low quality and Chinese, wasn't it?

 Lord Damocles wrote:
The vacuum formed Planetstrike terrain was heavily criticised at the time for being low quality and Chinese, wasn't it?

The first, yes, the second I don't really think so, but I don't quite remember.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
If it actually included the 3rd edition rulebook they'd have a worthwhile product

If they released it with all the original content I'd buy that gak like it was my job...

If they want to do more MTOs, please do a terrain MTO with things like the ruined rhino minefield, plasma annihilator, larger wall of martyrs kits, Aquila sanctum, crashed aquilla.

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
GW have been doing a few interesting things with MTO of late, notably the extended lead times also.
.

They also do not necessarily need to spend the time and money sourcing all the paper materials, just release the rules digitally, it doesn't need to be a complete game re-print.

Mordheim
Epic 40000
BFG

I think I'd buy all 3 if they were re-released.

Me too. But what is a Mordheim release with digital rules? Some skaven clanrats and freeguild militia?

Also, does not epic 40k presume more than the starter set. Like a lot of releases?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 solkan wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:

 vipoid wrote:
GW - "Now, Drukhari players, we know you might be feeling a little left out after we cut a third of the units from your codex and haven't released a single new Drukhari unit in over a decade, so we're pleased to finally announce a new Drukhari release!"

Players - "Let us guess, another resculpt of an existing unit, except worse in every way bar the material?"

GW - "No, no, we promise it isn't a resculpt."

Players - "Huh. Okay, we're interested, what is it?"

GW - "We're re-releasing a box of Warriors from 3rd edition!"

Players - ". . ."

Well, technically it is a resculpt of an existing unit, just not in the direction you are traditionally thinking of...

There is no technicality by which rereleasing the original sculpt of a model can count as a "resculpt".

This feels entirely like someone was cleaning out a warehouse, found the crate of old mold plates, and there ensued a bet between members of the production staff.

How large are those mold plates anyway?

I know it’s the one game that will never return due to scale but I would pay a fortune for a new Inquisitor. There never was a starter box cuz of the scale I imagine. Oh the lost possibilities

John D Law wrote:
I know it’s the one game that will never return due to scale but I would pay a fortune for a new Inquisitor. There never was a starter box cuz of the scale I imagine. Oh the lost possibilities

I could not agree more. By far some of the best miniatures GW ever made.

 Kanluwen wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:


Are you sure it doesn't go back further than 2015? I thought they started doing China casting for the large terrain sprues long before that. I thought there were some sprues that were at the time bigger than what they could cast in house. The stuff that used a darker plastic than what you normally find in GW kits. I guess it could have been cast externally but still in the UK.

It definitely goes back before 2015. My Skyshield landing pad(2009) box says "Made in China" on it.

To add to that, the box of the Chaos altar for Warhammer Fantasy also says Made in China. Single piece*, very sizeable plastic thing, that one.


*The main part, anyway.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
If they want to do more MTOs, please do a terrain MTO with things like the ruined rhino minefield, plasma annihilator, larger wall of martyrs kits, Aquila sanctum, crashed aquilla.

And all the various WHFB wizard towers, and the manor house!